I just joined the fun of this game with my 100$ D3 purchase and now that i`m fully into it I started looking and wow are we suffering because of two formats....My reason below...IF i`m wrong please tell me....I may have one or so of my studios wrong or not updated....

Of the Top 20 grossing movies of 2007:

1 Spider-Man 3 Sony ----BLU ONLY
2 Shrek the Third P/DW ----HD ONLY
3 Transformers P/DW ----HD ONLY
4 Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End BV ----BLU ONLY
5 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix WB ----DUAL
6 The Bourne Ultimatum Uni. ----HD ONLY
7 300 WB ----DUAL
8 Ratatouille BV ----BLU ONLY
9 The Simpsons Movie Fox ----BLU ONLY
10 Wild Hogs BV ----BLU ONLY
11 I Am Legend WB ----DUAL
12 Knocked Up Uni. ----HD ONLY
13 Rush Hour 3 NL ----BLU ONLY
14 Live Free or Die Hard Fox ----BLU ONLY
15 Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer Fox ----BLU ONLY
16 American Gangster Uni. ----HD ONLY
17 Bee Movie P/DW ----HD ONLY
18 Superbad Sony ----BLU ONLY
19 I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry Uni. ----HD ONLY
20 Hairspray (2007) NL ----BLU ONLY

So, $100 for you HDD player. Now let's say that within the next 2-3 months, there will be BR players to be had for less than $200.
So that's $300 to go purple, and there are TONS of sales that are allowing us to buy HDM discs for around $10 each.
Hmm...;)

I just joined the fun of this game with my 100$ D3 purchase and now that i`m fully into it I started looking and wow are we suffering because of two formats....My reason below...IF i`m wrong please tell me....I may have one or so of my studios wrong or not updated....

Of the Top 20 grossing movies of 2007:

1 Spider-Man 3 Sony ----BLU ONLY
2 Shrek the Third P/DW ----HD ONLY
3 Transformers P/DW ----HD ONLY
4 Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End BV ----BLU ONLY
5 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix WB ----DUAL
6 The Bourne Ultimatum Uni. ----HD ONLY
7 300 WB ----DUAL
8 Ratatouille BV ----BLU ONLY
9 The Simpsons Movie Fox ----BLU ONLY
10 Wild Hogs BV ----BLU ONLY
11 I Am Legend WB ----DUAL
12 Knocked Up Uni. ----HD ONLY
13 Rush Hour 3 NL ----BLU ONLY
14 Live Free or Die Hard Fox ----BLU ONLY
15 Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer Fox ----BLU ONLY
16 American Gangster Uni. ----HD ONLY
17 Bee Movie P/DW ----HD ONLY
18 Superbad Sony ----BLU ONLY
19 I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry Uni. ----HD ONLY
20 Hairspray (2007) NL ----BLU ONLY

I completely understand your frustration, which is the exact reason why I chose to go format neutral and purchase the Samsung Duo HD (BD-UP5000) player. I don't give a rat's patoot about the format. What I do care about is the audio and video of the software.

This format war is not going away anytime soon (in the next few years), so I choose to support both, or (depending on how you choose to view it) neither format. Let the manufacturers and studios fight over formats all they want.

...it no longer matters to me.

One thing I'd like to point out (don't want to get into a flame war over it), but I am of a mind that purchasing seperate units to support each format does nothing to send a signal to either side in the format war. You see, purchasing one of each format just provides each side with another number (on each side), but purchasing a single "combo" player puts a check mark under a box that sends the message "this buyer doesn't care about formats, and only wants to be able to play HD media".

Purchasing a combo player puts a check mark into a third category, telling the industry that we are fed up. Purchasing one of each, just kind of slides under the radar.

Cheers,
Spence

There was a open box Sharp Blu-Ray at my local Future Shop it was listed at 300$ i`m thinking I might go back and try to draw them down to around 200$ since I know some guys there. Then if all goes well i`ll have the best of both worlds. Its just sad that no one wants to budge on this and we have to drop mega bucks and deal with the headaches...

There was a open box Sharp Blu-Ray at my local Future Shop it was listed at 300$ i`m thinking I might go back and try to draw them down to around 200$ since I know some guys there. Then if all goes well i`ll have the best of both worlds. Its just sad that no one wants to budge on this and we have to drop mega bucks and deal with the headaches...

