Saw the headline news today at highdefdigest.com about HDDVD on SuperBowl XLII on Feb 3, 2008. Not sure if this was posted. Hopefully someone can find a real good source. If this was posted, please let me know of the link, then this can be deleted.

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/High-Def_Disc_Marketing/Toshiba/Toshiba_Plans_HD_DVD_Super_Bowl_Spot/1410

They should have been about the marketing earlier on. Not sure what the SB ad will do for them...

No it won't. Toshiba woke up a little too late.

The majority of HDTV's (3.9 million estimated for this year) are sold leading up to the Super Bowl, not after it.

This is simply a waste of 2.3 million dollars by Toshiba.

This will not work...I think Blu Ray has started taken hold of the semi curious HDM wannabe crowd...just today at lunch I had someone ask me what I knew about Blu Ray...previously not a SOUL I knew would ask about HDM.

Blu's marketing machine is too strong for HD DVD to overcome I think.

Meh...I dont expect this to help much.

I think this will work quite well! Go Toshiba! :)

Who knows? HDTVs were sold, so maybe now folks are looking for content. What interests me is the quality and content of the spot. If it's not something that people will talk about, then it won't do anything.

I don't know about a "difference"...we'll see.

P.S. And I'm not saying that because I'm a Blu-ray fan. If Sony ran an ad for Blu-ray I wouldn't think it'd matter either. There have been plenty of "The Future is Blu" and PS3 as a Blu-ray device ads running in regular spots while I have not seen an HD DVD ad in a while.

Will it help if they go into stores and find the HD players on clearance? Or what if the sales people give them the honest information about the studios and the format war? Do you think some of them will still purchase players? I don't.

Too little, too late. Waste of money. They should invest that money into making a combo or bd player.

If nothing else, it will at least make sure a high number of consumers are aware that Blu-ray isn't the only way to get HD movies. That alone should lead to questions about what each one does, how they're priced....a public debate about the two HD disc offerings can't hurt and could help HD DVD.

Also if they point out what an HD DVD player can do for existing DVDs as well as play HD DVDs available in stores now, they could pull over some folks looking to pick up another DVD player.

Too little, too late. Waste of money. They should invest that money into making a combo or bd player.

Nah.

The majority of HDTV's (3.9 million estimated for this year) are sold leading up to the Super Bowl, not after it.

This is simply a waste of 2.3 million dollars by Toshiba.

Not that I want to give Toshiba any ideas, but that wouldn't be a bad angle for an ad..

Announcer: "Football season is over"

(shots of forlorn fans staring at static on their new HDTVs)

Announcer: "what are you going to watch on your new HDTV now?"

(show fan buying an HD DVD player - watching some jaw-dropping EFX movies, Bourne, Transformers - going into excitement overload)

Announcer: "HD DVD, now only $149. Keep your HDTV busy through the off season".. etc.

Nah, it'll probably just be the Shrek commercial again.

Damn... Toshiba wins. Congrats HD-DVD guys.
Time to sell my Blu ray player... oh well, it was fun while it lasted.:(

Chances are this ad was paid for well in advance of the announcement by Warner Brothers. You don't go to the network and ask for a timeslot with one month to go before the game unless somebody wasn't doing thier job.

Even if this gets people into a Best Buy, once they start asking questions, they'll learn the facts and may not be that interested in buying the losing format. That's when the only one CE manufacturer, only two studios, etc. factors will kick in. And haven't people been seeing Blu-Ray ads throughout the playoffs?

My guess is that it won't matter. And it better be good if its going to be played between Bud and other big-ticket commercials.

I saw the BluRay ad last week and I really like it. It was shown like 5 times. Hopefully, HDDVD will show it many times as well. Showing an ad multiple times is the only way to really plant a seed to someone.

Biggest advertising play of the year, with massive reach.

SuperBowl advertising itself is one of the last watercolor group watching events and the commercials are topics of conversation.

As a minimum, it will be announcement that HD DVD is alive and will bring attention to its availability and may bring attention to the current price points and value.

Its a signal that Toshiba and HD DVD will continue to fight and sell hardware, which may be an important decision factor for concerned parties.

Interesting.

Do we know what the commercial will be?

A lot of economics and business majors frequent these forums, huh?

Even if this gets people into a Best Buy, once they start asking questions, they'll learn the facts and may not be that interested in buying the losing format.

Did you mean to say the'll learn the biased untruths which the Best Buy staff has been trained to tell, or they'll actually learn the truth that HD-DVD is a better standard than Blu-Ray?

Not that I want to give Toshiba any ideas, but that wouldn't be a bad angle for an ad..

Announcer: "Football season is over"

(shots of forlorn fans staring at static on their new HDTVs)

Announcer: "what are you going to watch on your new HDTV now?"

(show fan buying an HD DVD player - watching some jaw-dropping EFX movies, Bourne, Transformers - going into excitement overload)

Announcer: "HD DVD, now only $149. Keep your HDTV busy through the off season".. etc.
Now that is a well done idea! :).

Nah, it'll probably just be the Shrek commercial again.
That would be my bet too :(.

Biggest advertising play of the year, with massive reach.

SuperBowl advertising itself is one of the last watercolor group watching events and the commercials are topics of conversation.

As a minimum, it will be announcement that HD DVD is alive and will bring attention to its availability and may bring attention to the current price points and value.

Its a signal that Toshiba and HD DVD will continue to fight and sell hardware, which may be an important decision factor for concerned parties.

Interesting.

Do we know what the commercial will be?

I don't want to know it. I want to be surprised. :D I'm hoping that they'll mention something about movies on Triple Layer 51g. :P

I'm just hoping that Toshiba's advertisements are as beautiful as BluRay's ad.

The big problem for Toshiba at this point is that, at least in Canada, a lot of those HDTV's being sold leading up to the Super Bowl came with free Blu-ray players.

Too little, too late.

IMHO this will not be a very highly rated game, I believe alot of advertisers will be disappointed with the numbers.

or maybe, their ad will be like MC hummer's PEPSI ad when he drank Coke. That was like 14 years ago. :p Do you guys remember that?

I don't know about a "difference"...we'll see.

I agree - don't forget Toshiba ran a Super Bowl ad last year, but it sucked!


They should have been about the marketing earlier on. Not sure what the SB ad will do for them...

Toshiba's ads have been spotty at best. Recently they have been running a lot of radio ads in NY, so maybe they are picking up their efforts.

The majority of HDTV's (3.9 million estimated for this year) are sold leading up to the Super Bowl, not after it.

This is simply a waste of 2.3 million dollars by Toshiba.

But now that all these people have bought big TVs for the big game, they are prime candidates to buy HD-DVD players!

The big problem for Toshiba at this point is that, at least in Canada, a lot of those HDTV's being sold leading up to the Super Bowl came with free Blu-ray players.

Too little, too late.

Wow, that's a really good deal.

Chances are this ad was paid for well in advance of the announcement by Warner Brothers. You don't go to the network and ask for a timeslot with one month to go before the game unless somebody wasn't doing thier job.
Not true.

Could very well have been a recent purchase. I do not believe they were on the committed advertiser list list last month, at least not the ones I saw in the advertising and marketing trade journals and their business related web sites.

Advertising can be purchased late if the national slots or regional slots are not filled. Normal game of advertiser - network game of chicken. Some slots go late most every year at various rates, especially those with non specific game time placement.

Biggest advertising play of the year, with massive reach.

SuperBowl advertising itself is one of the last watercolor group watching events and the commercials are topics of conversation.

As a minimum, it will be announcement that HD DVD is alive and will bring attention to its availability and may bring attention to the current price points and value.

Its a signal that Toshiba and HD DVD will continue to fight and sell hardware, which may be an important decision factor for concerned parties.

Interesting.

Do we know what the commercial will be?

Could it be a current Blu-only studio going Red? ;)

Chances are this ad was paid for well in advance of the announcement by Warner Brothers. You don't go to the network and ask for a timeslot with one month to go before the game unless somebody wasn't doing thier job.

Wrong. A large percentage of the Super Bowl ad slots are sold after conference championships are over.

Even if they paid for the ad, cant they change it to an ad for another piece of electronics... like a Regza TV or something else.

Its too late for HDDVD. The damage it has taken this month... is just too much.

