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JBL 2226H enclosure question

31K views 103 replies 20 participants last post by  Kwikas 
#1 ·
I am thinking about building some speakers (LCR's) which will use the 2226h driver from 80 to 500-800hz and then use a compression driver + horn from JBL as well (not decided yet).


I know that JBL recommends an enclosure of 5 cu feet and tuning to 40hz, but what if I decide to use a 3 cu feet enclosure with tuning to 40hz as well? What would the difference in sound quality be?


I have modelled both in WinISD and they have almost the same FR (the smaller enclosure has higher -3db point of course), but does the enclosure size have any influence on the sound when the speakers will be crossed over at 80hz to a sub?
 
#3 ·
No, not really. If you were running a 'sub-less' speaker system and were pushing for each dB of bass then I'd say go for the bigger vented box but as a cinema system, you would be hard pressed to notice much difference. Only a 2-3dB difference between the two in a very narrow bandwidth (35-55hz).


Not worth having the extra sized cab, imho.


Good luck! Sounds like a fun speaker system.
 
#4 ·
If I were crossing to a sub at 80Hz and using active xovers for it I would probably just go sealed and give it at tickle of EQ to get it flat at xover. Box would be circa 40L for Qt=0.707. There is only about 2.5dB difference between the sealed and ported at 80Hz.


If I had to go ported, then there is no real difference between the two enclosure sizes, so I'd go with the smaller one.
 
#5 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian /forum/post/19891789


Not worth having the extra sized cab, imho.

Written by the guy with 50 cu feet subs
Kidding, I know it has much more to say down low..


About the sealed design, I am a little concerned about the FR. The -3db point is around 100hz and its a little more than 5db down at 70hz...But once I have the drivers, it'll be quite easy to try different enclosures.
 
#6 ·
*laughs*



Yeah, but that was worth it.



You didn't mention if you were using an active crossover or not (or I prolly missed it) but if you're using something like a Behringer DCX2496, you could get away with using a shelving filter to bring up the lowend of the sealed cabs. Doing this does limit total output above the knee of this filter though. Be aware of that. If your average listening levels are not that high, you could get away with this.
 
#8 ·
I'm currently using a JBL 4645c sub (with the 2242H driver I think), and I'll be adding another one when my project starts



You're right, I didnt mention anything about filters. I'm planning on using the Behringer DCX you mention. But the x-over to the sub will be handled by the processor and not the Behringer. But I can of course do some EQ'ing on the box anyway.


The expected listening levels will be ref.level (105db) at a distance of about 13 feet. I would think the 2226's should be able to handle this.
 
#11 ·
#13 ·
I just put down an offer for a new place, so if the seller accepts it, then my project begins when I move in
But that'll first be a couple of month into the future - just doing all the research now.


I am planning to use the top section from the 4722 cinema speaker: http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/The...es/4722-HF.pdf

Its the 2432 driver with a ScreenArray horn.


But I'm still very much in doubt about the speaker choice.. Have though about the Klipsch THX package too or the JBL LSR6332 - or even the pre-built 4722's. Argh this hobby ain't easy!
 
#14 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrager /forum/post/19892089


What horn and CD will you be using? Sounds very close to an AM6215/95.
http://www.jblpro.com/catalog/suppor...pe=3&docid=658


It uses a 90 x 50 WG and 2431 CD, excellent for home theater, I have one. The network is available from JBL for $86.

How would you describe the difference between your 4722's and the AM6215/95 below the horn-crossover? As mentioned, I am very much in doubt about the choice of speakers.
 
#15 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasHansen /forum/post/19892134


I just put down an offer for a new place, so if the seller accepts it, then my project begins when I move in
But that'll first be a couple of month into the future - just doing all the research now.


I am planning to use the top section from the 4722 cinema speaker: http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/The...es/4722-HF.pdf

Its the 2432 driver with a ScreenArray horn.


But I'm still very much in doubt about the speaker choice.. Have though about the Klipsch THX package too or the JBL LSR6332 - or even the pre-built 4722's. Argh this hobby ain't easy!

