Monsters, Inc.(JPN) comparison *PIX*

[ChrisPC]

WOW.. Forget tier 0, this is Tier -1!

This will be the ultimate BD demo. I want it now!

[teedoubleyou]

As much as this may grind some of your gears, I really think that there should be a separate PQ List for 3D animations.. Out of the 32/33 titles in the Tier 0 PQ thread, 12/13 of those are 3D animations -- and obviously these are great demo material but their source is so different from that of feature films that they should be judged accordingly.

Just my 2 pence.

[GmanAVS]

Amazing! Must buy now!

Amazon.co.jp Order Summary
Items: USD 36.75
Shipping & Handling: USD 21.34
Order Total: USD 58.09
Estimated ship date for this item: 2009/6/11 (tomorrow)


Can someone post a link to a less expensive but reputable Japanese BD retailer?

Gman

[Brandon B]

Originally Posted by teedoubleyou

As much as this may grind some of your gears, I really think that there should be a separate PQ List for 3D animations.. Out of the 32/33 titles in the Tier 0 PQ thread, 12/13 of those are 3D animations -- and obviously these are great demo material but their source is so different from that of feature films that they should be judged accordingly.

Why? No one is handing out prizes for the tier ranking, so it not like there is a basis for "unfair competition" or anything. It is merely a list to show you which transfers are really good vs. which ones aren't. Using your logic, one might suggest older films that required a restoration should be judged separately from films with well preserved or recent negs to work from.

Why does it matter if all we are interested in is the end result?

[lordcloud]

Originally Posted by Brandon B

It is merely a list to show you which transfers are really good vs. which ones aren't.

Why does it matter if all we are interested in is the end result?

As far as i can tell, the tier list isn't really a ranking of the best transfers, it's a ranking of the best looking discs.

[spectator]

Originally Posted by lordcloud

As far as i can tell, the tier list isn't really a ranking of the best transfers, it's a ranking of the best looking discs.

As far as I can tell, it's not a ranking of the best looking discs; it's a ranking of discs with a particular aesthetic.

[Steeb]

Originally Posted by spectator

As far as I can tell, it's not a ranking of the best looking discs; it's a ranking of discs with a particular aesthetic.

The best description I've read for that thread was from Cliff Stephenson: "The tiers don’t evaluate the quality of a disc; they rank the untrained EXPECTATIONS of a small group of people."

[spectator]

Originally Posted by Steeb

The best description I've read for that thread was from Cliff Stephenson: "The tiers don’t evaluate the quality of a disc; they rank the untrained EXPECTATIONS of a small group of people."

Bingo!

[MoFoHo]

I dont recollect anyone mentiong the sound quality on this disc yet? Is this the place to do it or will there be another thread (or even demand for a dedicated thread)?

The DTS-HDMA soundtrack is the bees knees! I always thought the DTS soundtrack on the DVD was good, but this soundtrack is really something! The intricacy of the sound effects, the directionality of the those effects (and voices) is just superb. I ended up sometimes just listening to the foley work, and letting my ears follow all the effects around! The bass is brilliant too, really rich, room shaking at times! Great stuff!

Oh and the picture is really, really nice too!

Here's a still on my screen setup....

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by Steeb

The best description I've read for that thread was from Cliff Stephenson: "The tiers don’t evaluate the quality of a disc; they rank the untrained EXPECTATIONS of a small group of people."

Do we really want this to be quoted here ? What's are the mods doing here ?

[chirpie]

Originally Posted by LilGator

Here's a cap of a HDTV broadcast I have, 8.5mbit x.264. Looks like some color differences, contrast, and maybe redone textures?

Look at the scratches near the top of the canister in the BD shot- nonexistent in this copy.

Spoiler  

I don't think they redid textures. Looking at his sleeve on the left arm, it looks like the compression threw out the extra detail and just had larger blocks of brown. Less detail, less info. I'd guess the same happened on the canister with the yellow.

[Mrkazador]

Grabbed from a different forum. Seems like they changed a few things on the Blu-Ray compared to an HDTV source. Maybe because its from Japan?

Originally Posted by jarwisz

I was bored ...... and.....esir vs sinners what do you think... why have they changed the english captions?

[jvtdi]

I never thought that I would want to see every little detail of a big furry monster or an evil looking bug dude, but I do now! Man I need an upgrade.

