Cox Cable 6412 w/ Pioneer Passport Review and Discussion

dresf · 06-19-04, 10:00 PM

I have had a Motorola 6412 for a few days now. The dual tuner capability is not functioning yet. They say it will be activated within a few weeks (yeah, and pigs fly). DVI is functioning... well sort of. The same issues with previous boxes still apply. Have to sequence the power on's, or in my case just unplug and re plug the DVI cable. I have went back to component until this is fixed. There does not seem to be any difference in PQ. I did an experiment with looking at the difference tonite. I recorded some content on DiscoveryHD on the DVR then went back and watched it thru component then DVI. I could not see any difference.
The on screen menu is the pioneer passport interface. The DVR does both analog and digital and HD content. We have been happy with it. Those who have had Tivo have liked tivo's intuitiveness better- I hear. The firmware version is 8.03 for those of you keeping score.

The unit does seem to take awhile longer to lock in to the digital channels than my old 5100 with a few hiccups and drops during the first few seconds of a new channel.

On the good side when one views the guide, you can still see the programing in the upper right hand corner.

I have no idea whether the firewire is "firing" since I dont have any firewire devices to check out with, but they said it was.

Kipp Jones · 06-19-04, 11:16 PM

Post a pic of the unit back and front please.

dresf · 06-20-04, 01:05 AM

front

dresf · 06-20-04, 01:08 AM

Bink · 06-20-04, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kipp Jones
Post a pic of the unit back and front please.

I'm more interested in seeing a pic of the unit ID sticker on the bottom!

dresf · 06-20-04, 09:53 AM

I am offended by the implication, but here it is.

hd-in-ks · 06-20-04, 09:57 AM

Thanks for the review. I'm waiting for one in Topeka. Now if Cox can just add some more HD channels, especially the locals I would be much happier.

dresf · 06-20-04, 12:38 PM

I too am impatiently awaiting more locals. I may be adding an OTA receiver soon just out of spite.

mktgMaven · 06-20-04, 12:40 PM

Hi dresf,

Thanks for showing us the front, back, and bottom of the box.

Hope there's no insult in this request: could you post a few shots of the Passport user interface? How are your recordings listed? What does search look like? How do you set a show to record? What are the options?

BTW: how man days of program guide info do you get?

Thanks.

SonomaSearcher · 06-20-04, 12:55 PM

Are you a beta tester? If so, employee or customer?

If not, how did you find out your local system had the 6412's available?

Thanks for the review.

dresf · 06-20-04, 01:01 PM

I am not a beta tester, just an early adopter glutton for punishment. Nor am I an employee or relative...
I called the cable provider awhile back and asked to be put on a list when the new boxes were available, mainly interested in DVI output, I then heard from a tech that was at my house on another issue that there were to be released. I get 7 days of programming in the guide. Here is a shot of what happens when you press "List" which shows which programs you have recorded

dresf · 06-20-04, 01:02 PM

Program guide

dresf · 06-20-04, 01:03 PM

press record from program guide or just hit record and this comes up:

dresf · 06-20-04, 01:05 PM

hit the menu button and one gets this:

DaveFi · 06-20-04, 01:23 PM

Looks decent enough. Anything is better than that TVGuide crap we have.

I'm looking forward to it. Comcast does a bit of extensive testing before they release new hardware. Surprised that your cable co would even release it in such a state.

dresf · 06-20-04, 01:58 PM

You said: " Surprised that your cable co would even release it in such a state."

Such a state? This is not a bad stb, and they were VERY upfront with the fact that it would be a few weeks before the dual tuner was functional and a few other things. 99% of all customers are not going to notice a thing wrong with this unit. Those of us who are A-V obsessive are going to nit pick anything to death. The DVI issue one can understand a little because hardly anyone uses it except for us geeks. Most of the CSR's don't even know what DVI is. The tech guru here in town at the cable co. told me I was his first call about DVI. And he was very helpful and courteous. Kudos! He is going to follow up with me tomorrow to see if the new power up-power down sequencing is still effective.

There has to be immense pressure to bring the dvr's to market since the satellite co's and Tivo have a corner right now. Despite the fact that the box isnt fully functional it is still good business as long as they are up front and they were.

We believe we have solved my DVI issue with some delays in power up and some sequencing of the power on commands.

Bink · 06-20-04, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dresf
I am offended by the implication, but here it is.

