We all know HD DVD is not going to be annointed the new/next optical standard - at this point in time. However, despite the giddiness of the bluest Bd fanboys, it remains to be seen if even Bd will.
The perception is almost universally going to be that as of 1/4/08, HD DVD is a dead man walking. Well I suggest Toshiba accept and roll with that- the best course of action for Toshiba and several hundred thousand loyal customers, is to re-make HD DVD into a 'zombie' format. The living dead format that keeps going and going and going...

By that I mean, keep supplying the capability to play HD DVDs in all your players, and add the functionality of Bd. You've made a lot of fans with the excellant build quality and value of your initial players- capitalize on that in a Bd world-
I've been dual format for 6 months now- but I burned myself on that $500 1.0 profile player...and I do not want to throw more money Bds way this soon in the game.
I would however like to have a backup HD DVD player for a sizable collection (remember attach rates?) of HD DVDs I've compiled in the last 18 months and will continue to purchase if Universal and Parmaount continue to publish exclusively in the format.
I would much rather buy a high quality Tosh Combo player , than a snazzy new 2.0 compliant Bd one.

If you can put that out- and convince Universal and Parmaount to put out at least another 100 or so quality exclusive titles between them thru this year- then HD DVD will have a catalog of exclusives compelling enough to make HD DVD functionality in a player a compelling feature.

And if you trojan horse that into Bd households...you have a good shot at capitilizing on that if/when Bd stumbles or loses patience with slow growth and high costs.

You aren't dead yet- grow a pair and get back in the game. Also realize that Sony probably paid a billion dollars for a treasure ultimately worth half that.

I would hope for Toshiba releasing combo players 'til the end of BD's lifespan. Kind of how Pioneer supported LD by making those DVD/LD players.. It would be a nice gesture to those who happened to support them. A form of 'backwards compatibility', like Sony does with their PS3 allowed Playstation owners to continue using their original PS1 games from the mid 90s to this very day.

I hope Toshiba goes out of business, seriously, they have no business being in consumer electronics.

I would hope for Toshiba releasing combo players 'til the end of BD's lifespan. Kind of how Pioneer supported LD by making those DVD/LD players.. It would be a nice gesture to those who happened to support them. A form of 'backwards compatibility', like Sony does with their PS3 allowed Playstation owners to continue using their original PS1 games from the mid 90s to this very day.

Amen to both of you! I'm really hoping Tosh will show us some respect and release a quality combo player.

I'm personally sitting on 30 movies, which I was happy to buy to support my jihad against Sony :D

It makes perfect sense for Toshiba to release a Blu-ray player with legacy HD DVD support. They would lose a lot of respect if they don't continue supporting the short-lived format that they started.

It would solve my problems if they did, at this point, IMHO Toshiba making a combo would be the best. If not, the next best thing would be for Warner Bros to do a title for title straight up Blu trade for my Warner HD-DVDs. Since they care so much about the consumer, why not?

I hope Toshiba goes out of business, seriously, they have no business being in consumer electronics.
I've had similar feelings about Sony for a while now.

It would solve my problems if they did, at this point, IMHO Toshiba making a combo would be the best. If not, the next best thing would be for Warner Bros to do a title for title straight up Blu trade for my Warner HD-DVDs. Since they care so much about the consumer, why not?
Warner only care about themselves...they care about the consumer only inasmuch as it serves to fatten their bottom line.

I would be one of their first customers if Toshiba released a combo player, and if the price is about the same or less than the average Blu-ray player it would force the market into releasing only dual format players, like LG and Samsung are already doing, and could even convince Paramount and Universal to remain HD DVD exclusive. HD DVD is still the better format, and although I would be "format neutral" in the sense of having a dual format player I would not purchase Blu-ray discs (I cannot bring myself to buy a format like Blu-ray that is not repairable. In my opinion this is a serious, serious problem for Blu-ray and is like a volcano waiting to explode within the buy/sell/rental industries).

It makes perfect sense for Toshiba to release a Blu-ray player with legacy HD DVD support. They would lose a lot of respect if they don't continue supporting the short-lived format that they started.

