How to record via IEEE 1394 (Firewire) to Windows XP

[madpoet]

My 6412 works, but 5c definately is turned on for anything but the locals.

[donquixote235]

Originally posted by Diode1
Try to unplug and reconnect the 1394 cable.

Tried it... I've both unplugged and replugged at the source (trying both firewire outs) and at my laptop, with the same issues.

[StLCards]

I saw in an earlier post someone had screenshots of more advanced menu items from the Moto 6208. How do you get to those? I know to hit "menu" to get to the HD menu, but what he was showing had individual port status, etc. Any help would be great.

[jonnyb]

I have been recording with DVHSCap and the SA3250HD via Comcast for a few weeks. I have the timers set up in DVHSCap, but I still need to manually check before each recording. DVHSCap will occasionally lose the ability to record network channels. It behaves like they are flagged for no copying. To fix this, I have to do a quick manual record of another channel (like Discovery HD). When I change the channel back to ABC, for example, I can then record with no problem.

Discovery HD seems to never have this problem, but CBS, ABC, and NBC all need to be "primed" to work. Has anyone else seen this behavior?

[shigaloo]

Originally posted by Mystic Pixel
How do I tell if a channel has 5C info?

also interested in how to tell what 5c level is enabled for a channel/program

using a 3250hd, trying to debug. I think i have the driver installed correctly, capvhs shows "panasonic MPEG2TS subinit unknown #1"

when i click record there is no info in any fields. The file is being created and gets large quickly, but is not playable.

also, is there any PC software to change channels via 1394?

thanks a bunch

-ds

[DFA]

shigaloo:

No way to change channels that I know of with this driver. Could be done if someone were to write Moto and SA specific drivers I suppose.

5c status is checked by going into the diagnostics menu for the STB. For the SA, on the box itself (not using the remote), press and hold the "+" button for a few seconds, the "envelope" light will come on blinking. (the + button is the "bulls-eye" in the middle of the 4 "arrow" keys). Press the "info" key next.

19 pages of data is available. Use the left / right navigation keys to move thru pages. Firebus port status is last or second to last page as I recall. SA will show CCI/EMI state rather than use the "5c" nomenclature but same, same. This is shown channel by channel so you must change channels to check state of the channel of interest.

Quit by pressing the "exit" key on the front panel.

DFA

[shigaloo]

DFA - THANKYOU!

guess ill go with an IR based solution for channel changing

[NGage]

Originally posted by drbenson
If you are getting audio glitches or video dropped frames on playback, pull out your motherboard manual and find a PCI slot for your audio card that does not share with your graphics card or HDTV card. ACPI sharing under XP DOES NOT work adequately for sharing an IRQ under .TS playback conditions, and the only way to get the audio card 'unshared' is to try slots, then look in Device Manager to see what's sharing IRQs with what.

drbenson,

THANK YOU for taking the time to come back and writeup your results! I have an HTPC with an Athlon 2200, am using CAPDVHS just as you, and was ready to give up and get a new machine, thinking I didn't have enough horsepower to avoid dropouts. Right now, I have my SB Audigy, a modem and the 1394 Host Controller all sharing IRQ 18 - I'm off to try to find another PCI slot!

NGage

[DFA]

OK, now for my mega-dollar question:

Background:
I have been playing with this STB Firewire TS for awhile and have some questions and some assumptions which might need dispelling. The SA3250HD STB shows everything free and clear which may or may not be true in reality. The TS of all digital SD stations will record / playback and display live w/o dificulty. I have six (6) HD channels: NBC (43), ABC (48), DISC-HD (55), TNT-HD (56), HBO-HD1 (790) and HBO-HD2 (791) (I might not quite have my channel #'s quite right but no matter). HBO-HD2 (791) captures great. HBO-HD1 (790) comes in about 50% when viewing live (audio and video starts and stops). ABC-HD, NBC-HD, TNT-HD, and DISC-HD I can't get at all except for some occassional snippets of audio (live viewing). Recorded files from these are just "black". You would think I could get ABC-HD, NBC-HD, TNT-HD or DISC-HD before either of the HBO-HD channels.

