2007 Mitsubishi WD-XX73X and XX831 Owner's Thread

[Trackman]

I just spent 60 mins at Fry's looking at the Mits and the new JVCs. The 831, 732 and 731 were all adjacent to one another on the main floor, running the Mits demo feed off a hard drive. The only JVC FN/FH out was a 70" in a darkened viewing room next to a 62" 627 Mits displaying Star Wars Ep 3 off a dvd. I adjusted the JVC as best I could and did the same with the 627, which was crushing blacks. The blacks on the Mits were quite superior to the JVC, so I switched my focus to the 831/732 (57"). I set them up identically (Natural, Low Temp, Sharp at 18, Color and Tint at default, DFI on, Sharpedge off). I couldn't see any difference in picture, though there were few white/bright scenes susceptible to SSE. Perhaps it was the bright showroom lighting but I can't see paying $$$ more for the 831 (a buddy of mine who owns a HT store agrees) bsaed on my viewing. Perhaps in a dark room it would be different. For those of you who saw a difference in the two (side by side) - what did you see?

[kenking]

Originally Posted by Trackman

I just spent 60 mins at Fry's looking at the Mits and the new JVCs. The 831, 732 and 731 were all adjacent to one another on the main floor, running the Mits demo feed off a hard drive. The only JVC FN/FH out was a 70" in a darkened viewing room next to a 62" 627 Mits displaying Star Wars Ep 3 off a dvd. I adjusted the JVC as best I could and did the same with the 627, which was crushing blacks. The blacks on the Mits were quite superior to the JVC, so I switched my focus to the 831/732 (57"). I set them up identically (Natural, Low Temp, Sharp at 18, Color and Tint at default, DFI on, Sharpedge off). I couldn't see any difference in picture, though there were few white/bright scenes susceptible to SSE. Perhaps it was the bright showroom lighting but I can't see paying $$$ more for the 831 (a buddy of mine who owns a HT store agrees) bsaed on my viewing. Perhaps in a dark room it would be different. For those of you who saw a difference in the two (side by side) - what did you see?

The differences between the 732 and 831 to my eyes are subtile too. However, one viewing example which is fairly unmistakable: Visit a showroom that is using the feed that has the "Mitsubishi" and "1080p" barrel-rolling insignia in the lower right (the one that slowly revolves vertically), and watch them closely on both sets. Likely you'll perceive a greater clarity on the 831's. Granted this isn't splashy, but there is a difference. There are undoubtedly other small differences like this. Since both sets are really good to begin with, we could be at the "splitting hairs" point. It's a matter of whether these small differences between "topnotch" and "best" are worth the extra bucks. [Epilogue: i took the plunge on the "best" (to be delivered tomorrow).]

[chuckhas]

Got my 57831 late yesterday. Here's a picture. Won't clean up the installation or add sound until I get my HD-A1 on Tuesday.

[chuckhas]

Also, having reserved a 57831 a couple of weeks ago sight unseen, I was worrying about shimmering. Reading about it here I remember see a very bad example of it at BB a couple of weeks ago but dismissed it as something really wrong with the setup (don't remember which YV it was).

But after a full day of HD NFL I'm happy to report no shimmer.

[lipcrkr]

Does anyone know why Mitsubishi hasn't posted the 732/831 owners manuals yet? What is the holdup?

[kdaniel]

Fry's in Woodland Hills, CA has all three models next to each other, 65-731, 732, 831. I know many of us in S-CA have been looking for the 831!
I thought the 831 had a better picture, it was subtile but was sharper. Like I just got my new presciption glasses filled. Fry's was not willing to deal on the price. If anyone is able to get them to work with you, I would appreciate a pm.

[Trackman]

Did the Fry's you went to have them in a viewing room (dark) or out on the main floor? I was looking at them on the main floor, which was quite bright.

Thanks Ken king - I'll check out the insignia next time I compare - if they have that feed on.

[Smeeg]

i've torn myself away from the set for just a minute for a quick update. giants/seahawks game looked great this afternoon. once again, best HD football coverage of the week goes to nbc. mitsubishi and nbc.... who'd a thunk it? i think my problems with cbs must be from the local affiliate because the highlights on nbc looked much better than what i was watching live on cbs. i'm really happy with the way the tv performed today. 732 owners should try some of our suggestions because a lot of the guts of the two lines are the same. anyway, here's some minor updates to my settings, which will probably not be the ideal settings for you. if you need an extra little kick, throw on DFI, but i wouldn't leave it on all the time. i'm making it a source dependent setting.