The Klipsch THX package won't even compete. I have heard good thing about the LSR6332 but it depends on your goals. The 4722 will sound very big compared to the others, not even close. 2226's can handle reference levels with no problems. I have owned the 3622, 3731 clone(not 2226 woof) and now the 4675c. I can tell you it will be worth it to use the 2226 with the 4722 top. I am using dual 2226's though. I bet it works fine.
 
#16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater /forum/post/19892451


The Klipsch THX package won't even compete. I have heard good thing about the LSR6332 but it depends on your goals. The 4722 will sound very big compared to the others, not even close. 2226's can handle reference levels with no problems. I have owned the 3622, 3731 clone(not 2226 woof) and now the 4675c. I can tell you it will be worth it to use the 2226 with the 4722 top. I am using dual 2226's though. I bet it works fine.

I've read all your threads with envy, so I've followed your entire process
But I'm leaning mostly towards the 2226h/4722-HF combo. To be honest, I think a single 2226H will be better than dual in my situation when sitting so close to the speakers (10 feet. The 14 feet I said earlier was incorrect).


My goal is just to have the effortless sound and clear dialogue which I have only heard in cinemas. Just the way gun shots are reproduced on such speakers is worth it IMO
I know all of this is very much related to the acoustics though.
 
#17 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasHansen /forum/post/19892493


I've read all your threads with envy, so I've followed your entire process
But I'm leaning mostly towards the 2226h/4722-HF combo. To be honest, I think a single 2226H will be better than dual in my situation when sitting so close to the speakers (10 feet. The 14 feet I said earlier was incorrect).


My goal is just to have the effortless sound and clear dialogue which I have only heard in cinemas. Just the way gun shots are reproduced on such speakers is worth it IMO
I know all of this is very much related to the acoustics though.

Well my friend a ported or even sealed 2226H coupled with a 4722 HF section will give you much more than that! Just think that the 3677 is an awesome speaker for the price and it uses a less potent 15 and a less potent horn and CD. Also, if you can get the 4722N(meaning with network) it may just be easier to go that route and you won't need any active XO's. I am actually using the Ashly amps with the XO built in which I like much better than the active XO as it simplified things for me. My XO is at 750hz and everythings sounds great. The biggest thing most people comment on is the clarity and big sound. BTW, Bass traps in the 4 corners and first reflections panels make a huge difference. My room went from having a huge sounding speaker in a small room to sound like a huge cinema! They work great! I will take new pics tonight.
 
#18 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasHansen /forum/post/19891717


......but does the enclosure size have any influence on the sound when the speakers will be crossed over at 80hz to a sub?

The pioneers of audio concluded that the optimum reflex alignment was one where the venting to Fs of whatever the sealed net box volume (Vb) was required to raise its Fs 1.56x once all series resistance was accounted for, so with today's T/S specs and powerful design programs we can get close enough to this 'optimum' using WinISD Pro or similar. I've built many with a wide variety of driver specs and they all performed above average SQ wise, sounding more like a high gain, low Qtc sealed alignment than vented. Note that you should get similar results using the Pi Align formulas.


The short answer then is that the Q of the roll off slope does impact the driver's performance up to its mass corner (2*Fs/Qts) to a greater or lesser extent depending on the alignment's F3, Fb and XO slope order.


All that said, conventional XO design wisdom is to have a nominally flat response for at least one octave for every slope order, so for 80 Hz: 1st = 5 Hz Fb, 2nd/10 Hz, 3rd/20 Hz, 4th/40 Hz.


GM
 
#19 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater /forum/post/19892591


Well my friend a ported or even sealed 2226H coupled with a 4722 HF section will give you much more than that! Just think that the 3677 is an awesome speaker for the price and it uses a less potent 15 and a less potent horn and CD. Also, if you can get the 4722N(meaning with network) it may just be easier to go that route and you won't need any active XO's. I am actually using the Ashly amps with the XO built in which I like much better than the active XO as it simplified things for me. My XO is at 750hz and everythings sounds great. The biggest thing most people comment on is the clarity and big sound. BTW, Bass traps in the 4 corners and first reflections panels make a huge difference. My room went from having a huge sounding speaker in a small room to sound like a huge cinema! They work great! I will take new pics tonight.

