I was just trying to figure out what the best resolution setting for a xbox 360 is for a tv who's native res is 1366x768. When you hook a 360 up to vga the closest resolution is 1360x768. If you set the 360 to 1360 the TV is going to have to upscale. Is it better to set the resolution to a higher one on the 360 (1080) and let the TV downscale?

There's no simple answer here. Everyone's AV setup is different, so it depends on a lot of different factors. Even if your display is 768p, its scaler could vary quite a bit in quality, and overscan or underscan can change things up a bit if you don't have 1:1 pixel mapping.

The best answer I can give you is to trust your own eyes. Test out a bunch of different settings and see what you see.

As for my setup, I've also got a 768p display, but I'm connected via HDMI (passed through my AVR). My set (a 32" Aquos) does a much better job of downscaling 1080i than upscaling 720p, so I have it at 1080i in the 360's display settings.

If your TV has a 1:1 mode then set it to 1360*768 and be done, if not you will have to do some visual testing like confidenceman said.

I have a 32 inch Sony S2010 LCD TV that is 1366x768 and I set my XBOX 360 for 720p output. If your TV is 1366x768 it will usually call itself 720p Native, even though it is not exactly (minimal difference...1280x720 = 720p).

A general rule of thumb is that you want your TV to have to work less to produce a picture. 720p output will do this for you in this situation.

- if you set the xbox to 1080p it will not work at all...
- if you set the xbox to 1080i your TV will have to reduce it from 1920x1080 down to 1366x768...and it will have to change it from Interlaced to Progressive Scan.
- if you set the xbox for 720p your TV will only have to change it from 1280x720 up to 1366x768, and it won't have to change it from (I) Interlaced to (P) Progressive Scan...

Use your judgement as to what looks best of course, because there are many other factors than just this for the best picture...

I chose option 3 for my best setup

I have a Westing House HDTV, here is the link, westinghousedigital.com/details.aspx?itemnum=18. I am using a VGA connection and what do you guys think would be a good setting to set the "Display Settings" too? The TV has a native resolution of 1366x768. Thanks.

I have a Westing House HDTV, here is the link, westinghousedigital.com/details.aspx?itemnum=18. I am using a VGA connection and what do you guys think would be a good setting to set the "Display Settings" too? The TV has a native resolution of 1366x768. Thanks.

Most TVs, but not all, that have a native resolution of 1366 x 768, will do 1:1 pixel mapping with VGA connection, if you set the xbox to 1360 x 768. Then there is no scaling at all, since the TV simply leaves 3 black pixels at the beginning and end of each line. Most people don't even notice the 3 pixel window box.

P.J.

Westies (and most other HDTVs that support WXGA over VGA) run native, 1-t0-1 at 1360x768. You get a couple black pixel columns on either side, nothing anybody can notice. The way I hear it, the VGA spec requires horizontal resolutions that are multiples of 8; 1360 is--1366 isn't.

Choosing a resolution for WXGA displays really depends on the individual set and the viewer's eyes.
- First rule is you don't want overscan. If your display has no zero-overscan option everything else is irrelevant; the 5-10% overscan means nothing you do is going to make much difference. Some games could even lose part of the HUD.
- Second rule is that if the set has limited zero-overscan, go with whatever port and resolution gets you zero-overscan. Some folks find stretched XGA to be preferable to overscanned 720. Your eyes, your call.
- Third rule, if you have a choice of zero-overscan ports, is that HDMI > DVI > VGA > component > everything else.
- Fourth rule, none of the above matters as much as going from SD to HD or properly calibrating your set; its all about the last 5% or so image quality so don't sweat it overmuch.

Best thing to do is spend as much time as possible gaming instead of fretting the specs and settings.

"HDMI > DVI"

Um, same thing. HDMI isn't greater than DVI.

A general rule of thumb is that you want your TV to have to work less to produce a picture. 720p output will do this for you in this situation.Not to be difficult, but this isn't true. It's no more "work" for your scaler to downscale 1080i to 768p or for it to upscale 720p to 768p. The difference in number is meaningless. Processing is processing, and it depends wholly on the scaling tech of your display and whatever else your video signal is passing through (like an AVR).

As I said above, the more correct rule of thumb for most scalers is that they tend to do a better job of downscaling than upscaling. But the differences can be rather marginal, so again, trust your own eyes. The difference on my set, though, is pretty substantial and easily visible even to untrained eyes. If you can't tell a difference, then don't worry about it.

Use your judgement as to what looks best of course, because there are many other factors than just this for the best picture...Yes.