Color Temp: High
Sharpness: 0 with VNR off, 6-9 with VNR on low
Tint: 27
Color: 27
Brightness: 34
Contrast: 42
Picture Mode: Natural
Video Noise Reduction: off (most of the time, or Low if absolutely necessary)
SharpEdge: off
DeepField: off

Perfect Color
Magenta: 33
Red: 35
Yellow: 38
Green: 56
Cyan: 38
Blue: 44

Perfect Tint
Magenta: 51
Red: 31
Yellow: 24 for accurate yellow, 17 for any kind of green/yellow color correction
Green: 11
Cyan: 44
Blue: 24

[TrendSetterX]

Originally Posted by MARS08

How do you get the 8300HD to pass through all resolutions? I'm using component cables but every time I check the info button on the Mits it shows 1080i for any channel I'm on.

The 8300 has an advanced setup wizard (see http://www.scientificatlanta.com/Exp...h=%22wizard%22 for info) which you'll need to go through to properly setup what resolutions your Tv supports. You'll also need to run component instead of HDMI to take advantage of all resolutions. For more information, see this post http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...40#post8475840 and this post http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...75#post8423775 .

[kdaniel]

Originally Posted by Trackman

Did the Fry's you went to have them in a viewing room (dark) or out on the main floor? I was looking at them on the main floor, which was quite bright.

Thanks Ken king - I'll check out the insignia next time I compare - if they have that feed on.

They were out on the main floor, not the optimal viewing situation. I thought the 732 flat black looked better under bright lights as the 831 piano finish did reflect the light, but I can't see that as being an issue under normal viewing conditions.

[spatel23]

Originally Posted by Smeeg

disclaimer:
for the love of all that is holy, don't use my settings. they've been known to drive men to the brink of insanity, or to the point of starting their own thread. use with caution. please wait at least thirty minutes after eating before using my settings. those having difficulties urinating should not use my settings. please contact your doctor before beginning my setting regimen. my settings have been known to cause birth defects in laboratory rats. do not operate heavy machinery while using my settings. erections lasting for more than four hours while using my settings are quite common and should be enjoyed to the fullest extent of law.

bwahhhahaa, nice disclaimer Smeeg

[svalley]

OK, I have my 65831 for 5 days now, here is my little review for anyone who care.

Some background:
I own a Sammy HLN 50" 720P for the last 3 years, initial seating 8' and
it was perfect. I moved and now seating 10' away the DVD with 2.40:1
ratio is getting little small, so time to upgrade.

I decided to go with 65831 after all the great reviews here.
The first couple days I was not impressed or happy with the new MIT
at all. Since most of the previous owner recommended Nature mode, I started
with Nature mode first, but I couldn't make it look good in this mode,
it always looked soft. Then, I changed the MIT to Bright mode, it is much
better, it looks sharp and bright. I also moved back 1 feet to 11' away from screen.

DVD up converted from the HD-A1 to 1080i:
Look good, but not as good as the old Sammy, this is probably due to
the screen size is 68% larger.

HDTV off Directv:
Not good, it is due to the crappy signal from Directv (see the post on HD lite)
I see a lot of mpeg compression in today's football games. I m thinking about
to install a off-air antenna to fix this problem.

XBOX 360:
It looks great, great color, bright, very smooth, definitely better than the Sammy

HD-DVD:
It also looks great, very sharp pictures, and the black is like ink. Also I see
more 3-D look with this TV than the Sammy, and the plasma look people are
talking about.

Summary:
The 65831 produce great color, great black (a lot better than my old DLP),
and it is very bright. Fan noise is noticable, but it is lower than my old Sammy.
SSE is there at 11', at 13' SSE is much harder to see.
I am happy with my upgrade, might be I should have go with 57" instead.
I used to think 50' was too big for 8', so I know I will get use to it.

[reincarnate]

Originally Posted by little_trader

Oh THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, Smeeg!!!!!

WOOHOO!

After turning the noise reduction and the sharp edge feature off, and the sharpness to zero per your suggestions, I now see absolutely NO shimmering as reported earlier. I watched FOX HD today (Packers vs Lions) and was totally blown away by the quality of the picture!