We don't "have" to do anything. I'm old enough to remember the VHS/Beta Max wars. Personally, I'm not going to lose sleep(or money) over this crap. I used to be an early adopter to all the new stuff, but it gets old paying 5x what the latest greatest new stuff is worth for minimal improvements. I'll keep using my Panasonic rp-52 and be happy for as long as it takes to sort out.

In my opinion, the winner is going to either be a third format that is technolgically superior and cheaper to produce, or IP-based distribution. However, I don't think either of those are happening (in the mainstream) in the next 3-5 years and I want to enjoy HDM within that time period. Both formats are going to be around for a while (years), probably until one of the aformentioned new solutions comes about. That's why I bought the 5000 now. Plus, if a new format does come out, it doesn't make my current HDM look any worse. They aren't going to increase consumer panel resolution beyond 1080p for a very long time. The main benefits I see to this hypothetical non-IP "third format" with more storage would be more lossless audio options, more HD bonus features, and lower cost. Again, that isn't gonna be an appreciable increase in quality from my HD-DVD's and Blu-Ray's.

The dual-format player takes the format out of the equation at a price. You could buy both format players for under $500.

In my opinion, the format war was never about providing a better format but controlling the market through the format. We just need a Chineese company to start pumping out cheap dual format players to end the war.

We just need a Chineese company to start pumping out cheap dual format players to end the war.

Amen.

I can't even find a Sam 5000 to buy! Where do you get one?

I really dont understand the problem with the dual formats no matter who wins. The prices are getting low enough on both format players that you can just buy one of each.

I do think it's bad for the industry because the avg. consumer is WAAAYYY too stupid to comprehend the two formats. Not to mention the fact that one is called "HD-DVD", which just confuses the crap out of them even more.

As for me, I'll be happier than a pig in slop when the war ends. Everyone with left over, losing format (HD-DVD imho), DVDs will need someone to give them to. ;)

I do think it's bad for the industry because the avg. consumer is WAAAYYY too stupid to comprehend the two formats.


So wouldn't the confusion result in less sales? If I buy the wrong format disc (because of stupidity) and my player doesn't play it, isn't that a negative?

Maybe if they color coded the players to match the format, that would solve the problem. Red players for HD-DVD, Blue for Blu-Ray, striped for dual format.

We just need a Chineese company to start pumping out cheap dual format players to end the war.
I'm all for that. Just don't lick them... ;)

I really dont understand the problem with the dual formats no matter who wins. The prices are getting low enough on both format players that you can just buy one of each.

The problem with this approach is that it validates the cry-baby attitudes of those propagating the two formats. If everyone just bought two players, there would be no reason for anything other than the status quo to continue. Being played as fools by large multi-national corporations should not sit well with anyone.

It would be far better if NO ONE bought these devices at all until they figured out a mutually agreeable resolution to their greed issues. Of course, this is not realistic as anything marketed heavily enough will attract buyers, but this whole thing is insane.

Imagine trying to choose a toaster that you could only toast certain brands of bread in. Laughable, but look at this thread!

The problem with this approach is that it validates the cry-baby attitudes of those propagating the two formats. If everyone just bought two players, there would be no reason for anything other than the status quo to continue. Being played as fools by large multi-national corporations should not sit well with anyone.

It would be far better if NO ONE bought these devices at all until they figured out a mutually agreeable resolution to their greed issues. Of course, this is not realistic as anything marketed heavily enough will attract buyers, but this whole thing is insane.

Imagine trying to choose a toaster that you could only toast certain brands of bread in. Laughable, but look at this thread!
Well, a lot of people want a toaster that can do better than 480 lines of video, and "universal toasters" allow us to do any bread we want -- with a little patience they will soon come down in price.

God this really sucks. The only thing that seems better from when I was looking a year ago is the prices :(

I just joined the fun of this game with my 100$ D3 purchase and now that i`m fully into it I started looking and wow are we suffering because of two formats....My reason below...IF i`m wrong please tell me....I may have one or so of my studios wrong or not updated....

