Maximum cable length to projector?

ondaedg · 12-23-06, 11:46 AM

Hi all. I am probably going to purchase a Mitsu HD1000 and mount it to my ceiling in my living room. I will be able to run the wires through the ceiling, but it may require a lot of distance (possibly 50 to 75ft) to my xbox360. I was going to use VGA as the cabling for best image quality. Will the cable length cause any picture degradation and should I be concerned? Thanks in advance!

buffexec · 12-23-06, 12:53 PM

Just make sure you go with the biggest gauge available, probably around 22 AWG. Monoprice may have these, i just ordered some long 22 AWG HDMI from them for in wall installation thru my ceiling.

Walt

ondaedg · 12-23-06, 01:00 PM

Thanks for the advice. I did some researching at other forums as well and am seeing mixed responses. Do you recommend component or VGA?

Are there any cabling guides that would apply to an xbox 360 and a projector?

absolutezerok · 12-23-06, 01:02 PM

Go with HDMI for the best picture. Run fiber optic and you can go VERY far!
http://www2.dvigear.com/hdfiopca.html

Resaebiunne · 12-23-06, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Will the cable length cause any picture degradation and should I be concerned?

Yes, you'll get ghosting if you use low quality cable and/or too long a run.

hoxbox · 12-23-06, 02:50 PM

I'm running regular cables 50ft HDMI cable + HDMI switch box + 3 ft HDMI cable (all from eBay) to my plv-Z4 without any troubles.

Dang fiberoptic is good but $$$

ondaedg · 12-23-06, 04:43 PM

How are you outputting the signal from an xbox 360? Are you using vga or component?

buffexec · 12-23-06, 06:35 PM

I believe component will give you better performance over VGA, and HDMI is the best option if you have HDMI available on the items you are looking to hookup.

Walt

absolutezerok · 12-23-06, 10:30 PM

Well you do have to be carefull with any method at 50'. That is a great distance, I would definately go digital (HDMI). If you can get the 22 awg HDMI cable from monoprice I would try that first, you CAN find cheaper fiber optic cables.

Montezumas_viper · 12-24-06, 02:16 AM

50-75 feet will put you WAY out of spec for VGA. Your going to need a repeater.

Otherwise ghosting is a very real possibility

EocThermos · 12-24-06, 02:19 AM

Do you think there's any chance of noticeable degrading with 35 feet of 22 awg HDMI cable from monoprice?

I'll redo the measurements, but I think 25 feet would be cutting it close. Is my best bet to go into a local retailer and have them cut a 30 foot cable?

I'd rather not have to spend a fortune in cables if I can avoid it- the $50 35 foot 22 awg from monoprice is definitely my choice if it works. if not, I'll see if I can make it with 25 feet.

bd_showtime · 12-24-06, 03:16 AM

I have looked into this as I own an Xbox 360 and looking to purchase the HD1000U as well...

It is my understanding that the original poster was asking about running a VGA cable 50 feet for an Xbox 360. I can understand why you would want to run VGA as it will allow you to up convert SD DVDs to match the 720P of the Mits. But VGA degrades pretty fast over a cable that length and as others had said ghosting from interference is a real good possibility to a probability. I believe bluejeanscable has VGA break out cables which allow for the signal to be split between different cables for the majority of the run. This help prevent image degradation from interference.

As for me, I am running VGA, Component, and HDMI to my projector this allows me tons of connection options. Also if your are planning on pulling wires might as well run everything you need(or might need).

Of course you can fix this whole mess by purchasing an up-converting to HDMI receiver for xxxx amount of dollars and run just the HDMI!

cavu · 12-24-06, 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EocThermos

Do you think there's any chance of noticeable degrading with 35 feet of 22 awg HDMI cable from monoprice?

At 35', you will see no difference at all!! In fact, you can use the more flexible and cheaper 30AWG.

BTW, with digital signals, it will either work or it won't. There isn't much in between although one might see "sparkles" if it is marginal!

Here are Monoprice's specs for the length versus wire gauge:

Maximum Data Length Based on Gauge of Wire:
0 to 50 Meters Over HDMI-Cable, 24 AWG STP
0 to 36 Meters Over HDMI-Cable, 28 AWG STP
0 to 30 Meters Over HDMI-Cable, 30 AWG STP
Compatible with DTV Resolutions 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i, and 1080p

ondaedg · 12-26-06, 12:27 AM

Once again, I appreciate everyone's help. Tiger Direct offers CablesToGo products and had a section devoted to explaining the differences between the cables. Here is a quote on their description of Component:

Component Video
The Component Video interface is the most common extended definition video interface in use on contemporary consumer products. Component connections send one luminance (brightness) and two phase-opposite chrominance (color) signals on three 75-Ohm coaxial cables with a color code of Red, Green, and Blue (RGB). This analog interface is compatible with 1080i and 720p HDTV signals. Component Video is not subject to the same length limitations as digital HDMI and DVI are and can be extended easily to 150ft.

