Official Samsung LNxxA650 Owner's Thread

[vinhdeizel]

Originally Posted by gmanvbva

Based on your symptoms, I would return it regardless, I think?!?

+1 I would return it regardless since it is defective and get the other tv you wanted.

[TEAMUS]

In reguards to lag. All games have some lag. I have my 360 hooked up via RGB and have minimal lag. When I do have lag it's because the "host" is laggy, and I ask if everyone else is lagging. Usually the answer is yes. Try asking the people your playing with if they are getting lag too. Just a suggestion. Good luck!

[VarmintCong]

Originally Posted by gmanvbva

On my 23" I average a 2-1 Kill ratio easily. When playing the the Sammy (HDMI renamed PC), I struggle to stay in the 1.0 - 1.35 area and I can consistently watch replays showing me only getting maybe 1-2 bullets off before being killed. While from my perspective (until the replay) I am getting 5-6+ shots off. Sometimes, on the replay, I am being killed without even getting a shot off. I can get in the 1.6 - 2.0 range for kill ratio, if I alter my play style and move much more methodically.

That is a huge difference, if you play in any competitive manner. I would estimate the lag is in the 80ms - 150ms range.

I may try hooking it up using component to see if there is any difference.

It is not exactly scientific but there is no doubt in my mind that there is a noticeable amount of lag being introduced.

A couple things to check - HDMI/PC must be HDMI2, and it must be 1080p. You can try game mode as well.

I'm using VGA for Halo 3 - and although I don't perceive lag, my lethality has taken a dive since getting rid of my HD CRT. In my case battle rifle rounds just don't hit people as often as before. Could be just the competition is getting tougher, network lag etc.

Is the Dell monitor 16:10? If so that means it's stretched vertically - this will throw off your aim a bit - but of course won't explain the replays.

[felonyr301]

Of course I have COD4 it's the online fps game out lol I play very competitive and if I wasn't then I wouldn't be posting up about the set having any distracting lag.

The thing about the cod4 replay is not a good confirmation because before I got this tv I never used an lcd at all I was always playing with my 17" sony trinitron crt pc monitor by vga from my 360 and the replay cam did the same thing your talking about. Issues with that would have to be with network lag and since people can join in anytime in cod4 lag can and go whenever.

Heres the funny part even crt hdtv have some lag because they introduce some processing even if it was small it had it. Analog crt tv's and crt pc monitors are the ones that have zero lag.

The thing about the combos sorry I didnt make sense right there I meant to say that I can pull off anything while playing online without getting beat because of the lag interfering. For example in dead or alive 4 when countering your opponent I don't see any difference as when I played it on my old crt monitor.

I played once on a dell lcd monitor it was the 24" model that was 1920x1200 native res and this was the first time I ever felt any lag and my god it was horrible when I played dead or alive 4 I couldn't counter for **** with that monitor. I googled it online for my friend and found out that model had input lag like crazy.

So I know how lag can affect serious gamers but it really depends on many factors network lag with in combination to the tv small lag can equal to many people's bitching and this doesn't include those people who think it can't be their skills but in reality it is lol.

[felonyr301]

Originally Posted by Dayton

I always use Standard Mode, also have the PS3 and 360 in Full and Enhanced RGB. If I could just bump up the Color to 60 I wouldn't ever think twice about defaulting to PC mode for all gaming.

I was messing with it again today and put the gamma down to -2 and readjusted the brightness to 46 and it looks better reduced the washed out look. For anyone that cares putting the gamma down and upping the brightness a little seems to help.

[JimtN01]

Originally Posted by Sopas

I have a Comcast Motorola DCH3200 digital box. To access CC on the setup menu, turn your TV on, set it to the proper input, and leave your STB off. With the STB off, hit menu on the remote – this should give you access to a setup menu and CC. You can change it from “disabled” to “enabled” and it opens up a whole set of options for CC.