News Flash: Toshiba pays Fox $3,000,000 in cash and gets 0 titles released on HD DVD. What irony. ;)

Of course, Sony may have a PS3 ad scheduled as well, and those go out of their way to promote Blu-ray. At this point, with all the media attention and editorials post-Warner, 10 seconds of Blu-ray from a PS3 ad will stick more than 30 seconds of HD DVD, especially if Warner doesn't let them use clips from any of their movies. An HD DVD commercial without Batman, Harry Potter, or the 300 will be a bare one indeed.

http://www.homemediamagazine.com/news/html/breaking_article.cfm?sec_id=2&&article_ID=11949

Its going to be a new spot, its a scheduled spot and the rate paid suggests its a recent purchase.

PS3 commerical
Preview for Warner Bros movie
HD-DVD commercial
Preview for Fox movie
Preview for Disney movie
Budweiser ad

Not that I want to give Toshiba any ideas, but that wouldn't be a bad angle for an ad..

Announcer: "Football season is over"

(shots of forlorn fans staring at static on their new HDTVs)

Announcer: "what are you going to watch on your new HDTV now?"

(show fan buying an HD DVD player - watching some jaw-dropping EFX movies, Bourne, Transformers - going into excitement overload)

Announcer: "HD DVD, now only $149. Keep your HDTV busy through the off season".. etc.

Nah, it'll probably just be the Shrek commercial again.

This is a commercial they already have, exactly as you've described it.
I saw it air a few weeks ago after the "Nothing But Trailers" show on HD Net.
It showed Pan's Labyrinth, Transformers, Bourne Ultimatum and Shrek 3.

It showed a football game with cheerleaders in the living room making it appear as though the "Full HD football game" was so real it you're actually there, then stated "but what happens when the game is done? How about watching movies in Full HD, on your Toshiba HD DVD player"

It wasn't a bad ad overall.
...a public debate about the two HD disc offerings can't hurt and could help HD DVD.

Also if they point out what an HD DVD player can do for existing DVDs as well as play HD DVDs available in stores now, they could pull over some folks looking to pick up another DVD player.

A public debate would be terrible for HD DVD and there is nothing an HD DVD player can do for an existing DVD that Blu cannot.

Toshiba Corp. will feature HD DVD in a scheduled Super Bowl XLII ad during the Feb. 3 telecast from Glendale, Ariz.

Jodi Sally, VP of marketing for the Toshiba Digital A/V Group, confirmed the Japanese consumer electronics giant will run the 30-second ad as part of a marketing strategy intended to reinvigorate HD DVD.

She said the spot would highlight the HD-A3, HD-A30 and HD-A35 players, which Toshiba recently cut the retail prices.

“It has always been our strategy to reach HDTV owners, using advertising on football games as just one vehicle,” Sally said. “If you recall, we had advertised on Sunday Night Football all season long.” Last year, the HD DVD Promotion Group sent a tour bus to Miami for the Indianapolis Colts, Chicago Bears rain-soaked affair decked out with a mobile theater and sound system to showcase the HD DVD experience.

Widely considered the most important (and expensive) domestic marketing day on the TV calendar, high-def is playing a major role in the Super Bowl as the perennial media showcase not only will be telecast in HD but also represents a major marketing tool for sales of HDTV. The Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) contemplated running an ad when a spot opened up at 50% the rate but decided against it when a Super Bowl-caliber ad couldn’t be completed in time, said sources familiar with situation. Andy Parsons, SVP, industrial solutions business group, Panasonic Electronics and spokesperson for the BDA, confirmed the group would not air an ad. New ad and a recent purchase.

Now that is a well done idea! :).
That would be my bet too :(.
Do we know what the commercial will be?

Have you guys not seen the "What to do after the Full HD football game is over" ad from Toshiba?

I have no doubt it will be that one.

Check out the next screening of "Nothing But Trailers" on HD Net and you'll probably see it.

Nothing in there says it's a new ad, as I believe current ads running on HD cable/sat channels "highlight [G3 players]" as well.

Biggest advertising play of the year, with massive reach.

Didn't we hear this at the same time last year? Or did the planned commercial during last year's SB not air?

Too little, too late.

Ladies and gentlemen, may I present the sole reason that HD-DVD is in dire straights; they don't have a clue how to market their products. The BDA, on the other hand, took the Bose/Monster approach: they went hell-bent on establishing a mental connection n the public between HD and Blu ray (and were hugely successful, I have to give them that).

To paraphrase Elizabeth Swan/Jack Sparrow (which, ironically is Blu-Exclusive):


Elizabeth (referring to the past two Christmas seasons):
"This Christmas buying season will be the moment you can really hit the HD-DVD marketing hard, and bury Blu ray!"

Jack (in a voice suspiciously similar to Toshiba's marketing rep):
"I love those moments. I love to watch them pass by."


If the deal with Paramount did include marketing incentives to be handled by Toshiba, I wouldn't blame Paramount for being pissed ("We got 1 lousy Shrek 3 commercial out of the deal?!?!?"), and wouldn't blame Warner for learning from Paramount's mistake. While I prefer HD-DVD (soon to be neutral with Panny's new 50 player), Toshiba could learn a thing or two about marketing from my laundry...

This is a commercial they already have, exactly as you've described it.
I saw it air a few weeks ago after the "Nothing But Trailers" show on HD Net.
It showed Pan's Labyrinth, Transformers, Bourne Ultimatum and Shrek 3.

It showed a football game with cheerleaders in the living room making it appear as though the "Full HD football game" was so real it you're actually there, then stated "but what happens when the game is done? How about watching movies in Full HD, on your Toshiba HD DVD player"

It wasn't a bad ad overall.

Weird. I record Nothing But Trailers on the DVR to watch when I'm bored, but I haven't watched it in a while and honestly I haven't seen this one.

Could it be a current Blu-only studio going Red? ;)

Wow!!! Really??? This is great!!!!!!!!

The majority of HDTV's (3.9 million estimated for this year) are sold leading up to the Super Bowl, not after it.

This is simply a waste of 2.3 million dollars by Toshiba.

That is exactly the point though. While I am not sure of it's impact what better time to advertise for a High Definition player than RIGHT AFTER someone bought an HDTV.:rolleyes:

I agree...there's always hope...and HD DVDs look better anyway!

The "after the football season is over, watch movies " ad would be good, but I think it is going to be a new ad, or as a minimum that ad with a new ending talking about HD DVD models and pricing.

That is exactly the point though. While I am not sure of it's impact what better time to advertise for a High Definition player than RIGHT AFTER someone bought an HDTV.:rolleyes:

Yeah I see what you mean, but it's still too little too late. What they should have done if they did indeed have 100's of thousands of players made as some round here have suggested, is bundle those players for free with all the Toshiba HDTV's, 720p and 1080p.
No store out there will recommend HD DVD right now. The dominoes are all falling, Woolworths, Circuit City, others will not be far behind.

Didn't HD DVD have a Super Bowl commercial last year? How many units did it move? That's when it was fighting strong.

Now almost all sales reps know what the outcome is and no-one will say "hey it only plays movies from 3/10 big studios? That's good enough for me" when for only $150 more they can get one that plays movies from 7/10 big studios.

Content is king, it always has been and the price argument as the leading factor continues to be proved wrong by software sales.

In the UK at Woolworths software sales were 10:1 over the Christmas period. It's getting close to that now here.

Again, too little too late. The commercial is a good one, if it's the one I've seen, but it's too little too late.

I think I still have the NBT PVR'd, so I can try and throw it on You Tube later.

At what point are they going to answer to their shareholders about this? Throwing more money in a hole isn't going to get them anywhere. If anything they're going to get people interested in HD movies, and when those people hit the stores they'll be informed of the realities of studio support and pick up a Blu-ray player.

Highest concentration of HDTV owners that will ever watch an event will be watching this particular SuperBowl, because of HDTV sales the last 15 months.

Absolutely targeted at new HDTV owners and potential new HDTV owners.

Could it be a current Blu-only studio going Red? ;)

And as Madonna said on Wayne's World, "And Monkeys are going to fly out of my butt."

Maybe Toshiba is going to air a concession speech ;) It has about as much of chance of occurring as the two things above.

Obviously Toshiba is not conceding defeat and is still fighting to move hardware unit to build up a installed base of hardware owners that cannot be ignored.

Toshiba is attempting to bypass the Hollywood decision making and go directly to consumers.

Superbowl ads often signal the start of new advertising campaigns as the SuperBowl ads massive reach and recall advantage add a lot to the start of any accumulation of media impressions.

Add to the fact its targeted at HDTV owners and its a really good ad buy for the price.

