Hello,

I am planning to buy some speakers soon. I bought myself a Yamaha RX-V659, since it is reported to have good stereo sound, and can do surround. The fact that it has 7 amplification channels is another pro. I don't have the money to get stereo amps, and pre/pros, or anything with hdmi - not that I need that anyway, I don't have hd-dvd or blu-ray players.

So I would like to buy quality speakers to match. To start with, I know the main thing when buying speakers is listen, listen, listen. Which I am doing to the extent available to me.

Edit: I would like to add that the speakers will be used much more for music than movies.

What I'm wondering is what size speakers I should be buying. I read some threads about "house curves" and appropriate speakers for room sizes, but it's hard for me to say what is right for me.

Here are the measurements of my room (with speaker placement shown in blue):
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b33/klankymen/avsmeasure.gif
The room is thus 170 square feet, or 1870 cubic feet.

I would like to buy sub-700€ (sub-1000$) speakers since I have a small budget. I have not settled on a manufacturer yet, I have listened to Canton, Klipsch, Kef, B&W....

To exemplify I will now use the products of one manufacturer, this does not mean I am set on buying them though.

I was thinking a good option for me would be floorstanders with two 5" drivers, such as the KEF iQ5, or the Klipsch RF-52.
Also an option would be Standmounted speakers, however with a larger 6.25" driver, such as the KEF iQ3, or the Klipsch RB-61.

would these be reasonably sized and powered speakers for my room size, or am I looking in entirely the wrong size range?

What do you think, am I better off with floorstanders? a dual 5" floorstander has more membrane surface than a 6.25" bookshelf design, not to mention more volume inside the cabinet, making for more sensitivity and lower range.

Pricewise floorstanders are still a little bit more expensive, even after discounting the price of mounting stands.

Can you recommend any good brands for me to try? Here is a list of the brands my local hifi-shop carries. (http://www.hificoncept.de/content_html?nid=46&nidc=46)
It is my intent to buy 2 front speakers to listen to music, but eventually buy a center and 2 or 3 surrounds for movies, so it is probably important that any brands I look at also produce matching surrround and center speakers.

As for subwoofers... I don't need a subwoofer (rather, the gains in LF would be counteracted by the losses of my neighbours calling the police - thus I don't want to spent money on one yet). However I looked around the craigsub top subs list, and don't see any of the big speaker brands in there. Does that mean that they just aren't as good as exclusive sub mfgrs? So better an SVS than a Klipsch or Kef sub, to go with a Klipsch or Kef speaker set?

If you're not going with a sub, then I'd say floorstanders are the way to go for the lower bass capabilities. Any of the ones you mention should work fine with your receiver. It looks like you have quite a few brands available for audition. Remember that the best speaker is the one that sounds best to you.

As far as subs, the internet direct companies such as SVS and HSU generally give a lot more bang for the buck, and it's completely unnecessary to have the sub come from the same manufacturer as your other speakers.

Hello, and thank you for your answer.

Well, the whole internet direct thing doesn't work too well for me, at least with SVS, since I am studying in Bavaria, and SVS doesn't seem to ship here :)

I have a few more questions that occured to me.

I have seen people recomment getting rears that are quieter/less powerful than the fronts - why? Could one not go with all 4 speakers the same? Also, is it recommended to get dipole rear speakers?

Well, the ultimate home theater would have 5 (or 7) identical speakers, each with the capability to reproduce the full range of audible frequencies (20 - 20k). Since this isn't practical in most situations (and it's a rare speaker that can reproduce 20 hz) we make compromises. In the case of rear surrounds, you can generally use smaller 'less powerful' speakers since the demands on the surrounds isn't usually as high as the fronts and center. Plus, pretty much every home theater receiver on the market has the ability to route lower frequencies to a subwoofer anyways, which is designed to reproduce low frequencies. Since the low frequencies are out of the picture, you can get away with using smaller speakers. Generally, I'd make sure any speaker you buy is rated down to at least 80 hz, 60hz would be better. If you aren't going with a sub, you'll want front speakers that can go lower if possible. Keep in mind that room interactions and speaker placement will also have a profound effect on how low your speakers will go in your room.

As far as dipole rears, that is a matter of personal preference. My first surrounds were bipolar and I didn't care for them personally. I use small bookshelf speakers for surrounds and have the lower frequencies sent to the sub (by selecting 'small' for speaker size) and it works well for me.

