If you go into the menu to the align or whatever function it is called, nothing is concealed. The red to green and the blue to green pop up and you will see where there is misconvergence.

Joe. Have you done this?

I looked at mine in the grids and saw some but I couldn't see any misconvergence in the picture when watching so I said why screw with it. I think I did crank a couple of ticks in the global rather than zone convergence.

Same here. I noticed the blue was slightly higher then the lines but the picture looks spot on so I did not mess with it. Plus rumor has it if we do then we lose a little sharpness. I am very happy where everything is at and really feel that, if it is not broke then do not fix it, applies here...

We will never be happy are we?: my take i this whole thing is...
You don't hear criticism from very high end projector for this reasons:

It is a different page.
they are way to expensive, and we can't afford them. and if you could you wouldn't be reading this.
Thats why the Qualia 004 was never criticized, not many people here owe it.
No matter how good the new one is, my will be always better.
I am a dealer/ installer and I know more them you do.
I hate Sony.
but there is a silver line. all of this make this Cos. push a little harder to make it better.:)

Edit - posted in wrong forum.

This is a thread about the VPL-vw200. Iit would be appropriate for you to simply start another thread with your question,. it is totally unrelated to this projector. Thanks in advance.

Joe. it isn't a rumor. Its in your manual.

It is not right for you to state as you have many many many times that your convergence is spot on. It is good, you don't notice the misconvegence when viewing content, but you do have some degree of misconvergence when viewing the convergence grids. To say yours is spot on leads other owners to feel somehow short changed because theirs have some misconvergence.

Let's just say it is "SPOT ON" from where I am sitting. :)

Let's just say it is "SPOT ON" from where I am sitting. :)

My is too, no complaints here.
Mark I think you got a lemon;) call Sony and let them know this.
And for those people afraid that this projector can't throw a 135in diagonal (2.35 screen) yes it can. just got yesterday a fire-hawk G3 and it is just fantastic even with some roll off. I will post some pics later.

Mark I think you got a lemon;)

(sniff... sniff...) Hey! It does smell a little lemony... oh wait, that's probably just the wipes I used to clean it off. ;) :)

(sniff... sniff...) Hey! It does smell a little lemony... oh wait, that's probably just the wipes I used to clean it off. ;) :)

Let it out, some times it is good for your health and will prevent you for going insane:rolleyes:

Meanwhile I will enjoy my Vw200 until something better under 15K comes around, just don't hold your breath.

Let it out, some times it is good for your health and will prevent you for going insane:rolleyes:


You're suggesting that I should take the VW-200 out for a walk? ;) I haven't even gotten it installed yet! :)

(Kidding... Mark's 200 is taking up residence at my place now.)

You're suggesting that I should take the VW-200 out for a walk? ;) I haven't even gotten it installed yet! :)

(Kidding... Mark's 200 is taking up residence at my place now.)

I am glad it found a good home:p let us know how it behaves and don't hit it with a stick if doesn't :D

Like Alan.I play with a lot of projectors. Unlike Alan, I can't afford to keep them all. I miss some of the features the Sony has on the one I am playing with know. At the $15K MSRP and above price points, all the machines are good. If only one could have a feature choice between all the competing brands and the strenghts of each competing technolgy, 1 chip DLP,3 chip DLP, and 3 chip SXRD type could be combined. Oh well.

Dont be surprised if i pulla Gouger. Sell a machine, miss it, and buy another. :)

I sometimes go in spurts to with my PJs but after adding the Denon 3800 with the VW200 I know I am set for awhile now. We watched Mr. Magorium's Wonder Emporium on Blu ray and it looked jaw-dropping. I can't imagine where I can go from here in terms of pic Q. Consider me on hiatus! ;)

I sometimes go in spurts to with my PJs but after adding the Denon 3800 with the VW200 I know I am set for awhile now. We watched Mr. Magorium's Wonder Emporium on Blu ray and it looked jaw-dropping. I can't imagine where I can go from here in terms of pic Q. Consider me on hiatus! ;)

At least until CEDIA, right? ;)

I just spent most of the afternoon wrangling the 200 up to the ceiling. I think I must have some Egyptian pyramid-builder blood in my ancestry somewhere. ;) If all goes well... I should be watching my first 'Sapphire' movie tonight!

Kevin

Kevin hook up some Blue Ray or HD DVD. Im sure you will be a happy camper. It may take you a little to work your way through all the features and decide on what you prefer but the variety of settings and its great picture is why this machine is one of the top contenders.

Kevin hook up some Blue Ray or HD DVD. Im sure you will be a happy camper. It may take you a little to work your way through all the features and decide on what you prefer but the variety of settings and its great picture is why this machine is one of the top contenders.

I've only begun to brush the tip of the iceberg of things I have to try out at this point, but I can report some limited observations and impressions...

I did some close-up inspection of the state of the convergence. Compared with what I was used to with my old 1272 and the VW100 after that, I was impressed that the provided grid on the 200 was really one pixel wide. I did go through the whole thing and make many tiny .1 and .2 adjustments along the way. After I did this, though, I happened to put up some test patterns from my scaler (Lumagen HDP)(yes, I had already set it to 'pixel perfect') and when I hit the 'every other vertical line' pattern was treated to a grayish field with lots of greenish and pinkish washes all over the place. I went back to the VW200 and turned off the convergence adjustment, and the test pattern went back to an even medium gray. Perhaps this is the kind of thing that TJN was seeing. I ended up leaving the adjustment off.

As far as movies, I went back to the most recent one I watched on the 100 ("Timecop" HD-DVD) in which I had noticed several instances of motion blur. For the moment I'm using film mode 2 and motion low... and I didn't get taken out of the movie at all by any motion artifacts.

I then picked out "The Last Starfighter". It had been many years since I saw this movie. The biggest thing I noticed here is that (with the space theme) I was quite impressed that 'star field' shots looked VERY good. Tiny bright white dots against BLACK. I know it might measure to be actually some dark gray, but subjectively it was registering as black to my mind. This is one area where it really sets itself apart from the 100. :D

Just to add a few quick additional thoughts...

- I find myself wondering why, with the convergence adjustments turned on, I saw the strange colors with the 'every other vertical line' pattern and not with the 'every other horizontal line' pattern. Hmmm. Definitely more investigation needed here.

- When I put in "Timecop" to look at some of the scenes where I had noticed motion blur before, I ended up getting pulled into the movie and letting it run past the scene I had intended to observe many times. This is a really good sign. I was also impressed with the detail in the dark - rainy scenes, and especially the crispness of the flashes of lightning. There were a few times when I was surprised by the lightning actually consisting of multiple rapid-fire quick flashes (maybe only one frame each) which I hadn't noticed before. I did most of this watching set at Iris 1, and the only time that I can say that I really noticed the brightness modulating was right at the end when the screen goes black and the credits roll. When the first lines of credits start up from the bottom they aren't super bright, and then as they occupy more of the screen you can see the iris opening up and making them brighter. For me, if that is the worst example I encounter where the iris operation is visible then I'm happy to make the compromise to get the deeper blacks in most other program material. The blacks on this 200 with <50 hours on the lamp are significantly deeper than I had on the VW100 with 400 hours.

- I think I still like the vertical stretch of the scaler more than the vertical stretch of the 200. More investigation needed.

Shadow detail is excellent on the 200. "The Last Starfighter" is not the best transfer but the deep space shots looks really good compared to the rest of the transfer. Timecop is a fav of mine. Wait until you screen one of the better transfers :)

Shadow detail is excellent on the 200. "The Last Starfighter" is not the best transfer but the deep space shots looks really good compared to the rest of the transfer. Timecop is a fav of mine. Wait until you screen one of the better transfers :)

Yep, there were definitely scenes of TLS where the transfer was a little sketchy. There were also some where I just had to shake my head because it looked so good (e.g. some of the wide shots at the star base with many dozens of workers visible in detail.) I have yet to hook things up to pass a 1080p signal all the way from source to projector, so I have much to look forward to. :) (HDMI switcher is on the way)

Although I'm still waiting for my HDMI switcher to arrive, I decided last night to try temporarily connecting the projector directly to my XA2 to get a taste of 1080p/24.

WOW!!!

I was totally unprepared for the difference between sending 1080p/60 from my HDP deinterlacing 1080i/60 and 1080p/24 direct. Soooo much smoother. This is one of those "now I have to re-watch all my discs" events for me.

I don't think there's an icon available with a big enough smile. ;)

:D

I was totally unprepared for the difference between sending 1080p/60 from my HDP deinterlacing 1080i/60 and 1080p/24 direct.
FWIW, the HDP can also handle 1080p24 input and output with the latest firmware. So you could duplicate the same smoothness with the HDP in the chain.

FWIW, the HDP can also handle 1080p24 input and output with the latest firmware. So you could duplicate the same smoothness with the HDP in the chain.

Thanks for the reminder! I knew that there was a revision to the firmware out there, but I read about it in the context of CMS / calibration threads, and glossed over the fact that it would now deal with 1080p/24 I/O. Sweet!

Heh heh... gotta order some more HDMI / DVI adapters. ;) I'm sure I'll read about it eventually, but my next thought is whether they've gotten all the HDCP protocol stuff worked out, and whether they maybe included some of the configurable EDID features that I've been reading about in the RadianceXD threads.

Heh... that single post turned the HDP firmware update from a 'when I get to it' to a 'must do this ASAP' task. :)

The EDID in the HDP is programmable, already for quite some time, IIRC. But enough about the HDP in this VW200 thread... ;)

Was looking on line for a good price for the VW200. Found a place on the east cost with a price under 9k. Went to order it, then he asked if I wanted the lamp also for another $500!! I said that the lamp comes with it, He insisted that they buy them without the lamps. Told him that sony doesn't sell them without the lamp. He insisted that they did. I canceled the order. He got mad. I told him that it wasn't about the price, but the deception. The games that these backroom sellers play!
I want to buy one of these before Sony forces the dealers to stick to the MSRP. I'm sure that I will find another good deal before May.

Maybe I should call them back, and try ordering just the lamp as It was a good price!

Hi Again.
Just called several other places on the east coast, and they all sell without the lamp. They said that's the way they buy them from asia. WTH, Didn't think that they would come that way from any supplier.

Bobcat, why dont you just buy the one that Jason/AVS has for sale? Its listed at $9k, US, comes with the bulb and full US warranty. Plus you know its convergence is already good, without adjustments.

Bobcat, why dont you just buy the one that Jason/AVS has for sale? Its listed at $9k, US, comes with the bulb and full US warranty. Plus you know its convergence is already good, without adjustments.

I asked about buying it two weeks ago, and it was already sold at that point. The listing was taken down finally with the last sticky thread reorganization.

I would have if he still had it. Oh Well,, Will just keep looking for that "Good Deal" The Ebay prices are going down, so will just watch them. When they get to my price point, will buy one.

Words to live by, always AVOID those NY/Camera/Pro/AV online REsellers... ;)

Was looking on line for a good price for the VW200. Found a place on the east cost with a price under 9k. Went to order it, then he asked if I wanted the lamp also for another $500!! I said that the lamp comes with it, He insisted that they buy them without the lamps. Told him that sony doesn't sell them without the lamp. He insisted that they did. I canceled the order. He got mad. I told him that it wasn't about the price, but the deception. The games that these backroom sellers play!
I want to buy one of these before Sony forces the dealers to stick to the MSRP. I'm sure that I will find another good deal before May.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE, I Know that part of Brooklyn NY don't buy anything from them their busyness tactics are terrible . PLEASE if you want a good deal call Graig on TheaterTec he has great deals.

Just an update. I have been using the new Denon 3800 Blu ray unit with the VW200 and the picture is astounding. I am sending in a direct 1080p/24 (not 23.98 or 23.97) because the Denon only does the resolution that way. Good thing the VW200 can take a direct 1080p/24 and display it nicely. :) I am still going thru my crystalio II and really like the picture Q. There has been some great HD media releases lately...

Joe, Do you see any diff if you run the Denon BR directly to the VW200, by-passing the vp?

Difference in pic Q or resolution settings?

Pic Q I like having my crystalio II gamma high IRE setting with most content. It really adds a pop to the picture while keeping blacks very deep and inky. Resolution wise I would see the stutter when I have the Denon go in 1080p/24 direct then have the crystalio II send out 1080p/23.98. The crystlaio II has a custom setting so I can send out a direct 1080p/24 (same it gets from the Denon) so the picture maintains a nice smooth judder free motion.

