I am trying to decide between these to projectors. I know the Epson 720 is only 720p vs 1080p for the Mitsubishi, but I have heard a lot of good things about the Epson and there is a great deal out there on both of them. Essentially I can get the Epson for $1,100 with a free bulb and the Mitsubishi for $1,400.

The Epson on paper looks to have a higher contrast (10,000:1 vs 7,500:1) and higher brightness (1600 vs 1000) lumens.

I am projecting an 85-95" image onto a wall and my seating is fixed at 10 feet 11 inches from the wall. Not sure what the calculation is for whether added resolution from 720p to 1080p will make a difference in my case based on my seating distance/projected image.

I am mainly feeding Xbox 360, HD-DVD, and over-the-air HD.

I really care about gaming from the 360 and also the occasional HD-DVD - I will also be watching sports via over-the-air HD.

Any comments on the HC 720 and or Mitsubishi on which is the better projector for what I need? Any experience with 360/PS3 gaming on the Epson or Mitsubishi?
Thanks in advance.

i have the 4900 and xbox 360 via hdmi looks awesome. My ps3 arrives on monday so I can try the blue ray on it

I have the HC4900 with Blu Ray. I give it thumbs up. For the price I don't think you can get a better PJ.

Thanks for the feedback. What about brightness, contrast, and black levels? Does the 1,000 lumens allow you any flexibility with ambient light, or do you have to be in total darkness?

Thanks

Anybody have some advice here? :-) I am torn between what to do between these two projectors.

Thanks in advance!

From what I'm reading the 720 has better blacks and shadow detail. The 4900 has better finer detail in HD images and is 1080p obviously.

It depends on your screen. The 4900 was too washed out on a painted wall during the day with it pretty bright (but light-filtering shades drawn). Using a grey screen, it was watchable, but not impressive. You wouldn't see any detail difference between 720p and 1080p during the day.

At night, if you fill the screen, I am betting the black levels of the HC4900 will be ok. I'm not sure why I didn't test that out yesterday night. But then again, I might be comparing black in the picture to black in the border and it will seem greyed-out.

Ok, thanks for the feedback guys.

I am really torn here and need to act quickly before the rebates in play expire.

I am concerned about the contrast, brightness, and black levels of the Mitsubishi. It is only rated 7500:1 vs the Epson 10000:1 as it relates to contrast and reviewers have also said they are underwhelmed when it comes to black levels.

I have been spoiled by a Sharp XR10 XGA resolution projector that has a very sharp picture (no pun intended) and 2000 lumens. I got used to it's brightness and I am worried also about how bright the Mitsubishi is at 1000 lumens vs the Epsons 1600. I have one large window in an otherwise dark room. The window has a roman shade that does a pretty good job of blocking most light but there is some leakage.

I'd like to hear more about black levels and contrast from both owners of the 720 and the 4900.

I am being seduced to the Mitsubishi, I think because of the boost in resolution from 720p to 1080p. I have a 90" image that I am watching from about 11 feet so I would see a difference in 720p vs 1080p from that distance - but I think black level and contrast is more important to me.

In fact, a recent SMPTE (Society of Motion Pictures and Television Engineers) study found that the four aspects of a picture that the human eye “sees”—in order of importance - are:

Contrast Ratio/Dynamic Range
Color Saturation
Colorimetry/Color Temperature or Grayscale
Resolution

So I am beginning to wonder if resolution is really as important as people are making it out to be. But on the flip side, I love the fact that the 4900 has motorized controls for adjustment and a low lamp mode (and I wonder if that is really too washed out).

HELP! :-)

Thanks for helping me make this decision!

So I am beginning to wonder if resolution is really as important as people are making it out to be.


Its the most over rated, over talked about thing on these forums.

Unless you plan on sitting 1.2X screen width or closer to your screen the benefits of the added resolution from 720p to 1080p will be nonexistent. The epson has better contrast, is brighter, is a better built machine, carries a better warranty, comes with a free spare bulb and costs less. An easy choice if you ask me. Also the exact reason I ordered the Epson myself.

Thanks for chiming in. I am wondering about the black levels of the Mitsubishi and the contrast. The problem is that I really need somebody that has seen both - a Mitsubishi owner and an Epson owner each will have a natural bias towards defending their own purchase.

Biglyle, I don't doubt your perceptions for a second - I am sure that you feel that way about the projector. I would love to hear from Mitsubishi owners as well.