With your budget and assuming no subwoofer will be used, I'd go for tower fronts with whichever center matches your fronts, and small bookshelf speakers from the same manufacturer for surrounds. That will get you the best overall sound at your budget IMO. If you are going to use a subwoofer, you might consider a larger bookshelf speaker for the fronts.

Is the sub 1000 budget for fronts only? I looked at the link you provided with the list of brands and saw Dynaudio listed. Putting 1k towards a pair of Dynaudio fronts would be a great foundation for a nice theater! It is important to note however that the 'best' speaker is the one that sounds best to you. Listen to everything you can. One thing to try might be to listen to a 'reference level' system and identify what you like about the high end systems. Then try to get speakers at your budget that come as close as possible to the reference sound (providing it's a sound you like).

Hello deneb, and thank you for the tips.

So, rear and surround speakers can be smaller than the Fronts, but they aren't explicitly supposed to be?

The 1000$ / 700€ price limit does indeed apply to only the front pair (including if necessary stands and/or spikes).

I will ask at the store if I can listen to some Dynaudios, thank you for suggesting that brand. However I think even the cheapest floorstanding speakers they sell are over 700€ a pair, but I will look.

My neighbour has a fairly high end home theater in his house, I'm not sure if it would qualify as reference - I do know that a fairly high sum of money was spent on it.
I'll also see if I can find something reference-like for music at the hifi-store, assuming his system doesn't allready qualify for that.

I would like to add that I edited one line into my original post at the same time as you were replying, which you might of missed, namely that the system would be used a lot more for music than for cinema. This is a reason for my considering getting towers for the front 2 channels - since when I listen to music I like to listen in stereo, and I have heard it is not really recommended to offload to subwoofers when listening to music. As such I'd rather have my mains be able to handle a big Freq range for music alone.

Edit: I have another question about speaker theory. I was wondering about sensitivity, and how Klipsch gives higher numbers than many other speakers. Now I don't mean to offend fans, I have listened to Klipsch speakers and liked them, but they are a pretty big brand, with a big mainstream reputation. I was wondering if they do maybe take one or to leaves out of Bose and Monster's books and somehow manipulate their measurements to look better than others. Is this even possible, considering the voltage and distance are always given equal? For example, comparing KEF and Klipsches iQ5 and RF-52. Both these speakers use the same amount of same size drivers, allthough granted Klipsch does have a bigger cabinet. However Klipsch's specs mention a 96dB sensitivity, whereas KEF says 88dB. Is there really a 8dB difference here?
This is not to say I couldn't accept this if it is a tradeof in sound quality... 2.83 Volts into 8 Ohm is only 1 Watt, and if I went by the amount my amp can do (100W) and the distance I will have to the speakers (2.5m), this would even with the KEFs give a maximum loudness of 104dB, which is easily enough for me.

Klipsch speakers typically use a horn or horn loaded tweeter which helps them achieve high sensitivity ratings. Other factors in driver/crossover design will affect sensitivity ratings as well. Sensitivity has nothing to do with the quality of sound, only the relative volume level a speaker can play with a given amount of power. Klipsch speakers are an 'aquired taste' to some, others love them, still others will tell you they are far too 'bright' sounding, which leads to listener fatigue. A speaker with a sensitivity 87db or greater should give plenty of volume. Dynaudio speakers tend to have a little lower sensitivity, so you'd definitely want to try them out with your reciever.

If this will be more of a music system first, cinema second type of system, then my Dynaudio recommendation just got stronger :) Although their floorstanding models might be out of your budget. KEF is another brand that has some great products.

As far as a reference system, ask to listen to a high end system at whichever store you're auditioning speakers, then audition speakers in your price range that seem to come close to the 'reference sound'.

And yes, surround speakers can be smaller than the fronts, (and many times are) but it's not a requirement. Many times, a larger front speaker will utilize the same tweeter as a smaller speaker used for surround duties from the same manufacturer. For example, should funds allow, you could get a pair of Dynaudio audience 62's for front floorstander, and audience 42's for the rear. The 42's use a smaller woofer in a much smaller cabinet than the 62's, but they both use the same tweeter. That with the 42c for a center speaker would be a great sounding setup. A setup consisting five audience 42's with a sub would be great as well. The main reason behind a sub not being recommended for music listening is that sub can sound boomy and muddy, but that is often due to a room acoustic issue as opposed to the sub itself. Also, integrating the sub crossover can be tricky for music listening as well. When properly integrated however, music with a sub can sound very good.