It's what Sony did with Beta. Long after the last Beta tape sold, you could still get a Beta player from Sony.

I hope Toshiba goes out of business, seriously, they have no business being in consumer electronics.

Why? They seem to make decent electronics as far as mass market companies go. If I had to choose a TV today, it'd be either Sony, Samsung, Sharp, Toshiba, Mitsubishi, Panasonic..and that's about it.

I think Toshiba would be very smart to release dual format players.

Also, HD DVD playback should be a feature of all upscaling DVD players that they sell - from $69, $99 and up.

I went to Pioneer's website and noticed that they still make a LD/DVD/CD player. Click here (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Products/HomeEntertainment/Blu-rayDisc+DVD/DVD+LDPlayers/ci.DVL-919.Kuro) to see the Pioneer DVL-919. It would be nice if Toshiba supported HD DVD 10+ years.

I think Toshiba would be very smart to release dual format players.

Also, HD DVD playback should be a feature of all upscaling DVD players that they sell - from $69, $99 and up.
I don't think we have anything to worry about. Everyone who has HD DVD discs will be able to play those discs for years to come, no doubt about it.

It seems to me that Toshiba's only choice in this "war" is to put out an affordable dual player. HD-DVD supporters can continue to buy the HD-DVD titles they want and not fear having to buy them again for blu-ray. As long as the player is affordable they can still keep a lot of customers IMO.

I went with Tosh on this one because of player price ($265 for my HD-A1 about a year and half ago) and the fact that it appeared Sony and it's gaggle were more interested in gouging the consumer than establishing a new format. Pretty incredible that I could get a fully functional HD player that flawlessly outputted great sound via analogs for that price, especially when compared to the features and price of BD players at the time. Tosh has also been great with timely updates.

While I am bummed about recent events, based on the way it has delivered over the past year and a half, I do hope that Tosh doesn't give up the ship on this one. That means a dual format player. I would gladly purchase a Tosh dual format player over that of any other brand.

Hopefully Tosh heads in this direction if Universal doesn't fold.

I hope Toshiba goes out of business, seriously, they have no business being in consumer electronics.

uhhhh, did you mean samsung??

i hope tosh comes out with a dual player that puts samsung in the dirt!!!

I don't know about anyone else, but I am not worried about the viability of future HD-DVD playback.

If I have any real worries about HDM in the future -- it's on the BD side. I have serious doubts here.
When will BD 2.0 players be out and reasonably priced?
Will my 1.0 BD player play 2.0 discs down the line (or 1.1 for that matter)?
What will happen when I click on a 1.1 or 2.0 feature in my 1.0 player?
Will new options in BD discs end up locking up or plain not work in my 1.0 player?
Will I be waiting for firmware just to keep my player working on new media the BD side?

Lots of questions on the BD side. And, no I don't want PS3.

-comix

I'm wondering if it would be worth it to produce a dual player if, let's say Universal and Paramount dropped HD DVD by the end of the month, or even end of 1st quarter. There would likely be less than 500 titles.

As for Laser Disc, there were easily over a thousand titles .. some say close to 10K. Would it be worth it for any manufacturer to make a dual player? Do you think Toshiba would do the honorable thing and make a dual player if this were to happen?

I hope Toshiba goes out of business, seriously, they have no business being in consumer electronics.

Very mature.....how old are you 12?

I'm wondering if it would be worth it to produce a dual player if, let's say Universal and Paramount dropped HD DVD by the end of the month, or even end of 1st quarter. There would likely be less than 500 titles.

As for Laser Disc, there were easily over a thousand titles .. some say close to 10K. Would it be worth it for any manufacturer to make a dual player? Do you think Toshiba would do the honorable thing and make a dual player if this were to happen?
Toshiba will always have HD DVD playback in their players, and I suspect that others will incorporate it as a feature as well in various models.

It's what Sony did with Beta. Long after the last Beta tape sold, you could still get a Beta player from Sony.

Sony did it with Beta because of the simple fact that Beta and Digital Beta are still used in film production. I work for an advertising agency and there are still occasions, when the cost of HD production is prohibitive, where we are still using Beta.