What is important is that it states that component does not have the same length limitations as DVI or HDMI.

I think there is some confusion surrounding the vga, component, and DVI/HDMI outputs with regards to the length of cables to be run. I also found a link to a sight that seems to feel that vga is indeed superior to component, but the site will not allow me to type a site until I have at least 5 posts. (As soon as I get my 5th, I will post the site that reviews all of the cable types).

What I do know is that I can not seem to find any definitive answer with regard to the length limitations for vga. Perhaps I will buy both cables and do a write up.

PeterNYC · 12-26-06, 08:20 AM

Somebody else posted the link to this article a few weeks ago on the topic of HDMI cables. I haven't personally tested any of these cables yet. But the article was certainly educational.

When I finally decide on a projector, my cable length will be 40'. I was originally planning to get the ProjectorPeople cable which incorporates component and HDMI in a single jacket. But it is only available in 35' and 50' lengths. So I'll probably go for separate cables instead.

Anyway, here's the article...
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/other...benchmark.html

-- Peter

ondaedg · 12-26-06, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterNYC

Somebody else posted the link to this article a few weeks ago on the topic of HDMI cables. I haven't personally tested any of these cables yet. But the article was certainly educational.

When I finally decide on a projector, my cable length will be 40'. I was originally planning to get the ProjectorPeople cable which incorporates component and HDMI in a single jacket. But it is only available in 35' and 50' lengths. So I'll probably go for separate cables instead.

-- Peter

The reason I am very interested in VGA for the xbox360 as bd_showtime stated is that the xbox360 will upscale standard dvds to 720p through vga. There seems to be information on DVI and HDMI on cable lengths, but not vga (probably due to the fact that most prefer DVI or HDMI for home theater. The other advantage of using vga or component with the xbox360 is that it will not require an additional adapter to convert to DVI or HDMI. Does anyone know of any articles dedicated to vga cabling lengths? Believe it or not, the best info I have seen thus far are worship forums who utilize projectors during their services. The only problem is they are not running high def content through them.

ondaedg · 12-26-06, 12:37 PM

Woohoo, 5th post. Here is that link: Cable article

PeterNYC · 12-27-06, 02:02 PM

Although it is technically not recommended, I have run 100' lengths of VGA cable with no issues. But it has to be a GOOD QUALITY cable.

On the other hand, I recently got a new LCD monitor for my office, and it came with really crappy 6' VGA cables, and I am having issues with it. (I hope it's just the cable, and not the monitor.)

-- Peter

ondaedg · 12-28-06, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterNYC

Although it is technically not recommended, I have run 100' lengths of VGA cable with no issues. But it has to be a GOOD QUALITY cable.

On the other hand, I recently got a new LCD monitor for my office, and it came with really crappy 6' VGA cables, and I am having issues with it. (I hope it's just the cable, and not the monitor.)

-- Peter

I think what I am going to do is test high quality component and VGA cables at the same length before running them through the walls and do a comparison. I will post back once I have some results. It is good to know that long runs of VGA can be done, but it has to be good cable. Thanks!

ondaedg · 12-28-06, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bd_showtime

I have looked into this as I own an Xbox 360 and looking to purchase the HD1000U as well...

It is my understanding that the original poster was asking about running a VGA cable 50 feet for an Xbox 360. I can understand why you would want to run VGA as it will allow you to up convert SD DVDs to match the 720P of the Mits. But VGA degrades pretty fast over a cable that length and as others had said ghosting from interference is a real good possibility to a probability. I believe bluejeanscable has VGA break out cables which allow for the signal to be split between different cables for the majority of the run. This help prevent image degradation from interference.

As for me, I am running VGA, Component, and HDMI to my projector this allows me tons of connection options. Also if your are planning on pulling wires might as well run everything you need(or might need).

Of course you can fix this whole mess by purchasing an up-converting to HDMI receiver for xxxx amount of dollars and run just the HDMI!

Any chance you could give us a summary of your results with vga vs component?

ellisz · 01-03-07, 11:36 AM

What cables do most people run up to the projector? I figure I will run a HDMi and a component video as that is all I need now but considered running a VGA for later maybe. Are these 3 the most common? Once the drywall is up, won't be easy to get back up there.

danieloneil01 · 01-03-07, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EocThermos

Do you think there's any chance of noticeable degrading with 35 feet of 22 awg HDMI cable from monoprice?

I'll redo the measurements, but I think 25 feet would be cutting it close. Is my best bet to go into a local retailer and have them cut a 30 foot cable?