Joe... what happened to the 'hiatus' going without a VP you talked about ~10 days ago?

I made it 10 days. :)

I tried to go forward. Then I put back in the crystalio II to double check the resolution the Denon 3800 was sending and when I first turned it on it was on DirecTV. It was on Night at the Museum in HD. I saw the extra punch it gave the picture in 5 seconds. I then went without it again just to see again. I realized I like having all the control of my set up. I like all the info it gives me. What is coming in, out, color space, resolution, film, video and so on. Then I realized I couldn't go back without. Alan gave me that High Gamma trick which is pure eye candy. :eek:

Now I will say if I never had the crystalio II hooked up I probably would be fine. But once you get used to something it is hard to go without. ;)

Hi guys. Finally next week, Sony will deliver my VW200 and I will receive my Denon BD Player from the local Denon representative. Can you give me some rapid initial set-up based on your experience that I can use to start using both? That way I can begin with your settings and adjust them to my room. Thanks a lot!!!!

It is hard to do that since your VW200 will be brand spanking new and at its brightest. I have noticed now that I am approaching 500 hours on my lamp that the film projection mode is more noticeable than before and that is still in mode 3. The best I can tell you is to reread my intial posts and go from there. My settings have been tweaked more to go with my lamp hours since it has now settled in. I am very happy with my brightness. I plan to get another lamp when I get around 800 or so. Then I will keep this one as my full time spare whenever I need to change out a lamp after it has went out. I am almost there! :)

I had an interesting session with my 200 last evening. I stopped on the way home to pick up a Panny DMP-BD30, since I had discovered that my BD10 was not 24p capable (or ever would be via firmware upgrade.) So, I was interested on pulling out Blu-ray discs that I'd already watched to check them out with the smoothness of 24 fps. As so many of these sessions go, it turned into a "Let's play with the 200 modes to see what looks the best" click-fest. :)

Similar to what many have reported here, I had mostly settled in to running the 200 in Film mode 3 and with Motion Off or sometimes Low. I was still seeing some flickery-blurry-ness now and then, but more and more was thinking that this might just be a attribute of the film transfer itself. Nonetheless, my brain still involuntarily interprets this as a projection artifact that I never ever used to notice on my CRT projector. The Panny 30 also allows me to nicely observe frame-by-frame to see what is statically on the film frame, so it's easy to isolate whether what I've noticed is something that appears natively on the film (e.g. some pans have blurred images on the frame) or whether it's related to the presentation of the sequence of frames.

So, the first disc that I popped in was "Casino Royale". After the black and white segment, the opening animation sequence was uber-smooth... bringing a 24p smile to my face. :) In the jungle segments, I isolated on the couple of seconds where the camera pans across the 3 cases of money and observed some interesting blur-blocking of the money details as the camera moved, especially with the motion modes. At that point I reverted to Motion Off, still staying in Film 3.

The next isolated segment that grabbed my attention was right after the sunlit hydro-plane flying over the ocean, when the shot switches to the helicopter taking off. As the chopper rises, there was significant artifacting of the two parallel red stripes on the side as they move up and out of the frame. It sort of looked like some kind of stobe effect. The two lines begin the ascent looking correct against the white body, but then I was losing the solidity as the speed increased. I have the feeling that the distance between these high contrast lines was interacting with the frame rate as the movement got to a certain speed. This was visible in all Film settings (1, 2, 3, and Off). Stopping on the individual frames, though, showed that the lines were clearly in focus all the way out of the shot. I tried going back to Motion Low. In this setting the lines retained their composure, but I observed some sparkly artifacting within the lines. Changing to Motion High kept the lines solid much better, with just a tiny bit of the the sparkly artifact just an instant before they left the frame.

This left me with a conundrum, though. In this instance I've identified that the setting which minimizes my observation of motion artifacts is also one which has been consistently criticized for use with motion pictures. Some of the comments I've read have compared it to video versus film, or that it causes people to feel like they are taken out of the illusion of the film context and on to the set where the film was shot. Some have imagined that it looks like the video that a director might have taken simultaneously with the film to review before the dailies of the previous days film. I can understand and see the basis for all of those impressions. I read all those comments before I got my 200, so naturally I have had all that commentary coloring my initial impressions.

I don't disagree that the motion features of the 200 do not reproduce the look of film. As I allowed myself to watch using them, though, what struck me was how incredibly three dimensional everything looked. Really intensely three dimensional. Back to "Casino Royale", the scene where Bond rides the girl around the loop in the parking lot and ends up back at the entrance... the car looked absolutely real, and the impression of it moving away from the camera seemed like a real 3d effect. Later in the film, walking into the parlor where the high stakes poker game was to happen literally felt like walking into a 3 dimensional space. Not watching the characters walk into the space, but literally entering the space yourself.

It occurs to me that what might be needed to accept this feature is just a slightly different kind of 'suspension of disbelief' that we're well versed in applying to movie-watching. The holy grail reference standard seems to always be that our home theaters look just like the presentation of real film projection in the theater. Simultaneously, there is increasing talk that the 'next big thing' in movie entertainment will be 3D. What if the motion enhancement features of the VW200 actually give us a taste of what 3D movies will be like? I'm well aware of the fact that reproducing the intent of the films director and producer is an established goal, and that intent didn't include any of this impression of 3D realism. This is certainly using the data that was captured on film to produce a different experience than watching that film, but for myself I'm challenging the notion that this is necessarily bad.

We always talk about the impression with high definition sources of 'looking through a window' into the real world. In some ways the motion enhancement features of the 200 are the difference between looking through that window with one eye closed, or with both eyes open and seeing the depth of the panorama.

It's not as though the motion enhancement features are totally without artifacts of their own. As I noted above with the 'money cases', on some pan shots I can see the motion processing 'losing its grip' on some particular objects and throwing up a dusty block for a split second around the object. At other times, I observed what appeared like heat waves emanating around a moving object. Another place I saw some artifacting (as noted in a different post) was in "Shaun of the Dead" when he is entering the convenience store. As he walks down the isle towards the refrigerator case at the back, the cans and jars on the shelves do all sorts of small de-resing. In some ways I can't help but wonder whether what I'm seeing in these cases is the video processing in the projector running out of computing capacity to keep up with the dynamic burst of processing to deal with many high contrast moving features.

So, I guess it's a case of 'pick your poison'. With all the film mode settings I'm still seeing some motion artifacts... not really 'blur' as in lacking focus, but a kind of object flashing / strobe effect with some motion. And yes, some of these artifacts may actually mimic actual film presentation artifacts. Alternatively, the motion enhancement features make thing look more 3 dimensional and 'real' than is part of the normal film experience (though at much higher resolution than normal video capture), and there are some artifacts there as well. I'm beginning to suspect that the artifacts in the latter case may be less objectionable to me than the flicker / strobe ones. I have also noticed that keeping Motion on Low rather than High does preserve some of the film feel while still keeping a portion of the 3D feel... which might end up being a good compromise.

Watching pieces of 'The Fifth Element' with Motion on Low were a revelation. When Lilu gets 'awakened' by the flash after reconstitution, I literally felt like I was constrained inside the transparent container with her. I could really feel the smallness of the apartment of Dallas. In the scene with the performance of the Diva, you could get a real sense of the space inside the auditorium.

I know that some of this may be considered heresy among film buffs. The way that the motion enhancement features of the VW200 work with frame interpolation are really the motion-dynamic analogy to the normal within-a-single-frame upscaling pixel interpolation that is in use commonly now to present SD source material on much higher resolution displays. Both are technically adding information to the presentation that wasn't present in the original source. For the motion enhancement features, the fact that it alleviates some artifacts that I personally find distracting has me wondering whether the end experience (although it is different from the intended film experience) might be an interesting and entertaining step in the direction of the 3D future on its own merits.

I just sat down to look at this month's Sound & Vision mag and was impressed that an article "A League of its Own" had a nice theater set up which featured the VW200. TO bad throughout the entire article they kept calling it the VW100 PJ. :eek: You would think they would at least get that right... :rolleyes:

Kevin

Using the motion feature during movies can indeed look very 3d. It worked great with the Simpson's movie. It works best on slow horizontal pans, it can be scary creepy at times. It also seamed to bother my eyes at times because when a scene pans we are use to film judder but when the image is solid and does not break up your eyes tend to lock on to the pan and you find yourself having to look away for a second and returning to the scene because it is un natural looking during the movement.

Kevin

Using the motion feature during movies can indeed look very 3d. It worked great with the Simpson's movie. It works best on slow horizontal pans, it can be scary creepy at times. It also seamed to bother my eyes at times because when a scene pans we are use to film judder but when the image is solid and does not break up your eyes tend to lock on to the pan and you find yourself having to look away for a second and returning to the scene because it is un natural looking during the movement.

This is all uncharted territory for me in terms of understanding what impressions people apply to what they're seeing on screen. You seem to be saying that the film judder is a comforting factor that keeps your mind understanding that "it's only a movie." That same judder may be a part of what my brain now seems to interpret as an artifact. I'm sure that part of this is from having been conditioned to watching movies on my CRT projector for so many years at 60p, and growing over time to really prefer that to the flicker that now seems much more prominent in film.

I have to admit feeling once or twice the 'scary creepy' sensation, but for me it was because what I was seeing just looked so REAL, and I guess I'm challenging the notion that this is a bad thing. Can you explain further what you are sensing that looks 'un natural'? Is it that it doesn't look like film? The 'solid and does not break up' frequently seems to pull me into the scene. The sensation is really one that eliminates the boundary at the screen surface, and places the movie scene as an extension of my room.

I don't know if the fascination of this is something that is going to wear off after awhile. I don't know how well the effect is going to be retained with different movies. I do know that this is a totally different experience, and I'm challenging myself to not apply a negative connotation a priori because it differs significantly from pure film presentation. As I said above... probably heresy for many. I've probably watched "The Fifth Element" hundreds of times, but I never felt as personally engaged 'you are there' as I did last night with Motion on Low.

I just sat down to look at this month's Sound & Vision mag and was impressed that an article "A League of its Own" had a nice theater set up which featured the VW200. TO bad throughout the entire article they kept calling it the VW100 PJ. :eek: You would think they would at least get that right... :rolleyes:

I'm sure that there was probably a VW100 hanging there when the article text was originally written, which had been swapped out by the time they got around to photographing the setup.

That magazine is sure getting thin... hope it survives at least as long as my current subscription (October 09)

You maybe right about the photo versus article writing time. Either way the VW200 looked great hanging in that theater! ;)

You maybe right about the photo versus article writing time. Either way the VW200 looked great hanging in that theater! ;)

It did! I can just imagine some magazine editor saying "I can't believe anybody is going to notice the difference" (that it had been upgraded to the 200)

I've tried reading through as many of the 700+ posts as I could but I've been working on setting up a dedicated home theater. A local company will be installing everything and suggested the VW200 with the optional anamorphic lens adapter and a 106" Gray Hawk Screen. The room is being built from the ground up so will be totally light controlled.
Many of the reviews and comments I've seen comment on the brightness. I know this depends on the screen and lighting but have people with this screen size been happy with the picture or are there other projectors I might consider?
It will also be paired with an Anthem Statement D2 so the video processing will be done there if that matters for the picture. Thanks.

Joe will now pop in re brightness no problem with his Silver Star.Seriously,a 106' grayhawk with its gain of 0.8 should givea very CRT like image with adequate but no eye popping brightness.

Many of the reviews and comments I've seen comment on the brightness. I know this depends on the screen and lighting but have people with this screen size been happy with the picture or are there other projectors I might consider?

I am using the VW200 on a 110" 2.35:1 screen with an anamorphic lens. My screen is a 1.3 gain screen in a light controlled room and I have no compliants yet about the brightness. I am only at 65 hours on the bulb so far, but having come from CRT front projection (via a VW100), the brightness is fine.

Simon

And now that my lamp has settled in it still has been able to maintain its nice level of brightness. I really like the consistent picture I get. We watched Dan In Real Life tonite and it had very nice colors. My neighbors kept saying how wonderful they were. After the fifth or sixth time I wanted to puke but I have to admit you can never hear that compliment to much. ;)

I am using the VW200 on a 110" 2.35:1 screen with an anamorphic lens. My screen is a 1.3 gain screen in a light controlled room and I have no compliants yet about the brightness. I am only at 65 hours on the bulb so far, but having come from CRT front projection (via a VW100), the brightness is fine.

