Sioux City, IA / Sioux Falls, SD - HDTV

[bbdotsd]

I have been posting in the Des Moines forum but I thought it was time for a Siouxland thread. I have a Hitachi 61" with an integrated digital tuner. I have an all channel antenna with a rotor to pick up the local ABC and NBC digital feeds. On other local forums the engineers from the local stations contribute and I hope that happens here. That way we can get accurate information about the digital transmissions. I encourage anyone in Siouxland to share their experience with HDTV and OTA digital reception.

[mekanixs]

hello Bill,
I have a 55" mits and a hughes e86 ..sure hope we have more Siouxlanders out there with hdtv..
craig

[dmadsen]

Thanks to Bill for letting me know about this forum.

I am Station Manager/Operations Manager for KTIV-TV and KTIV-DT. I probably have some answers you may need about DTV in Siouxland...or I can get the answer!

Let me start by explaining that KTIV is currently operating on Channel 41.1 with a low power (10KW) transmitter, so our coverage is not as big as it will be eventually. Our antenna is at about 750' on our tower southeast of Hinton. We should get a signal out about 35-40 miles.

KCAU (ABC) in Sioux City has just started broadcasting their DTV signal on Channel 30. They have a 500W transmitter on top of the Terra Building in downtown Sioux City.

KPTH (FOX) should start broadcasting within a week.

Don't know about KMEG (CBS).

If you have specific questions, you can find a contact for me at KTIV on our website...www.ktiv.com. I'd love to get email addresses of DTV enthusiasts in the area. For specific info about KTIV-DT, check out this page on our site: http://www.ktiv.com/CustomPages/DigitalTV/Index.cfm

I can't promise how often I'll check this forum, but I'll try!

[mekanixs]

hello,
Just to let you know KPTH-DT is broadcasting tonite.

Craig

[bbdotsd]

I couldn't pick up KPTH last night. My information is that it is on 49. Is that correct. Do you know if they are on their regular tower? Does anyone know how much power they are broadcasting with.
I think KTIV is broadcasting with more power. At least they are indicating more power on my signal strength meter. I can get them without an amplifier.

[mekanixs]

Bill,
I did a scan on 49 and it mapped it at 44-1. I called kpth today and it is on the regular tower. and they said that they are missing a couple of part and waiting for them to come in (there hoping this week)so there at a lower power. i have just a outdoor antenna with no pre-amp . My hughes signal strength meter has KTIV at 100% and KPTH at about 50% to 60% and KCAU at about 60% (It was at 100 % when the antenna was pointed at terra ) i have it pointed more at the tower now for a stronger signal on KPTH ... man power rotator
=====
craig

[bbdotsd]

Thanks Craig I will try it at 44-1. I am upgrading to a better UHF antenna when it comes in. I should be able to get the Norfolk PBS station and I am going to try to get the Sioux Falls digital stations when they come on the air.

[cdieren]

I just talked to KSFY (ABC Sioux Falls) this morning...they say they are on the air and at "full power". Anyone confirm this? I do not know the channel number.

[dmadsen]

If you haven't already, you might check out this website www.titantv.com. It has a lot of info about HD programming and which stations should be available where you live.

[hiltsy855]

Hello all. Great to see a thread on DTV/HDTV here in Sioux City. Thanks, Bill for getting it started. I've cruised this forum for a couple years & picked up lots of good info. I live in Morningside (way down in a valley) and thought I might have trouble getting a decent signal. But I've installed two Channel Master 4221 antenna in my attic - 1 pointed at the Hinton field & the other at the KCAU transmitter on the Terra building downtown - and I get about 76 signal strength on KCAU & 60 on KTIV. I get a dropout now & then but nothing that really bothers me. I have the old DTC-100 receiver & I'm pretty sure I'd get better results with a newer receiver. I've been looking at the new Sony, Zenith, & Samsung units.

Kudos to Dave Madsen & KTIV for taking the initiative in getting HDTV here in Sioux City. I kind of thought we'd be in an HDTV black hole & we really would be without them. I've been watching several NBC programs that I had never seen before. Also, was quite disappointed to hear KCAU would not be passing the ABC 1080i signal, only doing DTV. The Super Bowl would have been a great opportunity for them to promote their new digital system & HDTV. BTW Bill, nice editorial in the paper regards KCAU & DTV!