I have to get past caring about the extra bit of resolution and the stupid motorized controls...they know how to lure you in with things that aren't really that important but are tantelizing. I also read that the HDMI on the Mitsubishi is 1.2 instead of 1.3. Anybody know if that makes a huge difference?



Its the most over rated, over talked about thing on these forums.

Unless you plan on sitting 1.2X screen width or closer to your screen the benefits of the added resolution from 720p to 1080p will be nonexistent. The epson has better contrast, is brighter, is a better built machine, carries a better warranty, comes with a free spare bulb and costs less. An easy choice if you ask me. Also the exact reason I ordered the Epson myself.

I have to get past caring about the extra bit of resolution and the stupid motorized controls...they know how to lure you in with things that aren't really that important but are tantelizing. I also read that the HDMI on the Mitsubishi is 1.2 instead of 1.3. Anybody know if that makes a huge difference?I am in the same boat.

1) Motorized controls might actually be beneficial for me, I intend to initially use the PJ from a coffee table and/or from multiple areas in the home. Assuming that the controls operate off of the remote, it might be worthwhile having them instead of having to get up and make adjustments everytime I setup the PJ. I wonder how often things get out of whack when PJs are ceiling mounted (focus, zoom, etc.).

2) Check this link for HDMI 1.3 enhancements:
http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/faq.aspx#15

One benefit that I see right off the bat is having to deal with fewer backward compatibility issues down the road - if you buy a newer HD DVD player etc. it is more likely to be HDMI 1.3 compliant (so it would nice to have the Epson in that case, but again, presumably this is not going to be a big deal!).

With the rated contrast between the two machines, it is obvious that the Epson is better on paper, but what about black level. I hear lots of talk that the black levels of the 4900 aren't that great, but that is comparing them to other D6 or D7 LCD chips. The Epson is a D5, so are the black levels comparable or does the 4900 have a better black level. Art's review said that the 4900 was as good as any DLP DC2 and better than any other 720P LCD's (D5). I would just like to see if anyone else has seen both of these and can comment on which has a better black level. Thanks.

I second that. That is the question I am dying to know. I will pull the trigger on the Epson if the black levels are better. If they are comparable on the Mitsubishi, I will have to mull it over some more (argh).

The problem is, we need soemone who has seen both. Probalby an impossible feat...

With the rated contrast between the two machines, it is obvious that the Epson is better on paper, but what about black level. I hear lots of talk that the black levels of the 4900 aren't that great, but that is comparing them to other D6 or D7 LCD chips. The Epson is a D5, so are the black levels comparable or does the 4900 have a better black level. Art's review said that the 4900 was as good as any DLP DC2 and better than any other 720P LCD's (D5). I would just like to see if anyone else has seen both of these and can comment on which has a better black level. Thanks.

The reviews I have read seem to answer your question. I keep seeing this question asked over and over and I don't get it... I have read Projector Central and Projector Reviews and they both indicate that the Mit 4900 is better. I guess they must be wrong, I guess I must be wrong... Okay I am going to read them again... Then match it up with a good screen and setup/room/mount/source... By the way, I am usually wrong according to my wife!

Not sure I understand your post at all. Do you own both the Epson and the Mitsubishi? Non of the reviews you cite below directly compare the Epson to the Mitsubishi. Neither even mentions the other because they are in different classes. Reviewers typically don't refer to projectors in different classes in their comparisons.

The Epson is 720 and the Mitsubishi is 1080p. The question is, other then the advantage in resolution (720p vs 1080p) - which frankly doesn't matter to me because the distance to the screen relative to the size of my screen does not give me any benefit of the 1080p - are the black levels and contrast better in the Epson? It is clearly a brighter projector (1600 vs 1000 lumuns) which is a positive for the Epson - so the question is what about black level and contrast?

The reviews I have read seem to answer your question. I keep seeing this question asked over and over and I don't get it... I have read Projector Central and Projector Reviews and they both indicate that the Mit 4900 is better. I guess they must be wrong, I guess I must be wrong... Okay I am going to read them again... Then match it up with a good screen and setup/room/mount/source... By the way, I am usually wrong according to my wife!

Anyone else have anything to say on this topic. I need to pull the trigger very soon!

Thanks so much in advance!

I have owned the Mits 4900 for about three weeks. I have never seen the Epson.