Simon

You and I have followed very similar paths. I had CRT projection from 1998 until last October or so. I finally caved on the temptation to go CIH and got a VW100, lens, and a Carada BW 1.4 gain 2.35:1 120". Last week I swapped out the VW100 for a 200, which has 68 hours on the lamp now. I'm quite happy with the brightness and the blacks of the Sapphire.

I had some friends over tonight to go out to dinner and then check out the new projector. At dinner I was talking about my observations from last night (documented above). When we got back, they wanted to see some of the specific scenes from "The Fifth Element" that I had talked about... with the anticipation of moving on to a different movie quickly.

We started at the beginning, and my friends encouraged me to crank the motion enhancer to High so they could be sure to see the effect I was talking about. Heh heh. After about 3 minutes one commented "I thought all this talk about 3D was just going to be a subtle geek-hobbyist thing that you'd have to point out. This is so lifelike it's like something I've never seen before, even though I've seen this movie many times." We ended up watching the whole movie through.

What I'm trying to figure out now is to what degree I really want to feel like I'm watching film when I put in a Blu-ray or HD-DVD. Setting Motion on High is a different experience entirely. I thought this evening that it was like watching the same actors, on the same sets, with all the same special effects, re-enact the movie word for word in a live Broadway play.

I think the artifacting you are seeing is probably due to the early stage of motion flow perhaps comparable to the earlier stages of deinterlacing. A perfect 1/2 way frame between the image before the inserted frame and after the inserted frame must be constructed. A ball moving in a straight line, easy. A helicoptor with lines yada yada, not so easy. I am sure that motion flow will get better and better over the next 4 or 5 years as Sony figures out how to better implement it. Better algs, more crunch power.

In searching this thread I find no mention of it so need to ask. Has Sony improved their sealing/filtering of the optical light path to prevent dust blobs? If not, is the VW200 still user cleanable?

This has been a real annoyance on my very long in the tooth 10HT but at least cleaning isn't terribly difficult, though a bit of a PITA since it's ceiling mounted. The Sapphire is on my short list of potential upgrades.

I thinkthe artifacting you are seeing is probably due to the early stage of motion flow perhaps comparable to the earlier stages of deinterlacing. A perfect 1/2 way frame between the image before the inserted frame and after the inserted frame must be constructed. A ballmoving in a straight line, easy. A helicoptor with lines yada yada,not so easy I am sure that motion flow will get better and better over the next 4 or 5 years as Sony figures out how to better implement it. Better algs, more crunch power.

I'll be extremely interested to see where these algorithms lead in the next iteration or two. Over time there will be more power to take more frames forward / backward into consideration for the derived insertions. It will also be interesting to see as more and more directors use digital technologies for principal capture whether some of the artifacts that are related to the physics of film begin to go away. With my luck, they'll probably spend big $$ trying to perfectly replicate the film artifacts and we'll have judder long after anybody remembers why it existed in the first place. ;)

In searching this thread I find no mention of it so need to ask. Has Sony improved their sealing/filtering of the optical light path to prevent dust blobs? If not, is the VW200 still user cleanable?

This has been a real annoyance on my very long in the tooth 10HT but at least cleaning isn't terribly difficult, though a bit of a PITA since it's ceiling mounted. The Sapphire is on my short list of potential upgrades.

I've not noticed any owners of recent models (Ruby, Sapphire, Pearl, etc.) talking about dust blobs at all.

I've not noticed any owners of recent models (Ruby, Sapphire, Pearl, etc.) talking about dust blobs at all.

Thanks. Maybe Sony listens after all.

can you share so found best settings with me, I have this for a client with a 110 stewart firehawk screen , projector is 15 ft away , ceiling mount , but some how i do not get the pop , brightness seems to be lacking?

I am using this projector with a 110 stewart firehawk, room is completly black, projector was running comp. thru a pioneer vsx 72 , when first hu but now goes thru comp via a sonystrda5300es, the lamp has 115 hrs on it now it seemed to really pop for brightness at first but now less, is it because the change in receiver video processor? will switching to hdmi help? detail seems really well, but comes off dark, if try to brighten up , seems washed out,,,, any suggestions?????

I have been using the new Denon 3800 Blu ray unit with the VW200 and the picture is astounding. I am sending in a direct 1080p/24 (not 23.98 or 23.97) because the Denon only does the resolution that way.
I'm wondering how that can work. I mean 99.99% of all Blu-Ray discs are definitely encoded in (and marked as) 23.976. Now if the Denon plays those at 24.000 then for a 2 hour movie the audio should be off by 7 seconds in the end of the movie. I'm wondering how the Denon keeps audio in sync!?

I first go into my 905 receiver than my crystalio II. The Denon also has a HDMI AV sync option as well. Either way we watched Dan In Real Life and never lost sync once. We also watched Mr. Magorium's WOnder Emporium with the same result... I still don't like the difference and am hoping Denon comes out today and recognizes their mistake. If not I won't keep the 3800 beyond this week.

I can't help it, things like this don't strengthen my confidence in source devices. My impression has been for a long time that the devices which most often do things wrong are source devices. If Denon didn't even get the framerate right what else have they done wrong? :(

I'm wondering how that can work. I mean 99.99% of all Blu-Ray discs are definitely encoded in (and marked as) 23.976. Now if the Denon plays those at 24.000 then for a 2 hour movie the audio should be off by 7 seconds in the end of the movie. I'm wondering how the Denon keeps audio in sync!?24P is an acceptable label for this output mode. It's really 23.976, but for simplicity Denon calls it 24P. It wouldn't work otherwise without messing up the audio.

Vern

I know, but to their credit the image is excellent. I am contemplating going back to either my BD30 or Pioneer 95 if I send it back this week. I don't know what their record has been lately for firmware fixes (it has been 3 or 4 years since I owned their product) but I will give them a couple of days to at least announce something. And yes, 1080p/24 direct was a mistake the XA2 and first Pioneer Blu ray unit so how in the heck do they make the same mistake in March of 08? :eek:

Sorry Vern, it does not work unless I have it go thru my crystalio II. ALso, the crystalio II reports it as an exact 24P not 23.98 or 23.97. It has never been wrong. Also, when it goes into my crystalio II at straight 1080p/24 then goes out at 23.98 I get frame drops every 60 seconds or so. I have not had any issues with other Blu ray players or HD DVD players when they send in 1080p/23.98 or 23.97. Only the Denon doing 1080p/24... Trust me, it is wrong!

I think I'm definitely settling in to using Motion enhancement on Low as a preferred setting for movies. For me it retains a fair portion of the filmic look while removing the artifacts that have bothered me, but moderates the 3D effect to a really detailed image with palpable depth instead of the full-on 3D of the High setting. So far, I've found this compromise to be enough to mostly remove the sensation of "I'm just watching actors on a movie set."

I watched "The Matrix" HD-DVD last evening. Aside from my XA2 mostly refusing to play chapter 20, it was easily the best I've ever seen it (including in the theater on the original release date.) I'm (finally) getting to the point where I don't really feel that I'm seeing negative factors of the digital technology (artifacts, blur, etc.) counterbalancing the positives of the greatly enhanced detail and nicely saturated colors and brightness.

Extremely happy with my 200 right now. :D

I'm with you. I use low for film-based material and high for video-based material. Still cannot get 24p from my source through the Lumaen radiance to the VW200 without serious picture dropouts, so motion enhancer is my best option for judder removal.

I'm with you. I use low for film-based material and high for video-based material. Still cannot get 24p from my source through the Lumaen radiance to the VW200 without serious picture dropouts, so motion enhancer is my best option for judder removal.

My Lumagen HDP is sitting on the sidelines right now. I did upgrade to the most recent firmware to try and see if the reported ability to process 1080p/24 from input to output worked. After getting back in the signal path I tried to reconfigure the output setting to 24 (23.9-whatever), and was consistently getting 'out of range' messages. Tried 48, still no dice. Ignoring that for the moment I tried then to rework the pixel adjustments, and the thing eventually got into a mode where all test pattern lines were crawling with noise and I couldn't seem to get it out of that mode. At the time I wasn't in the mood to start again from zero, so I took it back out of the loop and reverted to my outboard hdmi switcher. I'll get back to it eventually. The anamorphic zoom mode of the 200 is fine for me to use my lens until I get the VP working again.

I am sending 24p from my XA2 and BD30 to the projector, and all my comments regarding use of the Motion enhancer Low are in that context. So far it's the only setting that has reduced my awareness of artifacts back down to the level that I had with my previous CRT projector. I also use the High setting for video source material. For some reason it doesn't ellicit the same ultra-3D effect with that material.

I do wonder if the motion enhancer does have the side-effect of subtly increasing eye fatigue, though. After I watched "The Matrix" on Sunday evening I tried to watch POTC "At Worlds End"... and had to stop about 40 minutes in because I was falling asleep. Last evening I tried to finish it starting at about 9:30... and was having a hard time keeping my eyes open again.

Or maybe POTC AWE is just inherently sleep-inducing. ;)

Keven you want to set the Lumagen to 23.97

The short cut code on the Lumagen is to press menu then 020 and that will set the output for you.
I have my XA2 hooked up and its working fine. The VW200 unlike the VW100 will not take 48hz.

I found the motion flow to work best for sports and HDTV viewing more so then for movies but this is subjective. I did like it on some movies but not all.

Keven you want to set the Lumagen to 23.97

The short cut code on the Lumagen is to press menu then 020 and that will set the output for you.
I have my XA2 hooked up and its working fine. The VW200 unlike the VW100 will not take 48hz.

I found the motion flow to work best for sports and HDTV viewing more so then for movies but this is subjective. I did like it on some movies but not all.


I tried. In the OUT settings on vertical rate, I first tried to enter 24. It double checks whether I want 24 or 23.97 in a 'drop down' and I select 23.97. It then says 'input out of range'. I tried a couple of different things, but the only thing it would accept was the 59 point whatever video refresh rate.

I did think that somehow this might be related to the HDMI signal chain and wasn't sure whether the XA2 was putting out 24 or whether it had reverted to 60 because of some handshake issue. Bottom line at that moment though I was trying to get the signal chain re-established quickly and these issues were frustrating my efforts to get back to a usable setup - so I bailed. I need to do a reset and start from scratch when I have time I think. I'm still getting a grasp on the way all the different settings between gear interact (e.g. the various positioning settings on the HDP versus the signal position adjustment in the 200.)

I agree that the use of the motion enhancer on movies is subjective. For me there is a significant difference between Low and High. On High, the 3D effect can sometimes be somwhat 'in your face' and obvious (even scary or creepy). The 3D sensation is interesting, but sometimes can also make incidental zooms and pans look like they were inserted intentionally to demonstrate the effect (which of course they were not.) We all remember those cheesy 3D productions where they gratuitously threw things at the camera just to get people to duck.

Low setting is much more subtle, just making certain shots look dimensionally deep and detailed while still avoiding the flicker/judder stuff that bugs me. As I've been watching a movie in Low I've also sometimes forgotten that I even had it turned on, and switched to the High setting momentarily just to revisit the difference.

Just a quick UPDATE. Denon has told me they will have a firmware fix for the 1080p/24 issue within 2 weeks! I knew I wasn't crazy... :D

We watched I AM Legend Blu ray lastnite and it looked excellent. The shadow detail was superb with those inky black areas. I highly suggest watching it in a darkened room. ;)

Next on tap, Enchanted Blu ray... :eek:

Just a quick UPDATE. Denon has told me they will have a firmware fix for the 1080p/24 issue within 2 weeks! I knew I wasn't crazy... :D



We're gonna need more evidence than that... ;)

Good point! :)

Admitting I am an Eye Candy Extremist does make me a little crazy! :eek:

Don't be so modest! :)

This is my first post so be easy on me :)

I've been an avid reader of this site for well over a year and have learned so much! Thanks for all the great information in helping me choose my home theater system:

Pioneer Elite 49TX receiver(w/i-link upgrade)
Denon 3800BDCi & Pioneer Elite HD-1
Classe CA-5100
B&W 802D's
B&W HTM2D
Some Boston Acoustic VR surrounds and rear surrounds
Pioneer Elite DV-79AVi
Yamaha DPX-1100 DLP Projector (720p)

On the way:

Classe CA-3200
Classe SSP-800

My question is I am itching to upgrade my projector to the VW200 (1080p over the 720p I have now) and was this close to doing so until I saw the DreamVision Dream Bee2 at a local A/V store. I couldn't believe how nice it looked and at a lower cost than the VW200. I apologize for even comparing these two as from what I've read here the 200 is awesome but I wondered if anyone has seen both of these in action and could comment what they thought.