Not knowing exactly what the problem is, I decided I needed to educate myself some. I read up on Transport Streams and how they are constructed. I now know enough to be dangerous. I understand the terms (PSI, PAT CAT, PMT, NIT, PID, PCR, etc.). I understand how the header and payload of each 188 byte packet is constructed.

I downloaded TSReader Lite to analyze some of the streams. I recorded 1 minute files from some of the SD channels for reference and all six of the HD channels. I opened multiple instances of TSReader and analyzed the different files and compared. The SD files analyze OK as does the one HD channel (HBO-HD2 (791)) that also views and records OK. In fact, the SD's and the one good HD files looked very much the same. Oddly, though, they all show about 260 PAT's and only 2 PMT's for a 1 minute file although the bit rate for the PAT's and PMT's are reported the same. The PAT's and PMT's are marked with "*" meaning continuity errors. According to my reading (the dangerous part), PAT's and PMT's should be coming through at least every 0.5 second. That would mean a minimum of 120 PAT's and 120 PMT's. Very few recognized PMT's might explain slow channel change response and channel change lockups since the decoder can't lock-on until at least one PAT AND one PMT come through.

The 1 minute recorded file for HBO-HD1 (790) (the one that comes through about 50%) will analyze but shows lots of continuity errors (41,789 of them to be exact) and hundreds of "stray" PID's. Since these are SPTS (Single Program Transport Steams), there will be a limited and low number of valid PID streams and values in this application. Besides the PAT (always PID=0x0000) and the PMT (PID=0x1394), I show only one audio PID stream and video PID steam for the "good" channels. The 50% HBO-HD1 (790) channel shows also shows two defined PID streams (1 - video and 1 - audio) from the PMT but has all these "stray" packets and continuity errors. The "stray" packets can not be null packets as these should not even be in these non-ATSC type streams and even if present, would all have the same value of 0x1111 (or perhaps 0x1fff). Besides, the valid and defined video and audio streams show continutity errors (missing or wrongly ordered packets) which I take are all the stray packets that are found.

As expected, ABC-HD, NBC-HD, TNT-HD and DISC-HD analyze even worse. While I can tell what should be the video stream PID and the audio stream PID by virtue of the relative packet quantities displayed, the number of discontinuities and "stray" packets is over the top. TSReader does not even find a PAT or PMT in the analysis so does not know and is unable to display what the valid stream PID values are. In fact, TSReader seems to think it is a DSS stream.

So, finally, my question is this: Am I seeing corruption or is this encryption? I do not understand enough about DTCP to know where the encryption layer is implemented at. I would think that encryption would be at the packet level or more precisely at the packet payload level and that the fundamental structure of the Transport Stream would remain intact. Or does DTCP encryption scramble everything including the TS structure?

For anyone wanting to know more about TS, I found "broadcastpapers.com" to be very helpful; technical enough but not overly. Also, try TSReader Lite for looking at problem streams and compare this to good streams. Very informative and free! (not news for some I'm sure)

This may not be a good place to pose this question and get comments. If there is a better thread to place this post, please advise.

Regards,
Dane

[dr1394]

DTCP/5C encrypts the whole 188-byte Transport Stream packet. I've attached a DOS shell program that is similar to TSReader, but without a graphical user interface. It also does demuxing to elementary streams.

With this program, a DTCP/5C encrypted Transport Stream will demux to 0 byte elementary streams and print a million errors.

Usage is:

xport <-pavtdszng> <infile> <program number> <video stream number> <audio stream number>

typically:

xport something.ts 1 1 1

The output files are always named bits0001.mpv for video and bits0001.mpa for audio. Unless the -n option is used, the demuxer will time align the beginning of the two elementary streams so that a remux to PS or back to TS will have correct A/V sync.