It's no more "work" for your scaler to downscale 1080i to 768p or for it to upscale 720p to 768p.


wrong.

de-interlacing AND then downscaling is much more "work" than just upscaling, and will produce a worse picture

wrong.

de-interlacing AND then downscaling is much more "work" than just upscaling, and will produce a worse picture

hmm...not necessarily. It's possible for a set to deinterlace simply by discarding half the lines of 1080i and then up/down scale 1920 x 540 to 1280 x 720. I'm not saying it's a good way to do it, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if some sets do it that way. That method neatly side-steps the need for sophisticated deinterlacing, at the expense of vertical resolution.

P.J.

wrong.

de-interlacing AND then downscaling is much more "work" than just upscaling, and will produce a worse pictureI'd also happily invite you over to my place to show you exactly how stark the difference is. Trust me, the PQ is substantially better when I have my set downscale and deinterlace rather than upscale.

Granted, it's wholly dependent on your set's processing abilities (as I've said above), but unless you've got a pretty good display (I'd call mine low- to mid-range at best, plus it's over a year old), this will generally be the case across the board.

EDIT: Here's a recent thread detailing some of the ins and outs of scaling for a 768p set:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=974423

maybe some sets will handle it differently, but if you look at what is actually going on, you're taking 720p(or 640p) rendered, up(down)scaling AND interlacing to 1080i (i'm actually not sure what process the 360 uses to accomplish this), de-interlacing to 540p and then "downscaling" (actually upscaling) to 768p

rather than outputting 720p and upscaling to 768p.

but with all things, i guess its mostly situation/equipment dependant.

so i'll say as many others have said before.... try them both, see what YOU like better.

Always set your TV to whatever looks best not whatever should look best. Trust your eyes. Only then can you be truly satisfied.:)

Most TVs, but not all, that have a native resolution of 1366 x 768, will do 1:1 pixel mapping with VGA connection, if you set the xbox to 1360 x 768. Then there is no scaling at all, since the TV simply leaves 3 black pixels at the beginning and end of each line. Most people don't even notice the 3 pixel window box.

How about 1:1 over HDMI?

My set (Olevia 237t) has a 1:1 mode for all inputs. When I set my PC (hooked up via VGA) to 1360x768 and set the TV to 1:1 I get what you are describing above.

When I set my 360 (hooked up via HDMI) to 1360x768 and set the TV to 1:1 I get a "windowed" image - about 1/2" to 3/4" of black space on all sides.

The TV reports both inputs as 768p, but obviously there's something going on that's different between the PC / VGA and 360 / HDMI combos that should be putting out the same resolution.

How about 1:1 over HDMI?

My set (Olevia 237t) has a 1:1 mode for all inputs. When I set my PC (hooked up via VGA) to 1360x768 and set the TV to 1:1 I get what you are describing above.

When I set my 360 (hooked up via HDMI) to 1360x768 and set the TV to 1:1 I get a "windowed" image - about 1/2" to 3/4" of black space on all sides.

The TV reports both inputs as 768p, but obviously there's something going on that's different between the PC / VGA and 360 / HDMI combos that should be putting out the same resolution.

Underscan like you're encountering is seen with some sets, but it's more common to encounter over-scan, if 1:1 is not achieved. My set (Sceptre 37" 1080P) overscans native resolution input on HDMI using RGB or YCbCr colorspace, but does 1:1 if I force "DVI" mode which only accepts RGB colorspace. I don't know why it cares, but it does what it does. Unfortunately, my Samsung blu-ray player cannot be made to output RGB colorspace. So, I can't use "DVI" mode for that.

I suppose I should ask what happens with the 360 input to the Olevia via HDMI, if you don't select 1:1 mode?

P.J.

Most likely 1360x768 will be best. Your TV should pixel map and leave a thin row of pixels blank.

"HDMI > DVI"

Um, same thing. HDMI isn't greater than DVI.
Really? I didn't realize that the DVI interface was capable of passing audio signals...

Now I think I know what you meant to say but methinks you probably should have worded it a bit differently, so as to not unintentionally imply that both HDMI and DVI do the same thing. ;)

Out of 2 1366x768 tv sets I have had, both performed better with 1080i content than 720p content, ironically. These sets are labeled as 720p sets, yet 1080i keeps more detail, and their de-interlacing is perfect (aside from upscaling sd-dvds to 1080i on the 360).

The right de-interlacing is capturing both fields and producing one whole image, then downscaling. It looks MUCH better than just getting a 1280x720 progressive image that upscales.

Really? I didn't realize that the DVI interface was capable of passing audio signals...

Now I think I know what you meant to say but methinks you probably should have worded it a bit differently, so as to not unintentionally imply that both HDMI and DVI do the same thing. ;)

actually the interface IS capable of passing audio signals, but you probably wont find a port that will accept them.

Get a CRT. :D

Most TVs, but not all, that have a native resolution of 1366 x 768, will do 1:1 pixel mapping with VGA connection, if you set the xbox to 1360 x 768. Then there is no scaling at all, since the TV simply leaves 3 black pixels at the beginning and end of each line. Most people don't even notice the 3 pixel window box.