No need to be offended, I was simply curious about the specific sub-model number (ie 6412/2000)

For the record, I have a 6208/2005.

Regards,

Randy

DaveFi · 06-20-04, 02:25 PM

This is very beta stuff- they couldn't have had the boxes for more than a few weeks before they released them. Comcast works with this stuff for months before they send them out.

I suspect like you, that these were the only DVRs they had and were under pressure to put something, anything out that would compete with Tivo.

Just curious as to what they charge?

dresf · 06-20-04, 03:19 PM

We are charged 9.95 for the box rental, then an additional 4.95 for the dvr function. I think. I know the dvr price is correct, but the box rental I am fuzzy on.

Hey Bink: I thought nobody was believing that I actually had one. No harm dude.

avic · 06-22-04, 11:57 AM

since the current tvguide IPG doesn't support dual-tuner recording and Comcast wont release the 6412 without that capability, can we correctly assume it will come with the microsoft IPG?

bfdtv · 06-22-04, 04:47 PM

avic,

Unfortunately, no. Some percentage of Comcast 6412s will continue to use the TVGuide software. What percentage is unknown.

An minor update to the Gemstar software is expected end summer for these boxes. Most MSOs will be deploying the 6412 this fall, but only Comcast has announced the intention to use the MS TV software on some boxes.

Comcast has not announced how or when they will deploy the MS DVR software. As of the announcement, they had not even decided many of these specifics.

GoIrish · 06-22-04, 05:23 PM

I would expect you would see MS more prominently in the North West portions of the US.

Regards,
GoIrish

Kipp Jones · 06-22-04, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dresf
front

Thanks. Obviously from the download count you can see the interest in what the unit looks like.

markjrenna · 06-24-04, 03:44 PM

Comcast NJ - Union/Verona

I have the 6208. I am very much looking forward to the new 6408/6412. One thing to keep in mind is that the Dual tuner Moto box does not have RF out. ***Make sure you have a TV with SVideo, Component, or DVI input.***

Mark

avic · 06-24-04, 11:37 PM

...or composite. but if all your tv has is an RF input, you're overdue for an upgrade!

MatthewT · 06-25-04, 02:57 PM

Quote:

We are charged 9.95 for the box rental, then an additional 4.95 for the dvr function. I think. I know the dvr price is correct, but the box rental I am fuzzy on.

It should be noted that the $9.95 monthly rental for the unit is the same price they charged for the nonDVR 5100. So, the only cost to switch to the DVR Motorola 6412 is the $4.95 charge for the actual DVR service.

Brett Miles · 06-25-04, 06:16 PM

I got mine yesterday from the Cox office in Manhattan, KS

! I've been looking forward to this since I saw it in the new products section of the website early this year. Everything is fairly good for the most part, so far. The remote is much more directional sensitive than the one for the non-dvr HD box, which sucks. I usually end up doing multiple button presses before I get what I want. I also had an issue with the purchase/parental PIN, which was eventually resolved. For anyone else who can't get that enabled, the initial/default PIN is 0000. I haven't tried the DVI since I don't have the cable yet.

dresf · 06-26-04, 05:06 PM

Over the past 2 days I have noticed that the audio and video dropouts when turning channels have gone away. The term for this seem to be macro blocking.

We have given up the DVI connection and will wait patiently for a firmware upgrade sometime down the line. It does work but there are some hoops to jump through with my particular configuration so it is not worth the trouble.

We like this box. My wife can easily record programs and call them up, pause live programming...

An old wise man once said: "If momma is happy, everyone is happy"

Just two things on the wish list for us:

1. Navigation arrows automatically bring up info at bottom of screen, and the navigate with them through time and channel without bringing up guide, as the 5100 did.

2. The ratings (G,PG, R...) would show up on the bottom of the screen when changing channels.

All that being said, we like the pioneer echo GUI and with a few tweaks we will love it.

BTW. I felt my remote was decidedly better than the one with the 5100. Although now that we have all the dvr functions on the Pronto Pro, we dnn't use it anymore.

Kipp Jones · 06-26-04, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dresf

An old wise man once said: "If momma is happy, everyone is happy"

Very true.

Brett Miles · 06-27-04, 06:37 PM

Anyone know how much HD recording time I can expect to get on this thing? The drive is 120GB. What's the typical file size for a 2hr HD movie?

