Xbox 360 DVD & HD DVD video playback bugs & feature requests

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Thanks to MS for the latest Xbox 360 1080p HD-DVD (etc.) update. Hopefully it's kosher to start a separate bug and feature request thread for the next update here...

I'll start:

I appreciate having the new Aspect Ratio button, but unfortunately it's missing one setting for those of us with older TVs. Some of these older TVs lock into widescreen mode when presented with progressive scan or HD content. This is a major issue with 4:3 material. To better explain:

My 16:9 TV is hooked up to the Xbox 360 via component 1080i.

Original 4:3 480p image:




What that image from the Xbox 360 is supposed to look like on a (recent) 16:9 TV in Default Aspect Ratio mode:




This is the Xbox 360's Default mode on my (older) TV. The image is stretched horizontally:




Horizontal Stretched mode looks exactly the same on my TV. This is what it should look like on a newer TV as well:




Letterbox Zoom mode on my TV corrects the aspect ratio, but cuts off the top and bottom:




What would be nice for the next update would be to have the Aspect Ratio button have an additional option where the Xbox 360 would add (107 pixels of) black space to each side, before output. This is how my HD cable box deals with 4:3 HD output. Even on my TV, such a hypothetical "Fixed 4:3" mode would display correctly:




I can't test the HD DVD drive yet (since it's still a couple of weeks before its release), but I suspect the same issues exist using the new Aspect Ratio button with HD DVD 4:3 material. (Or maybe not. See my next post below.)

[EDIT]
This is apparently NOT an issue with 4:3 material on HD DVD (either 4:3 480i/p or 4:3 1080p). It's only an issue with 4:3 DVD playback. See post #16
[/EDIT].

eg. Casablanca:




Original 4:3 Casablanca aspect ratio:




I suspect it will look like this on my TV (but maybe not - see my next post below):



A "Fixed 4:3" mode for the next update would be most welcome.

Now I'm off to test 720p and 1080p WMV video playback off DVD-R...

[drhill]

Request: Different output resolution options for dvds/hddvds and video games/other.

If this is a big deal you guys didn't do a good job on the software side.

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Bug:

I am running into the 1080p problem that others in this forum are running into too.
Ironically, in direct contrast to my problem in my previous post:

1080p widescreen WMV video files get squished into a 4:3 aspect ratio. 720p video works fine though.

This 1080p 16:9 clip should look like this...



...but ends up looking like this on my TV:



If only I had this problem with my 4:3 DVDs.

[EDIT]
However, it turns out these "1920x1080" videos are actually only "1440x1080" natively. If in fact that this is the behaviour with 4:3 HD DVDs, that would be a good thing for me, because then 4:3 HD DVDs would display correctly on my TV. However, this is definitely not the behaviour with standard definition DVD playback. 4:3 DVD 480p gets stretched on my TV, whether it needs it or not.

It seems that the Xbox 360 treats output of 480p video and 1080p video differently for some reason.
[/EDIT]

[EDIT]
Apparently 4:3 material on HD DVD (either 4:3 480i/p or 4:3 1080p) will display the right aspect ratio on older TVs. The 4:3 --> 16:9 stretch is only an issue with 4:3 DVD playback. See post #16.
[/EDIT]

4:3 1440x1080p WMV video displays correctly however. This original video...



...looks like this on my screen, as it should:



Again, my TV is hooked up to the Xbox 360 at 1080i over component.

----

Also, it seems the jellyfish artifact claim for WMV video is true.

I downloaded this WMV HD 1080p clip and this is what it showed: Jellyfish artifact

[chap]

Just in case you ddin't know, on xbox.com they have a feature request forum on the site. That supposedly how MS got the info to make this update.

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Originally Posted by BuGsArEtAsTy

I can't test the HD DVD drive yet (since it's still a couple of weeks before its release), but I suspect the same issues exist using the new Aspect Ratio button with HD DVD 4:3 material.

eg. Casablanca:

Given the behaviour with 1080p WMV, I wonder if this is actually the case. I can't wait until the HD DVD drive arrives.

Originally Posted by drhill

Request: Different output resolution options for dvds/hddvds and video games/other.

If this is a big deal you guys didn't do a good job on the software side.

Hey, give 'em a chance.

Originally Posted by chap

Just in case you ddin't know, on xbox.com they have a feature request forum on the site. That supposedly how MS got the info to make this update.

Thanks. I'll check it out.

[swanlee]

I noticed 1440X1080P WMV files get 4:3 treatment but 1920X1080P wmv files display in 16:9 correctly. Kind of Annoying and hope this is fixed.

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Originally Posted by swanlee

I noticed 1440X1080P WMV files get 4:3 treatment but 1920X1080P wmv files display in 16:9 correctly. Kind of Annoying and hope this is fixed.

You're right. That Discovers 1080p file is 1440x1080. I misread the app I was using because it reported the expanded size, which is 1920x1080. However, the native resolution is 1440x1080.