Of the Top 20 grossing movies of 2007:

1 Spider-Man 3 Sony ----BLU ONLY
2 Shrek the Third P/DW ----HD ONLY
3 Transformers P/DW ----HD ONLY
4 Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End BV ----BLU ONLY
5 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix WB ----DUAL
6 The Bourne Ultimatum Uni. ----HD ONLY
7 300 WB ----DUAL
8 Ratatouille BV ----BLU ONLY
9 The Simpsons Movie Fox ----BLU ONLY
10 Wild Hogs BV ----BLU ONLY
11 I Am Legend WB ----DUAL
12 Knocked Up Uni. ----HD ONLY
13 Rush Hour 3 NL ----BLU ONLY
14 Live Free or Die Hard Fox ----BLU ONLY
15 Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer Fox ----BLU ONLY
16 American Gangster Uni. ----HD ONLY
17 Bee Movie P/DW ----HD ONLY
18 Superbad Sony ----BLU ONLY
19 I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry Uni. ----HD ONLY
20 Hairspray (2007) NL ----BLU ONLY


I disagree... because of the format war the prices have been plummeting down... competition has it's advantages.

I disagree... because of the format war the prices have been plummeting down... competition has it's advantages.

Even in gen3 they both have severe issues though. Things not working, reading certain media, load times, etc. Maybe cutting back on costs too fast.

I just went purple for $256 shipped with the LG computer drive. Sure it doesn't do the HD audio codecs but it can back up your discs which is worth way more to me. Personally I don't care about the format war now. I just buy whatever disc is cheapest!

Personally I don't care about the format war now. I just buy whatever disc is cheapest!

Like everyone else. Guess which disks are cheaper to produce ...

Miata,

I was really addressing the arrogance of these multi-national firms. They have insisted on marketing conflicting formats knowing full well it is not in the interest of the consumer. Such a colossal waste of effort and money.

Of course, everyone wants the best solution but this one is particularly insidious. It isn't like DLP vs LCD in the projector arena. There, everyone gets what they want; absence of rainbows for the pro-LCD folks, deeper blacks for the pro-LCD people, etc. They agree to disagree with each other, but in the end, but their choice doesn't handicap their viewing habits. Here, the only way to watch whatever you want is to spend more money. It seems illogical to expect that a dual format machine could ever be the same price as a single format. The money matters more to some more than others, but being manipulated should bug anyone.

As an aside, one aspect of this that the studios seem to wish to overlook are the unintended consequences of this superior output signal. Poor transfers will still look poor no matter how many lines of resolution.

The average consumer may not be as tech savvy as those who hang out here. Calling them stupid is unnecessary, though. They just have other interests. They can smell a rat, though. SD will prevail until they sort out a unified format, the players are under $100, and the disks cost no more than what SD does now. You may scoff, but VHS tapes were about the same price as SD DVD is now and that was 15 years ago, so SD with it's superior resolution, ease of navigation, much more content is cheaper in constant dollars than VHS was back then. HD will have to follow suit to supplant SD and having a format struggle will only delay this from happening.

I disagree... because of the format war the prices have been plummeting down... competition has it's advantages.

Agreed!!!

Furthermore, other than Sony movies, I think in time the exclusive studios are going to figure out that they're missing profits by not offering their movies in both formats. Then the discussion will be about which which player produces the best HD experience.

The format war has just got a bit cooler - Warner has announced that it will begin exclusive support for Blu-ray.

...so much for competition. :(

Even if BR trounces HD, there will be no mass adoption until prices fall to those approximating what is available for SD. Look at all the folks who have bought HDTV's not realizing they need an HD signal. They are probably wondering what the big deal is all about. Getting the 'masses' to pay a multiple for a new DVD player to get a better picture is just a wet dream for manufacturers and content producers.

There is a parallel of sorts to the CD revolution in the early 80's. Prices were double to triple that of vinyl - $15 or so. Seemed outrageous at the time, plus even an entry level player was $200+. The justification was that there were such huge R&D expenses to recoup and new authoring equipment to be purchased. Whatever. Still a piece of plastic you stuck in a player. They then figured out that people weren't going to pay much more than that and look where we are today with CD's. Up a couple of bucks from that 25 years later, only in 2008 dollars. A strong difference between then and now is that the quality and convenience difference between vinyl and CD's was so profound that vinyl and cassettes disappeared within a year, seems like. It is hard to see how the content producers are going to be able to wish away SD. Maybe if the premium is only slight or something.