I had gone to BB the other day to see if any of the other brands was performing better than the Mits and the Sony, Samsung, Mits, ALL showed the shimmering effects I had reported earlier. Note that no adjustments were made to any TV by me while I was there, and I didn't look at settings either. Just went away with the feeling that I would be unhappy no matter which HDTV I would have chose.
Steve

A 1920*1080 picture already contains all of the detail and resolution anyone could want. All TV's should allow each individual digital pixel to pass without distorting it as the lossless transmission system needs NO enhancement. It called 1:1 pixel mapping. But we are not here yet, as we as human beings as to stupid to realize it. In the meantime lets all enjoy the digital artifacts byproducts.

Excuse me now while I go eat my peanut butter with its added corn syrup and partially hydrogenated oils. We know true added value when we can see its beauty or visit the heart surgeon

[reincarnate]

Originally Posted by chuckhas

Also, having reserved a 57831 a couple of weeks ago sight unseen, I was worrying about shimmering. Reading about it here I remember see a very bad example of it at BB a couple of weeks ago but dismissed it as something really wrong with the setup (don't remember which YV it was).

But after a full day of HD NFL I'm happy to report no shimmer.

This is why I always believe everything I read on the Internet and also enjoy someone else learning at my expense. Now I've got to go read that Mel Gibson quote about American civilization...

[reincarnate]

Originally Posted by svalley

OK, I have my 65831 for 5 days now, here is my little review for anyone who care.

Some background:
IDVD up converted from the HD-A1 to 1080i: Look good, but not as good as the old Sammy, this is probably due to the screen size is 68% larger.

Try setting the Toshiba to output 480p for SD DVDs.

[BadClams]

Originally Posted by kdaniel

They were out on the main floor, not the optimal viewing situation. I thought the 732 flat black looked better under bright lights as the 831 piano finish did reflect the light, but I can't see that as being an issue under normal viewing conditions.

The black gloss (piano) finish will look great with my Definitive Tech. BP2002's though!!!

[little_trader]

Originally Posted by kdaniel

They were out on the main floor, not the optimal viewing situation. I thought the 732 flat black looked better under bright lights as the 831 piano finish did reflect the light, but I can't see that as being an issue under normal viewing conditions.

The nice thing about the Mits is that there is so LITTLE gloss black bezel that you do not really notice any glare because it the bezel is so small.

Steve

[jacobms1]

My story:

I've had a 2005 Mits WD-52725 DLP since September of 2005, it was my first HDTV and when I got it I was simply amazed at the HDTV picture and quality of the set compared to the Samsungs/Sony's I had also been looking at. Going from a Sony Wega 32 inch tube tv to this widescreen set really felt overwhelming but after a small time I found myself wishing I had gotten the 62!

Fast Forward to this past weekend where I finally broke my wife down after months of hinting at needing a bigger tv. She finally relented if I could sell the old one. I put the Mits up on craigslist and had it sold within the day. Suddenly I had a big space to fill so off to Ultimate/American I went.

I was pretty sure I wanted to stick with Mits as I really enjoyed the TV for the past 2 years but I gave the other ones there fair shot. I looked at the 60" SXRD, the 61 inch Sammy and the 65 inch Mits 732. I asked about the 831 and they said they were bringing the 57 out for display but the 65 incher they had was already accounted for. I really wanted to see the 831 so I headed to the next store but they didn't have one at all. On my way back home I stopped back at UE and they had the 57 out. For me personally I really liked it better than the 732, I thought the blacks were blacker, and the picture really seemed to jump at me. I told them I wanted the 65 and asked when they would get more in, when the guy came back from checking the hold on the 65 was mysteriously removed and I was able to buy the set! Not only that but they met an offer I got at another local specialty store whic ended up being almost 1K off their price!

Anyway, I took the set home right then and got it hooked up in time to watch football last night. I had that same feeling I had when I got my set 2 years ago, I was amazed again at the difference in PQ from the set that was only 2 years old! I actually giggled like a girl at one point as the PQ was just so dang amazing!

[Tom Grooms]

Fenton? Ballwin?