You make several mentions of black levels in your posts above. If that is pretty important to you- pass on the 4900. There probably is some unit to unit variance in the 4900's ability to show acceptable black levels. I don't know any other way to account for some users reporting "inky" blacks and great black level performance, which is far from what I see. And no- I am not a black level snob or videophile. My completely uneducated (as far as HT goes) wife can clearly see the issue.

I would carefully consider how important black levels are to you before making a move on the 4900. The other aspects of it's image are outstanding- razor sharp image, excellent color saturation and accuracy and brightness should be no problem with a screen that small (no offense intended:)) In fact HD material will look like a 90" plasma for your viewing pleasure. :)

Again- I have not seen the Epson so I have no input.

One man's opinion anyway. Good luck!

I appreciate your candid response. I have heard reviewers mention unimpressive black levels as a criticism of the Mits 4900. While at the same time, reviewers have generally praised the Epson 720 on that dimension.

My biggest problem, is that the projectors are in a completely different class. The Epson 720 is a D5 class, the Mits a D6 (someone correct me if I am wrong). Black levels are very important to me - the problem I am having is comparatively speaking is the black level on the 4900 unimpressive - for that projector class but equally impressive (or better) if compared to the lower class (D5 Epson) or is it worse then the Epson despite the class?

Unfortuantely, I think I will never know unless someone sees the Epson and Mitsubishi right next to each other.

Given the deal and ratings on the Epson ($1,100 + $100 rebate + $350 lamp) that brings the effective price to $650 - I don't think I can pass on it. The 4900 is tempting, but I am thinking in 2 years I can upgrade to something else for what I am saving on the Epson.

Thanks again for chiming in.

I have owned the Mits 4900 for about three weeks. I have never seen the Epson.

You make several mentions of black levels in your posts above. If that is pretty important to you- pass on the 4900. There probably is some unit to unit variance in the 4900's ability to show acceptable black levels. I don't know any other way to account for some users reporting "inky" blacks and great black level performance, which is far from what I see. And no- I am not a black level snob or videophile. My completely uneducated (as far as HT goes) wife can clearly see the issue.

I would carefully consider how important black levels are to you before making a move on the 4900. The other aspects of it's image are outstanding- razor sharp image, excellent color saturation and accuracy and brightness should be no problem with a screen that small (no offense intended:)) In fact HD material will look like a 90" plasma for your viewing pleasure. :)

Again- I have not seen the Epson so I have no input.

One man's opinion anyway. Good luck!

Unfortuantely, I think I will never know unless someone sees the Epson and Mitsubishi right next to each other.


You have answered your own question. As long as you don't see them side by side you will never have the frame of reference to know which one has better blacks. In a dedicated room both will have blacks that appear black, both will have excellent shadow detail, and both will have a very sharp image. Any new PJ that is set up properly, calibrated, and used in a light controlled room will have blacks that appear black.

My advice is get the one that is the better deal, stop hesitating and start enjoying, and for goodness sake, STOP READING THESE FORUMS.

Get both!

Those that complain about the black levels on a $1,400 1080p projector are being overly critical IMO.

Given the deal and ratings on the Epson ($1,100 + $100 rebate + $350 lamp) that brings the effective price to $650 - I don't think I can pass on it.Doing the math, I agree, this is a very good deal. At this price, none of us can complain ....

I ordered mine directly from Epson. They have a coupon code for 10% off and charge no taxes to most of the US states. PM me if you folks need this reuseable coupon code.

the cheapest I have seen the HC720 is 1249 with $50 off instantly and then the $100 + bulb

where are people getting it for ($1,100 + $100 rebate + $350 lamp) that brings the effective price to $650

"Projector People Price (duh!) after rebates and deals: $1299 - $100 epson rebate - $100 Superbowl deal = $1,099 - $300 (bulb) - ($100 upconvert DVD) = $699."

quoted from this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=978160&page=2

Um, I broke the golden rule and mentioned the name of one of the sponsors of the forum...

I ordered mine from one of the Forum sponsors...you figure out which one I guess...and they have excellent customer service - btw. I paid $1200 with shipping but I also got a projector mount and dust cover. Those would run about $100 if I purchased extra.

So they way I did the math: $1200 - $100 (mount/cover) - $100(rebate) - $350 (lamp) = $650 net effective price.