All this will do is lead to a few dozen people wandering into Best Buy/Walmart/etc and asking about HD-DVD. When they find out that they can't play any Disney/Warner/Fox/Sony movies they'll pass. Doh.

Mentioning new prices in the SB ad is nice, but what they really need to do is show clips of JP, the Godfather, Star Trek movies, etc and then mention how they are only available on HD DVD...and then make them available on HD DVD.:D

Highest concentration of HDTV owners that will ever watch an event will be watching this particular SuperBowl, because of HDTV sales the last 15 months.

Absolutely targeted at new HDTV owners and potential new HDTV owners.

Agreed, but remember the Blu-ray group is targetting marketing at these consumers also.

HD DVD is on its deathbed at this point.

Yeah I see what you mean, but it's still too little too late. What they should have done if they did indeed have 100's of thousands of players made as some round here have suggested, is bundle those players for free with all the Toshiba HDTV's, 720p and 1080p.
No store out there will recommend HD DVD right now. The dominoes are all falling, Woolworths, Circuit City, others will not be far behind.

Didn't HD DVD have a Super Bowl commercial last year? How many units did it move? That's when it was fighting strong.

Now almost all sales reps know what the outcome is and no-one will say "hey it only plays movies from 3/10 big studios? That's good enough for me" when for only $150 more they can get one that plays movies from 7/10 big studios.

Content is king, it always has been and the price argument as the leading factor continues to be proved wrong by software sales.

In the UK at Woolworths software sales were 10:1 over the Christmas period. It's getting close to that now here.

Again, too little too late. The commercial is a good one, if it's the one I've seen, but it's too little too late.

I think I still have the NBT PVR'd, so I can try and throw it on You Tube later.

Oh, don't get me wrong I don't think it will win, I agree content is KING. I was just addressing your point as the timing is bad. The timing is bad b/c the war is virtually over, not b/c most HDTV's are sold.:)

Mentioning new prices in the SB ad is nice, but what they really need to do is show clips of JP, the Godfather, Star Trek movies, etc and then mention how they are only available on HD DVD...and then make them available on HD DVD.:D


Remember SS only movie available on HDM at this point is CEoTK on BD. JP is NOT coming to HD DVD except maybe its craptastic sequel JP3. What happened to Star Trek Season 2 on HD DVD? Cancelled?

Let it go its dead.

Too Little Too Late.

All this will do is lead to a few dozen people wandering into Best Buy/Walmart/etc and asking about HD-DVD. When they find out that they can't play any Disney/Warner/Fox/Sony movies they'll pass. Doh.

Yet the HD-DVD base keeps growing every day? Go figure!

And as Madonna said on Wayne's World, "And Monkeys are going to fly out of my butt."

Maybe Toshiba is going to air a concession speech ;) It has about as much of chance of occurring as the two things above.

What would Toshiba be doing then right now. If they want HD DVD to continue they need studios. Do you really think they are content with just Universal and Paramount? There are other studios that have yet to receive a paycheck from the BDA in the past year, Starz, Disney and Lionsgate. I imagine Toshiba is going after those studios as we speak. Will they get them? Who knows. But if there not, then Toshiba might as well just stop making players altogether.

Let it go its dead.

Too Little Too Late.

Toshiba isn't listening, and their pockets are deeper than yours!

Remember SS only movie available on HDM at this point is CEoTK is on BD. JP is NOT coming to HD DVD. What happened to Star Trek Season 2 on HD DVD? Cancelled?

Let it go its dead.

Too Little Too Late.


Close Encounters is a Sony owned title. Why would it be on Blu-ray?
Close Encounters on Blu-ray was timed with the DVD release as well.

The majority of HDTV's (3.9 million estimated for this year) are sold leading up to the Super Bowl, not after it.

This is simply a waste of 2.3 million dollars by Toshiba.

Isn't this ad for Toshiba HD DVD players? Not for Toshiba HDTVs.

Yet the HD-DVD base keeps growing every day?Not really, or at least not compared to the Blu-ray base.

Remember SS only movie available on HDM at this point is CEoTK is on BD. JP is NOT coming to HD DVD. What happened to Star Trek Season 2 on HD DVD? Cancelled?

Let it go its dead.

Too Little Too Late.

My my, why so touchy? Did you even read my post? I said that is what what they SHOULD do, not what they WILL do.

Right now the only way for HD DVD to compete will be to bring out the big catalog titles...but I can't see why Paramount and Universal would start now.

You have to admit though if they did and marketed it well, it would make things interesting.

Close Encounters is a Sony owned title.

Spielberg still approved the transfer and recorded new interviews in HD for the release.

You can tell he was involved with it as well by the audio tracks. Sony's first and only dts-ma track to date.

You know who requested that one.

Spielberg will not let JP come out on HD DVD nor be advertised as coming to HD DVD, nor will he let Indiana Jones 4 come out exclusively on HD DVD as that's the first Indy movie that he has ownership of along with Paramount and Lucas.

Remember SS only movie available on HDM at this point is CEoTK on BD. JP is NOT coming to HD DVD except maybe its craptastic sequel JP3. What happened to Star Trek Season 2 on HD DVD? Cancelled?

Let it go its dead.

Too Little Too Late.

Last I heard ST:season2 was postponed.

Let it go its dead.

Let them keep going... its very entertaining.

I think this will work quite well! Go Toshiba! :)

+1 :)

...Angelo

My my, why so touchy? Did you even read my post? I said that is what what they SHOULD do, not what they WILL do.

Right now the only way for HD DVD to compete will be to bring out the big catalog titles...but I can't see why Paramount and Universal would start now.

You have to admit though if they did and marketed it well, it would make things interesting.


Unfotunately they are NOT able to announce some of the tites you've mentioned. Jurassic Park is Amblin and Universal Pictures, so both have to agree on the release and all evidence points to Spielberg not being interested in the HD DVD format at all.

Toshiba isn't listening, and their pockets are deeper than yours!

And if they continue this too long they will do much more damage to their company image not to mention losing stockholder support.

How long do you continue to throw good money at bad investments?

Any studio that takes a payout at this point is not looking at the larger picture. HD DVD is not going to overcome anything. BD outsold in every arena last year. The only stat the HD DVD won was in player sales IF YOU TOTALLY IGNORE THE PS3.

Sorry but the PS3 users utilizing the BD ability was more than enough to outsell HD DVD software last year. The PS3 is continuing to outsell HD DVD players at a even more dramatic rate. Did you see the huge dropoff in HD DVD player sales after the WHV announcement?

Give it up. It is DEAD. Toshiba and the diehard are looking more foolish each day they let this joke continue.

Not really, or at least not compared to the Blu-ray base.

So which is it?

I think it is... yes it is, but not a much as the blu-ray base.

Spielberg still approved the transfer and recorded new interviews in HD for the release.

You can tell he was involved with it as well by the audio tracks. Sony's first and only dts-ma track to date.

You know who requested that one.

Spielberg will not let JP come out on HD DVD nor be advertised as coming to HD DVD, nor will he let Indiana Jones 4 come out exclusively on HD DVD as that's the first Indy movie that he has ownership of along with Paramount and Lucas.

Do you REALLY think the general public cares that Spielberg gave it the thumbs up? Sorry to dissapoint you, but they don't. $45 Blu-ray version or $10 DVD...hmmm....Tough choices there. But hey, this one has a DTS-MA track that 99% of people do not have the ability to even use. Wowzers!

They know one ad isn't gonna do much. This is part of a overall plan so I expect to see more spots over the next month.

Obviously Toshiba is not conceding defeat and is still fighting to move hardware unit to build up a installed base of hardware owners that cannot be ignored.

Toshiba is attempting to bypass the Hollywood decision making and go directly to consumers.

Unfotunately they are foolish for thinking that this will work in any way, shape or form. Price has obviously NOT been the most important factor in this war, as evidenced by Blu-ray's 60% of the hardware share in December and 85% then 83% of software over the last two weeks.

Toshiba is not conceding defeat, you are right, but that decision will be made for them by the retailers over the next 5 months. The dominoes have already started to fall, Circuit City, Woolworths, Wal*Mart's clearance of the Venturer player.

Anyone that can't see this as being anything other than a sisyphean task for Toshiba is blindly kidding themselves and others.

Toshiba will not be able to bypass either the Hollywood decision making or the retailers, in both cases the momentum is too strong and too far along.

