Have anyone gotten the UK release of Galapagos? I would like to know if it's encoded in 50i or if they used the same 60i transfer as the US release.

UK release says 1080i on the back I think - however quite a few Toshiba HD-DVD players currently sold in the UK won't replay 25p/50i HD-DVD content without a forthcoming firmware update AIUI... (the EP-10?) That may mean they've released a 60i version to avoid compatibility issues - though obviously if this is a 50i to 60i conversion or a 25p to 60i conversion there are picture quality implications...

I think - though I'm not 100% certain - that the show was shot 25p - as Planet Earth was - though it may have been edited in the 50i domain.

Thanks Sneals. :)
I read on another forum that the UK Planet Earth was the same 1080@24p transfer as the US release, and that only the extra disc was 1080i. Add that to Toshiba's problems with 50i, and it seems highly likely that 2Entertain/BBC uses the exact same transfers both on their domestic and their US releases. I think I'll skip Galapagos for now.

Btw, do you or anyone else know, if there's been a 50i release on Blu-Ray at all? I would like to know how my various Blu-Ray players would handle the content, but It seems to me that there might not exist any 50i releases yet... :eek:

I was thinking more of content that was shot natively in 25p or 50i. Film (24p) content converted to 50i would be horrible. I hope noone other is going the route of EiV and releasing old 25p HD masters made for PAL distribution as 50i Blu-Rays. that would be just sad :(

I was thinking more of content that was shot natively in 25p or 50i. Film (24p) content converted to 50i would be horrible. I hope noone other is going the route of EiV and releasing old 25p HD masters made for PAL distribution as 50i Blu-Rays. that would be just sad :(

They should release everything at 24fps or 60Hz. 50Hz video converted to 60Hz with the best motion estimation converters like from Snell Wilcox produces virtually identical image with no loss of quality. Going from 60Hz to 50Hz however, produces some loss of quality. No film that was shot at 24fps should ever be released now in HD at 50Hz, as to avoid horrible, unbareable sound (PAL) speed up. I am not a big fan of slowing down 25fps to 24fps as I hate any manipulation of sound. I'd rather see 25p converted electronically to 30p or 60p.

No film that was shot at 24fps should ever be released now in HD at 50Hz, as to avoid horrible, unbareable sound (PAL) speed up. I am not a big fan of slowing down 25fps to 24fps as I hate any manipulation of sound.

I agree with you that no 24fps film should be released in anything other than 24p (i.e. not 60i or 50i), I also agree that speed-ups/slowdowns should be avoided at all costs. :) However... I don't agree with the next quote...

They should release everything at 24fps or 60Hz. 50Hz video converted to 60Hz with the best motion estimation converters like from Snell Wilcox produces virtually identical image with no loss of quality. Going from 60Hz to 50Hz however, produces some loss of quality. I'd rather see 25p converted electronically to 30p or 60p.
(rant) :eek: F*ck that! I hate frame-interpolation and there's NOOOO reason whatsoever to do it either. 25p and 50i contents should be encoded as 50i. That means original speed, sound-pitch and no blended frames. It's part of the Blu-Ray spec. All players *should* be able to output 50i as 50i, and all modern flatscreen TVs should be able to output 50i at 50hz. Customers should complain to the Electronic company that made the product if their TV or player doesn't support these specs. The days of pitch-problems, speed-ups, bad frame-conversions should be over. And it can be over, if electronic manufacturers honor the specs, and if companies like BBC/2entertain dares to release 25p material as 50i instead of worrying about Toshiba players. F*ck Toshiba. (/rant over)
Btw, CKNA, that was not meant as an attack on you or your diplomatic opinion, more an attack of electronic manufacturers whoose lack of proper implementations makes you take such a diplomatic and pragmatic stance. (instead of cursing like a madman, like me) :D

I agree with you that no 24fps film should be released in anything other than 24p (i.e. not 60i or 50i), I also agree that speed-ups/slowdowns should be avoided at all costs. :) However... I don't agree with the next quote...


(rant) :eek: F*ck that! I hate frame-interpolation and there's NOOOO reason whatsoever to do it either. 25p and 50i contents should be encoded as 50i. That means original speed, sound-pitch and no blended frames. It's part of the Blu-Ray spec. All players *should* be able to output 50i as 50i, and all modern flatscreen TVs should be able to output 50i at 50hz. Customers should complain to the Electronic company that made the product if their TV or player doesn't support these specs. The days of pitch-problems, speed-ups, bad frame-conversions should be over. And it can be over, if electronic manufacturers honor the specs, and if companies like BBC/2entertain dares to release 25p material as 50i instead of worrying about Toshiba players. F*ck Toshiba. (/rant over)
Btw, CKNA, that was not meant as an attack on you or your diplomatic opinion, more an attack of electronic manufacturers whoose lack of proper implementations makes you take such a diplomatic and pragmatic stance. (instead of cursing like a madman, like me) :D


I agree with you that all TV's and players should play 50Hz and 60Hz. It pisses me off also, but unfortuantely it is not the case.

They should release everything at 24fps or 60Hz.


24Hz should be released at 24Hz, and 60Hz released at 60Hz.

I don't agree when it comes to 25Hz and 50Hz stuff though.

Just as PAL speed-up (24fps converted to 25fps for 50i) annoys people, 24p slow-down of 25p sources would also be annoying in the same way.


50Hz video converted to 60Hz with the best motion estimation converters like from Snell Wilcox produces virtually identical image with no loss of quality.


I don't agree. Snell and Wilcox produce excellent converters for situations where conversion is required.

However for premium quality HD-DVD and BluRay releases, there is still a quality drop involved in conversion, and so I would always urge for 50Hz stuff to stay 50Hz, and 25Hz to stay 25Hz (or if need be be transferred to 50Hz)


Going from 60Hz to 50Hz however, produces some loss of quality. No film that was shot at 24fps should ever be released now in HD at 50Hz, as to avoid horrible, unbareable sound (PAL) speed up.


Yep - now 3:2 pulldown can be avoided with 1080/24p interconnects and 48/72/96/120Hz refresh displays using 2:2, 3:3, 4:4, 5:5 etc. then the arguments for 50Hz speed-up have gone.


I am not a big fan of slowing down 25fps to 24fps as I hate any manipulation of sound. I'd rather see 25p converted electronically to 30p or 60p.

I don't agree. For European releases where all HDTVs are 50Hz and 60Hz compatible, there is no argument for not releasing 25p material at 25 or 50Hz. Slow-down is unacceptable.

25p to 30p conversion is pretty crude, and there isn't a 60p format for 1080 line material, so it would have to be 60i.

It IS really annoying that whilst Europe has mandated both 576/50i/p, 480/60i/p, 720p and 1080i 50Hz and 60Hz compatibility (along with DVI/HDMI + HDCP) for all "HD Ready" licensed TVs - ensuring the consumer has guaranteed compatibility with all HD and SD sources, that the US and Japan hasn't similar compatibility...