I guess since I have a lot of expensive gear on the way I could wait for the VW300 or whatever will replace the 200 this fall but from what I've seen the 1080p projectors (and especially the VW200) look phenomenal. Do you think the VW200 is a huge enough upgrade over the DPX-1100 that it's worth getting now or would waiting one generation be ok? Thanks for any replies!

Ralph

My question is I am itching to upgrade my projector to the VW200 (1080p over the 720p I have now) and was this close to doing so until I saw the DreamVision Dream Bee2 at a local A/V store. I couldn't believe how nice it looked and at a lower cost than the VW200. I apologize for even comparing these two as from what I've read here the 200 is awesome but I wondered if anyone has seen both of these in action and could comment what they thought.

If price is a factor - My suggestion is look at the
Sony VPL-VW60. They are selling online for $2999..

I'll bet the VW60 will beat the Dream Bee2. It won't
beat the VW200 - after all it is not in the same price
range as the VW200.

Thanks for the reply, drhankz. Price isn't a concern right now, fortunately! Do you think the VW200 is an evolutionary or revolutionary step up from my Yamaha DPX-1100? It's not a bad projector but if the Sony's just an evolutionary upgrade I may wait for the next high line VW. I've read the early specs for the new XBR8 line and I'm hoping those bells and whistles make it over to the projector line.

Thanks for the reply, drhankz. Price isn't a concern right now, fortunately! Do you think the VW200 is an evolutionary or revolutionary step up from my Yamaha DPX-1100? It's not a bad projector but if the Sony's just an evolutionary upgrade I may wait for the next high line VW. I've read the early specs for the new XBR8 line and I'm hoping those bells and whistles make it over to the projector line.

I can't comment on the Yamaha.

I have owned Front-Projectors since 1996 they
have either been RONCO or SONY. Now I'm a
Sony Bigot. I was going to buy the VW200 but
decided it was not a big enough step up over
my VW100. I was lucky to see the Sony DIAMOND
Prototype and speculation was the VW200 was
the Diamond. but it is NOT the Diamond - so I'll
wait for that product before I buy my next Sony
PJ. The Diamond will not be Cheaper than the
VW200 and I don't know when Sony will announce it.

If price is not a concern and you need a new PJ today
I would buy the VW200.

Get the 200... It is well worth it. :)

Get the 200... It is well worth it. :)

ABSOLUTELY well worth it if you need a PJ now.

Thanks for the replies from both drhankz and joerod. Although the VW200 really has me thinking hard about it the eventual diamond probably is worth the wait. I listened to both of you over on the bdp-hd1 thread and bought that piece and I'm so happy with it I'm not upgrading until a Pioneer Elite flagship blu-ray player comes out. joerod....I love your HT enthusiasm but if I listened to EVERYTHING you said I'd be one poor dude ;) More HT lovin' power to ya!

drhankz, if the diamond comes in under 25k this fall/winter and if Sonystyle or Magnolia has one of their three year same as cash offers...there'll be a diamond hanging from my ceiling (hopefully).

:D

Ralph

drhankz, if the diamond comes in under 25k this fall/winter and if Sonystyle or Magnolia has one of their three year same as cash offers...there'll be a diamond hanging from my ceiling (hopefully).

:D

Ralph

If my Ruby died today - I would have a VW200 by Monday.

But since I'm lucky with my Ruby and it is SPOT-ON - I
can wait until SOMEDAY :mad: Don't know when - Sony
might release the Diamond.

Anyone needing a NEW PJ today - the VW200 is the way to go.

My biggest problem with all of the Sony's is the dynamic iris. In my opinion you absolutely need a masking system otherwise the black bars during 2.35:1 movies are almost always a shade of grey which completely takes away from the image. Otherwise I really like the 60 and the 200. I used to own the Ruby and I traded that for a 60. I dont own the 200, but struggle to see a major difference from the 60.

My biggest problem with all of the Sony's is the dynamic iris. In my opinion you absolutely need a masking system otherwise the black bars during 2.35:1 movies are almost always a shade of grey which completely takes away from the image. Otherwise I really like the 60 and the 200. I used to own the Ruby and I traded that for a 60. I dont own the 200, but struggle to see a major difference from the 60.

I never use the IRIS.

drhankz
I hope you can tell us that the Diamond was brighter and will be brighter than the vw200Will the Diamond step sxrd back up to the Q004 lumen level to handle bigger screens or more ambient light?

I never use the IRIS.

But then the contrast is acceptable at best?

If price is a factor - My suggestion is look at the
Sony VPL-VW60. They are selling online for $2999..


$2999? :confused:

drhankz
I hope you can tell us that the Diamond was brighter and will be brighter than the vw200Will the Diamond step sxrd back up to the Q004 lumen level to handle bigger screens or more ambient light?

What I saw was FANTASTIC - what will eventually
be delivered is UNKNOWN. The prototype I saw needed
a lot of Tweaking. It's like a powerful race car. Either
they figure out how to make it reliable and stable or
they back out some performance to get it reliable.

But then the contrast is acceptable at best?

I find the Ruby with NO IRIS in my theater is
acceptable. Could it be improved - sure.
But I'll wait for a newer unit. I'm anti-iris:D

Native is always better :D

$2999 sounds right for the 40. The dealer cost on the 60 is considerably higher than $2999.

Ive seen the $2999 price from NYC camera shops. When you call they want another $500 for the lamp and then a crazy shipping fee:)

I find the Ruby with NO IRIS in my theater is
acceptable. Could it be improved - sure.
But I'll wait for a newer unit. I'm anti-iris:D

Native is always better :D

Agreed! Not a fan of auto iris tricks.

Ive seen the $2999 price from NYC camera shops. When you call they want another $500 for the lamp and then a crazy shipping fee:)

Tell you what Alan - you are most likely Right.

But if you order it online and get a print out
of your order when they call you back and
then TELL THEM you are recording the call
and they are doing bait and switch.

Guess What Happens?????

You get the exact product at the price they
advertise. I called them on the carpet more
than once and they delivered. Of course
they were very angry :mad:

I was going to buy the VW200 but
decided it was not a big enough step up over
my VW100.

I bought a 100 back in October, after using CRT projectors since 1998. A couple weeks ago I did see enough of a step up from the 100 to make the move to a 200.

My 100 wasn't exactly what I would call spot-on, but 1080i component sources could be adjusted with the chroma delay setting on my lumagen HDP to bring the red field into good alignment with the green/blue, so I was OK for 1080i. I thought the blacks were ok, but not great (given my recent CRT history). I was more bothered by the motion blur and strobe/flickery artifacts than I had originally anticipated.

With the 200, blacks are now within a reasonable approximation of those I was accustomed to seeing w/ CRT. The convergence of my 200 is very close to being spot-on, and that's working from a 1 pixel grid versus the 2 or 3 of the 100, so things in general are much sharper.

A main difference, though, is its ability to handle 24p properly. With my 100 I was still using component switching at 1080i and then converting to 1080p in the Lumagen. The inability of the 100 to really handle 24p natively made it easy to ignore that I was still only at 1080i for most of my signal path. The opportunity to have 1080p all the way from source to projector was a significant upgrade in my estimation.

Beyond that, the major distinction is the new processing modes. For many the film modes are enough to eliminate enough of the blur/flicker artifacts. For me, the motion enhancer has finally provided a setting where I can stop seeing any significant artifacts for the majority of movies... and that is worth whatever it costs.

The opportunity to have 1080p all the way from source to projector was a significant upgrade in my estimation..

The VW100 kind of supports 24 fps - but not as well as the VW200.

No Question.

The VW100 supports 48 fps not 24 fps.

I run 1080p to my Ruby all the time. The only thing
that is 1080i in my theater is HDTV. My D2 converts
'that to 1080p which is the only thing I feed to the
Ruby. All my Hi-Def DVD sources are 1080p native.

I have used my D2 to convert 1080p/24 to 1080p/48.
It is not that HOT.

My 1 pixel convergence is right on. If it wasn't - I
agree there is nothing I could do about it.

With the VW200 - you should be able to throw your
lumagen away.

There is NO QUESTION the VW200 is Better than the
VW100. SUBJECT CLOSED :D I AGREE 100%.

But having seen what MIGHT be next - my choice is to WAIT.

I also came from 12 years of Runco CRT PJs.

My biggest problem with all of the Sony's is the dynamic iris. In my opinion you absolutely need a masking system otherwise the black bars during 2.35:1 movies are almost always a shade of grey which completely takes away from the image. Otherwise I really like the 60 and the 200. I used to own the Ruby and I traded that for a 60. I dont own the 200, but struggle to see a major difference from the 60.

I spent the past few weekends doing a side by side with the 60 and the 200. They were not identical setups and they were both at the Sony Store here in NY where they are on display. The biggest difference was that the 200 had more depth to the picture. I know that sounds cryptic for a description but that's the only way to describe it. As Art would say, it had that "Wow" factor over the 60. The 60 was still an impressive machine for the price though. I've been torn between the two Sony's for a while and the JVC's. I'm leaning towards the JVC (not trying to start a flame war here!) but that's after spending a few hours with each of them.

200 - Very impressive image, color were okay on an uncalibrated unit but I think it could definately wow the crowd once it's calibrated. It had a very 3D look to the picture, I demoed with Pirates 2 Blu=Ray and Ultra Violet Blu-Ray. Not to mention that I found the image to be crisper than I had expected. I'm not sure what the iris setting was but I could see the auto iris without looking to hard for it, I'm sure you can dial it down as they had it set rather aggressively.

60 - For the lower priced projectors (not a slap, but it is a great price for the hardware!) it looked very good. Sharp picture, fairly bright, even in non-perfect conditions with plenty of recessed ambient light. The colors were vibrant, not as sharp as the JVC RS-2 or the Sony 200. The blacks were not as good as the 200 and the image did not have the depth of the 200 either, comparitavely it seemed rather flat (that could have been because of the demo material as well though.) I demoed with "I am Legend" Blu-Ray, NCAA HD Basketball from I believe Comcast, and some random image demo disk on blu-ray.

RS2 - It was running in high power and had not been calibrated. Saw a couple of random demo disks on this from blu-ray and comcast HD. The colors were good, blacks were better than either of the Sony's. The colors on the RS2 and the Sony 200 were pretty close, the Sony 200 I felt was a tad sharper. The Sony 200 had that 3d look on the material that the JVC didn't. Don't know what they're doing to get that but it's a cool thing to see. JVC was brighter (a little bit brighter, but JVC had a newer bulb too...not sure the hours on it) than the 200 and the 60 on comparably sized screens. JVC had better blacks and obviously no iris to distract. I wish I had seen different demo material on the JVC b/c I could see that technically it could perform as well or better than the sony 200 (in my opinion). The blacks were better but they're not a "perfect black" either. All in all it's a close call, I haven't been able to see the RS1 yet. Still working to find one in NYC to check out.

The decision point for me comes down to if you want a 3d looking image or better blacks and contrast and a little bit more brightness. I'm leaning towards the JVC as the 3d image is impressive, but I'd rather have the brightness edge and I don't think I"ll miss that image depth...once you're used to seeing you're own picture it just keeps growing on you mentality.

Cheers!

Oh, I did see the 100 and the 50 a few months ago so I can weigh in on those as well, but only listed the newer models to be relevant to discussion. I will say that both the 200 and the 60 are a good step -up from the 100 and the 60 (again, in my opinion)

The VW100 kind of supports 24 fps - but not as well as the VW200.

No Question.

The VW100 supports 48 fps not 24 fps.

I run 1080p to my Ruby all the time. The only thing
that is 1080i in my theater is HDTV. My D2 converts
'that to 1080p which is the only thing I feed to the
Ruby. All my Hi-Def DVD sources are 1080p native.

I have used my D2 to convert 1080p/24 to 1080p/48.
It is not that HOT.

My 1 pixel convergence is right on. If it wasn't - I
agree there is nothing I could do about it.

With the VW200 - you should be able to throw your
lumagen away.

There is NO QUESTION the VW200 is Better than the
VW100. SUBJECT CLOSED :D I AGREE 100%.

But having seen what MIGHT be next - my choice is to WAIT.

I also came from 12 years of Runco CRT PJs.