This is sort of a remarkable decision. After limited marketing during 2006-2007 and imminent collapse of the format, Toshiba is now spending millions on a single ad during the Super Bowl. Again, when people get the facts from wherever they might buy or do any online research, they will find that virtually everyone says Blu-Ray has won and HD-DVD is the new Betamax. (As an example, if they get to CNET, they will discover that CNET recommends "refraining from purchasing an HD DVD player in the near future.") It is hard to see how this ad helps at this point.

Unfotunately they are NOT able to announce some of the tites you've mentioned. Jurassic Park is Amblin and Universal Pictures, so both have to agree on the release and all evidence points to Spielberg not being interested in the HD DVD format at all.

Lots of rumors and very little facts on this.

The fact is Paramount and Unviversal hold the rights to a ton of movies that could help HD DVD. The questions is, DO they want to help HD DVD?

Unfotunately they are foolish for thinking that this will work in any way, shape or form. Price has obviously NOT been the most important factor in this war, as evidenced by Blu-ray's 60% of the hardware share in December and 85% then 83% of software over the last two weeks.

Toshiba is not conceding defeat, you are right, but that decision will be made for them by the retailers over the next 5 months. The dominoes have already started to fall, Circuit City, Woolworths, Wal*Mart's clearance of the Venturer player.

Anyone that can't see this as being anything other than a sisyphean task for Toshiba is blindly kidding themselves and others.

Toshiba will not be able to bypass either the Hollywood decision making or the retailers, in both cases the momentum is too strong and too far along.

Sorry to dissapoint, but Circuit City is not clearing out players. Bummer for you guys.
Woolsworths no one cares about.
And Wal-Mart knocked 5% off the Venturer. OMG its doomed!

I have yet to see pricing for any Blu-ray 2.0 players....wonder why.

Do you REALLY think the general public cares that Spielberg gave it the thumbs up? Sorry to dissapoint you, but they don't. $45 Blu-ray version or $10 DVD...hmmm....Tough choices there. But hey, this one has a DTS-MA track that 99% of people do not have the ability to even use. Wowzers!

With that logic too, most consumers do not care about quality at all. So they don't care if its DVD, HD DVD or BD. Hell give em VHS.

Do you REALLY think the general public cares that Spielberg gave it the thumbs up? Sorry to dissapoint you, but they don't. $45 Blu-ray version or $10 DVD...hmmm....Tough choices there. But hey, this one has a DTS-MA track that 99% of people do not have the ability to even use. Wowzers!

The subject, which you've clearly ignored, is whether or not HD DVD can advertise Jurassic Park as coming soon exclusively to HD DVD; they cannot.
It matters not whether or not the public knows what Spielberg's viewpoint is, but it does matter what Spielberg's decisions are because without his consent Jurassic Park will not come to HD DVD and based on two apologies so far on behalf of the HD DVD PG for mentioning this title, it's not likely en route.

Do you follow now? Nowhere have I stated that the people will choose Blu-ray because Spielberg supports it or because it features dts-ma.

:confused:

Do you REALLY think the general public cares that Spielberg gave it the thumbs up? Sorry to dissapoint you, but they don't. $45 Blu-ray version or $10 DVD...hmmm....Tough choices there. But hey, this one has a DTS-MA track that 99% of people do not have the ability to even use. Wowzers!

I think what you are missing is that SS needs to approve any release of his titles for either HD DVD or Blu-ray and so far he has only approved the one title, Close Encounters (which is absolutely brilliant btw). So much so that the HD DVD group had to apologise twice for wrongly putting his titles into a press release without permission (permission they won't get).

IMHO this will not be a very highly rated game, I believe alot of advertisers will be disappointed with the numbers.

Interesting opinion, you must not follow football. The Pats are now one game away from a historic perfect season and New York is the largest TV market in the nation (population of the New York metro area is almost 20 million people).

The last Giants Pats game was the highest rated regular season game

"According to overnight ratings, the game drew 34.5 million viewers, making it the most-watched telecast of the 2007-08 season to date."

http://community.tvguide.com/blog-entry/TVGuide-News-Blog/Tv-Guide-Sports/Perfect-Patriots-Beat/800029994&

Also

"Fox got an absolutely phenomenal rating from the Giants-Packers overtime NFC Championship Game, a 31.7/46 overnight, the highest rating for any television program since last year's Super Bowl. It's yet another sign that when it comes to American TV, the NFL is king, and nothing else in sports or entertainment can match it."

http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2008/01/22/giants-packers-gets-huge-rating-for-fox-chargers-patriots-gets/

Not that I want to give Toshiba any ideas, but that wouldn't be a bad angle for an ad..

Announcer: "Football season is over"

(shots of forlorn fans staring at static on their new HDTVs)

Announcer: "what are you going to watch on your new HDTV now?"

(show fan buying an HD DVD player - watching some jaw-dropping EFX movies, Bourne, Transformers - going into excitement overload)

Announcer: "HD DVD, now only $149. Keep your HDTV busy through the off season".. etc.

Nah, it'll probably just be the Shrek commercial again.

That would be an awesome ad.

Let it go its dead.

Too Little Too Late.

How you wish it was that simple and how the BD group/fans underestimate the HD group. The fun has just starting. :D

...Angelo

Sorry to dissapoint, but Circuit City is not clearing out players. Bummer for you guys.
Woolsworths no one cares about.
And Wal-Mart knocked 5% off the Venturer. OMG its doomed!

I have yet to see pricing for any Blu-ray 2.0 players....wonder why.

I have a price for you $399. Sony confirmed for us at CES that 2.0 will be added to the PS3.

The future is much more gloomy for HD DVD.

The subject, which you've clearly ignored, is whether or not HD DVD can advertise Jurassic Park as coming soon exclusively to HD DVD; they cannot.
It matters not whether or not the public knows what Spielberg's viewpoint is, but it does matter what Spielberg's decisions are because without his consent Jurassic Park will not come to HD DVD and based on two apologies so far on behalf of the HD DVD PG for mentioning this title, it's not likely en route.

Do you follow now? Nowhere have I stated that the people will choose Blu-ray because Spielberg supports it or because it features dts-ma.

:confused:

How do you know they can't? Oh wait, you work for Panasonic, right? :rolleyes:

And please show me that second apology. The only one I saw was posted on a propaganda website. No second apology was issued.

I have a price for you $399. Sony confirmed for us at CES that 2.0 will be added to the PS3.

The future is much more gloomy for HD DVD.

Sorry, thats not a stand alone price, you know, the thing that most people will buy. Funny how I see DVD players in the DVD section at Best Buy but no PS2.

Sorry to dissapoint, but Circuit City is not clearing out players. Bummer for you guys.
Woolsworths no one cares about.
And Wal-Mart knocked 5% off the Venturer. OMG its doomed!

I have yet to see pricing for any Blu-ray 2.0 players....wonder why.

I should have said "Woolworths UK" because that's the decision I was talking about.

They are the biggest disc retailer in the UK. Their software sales in December were 10:1 in favour of Blu-ray.

You should slow down and look up some facts, because you're appearing to be a little manic at the moment.

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/29449/Woolworths-dumps-HD-DVD

Woolworths has announced that it is to drop HD-DVD from its product mix in March – leaving Blu-Ray as the sole ‘next-gen’ DVD format in its stores.

The decision was made by Woolworths execs after Blu-Ray discs outsold HD-DVD by ten-to-one at the chain over Christmas.


Whatever Woolworths UK are experiencing is being experienced all across Europe.

Circuit City are clearing out HD DVD hardware - go to your local one and take a look.

Last I heard ST:season2 was postponed.

http://www.tvshowsondvd.com/news/Star-Trek-Season-2-Delay/8544

How you wish it was that simple and how the BD group/fans underestimate HD group. The fun has just starting. :D

...Angelo

Since we are still in football season here is analogy.

HD DVD is down 4 touchdowns at the two-minute warning with the ball at their 5. The coach is looking in his playbook for 95yard 29point play. Sorry it does not exist just like any chance of HD DVD pulling this off.

Give it up. It is DEAD. Toshiba and the diehard are looking more foolish each day they let this joke continue.

You must be a shareholder cause its really bothering you.:)

I should have said "Woolworths UK" because that's the decision I was talking about.

They are the biggest disc retailer in the UK. Their software sales in December were 10:1 in favour of Blu-ray.

You should slow down and look up some facts, because you're appearing to be a little manic at the moment.