P.J.
so you mean that if i have a 1366x768 HDTV, and i set the resolution to 1360x768 in the dashboard of my 360, i should have 3 black pixels on the left side and 3 black pixels on the right side of the screen?

i'm only asking because my Vizio doesn't have a 1:1 setting, but it does have a Horizontal Size setting on the RGB input, so i can adjust it that way to get the perfect ratio picture with the 3 black pixles on the left and right side, but if i do that than my desktop is also going to be off by those same 3 black pixels on the left and right side. but then again, i'm guessing it's crunching a 16:10 ratio PC desktop onto the 16:9 ratio HDTV screen anyway, since it seems like it automatically adjusts any image to fill the 16:9 screen...

am i right by saying this?

so you mean that if i have a 1366x768 HDTV, and i set the resolution to 1360x768 in the dashboard of my 360, i should have 3 black pixels on the left side and 3 black pixels on the right side of the screen?

i'm only asking because my Vizio doesn't have a 1:1 setting, but it does have a Horizontal Size setting on the RGB input, so i can adjust it that way to get the perfect ratio picture with the 3 black pixles on the left and right side, but if i do that than my desktop is also going to be off by those same 3 black pixels on the left and right side. but then again, i'm guessing it's crunching a 16:10 ratio PC desktop onto the 16:9 ratio HDTV screen anyway, since it seems like it automatically adjusts any image to fill the 16:9 screen...

am i right by saying this?

If you send a 1360x768 signal to a 1366x768 TV and use the 1:1 setting (or pixel map or dot by dot or whatever your TV calls it) then there will be no scaling and you will have three vertical rows of pixels blank on each side of the screen which should be pretty unnoticeable. Your desktop will be fine, just tell your computer to output 1366x768 or 1360x768 and you'll get the same thing. Computers don't output 16:10 resolutions, they output the resolution you tell them to.

Your desktop will be fine, just tell your computer to output 1366x768 or 1360x768 and you'll get the same thing. Computers don't output 16:10 resolutions, they output the resolution you tell them to.
ok, it's just that this stuff starts to get very confussing after a while. the reason i was asking was because i know that widescreen PC monitors are 16:10 ratio, and widescreen HDTV's are 16:9 ratio, so i was under the impression that if i was using a HDTV as a PC monitor that the :1 that the PC monitor would have would be lost somehow since the HDTV is :1 smaller...

basically, the bottom line is that if i use VGA with my 360 i have 3 options:

1. having a correct ratio PC desktop, but in turn having the 360 horizontally stretched out those 3 pixels on each side, or

2. modify the disply settings so that the 360 has the correct ratio by adjusting the horizontal image, but in turn having the PC desktop horizontally crunched those same 3 pixels on each side...

and yes, i know i am probably making this much a bigger deal than i should, but i want to try to get everything the correct ratio and i know that i can't with the TV that i'm using since there are no picture ratio settings...

Underscan like you're encountering is seen with some sets, but it's more common to encounter over-scan, if 1:1 is not achieved. My set (Sceptre 37" 1080P) overscans native resolution input on HDMI using RGB or YCbCr colorspace, but does 1:1 if I force "DVI" mode which only accepts RGB colorspace. I don't know why it cares, but it does what it does. Unfortunately, my Samsung blu-ray player cannot be made to output RGB colorspace. So, I can't use "DVI" mode for that.

I suppose I should ask what happens with the 360 input to the Olevia via HDMI, if you don't select 1:1 mode?

P.J.

Weird. I had replied to this, and now it's gone. Oh well.

I did notice last night that the Olevia reports the PC input over VGA as 1360x768 and the 360 input over HDMI as "768p".

From your post and what little I know about colorspace, isn't the analog VGA input in YCbCr and the HDMI in RGB? Is there a way to force the 360 over HDMI to do RGB? Maybe the set would properly detect the input as 1360x768 instead of "768p" and handle the 1:1 correctly.

Part of me thinks that the "768p" input is getting scaled down to 720p by my set and then stretched back out when I select the "full" mode as opposed to 1:1. If that's the case wouldn't I be better off setting the 360 to output true 720p to get rid of the initial downscaling?

ok, it's just that this stuff starts to get very confussing after a while. the reason i was asking was because i know that widescreen PC monitors are 16:10 ratio, and widescreen HDTV's are 16:9 ratio, so i was under the impression that if i was using a HDTV as a PC monitor that the :1 that the PC monitor would have would be lost somehow since the HDTV is :1 smaller...

basically, the bottom line is that if i use VGA with my 360 i have 3 options:

1. having a correct ratio PC desktop, but in turn having the 360 horizontally stretched out those 3 pixels on each side, or

2. modify the disply settings so that the 360 has the correct ratio by adjusting the horizontal image, but in turn having the PC desktop horizontally crunched those same 3 pixels on each side...

and yes, i know i am probably making this much a bigger deal than i should, but i want to try to get everything the correct ratio and i know that i can't with the TV that i'm using since there are no picture ratio settings...

