I'm in the process of shopping for a new projector. But as I sort through all the options and various technologies, it seems to me that each technology has various "flaws" that many people find unforgivable. But these flaws are rarely, if ever, mentioned in any of the professional reviews.

I'd like to get these "dirty little secrets" out in the open before I make a decision. Feel free to add the list. I'll update my OP with valid/non-duplicate comments from subsequent posters.

Also, remember that I am dealing with generalities, so I may step on a few toes with my comments. All technologies are getting better, but old "generalities" die hard. Also, for the DLP discussion, I am omitting the 3 chip variety. They are relatively rare and very expensive and should probably be in their own category.

DLP Minuses

Rainbow effect - RBE (though this is less of a problem now than several years ago)
Dithering artifacts (especially on bright colors)
Causes eye fatigue on some users (related to RBE??)
Can sometimes hear the color wheel spinning
Generally limited placement options (Few projectors have lens offsets -- some have vertical; none(??) have horizontal)
Screen door effect (Though not as bad as LCD. More visible due to very sharp focus??)


DLP Pluses

Very sharp focus
High native ANSI contrast ratio (though relatively low full on/off contrast ratio)
Generally available with a relatively short-throw lens (though this is a negative to some)
Vivid colors (maybe related to the sharp focus??)
Sealed light path (very "dust blob" resistant)
No misconvergence


---------------------------

LCD Minuses

Screen door effect (though this is less of a problem now than several years ago)
Video smearing for fast moving scenes (some find this very annoying especially on sports/games)
No sealed optical path (prone to "dust" blobs")
Generally low contrast ratios (new dynamic irises help)
Picture quality tends to degrade over time (polarizers fail, blacks get bluer, etc.)
Misconvergence of the RGB panels (e.g. white pixels show traces of separate R/G/B colors)


LCD Pluses

Sharp focus (though not as sharp as DLP)
Often available at very good prices
Generally available with a relatively long-throw lens (though this is a negative to some)
Very flexible placement options (vertical and horizontal lens offsets)


---------------------------

LCOS/DILA/SXRD Minuses

Relatively soft focus
Misconvergence of the RGB panels (e.g. white pixels show traces of separate R/G/B colors)
Video smearing for fast moving scenes (some find this very annoying especially on sports/games)
Uneven screen illumination (often has bright corners)
Generally more expensive than the other technologies


LCOS/DILA/SXRD Pluses

High native full on/off contrast ratio (though only average ANSI contrast ratio)
Generally available with a wide variety of lens "throws"
Very flexible placement options (vertical and horizontal lens offsets)
Vivid colors
Sealed light path (very "dust blob" resistant)


Aside from the list of positives and negatives. Each technology tends to have its own "look" that makes it almost immediately identifiable to a trained eye. The very traits some people love, others hate equally as much.

Ok, that's my list as best as I can recall while I type...

Hi ScottS,

While your intentions for this thread may very well be altruistic, the title is pretty provocative, and some of the points very debatable. It kinda looks like troll bait.

Jonathan

Seems as he presented it simply, doesn't hurt to see if some of the pros here can break things down further. Theres a few things that I'd like to hear more on like dithering - I guess this is the sparkle/shimmy effect you see in bight light graduation borders and the pj fights to blend the two to make it smooth looking.

LCD blurring can also be looked at as good because it mask some of the mpeg 2 compression issues that DLP exposes it almost can have a image processor effect sometimes as long as it's not to slow, it's one of the things I like about an LCD Sports image.

I haven't been paying attention enough to ANSI contrast to grasp it, so I'm open to hearing someone state why thats so big and how it works. I know it is I guess some say, "THE most important Contrast figure" when Known in a true amount(not the manufacture spec/hype).



Maybe he could add Misunderstood little secrets to the title < just a thought.

Thankyou very much for starting this thread. I was thinking of doing some thing similar.
A few comments, 3 chip DLP's and single panel LCD's should have there own catagories (just like you mentioned) Is there a good way to show which items are baised on the technology.

DLP- #3 could be labled as #1b
#5 Is not technology based
DLP+ #5 Not quite entirly true. (Dust can effect the picture. I have an old DLP and after taking it apart I noticed plenty of dust on the color wheel and lens [newer lens are much better] after cleaning it was like getting a new projector :) )

LCD+ #4 Is not technology baised

LCOS/DILA/SXRD- #5 Is not technology baised (Customer demand and technolgy developement/production issues ?)

