IR to BT Converters (yes there are 4 of them): Comparisons/User Reviews

[dogdoctor]

Since I purchased the PS3 at launch, I've been patiently waiting for the IR command of the PS3 via BT since it came out. I can't think of a day that I ever regret purchasing my Harmony universal remote, but the PS3 did make it very problematic from a one remote control perspective.

Now it appears that 6 very small companies (and 1 large) have come out with a similar device. All will take the IR commands from a programmable universal remote and then resend the signal as a BT command the PS3 can receive. It's a 1 remote home theater answer if you have and like PS3.

IR2BT

11/3/08 DISCONTINUED: The IR2BT, made by IR2BT Devices, Inc. hit the streets first as ordering began on 3/28/08 - selling 200 in approx. 12 hours and preordering another 300 in about 8 hours 1 week later. The current plans of the manufacturer at this time of writing is to ship 100 units/week. To power the device the owner can use a mini-usb cable to an always on USB port or 2 AA batteries. So far what I'm hearing is the reviews are good if not great. The current price is $55 plus shipping. There is an option for an opt-in mailing list when more IR2BT become available. IR2BT offers good forum support for their device and consumers.

MAJOR EDIT: With as of Firmware 2.40 on 7/1/08 there appears to be a problem with BT communication and pairing upon startup of a PS3 with IR2BT units with serial numbers from 0001 to 1399. If you didn't update to 2.40/2.41 and you have an affected unit, there isn't a problem yet. However, when you do upgrade your PS3's firmware you will run into this unfortunate error. Without the ability for the user to update firmware for the IR2BT device at home, this is real problem, but a fix has been made. It does however, require you sending your unit back to the manufacturer to flash a new firmware that corrects for the problem. Follow the instructions for returning the IR2BT as found on their website. All currently sold IR2BT units are not showing this error and according to the manufacturer while it might be possible for Sony to cause an error in the future, that change in BT would have to disable the functionality of the Sony BT remote, so it is believed to be highly unlikely to happen again.

8/31/09 MAJOR EDIT UPDATE:In a wacky twist of fate, with the release of FW 3.00 for the PS3, if you never sent your IR2BT back in the recall to be fixed, it should now be working! Well that is what users here at AVS are reporting. A full year later Sony messes with its firmware and its like the problem never existed. I'm sure Bruce with the IR2BT company is little less than thrilled to hear that.

NEW IR2BTci: The IR2BT company has discontinued the original IR2BT model and replaced it with the new IR2BTci model sold for $150. For information and images: start here. The major changes include power by USB option and firmware upgradeable but read the link for further details.


SCHMARTSTUFF

The second group of products, are brought to you by Schmartz.com. Schmartz.com does offer great email support and communications to which I can attest and a return customer discount.

EDIT: Their first product, the PS3IR-PRO has now been discontinued (firmware support still continues). What once sold for $100 has now been replaced with much more feature packed and cheaper alternatives. See Below:

EDIT (5/7/09): NEW PS3IR-1000 has been released which boasts USB Power Sensing for flawless power functions, Infrared Emitting for remote control programming, twelve User Macros including a fully editable Discrete Off macro, and PS3 control from your PC desktop. Full PS3 control including Discrete On and Discrete Off, external infrared input, firmware upgradeability and good looks with slimmer design, LED status indicator for power state/signal reception. PS3 powerstate sensing (ps) (additional USB ps cable required - see accessories) and custom macros at a price of $80 ($90 w/ ps cable).

EDIT (9/14/09): NEW PS3IR-500 Just to add, as I am a current Schmartz consumer, he had added a new lower cost device running at $39.99 that beats the logitech in functionality and price, while maybe not in aesthetics. Apparently its virtually the same as the PS3IR-1000, but without the power sensing. EDIT: 4/16/2010 - It appears to be discontinued.