In a way, this is actually good for me. If Casablanca is 1440x1080p, that means it may display correctly on my TV.

[Kysersose]

I'l make this a sticky for a while...

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Here is a site that has some true 1080p WMV video clips with native 1920x1080 resolution.

Originally Posted by Kysersose

I'l make this a sticky for a while...

Hey cool. Thanks.

[ferrisg]

Sounds like the 1440x1080 WMV files are not flagged as anamorphic (they should be) or the 360 is not respecting this flag. Is there a tool to check this on WMV files? I suppose other apps automatically expanding the video would be a good indicator.

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Originally Posted by ferrisg

Sounds like the 1440x1080 WMV files are not flagged as anamorphic (they should be) or the 360 is not respecting this flag. Is there a tool to check this on WMV files? I suppose other apps automatically expanding the video would be a good indicator.

There must be a flag. The reason I say this is that the 1080p 1440x1080 "Speed" WMV video shows up on my computer as 4:3, whereas most of the other 1080p 1440x1080 WMV videos are widescreen on my computer, despite being the same resolution. These latter files must be flagged. All these videos are 4:3 on the Xbox 360 though.

PS. In the other Xbox thread in the HD DVD section, a mention is made that 480p on DVD may be stretched on my TV due to DVD's non-square pixels.

What about 480p on HD DVD (ie. extras)? Can it be upscaled to 1080i over component (unlike DVD)?

[perpetual]

can you get the 1080p resolution through the component video cables, or do you have to use the VGA cables. I've been reading but haven't found the answer to this question. Thanks everyone.

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Originally Posted by perpetual

can you get the 1080p resolution through the component video cables, or do you have to use the VGA cables. I've been reading but haven't found the answer to this question. Thanks everyone.

Component: 1080p games and 1080i HD DVD
VGA cable: 1080p games and 1080p HD DVD

Note that most TV sets cannot acccept 1080p over component, but it depends on your specific model.

[TMSKILZ]

Originally Posted by perpetual

can you get the 1080p resolution through the component video cables, or do you have to use the VGA cables. I've been reading but haven't found the answer to this question. Thanks everyone.

Amirm who's an HD-DVD insider stated to me when I asked him this very question in another thread the following:

The XB360 HD-DVD add-on can do 1080p for games & movies only through VGA.

The XB360 HD-DVD add-on can only do 1080i through Component. But if you have a 1080p HDTV, your HDTV should be able to take that 1080i signal through Component & upconvert it to 1080p on it's own.

[perpetual]

Originally Posted by BuGsArEtAsTy

Component: 1080p games and 1080i HD DVD
VGA cable: 1080p games and 1080p HD DVD

Note that most TV sets cannot acccept 1080p over component, but it depends on your specific model.

My tv can do 1080p through both, component and VGA so thats not a problem. I just dont want to buy the extra VGA cable.

Originally Posted by TMSKILZ

Amirm who's an HD-DVD insider stated to me when I asked him this very question in another thread the following:

The XB360 HD-DVD add-on can do 1080p for games & movies only through VGA.

The XB360 HD-DVD add-on can only do 1080i through Component. But if you have a 1080p HDTV, your HDTV should be able to take that 1080i signal through Component & upconvert it to 1080p on it's own.

so it cant do 1080p on the games through component either? Well then I really need to get the VGA cable if I want 1080p from the 360.

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Originally Posted by perpetual

so it cant do 1080p on the games through component either? Well then I really need to get the VGA cable if I want 1080p from the 360.

Games do 1080p over component.

---

Interestingly, according to somebody in another thread who claims to have the HD DVD drive already (along with an older TV), 4:3 material on HD DVD displays correctly through the Xbox 360 even on TVs that stretch DVD 480p material. This applies to both 1080p 4:3 HD DVD material and 480p 4:3 HD DVDmaterial:

In other words, even with older TVs like mine that stretch DVD 4:3 material:

1) 4:3 1080p HD DVD displays correctly over component.
2) 4:3 480p HD DVD also displays correctly over component.

That's cool, but also very cool is the statement that all 480p HD DVD content is upscaled to HD over component.

So, assuming all of this is true, then HD DVD 4:3 playback of any kind will not be a problem for those of us with older TVs. We will still need another DVD player for DVD 4:3 playback, but that is not a big deal.

[Dioneo]

On the HD-DVD side of things, reports are that this player will not have HDMI output? If that is true, that means you won't be able to output the new HD audio formats DD TruHD and whatever DTS is calling their new audio format. If that's the case, it's a weakness that will become apparent to more people who start updating their surround receivers/processors over the next few years.

[tacos]

Is there anyway to watch T2 WMV on the 360 without having to stream it from the computer? Thanks

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Originally Posted by Dioneo

On the HD-DVD side of things, reports are that this player will not have HDMI output? If that is true, that means you won't be able to output the new HD audio formats DD TruHD and whatever DTS is calling their new audio format. If that's the case, it's a weakness that will become apparent to more people who start updating their surround receivers/processors over the next few years.