I didn't know KPTH was on yet. I'll check it out tonight. I heard from their chief engineer that they won't be doing FOX's 480P widescreen at this time. Maybe down the road, but from what I hear, its nothing that great anyway.

I'd like everyone's opinion on how KTIV is handling the 4:3 SD material. I think they've decided to stretch to fit a 16:9 window (maybe its more like 14:9 cropped to fit the 16:9) & upconvert to 1080i. The problem I see is, when its sent out as 1080i HDTV, neither my receiver or TV has any control over the aspect ratio (it locks to 16:9 so its always stretched). If they would send out 4:3 SD material as 480I/P or as 1080i 16:9 with side bars, then we'd see the original 4:3 aspect ratio. 480I/P would allow stretching as desired. At least we'd have a choice.

Anyway, glad we're getting some DTV/HDTV going here in Sioux City.

Mark

[bbdotsd]

Wow A lot of people saw that editorial in the Journal. I have had many comments on it. Thanks for your kind words. It looks like the digital world is starting to get interesting. I am going to try and receive the ABC channel from Sioux Falls when I get my new antenna up. (My never ending quest to see the Superbowl in HD) I will keep the forum posted on my results.

[hiltsy855]

Bill,
What antenna are you getting? Can you install outside or in the attic? Sioux Falls is quite a ways - hope it works out.

Mark

[mekanixs]

Hello Mark,
It's good to hear from another siouxlander with hdtv

Craig

[Eyedox]

To Dave Madsen (KTIV):
My father lives in PENDER, NE ... about 45 miles SSW of Sioux City. I was wondering if he would have any chance at receiving KTIV, KCAU or KPTH out of Sioux City? He wants to get a HDTV soon, and would be getting a large directional UHF antenna, with a antenna-mounted amplifier. He also lives up on a hill. Thanks in advance ...

[dmadsen]

To Eyedox about your father in Pender, NE. This is Dave Madsen from KTIV in Sioux City. I would say your father is on the fringe of where our signal would go at this point. We are using a low power transmitter now, and we're thinking 35-40 miles for a signal range, but we haven't actually tested the signal outside of Sioux City yet. I'd like to hear from other folks about their reception of KTIV-DT. You can reach me directly at dmadsen@ktiv.com.

[Eyedox]

Originally posted by dmadsen
KCAU (ABC) in Sioux City has just started broadcasting their DTV signal on Channel 30. They have a 500W transmitter on top of the Terra Building in downtown Sioux City.

KCAU at 500 watts? I have light bulbs that are brighter than that! You would think they would at least do a few thousand watts! Good grief! Thanks for the reply Dave Madsen! Any idea when KTIV might be boosting the signal a bit for the less fortunate folks who live outside the current fringe area?

[dmadsen]

Sorry, but we don't have a specific timetable for increasing DT power for KTIV-DT. The FCC said stations had to get on the air with at least a low power transmitter (to provide a "city grade" signal), and that's what many stations are doing due to the huge costs involved.

[Eyedox]

I heard that KTIV is broadcasting in 1080i. Does anyone know if KCAU is broadcasting 720p yet? Also, is the Siouxland FOX station there broadcasting 480p (FOX WIDESCREEN) or are both ABC and FOX locals in Sioux City just 480i right now??

[chummel]

Will anyone be able to get HDTV in Westfield????? I used to live there!!!!

[dmadsen]

If you mean Westfield, Iowa...I think they should be able to get KTIV-DT.

[hiltsy855]

Eyedox,
Yes, KTIV is sending out 1080i, but KCAU is SD only so far. I e-mailed KCAU to ask if they were planning to broadcast 720P & this was the responce:

" Thanks for your note.

We are presently offering a "standard definition" digital signal. Our
capital plans include an upgrade to a "high definition" transmission in the
future. Just how far into the future is dependent, at least in part, on how
quickly the penetration of digital receivers in the Siouxland market grows.
I hope that's not too far off, but it certainly won't be before SuperBowl
XXXVII.

Thanks again for your interest.