PS3TOOTHFAIRY

As of a post today at avs, there appears to now be a 3rd player in this niche market. http://www.ps3toothfairy.com has come out with something very similar to the above 2 products. Their target ship date is 4/30/08 with a starting price of $50 (which will hopefully be lower) that is a retrofit, utilizing your existing PS3 remote. The $75 assembly is ready to go, minus the power supply. For power, "the ps3toothfairy uses a standard 2.1mm polarized, tip-positive barrel connector. We will also offer a subminiature 110-250V wall pack as well as a USB-A to 2.1mm cable. You may of course provide your own power cable, the device requires a 4 to 12VDC input. For installers that wish to build their own cable, we can provide a list of qualified connectors." Sorry for the direct quote, but that escapes my technical jargon. There is an option for an opt-in mailing list for when the toothfairies go on sale/are available. There is now an PS3toothfairy thread going here at AVS which has some user reviews and discussion.


IR4PS3

EDIT: 5/23/08 - I have updated this post to include the 4th version of an IR to BT converter. There unfortunately is very little web information about this product but I will give you what posters have reported. The device is called the IR4PS3 and has been available since mid-April, and according to some works great. There is no website as of yet, but all inquiries/orders are done through ir4ps3@hotmail.com c/o Ben. For a review of the IR4PS3 you can read a pretty good review at remotecentral.com. According to one reviewer, the the latest version of the device includes a kit with a little box that requires you to pull the card out of the PS3 BT remote and also get an AC adapter for everything to work. There is now an IR4PS3 thread going here at AVS which has some user reviews and discussion.


BLUEBEAM

EDIT: 3/5/09 - And it looks like we might now have yet a 5th player in this game if IR control of the PS3. Audio Authority's new BlueBeam IR to Bluetooth converter. It will be available late March and it appears it will also among the most expensive at $159. We'll have to see how that plays out.


HARMONY

EDIT: 3/19/09 (updated 5/13/09) - And yet again there is new player in town. This time coming from a much bigger name. It looks like Logitech/Harmony is about to enter the fray of IR to BT converters. Here is the link @ EngadgetHD It is now out and for sale at Amazon for $59.99!

8/31/09 MAJOR EDIT: Apparently with the advent of the PS3 Slim, when used in conjunction with Harmony adapter, seems to have created a major pairing problem for BT devices. Not a good sign for a device that doesn't have the ability to update its firmware.

The problem has been isolated by Logitech to a FW change made by Sony and select Logitech devices with PID #'s earlier than LZ922xx will have this issue with PS3 slims. The have RMA's the affected devices and those currently being shipped are not affected.



SYNOPSIS

So, for those of you out there looking for a IR/BT universal remote to work this your PS3, you need not to. Check out these three sites to see your options to get the PS3 onto your IR universal remote. For those that have any product I/we would love to hear your reviews.

Here is very good synopsis for 3 of the 4 IR/BT converters in layman terms. Big thanks to Beerstalker!

Originally Posted by Beerstalker

Nyko BluWave - does not support PS button so not power on or off. Does not allow you to directly control audio tracks, subtitles, video angles, color buttons, etc. You have to bring up the PlayStation on screen menu and use it to perform those functions. The IR receiver looks like a thumb drive sticking out of the front of the PS3 when installed.

Edit by dogdoctor 8/15/08: with PS update 2.40 there is now an option to turn off the PS3 without the use of the PS button. So in essence with pure IR controllers of the PS3 you can now turn off the PS3, you still however, can not turn it on.

Shmartz Stuff PS3IRX1 - Same limitations as the Nyko BluWave. This is a more attractive USB device that blends into the PS3 so well most people won't even notice it is there.

IR2BT - supports all the same functions as the official Sony Bluetooth remote. Requires the remote control to send out the macro for power down (PS, down, down, PS held for 3.5 seconds, X, X). Some Universal remotes cannot be programmed with a 3.5 second button hold, so the macro will not work with them. Those owner's would have to shut the PS3 down manually. This unit can not be updated in the field, so it possibly could stop to work at some point in the future but it is highly unlikely.

PS3 Toothfairy - supports all the same functions as the official Sony Bluetooth remote. The power off macro is built into the unit itself, so users just send a single discreet power off command from their remote, and the PS3Toothfairy sounds out the entire power off macro (so you don't have to sit there and point the remote at the unit for 5 seconds while the PS3 shuts down). The PS3Toothfairy is also available in a version that offers a 3.5mm mono jack input for direct IR control. The PS3 Toothfairy does not support firware upgrades (at least not that I know of), but it does offer the ability to change some of programming through different button presses etc, so it should be a little more futureproof.