"Projector People Price (duh!) after rebates and deals: $1299 - $100 epson rebate - $100 Superbowl deal = $1,099 - $300 (bulb) - ($100 upconvert DVD) = $699."

quoted from this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=978160&page=2

what kind of mount is it?
and how about the cover?

I would say $50 is more like it... not $100 for the mount and cover.

and $300 for the bulb is more like it.

so you got it for $750.... still a great deal.

at Epson.... you can get it for 1169 - 100 (rebate) + free bulb
and they have a 30 day return policy with no restocking fee.

but remember.... you only claim you got it for $750 if you can get $50 for the mount/cover and $300 for the bulb. If you keep them... you can't claim you got it for less then $1000.

Um, I broke the golden rule and mentioned the name of one of the sponsors of the forum...

I ordered mine from one of the Forum sponsors...you figure out which one I guess...and they have excellent customer service - btw. I paid $1200 with shipping but I also got a projector mount and dust cover. Those would run about $100 if I purchased extra.

So they way I did the math: $1200 - $100 (mount/cover) - $100(rebate) - $350 (lamp) = $650 net effective price.

there is no way you could say it is a $100 DVD Player.... It is a REFURB worth about $40. And the superbowl deal is not $100... it is $50 off for this projector.

"Projector People Price (duh!) after rebates and deals: $1299 - $100 epson rebate - $100 Superbowl deal = $1,099 - $300 (bulb) - ($100 upconvert DVD) = $699."

quoted from this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=978160&page=2

You paid exactly what you paid. You can try and say it came to a lower amount with the free bulb and such, but in the end if you shelled out $1200, then imo you PAID $1200.

You paid exactly what you paid. You can try and say it came to a lower amount with the free bulb and such, but in the end if you shelled out $1200, then imo you PAID $1200.

Exactly. Well said.

To many posts about what it cost with the extras....will you ever need the bulb? Probably not based on the prices going down and the speed of technology changing. Sell the bulb? time and money are worth something, as will be the ebay fees and the fact that the value of the bulb may not be what you imagine.

I plan on going with the 4900, and will buy it from one of the sponsors that takes returns. I will be closer than 1.2 and my eyes (and ears) are the only things not showing my age. My current projector was on the tail end of it's life cycle and I don't want to repeat that.

If they took out the extras and priced the Epson accordingly my view might change.

At that seating distance I agree the 4900 was your best choice. Myself I plan on sitting a bit further back and hence chose the Epson as a result. The thing I like about having the second bulb is I no longer have to worry about the damn thing. I can run the thing in light cannon mode when the boys are over for football or I am playing Madden and want the lights on so I can see the darn controller and its 257 buttons. Piece of mind if you will.

In the end both are excellent PJ's and will make us all happy. People read way to much into things like black levels, resolution, 1080/24 playback etc. Most new PJ's once calibrated will provide an excellent picture, especially when you factor in the low prices these things cost in relation to plasma and LCD set of 1/4 the size. For newcomers to the PJ world, stop fretting over reviews and minute details. Just get a PJ, and start enjoying it. Once you do, you will wonder why you waited so long. You will also quickly realize that everything you read here needs to be taken with a grain of salt.

Did you read the reviews on the 4900 in the Tweakers thread? Projectorcentral says the black levels on the 4900 are better than any 720p projector. All other reviews that I read are comparing the 4900 to the much higher priced 1080p projectors, so of course it's going to be bad against them.

The rebate on the 4900 has been extended into February.

there is no way you could say it is a $100 DVD Player.... It is a REFURB worth about $40.

It isn't even worth $1 - I'm replacing the one they sent me (POS, wouldn't even give it to a friend).

You paid exactly what you paid. You can try and say it came to a lower amount with the free bulb and such, but in the end if you shelled out $1200, then imo you PAID $1200.

Yeah - PAID $1200 for a PJ, AND an extra bulb was included (we'll leave the other stuff out), and then a $100 check will come. So, if you only have $650 to spend then of course the math doesn't add up. But people say the 4900 is only $1400, but nobody jumps on that and says, "but what about the rebate, you actually are not paying $1400...". So you either have to value the bulb at $0, or reduce the value of the PJ, or somewhere in between.

....will you ever need the bulb? Probably not based on the prices going down and the speed of technology changing. Sell the bulb? time and money are worth something, as will be the ebay fees and the fact that the value of the bulb may not be what you imagine.