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/29449/Woolworths-dumps-HD-DVD




Whatever Woolworths UK are experiencing is being experienced all across Europe.

Circuit City are clearing out HD DVD hardware - go to your local one and take a look.

Circuit City was a computer error. They aren't clearing out inventory.

I should have said "Woolworths UK" because that's the decision I was talking about.

They are the biggest disc retailer in the UK. Their software sales in December were 10:1 in favour of Blu-ray.

You should slow down and look up some facts, because you're appearing to be a little manic at the moment.

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/29449/Woolworths-dumps-HD-DVD



Whatever Woolworths UK are experiencing is being experienced all across Europe.

Circuit City are clearing out HD DVD hardware - go to your local one and take a look.

How many discs were sold in the UK total? You do know 10:1 when 100 discs were sold really means nothing, right?

As for Circuit City, its not a clearance of HD DVD players. They are simply dumping the players with 300 to make room for Bourne Supremacy inside. The original OP that started the whole BS thread on HighDefDigest confirmed this and asked for the thread to be locked.

I have a price for you $399. Sony confirmed for us at CES that 2.0 will be added to the PS3.

The future is much more gloomy for HD DVD.

PS3/BD is only catching up to HD DVD features. My A1 almost 2-years old has features that BD doesn't support today. :rolleyes:

...Angelo

This is a smart advertising move. Is it too late? = possibly, but a good
move nonetheless. The more people made aware the better for
Toshiba. Godaddy.com & Monster.com did pretty well with Super Bowl
ads.

If the BDA was running this ad than all the Blu-ray supporters would be
doing high fives like they won the Super Bowl. Talk about hypocrisy.

Nielson Media Research reported 93 million people viewed last years Super Bowl and this year even more viewers are expected because of the Pats
quest for perfection.

I should have said "Woolworths UK" because that's the decision I was talking about.

They are the biggest disc retailer in the UK. Their software sales in December were 10:1 in favour of Blu-ray.

You should slow down and look up some facts, because you're appearing to be a little manic at the moment.

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/29449/Woolworths-dumps-HD-DVD



Whatever Woolworths UK are experiencing is being experienced all across Europe.

Circuit City are clearing out HD DVD hardware - go to your local one and take a look.

I wouldn't say biggest, that would be HMV, followed by Tesco. Woolies are not as high in the pecking order as most people here think, not that it matters because HMV will be picking a side sooner rather than later...

How do you know they can't? Oh wait, you work for Panasonic, right? :rolleyes:

And please show me that second apology. The only one I saw was posted on a propaganda website. No second apology was issued.

The first one was an apology from HD DVD group.
http://www.hddvdprg.com/eng/list.html

The second one was a rebuttal directly from the Spielberg camp - http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/Steven_Spielberg/Universal/Spielberg_Camp_Shuts_Down_Latest_HD_DVD_Rumors/1046

If an apology was issued, it would be from Universal Japan, not from HD DVD PG as they did not run the slide. Therefore you would find it on the Universal Japan press releases, not NA.

As for film rights, it's common knowledge. I could be washing dishes at Red Lobster and know that much.

I have yet to see pricing for any Blu-ray 2.0 players....wonder why.I'm seeing it for $299 (PS3 officially guaranteed support for 2.0), and the new Panasonic is expected to come in under $500 retail.

Sorry, thats not a stand alone price, you know, the thing that most people will buy. Funny how I see DVD players in the DVD section at Best Buy but no PS2.

You act like the price will never come down. Well my first two DVD players were well over $500. HD DVD only advantage was price and that was because they had to lower price due to low studio support. Do you really think Toshiba would have launched HD DVD at $500 if they had 6 of the 7 major studios at that time?

HD DVD software last I checked costs the same as BD software.

With that logic too, most consumers do not care about quality at all. So they don't care if its DVD, HD DVD or BD. Hell give em VHS.
Remember who gets most of the royalties for SD DVD. Toshiba still wins if DVD remains the standard format regardless of what happens to HD-DVD and Blu-Ray.

How many discs were sold in the UK total? You do know 10:1 when 100 discs were sold really means nothing, right?

How many discs were sold in the UK?
Perhaps Max can answer that one.

How many discs were sold in the UK total? You do know 10:1 when 100 discs were sold really means nothing, right?

Sales in the UK range from about 10,000 a week to above 50,000 a week, but the growth has been phenomenal over the last few weeks.

The European market as a whole will overtake the US market in about 8-12 months, it has already done so in everything else...

Edit: I do wish that people from the other side of the pond would be less insular, it would help to know what other nations are doing from time-to-time rather than making assumptions as sweeping generalisations.

Edit 2: The market split is about 4:1 last time I checked, I'll get some more concrete figures when I am next able to.

Circuit City was a computer error. They aren't clearing out inventory.

Was the word "Clearance" printed on the sales tags in error?

The first one was an apology from HD DVD group.
http://www.hddvdprg.com/eng/list.html

The second one was a rebuttal directly from the Spielberg camp - http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/Steven_Spielberg/Universal/Spielberg_Camp_Shuts_Down_Latest_HD_DVD_Rumors/1046

If an apology was issued, it would be from Universal Japan, not from HD DVD PG as they did not run the slide. Therefore you would find it on the Universal Japan press releases, not NA.

As for film rights, it's common knowledge. I could be washing dishes at Red Lobster and know that much.

Today, however, in a statement to Blu-ray.com, Spielberg spokesperson Marvin Levy put the rumors to bed.

Yes, great reporting there. So they only offered an apology to a fan website, REALLY? :rolleyes:

C'mon. You have already been proven wrong on This, Star Trek Season 2, and Circuit City. What next?

I'm seeing it for $299 (PS3 officially guaranteed support for 2.0), and the new Panasonic is expected to come in under $500 retail.

Yes, it will.

Since we are still in football season here is analogy.

HD DVD is down 4 touchdowns at the two-minute warning with the ball at their 5. The coach is looking in his playbook for 95yard 29point play. Sorry it does not exist just like any chance of HD DVD pulling this off.

You only wish. :D

...Angelo

Was the word "Clearance" printed on the sales tags in error?

Yes. The A2/A20 are on clearance as they are no longer being made anymore. The A3/A30 tags should be rectified soon.

This is definitely too little, too late.

Toshiba is now in a serious bind. I'm sure their price cut brought some more people off the sidelines, but just like casting a net into the ocean, you get a lot of chum. Price-conscious buyers aren't early adopters (in fact, I'd say a lot of the self-proclaimed "early adopters" on this forum really aren't), and, similar to PS3 owners, are going to have a low attach rate even if they're aware they can use those funny looking discs in the red cases.

Advertising is going to get some stick rate, and they may get a small bump in hardware sales as a result, but those buyers are going to be dismayed when they go to the store and find out that the huge wall of blue cases on the opposite side of the aisle won't play in that Toshiba unit.

How many discs were sold in the UK?
Perhaps Max can answer that one.Well over a million in Europe, of which UK is the largest piece of the pie at (IIRC) about 30%-35%.

Yes, it will.

Awesome. So we are back at pricing Blu-ray players at a premium, not at a price that general public can buy. Its awesome that a Profile 2.0 player is the same price as an A1 that was released 2 years ago and it has the same exact features!

Yes, great reporting there. So they only offered an apology to a fan website, REALLY? :rolleyes:

C'mon. You have already been proven wrong on This, Star Trek Season 2, and Circuit City. What next?


Sorry, who's been proven wrong? Your ridiculous claim of 100 discs sold in the UK just got pwned.

As for Blu-ray.com, they were also amongst the 50 groups invited to the Blu-ray Disc Event 2007 by the BDA. You think they should have made the statement through CNN perhaps?

What did I say about Star Trek 2? Please try and follow the conversation before making false accusations.

Close Encounters is a Sony owned title. Why would it be on Blu-ray?
Close Encounters on Blu-ray was timed with the DVD release as well.

CEOT3K, whether it had been issued on BD or not, was still gonna get the DVD release, as it was for the 30th anniversary of the film. Perfect opportunity to re-issue it yet again.

Sales in the UK range from about 10,000 a week to above 50,000 a week, but the growth has been phenomenal over the last few weeks...

The European market as a whole will overtake the US market in about 8-12 months, it has already done so in everything else...

keep dreaming. when you can buy a hd dvd player for 60 british pounds or a blu-ray player for 160 british pounds (or the equivalent amount in euros -- those amounts should be roughly comparable to amazon's best prices of about $125 and $330), maybe, but until then more high-definition video disc players will be sold in the united states than in europe.