PS3IR-Pro - Supports all the same functions as the official Sony Bluetooth remote. A recent firmware update has the power off macro is built into the unit itself. Users just send a single discreet power off command from their remote, and the Pro sounds out the entire power off macro (so you don't have to sit there and point the remote at the unit for 5 seconds while the PS3 shuts down). The Pro allows for firware updates through a USB port, so it can add new features and be more future proof. Mike is still working to get direct IR control working, but as of right now it is not.

[dogdoctor]

I missed the IR2Bt original preorder and then after much communication with Schmartz.com, I've decided to go the PS3IR-PRO route, skipping the second IR2BT preorder. I'll post my review as soon as I get it. I'm glad both these companies took on this endeavor. It will be interesting to see how the patent thing works out if everything holds up.

[zmn668]

I have had the IR2BT for 1 week now and I feel it is a great product. Extremely easy to set up and works exactly as the Sony BT remote only I am using my Harmony 880. As this is the sole purpose of this device I couldn't ask for anything more.

Bill

[Bugg77]

Originally Posted by zmn668

I have had the IR2BT for 1 week now and I feel it is a great product. Extremely easy to set up and works exactly as the Sony BT remote only I am using my Harmony 880. As this is the sole purpose of this device I couldn't ask for anything more.

Bill

I'm with you! Bruce and the IR2BT group have been great! Some of the things I like a lot:

1. There's no lag in usage
2. Paring was easy and straight forward, and it stays paired with the PS3, even after a loss of power
3. My IR2BT doesn't stand out in my system
4. It's powered through my DirecTV HD-DVR's USB port
5. The $55 price is just about right
6. The IR2BT has been working with Logitech to provide a solid default button mapping
7. Great communication from Bruce and the IR2BT company

[Budysr]

Why pay 75-100 when you can get the same effect for 55? IR2BT seems to be the better deal at this point and that is where my money will go

[kyungkim]

This thread is completely premature. There aren't 2 alternatives, only one.
If the ps3irpro ships on april 15th, I'd be very, very surprised.

A week before the launch, I would suspect he would have review samples out to beta testers by now. There doesn't seem to be a real photo of the final product yet.

Whatever the situation is, I don't think its cool to offer a product at over double the price (shmartz lowered it down from an original price of ~130) and start waving the patent hammer. Especially if your product hasn't yet shipped. It's not really in keeping with the spirit of these projects.

Besides, there has been home grown versions of this talked about on the intraweb since back in December. Theres more to this than the simple idea, there has to be some hardcore engineering in there, not merely to get it to work, but to produce it in decent quantities at this price.

[brhow]

ir2bt:
-currently available through preorder (at times)
-already in hands of customers with positive feedback
-$55
-great communication with customers

PS3IR-PRO:
-not yet available
-no customer reviews whatsoever
-$100 (brief sale for $75)
-creator tried to sell it in a thread devoted to the competition, while insinuating that his
patent would eliminate the competition (a classless move)

seems like an easy decision to me, especially based on the behavior of the PS3IR-PRO creator.

[bryansj]

I've got the IR2BT and it works great. I chose it over the PS3IR-PRO for two reasons:

1. It was cheaper (this was also before the $75 "sale").
2. It was available first

[jmpage2]

Originally Posted by brhow

ir2bt:
-currently available through preorder (at times)
-already in hands of customers with positive feedback
-$55
-great communication with customers

PS3IR-PRO:
-not yet available
-no customer reviews whatsoever
-$100 (brief sale for $75)
-creator tried to sell it in a thread devoted to the competition, while insinuating that his
patent would eliminate the competition (a classless move)

seems like an easy decision to me, especially based on the behavior of the PS3IR-PRO creator.

I couldn't agree more. I was disappointed to see such a cheap shot move from a company that has generally been well received around AVS.