In my case (yours may differ) ABSOLUTELY. I use my PJ as a TV. On in the morning for about an hour, on at night for about five to six hours, then on all day (~16 hours) Saturday and Sunday. I'm normally in one of the brighter modes because this is my living room with attached kitchen. The OP mentioned gaming, so that probably equals bright setting and a fair amount of time.

It all comes down to how you plan to use it. I sit 17' away from my 150" diag 16:9 image and therefore 1080p isn't really that important (to me). I'm not using it for "critical" viewing (my viewing environment totally skews any efforts towards this), so enhanced PQ or silky blacks aren't really that important either. In this price range, those differences are for videophiles.

But other people's needs do not match mine. I think the OP made an ok choice, I love my HC 720. But if I were sitting that close I probably would have gone 1080p. Hopefully Big_D will come back after a while and give folks an update regarding his level of satisfaction.

yes... I read this... but the HC720 was not reviewed before the review on the 4900.

Did you read the reviews on the 4900 in the Tweakers thread? Projectorcentral says the black levels on the 4900 are better than any 720p projector. All other reviews that I read are comparing the 4900 to the much higher priced 1080p projectors, so of course it's going to be bad against them.

The rebate on the 4900 has been extended into February.

Audixium
qoute: It all comes down to how you plan to use it. I sit 17' away from my 150" diag 16:9 image and therefore 1080p isn't really that important (to me).

Wow!, My screen is 123" at 15-17' and I can easily see the difference, especially in sde. Funny how to each his own.

That being said, I would have a hard time choosing the HC4900 over my old Z5 which had much better black level and shadow detail when I compared them side by side in my theater. I would think the epson were closer to the Z5 but have not seen the new epson in person. I had viewed a pro 810 it I felt it comparable.

Meant to also ask this - people say that the Epson 720 is softer and/or lacks edge detail relative to the 4900. Can someone quantify this? Softer by 10%, 50% or more?

they also give the edge to the Epson 720 over the Pany AX200 for black levels.

I doubt you can get the Epson 720 for $1000 after the rebate plus the bulb to boot. It is more like a $800 to $900 deal for the projector after the rebate and bulb. (that's if you sell the bulb!) and time is not free... so you have round it up a little.

I appreciate your candid response. I have heard reviewers mention unimpressive black levels as a criticism of the Mits 4900. While at the same time, reviewers have generally praised the Epson 720 on that dimension.

My biggest problem, is that the projectors are in a completely different class. The Epson 720 is a D5 class, the Mits a D6 (someone correct me if I am wrong). Black levels are very important to me - the problem I am having is comparatively speaking is the black level on the 4900 unimpressive - for that projector class but equally impressive (or better) if compared to the lower class (D5 Epson) or is it worse then the Epson despite the class?

Unfortuantely, I think I will never know unless someone sees the Epson and Mitsubishi right next to each other.

Given the deal and ratings on the Epson ($1,100 + $100 rebate + $350 lamp) that brings the effective price to $650 - I don't think I can pass on it. The 4900 is tempting, but I am thinking in 2 years I can upgrade to something else for what I am saving on the Epson.

Thanks again for chiming in.

Meant to also ask this - people say that the Epson 720 is softer and/or lacks edge detail relative to the 4900. Can someone quantify this? Softer by 10%, 50% or more?

HC4900, sharpest pj I've seen, including my old BenQ 8700+ single chip dlp.

In defense of the hc4900, I hear the nd filter mod brings the black levels to a respectable level for movie watching, would love to see it but I sent it back in the 4 hour window.

HC4900, sharpest pj I've seen, including my old BenQ 8700+ single chip dlp.

In defense of the hc4900, I hear the nd filter mod brings the black levels to a respectable level for movie watching, would love to see it but I sent it back in the 4 hour window.Hmmm .... so you never kept the 4900 :D ... May I ask why?

Funny how to each his own.

eyedoc - maybe I just need to go see an eye doctor to cure my inability to see SDE in those conditions...;)

Yeah, 20/15 vision brings out more detail than 720 to 1080 :)

The hc4900 just lacked black level. It was equal to my old z3 and worse than my old Z5. The AE2000 is much better in that regard, I'll have an RS1 next week.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I already sold off all the extra stuff that I don't really need for the price I mentioned. I didn't need the mount, dustcover, or extra bulb and sold them for a total of $400 to my neighbor who recently himself bought the Epson 720 (except before the bulb deal and rebate).