I didn't mean to challenge your opinion at all... just to recount that there were circumstances that could easily sway the scale in the other direction.

During the time that I had the 100 mounted, I hadn't become yet aware of the firmware upgrade for the lumagen that enabled handling of 1080p inputs, so I was stuck sending only 1080i from sources. (Even now after upgrading it, I haven't really gotten it to play fully yet... it might very well stay out of the signal path - but will probably stay paired with the 100, which I still have.)

I think that the fact that there was no option for addressing panel convergence issues short of sending the whole unit for service was an annoyance that I hadn't really anticipated with the 100. I really lucked out that the chroma delay setting for the red field happened to address the particular way that my unit was out.

I'll probably work with the lumagen long enough to determine whether I like the anamorphic stretch of it better than what's built into the 200. I agree, though, that it might not end up in the system. Until I get it reconfigured after the firmware upgrade, I'll be using my system without it.

The VW100 does not come close in sharpness and contrast when side by side with a VW200. I have had both and certainly can justify picking the VW200. Also, doing 1080p/24 on the VW200 blows away doing 1080p/48 DVI on the VW100. Heck, even the VW60 was much better. The only thing in common is the excellent colors. Both PJs have damn good colors. Of course the VW200 when combined with its better image depth, much sharper image and deeper blacks definitely makes it next level. I am sure the Diamond (if it ever gets released) will be better but by how much will again be the BIG question. I for one will not worry about it because I plan to keep the VW200 for a very long time. I was at 2 funerals the past couple of weeks and all I know is if there is something better now I do not like waiting. Sure there is better PJs then the VW200 available now but I have reached the pinnacle of where I want my theater to be for a long time. I am satisfied and that is all that matters...

Try as I might-and boy have I tried -I really dont get the flicker-attraction of the film projection modes for anything-I find it very unattractive! Oh and I think it gives me a headache.
My set up for HD sports at 1080i which also works for other HD channels does however have Motioflow on-and looks superb. Thoughts?

Some people just don't like it as much. SOme do because it has that film projecting look. My wife lately has been asking for me to turn it off. I will admit now that I am over 500 hours on my lamp and when we do turn it off it does increase brightness a lot. Some movies look really good adding it. DirecTV with sports I am not using it at all nowadays. I like motionflow on still though (for sports)... I was very shocked at how well Bonnie and Clyde looked on blu ray going thru the 3800 and then my crystalio II. Very impressed... :)

Low or high for sports Joe? Tonight is a tough sports nite with 4 NCAA games and the Celtics Hornets. 1080i 60 in 1080p 60 out into my CRT this weekend. Digitals are all off to reviewers.

High baby! :) I like low for animated cartoons..

Oh yes def. high! haha

We had a very knowledgeable customer visit us who viewed several projectors side by side. Despite the price tag guess which one they picked:)

There is so much good stuff now, its hard to go wrong with almost anything with smaller screen sizes though obviously the type of viewing and room environment will favor certain machines over others.Right now mt two favorite 'affordable" machines, that used to be Alan's favorite word, are the !!S2 and the VW200. Going up the food chain, then the C3x 1080 and the HT5000.

alan.You have been very quiet about your 11S2.I suspect you are having problems with it. Greg R will be reviewing it shortly.

Mark I actually like the S2 very much. I have not spent time with 1 chip DLP in a while and needed to revisit to see how its doing. The S2 is on the cutting edge for 1 chip. I still will always prefer 3 chip technology when I can afford it.
As you say it is amazing how far all this technology has come. Each platform is close to being perfected, I dont know whats next.

I happened to see that BB is selling these now. :eek:

Of course it's "in store only". :D

Can't imagine they will be selling a lot of these...

I happened to see that BB is selling these now. :eek:

Of course it's "in store only". :D

Can't imagine they will be selling a lot of these...

Are they full retail?

Yep. And shortly everybody will have to under Sony's unilateral pricing policy which goes ito effect in late May or June.

Are they full retail?

I assume so:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp;jsessionid=LDGIQYRAVQU1NKC4D3PFAFQ?skuId=8589253&type=product&id=1190678774531

In your experience with the VW200 coupled with Denon DVD or BD, which processor is better, the VW200`Bravia PRO or the new Realta HQV included with the Denon BD player?
Finally, I will install this pair next week and want your precious advice to my initial set-up.

The VW200's scaling can hold its own against the best of them out there. I just like having a good VP to push the gamma envelope to the next level. The 3800 as good as it was in my set up just could not overcome the issues it has at the moment. I am worried they may not be able to do get the 1080p/24 issue done anytime soon or correctly so I went back to the Pioneer 95FD.

The last lumagen unit I had was the HDQ. So I would be going totally by memory but I would say the VW200 is close. I would have to give the edge to the VP since it allows so many more tweaks to be aqueezed out of the picture. I like that option for Motion Flow. We only use it for sports so I don't get to see it to often... :)

Film Mode on 2. Gave life to regular DVDs
Motion Flow on low or off
Color temperature on middle
I left the auto iris off, raised the contrast to 94 and reduced the brigtness to 44 to match the THX patterns (brand new lamp).

I will play with it this weekend!!!!!.

What's the native contrast of the VW200? It'd be best to match the gamma to the native contrast rather than the ~29,000:1 DI enabled?

According to Cine4fhome's review of the JVC HD100 (RS2), the native CR of the VW200 is only 6000:1 max.

Then that means the maximum gamma the VW200 can display is ~2.2, so you never crush blacks or whites? According to Tom's contrast-gamma spread sheet. :(

If you assume a 15 ftl image, then the black level is a maximum of 0.0025 and a 2% stim is 0.0027. But as soon as the gamma goes to 2.3, the 2% stim is .0019 which is blacker than the black level!I figured it would be interesting to consider the above with respect to ANSI CR and a CRT. Based on my measurements of a Sony G70 and what I've read for a Sony G90, I believe they are in the range of about 110:1 to 130:1 ANSI CR (with non-LC units being lower). Consider an image that isn't as tough as the ANSI CR test (half white and half black in a 4x4 checkerboard is a pretty tough test) and so has a simultaneous CR of about 1000:1 (mostly from washout and not much from the raised black floor indicated by on/off CR, since the CRT has very high on/off CR). 1000:1 for an image in your 15 ftL case above would be .015 ft-L. In this case, if the CRT has a gamma of 2.4 (I've heard 2.4 to 2.5 generally), then anything under about 5.6% stim would have a black level from the projector of less than the black level from the washout (not counting the washout of course), for an image like that. If the projector gamma was changed to 2.2 instead of about 2.4, more low level stuff would be driven at higher black levels than the black level from the washout effect. It could of course be argued that CRTs used for mastering also have this problem of washing out the details in dark parts of mixed images with enough bright stuff, but the idea that a bigger gamma number washes out some low level details, which wouldn't be washed out at the same gamma number if the on/off CR or ANSI CR were higher, applies to both technologies.

--Darin

Thanks to everyone who drove me to buy this projector over the RS2..Of course I am working on finishing my Dedicated HT and will be buying the PJ last hopefully to save some $$.

My question to you guys...This will be my first PJ setup so why not do it right - Screen is 130" (2.35) wide and still deciding between the fire hawk 1.3 or the HP 2.8 gains....The PJ can be placed anywhere, right at eye level, ceiling mounted etc.. and about 16-23ft throw - Also the 6 seats (3 front 3 back) are all within the border so that is why I am considering the HP screen.. thoughts?

Also I will be zooming for 2.35 movies can anyone confirm the PQ quality of this compared to the lens, I know I will lose some light output but with the HP that shouldn't be a problem.

I appreciate it and to those who drove me to this projector, I have discovered a new type of arguing with the wife, its called.....I'll do whatever you want for a year :-p


PS. I am DYING to know how PS3/360 games look on this thing especially with motion on!

Welcome to the club. At 130" wide I would go for the HP. After a few hundred hours on the lamp you will lose some brightness and at that screen size I think the FH will be to dim. Maybe someone here uses that combo, if so maybe they will jump in.
Placing the projector center screen will work. As far as zoom verses using an attachment the pixel fill is enough that you will not need a lens but you will have to re zoom and use lens shift between each format which may grow old fast.

Gaming looks great on the 200. Motionflow is something you ether like or dislike. For gaming I think it would be cool but most here prefer not to use for movies but do like it for sporting events.

The projector has a large assortment of features that will no doubt take you some time to learn and decide which combination you prefer. Have fun with the new theater.

PS. I am DYING to know how PS3/360 games look on this thing especially with motion on!

You been talking to my kids?:D

Amazingly good on LOW to watch movies. When the camera moves you get that video smoth feeling and a more 3D sense of the landscape. I have never seen something like this. Filmlike or not I like it and cannot live without it anymore. Film mode on 2 works better to my taste. I am usinf the AutoIris 1 without being disturbed. Inky blacks!!! I had to adjust the primary colors using the AVIA II DVD. Also had to set contrast to 95 and brightness to 48using THX DVD to calibrate my Panny BD10A. I am very happy with this gizmo!!! Any tips to take the last drop of image from this baby?????

Also had to set contrast to 95

This would make most people go:eek: but with the Sony it does not over drive
the peak whites allowing you to expand the dynamic contrast.

Any tips to take the last drop of image from this baby?????

How about some good old Blue Ray or HD DVD:)

I couldn't have said it better. ^ :)

Went to BB today to check out the sony with motionflow....It probably wasn't on since I really didn't notice any difference compared to my Sammy 5688..It's supposed to stop me in my tracks correct?

No. Its not.

So far, I have gotten the best image from this pj in a completly dark ambient with autoiris set to auto 1, contrast set to 95, brightness set to 50, color space set to normal, color temp set to medium, RCP set to match the AVIA II pattern, film projection set to 2, sharpness set to 25 and motion flow set to high (Cartoons, sports and movie with lots of CGI).
As I am using a Panny BD10A to watch Blu-Ray discs, I had to set the contrast and sharpness to +1 to also match the AVIA patterns.

Yesterday I saw the best image I could ask for watching "The Antbully" Blu-Ray with my family with motionflow set to HIGH. NEVER seen anything like that. Seemed like one of these new plasma or LCD monitor with 120Hz refresh rates but with 100"!!!!

I had to set the contrast high enough to match the AVIA, THX and DVE patterns. Also, Brightness set to 50 didn`t get me any black or whitecrush despite using AutoIris 1.

Any tips from you guys?:D

Hi Guys

Haven't visited here for over 3 months - about the time I've had the Sony in place so thought to report back.

It is fed from various sources, all going through a DVDO VP50 Pro and some via a Video Storm switcher -> DVDO. The VW200 has replaced a Barco 808s.

So, am I a happy camper - a big YES. :) No problem with the blacks compared to the old CRT + the brightness is far better. I like the 3 user settings as I find different settings are needed for different sources.

Now here is a big surprise - just how good the old laserdiscs look ex a Pioneer HLDX9 player. On the Barco they were pretty washed out relative to DVDs but now they are incredibly close on good material. I guess the Sony cannot claim all the benefit as obviously the iScan DVDO VP50 pro has a lot to do with it. So those old LDs are now getting used again instead of languishing on the shelf.

But the Sony is mostly used to view time shifted FTA HD TV which, on our PAL system here, on good HD material recorded on HDD, is quite stunning. Even SD material scales up nicely from pay TV and DVD.

No, I have not bought into a blu ray player yet as the material being issued is not of great interest to me yet - I'm not into accumulating heaps of movies that only get looked at once every 5 years. But the time will come for sure.

Digital TV is having slow penetration in this country and the shut down of analog keeps being deferred and is now listed as 2013.

I have not found any need to tweak the Sony from the settings on it when delivered. The picture quality on the 96" Stewart screen is fine.

Now I have come from a manic audio background :Dwith an accompanying audio system we are rather pleased with. Anyone interested can see pics and flowchart diagrams at http://gallery.audioasylum.com/cgi/view.mpl?UserImages=3758&session=

John

Thx for the review. Nice looking place - great view!