And who knows on this patent business. He didn't mention the patent number, or what specifically the patent covers. You would think that the IR2BT would be exempt from the patent as "prior art", they had samples and shipping products long before the PS3IR-PRO has gotten to market.

[steven975]

well, one delayed the product to get the patent process started, one didn't.

I doubt it will remove the IR2BT from the market, though. You'll just see the price go up to cover any possible royalties.

[jmpage2]

Originally Posted by steven975

well, one delayed the product to get the patent process started, one didn't.

I doubt it will remove the IR2BT from the market, though. You'll just see the price go up to cover any possible royalties.

In all likelihood it will be a year or more before such a supposed patent infringement would ever make it to the courts, although based on previous tactics from the Schmartz guy I would suspect that "cease and desist" papers have already been sent to Bruce of IR2BT.

It really chaps my hide to see someone bust their ass to bring a product to market at a fairly reasonable price only to have someone else swoop in a month or two later claiming that they patented the idea for their ridiculously overpriced version of the same thing.

[dogdoctor]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

....It really chaps my hide to see someone bust their ass to bring a product to market at a fairly reasonable price only to have someone else swoop in a month or two later claiming that they patented the idea for their ridiculously overpriced version of the same thing.

This wasn't meant to be an attack one business practice vs another thread. Who is to say they haven't both busted their butts to reach the state they are at. If you can refrain, please keep this type of jargon out of it.

Now it is true no one can prove patent to be true other than the manufacturer. That being the case, those that already bought the IR2BT won't lose out on anything, they will still have a product that works. Future buyers may just have to pay a higher price to cover royalties - but that is all pure speculation at this time. I just said it would be interesting to see what happens with the pattent - I mean someone had to pattent it right?

I spoke with Schmartz.com yesterday - shipments plan on going out very likely this thursday.

I will say - for a company that had some pretty good feedback at AVS, this little device (and some controversial posts I hear) has created some real animosity.

[jmpage2]

The reason for the animosity is that the owner of Shmartz dropped an advertising blurb about their new PS3-IR device into the thread dedicated to the IR2BT device.

Not only did this happen but the forementioned patent was mentioned with an insinuation that sales/support of the IR2BT might cease at some point due to patent infringement.

Personally I found it unprofessional in the extreme, and apparently the mods agreed as the offending post and responses were removed from that thread.

[Bugg77]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

The reason for the animosity is that the owner of Shmartz dropped an advertising blurb about their new PS3-IR device into the thread dedicated to the IR2BT device.

Not only did this happen but the forementioned patent was mentioned with an insiduation that sales/support of the IR2BT might cease at some point due to patent infringement.

Personally I found it unprofessional in the extreme, and apparently the mods agreed as the offending post and responses were removed from that thread.

Agreed on all counts!

As for the patent, it is a non-issue. Even if the folks at Schmartz are awarded a patent (in a year or two), the IR2BT has a case to have the patent voided. Not only that, but it is cost prohibitive to carry forward a patent infringement lawsuit for companies of this size. By the time any of this could even happen, we'll be moving on to the PS4!

[dogdoctor]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

The reason for the animosity is that the owner of Shmartz dropped an advertising blurb about their new PS3-IR device into the thread dedicated to the IR2BT device.

Not only did this happen but the forementioned patent was mentioned with an insiduation that sales/support of the IR2BT might cease at some point due to patent infringement.

Personally I found it unprofessional in the extreme, and apparently the mods agreed as the offending post and responses were removed from that thread.

And while I agree with you - what you are doing here is not furthing the actual topic of this thread. I guess if had I been the maker, I might have created my own thread and slipped a post in IR2BT thread that said something to the effect of if you still can't get the IR2BT check out this thread, letting people do their own reading of the options. That is what I attempted to do here. But thanks for the continued lambasting of the guy for some misguided posts, and derailment of this thread. You haven't yet even posted that you have an IR2BT.

Edit: Can we again keep this to the comparisons of the 2 devices. On a personal note from the invention side I'm intrigued to see if there are any.