Exactly. Well said.

To many posts about what it cost with the extras....will you ever need the bulb? Probably not based on the prices going down and the speed of technology changing. Sell the bulb? time and money are worth something, as will be the ebay fees and the fact that the value of the bulb may not be what you imagine.

I plan on going with the 4900, and will buy it from one of the sponsors that takes returns. I will be closer than 1.2 and my eyes (and ears) are the only things not showing my age. My current projector was on the tail end of it's life cycle and I don't want to repeat that.

If they took out the extras and priced the Epson accordingly my view might change.

I love how people keep beating a dead horse with this. Your logic escapes me. Did you factor in all the time you spent researching a projector into the total price of that projector (as you say below, time is not free)? Most of us on here have spent hundreds of hours researching (and if not hundreds, a significant number of hours). How much do you make an hour? Do the math...

That argument is a slippery slope. The issue here is not exact pricing, but VALUE. What is the value of the projector based on the going rate. The mount and dust cover go for about $100 combined (tax, shipping, etc). The bulb is actually almost an $380 value - and the rebate is $100 in cash. The issue here is not what or how you would sell the items, but what would it cost you to buy them separately.

If you consider what you are getting for nothing, it places the value of the free items at $550 - $1200 (forum sponsor price...) ergo a VALUE that makes the net effective price of the projector $650.

they also give the edge to the Epson 720 over the Pany AX200 for black levels.

I doubt you can get the Epson 720 for $1000 after the rebate plus the bulb to boot. It is more like a $800 to $900 deal for the projector after the rebate and bulb. (that's if you sell the bulb!) and time is not free... so you have round it up a little.

Um, I broke the golden rule and mentioned the name of one of the sponsors of the forum...

I ordered mine from one of the Forum sponsors...you figure out which one I guess...and they have excellent customer service - btw. I paid $1200 with shipping but I also got a projector mount and dust cover. Those would run about $100 if I purchased extra.

So they way I did the math: $1200 - $100 (mount/cover) - $100(rebate) - $350 (lamp) = $650 net effective price.

Congratulations on your purchase. I have the HC4900 and thoroughly enjoy it. In my room, which is entirely windowless with no door to the outside, it produces a stunning picture. Even in low lamp mode, I have to turn the brightness down a bit as it is a little too bright for my tastes.

I previewed an Epson HC720, but did not like the overall softness of the image, so back it went. Otherwise, it was very nice.

I've never read a review yet that could tell me what I'll like. I do find them helpful, though to avoid any dogs that might be out there.

As for the math, in the original deal you got $1650 worth of product for $1100, you didn't get $1200 worth of stuff for $650. Since you sold some of it for $400, then you could argue you got the PJ for $700, though most people wouldn't be able to match your $700 as they'd probably not have a relatively painless sale right next door, and many would not want to sell the spare bulb.

You certainly did a good job to maximize the deal to your advantage (unless of course the bulb dies young). Again, congratulations, good luck, and enjoy.

Thanks for your post - and I appreciate your input on the 4900. Others have told me the black level was so unrespectable they packed it up and sent it back.

Every review I have read, including user reviews suggest the 720 has a razor sharp image. What I have heard from the 4900 is that it is several increments sharper - so in a direct comparison I can see how you could argue the Epson is "softer" but to call it "soft" without that comparison as a direct frame of reference is misleading.

As for the VALUE of the total purchase of my Epson, please see my post above. Everyone seems to want to add to the fire on something that is completely irrelevant to the topic of my thread.

The overall value of my package makes the net effective price of my Epson $650. Advertisers use this type of logic when they advertise packages all the time, (that is subtract the value of free items from the overall price of the main item to obtain a net effective VALUE of the main item).

Thanks

Congratulations on your purchase. I have the HC4900 and thoroughly enjoy it. In my room, which is entirely windowless with no door to the outside, it produces a stunning picture. Even in low lamp mode, I have to turn the brightness down a bit as it is a little too bright for my tastes.

I previewed an Epson HC720, but did not like the overall softness of the image, so back it went. Otherwise, it was very nice.

I've never read a review yet that could tell me what I'll like. I do find them helpful, though to avoid any dogs that might be out there.