[SailorKane]

Great posts. Thanks everyone. I broke down today and ordered my 65831!!! Hurray!! I was also worried about the shimmering, and hoped that it was not evidence of poor deinterlacing circuitry. However, the newest posts seem to have cleared up that issue. I also spent a lot of time in a store with the Mits, Sony and Sammy next to each other and convinced myself of no problems there, after looking at football and auto racing. Seating distance ranges from 7' sitting on the floor to 10' on the sofa. Total immersion. I still don't like the shiny bezel, but its so small I don't think it will be a factor.
Delivery date is yet TBD, but the set will hit the warehouse on 9/29. Looking forward to it.
Also ordered a new RXV-2700 yamaha receiver. It will hit the warehouse on 10/6 and arrive soon afterwards. I really like the Yamahas, including their proprietary sound fields. Been using older units for about 15 years now.
Also ordered Verizon FIOS "cable" service. It uses the Motorola 6416 STB. That is a slight upgrade from the 6412 that people have reported on this thread, but still doesn't seem to have the "pass-thru" mode. So I will have to wrestle with the 720p/1080i output issue. However, they offer a month to month agreement, which is important to me, and is all-digital, which hopefully will be slightly better than some analog SD. We already have the Verizon internet service over the same fiber optics and it works well, so we are hopeful. However, its a two week wait for that also--schedule date 10/9! This will replace the DirecTV that has such compressed HD. Also I would have to upgrade the DirecTV equipment, which either requires a several hundred dollar purchase, or a year contract.

Next is Repairmaster EW, which is apparently around $328 for 5 years, including 2 bulbs.
Then need stand--the CC $300 shiny black unit should complement the TV pretty well.

Now gotta figure out cables and order from mono. Might need some component cables and a couple HD. Anyone know the best cable to connect a Dell Inspiron 6000 to the TV? My intent right now is to use the receiver to switch the inputs, and the TV to do the upconverting. The 2700 will switch up to 1080p--the first yamaha to do so.

Then need some more speakers for the 7.1 receiver. I'll probably check out all new speakers, but most likely just add to my Infiniti setup. I really like the sound of Infinity, and with my 15" Velodyne sub, the sound is pretty good. I've got the older Kappa 7.1 towers.

I haven't decided on the DVD player. Most likely will wait on that until the format wars are over. I like the best stuff, but hate to pay for something that might become obsolete shortly. Beta/VHS. My current DVD player is very old and low end, but has dolby digital, coax and optical audio outputs and component video. So I think I'll try to work with this until the HD-DVD vs Bluray sorts out. Even 500 for a Tosh HD-DVD is too much for me if it has a fair probability of becoming obsolete soon.

Funny thing how just "getting a new TV" ripples into so many other things!!!!
We're all psyched. Now just playing the waiting game.

Thanks to everyone on their posts (esp Capn Preshoot). It was EXTREMELY helpful in picking all this stuff. If anyone has any comments on my selections, esp those still in process, please feel free.

Sorry to use the thread to chat about all the peripherals, but to me, the entire TV experience includes all these other things too.

Peace.

[gtsorbet]

My weekend-

Ok, well, whatever I did wrong with the card reader it must be me, I am over it. But more exciting was that I finally talked my roomate into real cable [more than local channels] which means I get more football and MNF! Saturday he was supposed to come between 1-5...inevitably it came at 4:45. So I spent the whole morning watching college football in HD on the $30 antenna I bought 2 weeks ago, it looked great like usual. Then came the cable guy with the cable box and most importantly ESPN2 so I could watch the Notre Dame game [holy crap, what a game!]. [funny side note] The guy comes in and says, "wow, that's a big tv...wait...how are you recieving HD before I get here?" Turns out he had no clue you could really get HD from an antenna, not a good first impression. [end side note] So the cable guy explains to me how to hook up component cables [again, freaking idiot] and we get it up and running. He explains to me how to work the controller [uh huh...oh really, so that is how you get to the guide?] and puts it on DiscoveryHD to show me how the HD works, I signed something and he left. Before I can say anything, my girlfriend says, "um...is that really HD? the football game was much clearer." So I turned the football game on through the cable and we were shocked. The cable feed of the game had much more "blocking" [the feed can't keep up with the picture?] and it looked like how it did in the store. So I flipped back to my antenna and it was soo much better. All this worrying about how my cable box doesn't have HDMI and here I am seeing a much better picture through a freaking coaxial cable than through that box of technology. So I did the side by side picture thingy [way cool] and found that the antenna was far superior to the cable box picture [and also the cable box is about 3-4 seconds behind]. I am not sure if I am the first to notice such a huge difference but if you have a chance...go buy a $30 antenna and use that for your HD local channels, well worth it. I am about 25-30 miles away from the stations and I just have the antenna on the floor in the corner and it works perfect.
Now I have a question if anyone knows it. My new house will be done in about a month and I will need to purchase either cable or dish. I have hated dish since forever but just noticed that it's about the same price and you get 24 channels of HD compared to cable having ESPNHD, DiscoveryHD and INHD and not much else. I don't know what the picture quality difference is but I am guessing dish can't be much worse than cable. If anyone knows if dish is better I will for sure go with them then. Any info on this would be outstanding...dish comes with ESPN2HD as well, and on Saturday I was watching Notre Dame vs. Michigan State on ESPN2 standard def and it was more like watching the white blobs vs. the green blobs fight over a brown blob. Would have been nice to see the game I really wanted to see in HD...