I'd rather not have to spend a fortune in cables if I can avoid it- the $50 35 foot 22 awg from monoprice is definitely my choice if it works. if not, I'll see if I can make it with 25 feet.

I have a 50ft HDMI cable running from a closet through the attic to a plasma with no problems of picture quality..

EocThermos · 01-03-07, 12:46 PM

So now I need to run a 35 foot composite video cable from the receiver to the PJ. (Video only) Will any RCA cable work? Anyone have any recommendations from monoprice?

SixkillerNYC · 01-03-07, 12:54 PM

I bought a composite cable from monoprice for legacy devices. Anything I plugged in to it looked pretty awful, though, so I don't use it.

it's a good quality cable, though.

Y2KFirehawk · 01-03-07, 03:15 PM

I ran the following Monoprice cables in the ceiling of my house before they drywall.
- HDMI Tin-Plated Copper CL2 Rated (for In-Wall Installation) Cable (24AWG) - 35ft (Gold Plated)
- 50 Ft 3-RCA Component Video Cable (RG-59/u)
- 50 Ft S-Video & 50FT RCA Audio Cable - MOLDED
- 50 Ft SVGA Super VGA M/M Monitor Cable w/ ferrites

I will use one of the RCA's on the S-Video molded run to connect composite. I know the quality of S-Video and Composite are quite low, but I wanted to run EVERYTHING I would ever connect to the PJ now while the ceiling was open. I will be sure to post my results of everything once the house is done and we move in.

12-23-06, 11:46 AM	#1 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a4ac4393' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:30&n=a4ac4393' border='0' alt=''></a>
ondaedg Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 201	Maximum cable length to projector? Hi all. I am probably going to purchase a Mitsu HD1000 and mount it to my ceiling in my living room. I will be able to run the wires through the ceiling, but it may require a lot of distance (possibly 50 to 75ft) to my xbox360. I was going to use VGA as the cabling for best image quality. Will the cable length cause any picture degradation and should I be concerned? Thanks in advance!

12-24-06, 02:16 AM	#10 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a591f81a' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:36&n=a591f81a' border='0' alt=''></a>
Montezumas_viper Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 25	Montezumas_viper 50-75 feet will put you WAY out of spec for VGA. Your going to need a repeater. Otherwise ghosting is a very real possibility

12-24-06, 03:16 AM	#12 \| Link
bd_showtime Front Projection Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: SouthEast, FL Posts: 33	Let me see if I can help here I have looked into this as I own an Xbox 360 and looking to purchase the HD1000U as well... It is my understanding that the original poster was asking about running a VGA cable 50 feet for an Xbox 360. I can understand why you would want to run VGA as it will allow you to up convert SD DVDs to match the 720P of the Mits. But VGA degrades pretty fast over a cable that length and as others had said ghosting from interference is a real good possibility to a probability. I believe bluejeanscable has VGA break out cables which allow for the signal to be split between different cables for the majority of the run. This help prevent image degradation from interference. As for me, I am running VGA, Component, and HDMI to my projector this allows me tons of connection options. Also if your are planning on pulling wires might as well run everything you need(or might need). Of course you can fix this whole mess by purchasing an up-converting to HDMI receiver for xxxx amount of dollars and run just the HDMI! Last edited by bd_showtime; 12-24-06 at 06:06 AM.. Reason: grammar

12-26-06, 08:20 AM	#15 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a591f81a' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:36&n=a591f81a' border='0' alt=''></a>
PeterNYC Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Fairfield, CT (originally from NYC) Posts: 51	HDMI Cable discussion Somebody else posted the link to this article a few weeks ago on the topic of HDMI cables. I haven't personally tested any of these cables yet. But the article was certainly educational. When I finally decide on a projector, my cable length will be 40'. I was originally planning to get the ProjectorPeople cable which incorporates component and HDMI in a single jacket. But it is only available in 35' and 50' lengths. So I'll probably go for separate cables instead. Anyway, here's the article... http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/other...benchmark.html -- Peter

12-23-06, 12:53 PM	#2 \| Link
buffexec Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 47	Just make sure you go with the biggest gauge available, probably around 22 AWG. Monoprice may have these, i just ordered some long 22 AWG HDMI from them for in wall installation thru my ceiling. Walt

12-23-06, 01:00 PM	#3 \| Link
ondaedg Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 201	Thanks for the advice. I did some researching at other forums as well and am seeing mixed responses. Do you recommend component or VGA? Are there any cabling guides that would apply to an xbox 360 and a projector?