[jmpage2]

Originally Posted by dogdoctor

And while I agree with you - what you are doing here is not furthing the actual topic of this thread. I guess if had I been the maker, I might have created my own thread and slipped a post in IR2BT thread that said something to the effect of if you still can't get the IR2BT check out this thread, letting people do their own reading of the options. That is what I attempted to do here. But thanks for the continued lambasting of the guy for some misguided posts, and derailment of this thread. You haven't yet even posted that you have an IR2BT.

Edit: Can we again keep this to the comparisons of the 2 devices. On a personal note from the invention side I'm intrigued to see if there are any.

I have IR2BT order #160 and will provide a review when it arrives (it shipped Monday). I also believe that the character and behavior of the companies involved IS a factor to many here, and that it did deserve some discourse.

[dogdoctor]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

I also believe that the character and behavior of the companies involved IS a factor to many here, and that it did deserve some discourse.

Yes, and people make mistakes. But hey feel free to make your own thread about why you hate the company. I don't even have the product yet to hate it. I believe I ordered mine before the discourse at avs took place. As far as I have seen - I have had great customer support via email, even cancelling an order for the IR version that I placed, not five minutes before finding out about the IR2BT and the PRO version. And so I patiently wait.

I'd like to see your reveiw. I hope you will take the time to read mine and compare when mine arrives.

[omegadsl]

I received my IR2BT this morning. Pairing went smoothly and the product works exactly as advertised. I am very happy with this device.

[Bugg77]

I'm just not sure how much of a review/comparison there can be. Both devices will convert some set of IR commands to BT and unless the PS3IR-Pro has a discreet power function then I don't see a difference other than price.

I'm very happy with my IR2BT and even a discreet power function wouldn't be worth an additional $20-$45 IMHO.

[MMuecke]

First of all, please don't respond to this post. It is slightly off topic but I wanted to get my apology out there. If you would like to contact me please PM me instead. That way we wouldn't be pulling this thread off topic.

I see now that my post was not appropriate. I was naive and just not thinking. I thought what I posted was very topical. If I had realized it was inappropriate I would not have posted. My intent was to be informative, not to offend or invade anyone's territory. If there is anyone out there that was offended by my post on the IR2BT related thread, I am truly sorry. I wandered over because someone was sprinkling IR2BT posts all over the thread that people use to find out what's going on with my products (it's not my thread , it's theirs!). I actually thought it was kind of funny and annoying at the same time. There was no information, just the advertisement for the IR2BT device

As far as the patent is concerned, I applied for the patent in January for a generic device that converts IR commands to BlueTooth commands, and citing the PS3 as an example. I put together my first full prototype back in November but was fiddling around with the concept much earlier. It wasn't until several people posted that they would like to see a device like that available that I decided to move it to the front burner. I seem to remember one AVS member even cobbled something together using relays to make closures on the PS3 remote keypad. That pretty much convinced me I should spend the resources on a production model. This is all from memory so I don't remember if the relay version was before the nice guy in Canada was doing his or what. The point is, there was just a great deal of interest then by many folks.

yada yada Yada... the bottom line is I applied for a patent because it is the sensible thing to do if you're going to pour money into something. In today's market, it is less useful, but still expected, when you meet with anyone about investing. I applied because it is just good business practice. I am trying to bring a product to market for the purpose of providing a solution for this problem. It's Sony that everyone should be upset with, not me. I've put in really long hours this year providing solutions for this market. And I have shelled out my own cash to get them out. I've also reinvested all profits back into growing the company and bringing new products to market.

I'd just like to say that the early adopters are part of the team and are partially responsible for any products developed by a small company. I get the sense that most people get that and in fact, enjoy being part of the whole process. It is a selfless act since inevitably you end up buying each new and improved version as it comes out and almost always pay much more at first as well. But this allows and nurtures the development of a product. Otherwise we would all be slaves to the Sony's of the world that pretty much do whatever they want and have very little dialog with the very customers in the markets they serve. If they did they would have provided IR. Doh!

I disagree with the lower price for the early stages of a product because it doesn't provide much to help grow and evolve the solution. Eventually, yes, that price will likely come down if a big piece of the market buys in because of the economy of scale.