[SupraLB]

Originally Posted by TrendSetterX

The 8300 has an advanced setup wizard (see http://www.scientificatlanta.com/Exp...h=%22wizard%22 for info) which you'll need to go through to properly setup what resolutions your Tv supports. You'll also need to run component instead of HDMI to take advantage of all resolutions. For more information, see this post http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...40#post8475840 and this post http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...75#post8423775 .

Trend, thanks so much for the info.

Cable guy installed with components and I wasn't really happy with the HD picture. It kept blocking and getting hung up, kind of like it wasn't processing fast enough. The HD picture was also not as clear as hoped.

The HDMI cables I intalled helped with the processing speed, and the picture quality because a little better in HD.

I really don't watch much SD television (maybe 10%), so I am wondering if I should really switch back to components. I will play around tonight during the monday night football game. I'm concerned with getting the best possible HD picture, even if SD suffers a little.

[mlpetrozelli]

Congrats Sailor!! I just received my 65831 approx. an hour ago and am waiting for the stand to arrive shortly. I temporarily ran my cable feed directly to the set (sent back box as it wasn't digital and may try cablecard), and had it pull in all the stations and it got alot more than my box gave me!! I have an OTA antenna arriving today also, but it looks like HD feeds of local channels are there, does that sound right? I thought I needed the antenna because of this, but maybe the internal pulled them down? Nonetheless, I will be abpot 9' back, but right now I'm at 4' while I wait for the stand to be put in the correct place. Let me just say this: watching ESPN HD even at this distance was gorgeous!! Smeeg, I owe you the full price of this TV, because after applying your recommended settings, it was an entirely different picture, holy crap!! Trust me guys, apply those settings about a half hour after watching the default setup and you will just stare and drool!! I, myself LOVE the piano finish, very classy, and the speaker cloth to me looks like a dark charcoal, not gray, and smooth, not like that funky 70s speaker cloth . I can't wait to hook up my receiver, HTPC and XBox360 today. I will have pics very shortly guys!! To you 57" guys that thought the 65" may be too big, 3 words for you: keep your receipt!!

[mlpetrozelli]

So I did the side by side picture thingy [way cool] and found that the antenna was far superior to the cable box picture [and also the cable box is about 3-4 seconds behind]. I am not sure if I am the first to notice such a huge difference but if you have a chance...go buy a $30 antenna and use that for your HD local channels, well worth it. I am about 25-30 miles away from the stations and I just have the antenna on the floor in the corner and it works perfect.

Hey, I think gtsorbet answered my question before I even asked!

[Ruin]

Now I have a question if anyone knows it. My new house will be done in about a month and I will need to purchase either cable or dish. I have hated dish since forever but just noticed that it's about the same price and you get 24 channels of HD compared to cable having ESPNHD, DiscoveryHD and INHD and not much else. I don't know what the picture quality difference is but I am guessing dish can't be much worse than cable. If anyone knows if dish is better I will for sure go with them then.

gtsorbet,

the main thing seems to be that dish is more compressed than cable. In fact, I think there is a class action suit against Dish for marketing HD but delivering "HDlight."

Ruin

[Gizmo Joe]

Originally Posted by Gizmo Joe

Anyone buy their 65732 from Costco? Did it come with a stand? I ask because all of the RPTV on display at my local Costco, including an older Mitsubishi DLP (WD-52628?) and the Samsung HL-S6767W (which I am also considering), had a stand included in the price despite there being no mention of included stands in the online descriptions for those models. It would make the $3,299 price much more competitive with some of the other deals that have been struck with other retailers.