Ray Cole, President
Citadel Communications
3903 Westown Parkway
West Des Moines, IA 50266
Phone: 515-457-9645 (Ext. 127)
Fax: 515-457-1033
rcole@woitv.com
"

I haven't been able to get FOX digital, but the engineer there I e-mailed said they won't be doing FOX Widescreen yet.

Anybody else get KPTH FOX digital?

Mark

[Eyedox]

There are so many of us in the Des Moines market that are so incredibly disappointed in WOI-TV (ABC) for not making the SuperBowl deadline as previously scheduled. They've had their equipment for months and have had plenty of time to get it up on the tower. I guess unlike some markets and stations, WOI doesn't consider their HD viewers an important priority. The FCC deadline was almost a YEAR ago for commercial stations. WOI is also planning on being 480i for awhile (no 720p HD). I am just so tired of chronic excuse-makers and people that do the bare minimum. If the FCC weren't requiring digital signals, some of these stations would NEVER switch on their own. I know there are costs, but we had to spend thousands on our TV's too.

[dmadsen]

FYI to Siouxland DTV folks, KTIV has changed the aspect ratio on our DTV to more closely resemble a 4:3 screen when we are just sending a standard definition signal (which is an upconverted analog signal).

When we are passing HDTV, you should still get the same "FULL SCREEN" 16:9 picture.

If you want to fill the screen with our standard def picture, you can do it on your set.

If folks have comments about this, we'd love to hear from you. It's a simple enough thing to change back if most people don't like it.

[mekanixs]

Dave,
I have a mits set that will not let me change the format on the DTV input. I have half of the logo cut off.
Craig

[Eyedox]

Most sets won't let any 1080i or 720p HD signal be stretched, etc ... Neither can a 480p 16:9 signal ... Only a 480i or 480p 4:3 aspect ratio signal can be manipulated with most HDTVs. (like the Mits). So if KTIV is upconverting a standard def 4:3 show to 1080i 4:3 ... the HDTV's still see it as a 1080i 16:9 signal (even though there are horizontal bars). On the other hand, if KTIV sends a 480i or 480p 4:3 signal of their standard def TV shows, you WOULD be able to manipulate the picture ... however you would lose some picture quality ... I can tell you for certain that FOX 480i looks a hell of a lot more fuzzy and washed out than an upconverted standard def show on NBC in 1080i (even though its not a TRUE 1080i picture).

[bbdotsd]

I have installed my new ChannelMaster antenna (4228) and the improvement in the signal was impressive. I now can receive both ABC and NBC with no drop outs and as an extra benefit channel 14 (analog) is ghost free for the first time since I moved here. No luck on getting the Sioux Falls channels but I am still satisfied. I have one question on channel 44. Titan TV says that the major and minor channels are 44-1. When I tune my receive to 44-1 it just brings in analog 44. Is 44 on the air and is anyone receiving it? Thanks to Dave Madsen from channel 4 for being the only station that seems to care about the new world of digital broadcasting.

[UpStreamDown]

"No luck on getting the Sioux Falls channels but I am still satisfied. "

Don't give up hope, SF channels are not up yet. Should be soon.

[dmadsen]

KPTH-DT is on Channel 49, not 44.

[hiltsy855]

Hello all.
I still can't get KPTH-DT. I've tried 2 different receivers & still nothing, not even a recognition that 49 is there at all. I called the station & they said their transmitter is on the same tower as KTIV, but at a lower elevation. They are sending low power at this time. Must be 1/10 of a watt. How did they get FCC approval for that? I used to get some good KPTH info by e-mailing the chief engineer there, but I haven't received any replies in a month. Maybe they've got her on a pedal-powered generator that runs the transmitter .

Dave,
As you know, I'm a big fan of original aspect ratio & I appreciate KTIV sending an upconverted un-stretched image for 4:3 SD broadcasts. I think they look great and you don't have to watch fat faces. If one has the TV contrast & brightness properly set, burn-in should not be an issue on a 16:9 set. Also, all receivers have S-video 480i output which allows the TV to stretch the image to fill the screen if desired.

Mark

[bbdotsd]

I was able to get KPTH-DT after following Dave's suggestion of using channel 49. I punched in 49-1 and it found KPTH-DT but the display says 44-1. Weird. Now I cannot get KTIV-DT. Is anyone else having trouble? I get KCAU and KPTH.