12-23-06, 01:02 PM	#4 \| Link
absolutezerok Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: McKinney, TX Posts: 288	Go with HDMI for the best picture. Run fiber optic and you can go VERY far! http://www2.dvigear.com/hdfiopca.html

12-23-06, 02:50 PM	#6 \| Link
hoxbox New Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 11	I'm running regular cables 50ft HDMI cable + HDMI switch box + 3 ft HDMI cable (all from eBay) to my plv-Z4 without any troubles. Dang fiberoptic is good but $$$

12-23-06, 04:43 PM	#7 \| Link
ondaedg Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 201	How are you outputting the signal from an xbox 360? Are you using vga or component?

12-23-06, 06:35 PM	#8 \| Link
buffexec Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 47	I believe component will give you better performance over VGA, and HDMI is the best option if you have HDMI available on the items you are looking to hookup. Walt

12-23-06, 10:30 PM	#9 \| Link
absolutezerok Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: McKinney, TX Posts: 288	Well you do have to be carefull with any method at 50'. That is a great distance, I would definately go digital (HDMI). If you can get the 22 awg HDMI cable from monoprice I would try that first, you CAN find cheaper fiber optic cables.

12-24-06, 02:19 AM	#11 \| Link
EocThermos Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 153	Do you think there's any chance of noticeable degrading with 35 feet of 22 awg HDMI cable from monoprice? I'll redo the measurements, but I think 25 feet would be cutting it close. Is my best bet to go into a local retailer and have them cut a 30 foot cable? I'd rather not have to spend a fortune in cables if I can avoid it- the $50 35 foot 22 awg from monoprice is definitely my choice if it works. if not, I'll see if I can make it with 25 feet.

12-26-06, 12:27 AM	#14 \| Link
ondaedg Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 201	Once again, I appreciate everyone's help. Tiger Direct offers CablesToGo products and had a section devoted to explaining the differences between the cables. Here is a quote on their description of Component: Component Video The Component Video interface is the most common extended definition video interface in use on contemporary consumer products. Component connections send one luminance (brightness) and two phase-opposite chrominance (color) signals on three 75-Ohm coaxial cables with a color code of Red, Green, and Blue (RGB). This analog interface is compatible with 1080i and 720p HDTV signals. Component Video is not subject to the same length limitations as digital HDMI and DVI are and can be extended easily to 150ft. What is important is that it states that component does not have the same length limitations as DVI or HDMI. I think there is some confusion surrounding the vga, component, and DVI/HDMI outputs with regards to the length of cables to be run. I also found a link to a sight that seems to feel that vga is indeed superior to component, but the site will not allow me to type a site until I have at least 5 posts. (As soon as I get my 5th, I will post the site that reviews all of the cable types). What I do know is that I can not seem to find any definitive answer with regard to the length limitations for vga. Perhaps I will buy both cables and do a write up.

12-26-06, 12:37 PM	#17 \| Link
ondaedg Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 201	Woohoo, 5th post. Here is that link: Cable article

12-27-06, 02:02 PM	#18 \| Link
PeterNYC Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Fairfield, CT (originally from NYC) Posts: 51	Although it is technically not recommended, I have run 100' lengths of VGA cable with no issues. But it has to be a GOOD QUALITY cable. On the other hand, I recently got a new LCD monitor for my office, and it came with really crappy 6' VGA cables, and I am having issues with it. (I hope it's just the cable, and not the monitor.) -- Peter

01-03-07, 11:36 AM	#21 \| Link
ellisz Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 78	What cables do most people run up to the projector? I figure I will run a HDMi and a component video as that is all I need now but considered running a VGA for later maybe. Are these 3 the most common? Once the drywall is up, won't be easy to get back up there.

01-03-07, 12:46 PM	#23 \| Link
EocThermos Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 153	So now I need to run a 35 foot composite video cable from the receiver to the PJ. (Video only) Will any RCA cable work? Anyone have any recommendations from monoprice?

01-03-07, 12:54 PM	#24 \| Link
SixkillerNYC WeGameOn.net Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 562	I bought a composite cable from monoprice for legacy devices. Anything I plugged in to it looked pretty awful, though, so I don't use it. it's a good quality cable, though.

01-03-07, 03:15 PM	#25 \| Link
Y2KFirehawk Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Lehigh Valley, PA Posts: 325	I ran the following Monoprice cables in the ceiling of my house before they drywall. - HDMI Tin-Plated Copper CL2 Rated (for In-Wall Installation) Cable (24AWG) - 35ft (Gold Plated) - 50 Ft 3-RCA Component Video Cable (RG-59/u) - 50 Ft S-Video & 50FT RCA Audio Cable - MOLDED - 50 Ft SVGA Super VGA M/M Monitor Cable w/ ferrites I will use one of the RCA's on the S-Video molded run to connect composite. I know the quality of S-Video and Composite are quite low, but I wanted to run EVERYTHING I would ever connect to the PJ now while the ceiling was open. I will be sure to post my results of everything once the house is done and we move in.