I just sold my Panny 900 and it's time for a new projector. I can afford any of the below, but I don't want to pay for what I don't need, so I'd appreciate some opinions.


Partially light controlled room
106 DaLite Video Spectra 1.5 screen
Sit 13 feet back from screen
Projector mounted 15 feet back from screen


Video signals are HD Dish Net box, OTA HD, SD DVD upscaled (will move to BluRay when they drop below $200)

My initial candidates from most to least expensive:

Epson 1080 UB
Panny 2000U
Sanyo Z2000
Mits 4900
Panny AX200
Epson 720


As my 900 was barely bright enough, I think the Sanyo and Mits are off the list Too bad, because the price on both is right and both use inorganic panel materials which are touted to last longer. The complaints around here about Sanyo customer service has me a little wary also.

I think i'd take the Epson 1080 UB over the 1080 Panny so that leaves the high end Epson, and the two 720 candidates on the bottom.

I like a sharp picture, color saturation, and deep blacks (that sounds like I'm a DLP guy, but I prefer LCD. Besides, I need a lens shift feature). Both the light output and contrast ratios produced by the 720 candidates are (on paper at least) a big improvement over my old 900.

So given the $1700 price difference between the two extremes, will the picture fed by a BluRay disk be MUCH better at 13 feet with a 1080i projector vs. a high quality 720 machine? How about 720 signals? Better on the high end Eps? I'm curious if I'm going to notice a big improvement with the new Eps and Panny 720 models over my old 900.

I have to pull the trigger this week. Comments are appreciated. Sometimes I go too cheap and later regret it.
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t181/tweak48/DSC_0048.jpg

Im in the same boat as many and simply can't decide. I was sold on the AX200 but because of my screen size (140" 2.35) I think I must go 1080P. The Epson is priced too high IMO considering the pricing of the MITSU and SANYO. Yes the Epson is a better unit...but double the price?

Interested to see what you decide.

OP, it would be nice if you could hold out a bit longer.
Anyway, no DLP or LCOS love? You must have good reason.

You'll fall in love with the Epson 1080 UB.

Dan

The Mits would hold you over well. I had it for a few days with an AE2000 and the Mits was brighter in best mode. The HC4900 would perform well for you but without much HD as a source I'm not sure 1080 now would be a waste for you since you plan to upgrade later anyway. Perhaps a nice <1k 720 unit would serve you well. If you could get a 7210 to work in your room, you would have plenty of brightness. If not, there's always the ax200 for lumens.

Hi Tweak - just to clarify my PM:

1. Both the Epson 1080UB and Epson 720 have rebates ($200, $100 respectively) through the end of this month (the 10% off coupon will work only for the Epson 720 purchase at Epson.com).
2. Epson 1080UB comes with a spare bulb as part of its package.
3. Epson 720 offers a spare bulb as part of the temporary rebate promotion.
4. Mitsubishi 4900 offers a $500 rebate through the end of this month.

I vote on the Mitsubishi 4900. At the rate that technology is changing and prices are falling, at $1399 or so, it will tide you over for a couple of years and then you can get something even better.

The Optoma HD65 is under $1000 many places and has the advantage of being really small and really white (it would blend in with your wall color). I know it is 720p but it looks great to my eyes.

My friend brought over his Mits 4900 the other night and we compared it to my Panny 900. The Mits looked awesome, it is BRIGHT, and sharp with excellent colors! At the current price minus rebate it's an incredible deal. Some say the blacks aren't that great, but they looked good enough for me, especially for that kind of money. You have to spend twice what the Mits costs right now to get another projector that's even close.

If I was in that same situation (which I kinda am, but just not financially...unfortunately) I'd go for the Epson 1080UB. From everything I've read that is the under $3k projector to beat (Epson 1080UB Home).