That's good info, but I'm not quite sure about "the proper input." I downloaded and printed the entire DVR manual from Motorola. (studied it VERY carefully.) It gives good detail, but NEVER mentions any setting on the TV - guess they are all too different. Also, it specifies MENU on the DVR box.
BTW - if it won't show on the TV, the manual says you can read it on the DVR screen - pretty cryptic for me.

[dsh1998]

Originally Posted by VarmintCong

A couple things to check - HDMI/PC must be HDMI2, and it must be 1080p.

Yes, make sure it is HDMI2 labeled to PC. Labeling any of the other HDMI inputs as PC does absolutely nothing.

A couple of other notes on game lag. I've been playing quite a bit of Gears of War 2 online lately, and the only lag I've noticed is network lag. Sometimes it's unplayable, other times things will feel a little sluggish, and then there times where all is good and the controls are extremely responsive. I'd have a hard time blaming any of the lag I've experienced on the LCD, as the network lag varies greatly from game to game. It's more accurate to measure lag offline.

Also, I've been playing around with hooking up my laptop and measuring lag in difference ways. I got a DVI->HDMI cable so I can hook up my laptop via HDMI (the video card on my laptop doesn't have HDMI out), but when I feed this into the Sammy, it reports the source as 1080i, not 1080p, and the lag is very apparent with measurements reaching as high as 200+ms. Even moving the mouse around on the screen exhibited noticeable lag. Switching the input HDMI2/PC lessened it somewhat but it was still very much there and noticeable. But when connecting the laptop via VGA, the Sammy reports it as 1080p, and the lag was around 30ms which was unnoticeable to my eyes.

So, I think I can conclude, as has been stated previously, the biggest cause of lag is having to upconvert an interlaced signal. It would have been nice if I could've tested HDMI out from my laptop @ 1080p...I'd imagine that it would be similar to the VGA 30ms measurement, but I haven't figured a way to do that yet.

[Dayton]

Originally Posted by felonyr301

I was messing with it again today and put the gamma down to -2 and readjusted the brightness to 46 and it looks better reduced the washed out look. For anyone that cares putting the gamma down and upping the brightness a little seems to help.

I'll try it out. Also thanks to all who mentioned that PC mode not only requires a RGB signal but a 1080p resolution. I hadn't noticed that before. So I suppose PC mode is really only a 360 option. I'm sure glad that I have always purchased the 360 version of cross platform games and considered my PS3 mostly a Blu-Ray player.

[gmanvbva]

I play regularly since release. I know the difference between network lag and input lag. Also, even in the replays, it is noticeably different. I am used to the slight difference between replay and my view but with it hooked up to the 650 it was even more than normal... much more.

Fiance was watching TV tonight so I'll have to test it after I change it back to 1080P. I know it is at 720P right now.

[Cougar_]

Can anyone tell me if they have had any success with trying to use a receiver, especially the Onkyo TX-SR705 with HDMI-CEC enabled on this TV. The TV recognizes my receiver but when I go back to the device list, it says no devices even tho during the 'refreshing devices' phase, it says TX-SR75 in parentheses.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[felonyr301]

Originally Posted by Dayton

I'll try it out. Also thanks to all who mentioned that PC mode not only requires a RGB signal but a 1080p resolution. I hadn't noticed that before. So I suppose PC mode is really only a 360 option. I'm sure glad that I have always purchased the 360 version of cross platform games and considered my PS3 mostly a Blu-Ray player.

Yea Sony wasn't thinking right when it came to having an internal scaler to upscale any game to whatever resolution you set it to. You don't have to have it in RGB for example I use the source option on the 360 where for games it uses RGB and YCbCr for videos automatically.

Make sure to have it on 1080p setting not the optimal resolution heard some funny stuff happening when using that setting.

[felonyr301]

Originally Posted by gmanvbva

I play regularly since release. I know the difference between network lag and input lag. Also, even in the replays, it is noticeably different. I am used to the slight difference between replay and my view but with it hooked up to the 650 it was even more than normal... much more.