I am pairing my VW200 up with a PS3 and I am very impressed with the 10 bit color the PS3 provides! :eek: I wish I had done it sooner!!! At 1080p/24 (23.98) it looks as good as any Blu ray unit I have had to date. And that includes the Denon 3800!!! :eek:

I am pairing my VW200 up with a PS3 and I am very impressed with the 10 bit color the PS3 provides! :eek: I wish I had done it sooner!!! At 1080p/24 (23.98) it looks as good as any Blu ray unit I have had to date. And that includes the Denon 3800!!! :eek:

And is it FAST LOADING :D

The fasted loading Blu ray unit I have ever put my hands on! :D And all for 299!!! :eek:

Thanks DrHankZ, it was because of your suggestion that I tried one. I can now say without any hesitation the PS3 can hold its own with any current Blu ray unit on the market... And probably with others being released this year! :eek:

The fasted loading Blu ray unit I have ever put my hands on! :D And all for 299!!! :eek:

Thanks DrHankZ, it was because of your suggestion that I tried one. I can now say without any hesitation the PS3 can hold its own with any current Blu ray unit on the market... And probably with others being released this year! :eek:


My 2nd PS3 should be here this week for $299. At that price it
is GOING TO KICK a lot of serious but :D

I ordered my Rack mount chassis today from Mid Atlantic.

I have always made my own - I guess I am getting OLD and LAZY.

The fasted loading Blu ray unit I have ever put my hands on! :D And all for 299!!! :eek:

Thanks DrHankZ, it was because of your suggestion that I tried one. I can now say without any hesitation the PS3 can hold its own with any current Blu ray unit on the market... And probably with others being released this year! :eek:

Joerod,

I'm surprise you opted for the PS3 since I thought you like the receiver doing the audio decoding instead of internally decoding inside the player?

Joerod,

I'm surprise you opted for the PS3 since I thought you like the receiver doing the audio decoding instead of internally decoding inside the player?

I was told the PS3 will get this upgrade soon anyway am I correct?

I do like having my receiver do the work but with the cost versus performace of the other units on the market (plus reliability) it is much more conveinant to have the PS3 do it... I can bitstream with HD DVD for now. And yes I heard the PS3 would do it soon as well. :)

Not to take this off topic but do you really hear a difference?

Ive heard both yes and no so Im guessing the difference is small enough to make it subjective.

I know when I first did it I liked the sound better coming from my 905 receiver (which I use as a prepro these days) and when given the option I always bitstream. I will say that it is very close and most will not tell a difference anyway. Still, since the PS3 can only do it itself it still sounds terrific. I would still (and did) take the PS3 without bitstreaming for FAST load times, Blu ray disc playback reliability, 1080p/24 (23.98) pic Q, 10 bit color, and of course its price! ;)

Now that I have had the PS3 longer in my setup and have played more DTS-HD titles I can say I think having a good receiver can make a BIG difference. I have the PS3 decode but I still use my 905 to add the Ultra2 Cinema processing (which has always been my favorite) so that is why I am hearing the same exact sound I heard when I had the Denon 3800 and Pioneer 95FD and Panny BD30 recently in its spot. The PS3 sure sticks out... :) I am still very happy I went with it since it can do so much more. I, Robot looked awesome (just like it did on the other units) so I know I am not giving up anything sound or pic Q wise... I am gaining 10 bit color, faster loading and a lot more features (not to mention gaming)... The VW200 and PS3 make a good combo. ;)

Now that I have had the PS3 longer in my setup and have played more DTS HD titles I can say I think having a good receiver helps still. I have the PS3 decode but I still use my 905 to add the Ultra2 Cinema processing (which has always been my favorite) so that is why I am hearing the same exact sound I heard when I had the Denon 3800 and Pioneer 95FD and Panny BD30 recently in its spot. The PS3 sure sticks out... :)

That PS3 Looks nice in the Equipment Rack - JOE http://www.rx8web.com/smilies/bouncy.gif

Now that I have had the PS3 longer in my setup and have played more DTS-HD titles I can say I think having a good receiver can make a BIG difference. I have the PS3 decode but I still use my 905 to add the Ultra2 Cinema processing (which has always been my favorite) so that is why I am hearing the same exact sound I heard when I had the Denon 3800 and Pioneer 95FD and Panny BD30 recently in its spot. The PS3 sure sticks out... :) I am still very happy I went with it since it can do so much more. I, Robot looked awesome (just like it did on the other units) so I know I am not giving up anything sound or pic Q wise... I am gaining 10 bit color, faster loading and a lot more features (not to mention gaming)... The VW200 and PS3 make a good combo. ;)


What about the PS3 not being able to properly decode 7.1 DTS-HD-MA content? ;) I don't think is a big deal right now but hopefully Sony provides a fix soon.

What about the PS3 not being able to properly decode 7.1 DTS-HD-MA content? ;) I don't think is a big deal right now but hopefully Sony provides a fix soon.

Is it the fault of the PS3 or the mix of the few discs. If its the PS3, following Sonys track record Im sure it will be fixed and soon.

I thought it was the few discs that weren't done correctly. Either way so far I have been excited by what I am hearing and seeing. If it is the PS3 like Alan said I bet it would be fixed soon anyway. Watched AVP2 recently and was quite impressed with the picture and sound! :eek:

I thought it was the few discs that weren't done correctly. Either way so far I have been excited by what I am hearing and seeing. If it is the PS3 like Alan said I bet it would be fixed soon anyway. Watched AVP2 recently and was quite impressed with the picture and sound! :eek:


This is definitely OT so if you want more info check the PS3 firmware 2.3 thread. According to Ronny (DTS insider) the dics were encoded correctly. The PS3 according to him has limited DTS-HD-MA capabilities that doesn't allow the PS3 decode some DTS speaker configurations encoded in the track. Him seems to imply that it was done intentionally for whatever reason but it still not clear if that is true or not. But like you said it only affects a few dics so far.

I haven't encountered any issues at all yet. And as the past I am willing to bet Sony will have a fix for it soon. :) It's another rainey night here so the VW200 will be working hard tonite. :)

For those early adopters, how many lamp hours do you have and how's the brightness? Is it true the replacement cost is close to $1k? Thanks!

Ralph

I am approaching 800 hours on my first lamp and it has settiled into a comfortable level. I will get a replacement no matter what in a few months and save it as my emergency spare. :)

I am approaching 800 hours on my first lamp and it has settiled into a comfortable level. I will get a replacement no matter what in a few months and save it as my emergency spare. :)

So what is your 'comfortable' # of lumens?

The fasted loading Blu ray unit I have ever put my hands on! :D And all for 299!!! :eek:

Thanks DrHankZ, it was because of your suggestion that I tried one. I can now say without any hesitation the PS3 can hold its own with any current Blu ray unit on the market... And probably with others being released this year! :eek:


Where can one get a $200 ps3,Thanks BOB:D

I don't and won't disclose my PJ measurements I get with my OTC1000/CP6000 Sencore equipment & software. What goes in my set up is meaningless comparing it to others. Let's just say I am much more satisfied then I was with the same hours on my Ruby. ;)

The PS3 can be had for cheaper by applying for a sony card. Then no matter where you purchase it at (even BB or CC or Walmart) the 100.00 off is automatically applied... I am still shocked at the excellent pic Q I get when compared to the stand alone units. If I knew then what I know now I would have just gotten a PS3 and called it a day... :)

I don't and won't disclose my PJ measurements I get with my OTC1000/CP6000 Sencore equipment & software. What goes in my set up is meaningless comparing it to others. Let's just say I am much more satisfied then I was with the same hours on my Ruby. ;)

No problem. Can you say what size and gain your screen is? My questions are because I've heard some comments about the brightness of the 200 restricting it to moderately small screens.

No problem there. :) I use a 120.5" Vutec SS which is supposed to have a 6.0 gain but more realistically has about a 2.7. I also use a Carada Masquerade Masking System over it. I know there are many that believe this PJ should have a screen size limitation but honestly I just don't see it. ;)

I don't and won't disclose my PJ measurements I get with my OTC1000/CP6000 Sencore equipment & software. What goes in my set up is meaningless comparing it to others. Let's just say I am much more satisfied then I was with the same hours on my Ruby. ;)

The PS3 can be had for cheaper by applying for a sony card. Then no matter where you purchase it at (even BB or CC or Walmart) the 100.00 off is automatically applied... I am still shocked at the excellent pic Q I get when compared to the stand alone units. If I knew then what I know now I would have just gotten a PS3 and called it a day... :)

Thanks Joerod:)

No problem. We watched The Golden Compass Blu ray using the PS3 and had exceptional DTS-HD MA 7.1 surround and brilliant colors that never let up the entire movie. I really think we are at the pinnacle of pic Q these days. I serioulsy doubt there will be any night and day difference products out for a few years! :eek:

No problem. We watched The Golden Compass Blu ray using the PS3 and had exceptional DTS-HD MA 7.1 surround and brilliant colors that never let up the entire movie. I really think we are at the pinnacle of pic Q these days. I serioulsy doubt there will be any night and day difference products out for a few years! :eek:

I agree with Joe also.

Watched the Same move on the PS3 last
night as well. Just Awesome.

I hate to repeat myself but if I knew then what I know now I would have just gotten a PS3 and called it quits... Thanks again, drhankz! :)

I just lent out my PS3 to one of the guys at work and Im using stand alone which is painfully slow. I cant wait to get my PS3 back.

I am not sure when (or if) I will ever go back to a stand alone in my main theater... :eek:

Does it matter which model PS3 to buy as they have 40, 60 and 80GB versions

Does it matter which model PS3 to buy as they have 40, 60 and 80GB versions

The 40 does not support PS2 games if that matters to you.

I also believe the 60's are Gen 1 and may have loud fans.
Do they still sell 60's as NEW today.

Get a 40GB and call it a day. :)

It worked out great for me. It is silent, and I never had a PS2 just an original PS and I still have most of my old games! The Bulls in 96 were amazing and they live again!!! I forgot how they made Rodman's hair change colors... :D

Anyway, the PS 40GB version is perfectly fine if the main goal is exceptional Blu ray playback (as was mine) and the fastest load times in the west! ;)

Ok, fine.
Thanks for everyone's quick response. Will check out ebay for a 40GB PS3.

Ok, fine.
Thanks for everyone's quick response. Will check out ebay for a 40GB PS3.

You can get one BRAND NEW from Sony Style for $299.

Thanks

That is exactly what I would do... Wait, I already did... :)

No problem yet with the VW200 lamp life but no doubt it will need replacing in the future.

Anyone had to do that yet?

If so, where have you sourced the lamp?

I'm visiting Hong Kong in a few weeks so will look for one there - any advice appreciated.

TIA

John (the infrequent poster from down under)

PS: just updated my profile & was somewhat shocked at how out of date it was - sort of embarrassing as it indicated how many changes have been made!!!

I have replaced the lamp on the VW100 before and it is not that big of deal. I purchased my lamp from a store online that had a pretty good price. I keep hoping one day they will finally have a price drop so I am hanging in there before I purchase another lamp.

Reminds me of my blind friend, Bruce, who used to run out of milk for his coffee on every Weds. His wife who is sighted and who does all the driving and food shopping, said she knew, but she only bought milk on Thursday because the local dairy store sold it for a dime cheaper per quart every Thursday. Bruce is in the fast food business and makes lots of money but his wife is CHEAP. He came home on Thursday and confronted here. He had a roll of dimes and cracked it open in front of her and placed the roll on the window sill. He told her any time they ran out of milk other than on a Thursday to take a dime from the roll and buy the milk at the higher price and to tell him when she ran out of milk offset dimes, because he would give her a new roll. :)

Now that makes perfect sense. :)

I like that story... :)

I have already installed and calibrated the VW200 with the video essentials blu-ray and I also had fired almost 100 lamp hours. So, I have achieved the best result here with my 1.0 gain white mate 100inches screen with contrast boosted to 90 and brightness set to 52 conpensating for the dark images of the Panny BD-10A that I have connected. I love and keep the Film mode set to 2 and Motionflow set to low (movies) and high (cartoons and concerts filmed in video). I had to boost the color to 54 to match Video Essentials patterns. Now, I will move to a Blu-Ray player able to receive 1080p;24 fps to squeeze everything I can from the VW200. I also set sharpness to 25 checking the patterns from VE BluRay. Iris set to Auto 1 do not bother me and set the blacks to a very nice image without black crush from the patterns. I would like to get suggestions from you guys to correct any setting I am making wrong and improve the details, specially on the dark scenes. I had to set the contrast and Sharpness to +1 to get more close to the video essentials patterns. I wonder if these patterns, specially the one to contrast and brightness work with autoiris.