For the listed projectors you have, I'd put them in order of:

Epson 1080UB
Sanyo Z2000
Panny AE2000u
Mitsu
Panny AX200
Epson 720

I'd also recommend checking out this sites' reviews on the projectors that you've mentioned. There's an extensive write-up on each one of them:

http://www.projectorreviews.com

I vote on the Mitsubishi 4900. At the rate that technology is changing and prices are falling, at $1399 or so, it will tide you over for a couple of years and then you can get something even better.


Hard to fight the logic here. I was just over at a member's theater watching his Mits 5000 and it exceeded my expectations. I'm guessing the 4900 isn't far behind. I'd give this one a long look.

How about some nice, dark paint for that home theater of yours??? ;)

You have a very nice setup, congrats. You seem like the kind of guy who values good taste and you want something that looks good (on the screen, I mean) so I think the 1080UB is a no-brainer. It's the best bang for the buck going right now and since you don't have white walls too close to your screen you'll really be able to appreciate the deep blacks of the unit.

If you can afford the 3 grand go for it - none of the others will match it for image quality and I don't think you want to go home with something less than what you want.

Thanks for all the inputs. I decided to go with Epson (from the factory store) because they have by far the best service and also an easy upgrade path.

From reading all the reviews, the Epson 720 overall was rated better than the Panny 200.

Clearly, the Epson 1080UB is the one to beat in the under $3k 1080 category. I like a bright picture, and the Mits and Sanyo (although cost effective) just won't cut it in my only moderately light controlled room.

So, I ordered a Epson 720. After selling my Panny 900, the out of pocket upgrade for me is $319. That's for a new, brighter projector with better contrast AND a replacement lamp.

I'm expecting a HUGE improvement over my 900. With Epson's return policy, if it's not good enough, I'll return it and buck up for a 1080UB.

Hey tweak tell me what you think about the Epson 720 when it comes in. I'm on the fence between the Epson 720 and the Epson Home cinema 1080UB. I just can't see spending the extra 1300 on the UB if it's not going to be a big improvement over the 720.

I'll be sitting 12.5ft from a 106 inch screen. With good ambient light control.

Im in the same situation you guys are in, like you I considered :
* Epson 1080 UB ( contender: best under 3000)
* Panny 2000U (eliminated: highly priced in canada)
* Sanyo Z2000 (eliminated: brightness/focus issues)
* Mits 4900 (eliminated: highly priced in canada)
* Panny AX200 (eliminated: highly priced in canada)
* Epson 720 (contender: best value)

I will not be watching to much of 1080p hd content, most the time ill probably be watching upconverted dvd's and 720p/1080i cable broadcasts. If money were no object, hands down, 1080ub, but considering the money you save you can get yourself a fine projector several years down the line for the difference or invest in some home theater components now. At 1200, the hc720 and a free bulb is a deal that is hard to pass up.

The major concern I have with the hc720 is the screen door, ive read its not an issue at about 1.5 screen widths. I will be projecting on to an 8 foot wide screen with seating situated at 11-12 feet. Ive read through the hc720 projector thread and many people with simular setups say it is not a concern, which is good news.

I got the Epson 720 about 15-20 days ago (still in the 30 day window). Every feature of this unit is exceptional - this is my first projector - a friend of mine has had a projector but it has seemed very dull, blurry and without any significant light output (dont know his brand - but that had been my perception all along about projectors in general). The Epson 720 changed all that - very good contrast, eye popping color, very bright, plenty of parameters/adjustments. The unit is built extremely well - like a tank.

There are a couple of things that seem to be issues for me - the SD performance is ok, and, I wish the sharpness was a little little bit better (I have no reference for sharpness) especially on HD content. I use Dish HD 720p as my measuring stick for HD.

I dont have blu-ray but I will be getting a player soon, hopefully it will make a difference. I don't want to invest in the Epson 1080UB, as you folks say, not worth the incremental quality for the extra $$ spent - but seriously considering a Mitsubishi HC4900 - my only concern with the Mitsubishi is brightness - it can output no more than 1000 lumens on paper (while the Epson 720 does 1600 lumens).