As for the math, in the original deal you got $1650 worth of product for $1100, you didn't get $1200 worth of stuff for $650. Since you sold some of it for $400, then you could argue you got the PJ for $700, though most people wouldn't be able to match your $700 as they'd probably not have a relatively painless sale right next door, and many would not want to sell the spare bulb.

You certainly did a good job to maximize the deal to your advantage (unless of course the bulb dies young). Again, congratulations, good luck, and enjoy.

I have the 4900 and here are some quick pros and cons:

Pros:
*sharpness (one of the sharpest projectors ever)
*color accuracy (very accurate decoding)
*quietness (nearly silent)
*aesthetics (black pearlescent finish is better than standard finishes)
*price (less than $1500 AR for 1080p!)
*motorized lens shift/zoom
*brightness in best mode (i.e. bulb = low, gamma = cinema - it is also bright enough for me to watch in this mode with significant ambient light on my 2.2 gain screen)
*5000 hour rated bulb

Cons:
*DUST BLOBS (a problem with all LCD projectors to some degree)
*Black level (Blacks are really a dark gray rather than black - however shadow detail and contrast are still good. I only really notice the black level deficiency on 2.35 AR movies because the black bars aren't as black as my screen's boarder. With 16:9 AR movies and HDTV this deficiency is simply unnoticeable. Also, if your room is not a bat cave, I don't think you are going to notice the difference between the black level of this projector and another projector with slightly better black levels).

Can someone clarify the lumens output for HC4900. According to excerpts from this review link (http://www.projectorreviews.com/mitsubishi/hc4900/performance.php#brightness):

The HC4900 performed about as expected, in terms of brightness. Rated 1000 lumens, the HC4900 projector measured 962 lumens in its brightness mode (Dynamic), with lamp at full power.

For all measurements, the zoom lens was slightly to the wide angle side of center. (A projector with a zoom lens of 1.6:1 like this projector is significantly dimmer in full telephoto, than full wide angle. The difference should be at least 35%.

In Cinema mode, the HC4900 produced a very impressive 688 lumens, which is significantly more than the original HC5000 measured (480 lumens), despite being rated the same 1000 lumens.

The measured difference between lamp on full power and eco-mode, is a little less than with most. Low power dropped the total lumens in Dynamic mode, by 17% in our measurements, and that should be fairly consistant, regardless of mode.

So, I'm not exactly sure how many lumens are being effectively output during the Normal, which I presume is the lamp saving eco-mode. If I watch in a generally dim light environment, is the Normal mode acceptable? Here are the corresponding review notes for the Epson 720 (http://www.projectorreviews.com/epson/powerlite-home_cinema_720/performance.php#brightness):

Dynamic mode measured a healthy 1613 lumens with the lens set in the center position. I don't measure closest and furthest zoom positions separately, but you can figure roughly 30% less for maximum zoom (smallest image from a given distance), and 30% more for full wide angle. So, even on long telephoto, the projector should kick out over 1100 lumens, and produce more than 2000 in closest position (wide-angle).

Epson, like most, pushes up green, as well as other things for their dynamic mode. I usually don't bother creating a "better" brightest mode, but in this case, I decided to see if I could get a much better looking image without sacrificing lots of lumens. You'll find those settings below in the Calibration section.

The retuned Dynamic mode was still very bright for a home theater projector, outputting 1337 lumens!

OK, now that we have brightest, out of the way, I'll list most of the others, starting with best mode:

Theater Black 1: 371 lumens - This is technically the best movie watching mode (and quietest), although many people who aren't perfectionists may prefer slightly brighter modes that don't sacrifice significant picture quality.

BTW, after I fine tuned Theater Black 1 mode, it actually was about 12 lumens brighter.

Theater Mode: Unlike Theater Black 1, the fan runs louder. Surprisingly it wasn't significantly brighter, measuring 392 lumens.

Natural mode, did much better in terms of brightness, with 476 lumens.

That takes us to Living Room mode, which for some reason was a real mess from a color temperature standpoint. As such, I won't bother you with the lumen rating at default Living Room mode. However, I spent some time and significantly improved the picture quality. And, to my amazement, after adjustment, the Living Room mode ended up siginficantly brighter as well.

The final number for Living Room Mode: 929 lumens!