Awesome. So we are back at pricing Blu-ray players at a premium, not at a price that general public can buy. Its awesome that a Profile 2.0 player is the same price as an A1 that was released 2 years ago and it has the same exact features!

You seem to have extracted what the price will be out of a statement saying that it will be less that $500.

Where has the MSRP been listed?

You really are good at misdirection aren't you?

You must be a shareholder cause its really bothering you.:)

I have to agree. He's post sounds like he's frighten of a HD come back! :)

...Angelo

keep dreaming. when you can buy a hd dvd player for 60 british pounds or a blu-ray player for 160 british pounds (or the equivalent amount in euros -- those amounts should be roughly comparable to amazon's best prices of about $125 and $330), maybe, but until then more high-definition video disc players will be sold in the united states than in europe.

You're talking to someone in finance that sees the sales figues.
:rolleyes:
I think they know more than you do.

PS3/BD is only catching up to HD DVD features. My A1 almost 2-years old has features that BD doesn't support today. :rolleyes:

...Angelo

Well my PS3 offers lossless audio on over 90% of my BD discs. Exactly how many HD DVD discs have lossless. I can tell you its a heck of a lot less than even 40 percent.

To me its the quality of the presentation first, then special features. Frankly I have not been too impressed with either HD DVD's HDi or BD-Java special features.

But man 1080p24 on a 100"-screen with lossless audio is the ultimate HT experience.

Does your A1 over 1080p24? Well my PS3 did not initially but it does now and its true 24p not some kludge job that Toshiba did with their offerings.

This thread is about the HD-DVD Super Bowl advertisement, no?

You seem to have extracted what the price will be out of a statement saying that it will be less that $500.

Where has the MSRP been listed?

You really are good at misdirection aren't you?

Less then $500 = $499.99

keep dreaming. when you can buy a hd dvd player for 60 british pounds or a blu-ray player for 160 british pounds (or the equivalent amount in euros -- those amounts should be roughly comparable to amazon's best prices of about $125 and $330), maybe, but until then more high-definition video disc players will be sold in the united states than in europe.

Take it from someone who has run the numbers, that isn't going to be the case for very long.

The US used to be the biggest market for all media, now for movies, DVDs, games and music it has been overtaken by the EU. It's not anything to be ashamed of though, there are more people in Europe and that means more money...

Sorry, who's been proven wrong? Your ridiculous claim of 100 discs sold in the UK just got pwned.

As for Blu-ray.com, they were also amongst the 50 groups invited to the Blu-ray Disc Event 2007 by the BDA. You think they should have made the statement through CNN perhaps?

What did I say about Star Trek 2? Please try and follow the conversation before making false accusations.

You do know I was kidding about 100 discs, right? UK sales are no where near the US. Next your going to sell me Blu-ray sells better in Australia, right? Thats an important factor in the war!

Yes, a statement could have been made ANYWHERE but at Blu-ray.com. That is the LAST place I would ever get information to.

But man 1080p24 on a 100"-screen with lossless audio is the ultimate HT experience.

..and we are in the teeny, tiny minority. I have a PS3 and a Panny 1080p projector, but the vast majority of people are using 50" and smaller TVs and HTiBs or TV speakers.
They get a lot more use out of PiP than they do lossless.

C'mon. You have already been proven wrong on This, Star Trek Season 2, and Circuit City. What next?The only thing he's been proven "wrong" on is CC. There have been two publicly reported retractions from HD DVD PRG on Spielberg titles, as reported by many news sources. TOS Season 2 was indeed "indefinitely delayed".

And if they continue this too long they will do much more damage to their company image not to mention losing stockholder support.

How long do you continue to throw good money at bad investments?

Care to post a link to sales/earnings statements?

It really bothers you that HD-DVD will be around for a long time, huh?

Do you think indie film makers are going to adopt Blu-Ray as their standard when they can produce films much for much less money on HD-DVD? That's simply one example of many one the side of HD-DVD, and why the format will be here long after this discussion is forgotten.

I have to agree. He's post sounds like he's frighten of a HD come back! :)

...Angelo

Whats frightening is people actually believe that HD-DVD is on the verge of a comeback.

What's frightening is that people can't just sit down in their home theater room and enjoy movies instead of bickering back and forth on forums like this.

Well my PS3 offers lossless audio on over 90% of my BD discs. Exactly how many HD DVD discs have lossless. I can tell you its a heck of a lot less than even 40 percent.

To me its the quality of the presentation first, then special features. Frankly I have not been too impressed with either HD DVD's HDi or BD-Java special features.

But man 1080p24 on a 100"-screen with lossless audio is the ultimate HT experience.

If so why are backing profile 2.0 on the PS3?

For most people it's PQ that stands out more than AQ and BD does have the highest number MPEG2 releases. :eek: For most people their $499 5.1 audio system are junk to tell the difference between Lossless and regular DTS.

...Angelo

Yes, a statement could have been made ANYWHERE but at Blu-ray.com. That is the LAST place I would ever get information to.

How convenient for your cause.

;)

If BD "won", how come the propaganda machines are still in full force "defending" BD in here? Can't they go home now?

Whats frightening is people actually believe that HD-DVD is on the verge of a comeback.

Agreed.

But then again, if people really thought it was thriving then they wouldn't be buying backup players so they could be sure to have a player when their primary died.

(because they will no longer be able to purchase a new unit)

Whats frightening is people actually believe that HD-DVD is on the verge of a comeback.

Time will tell.... :)

...Angelo

If BD "won", how come the propaganda machines are still in full force "defending" BD in here? Can't they go home now?

We still need movies from Universal and Paramount.

I don't know about a "difference"...we'll see.

P.S. And I'm not saying that because I'm a Blu-ray fan. If Sony ran an ad for Blu-ray I wouldn't think it'd matter either. There have been plenty of "The Future is Blu" and PS3 as a Blu-ray device ads running in regular spots while I have not seen an HD DVD ad in a while.

I would agree wholeheartedly unless the spot touts the price. If they say get an HD DVD player starting at $149 and 5 movies free, then it may make some of those new HDTV owners an offer tehy can't refuse.

If it is that same old "HD is the future" junk, then no one will notice.

On second thought, maybe it'll be a hialrious spot that will be reviewed on all of the news channels and morning shows the next day. If they also mention price in that kind of an ad, it might make a big difference- it might be seen by 100 million people over two days. My wife records the Today Show every year on the day after just to see the "award winning" ads.

An advertising campaign -- even one with an ad during the biggest advertising event of the year -- cannot change the underlying facts. After the ad, HD-DVD will still have lost the last 60+ Nielsen weeks, will still have fewer CE companies, will still have fewer studios, will still not have the PS3, will still be abandoned by Warner in May, will still receive unfavorable retail treatment at Best Buy, Target, etc. The list goes on and on. An ad cannot change the facts.

How convenient for your cause.

;)

It is a really bad site. But what do you expect given the name of the site.

I had asked on there regarding an issue with my Sharp HP20 and was called an HD DVD fanboy. :confused:

I'm seeing it for $299 (PS3 officially guaranteed support for 2.0), and the new Panasonic is expected to come in under $500 retail.

It sucks that I wasn't able to get the PS3 80g. My friend was lucky since he got his PS3 80g 2 weeks ago. I spoke to a manager at BestBuy Algonquin yesterday and confirmed that they're not selling the 80g anymore. Anyways, my money went to an amplifier.

Less then $500 = $499.99

Daewoo have also said they're bringing a player under the Daytek name to Canada for between $199-$299 which will at least be a 1.1 profile player and likely a 2.0 based on their IFA showing.

I do not know if the price on the DMP-BD50 will be $499.99 - are you saying that you've found out that this will be the MSRP?

It is a really bad site. But what do you expect given the name of the site.

I had asked on there regarding an issue with my Sharp HP20 and was called an HD DVD fanboy. :confused:

We're talking about the news section, not the forums; sorry.

We still need movies from Universal and Paramount.

Go neutral. Nothing like having access to all HDM and not being part of a "team".

I would agree wholeheartedly unless the spot touts the price. If they say get an HD DVD player starting at $149 and 5 movies free, then it may make some of those new HDTV owners an offer tehy can't refuse.

If it is that same old "HD is the future" junk, then no one will notice.