Mitsubishi seems like a good option for future proofing - but dont know if that is worthwhile, considering that it might be necessary to get a new projector after 3-4 years especially if the cost of the bulb overshadows the incremental cost of getting a newer, better technology unit.

I have read in these forums though that the Mistubishi's Econ mode outputs a litte better light (approx 450-500 lumens) than the Epson's Theater Dark1 (normal viewing) mode (approx 400-450 lumens). From all indications, the Mitsubishi HC4900 is relatively sharper - which is important to me. I tried the Epson 720 around 12pm during the day at full lumen output in Dynamic mode and the picture was very watchable - amazing, I have never seen a projector output so much light for daytime watching. I am not sure if you can watch the Mistubishi 4900 at full power with plenty of ambient light.

With the Epson 720, I see absolutely no screen door, on a 100" Matte 16:9 1.1 screen, seated around 11' from the screen.

Ultimately, it is an issue of your budget, watching habits and personal preferences/expectations. I need to decide quickly which way I should go :D

Get the epson! I did and am glad.

Also if you get the Epson Pro model (3999) from avs store you get a 1000 store credit SO if you need other stuff it makes the pro the price of the home. (free ceiling mount, extra bulb and black case).

To tweak48, mushi_mushi. What did you end up doing? I am particularly interested in how your new projector compares to the AE900, which I have.

depends, if you plan to not have a Bluray players in the next 3-4 years go 720p. 1080p will not do much good on SD, other then smaller grid size and more opacity to the screen.

And you should consider than the 1080ub have a Qc issue, lots of people are reporting exchanging machine upto 5 times (look in the UB thread) some are correct, some are not.

Since you seem in 100% control of you're lightning, i wouldn't put down the lower brithness model. I had a Z4 witch is very low quoted and never had a single problem with it (100% light controlled room)

To tweak48, mushi_mushi. What did you end up doing? I am particularly interested in how your new projector compares to the AE900, which I have.

I thought I had my mind set on the epson HC720 but the more and more I read the epson hc720 thread, it becomes clear that just like so many other LCD projectors it has quality control issues of its own. The one thing that has been pointed out by many is that epsons return/exchange policy is second to none, so if you get a dud you can always exchange it for another machine.

Since I have a restrictive setup LCD is my only choice. I was quick to rule out many LCD projectors based on the fact that there exists a high markup in price when compared to the same product which is sold in the states. Had there not been such a high price discrepancy I might have went went one of the other units.

With all that said I still think an epson projector is the right one for me. Part of the reason im holding back my purchase for a few months is that I have not purchased all the home audio equipment/seating for my home theater. I think by that time the deal on the 720 will be over, likewise prices on the 1080ub will continue to fall, and maybe i'll purchase it when some of the quality control issues have been resolved.

Im having a really hard time not purchasing the hc720 because I know I wont see a better deal for a 720p machine anywhere for a few months (at least in canada) but since I got a few months until I purchase the rest of my HT stuff I dont want to be to hasty and purchase a projector to soon.

To be fair each of these projector have very satisfied owners, and in each case a few people probably have some buyers remorse and wish they would have bought something else. Im sure for first time buyers and those that still have projectors that are several years old it will be hard to be disappointed regardless of the projector we decide to go with.

I was quick to rule out many LCD projectors based on the fact that there exists a high markup in price when compared to the same product which is sold in the states. Had there not been such a high price discrepancy I might have went went one of the other units.


The AE900 is my 4th Panasonic projector, and because of the high markups in Canada, I got all of them from our friend in Japan :). Unfortunately it looks like he is no longer in business, since he did not reply to my last message, and his website prices are way out of date.

But my importing experience has been all positive, and I will likely go that route again, but this time from the U.S. There is no duty on projectors, so you only pay PST/GST. And as long as you avoid UPS, the brokerage fee is very reasonable.

Have fun on finishing your theatre construction.

While going through the US is certainly not a bad option the only concern I would have is if you have a bad unit. I assume you would have to purchase a unit using a credit card thats registered to a US resident (need a US address to be eligible for rebates). If you were to have problems you would have to send the projector to your pal in the US, who would then forward the package to the manufacturer. Thats just my understanding of the process, I might be mistaken.

But it certainly is ridiculous how out of line some of these prices are up north. With the rapid change in projector technology I would probably prefer a cheaper 1080p solution like the mits 4900 to hold me over until the technology becomes more refined. However the mits 4900 is within a couple of hundred dollars within the price of the ub, which makes the choice a no brainer.

Out of curiosity which projector do you intend to go with? It sound like your going with a 1080p projector (AE2000). Even if you were to purchase this projector from a US dealer, you can get the 1080ub for about the same cost here in Canada.

Since you list deep blacks as being important, I would cross off the 4900.

I vote for the 1080UB espically with the 1k credit at the AVS store if you can swing the 4k it would be worth it. There are only three projectors in the same league with it as far as LCDs go the Sony mdoels and the RS2 and for the price you cant beat the epson. Hopefully you get a good unit if you go with it, there seems to be uniformity issues due to bad QC, but you can swap til you get a good one. Buy the Epson and you will be set for 3-4 years if you go 720p youll always want a 1080p model and want to upgrade alot sooner. I could be wrong but I think the Sony VW-40 is about as bright as the epson in its best mode so unless you want to watch with the lights on you could always check that out. Same price as the Epson I do believe.

Just my thoughts
Rahimlee54

I thought that AVS stopped carrying the 1080ub pro, due to epson's policies/issues with quality control. I know that AVS still carries the 1080ub home model. Even with this deal ive already purchased most of my theater equipment so im not sure what I would use the credit for.

If I had a setup that could accommodate a cheap (price wise) dlp I would get the mits hc1500. Im going to watch at a bit less then 1.5x screen width, and as such sde is a concern. Im going to get a NAS sever and fill it with 720P x264 files and that will be my primary source of HD viewing, there arnt that many 1080p sources to take advantage of the resolution (besides blu-ray).

The problem with the 1080ub is they have a bunch of quality control issues, but if you can exchange it for a unit within spec it becomes more of a hassle than a major concern. I intend to wait a couple of months, by then I hope that some issues are sorted out.

Prices on 1080p units continue to drop, in a few months the 1080 ub will probably be a at a 2400-2500 dollar price point with an additional bulb. Maybe its wishfull thinking but at least thats the way I see things going. if not within the next 3 months within the next 5 for sure. At least in the US you guys have some options, here in Canada the choices are alot more limited.

I own an Epson HC400, and I'm thinking of upgrading to the Mits 4900. While others may have better blacks and shadow detail, the Mits is the equal of Darkchip 2 PJs, which really isn't bad. In return for not getting the absolute greatest blacks, however, you're getting a feature-packed 1080P machine for under $1400 after rebate, not bad! The best part is the Mits has motorized zoom, focus, and lens shift. This allows a "poor mans" CIH setup, which eliminates black bars. With your screen you just pull it down a bit less for widescreen movies, and use the remote to adjust the image. That alone is worth the price of admission, IMO!

Out of curiosity which projector do you intend to go with? It sound like your going with a 1080p projector (AE2000). Even if you were to purchase this projector from a US dealer, you can get the 1080ub for about the same cost here in Canada.

I have eliminated the DLPs from contention due to their limited zoom range (BenQ W5000 & Optima H80).

I am tempted by the HC4900. Even in Canada, you can get it for under $2K, and the power focus, zoom, and shift is great because I want to go constant height.

But the Sanyo Z2000 and Epson 1080UB has greater zoom range (on the telephoto end). These are the 3 that are still in contention.

If Panasonic had kept the same ceiling bracket for the AE2000 as the AE900, I would have just went with it (no brainer). It is not cheap buying a new bracket, having someone remove the old one, install the new one, and patch/paint.