06-19-04, 10:00 PM	#1 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a4ac4393' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:30&n=a4ac4393' border='0' alt=''></a>
dresf Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: wichita, ks Posts: 219	Motorola 6412 review-Cox/Pioneer I have had a Motorola 6412 for a few days now. The dual tuner capability is not functioning yet. They say it will be activated within a few weeks (yeah, and pigs fly). DVI is functioning... well sort of. The same issues with previous boxes still apply. Have to sequence the power on's, or in my case just unplug and re plug the DVI cable. I have went back to component until this is fixed. There does not seem to be any difference in PQ. I did an experiment with looking at the difference tonite. I recorded some content on DiscoveryHD on the DVR then went back and watched it thru component then DVI. I could not see any difference. The on screen menu is the pioneer passport interface. The DVR does both analog and digital and HD content. We have been happy with it. Those who have had Tivo have liked tivo's intuitiveness better- I hear. The firmware version is 8.03 for those of you keeping score. The unit does seem to take awhile longer to lock in to the digital channels than my old 5100 with a few hiccups and drops during the first few seconds of a new channel. On the good side when one views the guide, you can still see the programing in the upper right hand corner. I have no idea whether the firewire is "firing" since I dont have any firewire devices to check out with, but they said it was. Last edited by dresf; 10-15-04 at 04:41 PM..

06-19-04, 11:16 PM	#2 \| Link
Kipp Jones AVS Heavy Hitter AVS GOLD CLUB MEMBER Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 11,623	Post a pic of the unit back and front please. __________________ Kipp Are you boozen & cruisin the AVS? Join us here ---> http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8&page=1&pp=60 good times! www.illinoiscarry.org www.nra.org

06-20-04, 12:40 PM	#9 \| Link
mktgMaven Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: USA Posts: 67	can you post screen shots? Hi dresf, Thanks for showing us the front, back, and bottom of the box. Hope there's no insult in this request: could you post a few shots of the Passport user interface? How are your recordings listed? What does search look like? How do you set a show to record? What are the options? BTW: how man days of program guide info do you get? Thanks.

06-20-04, 12:55 PM	#10 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a591f81a' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:36&n=a591f81a' border='0' alt=''></a>
SonomaSearcher AVS Moderator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Petaluma, CA Posts: 2,632	Are you a beta tester? If so, employee or customer? If not, how did you find out your local system had the 6412's available? Thanks for the review. __________________ Comcast 6412 w/ iGuide Thread Comcast San Francisco Bay Area Thread

06-20-04, 01:23 PM	#15 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a591f81a' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:36&n=a591f81a' border='0' alt=''></a>
DaveFi AVS Addicted Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Natick MA Posts: 13,405	Looks decent enough. Anything is better than that TVGuide crap we have. I'm looking forward to it. Comcast does a bit of extensive testing before they release new hardware. Surprised that your cable co would even release it in such a state. __________________ PSN: Wagg My Sackboy is going to have a really big sack.

06-20-04, 09:57 AM	#7 \| Link
hd-in-ks New Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 9	Thanks for the review. I'm waiting for one in Topeka. Now if Cox can just add some more HD channels, especially the locals I would be much happier.

06-20-04, 12:38 PM	#8 \| Link
dresf Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: wichita, ks Posts: 219	I too am impatiently awaiting more locals. I may be adding an OTA receiver soon just out of spite.

06-20-04, 01:58 PM	#16 \| Link
dresf Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: wichita, ks Posts: 219	You said: " Surprised that your cable co would even release it in such a state." Such a state? This is not a bad stb, and they were VERY upfront with the fact that it would be a few weeks before the dual tuner was functional and a few other things. 99% of all customers are not going to notice a thing wrong with this unit. Those of us who are A-V obsessive are going to nit pick anything to death. The DVI issue one can understand a little because hardly anyone uses it except for us geeks. Most of the CSR's don't even know what DVI is. The tech guru here in town at the cable co. told me I was his first call about DVI. And he was very helpful and courteous. Kudos! He is going to follow up with me tomorrow to see if the new power up-power down sequencing is still effective. There has to be immense pressure to bring the dvr's to market since the satellite co's and Tivo have a corner right now. Despite the fact that the box isnt fully functional it is still good business as long as they are up front and they were. We believe we have solved my DVI issue with some delays in power up and some sequencing of the power on commands.