On second thought, maybe it'll be a hialrious spot that will be reviewed on all of the news channels and morning shows the next day. If they also mention price in that kind of an ad, it might make a big difference- it might be seen by 100 million people over two days. My wife records the Today Show every year on the day after just to see the "award winning" ads.


Question, do you remember how funny and widely covered the pets.com adds were?

If BD "won", how come the propaganda machines are still in full force "defending" BD in here? Can't they go home now?

+1

Yes, they the BD people do sound worried. :D And they should be. :cool:

...Angelo

Go neutral. Nothing like having access to all HDM and not being part of a "team".

Why would I buy an additional player when it appears that all studios are coming to me?

I hope this thread stays open for awhile, cause I am DYING to see what the sales figures will be the week after and two weeks after this 30 seconds of saving our lives is run during the Super Bowl.

We still need movies from Universal and Paramount.

Well that ain't going to happen anytime soon. ;)

...Angelo

Care to post a link to sales/earnings statements?

It really bothers you that HD-DVD will be around for a long time, huh?

Do you think indie film makers are going to adopt Blu-Ray as their standard when they can produce films much for much less money on HD-DVD? That's simply one example of many one the side of HD-DVD, and why the format will be here long after this discussion is forgotten.

Not a link, but Sony will post earnings growth of about 17-18%, Panasonic (MEI) about 13-14%, while Toshiba (citing HD DVD as a difficult market) will post growth of about 3%, this is based on my company's financial analysis (and you know, we are in the business).

Sony will make 215bn JPY, MEI about 150bn JPY and Toshiba about 60bn JPY.

You can see the difference.

Go neutral. Nothing like having access to all HDM and not being part of a "team".

Why go neutral when all studios will be supporting Blu-ray by this time next year?

Question, the title of this thread is 'Looks like this is going to make a difference'

Yet I don't see anything about it making a difference, I basically see people saying 'See HD DVD isn't dead yet', and other people saying 'just give up already'.

So where is the difference made?

Take it from someone who has run the numbers, that isn't going to be the case for very long.

The US used to be the biggest market for all media, now for movies, DVDs, games and music it has been overtaken by the EU. It's not anything to be ashamed of though, there are more people in Europe and that means more money...

"Sales in the UK range from about 10,000 a week to above 50,000 a week, but the growth has been phenomenal over the last few weeks...

The European market as a whole will overtake the US market in about 8-12 months, it has already done so in everything else..."

Europe sold 1 million high-definition video discs in 2007 versus about 5 million in the United States (my numbers for both Europe and the U.S. might be a little low, but it is still about 1:5).

Europe might get to 5 million hi-def discs this year, but u.s. will be over 20 million. so it may close the gap, but won't come anywhere close to surpassing the u.s. this year.

the hardware is just prohibitively expensive in europe to make a run at the u.s. in terms of software or hardware in 2008. now in 2009, europe might stand a chance at making a huge surge, but 8-12 months is not enough time.

I hope this thread stays open for awhile, cause I am DYING to see what the sales figures will be the week after and two weeks after this 30 seconds of saving our lives is run during the Super Bowl.

Why do you care? I sure don't....

I hope this thread stays open for awhile, cause I am DYING to see what the sales figures will be the week after and two weeks after this 30 seconds of saving our lives is run during the Super Bowl.

Yes, it won't get locked unless we guys start throwing bs to different parties...

Not a bad idea to put it on during the Superbowl. Let people know of their cost advantages when it comes to entering the HD movie market.

+1

Yes, they the BD people do sound worried. :D And they should be. :cool:

...Angelo

Are you kidding?

85:15
83:17

Yeah, real worried about one 30 second Super Bowl commercial when three days worth of $99 players couldn't turn the software sales around for HD DVD.

I hope this thread stays open for awhile, cause I am DYING to see what the sales figures will be the week after and two weeks after this 30 seconds of saving our lives is run during the Super Bowl.

I would be happy with NPD data from the week after the last group of figures we got.

Since that was the one with the new prices that are saving HD DVD.

Why go neutral when all studios will be supporting Blu-ray by this time next year?

If I didn't have an HD DVD player, $129 for access to all titles NOW instead of one year from now would be a no brainer....

Then you also cannot assume they will IMMEDIATLY release all their existing HD DVD titles on BD day one either.... it could be a long wait.

PS3/BD is only catching up to HD DVD features. My A1 almost 2-years old has features that BD doesn't support today. :rolleyes:


The feature that really counts is being able to play HD movies available now those released in the future. On that count, there isn't an HD player out there worth anything.

At best, your argument is a valid argument for postponing a BD purchase. There's no valid argument for making an HD purchase. Current BD players aren't future proof, but HD players have no future at all as anything but overpriced SD upscalers.

An advertising campaign -- even one with an ad during the biggest advertising event of the year -- cannot change the underlying facts. After the ad, HD-DVD will still have lost the last 60+ Nielsen weeks, will still have fewer CE companies, will still have fewer studios, will still not have the PS3, will still be abandoned by Warner in May, will still receive unfavorable retail treatment at Best Buy, Target, etc. The list goes on and on. An ad cannot change the facts.

But you are forgetting some facts. You can purchase a brand new HD-DVD stand alone player for $100, and get 5 free movies. There are over one million HD-DVD players in homes already. The titles available for both formats are nearly equal on every popular online sales website. HD-DVD is a finalized format and won't have playback issues like Blu-Ray when 2.0 is adopted. HD-DVD has better interactive features. Paramount and Universal are STILL putting out exclusives on HD-DVD (Ouch!). Indie film makers prefer HD-DVD's cheaper manufacturing costs to Blu-Ray. The list goes on and on. An add reaching 90,000,000 people CAN make a difference.

If I didn't have an HD DVD player, $129 for access to all titles NOW instead of one year from now would be a no brainer....

If all studios were releasing on HD DVD NOW, I too would buy that player.

Agreed.

But then again, if people really thought it was thriving then they wouldn't be buying backup players so they could be sure to have a player when their primary died.

(because they will no longer be able to purchase a new unit)

I know! Case in point...
Look at Gizmo's equipment. He's got 4 HD-DVD players. 2 or 3 were probably snatched up on an incredible deal with free disc's, which basically means he got the players for free.
Thats 4 HD-DVD players in the wild that are only going to have an attach rate of one.
HD-DVD fanatics are Toshiba's worse enemy.... you can't make this stuff up folks!

The feature that really counts is being able to play HD movies available now those released in the future. On that count, there isn't an HD player out there worth anything.

At best, your argument is a valid argument for postponing a BD purchase. There's no valid argument for making an HD purchase. Current BD players aren't future proof, but HD players have no future at all as anything but overpriced SD upscalers.

Is the XA2 an over priced upscaler? it is better than $3,500 Denon DVD players.

I know! Case in point...
Look at Gizmo's equipment. He's got 4 HD-DVD players. 2 or 3 were probably snatched up on an incredible deal with free disc's, which basically means he got the players for free.
Thats 4 HD-DVD players in the wild that are only going to have an attach rate of one.
HD-DVD fanatics are Toshiba's worse enemy.... you can't make this stuff up folks!

BD fanatics aren't any better ;)

Maxpower,

Given the size of the companies you listed, Toshiba's earnings are good. When construction begins on new nuclear plants you'll see Toshiba's earnings gain tremendous momentum. HD-DVD is only a small part of Toshiba's portfolio.

There are over one million HD-DVD players in homes already.

There are over 13 million SACD players in homes already, not including the PS3.


One million is a small pittance, easily ignored by companies that want to sell 8 million copies of a disc in one week.

Blah blah blah.

All I ever hear from some people is "sure Blu-ray is winning now, but wait til..."

$300 players.
$250 players.
$200 players.
Tranformers week.
$99 3-day sale.
Christmas.
Warner goes HD-DVD exclusive.

It's like some people just don't learn.

But you are forgetting some facts. You can purchase a brand new HD-DVD stand alone player for $100, and get 5 free movies. There are over one million HD-DVD players in homes already. The titles available for both formats are nearly equal on every popular online sales website. HD-DVD is a finalized format and won't have playback issues like Blu-Ray when 2.0 is adopted. HD-DVD has better interactive features. Paramount and Universal are STILL putting out exclusives on HD-DVD (Ouch!). Indie film makers prefer HD-DVD's cheaper manufacturing costs to Blu-Ray. The list goes on and on. An add reaching 90,000,000 people CAN make a difference.