The Epson 720 is rated for 1600 lumens, and the Mitsubishi HC4900 rated for 1000 lumens. I am not sure and trying to determine the lumens being displayed during normal viewing modes (meaning, sort of in darkness with light control without any significant ambient lighting) for each of these projectors. Can someone clairfy ? :D

I know the obvious. But I was wondering how much better the epson is over the Sanyo?
Has anyone done any direct comparisons???

Meant to also ask this - people say that the Epson 720 is softer and/or lacks edge detail relative to the 4900. Can someone quantify this? Softer by 10%, 50% or more?

I don't know how sharp the the HC4900 is, the the 720 is very sharp.

I think people put too much stock in sharpness. There has to be a point where too much sharpness takes away from the film-like look.

I don't know how sharp the the HC4900 is, the the 720 is very sharp.

I think people put too much stock in sharpness. There has to be a point where too much sharpness takes away from the film-like look.In this case, maybe my unit is defective :D The edge sharpness is sort of lacking in Epson 720's - I am talking about HD broadcasts. I have to turn up the sharpness to +5 to get close. As you, others say, it is also a matter of perspective and opinions. My expectation of sharpness is probably different than yours. Your expectations make you happy - mine dont :D :D If you find it too sharp, you are able to turn it down. My unit does not give me the ability to do that - the edges always seem blurry. Overall softness may be one of my only gripes with this otherwise excellent PJ.

In this case, maybe my unit is defective :D The edge sharpness is sort of lacking in Epson 720's - I am talking about HD broadcasts. I have to turn up the sharpness to +5 to get close. As you, others say, it is also a matter of perspective and opinions. My expectation of sharpness is probably different than yours. Your expectations make you happy - mine dont :D :D If you find it too sharp, you are able to turn it down. My unit does not give me the ability to do that - the edges always seem blurry.

Too much lens shift? That will make things go blurry real quick as I found out the hard way. Go to Advanced Sharpness and crank the hell out of all the controls. :)

Let me give some perspective here. As you noticed, the Mits has a higher lumens output once it is calibrated. That is the key. If you are looking to burn a hole in your screen, then the Epson, uncalbrated and in vivid mode, will do that. If however, you prefer to view your movies correctly, then the Mits puts out more lumens calibrated than the Epson.

I had the Epson Pro Cinema 800 b4 it just got replaced by the HC4900. I have no problems with the black levels on my DIY screen. I think that some that do have a high gain/white screen. I painted my screen with Behr Silverscreen and the blacks are very good. All the complaining about black levels need to be investigated further with this projector. What is the dynamic Iris set at? What kind of screen are they using, etc. It all adds up to the perceived black levels of the projector.

Once I got the HC4900 up on my 100 inch screen, I never went back to the Epson.

Too much lens shift? That will make things go blurry real quick as I found out the hard way. Go to Advanced Sharpness and crank the hell out of all the controls. :)Thanks eightninesuited .... I have close to 0 lens shift. I wondered about the advanced sharpness ... will give that a try tonight :D By edges I mean, edges on subjects, people, etc. in the image itself. Text seems a tad blurry ... edges on the text is what I mean.

Thanks eightninesuited .... I have close to 0 lens shift. I wondered about the advanced sharpness ... will give that a try tonight :D By edges I mean, edges on subjects, people, etc. in the image itself. Text seems a tad blurry ... edges on the text is what I mean.

Advanced sharpness.

Had issues with two Epson 720 units - first one had a very soft picture and the 2nd one has dust in the lens, SD playback issues (looks like a refurb even though they claimed it was new).

Ordered an HC 4900 and will receive it early next week. Basically, I will keep one of the better one of the two brands (the dust blob issues on the HC 4900 scare me though) - there seem to be QC issues with all brands.

If you receive a reasonably good unit, just hang on to it, you never know what new issues a replacement will bring with it :D :D

If you receive a reasonably good unit, just hang on to it, you never know what new issues a replacement will bring with it

True that. I keep going from PJ (Panny PT-AX100U / PT-AX200U) to PJ (Epson 1080 / Panny PT-AX200U (again) and I still can't match what I had when I got rid of the Epson 1080. I now have a Epson 720 that wil be here next week. I will tell you this, I'll never buy Panasonic again...

I had to (unfortunately) sell my Epson 1080 because I was about to move overseas (since canceled) and I have spent many hours trying to get back what I had going with that PJ.

If you find something you like - keep it and enjoy the heck out of it...