06-20-04, 02:25 PM	#18 \| Link
DaveFi AVS Addicted Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Natick MA Posts: 13,405	This is very beta stuff- they couldn't have had the boxes for more than a few weeks before they released them. Comcast works with this stuff for months before they send them out. I suspect like you, that these were the only DVRs they had and were under pressure to put something, anything out that would compete with Tivo. Just curious as to what they charge? __________________ PSN: Wagg My Sackboy is going to have a really big sack.

06-20-04, 03:19 PM	#19 \| Link
dresf Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: wichita, ks Posts: 219	We are charged 9.95 for the box rental, then an additional 4.95 for the dvr function. I think. I know the dvr price is correct, but the box rental I am fuzzy on. Hey Bink: I thought nobody was believing that I actually had one. No harm dude.

06-22-04, 11:57 AM	#20 \| Link
avic Advanced Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: BOSTON Posts: 660	since the current tvguide IPG doesn't support dual-tuner recording and Comcast wont release the 6412 without that capability, can we correctly assume it will come with the microsoft IPG?

06-22-04, 04:47 PM	#21 \| Link
bfdtv AVS Addicted Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 12,915	avic, Unfortunately, no. Some percentage of Comcast 6412s will continue to use the TVGuide software. What percentage is unknown. An minor update to the Gemstar software is expected end summer for these boxes. Most MSOs will be deploying the 6412 this fall, but only Comcast has announced the intention to use the MS TV software on some boxes. Comcast has not announced how or when they will deploy the MS DVR software. As of the announcement, they had not even decided many of these specifics. __________________ Your choices for standalone HDTV recorders: DTVPal DVR \| TivoHD \| Moxi \| Feature Comparison Chart

06-22-04, 05:23 PM	#22 \| Link
GoIrish Advanced Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Baltimore Posts: 796	I would expect you would see MS more prominently in the North West portions of the US. Regards, GoIrish

06-24-04, 03:44 PM	#24 \| Link
markjrenna Advanced Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Verona, NJ Posts: 588	Comcast NJ - Union/Verona I have the 6208. I am very much looking forward to the new 6408/6412. One thing to keep in mind is that the Dual tuner Moto box does not have RF out. *Make sure you have a TV with SVideo, Component, or DVI input.* Mark

06-24-04, 11:37 PM	#25 \| Link
avic Advanced Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: BOSTON Posts: 660	...or composite. but if all your tv has is an RF input, you're overdue for an upgrade!

06-25-04, 06:16 PM	#27 \| Link
Brett Miles Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: KS Posts: 187	I got mine yesterday from the Cox office in Manhattan, KS ! I've been looking forward to this since I saw it in the new products section of the website early this year. Everything is fairly good for the most part, so far. The remote is much more directional sensitive than the one for the non-dvr HD box, which sucks. I usually end up doing multiple button presses before I get what I want. I also had an issue with the purchase/parental PIN, which was eventually resolved. For anyone else who can't get that enabled, the initial/default PIN is 0000. I haven't tried the DVI since I don't have the cable yet.

06-26-04, 05:06 PM	#28 \| Link
dresf Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: wichita, ks Posts: 219	Over the past 2 days I have noticed that the audio and video dropouts when turning channels have gone away. The term for this seem to be macro blocking. We have given up the DVI connection and will wait patiently for a firmware upgrade sometime down the line. It does work but there are some hoops to jump through with my particular configuration so it is not worth the trouble. We like this box. My wife can easily record programs and call them up, pause live programming... An old wise man once said: "If momma is happy, everyone is happy" Just two things on the wish list for us: 1. Navigation arrows automatically bring up info at bottom of screen, and the navigate with them through time and channel without bringing up guide, as the 5100 did. 2. The ratings (G,PG, R...) would show up on the bottom of the screen when changing channels. All that being said, we like the pioneer echo GUI and with a few tweaks we will love it. BTW. I felt my remote was decidedly better than the one with the 5100. Although now that we have all the dvr functions on the Pronto Pro, we dnn't use it anymore.

06-27-04, 06:37 PM	#30 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a591f81a' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:36&n=a591f81a' border='0' alt=''></a>
Brett Miles Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: KS Posts: 187	Anyone know how much HD recording time I can expect to get on this thing? The drive is 120GB. What's the typical file size for a 2hr HD movie?