Fortunately for me, the market I am after is the people who want a well supported and fully featured solution. That would include some very cool people here at AVS plus mainly the installer market. They get it. And they participate. And I totally appreciate their support and business.

Again, my post on the other thread was ill advised and I'm truly sorry. Everyone that knows me and has done business with Schmartz.com knows that I am fair, honest, and earnest in my desire to help provide a solution for this market. But that doesn't mean that I can't be naive or even dumb sometimes.

Mike Muecke
Schmartz.com

[MMuecke]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

I couldn't agree more. I was disappointed to see such a cheap shot move from a company that has generally been well received around AVS.

And who knows on this patent business. He didn't mention the patent number, or what specifically the patent covers. You would think that the IR2BT would be exempt from the patent as "prior art", they had samples and shipping products long before the PS3IR-PRO has gotten to market.

I respond only because you seem to cast doubt on my integrity. This info is useless but, there you are.

[jmpage2]

I'm not going to dignify much of that with a response as you are busy labeling people as "whiners", "trashers", etc. If you will recall you are the one that dropped into a thread dedicated to a competitor product that was 1st to market with talk about patent infringement and royalties. As far as the patent you have provided, it's interesting as it's the same date that this article was featured on remotecentral.com in which the proof of concept for IR->BT conversion for the PS3 was actually demonstrated by the sharp fellow in Canada who had working prototypes to show off before your patent was ever filed.

I believe Bruce started providing details of the IR2BT back in early February.

So, as far as patenting, good luck with all of that, as it seems that there were prototypes, etc, from others in existence at the time the patent was filed.

In any event, here's the review I promised to dogdoctor which is more in the spirit of this thread. I received my IR2BT today in the mail (order #160) which had shipped out from FL on Monday and somehow made it to Colorado in just two days (you gots to love USPS Priority Mail).

The device ships in a plastic bubble wrap sleeve and includes a single sheet of paper thanking you for purchasing the product and recommends you visit the website www.youtube.com/ir2bt for informational videos on pairing the device with the PS3, etc.

I think it would be helpful if a simple manual (even just a few sheets of paper) were included for instructions, but right now the market is probably almost solely among the techn-illuminati so probably won't be much of an issue.

As promised I was able to find the IR2BT profile in Harmony's database, which is also when I discovered the oft-mentioned problem that the default buttons aren't assigned. It only takes a few minutes to assign all of the buttons, including the zillion extra ones that aren't mapped onto the standard keys. I'm using the 880 and setup was pretty painless.

I plugged the IR2BT into my Tivo HD box's USB port, saw the little light jump on and knew I only had about 10-15 seconds to pair the device. I navigated with my PS3 remote into the accessories section of the PS3 setup, and told the PS3 to look for a remote to pair with. At this point I held down "2" on the Harmony remote (which I had already done the button assignments for, an important step) and after a few seconds the Sony reported it was pairing with the remote. A second later it showed it was finished.

That's literally all there is to it. Setup is extremely simple. One nice thing is that since the device is BT you can really put it anywhere you want, I just stacked it in my home theater rack.

Speed wise it is MUCH faster than the Nyko Blu-Wave USB-IR solution I had been using, there is no control lag at all. Additionally I no longer have the annoying problem of having to re-assign controller numbers due to the Nyko always taking up controller position number 1 on the PS3.

Power up and power down work great as activity macros with the Harmony 880. It does take the PS3 a while to actually shut down so at first I didn't think it was working, but it does. Apparently a different power down macro is required if you want to power down from within a game without going to the main PS3 system menu. Powering down from the menu or from within a BD movie seems to work fine though.

It's a real treat having total and complete integration between my 880 and PS3. This is really what Sony should have provided in the first place.

IR2BT is a solid buy at $55 + shipping, although obviously you might be in for a bit of a wait at the moment as demand is much higher than they can currently handle. They could probably sell several thousand right now and simply can't produce that many.

On the other hand you have the satisfaction of knowing that the units have (apparently) been built in the US and tested so you know that it will work. I haven't read of anyone getting a DOA or defective one yet on their forum.