A plus for your thread: this is the first time I have seen an unbiased comparison of projector technologies in one place.

A minus for your thread: an inaccurate and misleading title that will prevent people from finding your thread when they are looking for this type of discussion.

Yep misleading title. There is nothing dirty about those and they are no secrets.
They are all very well known and many of them are no longer an issue.

With 720/1080p if any one is complaining about SDE, he or she is sitting
2 feet from the screen.

There has to be some commitment from the manufacturer regarding fan, color
wheel noise. Try the Infocus IN72 or 76 then you will no longer consider
those as issues. I have my IN72 just some 3 feet from my seating, table
mounted. I dont hear any color wheel whining. The fan noise is like a
constant white noise and not at all loud to distract me even during news.


LCOS/DILA etc are for ball players so I dont know anything about them :-)
They dont belong in this forum anyway :-)

My intention is not to be troll bait. It's simply that when you read professional reviews, these topics are rarely discussed. It's as though they assume that you already know about them, or that they simply don't exist. The only ones that ever appear in reviews are discussions about contrast and mounting flexibility (lens offset and such).

As an example, from reading the professional reviews, you would think that you could buy any of dozens 720p or 1080p projectors and have one that will deliver the promise of Home Theater. But depending upon your very subjective sensitivities you may very well end up with a projector that "technically" throws a high quality picture which none-the-less you absolutely hate. If you are sensitive to RBE ad buy a DLP, you will be very unhappy. If you buy an LCD and the screen door catches your eye, you will be very unhappy. And if you buy an LCOS and the soft focus catches your eye, again you will be very unhappy. But these are rarely, if ever, discussed in reviews.

The Benq W10000, the Epson 1080 UB and the Sony VW40 all project a very high quality picture, but if you buy one sight unseen (based upon reviews) you might end up very unhappy with your choice.

So my point in creating this thread is to educate people about the pluses and minuses of each of the technologies (hopefully from an unbisased point-of-view) so when they go to see projectors in person, they can ask educated questions and let their eyes be the judge. Because these minuses will never be brought up by the salesman. Does the car salesman ever say, "Oh yeah, it's a great truck. But it only gets 8 MPG." It will never happen. You need to educate yourself.

Motororo2,

Let me respondto your comments:
DLP Minus - #3 could be labled as #1b?Possibly. But for me, I rarely see RBE. Even so, after I watch some DLPs, my eyes feel strained and tired. As though I was out in the snow (without sunglasses) on a bright day and I almost feel the need to squint. We have a DLP projection TV at work, and I can't look at it for more than 10 miuntes without feeling eye strain.

DLP Minus - #5 Is not technology based Agree. But it is true none-the-less for the vast majority of DLP projectors on the market. Few have vertical offset and none (that I know of) have horizontall offset. I agree it is not a limitation of DLP technology, but it is a limitation of DLP projectors, in general.


DLP Plus - Not quite entirly true. (Dust can effect the picture. I have an old DLP and after taking it apart I noticed plenty of dust on the color wheel and lens [newer lens are much better] after cleaning it was like getting a new projector :) )
Again true, most most modern DLP projectors (less than 2 or 3 years old) do have a sealed light path, so this is not a problem. If I made my list based upon 4 or 5 year old technology, there would be a lot fewer pluses and a lot more minuses for all technologies.

LCD Plus - #4 Is not technology baisedAgain, agreed. But it does hold true for most LCD projectors. if not the technology per se.

LCOS Minus - #5 Is not technology baised (Customer demand and technolgy developement/production issues ?)Again, agreed. But this is true for the implementation of the technology. The Sony VW40 is the cheapest LCOS projector I know of and its MSRP is $2999.

Maybe I should be more clear in that I am discussing not only the technologies, but also their most common implementations as well.

BTW, everyone is right. My title was poorly chosen. I have no excuse other than it was getting late. :rolleyes:

[EDIT]
I'm in the process of finishing my basement (dog-gone oak treads on the stairs are a lot of work -- nothing is straight and nothing is square), and have begun shopping for projectors. Each technology (and its most common implementations) have something unique that I like. But none of them have it all in one package. So I'm trying to sort through the options and this thread became one way of putting it down on paper (so to speak).