[stumlad]

I know a lot of people think Bolt looks great (I do as well), but when compared to Monsters Inc, or A Bug's Life, it clearly is a full step down as far as showing fine detail. It may have been artistic intention, but I'd rather demo something like Monsters Inc or A Bug's Life than Bolt any day.

[babrown92]

Where would be a good place to pick this up? Also will any of the extras play over here?

[CKNA]

Originally Posted by GmanAVS

Amazing! Must buy now!

Amazon.co.jp Order Summary
Items: USD 36.75
Shipping & Handling: USD 21.34
Order Total: USD 58.09
Estimated ship date for this item: 2009/6/11 (tomorrow)


Can someone post a link to a less expensive but reputable Japanese BD retailer?

Gman

http://www.hmv.co.jp/en/ is around $42 with shipping to US.

[Kris Deering]

Originally Posted by Mrkazador

Grabbed from a different forum. Seems like they changed a few things on the Blu-Ray compared to an HDTV source. Maybe because its from Japan?

Pixar has said many times before that they always tinker with their titles for a home video release. Things that they wanted to add or just little changes. I went to an interview with Lasseter and Bird and they mentioned it again and some of the small changes they made to Ratatouille for its home video release compared to the theatrical. Pretty much their norm. It will be interesting to see if the US release is different than the Japanese release.

[teedoubleyou]

Originally Posted by Brandon B

...Why does it matter if all we are interested in is the end result?

If all you are interested is the end result.. I personally am far more impressed by the quality of an encoded film regardless of age (in fact the encodes of older films have impressed me more) than an encode of a 3D animation which isn't going to suffer from DNR or EE.

But for demo purposes, please go ahead and wow your friends with Monsters Inc. It certainly does look top notch.

I for one will stick to How The West Was Won. But then again it's only a Tier 1.0 apparently..

[Brandon B]

Originally Posted by Kris Deering

Pixar has said many times before that they always tinker with their titles for a home video release. Things that they wanted to add or just little changes. I went to an interview with Lasseter and Bird and they mentioned it again and some of the small changes they made to Ratatouille for its home video release compared to the theatrical. Pretty much their norm. It will be interesting to see if the US release is different than the Japanese release.

What you say is correct, but they have also said they make region specific changes, which is very much what these look like to me. One example of that I remember them describing is the TV station sign off in Toy Story in Sid's Dad's room. We got the shot of the waving American flag a lot of TV stations used to have. THey knew that wouldn't have been recognized in most other countries, so they changed it to a shot of fireworks, I believe.

I would bet the US release will look like the caps from the original version.

[GmanAVS]

Originally Posted by CKNA

http://www.hmv.co.jp/en/ is around $42 with shipping to US.

^^ Thanks

Now all I need to do is junk my 1.5 year old Panny plasma and buy me a Pioneer 500m or 101FD

[spectator]

Originally Posted by teedoubleyou

If all you are interested is the end result.. I personally am far more impressed by the quality of an encoded film regardless of age (in fact the encodes of older films have impressed me more) than an encode of a 3D animation which isn't going to suffer from DNR or EE.

I believe his point is that the question at the heart of the thread isn't "How impressive a feat is the production of this disc?", but "How well does this disc meet a set of picture-quality standards?"

I agree with you that some of the efforts involved in transferring older films are often more impressive (in technical achievement terms) than those typically taken with newer films. However, I don't see what that opinion has to do with the tier thread nor why it should be a cause for particular discs to be corralled from others onto a separate list.

[Brandon B]

Originally Posted by teedoubleyou

If all you are interested is the end result.. I personally am far more impressed by the quality of an encoded film regardless of age (in fact the encodes of older films have impressed me more) than an encode of a 3D animation which isn't going to suffer from DNR or EE.

But for demo purposes, please go ahead and wow your friends with Monsters Inc. It certainly does look top notch.

I for one will stick to How The West Was Won. But then again it's only a Tier 1.0 apparently..

Nice snipe. My point was nothing to do with the merits of the movies themselves. Just my interpretation of what the the tier system is ranking.

I don't buy titles because they are clean looking, whether they are 3D CGi or film sourced. I buy them because I want the movie. But that wasn't what was being discussed.