All of those things were true when HD-DVD lost every Nielsen week in 2007 (and since) and when Warner decided to go Blu-Ray exclusive. And the Nielsen and NPD numbers get worse and worse despite these supposed advantages. The facts demonstrate that those things don't matter.

If all studios were releasing on HD DVD NOW, I too would buy that player.

I guess I am just a movie fan. I want 100% access to all HDM titles. If I were on a "side" I'd be limiting my choices.

Too bad they didn't do this last year. I'm not sure it will even matter now.

The feature that really counts is being able to play HD movies available now those released in the future. On that count, there isn't an HD player out there worth anything.

At best, your argument is a valid argument for postponing a BD purchase. There's no valid argument for making an HD purchase. Current BD players aren't future proof, but HD players have no future at all as anything but overpriced SD upscalers.

I have about 30 HD-DVDs, i will be able to play them for as long as the player works. btw I spent about as much on those 30 movies as people did on their 1.0 bluray player :D

The valid argument for postponing a BluRay player purchase is the cost. Unless you think getting a 1.0 player with a 1500 dollar TV is really a deal. Most people probably do though. They really think the price tag of 499 means they got the TV for 1000 bucks lol :D

Ill get a BluRay player no doubt. When it hits the 100 dollar mark my A2 did and can perform at a 2.0 profile spec. Until then Ill gobble up as much HD-DVD movies from BOGO sales to last me a lifetime. Anything on BluRay ill grab from my HD movie channels on my TiVo. They typically look good enough for my avg joes eyes.

I think this will work quite well! Go Toshiba! :)
Of course you do.

Just like lower prices will work well. TL51 will work well. Buying Paramount will work well. Everything Toshiba has done has worked really, really well.

But you are forgetting some facts. You can purchase a brand new HD-DVD stand alone player for $100, and get 5 free movies. There are over one million HD-DVD players in homes already. The titles available for both formats are nearly equal on every popular online sales website. HD-DVD is a finalized format and won't have playback issues like Blu-Ray when 2.0 is adopted. HD-DVD has better interactive features. Paramount and Universal are STILL putting out exclusives on HD-DVD (Ouch!). Indie film makers prefer HD-DVD's cheaper manufacturing costs to Blu-Ray. The list goes on and on. An add reaching 90,000,000 people CAN make a difference.

+1

and a bit off topic though that I got a confirmation this morning that Triple Layer 51g will really play on current players. :) and an anonymous pm'ing that he has seen all my emails to Toshiba and matches what I have mentioned on the email and tells me that TL51 will actually work on current players.

Is the XA2 an over priced upscaler? it is better than $3,500 Denon DVD players.

Actually it's not, the Denon uses a 10-bit Realta chip, which is better than the Reon.

I would be happy with NPD data from the week after the last group of figures we got.

Since that was the one with the new prices that are saving HD DVD.

The week that the players dropped the sales figures were 83:17. Those numbers were posted Friday. It helped HD DVD go from 15% to 17%. The Friday numbers will be similar or even worse then the last two week. Putting numbers like this up to one solid month. Not to mention starting Jan of last year BD has won 55 weeks consecutive and should easily have another one this week giving it 56 straight weeks. That is 13 straight months of total domination. Now studios and retailers are jumping ship. I am still puzzled how ONE 30 second commercial is going to erase all of this that has and is happening.

But you are forgetting some facts. You can purchase a brand new HD-DVD stand alone player for $100, and get 5 free movies. There are over one million HD-DVD players in homes already. The titles available for both formats are nearly equal on every popular online sales website. HD-DVD is a finalized format and won't have playback issues like Blu-Ray when 2.0 is adopted. HD-DVD has better interactive features. Paramount and Universal are STILL putting out exclusives on HD-DVD (Ouch!). Indie film makers prefer HD-DVD's cheaper manufacturing costs to Blu-Ray. The list goes on and on. An add reaching 90,000,000 people CAN make a difference.

+1

and a bit off topic though that I got a confirmation this morning that Triple Layer 51g will really play on current players. :) and an anonymous pm'ing that he has seen all my emails to Toshiba and matches what I have mentioned on the email and tells me that TL51 will actually work on current players. Link here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=985565)

There are over 13 million SACD players in homes already, not including the PS3.


One million is a small pittance, easily ignored by companies that want to sell 8 million copies of a disc in one week.

Bad analogy. Those CD players were sold as CD players. SACD is just a feature.

The attach rate of HD DVD versus BD shows this. PS3 is sold as a gaming machine. BD player is a feature. It takes a hell of a lot of PS3 sales to sell the same amount of BD's as it does an HD DVD SAL.

The week that the players dropped the sales figures were 83:17. Those numbers were posted Friday. It helped HD DVD go from 15% to 17%. The Friday numbers will be similar or even worse then the last two week. Putting numbers like this up to one solid month. Not to mention starting Jan of last year BD has won 55 weeks consecutive and should easily have another one this week giving it 56 straight weeks. That is 13 straight months of total domination. Now studios and retailers are jumping ship. I am still puzzled how ONE 30 second commercial is going to erase all of this that has and is happening.

I don't know about total domination...

it's .4% v .6% of a much larger pie.

sales of both are dismal, and much slower than studios had hoped.

I guess I am just a movie fan. I want 100% access to all HDM titles. If I were on a "side" I'd be limiting my choices.

I picked a side to not limit my future choices.

See SACD and DVD-Audio.

It's like "can I get a frikkin' bone here?"

Had one side won, it may have been different.

Are you kidding?

85:15
83:17

Yeah, real worried about one 30 second Super Bowl commercial when three days worth of $99 players couldn't turn the software sales around for HD DVD.

For the amount on people that will watch the Super Bowl World-Wide, this the cheapest way to advertise at only 2.7 Million. But I guess the BD group was a bit slow on that one and has a lot of BD fans upset about it. I could only imagine if the BD group took the Super Bowl spot what the fan base for this would be, but they didn't and they will get burned.

...Angelo

Maxpower,

Given the size of the companies you listed, Toshiba's earnings are good. When construction begins on new nuclear plants you'll see Toshiba's earnings gain tremendous momentum. HD-DVD is only a small part of Toshiba's portfolio.

3% growth in the most important quarter of the year for a CE company is not good, whichever way you look at it.

As for Westinghouse, well, contracts worth about $4-5bn have been signed but the money will be paid over a very long time and by governments. Don't get me wrong, I think nuclear is a great investment for Toshiba, but at their core they are still a CE and semi-conductor company, and unfortunately they are not doing as well as they should in either. Fair enough semi-conductors are out of their control, they have no influence on memory chip prices, but they can drop HD DVD to help their bottom line and I can tell you now that everyone in this industry has been telling them to do so now that winning the format war is out of reach, a stalemate helps nobody.

+1

and a bit off topic though that I got a confirmation this morning that Triple Layer 51g will really play on current players. :) and an anonymous pm'ing that he has seen all my emails to Toshiba and matches what I have mentioned on the email and tells me that TL51 will actually work on current players. Link here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=985565)

Excellent! Maybe they can rerelease Transformers and fit lossless audio on it!

Actually it's not, the Denon uses a 10-bit Realta chip, which is better than the Reon.

Have you read technical articles of Reon v Realta? Have you read Silcon Optix's own opinion of the two versus each other for DVD playback? Specs aren't everything...

The week that the players dropped the sales figures were 83:17. Those numbers were posted Friday. It helped HD DVD go from 15% to 17%. The Friday numbers will be similar or even worse then the last two week. Putting numbers like this up to one solid month. Not to mention starting Jan of last year BD has won 55 weeks consecutive and should easily have another one this week giving it 56 straight weeks. That is 13 straight months of total domination. Now studios and retailers are jumping ship. I am still puzzled how ONE 30 second commercial is going to erase all of this that has and is happening.

It really depends imo on how long or how much stock the CE's have to bundle the players with their TV sets. Now if they continue to push 1.1 players with 2000 dollar sets they have a gold mine. It is just a matter of how much they want to bundle the players. The article i read this morning clearly indicated the ridiculous surge in players was due to bundling of TVs with BluRay players, most of them 1.0 profile. In other words like many Blu fans pointed out when A2s were 100 bucks at Walmart. This is a clearance action on outdate players not moving worth a knob.

Should be interesting to see if the CE's keep up the full court press or if they back off and try to push 399-599 BluRay standalones. Ill be awfully surprised if a 399 player outsells a 99 dollar player on merit alone. But anything can happen in this world.

thank you

^^^

need for last word:)