Also, has anyone seen the 65732 in a Costco showroom yet? Does Costco perhaps plan on selling the 732 models online only? I would love to avoid the $165 shipping charge and would be willing to wait a few weeks if I could pick it up locally.

Thanks!

Gizmo Joe

A follow up to my own post. I just got off the phone with a Costco.com customer rep and she said the 65732 does NOT come with a stand. I had her check the Sammy 6767 and she confirmed that it DOES come with a stand, so that matches the store's offering. They were unable to tell me if the 732's would be ever be available in the showroom and my local store verified that no store in the Midwest has one in stock. Since I do not have a stand and would have to spend around $420 for the matching Mitsubishi MB65GB stand plus $165 for shipping from Costco.com, that would make purchasing the larger Samsung 67" at my local Costco warehouse $385 cheaper than the Mitsubishi 65" from Costco.com. With a professional calibration on the Samsung by Eliab almost fully covered by the savings, I would arguably have a better looking (not to mention 2" bigger) set for about the same price. My opinion after viewing the sets (both looked good, but separate showrooms makes a real comparison impossible) and extensive reading of these forums leads me to slightly favor the Mitsubishi, but a professionally calibrated Samsung with the 87/88 guts of the 6767 sounds like it would be hard to beat.

Anyone else have any guidance they would like to share?

Gizmo Joe

[RommelB]

Originally Posted by Ruin

gtsorbet,

the main thing seems to be that dish is more compressed than cable. In fact, I think there is a class action suit against Dish for marketing HD but delivering "HDlight."

Ruin

I'm not surprised. I have E* and a lot of their HD channels shouldn't even be called HD.

[sourcery]

Originally Posted by gtsorbet

If anyone knows if dish is better I will for sure go with them then. Any info on this would be outstanding

Cable is usually much better in PQ than either DirecTV or Dishnetwork. On the other hand, the satellite services usually provide far more "HD" channels than any cable provider other than Verizon FIOS. OTA is often superior in PQ to cable, although that depends on how many subchannels the local broadcast stations decide to transmit within their alloted broadcast spectrum (and also on how much compression the cable company decides to employ.)

Another factor is the relative digital processing prowess of the set top boxes. In the case of cable, you can simply plug the cable into the TV directly and use the TV's own QAM tuner to receive cable channels. The TVs tuner will almost certainly be far superior to whatever the cable company's STB uses. If you also get a Cable Card from the cable company, the TV will then also be able to tune in the encrypted cable channels (HBO-HD, SHO-HD, STARS-HD, TNT-HD, etc.)

[pvcleave]

Originally Posted by gtsorbet

My weekend-
Now I have a question if anyone knows it. My new house will be done in about a month and I will need to purchase either cable or dish. I have hated dish since forever but just noticed that it's about the same price and you get 24 channels of HD compared to cable having ESPNHD, DiscoveryHD and INHD and not much else. I don't know what the picture quality difference is but I am guessing dish can't be much worse than cable. If anyone knows if dish is better I will for sure go with them then. Any info on this would be outstanding...dish comes with ESPN2HD as well, and on Saturday I was watching Notre Dame vs. Michigan State on ESPN2 standard def and it was more like watching the white blobs vs. the green blobs fight over a brown blob. Would have been nice to see the game I really wanted to see in HD...

It seems to me people with cable are complaining more about the picture quality than Dish owners. I have Dish and while they have pissed me off I have been very happy with the quality of the signal. I keep my signal on 1080i all the time and do not seem to have problems with football at all. I watched as much as I could this weekend, even the canadian football. I also read a story in USA Today a few months ago how cable did not want cable channels to go HD because at the moment they have no way to carry them.

[M.T.Nest]

Originally Posted by sourcery

<SNIP>

If you also get a Cable Card from the cable company, the TV will then also be able to tune in the encrypted cable channels (HBO-HD, SHO-HD, STARS-HD, TNT-HD, etc.)

A couple of question:

1) Does that mean that with a cablecard one can receive encrypted channels without subscribing to "premium" channels?

2) With the 831, how would one use cablecard in conjunction with an HD DVR?

The cable guy's coming tomorrow, and the TV later this week...If I want cablecard I need to let them kow today.