I have my 200 paired with a PS3 and get exceptional playback at 1080p/23.98. I recently had the Denon 3800, Pioneer 95 and Panny BD30 in the same exact spot and all around the PS3 is the better player. Much faster load times, great pic Q, great sound, and not to mention the reliability factor is by far the best. I do not have to hold my breath and wonder if a new release on Blu ray is going to work. Every title I have thrown at it has played without issue. Every other stand alone on the market has had (and still does) issues with some titles. Especially new releases... Speaking of which we watched Twister Blu ray and was "blown" away by the excellent sound Q. The picture was nice (not as good as some of the top notch Blu ray titles) but I think it is a great title to have around for sound DEMO material. THe VW200/PS3 combo is hard to beat! :)

Just an FYI, The Ruby, both VW100 and 200 lamp is being offered a special right now at $475.00 each. Contact Ralph Felten rfelten@asltg2.com
Here is the DIY VW 100 & 200 and Qualia Lamp (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=697416&highlight=vw100+lamp) replacement thread for reference.

Now that is to good to pass up... :)

Hi All, Does anyone have a dead VW100/200 lamp assy that they would like to let go of? I would like to build a spare with one of Ralph's lamps that he is selling. thanks

Just an FYI, The Ruby, both VW100 and 200 lamp is being offered a special right now at $475.00 each. Contact Ralph Felten rfelten@asltg2.com
Here is the DIY VW 100 & 200 and Qualia Lamp (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=697416&highlight=vw100+lamp) replacement thread for reference.

Thanks for that Alan. :p I've emailed the guy and could pick one up in the USA in a couple of weeks when I'll be there (in Ohio visiting my youngest son).

Networking on forums like this is just so helpful.:)

Must admit to laziness - I'll have to tweak the VW200 with the video essentials DVD.:cool: However I really have no complaints on the picture quality -> 96" Stewart screen from HD FTA TV. I'm resisting blu ray for the moment but guess I'll weaken around Xmas when they finally get their act together.

John (from down under)

I'm resisting blu ray for the moment but guess I'll weaken around Xmas when they finally get their act together.

John (from down under)

Your in for a treat, the colors really pop with this projector :)

Your in for a treat, the colors really pop with this projector :)

Alan, When you say 'really pop', do you mean somewhat oversaturated, like the RS2 and Marantz 11S2? Or is it something else?

Alan, When you say 'really pop', do you mean somewhat oversaturated, like the RS2 and Marantz 11S2? Or is it something else?

With the on board CMS you can dial in perfect color including primaries. I prefered to run my colors a little rich, it looked very CRT like to my eye.
Over sat colors with wrong primaries may not be as pleasing.

With the on board CMS you can dial in perfect color including primaries. I prefered to run my colors a little rich, it looked very CRT like to my eye.
Over sat colors with wrong primaries may not be as pleasing.

Sorry to dense, Alan, but what does a 'little rich' mean? What is beyond the Rec 709?

Well one good example is finally using a PS3 allows me to take advantage of the VW200's 10 bit color spec. That is one example of how we get better colors. All the reviews I have read and anyone I have spoken to have all agreed the VW200 is one of the best when it comes to color. I was more than impressed before but now... :eek:

I am following (again) in the joerod footsteps as a proud new owner (as yet unopened). I'm wondering if anyone has had HDMI issues specifically with the unit in combination with other devices (one reason I'm moving up from a JVC HD2K DVI/HDCP 1080p only projector).

This is a big step, but one negative. This is the first front projector I have owned not from AVS (not stocked), and I have always been happy with the JVC Professional line (and the Phelps calibration).

Sorry to dense, Alan, but what does a 'little rich' mean? What is beyond the Rec 709?

Nothing to do with color space or calibration, I turned up my color control for a more saturated color palette :)

Nothing to do with color space or calibration, I turned up my color control for a more saturated color palette :)

Ah, simpler than I thought; I might even manage to do that.

OK, after minor swearing but an otherwise fairly painless setup I can only say WOW!

The calibration is very straightforward, it perfectly fit my 123" silverstar despit a minor lens shift and VERY minor keystone correction. Zoom & Focus dialed in perfectly. (Hey you can use the remote. Used to the old fashioned everything is manual.

I am incredibly happy to find this thread and get this unit. The picture is gorgeous (and my HD2K calibrated by Wm Phelps was no slouch).

This thing is near dead silent too. (I know these things are relative, but I can't believe it.)

Start up is fast.

Still having issues with component in, but I can run everything into HDMI.

One gripe. I'm no power cord snob, but the power connection is really bad. I have a few proceed cords that may work with adapters, and I understand the dooddad to clamp the power cord in, but it really makes it hard to use even a cheap better quality cord.

Ok second gripe. The options on this for different types of material is daunting :o But I'll have fun playing.

Congrats Rudolpht! :)

There are so many different features and combos you can do it will take a little while to go thru them. Take your time and see what you like best. As for HDMI connections I have used around 12 different HDMI source components with the 200 and not had any hiccups whatsoever. No worries there. ;) When you settle in try a few Blu ray titles and let us know what you think... Have fun... :cool:

Hey everybody

Im a happy owner of a VW200 (still unpacked). What surface matches better within the PJ, a Firehawk G3?, maybe a SST?

Thanks in advance

Mig

That wil depend on your room and your taste. There is not one correct answer... :)

Has anyone had trouble logging into the projector to perform setup. Using the defaults included in the horrible manual, but just not working with any of 3 different browsers.

I second Joes comments, congrats to rudolpht and Mig. The 200 is a great projector. Great color and a ton of features. You may spend a month or more with this before settling into a choice of settings that fit your needs. Enjoy!

I second Joes comments, congrats to rudolpht and Mig. The 200 is a great projector. Great color and a ton of features. You may spend a month or more with this before settling into a choice of settings that fit your needs. Enjoy!

Thanks Alan. Your thinking on this unit played a big part in buying.

I did get the setup working and changed. Start with Username root and no passwd, then change.

Hi
I have been trying to demo this unit in the Boston area. Willing to travel around to see - any ideas where?
thanks

Hi
I have been trying to demo this unit in the Boston area. Willing to travel around to see - any ideas where?
thanks

Would check the Dealer link and see storefronts that have it.

Ok, i give !
Where is the dealer link?

Google gave me this but I have not tried it. It should give you what you are looking for.

http://direct.where2getit.com/sony/

Ugh - called the 3 sony style stores in MA
and the Circuit citys with the Magnolia theater setup
All they have is the 60 on display

THe high end stores don't carry Sony, mostly Runco and the like
I guess i can go to NYC as i readd that it is there..........

Ugh - called the 3 sony style stores in MA
and the Circuit citys with the Magnolia theater setup
All they have is the 60 on display

THe high end stores don't carry Sony, mostly Runco and the like
I guess i can go to NYC as i readd that it is there..........

I guess Tim won't let you see HIS [GRIN]!

If the 200 is in your price range - then there is nothing
else to compare it to :D

If you want to compare the 200 to the 60 then that is
another story!

If you are willing to make the trip to Rochester we can arrange a demo.
Also try contacting Mark Haflich on this board. I think he is in your neck of the woods.
He may very well have one to demo for you.

If you are willing to make the trip to Rochester we can arrange a demo.
Also try contacting Mark Haflich on this board. I think he is in your neck of the woods.
He may very well have one to demo for you.

Mark is in MD.

Ugh - called the 3 sony style stores in MA
and the Circuit citys with the Magnolia theater setup
All they have is the 60 on display

THe high end stores don't carry Sony, mostly Runco and the like
I guess i can go to NYC as i readd that it is there..........
I was at the Sony Style store at the Burlington Mall last Saturday. They had the 11" OLED display up. It looked nice, but I didn't think it would have looked noticeably better than an 11" LCD if running the same Blu-ray cartoon.

I guess Tim won't let you see HIS [GRIN]!


I would say buy it from a reputable dealer like AVS and see what the restock fee is if you don't like it. Coming from a first gen 3 chip LCOS 1080p projector that was professionally calibrated myself, I'm simply amazed how much beter the 200 is.

You will get a general idea with the 60.

I would actually invite you over if a) you had a history on the board, b) I was actually ever home to see it too :o

I would actually invite you over if a) you had a history on the board, b) I was actually ever home to see it too :o

I have a HISTORY - when am I coming Over Tim ;)

I agree with your Advice. Buy from AVS and Return if he
doesn't like it. But then why wouldn't he like it?

I am willing to bet he would love it! ;)

I have a HISTORY - when am I coming Over Tim ;)

I agree with your Advice. Buy from AVS and Return if he
doesn't like it. But then why wouldn't he like it?

Hank, you are always welcome, and not only because Dr's stick together.

I can't imagine a single reason why one would not like a 200. Like I said my HD2K was fantastic, and very well supported by AVS. I couldn't imagine a PJ could be anything but a small increment better, but I was wrong. My 200 is a huge leap better.

I am willing to bet he would love it! ;)

I agree Joe, and I know it's not pride of owners or Sony lovefest syndrome with us. These product assessments are based on the merits of the 200, not fanboy antics.

Hank, you are always welcome, and not only because Dr's stick together.

I can't imagine a single reason why one would not like a 200. Like I said my HD2K was fantastic, and very well supported by AVS. I couldn't imagine a PJ could be anything but a small increment better, but I was wrong. My 200 is a huge leap better.
The one I saw in a showroom was pretty dim. The 200 was a brand new unit with minimal hours on the bulb, the screen was only 92" diagonal, and the room conditions were ideal. Another AVS member was with me and felt the same way about it.

hrd,
Since your in Boston & Lic265 is looking for even a dim one in Boston, can you point him in the right direction.

Interested in where the ideal showroom is. Interested to know what was a better displaying unit (any location) you are comparing the 200 to.

I am not a sony fan boy either. I have had other brands of PJs and only own the PS3 and Navitus Remote as my other sony products. My opinions are based on only what I see in my set up. And I still planning to keep the 200 for another year or two. There is just not anything on the horizon that will have a night and day difference. I seriously doubt we will see a PJ like that for a long time. We are at the pinnacle of 1080p/23.98 performance and I am glad I have a front row seat. :)

hrd,
Since your in Boston & Lic265 is looking for even a dim one in Boston, can you point him in the right direction.

Interested in where the ideal showroom is. Interested to know what was a better displaying unit (any location) you are comparing the 200 to.
rudolpht, I did send him a PM earlier tonight.

The best demos I have seen around here are an RS1 on a 110" Silverstar at New England Home Theater in Littleton and a SIM2 HT3000E on a 100" Firehawk at Huntington TV in Newton. Both stores are open on Saturdays. The Littleton store is on 2A just a half mile or so off of 495 - you could almost walk there on a nice day (not tomorrow, it seems). It's not the type of place where you would have to have the projector turned on for you. It's on all the time and you can probably get a hold of the remote and go through the FIOS channels all you want.

rudolpht, I did send him a PM earlier tonight.

The best demos I have seen around here are an RS1 on a 110" Silverstar at New England Home Theater in Littleton and a SIM2 HT3000E on a 100" Firehawk at Huntington TV in Newton. Both stores are open on Saturdays. The Littleton store is on 2A just a half mile or so off of 495 - you could almost walk there on a nice day (not tomorrow, it seems). It's not the type of place where you would have to have the projector turned on for you. It's on all the time and you can probably get a hold of the remote and go through the FIOS channels all you want.

But the mystery question still remains.

Where did you see the VW200 Demo?

But the mystery question still remains.

Where did you see the VW200 Demo?

It is a tough projector to spot but the club is slowly growing.

Here is the contact for the Sony Style store in Boston.

Copley Place

Store address:

100 Huntington Avenue
Boston,MA 02116
Phone (617)859-1407

But the mystery question still remains.

Where did you see the VW200 Demo?
I sent you a PM.

It is a tough projector to spot but the club is slowly growing.

Here is the contact for the Sony Style store in Boston.

Copley Place

Store address:

100 Huntington Avenue
Boston,MA 02116
Phone (617)859-1407
The last time I was at the Sony Style store at Copley Place, they had an old LCD up, like an HS51. The room conditions were not good and the image was one of the most washed out I have seen on a screen. The screen was only around 80" diagonal and there was a large RPTV near it that totally smoked it without being all that smaller. Months ago, I called them and they did not have anything worth checking out.

I did not see any projectors around when I visited the Sony Style store in Burlington, MA last Saturday.

HRD that is a shame. That tells us RP must be the money maker.

The last ime I was at the NYC Sony store, they had both a vw-200 and a vw-60 on display. That was a few months ago and I don't know if things have changed.