[kingsleytim]

Originally Posted by chirpie

I don't think they redid textures. Looking at his sleeve on the left arm, it looks like the compression threw out the extra detail and just had larger blocks of brown. Less detail, less info. I'd guess the same happened on the canister with the yellow.

His jacket has the smooth spots in a lot of scenes. It looks like that is intentional for the design of his clothing. And the canistar has a specular map on it so it will look differently based on the source of the lighting and location, remember this is a 3d environment.

[kingsleytim]

Originally Posted by stumlad

I know a lot of people think Bolt looks great (I do as well), but when compared to Monsters Inc, or A Bug's Life, it clearly is a full step down as far as showing fine detail. It may have been artistic intention, but I'd rather demo something like Monsters Inc or A Bug's Life than Bolt any day.

Bolt looks different because it is not a Pixar film. It is a seperate team who did the work. Pixar maintains a high level of quality with the work that they do and that is why it takes longer for them to produce the films. Its all Computer animation but there are very obvious style differences between them. Pixar is the king of animated films currently. They basically revolutionized the industry and their Renderman program is so much more powerful than the competitors. I cant wait to get my hands on Monster Inc BD it was a huge leap in fur rendering and the quality of the movie is outstanding.

[Neo_Reloaded]

Originally Posted by Mrkazador

Grabbed from a different forum. Seems like they changed a few things on the Blu-Ray compared to an HDTV source. Maybe because its from Japan?

In which order are they? BD pic and then HDTV source pic, or vice versa? (I ask because I can't see the full images for some reason, just the thumbs. I imagine the BD is fairly easy to pick out at full size because of better quality)

[Mrkazador]

HDTV then BD. How can you not tell, the BD obviously looks better.

[Neo_Reloaded]

Originally Posted by Mrkazador

HDTV then BD. How can you not tell, the BD obviously looks better.

I edited my above post with clarification. I can't see the fullsized images on the system I'm on for some reason, so I'm just going by the thumbnails.

Now that I know the HDTV pics are first (presumably from a US-based HD channel?) I suspect the changes may be localization for the Japanese market. Instead of changing the English text to Japanese, which may look out of place considering the movie is an American production, Pixar instead changed things from text to more universally understandable icons. The "Scare / Don't Scare" to red and green monsters, the news headline to simply a biohazard symbol with a baby in the middle, etc.

I think some of the gags work better as icons instead of text, and I'm curious to see what the US BD will have (maybe I'll try to dig up my US DVD and check what that used).

[JBlacklow]

Originally Posted by Neo_Reloaded

Now that I know the HDTV pics are first (presumably from a US-based HD channel?) I suspect the changes may be localization for the Japanese market. Instead of changing the English text to Japanese, which may look out of place considering the movie is an American production, Pixar instead changed things from text to more universally understandable icons. The "Scare / Don't Scare" to red and green monsters, the news headline to simply a biohazard symbol with a baby in the middle, etc.

I think some of the gags work better as icons instead of text

Yeah, the Japanese do love them some icons. It's like Times Square combined with the iPhone, but with scarier pictures due to earthquakes, tsunamis, and the occasional radioactive sea creature.

[Josh Z]

Originally Posted by Neo_Reloaded

Now that I know the HDTV pics are first (presumably from a US-based HD channel?) I suspect the changes may be localization for the Japanese market. Instead of changing the English text to Japanese, which may look out of place considering the movie is an American production, Pixar instead changed things from text to more universally understandable icons. The "Scare / Don't Scare" to red and green monsters, the news headline to simply a biohazard symbol with a baby in the middle, etc.

I think it's likely that they prepared one "International" version of the movie with more icons than text, which would be good not just for Japan, but any foreign-language market.

[eric.exe]

Weren't all Pixar movies before Cars rendered below 1080p? I read it was ~1536×922. If so I'm quite sure A Bug's Life and Monsters Inc were rerendered recently (I wonder if it was 2K or 4K). While they were redoing Monsters Inc it look they tweaked the contrast also.

Originally Posted by stumlad

I know a lot of people think Bolt looks great (I do as well), but when compared to Monsters Inc, or A Bug's Life, it clearly is a full step down as far as showing fine detail. It may have been artistic intention, but I'd rather demo something like Monsters Inc or A Bug's Life than Bolt any day.

Same with Wall-E. I always said Wall-E was intentionally soft and not very impressive for a CGI movie, in regard to sharpness and detail.