Options:

p = parse only, do not demux to video and audio files.
a = dump audio PTS.
v = dump video PTS.
t = GOP timecode mode, count repeated fields/frames.
d = dump all PID's (useful for debugging muxers, but tons of output).
s = suppress TS rate dumping (useful when piping output to a file).
z = demux to PES streams (instead of elementary streams).
n = demux all audio, don't try to cut the start of audio to match the start of video.
g = dump ATSC PSIP information.

Update 07/14/2005:

added ATSC PSIP dumping option (-g).

Ron

[DFA]

Thanks Ron.

It's usage is clear and I will give that a shot as well. You stated that DTCP encrypts the entire packet. Does that include the PID value of the packet? And not just the PES packets but the PAT and PMT packet PID values as well?

Thanks,
Dane

[dr1394]

Everything is encrypted, even the 0x47 sync byte.

Ron

[TooLittleTimeZZZ]

Comcast is pushing out firmware v8.12 for the 6200 in my area (new guide look). Has anyone been able to record via the 1394 with that firmware (I haven't tried yet)?

[shankomatic]

If I wanted to use a machine to just run CAPDHVS to capture a HD stream from a Moto6208 what type of speed requirments would it need to create the TS files. I have no intention to use this machine for playback of the files. Just want to use it to write the TS stream to the computer.

[Wizziwig]

Originally posted by DFA

So, finally, my question is this: Am I seeing corruption or is this encryption? I do not understand enough about DTCP to know where the encryption layer is implemented at. I would think that encryption would be at the packet level or more precisely at the packet payload level and that the fundamental structure of the Transport Stream would remain intact. Or does DTCP encryption scramble everything including the TS structure?

Regards,
Dane

I found that certain cable systems introduce continuity errors which are not truly errors. They may repeat certain packets or incorrectly increment continuity counters in cases where they shouldn't (i.e no payload). If you want another method of checking continuity, try my MPEG2Repair utility. It ignores these false continuity errors and also checks the mpeg2 payload for actual decoding errors in the pictures. Of course, it will only work for non-encrypted data.

See this thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...hreadid=442446

-Mark

[shigaloo]

Originally posted by DFA


5c status is checked by going into the diagnostics menu for the STB. For the SA, on the box itself (not using the remote), press and hold the "+" button for a few seconds, the "envelope" light will come on blinking. (the + button is the "bulls-eye" in the middle of the 4 "arrow" keys). Press the "info" key next.

DFA

is this for SARA or passport? My 3250hd is running passport 3.3 build 017 and that little envelope wont light up no matter how long i press the "+"

thanks - ds

[shigaloo]

ok figured it out...

how to check 5c flag for 3250HD w/ passport software:

go to your diagnostic channel, mine in 996

press "exit" on the stb, a new screen opens

scroll down to 1394, it will display info for the last channel you tuned to

[DFA]

shigaloo:

Sorry, the info I gave you was for Sara based SA3250. I should have mentioned that.

DFA

[NGage]

Originally posted by shankomatic
If I wanted to use a machine to just run CAPDHVS to capture a HD stream from a Moto6208 what type of speed requirments would it need to create the TS files. I have no intention to use this machine for playback of the files. Just want to use it to write the TS stream to the computer.

Shankomatic,

From what I've read, the requirements for doing the capture of the TS stream are very low (I think I've read that sub-1Ghz machines work fine.)

I'm doing it with an Athlon 2200+ (1.8Ghz equivalent) with no problems, even while also playing back another recorded stream with Zoomplayer.

NGage

[grittree]

Originally posted by shankomatic
If I wanted to use a machine to just run CAPDHVS to capture a HD stream from a Moto6208 what type of speed requirments would it need to create the TS files. I have no intention to use this machine for playback of the files. Just want to use it to write the TS stream to the computer.

If it's not doing anything else, any puter that can load winXP will do fine. About 400mhz should do it easily.

[shankomatic]

Thanks for the info. I will give it a try tommorow.