HRD that is a shame. That tells us RP must be the money maker.
At the Burlington store, it was all about the LCD flat panels. There were more LCD flat panels than you could shake a stick at.

Wish I had asked if they'd actually sold any of the $2,499.99 11-inch OLEDs.

I do know that the VW200 is in small numbers out there. It is like being in an exclusive club owning one. It is crazy that still the RPTV business is so strong. Most people don't realize that for the same money you can get a PJ and screen and then have an amazing picture twice the size of a RPTV! :eek:

rudolpht, I did send him a PM earlier tonight.

The best demos I have seen around here are an RS1 on a 110" Silverstar at New England Home Theater in Littleton and a SIM2 HT3000E on a 100" Firehawk at Huntington TV in Newton. Both stores are open on Saturdays. The Littleton store is on 2A just a half mile or so off of 495 - you could almost walk there on a nice day (not tomorrow, it seems). It's not the type of place where you would have to have the projector turned on for you. It's on all the time and you can probably get a hold of the remote and go through the FIOS channels all you want.

I'm sure he appreciates that. Don't know why it isn't public, but OK.

Despite being "next door" I haven't stopped into NE Home Theater (I should). I could use the exercise walking ;)

Unless the same screen is used and all other conditions are same, ie units are properly calibrated, it's hard to do a comparo. The JVC comes out of the box "hot" and the incorrect primaries add some vibrancy, but you can't argue with deep iris-trick less blacks, even uncalibrated.

I noticed the 200 even with the Ultimate A/V settings tweaks made a huge difference.

The HD1000 would be my second choice in a heartbeat.

I just read another review someone sent me on the VW200. This one was for Teck UK. It was short and pretty much down to the point. The reviewer raves about colors and a few other things then bashes all of the features and says it is much better without them. I know they are not for everybody and people's tastes will vary. But then he discusses brightness and then says he was in LOW LAMP MODE. Am I missing something? Is there a different VW200 pj over there? I have never seen a Low Lamp Mode on my unit. And I know it was the VW200 he was reviewing because he discusses Motionflow, Dark Frame Insertion and the cool metallic blue look of the case. So he did not really discuss viewing material or anything of substance. It read more like a fifth grader's book report. I also found it odd that his last statement was it is a good pj but you can get the superior RS2 for a lot less. Now I don't doubt how good the RS2 is. I have seen one or two in action but I have not had one in my set up. Is it possible this "reviewer" did not even turn on a VW200? :eek: Or maybe their site sells JVC pjs... Or is there a different VW200 over there?

Joe I think your last sentence nailed it with the possibility of some sort of hidden agenda or bias at work.

More than likely Alan. :) I just wanted to confirm that there is not a Low Lamp Mode and that just goes to remind us that anyone can post a "review" on any site without ever even turning on the unit! :eek:

I noticed the 200 even with the Ultimate A/V settings tweaks made a huge difference.




Tim

For those not in the know ( me :) )
what is the Ultimate AV tweaks?

Thx.

I really like the Ultimate AV review (Thomas Norton's). I think those are some of the tweaks he is referring to. He does give some useful tips in it as well as a very good overview of the 200. :)

Oh and at least you can easily tell he actually turned on a VW200. :)

I'm sure he appreciates that. Don't know why it isn't public, but OK.

The reason is because when I was there with another forum member some months ago to demo the 200, the store manager asked if I was the person posting about his store on AVS forum and questioned if I had brought the other member there as my customer. He was concerned I was taking advantage of their expensive facilities to make my own sales at their expense, which was certainly not true. He mentioned I had brought a screen sample with me. I guess I should have retrieved the sample and said, "but if I were a dealer, wouldn't this sample screen be a Stewart rather then a Silverstar?"

It was annoying, so why give any more free publicity? I'll bet the store in Littleton is happy to have the free publicity.

I'll PM you the store if you would like.


The JVC comes out of the box "hot" and the incorrect primaries add some vibrancy, but you can't argue with deep iris-trick less blacks, even uncalibrated.

Thos deep blacks really look fantastic on the Silverstar.

I really like the Ultimate AV review (Thomas Norton's). I think those are some of the tweaks he is referring to. He does give some useful tips in it as well as a very good overview of the 200. :)

Alan, Joe hit the nal on the head. Less tweaks, more just general settings. Good to see a review that givers details for a change, even given differences in unit to unit variances.

Thos deep blacks really look fantastic on the Silverstar.

hrd,

I get it more now, thanks.

I love the SilverStar too, since my very first JVC. It marries well with the Sony too. My apologies if I missed the connection to earlier trials and tribulations, there are so many helpful folks here on avsforum.

I love my VW200/SS/Masquerade combo! Wait, haven't I mentioned that before? :D
Last night we actually watched The Perfect Storm HD DVD, and it looked and sounded great. The water was very scary. I then (for a minute) put it into High Motionflow Mode and people started to get sea sick. :D

I also just checked and I am at 808 hours! :eek: Almost time to get another lamp so this one can be my full time spare... :)

I also just checked and I am at 808 hours! :eek: Almost time to get another lamp so this one can be my full time spare... :)

You must be using the super ultra non-economy bright mode, in sharp contrast to European equipment reviewers. :o Either that or you are not getting credit for black frames being inserted to folks sea sick :o :)

Good one. :D Not sure what the case is but I know it is not supposed to still be this bright! :eek:

I appreciate all the comments to my question
hrd - i sent you a PM
I have seen the 60, not interested. Could buy and return the 200, but that seems like a hassle
Will be checking out the 2 stores mentioned in the next week or so
Thanks
Greg

Hello, I am thinking of getting some replacement lamps for the VPL-200, just as a little insurance for when the bulbs get worn out. As this is my first "real" projector I was wondering when you buy the replacement bulbs are you supposed to buy them with the lamp assemblies as well? Does this make for an easier swap over?

I have seen companies online selling the lamp with the assembly for about $1000.00 but you can find people who will sell you the lamp only for half that amount. What is the difference? Is it difficult to replace the lamp in the 200? I have checked out the DIY lamp thread here on AVS and the majority of the posts seem concerned with the 100 which (as is my understanding) uses a different bulb/assembly from the 200, and none of the posts really tell you how to swap it out.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

I believe they are the same exact lamp and assembly for both the 100 and 200. No worries there. With my PJs I like to put about 850 to 900 hours on my lamp that came with it. Then I get another new lamp. I then take out the factory lamp and use it as a full time spare. Then when the second lamp I purchased goes out I can put back in my factory lamp and use it until I get a new one. Then when the new one comes I do the same procedure and save the factory one again to keep as my spare. You never know when these are backordered. You do not want to stock one that is new and never used because for one they are to expensive and for two what if it does not work? Hope this helps...

With my PJs I like to put about 850 to 900 hours on my lamp that came with it. Then I get another new lamp. I then take out the factory lamp and use it as a full time spare. Then when the second lamp I purchased goes out I can put back in my factory lamp and use it until I get a new one. Then when the new one comes I do the same procedure and save the factory one again to keep as my spare. You never know when these are backordered. You do not want to stock one that is new and never used because for one they are to expensive and for two what if it does not work? Hope this helps...

This is a quite sensible approach. The problem with buying a spare lamp and then keeping it in 'the closet' is that the warranty runs out. If you try to use it and are unlucky to have a dud .... well, SOL! I tend to push my lamps a bit more (generally to 1000 hours) before swapping in a new one and using the old one as an emergency spare.

I do the same thing with the vacuum tubes on my amps. Once they reach the recommended replacement point, I swap in a new set but keep some of the old ones as emegency spares.

Just out of curiosity, what kind of usage do folks put on their projector? I have found in recent months that I increasingly use mine predominantly for BluRay, some DVD and the occassional sports event in hidef. Consequently, with almost 7 months of 200 ownership I only have 175 hours on the thing - REALLY PATHETIC!

Good news is that the bulk of the family watching occurs on a 3 1/2 year old Sony SXRD HD rear projection unit which I estimate has close to 3,000 hours on the bulb - and it is still going strong!

Perhaps the obsessive-compulsive nature of videophilia nervosa is having us replace these bulbs far more frequently than necessary?

Whilst not an owner I am a fan of the 200. Its the only LC machine Ive ever liked the look of.

Regarding lamp life, I prefer to pick my minimum fL number, and if and when the lamp reaches that, its time to change.

I also think some people need to rethink the oft quoted 50% loss ideas. Many quality machines with good lamps, great PSUs and start cycles achieve better than that. From direct personal experience, the HT5000 for example loses around 25%. That was at 600hrs and other owners results are actually better than mine, some being below 20%. Thee HT5000 is an exception here but my HT380 lost 35% at 700hrs.

Check your lamps, you may be getting better than you think.

Hope this helps.

Regarding lamp life, I prefer to pick my minimum fL number, and if and when the lamp reaches that, its time to change.

Just out of curiosity, I assue you have a light meter to make these measurements. Are there any reasonably-priced ones that I might look into since I am relying on my eyeballs currently?

So do I need to buy just the bulb or should I get it with it's bulb assembly? Is it a very complicated procedure to take the bulb out of it's lamp housing during the replacement task?

It does not look to complicated but I will admit I have not attempted it yet. My hours or pushing the 850 mark. I may wait until the 1000 hour or so because it is still plenty bright. I also think the look of the 200 is really cool! :cool:

Just out of curiosity, I assue you have a light meter to make these measurements. Are there any reasonably-priced ones that I might look into since I am relying on my eyeballs currently?

I do. I take a measurement every 20hrs or so.

There are a number of reasonable units. The calibration forum is probably the place for a cheap unit.

So do I need to buy just the bulb or should I get it with it's bulb assembly? Is it a very complicated procedure to take the bulb out of it's lamp housing during the replacement task?

Seems to me there are two questions here. It is relatively simple to remove the lamp assembly (which is the bulb mounted into the housing that includes the heat sinks, etc.) which is the thing that goes for around $1,000. Although disposing of the entire unit is certainly not particularly 'green', it is what Sony recommends in the manual. Not sure if the assembly can then be recycled? Actually replacing the bulb in the assembly is something I have not tried and i am not sure whether it is doable/simple or not.

I watched Patton Blu ray and was very impressed with the age of this title and how good it looked on teh VW200. Now this is one of those titles that benefits greatly from the Film Projection Mode 3. ;) It looked really cool! :cool:

Tonite we are doing There Wil Be Blood. Can't wait to get their reaction. The same who watched Patton are coming back for round 2. Now they will see a newer title versus an older one on Blu ray... Maybe they will finally buy a PS3 or more cost effective Blu ray player... :)

Why would Sony recommend ditching the entire lamp assembly? Is anyone here familiar with this issue enough to make a call as to whether or not using the same lamp assembly twice is harmful to the projector?

I watched Patton Blu ray and was very impressed with the age of this title and how good it looked on teh VW200. Now this is one of those titles that benefits greatly from the Film Projection Mode 3. ;) It looked really cool! :cool:


Patton on tonight in my house too. Will Try Film Proj Mode 3

Patton on tonight in my house too. Will Try Film Proj Mode 3

How was Patton for a 38 Year Old Movie Transfer?

How was Patton for a 38 Year Old Movie Transfer?

Hank,

I'm bowled over. The restoratrion is amazing, sharp, vibrant technicolor. The DTS-HD Master Audio is included (need that new Profile 2 Pio).

I can't believe it.

The threads of the blue medal ribbon in the opening scene & the orange sash in the Morocco scene, it's better than if filmed last year.

Agree with Joe on the Film Proj Mode 3!

Glad you liked it! :)

The DTS-HD Master Audio is included (need that new Profile 2 Pio).!

Come on Tim - I have had that GREAT 2.0 Profile player
for 2 months now - it is GREAT and only $299. You can
throw it away in a year when the Pio shows up.

Come on Tim - I have had that GREAT 2.0 Profile player
for 2 months now - it is GREAT and only $299. You can
throw it away in a year when the Pio shows up.

I don't think it bitsteams or even converts to PCM DTS-HD MA does it? That's what's on Patton, a real keeper. I have almost every version of this movie from LD on up. This is the real experience.

I used a PS3 with mine and it decoded DTS-HD MA which I sent to my 885 PRO. Yes it does not bitstream but believe me it sounded awesome nonetheless. I plan to use the PS3 for quite awhile still. You just can't beat the superfast load times (most within seconds) and the exceptional pic Q at 1080p/23.98... :) And not to mention the fact that it has never rejected any of my titles and that includes new releases! :eek: