I have a lot of HD movies that I've recorded from Dish Network in HD MPEG2 TS using my Dish 6000 with R5000-HD mod, was wondering if I can make Blue-Ray format on regular DVD-R DL even if it takes 2 or 3 discs as long as I keep the high quality of the video and AC-3 audio so I will be able to play them on my playstation 3, I know I can play them as Data Disc if converted them to MPEG2 PS using videoredo, But I just want to go for this option for fun purposes, I have roxio 9 it does author in blue ray but it won't let you save disc image it copy stright to blu-ray disc.

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.

I haven't found a way to do that either. I guess you can always stream that content (.tp/.ts) files to the PS3. Oh wait, you can't do that either :mad:

And pro-WMV HD files, they play but no sound.

Convert it to MPEG2, great...oh wait, the 2GB limit kicks in and you get 1/2 of the time of a DVD-R or 1/4 of the time of a DVD+R DL :(

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.

Please reserve your opinions to the format. Don't assume everyone else thinks its "the better format".

I've owned both, I was an A1 & XA2 owner the days those players came out. I don't know I'd say they are the "better" format; they had QUITE a few downfalls. Bought a PS3 and sold the players in early '07 because I had a bad feeling about the format, but that's besides the point...

In response to the OP's question, I'm not entire certain on this but I believe it can be done but the authoring software isn't quite where it needs to be yet.

I have Roxio too and I can't get it to burn to a DVD (much less DL) because its looking for a BD-25. I don't even see an option to burn to a BD-50. I'm pretty sure the PS3 will just read it as a BR-authored disc if its done right. I don't know though, someone needs to come out with some better authoring software so we can test this!

Can anyone with some more experience chime in? This would be excellent if we can get it to to work!

It must be possible, since the AVS HD calibration disk can be burned to DVD-R and played on Blu-Ray players:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=948496&highlight=blu-ray+calibration+iso
Ask them how they made the ISO.

There is a BD9 spec, but I'm not sure if it's mandatory that all players can do it. BD9 would be similar to how HD DVD does it, where a lower bitrate HD signal can be played with red laser from regular DVD9 media.

This is something I was actually looking forward to down the road with HD DVD as we are planning on getting an HD camcorder soon. This would let us burn HD material on regular DVD9 and watch it in high definition on our HD player.

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.
Yes, you CAN.

Here is couple thread for you to chew on:

My Blu-Ray Movie Burning Experiences...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=815296

TsRemux: Transport Stream De/Re-muxer
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=125447

This is something I was actually looking forward to down the road with HD DVD as we are planning on getting an HD camcorder soon. This would let us burn HD material on regular DVD9 and watch it in high definition on our HD player.
I can author my MPEG-2 HDV or MPEG-4 AVCHD home videos on DVD 5/9 using TSRemux and play them on PS3.

You need one of the following programs: Pinnacle studio11, Ulead movie factory6, Sony Vegas pro8.

Any one of these programs will do what you want. The format will be AVCHD with DD5.1 sound.

Another possible option: When Apple announces Mac Pro Blu-ray drive add-on options at Macworld this month (as they're strongly rumored to do), I'm sure some authoring software updates will go with it. There should be some sort of solution in there, I'm sure. Just have to keep one's eyes peeled.

BTW, I'm in the same boat as the OP...I've got a lot of R5000-HD content on HDDs that I'd love to throw onto some shiny discs this Spring.

Problem is, the media is still just too expensive to warrant the move. Hard drives are waaaay cheaper.

Any one of these programs will do what you want. The format will be AVCHD with DD5.1 sound.
Yes, format will be AVCHD, but with TSRemux you can put MPEG-2 video, because TSRemux puts AVCHD tag into index.bdmv and MovieObject.bdmv files and makes Blu-ray players to think that video is AVCHD..

There is no e in Blu-ray.

There is no e in Blu-ray.

Yes, that's tru! :)

Here is couple thread for you to chew on:

My Blu-Ray Movie Burning Experiences...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=815296


Where is the nice guide? The first page only talked about burning on BD-R / BD-RE discs.

I am encouraged to see 25GB BD-R's at Fry's for $10, but the burners still up over $400 is disheartening. If my team makes it to and wins the Superb Bowl, it looks like I will be learning how to author and borrowing my cousin's burner.

Please reserve your opinions to the format. Don't assume everyone else thinks its "the better format".

I've owned both, I was an A1 & XA2 owner the days those players came out. I don't know I'd say they are the "better" format; they had QUITE a few downfalls. Bought a PS3 and sold the players in early '07 because I had a bad feeling about the format, but that's besides the point...

In response to the OP's question, I'm not entire certain on this but I believe it can be done but the authoring software isn't quite where it needs to be yet.

I have Roxio too and I can't get it to burn to a DVD (much less DL) because its looking for a BD-25. I don't even see an option to burn to a BD-50. I'm pretty sure the PS3 will just read it as a BR-authored disc if its done right. I don't know though, someone needs to come out with some better authoring software so we can test this!

Can anyone with some more experience chime in? This would be excellent if we can get it to to work!

Don't tell me how to voice my opinion. It is MY OPINION, jerk.:mad:

Don't tell me how to voice my opinion. It is MY OPINION, jerk.:mad:

Well, opinions around here are not as tolerated as they once were...so I forsee this thread getting shut down pretty quickly...

You need one of the following programs: Pinnacle studio11, Ulead movie factory6, Sony Vegas pro8.

Any one of these programs will do what you want. The format will be AVCHD with DD5.1 sound.

Just be clear, can you burn an HD video to a DVD-R with one of those programs and play it on any Blu-Ray stand alone?

Has anyone actually done this (not on a PS3)?

From the SW documentation, you have a choice of Blu-ray Disc™ (BDMV) Authoring or HD DVD on standard DVD (Create HD DVD productions with motion menus and burn onto standard DVDs). I can not find anything that says Burn Blu-ray to standard DVDs.

Yes. I haven't tested these apps, but in principle it works because I've done it.

There's two kinds of formats. BDAV and BDMV. BDAV is an mpeg2 only format (from what I can tell) and is old legacy support that might have been dropped

I have both the HD DVD and BD specs on the actual formats (we are members of both), and because of that, we get to write test authoring programs to generate HD DVD and BDMV wrappers around AVC & MPEG2 (& VC-1 too) streams.

The BDMV structure for DVD/R you can derive from AVCHD DVD/R disks burnt by camcorders.

You can burn them onto DVD/RW, except that there's a limit to how high a peak bitrate HD-A1/A2 can play (30Mbps is where is stutters and dies). The PS3 also cannot play anything with peak higher than 54Mbps. The thing to watch out for is that some players don't recognize the AVCHD format, but anyone making AVCHD camcorders : Sony, Panasonic, Hitachi will bend over backwards to support AVCHD or release FW upgrades for it.

AVCHD file structure is basically BDMV.

While not a true BD disc, I can burn a AVC-HD disc and my Pio 95HD BD player recognizes it as a AVC-HD disc and plays it.
-Evangelo2

Yes. I haven't tested these apps, but in principle it works because I've done it.

There's two kinds of formats. BDAV and BDMV. BDAV is an mpeg2 only format (from what I can tell) and is old legacy support that might have been dropped

I have both the HD DVD and BD specs on the actual formats (we are members of both), and because of that, we get to write test authoring programs to generate HD DVD and BDMV wrappers around AVC & MPEG2 (& VC-1 too) streams.

The BDMV structure for DVD/R you can derive from AVCHD DVD/R disks burnt by camcorders.

You can burn them onto DVD/RW, except that there's a limit to how high a peak bitrate HD-A1/A2 can play (30Mbps is where is stutters and dies). The PS3 also cannot play anything with peak higher than 54Mbps. The thing to watch out for is that some players don't recognize the AVCHD format, but anyone making AVCHD camcorders : Sony, Panasonic, Hitachi will bend over backwards to support AVCHD or release FW upgrades for it.

AVCHD file structure is basically BDMV.

I have an AVCHD camcorder, so this is good. So it sound like you can burn AVCHD video to DVDs and you just need player that supports that.

I have used Nero 8 to burn transport stream files onto a DVD DL disc into AVCHD and played it on my PS3.

If you don't need menu options, then that would be the way to go.

If you do need menu options, then you will have to go with some of the other software listed above!

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.

I'm very close to getting HDDVD header on a DVD disc to work. I have my local HD recordings of Heroes, CSI saved on a DVD+R but with HDDVD header. When I insert the DVD+R with Heroes I saved, my A2 shows HDDVD on the lcd panel. However, the audio sometimes stutters. I'm getting real close. Maybe, if I change a burner software like Nero, it would work. I'm just using Deepburn to burn it and maybe that's the problem.

Anyways, I wasn't aware that it cannot be done on blu-ray.

I'm very close to getting HDDVD header on a DVD disc to work. I have my local HD recordings of Heroes, CSI saved on a DVD+R but with HDDVD header. When I insert the DVD+R with Heroes I saved, my A2 shows HDDVD on the lcd panel. However, the audio sometimes stutters. I'm getting real close. Maybe, if I change a burner software like Nero, it would work. I'm just using Deepburn to burn it and maybe that's the problem.

You do know there's a huge thread that describes exactly how to author HD-DVD content on a DVD-R, right? It's a sticky at the top of the HD-DVD Software Forum.

Chris

I have an AVCHD camcorder, so this is good. So it sound like you can burn AVCHD video to DVDs and you just need player that supports that.

I have 3 AVCHD camcorders.

Sony's HDR-UX1 - this burns to small DVD/R/RW/DL of any combination. The disks can be inserted to a PS3 or panasonic player.

Hitachi's BDR-Z70a BD-RE/R - this burns to any small DVD or BD media as well. The disk also plays directly on a PS3 or panasonic player without changes. The small BD-RE is even more expensive than normal BD-RE (yes, they always fleece the early adopters). This camcorder is bulky, and the BD-RE after being written and erased about 12 times sems to have a glitch that caused recording to fail in the middle. I can't find small BD-RE in canada. Will find a few more when I visit akihabara again. But this is not my favorite camcorder.

Panasonic HDC-SD5 - this uses a SDHC but writes in AVCHD folder structure. It comes with software to take the SD AVCHD content and burn onto DVD/R, but I bypassed all that and used my own tools. This is my favorite because the 4GB/8GB/16GB SDHC can be inserted in the PS3 and played directly like a disk. You can also copy the video onto the PS3's HDD. I kept quite a few for demo purposes. Archival is via HDD, but I will have to move them to BD-RE at some point.

---

Of the three, I like the panasonic best. But SDHC is very expensive.

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.

As far as I know, you are completely incorrect (and I know what I am talking about, as opposed to you). Another reason why BOTH formats are quite consumer friendly and BOTH formats have their pros and cons. Oh, and Blu-ray is really the better format, so there.

I think you can only do this with HD-DVD. Sorry.

I think you can only do this with HD-DVD. Sorry.

I beg to differ. I have 35 BD-REs and 5 DVD/R disks that works on any player that supports AVCHD (Panasonic and PS3 were tested). Last year, I authored a 1GB BDMV on DVD-R that plays on panasonic and sony player and made the ISO available for people to download. I was hoping for people to tell me if it plays on their player.

From what I can tell, at least 5 people downloaded the ISO file that can be burnt onto any 8X speed DVD/R.

The disk was made from the 1080P Elephant Dreams VC-1 Optimal encode that microsoft was kind enough to distribute freely on their website. That video peaks at close to 50Mbps for 12 seconds.

I think you can only do this with HD-DVD. Sorry.

Did you actually read any of the thread at all? It has already been stated by numerous posters that BOTH formats have this ability.

Yes, you CAN.

Here is couple thread for you to chew on:

My Blu-Ray Movie Burning Experiences...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=815296

TsRemux: Transport Stream De/Re-muxer
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=125447


I can author my MPEG-2 HDV or MPEG-4 AVCHD home videos on DVD 5/9 using TSRemux and play them on PS3.

Thank you for providing this cool application, fast and easy, most of the other softwares such as Pinnacle studio11, Ulead movie factory6, Roxio, Sony Vegas don't allow to burn to DVD-R's and the procedure takes hours because they render video, However using a DVD+RW PS3 couldn't read the video it detects it as AVCHD but gives an error after the black screen "The video cannot be played (8002994)" tryed DVD-R got 8002991 message, I even tried DVD+R DL got 8002994, I think the latest PS3 update added protection against authored DVD-R's.

I beg to differ. I have 35 BD-REs and 5 DVD/R disks that works on any player that supports AVCHD (Panasonic and PS3 were tested). Last year, I authored a 1GB BDMV on DVD-R that plays on panasonic and sony player and made the ISO available for people to download. I was hoping for people to tell me if it plays on their player.

From what I can tell, at least 5 people downloaded the ISO file that can be burnt onto any 8X speed DVD/R.

The disk was made from the 1080P Elephant Dreams VC-1 Optimal encode that microsoft was kind enough to distribute freely on their website. That video peaks at close to 50Mbps for 12 seconds.
Neo,

I downloaded it and burned it on 8x DVD+RW. Played perfectly on PS3.

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.

Yes you can. BTW ever heard of Nero? The famous burning software that comes with Blu-Ray authoring, have you heard of consumer level HD DVD authoring programs?

I beg to differ. I have 35 BD-REs and 5 DVD/R disks that works on any player that supports AVCHD (Panasonic and PS3 were tested). Last year, I authored a 1GB BDMV on DVD-R that plays on panasonic and sony player and made the ISO available for people to download. I was hoping for people to tell me if it plays on their player.

From what I can tell, at least 5 people downloaded the ISO file that can be burnt onto any 8X speed DVD/R.

The disk was made from the 1080P Elephant Dreams VC-1 Optimal encode that microsoft was kind enough to distribute freely on their website. That video peaks at close to 50Mbps for 12 seconds.

I've never ever seen anyone burn a Bluray authored disc on a regular DVD-R and have it play in a stand alone Bluray player.

If you can show me a link to "how to" i'd be happy to read up and say I'm wrong.

I know you can author HD DVDs on standard DVD-Rs very easily and they play in every single player ever created and to be created.. part of the standard spec... not just only on the PS3.

OK, I did some research and tesing last night, and here is what I found (please correct me if I am wrong)...

You can create AVCHD/DVD-R discs that work on the PS3 and the Panny BD players. With software like Ulead MF and VS you can even create nice menus.

You can not create Blu-ray discs with DVD-Rs. Blu-ray discs need the data to be .1 mm from the surface and DVD-Rs have that data .6 MM from the surface.

Because the direcotry and file structure seem to be very similar, people may be creating AVCHD discs and thinking they are BD. It is my understaning though that they will ONLY work on the PS3 or Panasonic players.

OK, I did some research and tesing last night, and here is what I found (please correct me if I am wrong)...

You can create AVCHD/DVD-R discs that work on the PS3 and the Panny BD players. With software like Ulead MF and VS you can even create nice menus.

You can not create Blu-ray discs with DVD-Rs. Blu-ray discs need the data to be .1 mm from the surface and DVD-Rs have that data .6 MM from the surface.

Because the direcotry and file structure seem to be very similar, people may be creating AVCHD discs and thinking they are BD. It is my understaning though that they will ONLY work on the PS3 or Panasonic players.

In practice, what are the differences between an AVCHD and Blu-ray disc? Why can't players other than the PS3 and Panasonic play an AVCHD disc?

In practice, what are the differences between an AVCHD and Blu-ray disc? Why can't players other than the PS3 and Panasonic play an AVCHD disc?

Excellent questions, and I hope someone can answer them. I am still learning all this stuff.

I beg to differ. I have 35 BD-REs and 5 DVD/R disks that works on any player that supports AVCHD (Panasonic and PS3 were tested). Last year, I authored a 1GB BDMV on DVD-R that plays on panasonic and sony player and made the ISO available for people to download. I was hoping for people to tell me if it plays on their player.

From what I can tell, at least 5 people downloaded the ISO file that can be burnt onto any 8X speed DVD/R.

The disk was made from the 1080P Elephant Dreams VC-1 Optimal encode that microsoft was kind enough to distribute freely on their website. That video peaks at close to 50Mbps for 12 seconds.

Is it still available for Download?
Thanks

In practice, what are the differences between an AVCHD and Blu-ray disc? Why can't players other than the PS3 and Panasonic play an AVCHD disc?

ilsiu,

Here is a good info about AVCHD on Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AVCHD
And I think that all BD players should be compliant with AVCHD.

ilsiu,

Here is a good info about AVCHD on Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AVCHD
And I think that all BD players should be compliant with AVCHD.

Does anyone know if you can play an AVCHD disc on a Samsung player?

Is it still available for Download?
Thanks

It already expired. I put it up on a filestorage service twice last year.

It takes a long time to upload, and also to download.

I was trying to find out if LG and samsung players could play the disks. I think at this point anything that says it plays AVCHD will work since that is essentially BDMV on recordable media.

If you look at the AVCHD folder structure on a SDHC or 8cm DVD/RW, there's a BDMV folder and the structure looks a lot like the BD, just that a rather pesky and troublesome folder is missing from the AVCHD disk. How titles and chapters are setup look pretty much identical between the two.

While in the long term camcorder content have too much fluff to leave unedited before presentation, avchd can be inserted directly into the bd players that support them and played directly, so just after you return home, you don't need to do a lot of editing and can still see the highdef footage you worked so hard to capture. That's a valuable convenience - no PC needed.

The key with avchd is that the elementary streams themselves do not have to be reencoded, meaning there is no reencoding quality loss. So if all I do is edit and splice the avchd files and then put them together again, the quality in principle (except perhaps at splice point) is identical to the original footage, which is important since I can avoid generation loss this way.

Alternately, HDV works too, but HDV at 25Mbps (MPEG2) will consume a lot of storage and AVCHD is typically at 12-14Mbps today, (should be ok unless you film rapid motion or water sprinklers a lot).

My two main complaint with AVCHD are (1) the bitrate is too low, which means that if I do take video of people splashing in a waterpark, there are artifacts. While small files is a convenience for DVD/R, down the road, I'd rather take the higher bitrate and have them do 25Mbps to match the HDV bandwidth, except with the higher quality that AVC can provide at the same bitrate. (2) Current camcorders are really using 540 line CCDs and all video is interlaced, true 1080P camcorders are priced at ridiculously high numbers it's beyond reach of the hobbyists.

Neo,

I downloaded it and burned it on 8x DVD+RW. Played perfectly on PS3.

Yup, works on my PS3 too, but I was hoping for samsung and LG feedback. It's standardized as an AVCHD logo - if the box has this logo, then it can play the BDMV structure on a DVD/R. Ulead apparently supports it too now.

I've never ever seen anyone burn a Bluray authored disc on a regular DVD-R and have it play in a stand alone Bluray player.

If you can show me a link to "how to" i'd be happy to read up and say I'm wrong.

I know you can author HD DVDs on standard DVD-Rs very easily and they play in every single player ever created and to be created.. part of the standard spec... not just only on the PS3.

I started with that, but I've basically moved on to BD-RE for most of my content. Curiously my HD-A1 and A2 never could take the Ulead generated content and play past the layer change without skipping to the next chapter. It might be the Ritek/Ridata disks I use, but there's not a lot of options when it comes to inkjet-printable DL blanks, so I'm stuck with Ridata, which I know doesn't work as HD DVD on HD-A1/A2 but works as BDMV/AVCHD on a PS3.

I was told a Blu-ray compressionist/author that you cannot burn a true Blu-ray disc to DVD-R at this time and expect it to work on all standalone Blu-ray players. This is very problematic for him because he can't burn DVD-R versions of his work progress as demos for his clients.

It sounds like people are burning discs that don't meet the official Blu-ray spec, but which work on specific players like the PS3 and Panasonic players. To me, that is not Blu-ray. That's sort of like burning an MP3 CD and expecting it to work on a CD player. Yes it DOES work on some CD players, but that is not part of the CD spec.

I was told a Blu-ray compressionist/author that you cannot burn a true Blu-ray disc to DVD-R at this time and expect it to work on all standalone Blu-ray players. This is very problematic for him because he can't burn DVD-R versions of his work progress as demos for his clients.


I'm in a somewhat similar situation, because what I'd like to do is produce inexpensive collections of movie trailers I can distribute to film buyers. That seems like the ideal scenario for a "mini HD-DVD" or Blu-Ray on DVD-r application, but right now compatible playback equipment isn't widespread enough to make it practical.

So I'm certainly following this discussion with interest, but it looks like the whole concept is not quite ready for prime-time.

I was told a Blu-ray compressionist/author that you cannot burn a true Blu-ray disc to DVD-R at this time and expect it to work on all standalone Blu-ray players. This is very problematic for him because he can't burn DVD-R versions of his work progress as demos for his clients.

It sounds like people are burning discs that don't meet the official Blu-ray spec, but which work on specific players like the PS3 and Panasonic players. To me, that is not Blu-ray. That's sort of like burning an MP3 CD and expecting it to work on a CD player. Yes it DOES work on some CD players, but that is not part of the CD spec.

That's why I'm hoping we see some announcements by mainstream authoring solution vendors in the coming months (Apple at Macworld this month and/or at NAB in April [along w/ other big hitters like Sonic, Ulead, Adobe and Roxio, etc.]). When those guys get behind it w/ robust, easy-to-use and 100% spec toolsets, we'll be sure that the reliability of playback will have crossed the speculative/experimental stage. I'm happy folks have made this their hobby...but I just don't have the time/money to burn (;) get it?). I'm waiting for a drag-and-drop, pop in a disc and go solution that just works. But, believe me, I'm learning a lot from this discussion--so thanks and keep it coming.

I was told a Blu-ray compressionist/author that you cannot burn a true Blu-ray disc to DVD-R at this time and expect it to work on all standalone Blu-ray players. This is very problematic for him because he can't burn DVD-R versions of his work progress as demos for his clients.

It sounds like people are burning discs that don't meet the official Blu-ray spec, but which work on specific players like the PS3 and Panasonic players. To me, that is not Blu-ray. That's sort of like burning an MP3 CD and expecting it to work on a CD player. Yes it DOES work on some CD players, but that is not part of the CD spec.

It's known as AVCHD. If it has the AVCHD logo on the player, then it is compliant. AVCHD for all intents and purposes is BDMV, just that it can be on a DVD/R.

It is true though that due to the large number of different manufacturers of BD players, the firmware updates are not always complete immediately. This is why voting with our dollars will count. If player manufacturers know what features sell players (eg : streaming DTHD/DTSHD directly from the disk to HDMI, AVCHD, SDHC and photo slideshows), then they have to include them into firmware upgrades.

Because Sony and Panasonic have released fw upgrades to their players to support AVCHD, there is no BDA legal or technical barrier for the other box makers not to do so. The thing is BDMV on red laser anyway. AND BD9 is part of the spec too.

My video infos are:

File Name: War Of The Worlds.ts
File Size: 114229176 ( 0.11 GB )
Program Duration: 00:00:59.28
File Type: TS Stream
Encoding: MPEG 2
Video stream Id: 17 (x11)
Encoding Dimensions: 1920 x 1080
Display Size: 1920 x 1080
Aspect Ratio: 16/9
Frame Rate: 29.97 FPS
Bit Rate: 18.000 Mbps
VBV_Buffer: 976 KB
Profile: Main/High
Progressive: Prog or Int
Chroma: 4:2:0
Audio Format: 5.1
Audio Stream Id: AC3: 20 (x14)
Audio Bit Rate: 384 Kbps
Audio Sampling Rate: 48000 Hz

I thought thats what TSremux was made for. I already tried Ulead it won't let me record to DVD-R, I can create an image on my hard drive but excedes the DVD-R DL capacity, as of the thread that you posted a link for it's a 31 pages I can't go thru all that I just read the first two pages they are talking about creating a real blue-ray disc which is out of my budget.

It's known as AVCHD. If it has the AVCHD logo on the player, then it is compliant. AVCHD for all intents and purposes is BDMV, just that it can be on a DVD/R.

It is true though that due to the large number of different manufacturers of BD players, the firmware updates are not always complete immediately. This is why voting with our dollars will count. If player manufacturers know what features sell players (eg : streaming DTHD/DTSHD directly from the disk to HDMI, AVCHD, SDHC and photo slideshows), then they have to include them into firmware upgrades.

Because Sony and Panasonic have released fw upgrades to their players to support AVCHD, there is no BDA legal or technical barrier for the other box makers not to do so. The thing is BDMV on red laser anyway. AND BD9 is part of the spec too.
AVCHD alone is not part of the Blu-ray spec AFAIK, which is my point.

Slapping an AVCHD logo on a Blu-ray player is like slapping an MP3 logo on a CD player or a DivX logo on a DVD player.

It's known as AVCHD. If it has the AVCHD logo on the player, then it is compliant. AVCHD for all intents and purposes is BDMV, just that it can be on a DVD/R.

It is true though that due to the large number of different manufacturers of BD players, the firmware updates are not always complete immediately. This is why voting with our dollars will count. If player manufacturers know what features sell players (eg : streaming DTHD/DTSHD directly from the disk to HDMI, AVCHD, SDHC and photo slideshows), then they have to include them into firmware upgrades.

Because Sony and Panasonic have released fw upgrades to their players to support AVCHD, there is no BDA legal or technical barrier for the other box makers not to do so. The thing is BDMV on red laser anyway. AND BD9 is part of the spec too.

Since you have a vast knowledge in AVCHD, let me use the opporunity and ask few questions :

1)What's the maximum bitrate for Dolby Digital in AVCHD?
2)Does AVCHD support PCM 5.1/7.1 for soundtrack?
3) The wiki article says
. The compressed audio and video data are encapsulated in an MPEG-2 Transport stream called BDAV
If so, how BDAV becomes BDMV?

4) Does the spec for AVCHD allow for subtitles?

Thanks in advance.

AVCHD alone is not part of the Blu-ray spec AFAIK, which is my point.

Slapping an AVCHD logo on a Blu-ray player is like slapping an MP3 logo on a CD player or a DivX logo on a DVD player.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AVCHD

This stream format and most of the structure of AVCHD are derived from the Blu-ray Disc BDMV format.

This stream format and most of the structure of AVCHD are derived from the Blu-ray Disc BDMV format.
You can burn PCM audio files to a CD too and that won't work in existing players. You can burn MPEG2 files to DVD and that won't work in existing players.

The point is to create PROPER SPEC discs so they work in all Blu-ray players.

BTW, my DVD player (which is NOT a DVD recorder) can play DVD-VR. I would never recommend using this format to make DVDs to give to friends or clients though.

AVCHD and BDMV are both subsets of HDMV. Any Blu-ray player will support both. Until we see otherwise then it is just useless speculation.

And despite its name you can use MPEG2 as well with a tool like TSRemux.

Panasonic players and the PS3 are kind of unique. They read jpegs, mp3s and other non-blu-ray formats.

Until someone with another player says so, I think it would be better to say we don't know if it will work... and to say it will on ANY Blu-ray player is just "useless speculation".

BD-9 was added at the last minute to the Blu-ray standard. I assume it is optional since some players do not support it (most notably the PS3). I don't think Sony was too keen on the idea. They probably want to encourage everyone to buy Blu-ray burners. Business is business I guess.

But if you still want to use regular DVDs then you have AVCHD. It works in PS3 and in every blu-ray player as far as I know.

AVCHD and BDMV are both subsets of HDMV. Any Blu-ray player will support both. Until we see otherwise then it is just useless speculation.

And despite its name you can use MPEG2 as well with a tool like TSRemux.

In light of that lack of "keeness" that I think all us know Hollywood likely has for high def recording on standard dvd, what's the liklelyhood that with no more format war we will see even less support for these out-of-spec solutions on blu-ray?

PS3 is updated quite regularly after all and I don't think it's far fetched to imagine future updates enforcing the spec more, not less.

By contrast hd dvd officially supports high def recording on hd dvd9. By all accounts the entire process is easier and more reliable which I maintain is another good reason to keep an hd dvd player.

PS3 is updated quite regularly after all and I don't think it's far fetched to imagine future updates enforcing the spec more, not less.
I think it's unlikely that they'll take away this feature.

However, that's not the point. The point is that the not all players are the PS3 (or Panasonic, or whatever).

The point is that the spec exists, and if this doesn't meet that spec, then it's pointless for many people... like that disc author I was talking about, trying to make demos for his clients.

A similar situation for example would be wedding videographers making HD movies for their newlywed clients. A non-spec video just doesn't cut it.

The point is stop being cheap and wanting to stick to DVDs. Anyone who is serious about HD will buy a Blu-ray burner and burn REAL blu-rays where you can get more than 30 minutes of video on a disc. These will work in every player. I certainly would not give my business to any wedding photographer who can't afford a $300 blu-ray burner at this point.

This is no different than people who wanted to burn VCD onto regular CDs and watch them in a DVD player. And not all DVD players supported VCDs. Mine certainly didn't. But how many people are there that still want to make VCDs? None. And thats how many people there will be in 2 years who still want to make BD-9. Media prices will continue to drop.

Sorry I just had to get that off my chest.

And it still doesn't change the fact that AVCHD works in all Blu-ray players. If you have some evidence to the contrary please provide it.

BD25 blanks are $10-20 a piece, even in volume.

On the other hand blank DVD is down to like .25 per.

You can easily show off your typical 20 minute home movie on a 4.5 or 9GB regular DVD.

What exactly is the advantage of burning to BD25 with a PC BD burner other than the extra capacity? I don't see how it's "being cheap" when you are talking about hundreds of dollars for a BD burner not to mention the crazy media costs. Lets hope you don't burn a coaster since a single blank is what it costs to eat lunch at a sit down restaurant.

Guys back to the subject of the thread that I've started, how to make a blue-ray or AVCHD or whatever you wonna call it on a regular DVD-/+R or DL, anyway I tried TSRemux from the 1 min video file bellow burned it on DVD+R DL but my PS3 was unable to read it, error message "The video cannot be played (8002994)" I have already the latest PS3 firmware:

File Name: War Of The Worlds.ts
File Size: 114229176 ( 0.11 GB )
Program Duration: 00:00:59.28
File Type: TS Stream
Encoding: MPEG 2
Video stream Id: 17 (x11)
Encoding Dimensions: 1920 x 1080
Display Size: 1920 x 1080
Aspect Ratio: 16/9
Frame Rate: 29.97 FPS
Bit Rate: 18.000 Mbps
VBV_Buffer: 976 KB
Profile: Main/High
Progressive: Prog or Int
Chroma: 4:2:0
Audio Format: 5.1
Audio Stream Id: AC3: 20 (x14)
Audio Bit Rate: 384 Kbps
Audio Sampling Rate: 48000 Hz

ok I think this thread should be closed now, thanks

BD media is $8 now. And you don't have to buy in volume. Just a year ago it was $20. Its coming down a lot faster than CD and DVD ever did. I still remember when DVDs were $50.

And you can avoid coasters by testing on rewritable media. They only cost about $12. And you only need one.
It is foolish to spend $8 per disc, when you can spend 50 cents.

And it still doesn't change the fact that AVCHD works in all Blu-ray players. If you have some evidence to the contrary please provide it.

I have read through several player reviews and ONLY the Panasonic ones mention that the they can also play AVCHD. They say that is an extra feature on the Panasonic.

Also, I though I read in the Blu-ray forums that a few players like the S300 will NOT play BD-RE discs. I looked at the specs for it and the S300 does not have BD-REs listed while several other Blu players do.

It is foolish to spend $8 per disc, when you can spend 50 cents.

For Christmas I made 8 HD discs for family members. My wife found a mispelling after I burned them, so I had to burn them again. I also used about 8 more discs for tests.

I can't imagine paying $200 - $400 every time just to make a few discs for my family and friends. Buying USB flash drives would be a lot cheaper!

CC had a deal where I bought 50 DVD-Rs for $12 (24 cents each). I still have almost half left.

Since you have a vast knowledge in AVCHD, let me use the opporunity and ask few questions :

1)What's the maximum bitrate for Dolby Digital in AVCHD?
2)Does AVCHD support PCM 5.1/7.1 for soundtrack?
3) The wiki article says

If so, how BDAV becomes BDMV?

4) Does the spec for AVCHD allow for subtitles?

Thanks in advance.

From what little I saw AVCHD supports everything in BDMV. The disk is just flagged as AVCHD, o/w it is identical to a BDMV w/o a pesky folder. Hypothetically, one can create a AVCHD contraining mpeg2, avc or vc-1 m2ts (m2ts is just transport stream with some extra rules) files. The DD audio is at most 640kbps.... Lights must be flashing now, but yes this is a problem for the rum & eyepatch crowd. Anyway...

DD+/EAC3 audio is a problem for direct transcription onto BD. The option there is to convert the DD+ to PCM (or perhaps DD/DTS). There is a tool that does this. IMO, it's much better to just buy the BD version if available instead of taking HD DVD main feature and converting them to a BD-RE even though it can be done, the costs of the blanks makes it uneconomical, and there is no fancy menus. I've never tried PCM here as I'm not an audio fanatic, but in principle there is no reason why it won't work given it's the same m2ts files that can be played on either, unless the player deliberately disallows it.

I think that AVCHD is primarily done for the home camcorder crowd and that if it is abused by the wrong people for the wrong purposes, we might get stuck with heavier requirements and that dreaded folder might come back in, and that would make life difficult for us HD camcorder people.

BDAV was an MPEG2 only format from what I recall, it might have been used in the first BD recorders in japan, it is also different from BDMV, it's like there for legacy reasons as new Panasonic and Sony BD recorders are BDMV now. AND, these recorders have that dreaded folder on BD-RE !!!! !!!! making life difficult for us.

As the hacked AVCHD today is just BDMV in every known way (except for that flag), I'm not sure why subtitles would not work. I don't know how to do this!

This is all hypothetical. Other than main audio and main video from camcorders, in principle, it's a legal gray area to mess with this stuff if you don't own the content, and after DMCA, for americans, even if you own the disk legally, there's apparently stuff you can't do with it.

There's other places that talk about this stuff.

---
Sorry benes, I didn't read your notes before replying. I actually dabble in these things and have no interest in the rum and eye patch side of it. I needed to get a lot of video over to BD-RE/BD-R and that's why I looked into it. Even though the urge is great to do certain things to get around the pesky format war here, I resisted and resisted and .... ....

This thread is the wrong place for this so I won't reply. Perhaps it can be moved over?

OK this is my understanding. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

1) BDMV requires AACS, basically making it a non-starter for consumers.
2) BDAV does not require AACS.
3) BDAV is not supported by all Blu-ray standalones.
4) BDAV does not support advanced menuing. This requires BDMV.

So, effectively, it is impossible to create a full-spec Blu-ray disc at home which will work in all Blu-ray players.
However, even if all the players you deal with support BDAV, it is still a problem because of the menu limitations.

Wrong. BDMV only requires AACS when it is on a *PRESSED* BD-ROM that is replicated at a factory. It is NOT required for BDMV on a home burned BD-R/E. This is the default format for Ulead which is probably the best authoring solution right now short of Scenarist. This is the format I burn all of my BD-RE with. They will work in any player*.
I don't think this is correct.

BDMV without AACS is not supported as a Blu-ray format.
You can burn it, but it won't work on some players.
Proper spec Blu-ray players require AACS for BDMV to work.*

* Unless you have AACS-approved media.

This is according to paidgeek (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11237686#post11237686).

Blu-ray players were never supposed to support BDMV authored content using ordinary data type BD-R or BD-RE media. An exemption was made for a number of months so that available blank discs could be used for testing and other promotional activities; this exemption expired recently.

Consumers will be able to record their own authored movies using recordable media designed for this purpose (as specified by AACS). This media is designed to stop copies of copies of copyrighted material, something we can't prevent right now with the current media and drives.

However, AFAIK, no such AACS-approved media exists.

Correct. But AVCHD also supports menus.
OK but AVCHD is not supported by all players either.

Tivo Community Forums has information on burning HD DVD and Blu Ray readable DVD discs for HD content. It is Tivo oriented but the Video Redo part up to the finished product should be the same. I think .tivo files are just MPEG2 with a wrapper. AVCHD is supported by Studio 11 Plus and Ultimate not by Basic.

My two main complaint with AVCHD are ...(2) Current camcorders are really using 540 line CCDs and all video is interlaced, true 1080P camcorders are priced at ridiculously high numbers it's beyond reach of the hobbyists.

That's not correct. Actually, very few are using CCD's - they're using CMOS sensors instead @ 1440x1080. And although they're recording in 60i, you can still get 1080p24, out of the Canons at least, via Cineform's Neo HDV by removing pulldown, rendering to an intermediate, and dumping that on a 24p timeline in Vegas. I'm doing it right now with my HG10. This has been documented all over the 'Net. The non-24p cameras are effectively shooting 1080@ 30 frames/sec. after de-interlacing.

You have not even done any blu-ray authoring so I don't know why you are trying to pass yourself off as some kind of expert.
I'm not trying to pass myself off as an expert because I'm not. I'm flattered you would even think that. :p

I've been doing this for almost 2 years now before the format was even launched. I have a little basis for my knowledge. And I was actually involved in that discussion with paidgeek and talkstr8t which is why I know that he later corrected his response in this post here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11335652#post11335652

First of all, for those who have been waiting for my follow-up post on this topic, thanks for your patience...

After doing some research, here is what I have been able to clarify.

Blu-ray players first manufactured after Spring of this year are required to support BD-RE v3.0 media (AACS enabled) for playback of recordings where copyright has been asserted (e.g. digital broadcast, managed copy from a Blu-ray movie and similar).
These same players may playback authored content from other sources (e.g. home movies) where copyright is not asserted from either BD-RE V3.0 or v2.1 (currently available) media.

An exception was made for players produced before Spring this year such that they may playback authored BD movie content from BD-RE V2.1 media, even though they may not support V3.0 media. The PS3 is already fully compliant with the latest requirements. Other players may or may not be depending on current firmware revisions.

The simple summary is that a consumer can author their own content as they wish using currently available media and play it back on any player that was released prior to Spring 07' as well as any player released since that time, provided that the player can support BD-RE V3.0 media. If a newer player cannot yet support that media type, then BD-RE 2.1 support can be enabled as soon as firmware allows the player to do so.

The specifications are designed not to inconvenience any customer who wants to author content they own.

Incidentally all of my BD-RE are v2.1 and I've tested them in multiple players.
Good to know.

However, which players have you tested? According to that post, some players may not support v2.1 discs with such content (but may be updated later).

It's still a disappointment though that v3.0 media is required for other content, but I can understand their stance on this.

And finally, how does this apply to DVD-R? Same limitations, or more limitations? My understanding it that it is more of a limitation.

EDIT:

I see you have already answered this. BD-9 doesn't work on many existing players. It will be interesting to see if all players eventually get this feature, cuz not to have it very strange IMO.

You keep saying this without anything to back it up. BDMV and AVCHD are *exactly* the same thing. The only difference is that AVCHD is ostensibly limited to 1440x1080 AVC. But TSRemux allows you to get around this limitation.
So, you're saying they're not exactly the same thing then.

-----

So, are we correct to say that it is currently impossible to burn Blu-ray onto DVD-R and expect it to work on all Blu-ray players? Judging by my reread of this thread, that still seems to be the case.

AFAIK, some Samsung BD players didn't support AVCHD playback. I don't know if that's changed recently or not.

While not a true BD disc, I can burn a AVC-HD disc and my Pio 95HD BD player recognizes it as a AVC-HD disc and plays it.
-Evangelo2


Evangelo2, is there an easu dumb-arse way to transver my HDV recording to BD9 (or any HD optical format, be it BD9, AVCHD, or whatever else) without spending crazy time on a PC?

I'm thinking about outputting the HDV data via firewire to the PC, and use a SINGLE program to convert the HDV file and burn it to DVD or even BD-R 25 Gb to a BD playable format disc.

The most I'll do is add chapter mark. No editing, no menu, nothing else is necessary.

BDMV and AVCHD are *exactly* the same thing. The only difference is that AVCHD is ostensibly limited to 1440x1080 AVC. But TSRemux allows you to get around this limitation.

As it stands today, this is essentially true even though the spec is at 1920x1080, which is one of the big advantages AVC has over HDV. I'm sure this year, the market will produce a fair number of full 1920x1080 AVCHD consumer cam's. It's somewhat ironic that it will be the mass adoption of AVCHD "handycam's" that seals the deal for AVC (average consumer) - just a bit backwards. Panny & Sony were pretty smart here, although things were a bit rushed to market IMO.


^^^^David, Nero might work for you. I haven't personally tried it since my workflow is a bit different; but I think that might be a place to start. You might have to pick up a "lite" version of an NLE to edit HDV (like Vegas Movie Studio Plat).

Use AVCHD for DVD-R and it will work on everything.AFAIK, some Samsung BD players didn't support AVCHD playback. I don't know if that's changed recently or not.
OK, this is what I came up with after some searching. FWIW, this is Sony's list (http://www.sony.com.vn/subtype/checkcompatibility/asset/224973?site=hp_en_VN_i) of compatible Blu-ray players for finalized AVCHD DVD-Rs from Sony AVCHD camcorders:

http://www.eugbanana.com/files/Movies/Blu-ray/HandyCamAVCHDCompatibility.png

Both Panasonic and Sony Blu-ray players (including the PS3) are listed as compatible (which isn't surprising since it was mainly Panasonic and Sony who developed the AVCHD format), but Samsung, LG, and Philips players are not listed as compatible. (Note, however, that the list is from last summer.)

:( both my BD players are Samsung.

Wrong. BDMV only requires AACS when it is on a *PRESSED* BD-ROM that is replicated at a factory. It is NOT required for BDMV on a home burned BD-R/E. This is the default format for Ulead which is probably the best authoring solution right now short of Scenarist. This is the format I burn all of my BD-RE with. They will work in any player*.

*The only thing to keep in mind is that some players do not support burned media at all due to hardware or firmware limitations. Not unlike early dvd players.

The Sony S300 supports some burned media but not BD-REs. I think there are a number of players that do not support BD-REs.
http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&XID=O:bdp%2ds300:dg_pidf&kw=bdp%2Ds300&lp=8198552921665088000&productId=8198552921665088000
It supports ONLY, DVD+R/+RW, DVD-R/-RW4

Good find. We had to go to Vietnam just to get this info. :D

It could be that those players just don't support DVD-R media at all. Someone should test that.


At least the Sammy 1000, 1200 and 1400 I know for sure WILL play DVD-R and DVD+R

The Sony S300 supports some burned media but not BD-REs. I think there are a number of players that do not support BD-REs.
http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&XID=O:bdp%2ds300:dg_pidf&kw=bdp%2Ds300&lp=8198552921665088000&productId=8198552921665088000
It supports ONLY, DVD+R/+RW, DVD-R/-RW4
Sony updated firmware and S300 plays BDMV on BD-RE.

Sony updated firmware and S300 plays BDMV on BD-RE.

Weird ony the S1 on their web site says "Yes, Requires firmware higher than ver.1.55". The S300 just says "No".

They need to update their site.

I am totally new to this subject.

I use PVRExplorer Pro to extract HD programs directly off the hard drive of my Dish Network ViP 622. They are saved as MPEG2 files and I edit them (remove commercials, etc) with Video Redo plus (ver 2.5.6 512 June 15 2007) and copy the file directly to a DVD+R with my DVD burner. Video Redo reports them as 1080X1440.

Is there a Blu-Ray or HD-DVD player that will play these DVD's as they are? I can play them on any PC with either Windows Media player or Intervideo Win-DVD but I'd like to have a stand-alone HD player with component and/or HDMI output that would play them also.

If not, what can I do to the files to make them readable on Bluy-Ray or HD-DVD?

There is a BD9 spec, but I'm not sure if it's mandatory that all players can do it. BD9 would be similar to how HD DVD does it, where a lower bitrate HD signal can be played with red laser from regular DVD9 media.BD-9 is a mandatory feature of Blu-ray, and all players should support it. Note that BD-9 only applies to pressed discs, not DVD-R or -RW.

BD-9 was added at the last minute to the Blu-ray standard. I assume it is optional since some players do not support it (most notably the PS3).The PS3 should support it, but I've never seen an actual BD-9 disc with which to test it. Do you know otherwise?

Well obviously we at home are making DVD-R/W and not pressed discs. That is the topic of this thread. And unfortunately PS3 will not recognize these as Blu-ray format discs. I believe it used to work in an older firmware but they removed it. :(I agree it's not possible to burn DVD-R/RW other than as AVCHD (or some derivative thereof). BD-9 is targeted at a different market, however (short form commercial content, independent movies, etc.).

Anyone know how Roxio Toast 9 Titanium is dealing with Blu-ray on DVD?

Toast 9 Titanium: http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/toast/titanium/overview.html

Toast's HD/BD plugin: http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/toast/plugin/overview.html

If you're a TiVo HD or Eye TV owner you know that it's a great way to record and watch high-def TV. With Toast 9 and the HD/BD plug-in you can archive all the high-def shows you want by burning them to Blu-ray or standard DVD discs for playback on any Blu-ray compatible set top box.

Current camcorders are really using 540 line CCDs and all video is interlaced, true 1080P camcorders are priced at ridiculously high numbers it's beyond reach of the hobbyists.

My $650 Canon HV20 shoots 1080/24p with a 1920x1080 CMOS censor. It is recorded in a 1080/60i stream with a pulldown applied. Once you remove the pulldown it is a true 1080/24p video.

BD-9 is a mandatory feature of Blu-ray, and all players should support it. Note that BD-9 only applies to pressed discs, not DVD-R or -RW.

I agree it's not possible to burn DVD-R/RW other than as AVCHD (or some derivative thereof). BD-9 is targeted at a different market, however (short form commercial content, independent movies, etc.).
I find the statements in bold to be truly disappointing. BD-formatted DVD + or - DL discs (in any of the standard three video codecs) most certainly should be part of the Blu-ray spec. If they are not, and particularly if they are not intentionally, then the second poster in this topic was partially correct. With HD DVD, such discs are easily creatable, except maybe for the "any of the three video codecs" part, and that limitation is most likely due to available software, not the format. I own a Samsung Blu-ray player, so the home-recording options are important to me.

I am totally new to this subject.

I use PVRExplorer Pro to extract HD programs directly off the hard drive of my Dish Network ViP 622. They are saved as MPEG2 files and I edit them (remove commercials, etc) with Video Redo plus (ver 2.5.6 512 June 15 2007) and copy the file directly to a DVD+R with my DVD burner. Video Redo reports them as 1080X1440.

Is there a Blu-Ray or HD-DVD player that will play these DVD's as they are? I can play them on any PC with either Windows Media player or Intervideo Win-DVD but I'd like to have a stand-alone HD player with component and/or HDMI output that would play them also.

If not, what can I do to the files to make them readable on Bluy-Ray or HD-DVD?

Yes, if you convert your mpeg2 to program stream format, you should be able to burn it on DVD-R as HDDVD. You can use Movie Factory to author the file and prep the HVDVD_TS directory needed by Nero.

Current camcorders are really using 540 line CCDs and all video is interlaced, true 1080P camcorders are priced at ridiculously high numbers it's beyond reach of the hobbyists.

Thats not so bad as it sounds.

Since CCDs are analouge devices they behave a little different from devices like cmos.

There is a tech called pixelshift that extract extra data from the spatial offset of the 3ccd system.

So in best case scenario you can extract 1,5x extra resolution from the scan of the cdds.

So if you use 16:9 shaped progressive CCDs of 960*540 (60P) and utilise this tech you could in theory get as much as 1440*810 in luma. So while this isnt 1080 lines. You should remember that interlace recordings cant give you 1080 lines because of the interlace flicker that would occur.

So if you have a storage format of 1440*1080 (as is supported by AVCHD) and record in 60i you would have about 1296*756 as the highest practical resolution.

So in theory a camcorder scan system that gives 1440*810 60P and record it on a 1440*1080 60i stream would do alright.

But how each camcorder works in real life conditions is another question.


The handheld camera they used in Cloverfield also only has 3ccds of 960*540.

Thats not so bad as it sounds.

Since CCDs are analouge devices they behave a little different from devices like cmos.

There is a tech called pixelshift that extract extra data from the spatial offset of the 3ccd system.

So in best case scenario you can extract 1,5x extra resolution from the scan of the cdds.

So if you use 16:9 shaped progressive CCDs of 960*540 (60P) and utilise this tech you could in theory get as much as 1440*810 in luma. So while this isnt 1080 lines. You should remember that interlace recordings cant give you 1080 lines because of the interlace flicker that would occur.

So if you have a storage format of 1440*1080 (as is supported by AVCHD) and record in 60i you would have about 1296*756 as the highest practical resolution.

So in theory a camcorder scan system that gives 1440*810 60P and record it on a 1440*1080 60i stream would do alright.

But how each camcorder works in real life conditions is another question.


The handheld camera they used in Cloverfield also only has 3ccds of 960*540.

What about cmos? I have 1440*1080 60i cmos (3MP) camcorder and after I purchased it, several people told me that cmos should look better...of course they had no idea why.:D

What about cmos? I have 1440*1080 60i cmos (3MP) camcorder and after I purchased it, several people told me that cmos should look better...of course they had no idea why.:D

Well the sensor is just one part of a chain of devices.

But an advantage of CMOS is that it gets an individual pixel readout and get a better performance from a single CCD device. Its easier for the in camera processing to interpolate the different pixeldata from a bayer pattern as an example.

But on the other hand, CMOS isnt as lightsensitive as CCD wich is very crucial for homecamcorders.

It also has issues with rolling shutters instead of global shutters. This can make strobing lights such as lightning harder to film.

But as I wrote, the CMOS stongest advantage is that it can with one chip rival 3 CCDs. And that makes cameras cheaper and smaller.

So a camera like RED uses one chip and an even more expensive camera like the Sony F950 uses 3CCD.

Anyone know how Roxio Toast 9 Titanium is dealing with Blu-ray on DVD?

Toast 9 Titanium: http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/toast/titanium/overview.html

Toast's HD/BD plugin: http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/toast/plugin/overview.html

If you're a TiVo HD or Eye TV owner you know that it's a great way to record and watch high-def TV. With Toast 9 and the HD/BD plug-in you can archive all the high-def shows you want by burning them to Blu-ray or standard DVD discs for playback on any Blu-ray compatible set top box.

I bought the new Toast and while I haven't done BD, I'm not optimistic based on my HD DVD results.

So far, only MPEG2 encoding works and the results are not pretty.

You can learn more from on-going discussions on the Roxio support forums HERE. (http://forums.support.roxio.com/index.php?showforum=175)

Well the sensor is just one part of a chain of devices.

But an advantage of CMOS is that it gets an individual pixel readout and get a better performance from a single CCD device. Its easier for the in camera processing to interpolate the different pixeldata from a bayer pattern as an example.

But on the other hand, CMOS isnt as lightsensitive as CCD wich is very crucial for homecamcorders.

It also has issues with rolling shutters instead of global shutters. This can make strobing lights such as lightning harder to film.

But as I wrote, the CMOS stongest advantage is that it can with one chip rival 3 CCDs. And that makes cameras cheaper and smaller.

So a camera like RED uses one chip and an even more expensive camera like the Sony F950 uses 3CCD.

Thanks for you great response! At the time I went with the cmos over the 3 ccd because the cmos sensor was 1/3 of an inch and the 3ccds were only 1/6. That seems to help when filming indoors. I had no clue the about the difference between the 2.

I have a lot of HD movies that I've recorded from Dish Network in HD MPEG2 TS using my Dish 6000 with R5000-HD mod, was wondering if I can make Blue-Ray format on regular DVD-R DL even if it takes 2 or 3 discs as long as I keep the high quality of the video and AC-3 audio so I will be able to play them on my playstation 3, I know I can play them as Data Disc if converted them to MPEG2 PS using videoredo, But I just want to go for this option for fun purposes, I have roxio 9 it does author in blue ray but it won't let you save disc image it copy stright to blu-ray disc.

Have you tried TsRemux? Might give it a try and remember to burn using UDF 2.5 and keep the bitrate < 15mbps (this might be the deal breaker if Dish uses higher rates because you'll need to re-encode)

As far as I know, you can't do that with blu-ray. Another reason why HD DVD is more consumer friendly and the better format.

hd dvd's passed on! This format is no more! It has ceased to be! hddvd's expired and gone to meet its maker! hddvd's a stiff! Bereft of life, it rests in peace! If you hadn't nailed im to the perch it'd be pushing up the daisies! Its metabolic processes are now history! its off the twig! kicked the bucket, shuffled off its mortal coil, run down the curtain and joined the bleedin' choir invisibile! HD DVD IS AN EX-FORMAT!!

hd dvd's passed on! This format is no more! It has ceased to be! hddvd's expired and gone to meet its maker! hddvd's a stiff! Bereft of life, it rests in peace! If you hadn't nailed im to the perch it'd be pushing up the daisies! Its metabolic processes are now history! its off the twig! kicked the bucket, shuffled off its mortal coil, run down the curtain and joined the bleedin' choir invisibile! HD DVD IS AN EX-FORMAT!!

Chill!
Take it easy bud. It aint warzone!

hd dvd's passed on! This format is no more! It has ceased to be! hddvd's expired and gone to meet its maker!

The format has... yes. And they will no longer make the machines either, but regardless to that, there are still something like a million machines out there and creating HD DVD's is still very much alive so calm down a little.

The format has... yes. And they will no longer make the machines either, but regardless to that, there are still something like a million machines out there and creating HD DVD's is still very much alive so calm down a little.

Exactly, I'm hoping something as easy as creating an HD DVD on DVD-R will come out soon for Blu-ray that will play on all machines and not just a select few (I.e. PS3).

Following this thread, I have yet to see that.

Exactly, I'm hoping something as easy as creating an HD DVD on DVD-R will come out soon for Blu-ray that will play on all machines and not just a select few (I.e. PS3).

Following this thread, I have yet to see that.

FYI, Circuit City has 50-pack HP 16X DVD+R and DVD-R media on sale for $9 with no rebates (18 cents a peice!). I bought some there a while back for $11 and use them to make HD DVDs. I also make some AVCHDs, but they do not work on all Blu-ray players. Also, I can actuall play video files from the HD DVD/DVD-R discs on a PS3 because they are MPEG2.

The best place to go is Doom9 forum. There`s so much than can be done with AVCHD videos (although not compatible with all players); A LOT.
Ive been making AVCHD discs of my mkv files and they all play perfectly with Dolby, DTS or PCM tracks.

The best place to go is Doom9 forum. There`s so much than can be done with AVCHD videos (although not compatible with all players); A LOT.
Ive been making AVCHD discs of my mkv files and they all play perfectly with Dolby, DTS or PCM tracks.

What do you use to convert .mkv files to AVCHD?
Is it easy?

What do you use to convert .mkv files to AVCHD?
Is it easy?

It's not easy; but doable.
Here's how it goes :

1)Extract the streams from mkv and make them separate using MKV Extract.

2)Choose the streams you want.

3)Use H264info to make x264 streams AVCHD compatible (not re-encoding; it only changes flags and metadata on the stream). MPEG2 streams don't need any fixing and you barely find any VC1 streams. use 4.1 setting for the level

4)Use TsMuxer to mux the fixed x264track with the audio tracks you want (could be multiple audio tracks) and make a TS file

5)Now you can TSRemux to either make a BMDV folder and burn that folder by nero using UDF 2.5 setting

I watched many stuff (including HD TV shows) this way. You can also use Nero to play around with AVCHD files and add menus and such.
Doom9 is an amazing place. They help you as much as they can and you can find lots and lots of information over there.

It's not easy; but doable.
Here's how it goes :

1)Extract the streams from mkv and make them separate using MKV Extract.

2)Choose the streams you want.

3)Use H264info to make x264 streams AVCHD compatible (not re-encoding; it only changes flags and metadata on the stream). MPEG2 streams don't need any fixing and you barely find any VC1 streams. use 4.1 setting for the level

4)Use TsMuxer to mux the fixed x264track with the audio tracks you want (could be multiple audio tracks) and make a TS file

5)Now you can TSRemux to either make a BMDV folder and burn that folder by nero using UDF 2.5 setting

I watched many stuff (including HD TV shows) this way. You can also use Nero to play around with AVCHD files and add menus and such.
Doom9 is an amazing place. They help you as much as they can and you can find lots and lots of information over there.

Doom9 is great. Thanks for you help too!

It's not easy; but doable.
Here's how it goes :

1)Extract the streams from mkv and make them separate using MKV Extract.

2)Choose the streams you want.

3)Use H264info to make x264 streams AVCHD compatible (not re-encoding; it only changes flags and metadata on the stream). MPEG2 streams don't need any fixing and you barely find any VC1 streams. use 4.1 setting for the level

4)Use TsMuxer to mux the fixed x264track with the audio tracks you want (could be multiple audio tracks) and make a TS file

5)Now you can TSRemux to either make a BMDV folder and burn that folder by nero using UDF 2.5 setting

I watched many stuff (including HD TV shows) this way. You can also use Nero to play around with AVCHD files and add menus and such.
Doom9 is an amazing place. They help you as much as they can and you can find lots and lots of information over there.

Thanks for the quick guide ... I've been attempting to make AVCHD discs for a while and this has gotten me the closest yet. When I loaded up my disc, the audio seemed fine, but the video seemed to be on fast forward. Any ideas on where I messed up?? (I'm guessing I didn't select the right options in h264info - I used the 4.1 level, and kept the framerate at 59.94 - for my 720p video - but left everything else at the defaults) Any thoughts????

Thanks for the quick guide ... I've been attempting to make AVCHD discs for a while and this has gotten me the closest yet. When I loaded up my disc, the audio seemed fine, but the video seemed to be on fast forward. Any ideas on where I messed up?? (I'm guessing I didn't select the right options in h264info - I used the 4.1 level, and kept the framerate at 59.94 - for my 720p video - but left everything else at the defaults) Any thoughts????

In h264into, make sure "Write PPS every picture" is checked.

Also in TsRemux, make sure "Bypass audio allignment" is NOT checked!

Try them. Sometimes these two are the source of problems.

In h264into, make sure "Write PPS every picture" is checked.

Also in TsRemux, make sure "Bypass audio allignment" is NOT checked!

Try them. Sometimes these two are the source of problems.

Thanks! I'll try those settings tonight! :)