You're overthinking this. Your PC can put out whatever desktop aspect ratio you wish. There aren't any significant limitations. If you tell the PC to put out 1360 x 768, that is ~1.75:1 aspect ratio, which is near enough to 16:9 HDTV standard 1.77777777:1, that you will never notice anything, except the 3 rows of black pixels on the left and right edge of the screen. It makes zero difference that a PC wide screen monitor is usually 16:10 aspect ratio. Your PC is not locked into that. In fact, if you use a a DVI, HDMI, or VGA cable, to the monitor, the PC will query the monitor to find out what exact pixel resolutions it supports and only offer those choices to the user. Same for the XBOX. The monitor tells the XBOX what resolutions it supports and the XBOX offers those choices. You should pick the one matching the native resolution of your tv and hope that your TV does 1:1 pixel mapping like every PC computer monitor ever built does.

P.J.

Weird. I had replied to this, and now it's gone. Oh well.

I did notice last night that the Olevia reports the PC input over VGA as 1360x768 and the 360 input over HDMI as "768p".

From your post and what little I know about colorspace, isn't the analog VGA input in YCbCr and the HDMI in RGB? Is there a way to force the 360 over HDMI to do RGB? Maybe the set would properly detect the input as 1360x768 instead of "768p" and handle the 1:1 correctly.

Part of me thinks that the "768p" input is getting scaled down to 720p by my set and then stretched back out when I select the "full" mode as opposed to 1:1. If that's the case wouldn't I be better off setting the 360 to output true 720p to get rid of the initial downscaling?

I've never seen VGA do YCbCr colorspace. I don't think it's even possible. HDMI can do both RGB and YCbCr. Some TVs report to the source device that they support both, while others only support YCbCr. I'm not certain, but I believe the 360 prefers RGB on HDMI connections. So, if the TV reports that is supports both, you get RGB. As for why your TV shows a 1/2 to 3/4 border around the edge when selecting 1:1 mode, I can't say, but I'll bet if you call up Olevia and ask, they either know, or can find out. It would be quite strange if it is scaling anything in 1:1 mode, as that would be an oxymoron. If it's doing 1:1, it can't be scaling, by definition.

P.J.

Weird. I had replied to this, and now it's gone. Oh well.

I did notice last night that the Olevia reports the PC input over VGA as 1360x768 and the 360 input over HDMI as "768p".

From your post and what little I know about colorspace, isn't the analog VGA input in YCbCr and the HDMI in RGB? Is there a way to force the 360 over HDMI to do RGB? Maybe the set would properly detect the input as 1360x768 instead of "768p" and handle the 1:1 correctly.

Part of me thinks that the "768p" input is getting scaled down to 720p by my set and then stretched back out when I select the "full" mode as opposed to 1:1. If that's the case wouldn't I be better off setting the 360 to output true 720p to get rid of the initial downscaling?

768p *is* 1360x768. They are the same thing.

768p *is* 1360x768. They are the same thing.

What I'm saying is that I find it odd that the set is reporting "1360x768" on one input, and "768p" on the other. I'm guessing it's a difference between the set's handling of HDMI vs. VGA. I'd love to have a DVI->VGA cable to verify this.

It's really not a big deal to me, everything looks great, just curious more than anything.

What I'm saying is that I find it odd that the set is reporting "1360x768" on one input, and "768p" on the other. I'm guessing it's a difference between the set's handling of HDMI vs. VGA. I'd love to have a DVI->VGA cable to verify this.

It's really not a big deal to me, everything looks great, just curious more than anything.

VGA is usually meant for PC's, so the TV is reporting the full resolution. HDMI is usually for TV and video sources, so it's reporting that res in a simplified way, as 768p.

If you use a DVI to VGA adapter, the TV will say 1360x768, because it will be plugged into the VGA port.

VGA is usually meant for PC's, so the TV is reporting the full resolution. HDMI is usually for TV and video sources, so it's reporting that res in a simplified way, as 768p.

If you use a DVI to VGA adapter, the TV will say 1360x768, because it will be plugged into the VGA port.

That's pretty much how I figured it'd go.

I was just trying to figure out what the best resolution setting for a xbox 360 is for a tv who's native res is 1366x768. When you hook a 360 up to vga the closest resolution is 1360x768. If you set the 360 to 1360 the TV is going to have to upscale. Is it better to set the resolution to a higher one on the 360 (1080) and let the TV downscale?

If your TV has VGA input, then the TV will NOT scale the picture. It will put up 6 black or grey lines and you will get 1:1 pixel mapping.

So set the Xbox 360 to 1360x768.