BTW sealed optics is not something you get in the cheap projectors.
Even the so called sealed optics in some cheap PJ's is not really sealed.
Have to hear the stories from people who own those so called sealed
optics projectors. Dust, hair etc is bound to get into any item if it
has an opening and if there is a fan.

So dust is infact a major issue in digital projectors, whether DLP or LCD.
I consider dust as the biggest problem until the LED's take over so that
the entire projector can be a sealed unit.

The reason the reviews dont talk about issues like rainbow or dust etc is
that they are well known. If a PJ really has sealed optics it would become
very apparent and will be out in the review. They do say how loud/quiet the
fan is in pretty much all reviews.


Unlike an average Joe who walks into BB or CC and buys the brightest and cheapest
TV, projectors are not for an average Joe. We are expected to do some home work
and know about the technology. For people who dont know the basics, there are
stuff in most web sites like projector central or propector people and of course a
google search will give a lot of those basic info. So reviewers dont write about
things most people are aware of.

If a projector has a 6 segment color wheel no one is going to write a comprehensive
review about rainbow as it becomes a non-issue except for a few unfortunate people
who will see rainbow no matter what.

Also I am not expected to buy a PJ first and then figure out how to place it
or configure it. I am expected to read the specs or read the manual (which are
made available in all manfufacturers web sites) and then figure out if the PJ will
work for me.

If I have only some 11 feet of space in my living room, I cant expect a projector
like IN72 to give me a 100'' image and then complain about this. I have to do the
math using the throw ratio that is made available before I buy the PJ.

Digital projection technology has been out there for over a decade now.
but in my opinion it is not yet as reliable as the good old CRT TV. I hate
the idea that a projector (bulb) will only last for some 2 yrs and after that I have
to spend some $400 for a new bulb or buy a new PJ. I had my 27inch
SONY WEGA for some 5yrs. I sold it just because it was too heavy for me to
keep hauling it around. I am sure it would have lasted for another 5 yrs,
maintenance free.

The problem is that people prefer a bigger image and more resolution and
connections than a quieter unit. So the manufacturers may not care much
about putting money into making quieter fans, color wheel etc. All they care
about is getting a cheapest 1080p unit with HDMI and a bright bulb.

I, on the other hand, am satisfied with some 74'' image from my IN72
as it is so quiet and doesnt distract me like the SP4805 or X1.
So I am not buying any other brand even though I could get a 720p DLP
for some $900. If I can get IN76 for $900 direct from Infocus I would buy it.

ScottS -- Your DLP "eyestrain" problem is because it's set too bright (the Contrast control is too high, and/or you're using the high-power lamp mode). I had to put a ND2 filter (gray filter that cuts the output by 50%) on both my current DLP and LCD PJs because I couldn't get the maximum output low enough - due to my screen (Da-Lite High-Power, gain =2.8 - bought when I had a very dim LCD PJ). This has nothing to do with the RBE issue.

Mupi -- Excellent comments & all true. You have to read, read, and read, before you buy. Most PJs in our catagory (under $3K) are not available from local B&M stores so they will be purchased sight unseen (Infocus being one exception in some areas). This makes it very important to do your homework.

Title is misleading.

Pros and Cons you list are common and so you obviously know what most any informed person knows considering buying a projector. Are you upgrading?

You never asked for help or opinions on any specific issue relative to your plan to buy a new projector. Most all of what you list actually are mentioned in professional and user reviews.

Don't know how you could step on toes since most of what you post is generally known.

No offense meant - what is the purpose of the thread except to summarize widely know infro re different pj technologies.

Nothing wrong with the OP's thread to me. It's a good start to helping new potential PJ owners a quick understanding of the range of "issues" associated with PJs. Sure, most of the long time AVSers here already know these things, but not everyone does or even knows where to look online to get the info quickly and easily. Come on, give the OP a break.

well if it is going to help new owners then the title has to be changed
to something more meaningful.
Like I said there is nothing dirty or secretive about those facts.

In all probability this thread will go to the 10th page in a few days
or few weeks and no new potential owners is going to get a
chance to see this thread. So what was the main intention of the OP?