Sony did it with Beta because of the simple fact that Beta and Digital Beta are still used in film production. I work for an advertising agency and there are still occasions, when the cost of HD production is prohibitive, where we are still using Beta.

"Although there is a superficial similarity between Betamax and Betacam in that they use the same tape cassette, they are really quite different formats. Betamax records relatively low resolution composite video using a heterodyne color recording system and only two recording heads, while Betacam uses four heads to record in component format, at a much higher linear tape speed, resulting in much higher video and audio quality. A typical L-750 length Betamax cassette that yielded about 3 hours of recording time on a Betamax VCR at its B-II speed, only provided 30 minutes record time on a Betacam VCR or camcorder." - Wikipedia

Sony conceded defeat in 1988, and the last betamax player (in the US) was the SL-HF2000 which was released in 1993.

Betacam (even Betacam SP) is still used for broadcast.

Toshiba will always have HD DVD playback in their players, and I suspect that others will incorporate it as a feature as well in various models.

Exactly. Look at the number of Sony devices that support SACD or the number of Panasonic devices that support DVD-Audio. HD DVD has had more of an impact on the consumer than those two formats combined so if you can still buy a new device that will play SACD or DVD-A (sometimes both) today I think it's reasonable enough to think that Toshiba will support HD DVD even if the format goes under tomorrow.

The last Beta device was made in 2002.

The last dedicated VHS device was made in 2007.

NeoGeo Cart systems were being produced until 2004 with the last game being made in 2006.

Nuon (the failed videogame format) enhanced DVD players were made until 2004 and Nuance emulation software allows Nuon software to be played on computers to this day.

LD, DVD-A and SACD devices are still being made.

I want a DF player, but not from Toshiba. They can't even get a HD DVD only player right, why do you guys expect them to get a DF player right?

Then I guess you are stuck with 2 players. Neither Samsung or LG has gotten DF right yet.

Toshiba players have all performed better than their equivalent generation BD players. Part of it is the evolving BD standards.

BTW I love my A35 and BD30 combo.I bought the 5000 in hopes I could use a single player.

I hope Toshiba goes out of business, seriously, they have no business being in consumer electronics.

:rolleyes:

I want a DF player, but not from Toshiba. They can't even get a HD DVD only player right, why do you guys expect them to get a DF player right?

Explain. My HD-A2 is perfect.

Explain. My HD-A2 is perfect.


The A2 doesn't even output 1080/24p AFAIK.

And maybe if Toshiba makes a combo unit then Sony will to... :eek:

The A2 doesn't even output 1080/24p AFAIK.
Yeh because there are so many tv's with 1080/24p input. Let's discuss the deficiencies of CURRENT blu ray players.

The A2 doesn't even output 1080/24p AFAIK.

And that makes the entire Toshiba product line "not right"? I don't need 1080P output, as my projector does a marvelous job with 3:2 pulldown, which for 1080P/24 sourced material is trivial, and if you really need 1080P, Toshiba has players that will output 1080P.

1080P is all hype anyway. Do a little research, you will find out that 1080P results in NO MORE DATA being transmitted to your display. But the CE manufacturers found a neat trick to sell a feature, much like the progressive vs interlaced DVD players, which make absolutely no difference on fixed pixel displays driven digitally. Therefore those CE manufacturers trumpet it as a must have feature, charge you more for it, and suck in those who don't know better.

Do a side by side test of two players driving a 1080 fixed pixel display, one using 1080I, one using 1080P, and I guarantee you will see ZERO difference.

No, if you want to try to rip Toshiba's products, you're going to have to try harder than simply stating a couple of their models "only" output 1080I.

I hope Toshiba goes out of business, seriously, they have no business being in consumer electronics.

Another quality post. What ever happened to rational men...

MEC2

The A2 doesn't even output 1080/24p AFAIK.

Nor did they ever advertise it would. The A1, A2, and A3 have always been 1080i only.

LaserDisc is no longer being made. New, old stock still exist for those who need it.

Bring on a tosh df player with a toshiba 'spursengine' cell processor for the possible 'next step' in the 'evolution' of sd 'upscaling':D.