OK, PLEASE advise, fellow AVS folks ! I have been researching FP for about a year now:eek:, and I was sooooo close to pullin' the proverbial trigger on a VW-60 (I really think it has a LOT going for it)...BUT...I am a huge football fan, and I really preferred to not purchase an alternate TV (plasma, LCD, "whatever") in order to get a punchy-sharp football game. DISCLAIMER: I am NOT blaming, repeat...NOT blaming the VW-60, as virtually ALL FP I have seen (meaning under $15K) showing football from a (especially)720p satellite source or even 1080i satellite source, looks "murky" enough (not sharp enough and not "punchy" enough...like a rear projector or DLP, or plasma, etc)

I attribute my angst to the lousy signal of NON-1080p. On a SONY demo 1080p disc, a Delaware-Navy segment looks stunning, so it's not football, per se, but with motion, and then stretching non-1080p out over ~96", I think football (sharp lines, helmet logos, etc.) is a very demanding task for non-1080p (moreso than movies IMHO).

OK, so (other than throwing in the proverbial towel and NOT going FP) what would be my best solution in a quest for BEST picture quality for non-1080p football ? I'd be happy to havethe P.Q. of my five year-old Sony LCD1266X768p rear projector on a 96" diagonal screen with a 720p signal (DTV showing ESPN-HD ).:( Thanks for any and all advice !

Some games look great while others simply do not. I think it ALL depends on the cameras they are using for that particular game. CBS does have the absolute best looking HD broadcasts. Fox on the other hand sometimes look upconverted and not good at all even after using my crystalio II to do its magic. NBC Sunday night games seem to look pretty good while ESPN and ABC are like a crap shoot. You never know what you are going to get! :eek:

When I had my VW60 those CBS NFL HD games were stunning so I know that the Black Pearl is not at fault. ;)

I am going to miss football on CBS and NBC. I use a 1080p DLP projector at 119" diagonal with Da-lite Hi-Power screen. I use the off air antenna for HD broadcasts.

Yea, JoeRod, agreed...this was essentially what I was saying. 720p seems to really be a rotten source (FOX + ESPN-HD + ABC = all 720p). They just mess up a good presentation @ 96" or so. Joe- interesting that with your video processor, that you say FOX still stinks, so maybe that is not an answer. I'm afraid that to watch 720p sports via most FP on a big screen, that it may be better to have an alternative flat panel screen for that material ! :(

Oh no actually with my VP it makes it much better. Without it I would go nuts. Seriously, it is much less distracting having a good VP. ;)

Some games look great while others simply do not. I think it ALL depends on the cameras they are using for that particular game. CBS does have the absolute best looking HD broadcasts. Fox on the other hand sometimes look upconverted and not good at all even after using my crystalio II to do its magic. NBC Sunday night games seem to look pretty good while ESPN and ABC are like a crap shoot. You never know what you are going to get! :eek:

When I had my VW60 those CBS NFL HD games were stunning so I know that the Black Pearl is not at fault. ;)The Patriots-Giants game was broadcast natiuonwide on NBC and CBS, but here in Boston it was also on ABC. There was a lot of noise in the broadcast, which for some reason was worse on NBC. I was surprised to see the voices during interviews were not in synch.

The punch at 133" diagonal was more than adequate, though. :)

Like Joe said broadcast football is a crap shoot. Why not get the best of both worlds. When the signal is pristine zoom up to 96", when you get an iffy signal, zoom down the picture to big screen TV size say 60" or less depending on the signal quality.

Now that is a good idea. Good post. :)

It seems to depend on the cameras being used at the game or maybe some other processing link in the video chain because some games are spectacular and others are pretty irritating. I forget if it was the Giants game or a different one but one of them had really bad camera people, or malfuntioning autofocus as the shot was out of focus on a pretty regular basis. Maybe there's something with the Sony PJ's but the good games have lots on punch on a simple RS1 at 159" on high power. I watch a lot of football myself, despite the Vikings needing to fire the coach, QB and find an owner that isn't some cheapskate that shouldn't be a part of the NFL. Furthest under the salary cap and they want a huge new state funded stadium heh.

Supposedly when they use Sony's newer HD cameras for the broadcasts (which is why CBS looks so good) we always get a great picture... Just wish all the networks would use them...

Yea, good points. All I can say is that watching a 720p FOX hatchet job-football game, on about a 110" Firehawk w/ VW-60, it gave me a headache. mAlmost like it was a 480i or something, even though I KNOW it was their 720p broadcast. Man, I have to have a level of sharpness and punch for my football game !:eek:
I am still thinking smallishplasma + FP. combo.

It seems to depend on the cameras being used at the game or maybe some other processing link in the video chain because some games are spectacular and others are pretty irritating. I forget if it was the Giants game or a different one but one of them had really bad camera people, or malfuntioning autofocus as the shot was out of focus on a pretty regular basis. Maybe there's something with the Sony PJ's but the good games have lots on punch on a simple RS1 at 159" on high power. I watch a lot of football myself, despite the Vikings needing to fire the coach, QB and find an owner that isn't some cheapskate that shouldn't be a part of the NFL. Furthest under the salary cap and they want a huge new state funded stadium heh.

I believe it is the cameras also. Even at a single game, some cameras are better than others. Also, the overhead DLP camera seems to be quite good, esp. on long downfield passes. A good perspective and good HD quality.

Just for your reference, I saw the Standard Def Giants /Patriots game. I tuned into it via my big satellite dish on a C-band Fox broadcast for the US Virgin Islands and Puerto Rico.

I noted also a diminished quality. I switched to my little-dish Ku-band signal off of another satellite at 123 west longitude. I got exactly the same low quality result.

This leads me to believe that the problem is not likely in the transmission, but is somewhere else - maybe in the on-the- field cameras or up in the Fox hierarchy or something like that.

It was watchable, I enjoyed the game, but I get better definition off of standard DVDs and off of most other standard def satellite signals.

Yes, exactly. But I think that a crummy signal (even if it is technically "high def " @720p ), is exacerbated by "blowing it up" to...say...a 96" diagonal screen.:eek:

Oh, one more advantage to zooming down to say 60" you'll get plasma like brightness and very rich looking colors.