[dr_steel]

My 3250HD does not have firewire ports. Does anyone know offhand if TWC in Austin has the other model ?
Thanks

[shigaloo]

Originally posted by dr_steel
My 3250HD does not have firewire ports. Does anyone know offhand if TWC in Austin has the other model ?
Thanks

im not in austin, but i had to special order mine

check or ask in this thread

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...ghlight=austin

[Najeeb]

I've got a SA3250 with the 1394 ports but I guess they are disabled since I can't get any kind of reaction in XP when I connect the 1394 cable.

Any idea if the ports can be enabled? Does the cable company have to do it? Any way around this?

Thanks in advance

[DFA]

If the firmware / software is installed, the ports should be active. Check through your diagnostics screens for the 3250. Not many posts back it was stated how to get to the diagnostics for both Sara based and Passport based 3250's so look there for instructions.

DFA

[shigaloo]

hey folks I am just getting up to speed here - i read all the posts but theres a lot to digest, so a couple of quick questions

i have about 8 channels flagged "copy freely" and 2 "copy once"

in capdhvs the copy once channels record, but report no info in the fields and the file is garbage

the copy freely stuff record and report resolution, framerate and a bitrate of 80mbs. Opening the file in a player i can get alot of "tearing" and artifacts.

so i opened the file in HDTV2MPEG2 to see if there were multiple streams, but the program reported no steams

i havent tried recording by dvhs (jvc40k) yet, as i dont have any blank tapes but i could

also I am assuming i have the drivers installed correctly, but whenever i plug in the firewire cable it wants to install 3 devices, "a/v panel" and 2 others. Is this normal?

thanks -ds

[dc10forlife]

Originally posted by shigaloo
ok figured it out...

how to check 5c flag for 3250HD w/ passport software:

go to your diagnostic channel, mine in 996

press "exit" on the stb, a new screen opens

scroll down to 1394, it will display info for the last channel you tuned to

FOr some reason, I can't get to the service menu directly. While the settop box is on, I press and hold exit while holding in the diamond button in the middle of the directional buttons. The STB emits a beep and then I can get into the service menu. This is for the 3250HD w/passport.

All channels are marked "copy once". However, I can record my local channels, INHD1, INHD2, TNT-HD and Discovery-HD. I cannot record HBO-HD, Shotime-HD, ESPN-HD and HDNET even though they are marked "copy once". Can anyone explain? I have a feeling the STB is not accurate.

[shigaloo]

Originally posted by dc10forlife
FOr some reason, I can't get to the service menu directly. While the settop box is on, I press and hold exit while holding in the diamond button in the middle of the directional buttons. The STB emits a beep and then I can get into the service menu. This is for the 3250HD w/passport.

All channels are marked "copy once". However, I can record my local channels, INHD1, INHD2, TNT-HD and Discovery-HD. I cannot record HBO-HD, Shotime-HD, ESPN-HD and HDNET even though they are marked "copy once". Can anyone explain? I have a feeling the STB is not accurate.

dc - i was only able to get the menu by going to the diagnostics channel and then holding the exit button. didnt try two buttons at once...

by the following progression "HD channel" -> "Diangnostics Channel" -> "Enter Menu" i was able to get the status of each "HD channel"

for example tune to 701, then 996, then entering the menu would display the status of 701. to get the status of 702 i would have to start over

[DFA]

For HTPC, "copy once" or "copy never" flags are death. Even "copy freely" channels can have issues (but should not).

I have been analyzing streams from my SA3250HD Sara-based STB and have been getting a little help from a more knowledgeable forum member. It seems some of my "copy freely" HD streams are full of discontinuities and stray packets having random PID values while yet some of the stream is intact and as it should be. It seems the STB is falsely handling some of the streams. I suspect others are experiencing some of this "phenomena" as well.

I have firebus rev. 2.5.7.1.

DFA

[DaveFi]

Argh! I can't get WinXP SP2 to recognize my DVHS deck properly.

At first it shows the proper Player/Recorder, but then it switches over to standard Tape Device. When I install the JVC drivers for it, it won't work.

Anyone see this problem before?