If I go this route, I would prefer the active solution. I like to mess around with all these things
And in theory, the active solution provides better SQ.


Have any of you ever heard the JBL Array 1400's? (Its from their consumer/synthesis line).
 
#20 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasHansen /forum/post/19892667


If I go this route, I would prefer the active solution. I like to mess around with all these things
And in theory, the active solution provides better SQ.


Have any of you ever heard the JBL Array 1400's? (Its from their consumer/synthesis line).

No I have not but they are much more expensive than say a 3731. BTW, the 3731 is an awesome speaker.
 
#21 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater /forum/post/19892697


No I have not but they are much more expensive than say a 3731. BTW, the 3731 is an awesome speaker.

Yeah I could imagine, but I think it'll be to large for the distance im gonna sit from them. And it would be very convenient if the speakers could stand on the subs (subs are on their side). That makes the 3731'sa bad choice for me. But I know for a fact, that the cinema's I really like use two-way speakers. So that would be good enough I guess.
 
#22 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasHansen /forum/post/19892841


Yeah I could imagine, but I think it'll be to large for the distance im gonna sit from them. And it would be very convenient if the speakers could stand on the subs (subs are on their side). That makes the 3731'sa bad choice for me. But I know for a fact, that the cinema's I really like use two-way speakers. So that would be good enough I guess.

The 3731's are used more in post production than in cinemas. They sit up to 9-10 feet away. Yes, 2 ways sound excellent. Just have someone figure the box size for a single 2226. The 3678 uses a single 2226 and maybe you can clone it or buy the enclosure. It XO's at 1000hz so it should be fine for 750-800 which the 4722 uses.
 
#23 ·
MKTheater, remember those massive amps I mailed you? I was looking around today and came across some JBL theater stuff for sale, but not from the same amp guy. Large horns. I called, he bought the horns just for the compression drivers and told me where. Turns out it's the same guy I bought your amps from!


So I called the amp guy. He just got in a MASSIVE amount of JBL theater stuff. No amps though.



He's got the big 31" wide fiberglass horns with the metal throat and compression drivers. He also has the dual 15's (4648A-8) and then some 18's (4645C). And then a boat load of 8330 surround speakers.



I was curious what you spent on your speakers so I can make him an offer. The owner wasn't there to give prices, but his employee let me write down model numbers.



They must have 40 horns and dual 15's. I counted 12 of the 18" subs and he said he has over 100 surrounds.



I really don't know JBL stuff very well. They look like these:

 
#24 ·
Sounds like EXACTLY the same kind of gear that was on sale late this summer where a few of us landed the great deals. I've got four 8330 surrounds in the garage and a trio of 4648a cabs. I more than likely won't be using the cabs now though...


The 4645 (18" 2242 loaded iirc) would be an awesome sub system to get. I'd like me some of those.



Yeah, that picture is what I have but I opted out for the horn. MK, kept them for his system. I'll be using the exact same CD but different horn. If you can fit the big horns, get them!
 
#25 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian /forum/post/20047321


Sounds like EXACTLY the same kind of gear that was on sale late this summer where a few of us landed the great deals. I've got four 8330 surrounds in the garage and a trio of 4648a cabs. I more than likely won't be using the cabs now though...


The 4645 (18" 2242 loaded iirc) would be an awesome sub system to get. I'd like me some of those.



Yeah, that picture is what I have but I opted out for the horn. MK, kept them for his system. I'll be using the exact same CD but different horn. If you can fit the big horns, get them!

Any idea what I should offer for price?


If you want anything, let me know. Maybe I could just remove the drivers and ship those?
 
#26 ·
just be sure what you are bidding on. the 4675 came with 2035h and 2226h.


2 x 2226h -> fair value would be around $200-225 ea.

1 x 2446h -> fair value would be around $175-200 ea.

1x 2360a -> fair value would be around $175-200 ea.

1x enclosure -> $0


$750-850 ea. would be a fair deal for the buyer and the seller.


if they are in good shape and you can get them for less than $750, consider yourself lucky. not sure what mk and scott paid.
 
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