[xahmol]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

On the other hand you have the satisfaction of knowing that the units have (apparently) been built in the US and tested so you know that it will work. I haven't read of anyone getting a DOA or defective one yet on their forum.

Thanks for your review JMpgae, I am now eagerly waiting for my order that just shipped yesterday (but it will take probably some time to get to the Netherlands and past customs).

Just I could not help my self commenting: how does 'built in the US' and 'so you know that it will work' in any way relate to each other? Personally I could not care less where the product is build if I hear good reviews of people who have actually received the product.
Of course the fact that the product is priced in US$ is a very nice bonus at this moment that the US$ is at an all time low against the Euro and still dropping If it would have been an European build product it would probably have cost three times as much.

[HYPERTUNE]

Hmmmm, anyway...

I received my IR2BT today (order#98/99) and am extremely happy with it. Very easy to set up and works perfectly with my Harmony 1000. The PS3 integrates with my system just as well as the rest of my components, if not better (I actually have a good use for the directional and OK keys now . I guess this might be stating the obvious, but it works so seamlessly it is as if the PS3 has an IR port.

[jmpage2]

Originally Posted by xahmol

Just I could not help my self commenting: how does 'built in the US' and 'so you know that it will work' in any way relate to each other? Personally I could not care less where the product is build if I hear good reviews of people who have actually received the product.
Of course the fact that the product is priced in US$ is a very nice bonus at this moment that the US$ is at an all time low against the Euro and still dropping If it would have been an European build product it would probably have cost three times as much.

Thanks for making sure your first post here was devoid of merit. If some guy is building something in his garage and testing it out, vs. having thousands cranked out in a sweat shop, which product do you think is going to have a higher DOA rate?

[Bugg77]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

Thanks for making sure your first post here was devoid of merit. If some guy is building something in his garage and testing it out, vs. having thousands cranked out in a sweat shop, which product do you think is going to have a higher DOA rate?

I would say that it depends on the complexity - or maybe even maturity - of the product.

How many faulty LCD/Plasma TVs do you see? Very, very few. Of course, good QA costs money and a small company like IR2BT or Scmartz probably can't afford to pay a factory for the kind of QA that they could get by doing it themselves. Maybe they both will be able to transition to that in the future, but in this day and age, where's it's made has almost nothing to do with quality.

[xahmol]

Originally Posted by jmpage2

Thanks for making sure your first post here was devoid of merit. If some guy is building something in his garage and testing it out, vs. having thousands cranked out in a sweat shop, which product do you think is going to have a higher DOA rate?

Hey, do not take my post too seriously. But seriously, since when is 'not made in the US' and 'made in a sweat shop' the same? That is where I was reacting on. Most stuff nowadays in the electronics business come from Taiwan, China or elsewhere in South-East Asia, and most of that stuff has excellent DOA rates.
But my apologies for getting this topic off-topic, the important thing is that the IR2BT seems to be working excellently, will gladly recieve my own experience when I receive it.

[Fit2Run]

I have yet to try it but I will assume it works as advertised and reviewed. AS far as customer service Bruce was a straight shooter. Got the product as promised in the time frame promised. He took efforts to email me to confirm my order.

I hope both companies do well with their product and make lots of money. Most likely neither will make much of a killing unless they are bought out. But makes no sense to by either company or technology since PS3 is the only application and once PS4 or even sony comes out with their own Ir2bt everything else will be moot.

8/10 business fail within 3 years.

[brhow]

the more MMuecke posts, the less likely I am to ever buy one of his products.

[kyungkim]

Unfortunately there are NOT 2 sources. MM's product has yet to ship, and from the looks on his site it doesnt look like it anytime soon. The finished product from Bruce is in many ppl's hands (including myself) and its already much further along than MM's mockup photos. There is nothing MM could add to his product to make up for his higher price and lateness to market for what is really just a niche product.

I'm sure this MM is a nice guy. Was very close to getting one of his devices, but the tapeon solution looked like too much of a hack and its already been shut down by the fw update. He must have put a lot of work into this and it must be frustrating as hell to see someone else "cash in" as it were.

His recent posts have done nothing good for himself or his business.