Correct. No HDMI output.

However, the Xbox 360 will decode TrueHD and re-encode on-the-fly to 640 Kbps Dolby Digital 5.1, for transmission over SPDIF. Not a perfect solution, but good enough for my needs for the time being. By the time HDMI 1.3 (or higher) is commonplace on players, TVs, and receiver, I suspect standalone players will be under $199, and I'll get one then.

OTOH, if you want HDMI output now, the Xbox 360 add-on is not an option.

Originally Posted by tacos

Is there anyway to watch T2 WMV on the 360 without having to stream it from the computer? Thanks

AFAIK, no.

[maverick0716]

Originally Posted by BuGsArEtAsTy

Correct. No HDMI output.

However, the Xbox 360 will decode TrueHD and re-encode on-the-fly to 640 Kbps Dolby Digital 5.1, for transmission over SPDIF. Not a perfect solution, but good enough for my needs for the time being. By the time HDMI 1.3 (or higher) is commonplace on players, TVs, and receiver, I suspect standalone players will be under $199, and I'll get one then.

OTOH, if you want HDMI output now, the Xbox 360 add-on is not an option.



AFAIK, no.

I thought the deal with systems that can't do Dolby TrueHD, etc. they would be downcoverted to the maxium bandwidth of the digital optical cable.......which is 1.5 mbps.

[Caldor]

As a workaround for those with display aspect ratio problems with streaming the same footage over vista ultimate with media centre extender these problems dont occur. Also some other wmv video codecs are supported too.

[GlenF]

I want 75Hz and 71.9 whatever it is Hz to get Judder free playback from HD-DVDs in PAL and NTSC land.
It needs to be a multiple of the framerate. 60Hz=unacceptable judder for me.

(EDIT: They have added 1080P 50Hz for PAL, but still 60Hz only for NTSC, yuk)

[Caurus]

Originally Posted by GlenF

I want 75Hz and 71.9 whatever it is Hz to get Judder free playback from HD-DVDs in PAL and NTSC land.
It needs to be a multiple of the framerate. 60Hz=unacceptable judder for me.

(EDIT: They have added 1080P 50Hz for PAL, but still 60Hz only for NTSC, yuk)

Hello World,

the 3:2 Pulldown is my biggest concern, too.

So far I do not have a xbox, but I expect to buy one soon. Is is correct, that it outputs 720p and 1080i only with a 60 Hz refresh rate or has this been changed with the last update?

I hope they will give us an option with a 50 Hz and maybe even a 24p option with 48 or 72 Hz. But for right now, I would be happy if they give us 50 Hz with a speedup (like the PAL speedup) instead of 3:2 Pulldown with judder and a blurry picture.

-Caurus

[Shane Shooter]

When you buy an HD DVD Drive do you have to use a HDMI input to take advantage of it ? or can you you get the HD signal with Component Video ?

[BuGsArEtAsTy]

Originally Posted by Shane Shooter

When you buy an HD DVD Drive do you have to use a HDMI input to take advantage of it ? or can you you get the HD signal with Component Video ?

Component is fine. That's what I'll be using.

HDMI isn't even supported on the Xbox 360 anyway.

[WilliamR]

Originally Posted by Shane Shooter

When you buy an HD DVD Drive do you have to use a HDMI input to take advantage of it ? or can you you get the HD signal with Component Video ?

Well, I already have it and I am using component, my TV is only capable of 720p (but accepts 1080p), when I play a regular movie, my TV states the input is 720p.

[Evan S]

I'm having a weird issue. Playing King Kong, my picture was somewhat laggy, like you were watching an Windows Media file on your PC and it was buffering. I played with the settings for my display (switching from 720P to 1080I) to no avail. I finally just got the disc out and cleaned it off and that worked fine. However, putting in Mission Impossible III, the HD-DVD drive won't recognize the disc at all. Yet the disc looks fine, not a scratch on it. It's labeled HD-DVD (it's a Netflix rental) but I put it in the DVD tray just in case. Sure enough, it won't play their either. Neither disc was overly dirty (if at all) when watching and yet I had various degrees of difficulty getting them to play perfectly. Anyone having anything similar at all happening with their player?

Picture quality is great though...no disappointments there at all.

I have a few more HD-DVD's on the way from Netflix so I will post back with more feedback later.

[DFul4d]

King Kong and Tokyo Drift both played perfectly for me.

[Photic]

Maybe I'm just dunce. I couldn't figure out how to open the tray from the menu with the remote. When I push the eject button on the remote it opens the 360's tray. Am I going about this incorrectly?

[Evan S]

Quick update on my situation. I got another copy of MI3 and it plays perfectly.

In the 360 in order to open just the tray on the HD-DVD player, you need to click on the bottom half of the circle in the dashboard.