Fiance was watching TV tonight so I'll have to test it after I change it back to 1080P. I know it is at 720P right now.

That's perfectly understandable I guess I mean from the start I always notice the replay cam showing me being off while on my pc monitor but its the same when playing on my sammy tv. I guess it depends on the person and who knows maybe even on certain sets lag can be different because of firmwares who knows. My set came with firmware 2004 and still using that so it could be that but whatever. Just saying I'm a competitive gamer since day 1 and this set doesn't give me trouble.

[corbs]

Originally Posted by gmanvbva

Both are right next to each other and I can switch back and forth at will so it is fairly easy to see the difference. It isn't even close. I can tell my response time is different very easily based on the replays and what happens on screen. If you haven't played CoD4, perhaps you don't understand. After you are killed you can watch a replay of it from the perspective of the person who killed you. On each and every replay, it shows me reacting significantly slower and only getting 1-2 bullets of (if any sometimes) when I actually fire 5-6 from my initial perspective.

Both are using the same internet connection. The only difference is the HDMI connection to the monitor vs 650.

One thing you mentioned is the 1080P. I will switch the 360 back to 1080P tonight and see if this makes a difference. Yesterday, I bumped it down from 1080P to 720P to see if this helped. When testing yesterday and today, the lag seemed almost blatantly obvious (much more so), so perhaps that is the issue.

I am not following the SC4 and SSF2 combo remark. Combos are dependent upon sequenced/timed button presses in relation to each other. If everything is delayed 80ms those time relationships are not really changing? Me pressing a button 80ms late because what I see is delayed vs someone who is seeing the same thing 80ms before myself.

I could tell renaming it to PC changed the settings. The picture was brighter and a little less vibrant ("washed out" as others say). But it was in 1080P mode when I renamed it and I later switched it to 720P.

I have a samsung46a630 and can relate to you perfectly. This lag issue is exactly what has brought me to this forum. I play cod waw and cod 4 and have noticed my kill death dropping considerably since swithching to the lcd.It seems like I'm about a half or full second behind my opponents , in a fps this rwally sucks!!

[mkissin]

Originally Posted by corbs

I have a samsung46a630 and can relate to you perfectly. This lag issue is exactly what has brought me to this forum. I play cod waw and cod 4 and have noticed my kill death dropping considerably since swithching to the lcd.It seems like I'm about a half or full second behind my opponents , in a fps this rwally sucks!!

Even half a second of lag is completely bonkers. You couldn't watch a movie with that kind of video lag, the audio would be shockingly out of sync. If your lag is that bag, it's either network or skill related.

[samsvoc]

One of my friends has the Sony and I have the Samsung and when my friends come over they rave about the Samsung, even my Sony friend. I was watching the Golden Globe awards show Sunday and everyone made super positive comments on the crisp sharp picture. Very deep blacks without black crush. I'm very happy I chose the Samsung 46" 650.

[gmanvbva]

Originally Posted by felonyr301

That's perfectly understandable I guess I mean from the start I always notice the replay cam showing me being off while on my pc monitor but its the same when playing on my sammy tv. I guess it depends on the person and who knows maybe even on certain sets lag can be different because of firmwares who knows. My set came with firmware 2004 and still using that so it could be that but whatever. Just saying I'm a competitive gamer since day 1 and this set doesn't give me trouble.

I'll check my firmware version, when I set it back to 1080P.

[Dayton]

Originally Posted by mkissin

Even half a second of lag is completely bonkers. You couldn't watch a movie with that kind of video lag, the audio would be shockingly out of sync. If your lag is that bag, it's either network or skill related.

It's "input" lag, and so only noticeable in gaming. And it is in the order of about 80 ms to 100 ms at it's most prominent, at least in my experience. Game Mode wouldn't exist if "input" lag didn't occur. Again, not all will notice but your twitch gamer will.

If gamers experience lag, they have two options. Use Game Mode or PC Mode (requires use of HDMI2 and a 1080p signal). Personally I find the latter option to be very effective.

[VarmintCong]

Originally Posted by Dayton

If gamers experience lag, they have two options. Use Game Mode or PC Mode (requires use of HDMI2 and a 1080p signal). Personally I find the latter option to be very effective.

The 3rd option is VGA - some report that having less lag than game mode or even PC mode. Might be worth a try (though it's expensive, I think $40).

[Gor18]

I just got a 40a650...i finally got it all tweaked and it looks great. The only issue i have now is that when i watch blu rays on my sony s550 it looks like i have the 120hz auto motion on but i dont. the movie has the fakey gliding look ...like when auto motion is on but it is not on. My blu ray is set to 1080p 24....it wasnt doing this the other day...the movies look great but it just doesnt look right.....does having movie mode on...some how turn on the 120 auto motion and just not say that it is on?

I have another issue. if i watch the tv for to long in the dark...whichi normally do....but this new tv is giving me serious head aches. if i turn down the back light and contrast the tv looks dull. i used to a have a 42 inch plasma in the same spot... so its not like im looking at a bigger tv. Maybe my auto motion type issue is causing my head aches...well not headaches...it makes my eyes hurt.

Any ideas???

Thanks

400+ dvds
35+ blu rays

last purchase was band of brothers on blu

[gmanvbva]

Originally Posted by mkissin

Even half a second of lag is completely bonkers. You couldn't watch a movie with that kind of video lag, the audio would be shockingly out of sync. If your lag is that bag, it's either network or skill related.

80-100ms can seem like a lifetime when you are talking about reaction times in FPS games.

[gmanvbva]

Originally Posted by Gor18

I just got a 40a650...i finally got it all tweaked and it looks great. The only issue i have now is that when i watch blu rays on my sony s550 it looks like i have the 120hz auto motion on but i dont. the movie has the fakey gliding look ...like when auto motion is on but it is not on. My blu ray is set to 1080p 24....it wasnt doing this the other day...the movies look great but it just doesnt look right.....does having movie mode on...some how turn on the 120 auto motion and just not say that it is on?

I have another issue. if i watch the tv for to long in the dark...whichi normally do....but this new tv is giving me serious head aches. if i turn down the back light and contrast the tv looks dull. i used to a have a 42 inch plasma in the same spot... so its not like im looking at a bigger tv. Maybe my auto motion type issue is causing my head aches...well not headaches...it makes my eyes hurt.

Any ideas???

Thanks

400+ dvds
35+ blu rays

last purchase was band of brothers on blu

When you say "does having movie mode on" are you referring to the mode for that input OR are you referring to the pressing E.Mode until it is in "Movie" mode. If you are using the E.Mode button, these are presets that override your manual settings and likely enables AMP. Someone else may be able to confirm what settings are enable in the various E.Mode presets.

[VarmintCong]

Originally Posted by Gor18

I just got a 40a650...i finally got it all tweaked and it looks great. The only issue i have now is that when i watch blu rays on my sony s550 it looks like i have the 120hz auto motion on but i dont. the movie has the fakey gliding look ...like when auto motion is on but it is not on. My blu ray is set to 1080p 24....it wasnt doing this the other day...the movies look great but it just doesnt look right.....does having movie mode on...some how turn on the 120 auto motion and just not say that it is on?

I have another issue. if i watch the tv for to long in the dark...whichi normally do....but this new tv is giving me serious head aches. if i turn down the back light and contrast the tv looks dull. i used to a have a 42 inch plasma in the same spot... so its not like im looking at a bigger tv. Maybe my auto motion type issue is causing my head aches...well not headaches...it makes my eyes hurt.

Earlier firmware had trouble with AMP staying on, try updating it.

Headaches are from brightness - I started using CNET's calibration and the eye strain went away - backlight 3, gamma +3. Backlight 4 and up gives me eye strain. It might look a bit dull at first, but you get used to it.

[Gor18]

I selected movie mode from the menu...im 99% sure i didnt use emode. I checked the firmware last night...i have the newest firmware the 2007.....as far as the headaches go, i did have the backlight on 7 and contrast 77 but now after trying differnt settings on line, i have my back light on 8 or 9 and my contrast on 92....sharpness on either 0 or 17.

[Gor18]

I have looked over some calibration web sites for correct settings... Some settings are completely differnt from others on the sprectum...example...some say backlight 8 and contrast 92 some say back like 3 contrast 65. I know it comes down to personal preference...but does anyone have a good link to come correct settings thats not going to give me eye strain?? anyhelp would be greatly appreated.

[guffy1]

Originally Posted by Gor18

I just got a 40a650...i finally got it all tweaked and it looks great. The only issue i have now is that when i watch blu rays on my sony s550 it looks like i have the 120hz auto motion on but i dont. the movie has the fakey gliding look ...like when auto motion is on but it is not on. My blu ray is set to 1080p 24....it wasnt doing this the other day...the movies look great but it just doesnt look right.....does having movie mode on...some how turn on the 120 auto motion and just not say that it is on?

I have another issue. if i watch the tv for to long in the dark...whichi normally do....but this new tv is giving me serious head aches. if i turn down the back light and contrast the tv looks dull. i used to a have a 42 inch plasma in the same spot... so its not like im looking at a bigger tv. Maybe my auto motion type issue is causing my head aches...well not headaches...it makes my eyes hurt.

Any ideas???

Thanks

400+ dvds
35+ blu rays

last purchase was band of brothers on blu

This TV kills my eyes as well. To me it doesent seem like its the contrast or brightness though. Its the damn judder is what I feel like is killing my eyes.

Compared to my Sony XBR4 the judder on this thing is pretty much awful. I really cant watch it for more than a half hour at a time or so before my eyes are just fried.

I love the overall picture quality of this set. Colors, details, black levels, all amazing and easily an upgrade over the XBR4. The processing is horrible though, IMO. Ive tried every setting and tweak I can possibly think of with this thing, but the judder (especially on film sources) is horrible to my eyes. This thing is really hard to look at, and Im returning it and sticking with my XBR4 as my main HDTV. Ill never stray from Sony again, my bad

[Gor18]

Oh great lol....I have so much issues with my tv's errrrrrrrrrr.

[Gor18]

It wasnt doing this automotioning before...when it was off...it was off...i didnt look as good as it does now....but then i adjusted the settings and it looks like it has automotion on low...its not bad...but it seems like the picture is floating a little from left to right...like what they do on tv when they pan scan a widescreen movie and need to shift the focus to the other side of the shot and you magicly just float from one side to the other. well its not that bad...but it does look fake..and my eyes hurt. i might try resetting all the settings to factory default and see if the auto motion effect goes away and try to mess with the settings again.

Could it be something with my blu ray? does 1080p24 compare to 1080p 60 have anything to do with this or the xyrcc or whatever they call the deep blacks on a sony...could that be doing it...i have tried everything but resetting my picture back to factory defaults.

[Leetthal]

Is the lag around the same as the 71F?

because i played on the 71F alot before and felt no input lag so will the A650 be fine for me? i am looking for a Gaming TV 40"-46" and its either this or the Sony W4100 but the glossy screens makes the image look amazing on this Samsung and i dont want to pass on it because of the input lag! please help here!. Thx

[Gor18]

Originally Posted by Leetthal

Is the lag around the same as the 71F?

because i played on the 71F alot before and felt no input lag so will the A650 be fine for me? i am looking for a Gaming TV 40"-46" and its either this or the Sony W4100 but the glossy screens makes the image look amazing on this Samsung and i dont want to pass on it because of the input lag! please help here!. Thx

My Xbox 360 looks great...doesnt lag....although as a whole the tv is hurting my eyes but i think i have the contract and backlight to high.

[Gor18]

actually i havent watch the tv since last night and eyes are still messed up lol.