XA2 vs A35 repository

[sharkshark]

...premature, no doubt, to create a unique thread, but I know that I'm not alone in being very interested in the top of the G3 line (at least, so far that's been released.)

What we know so far about the A35:

- THIS is what it looks like:


- Preliminary Spec sheet (Via Value Electronics):
Dimensions: 16.9" x 2.34" x 13.58"
Weight: 8lbs
HDMI 1.3a
Ethernet (of course)
Extension Terminal (USB port(s)?)

Video:
As expected, up to 1080p, including support for 24p.
Audio:
"High Bit Rate “HBR” Audio decode by-pass for decoding any lossless audio in your receiver"
5.1 Analogue, 7.1 via HDMI
All Dolby formats supported
NO DTS-HD MA (ie., DTS-Lossless) or DTS-HD, only core DTS. I assume this means we'll get the 1.5mb/s extracted via analogue outs, HDMI, and/or Toslink/Coax.

*****************
- MSRP of $499 (vs. $700+, $999 in Canada for the XA2)

- 24p out of the box (vs. promised upgrade in the future)

- Deep Colour (hinted at with the XA2 upgrades, hard to see utility for HD DVD playback given the spec doesn't handle above 8bit)

- Sleeker chasis (pic of one of the models available on the link above, looks slightly "curvier" than the XA2, and downright svelte compared to my A1)

- 5.1 analogue (no 7.1 a la Panny BD, alas)

- 7.1 "audiophile mode" passthrough (again, hinted at with FW upgrades for XA2 but not yet available)

- CE link (to control other devices via HDMI - again, suggestions are that the G2 models will be able to do this, but nothing yet confirmed)


What we -don't- yet know about the A35:

- Will it do HDMI>DVI with proper colour space? (A1 does not, unsure about XA2)

- Will it cooperate with an HDMI switch properly, without -ever- getting HDMI errors and refusing to play? (My A1 does not, unsure about XA2)

- Is this the chip inside?

- Will it be joined by an XA3 big brother that has even better specs? UPDATE: Answer is, uh, "maybe..." (LINK)

- Does it have the REON or equivalent level of video processing for SD content? [update October2k7: The ABT chip has results that some are finding decent for SD DVD, but lacking in the advance colour and PQ setting modes that the REON has)

- Will it decode DTS-Lossless (aka, Master HD) internally and output through Analogue outs?

- How will the "passthrough" be implemented, given the necessity of current players to mix certain sounds like PIP audio, menu sounds, etc.? Will the implementation do what we want, namely, raw Lossless bitstream from the selected audio track set to the AVR for processing? [update October 2k7: aparently this is working well, an advantage of the yet-to-be implemented XA2 outboard decoding option]

- Is it HDMI 1.3? Deep colour would suggest that it needs to be, if I understand what's going on with HDMI correctly, but there's nothing clear in the release. Does it matter for everyday HD DVD viewing? [no, save for some possibilities with menus - Amir discusses this in insider thread]

- Will it finally be the rock solid, never ever have problems with discs player that we all really want?

- Could they throw in DVD-Audio support for fun? (heck, it's already doing MLP...) [no]

- Does it suffer from CUE?

- Does it avoid the lipsync issues that the XA2 seems to have (both with digital and/or analogue) for some users? [update October2k7 - more testing required, but early results are postive]


******************
I think there will be tremendous interest in this model in particular - in USD it's pretty close to what I paid for my G1 lower-end unit, and if performance is better and more stable than the XA2, without sacrificing anything of note, it may be a winner for many, many of us.

Thoughts? I'd be happy to edit any of the information above to keep it up to date as information rolls in. If I've made any mistakes or left things off, let me know that as well...

I'll be very pleased if this proves to be a solution that's more streamlined, easier to update from a FW perspective (one chip solution?), and sees an end to the quirks that we've almost all experiences with either G1 or G2 models. I remain cautiously optimistic...

[turansformer]

Great thread.... I hope to see some more announcements made at CEDIA on whether or not this player will include a Reon processor, or if that we will have to wait for a true successor to the XA2.

[jdawg131]

I too am interested in the A35. I would love to be able to get rid of the A1 and move the XA1 into the bedroom. Hopefully it will be a true successor to the XA2.

[binister]

Without the Reon there really isn't any compelling reason to get the A35 vs the A30 in my opinion.

I really hope they include the Reon in this puppy.

[hd nOOb]

Originally Posted by turansformer

Great thread.... I hope to see some more announcements made at CEDIA on whether or not this player will include a Reon processor, or if that we will have to wait for a true successor to the XA2.

Quick question, the main purpose of this chip ( Reon ) is for SD DVD up scaling?
And is not an important part for HD DVD 1080p viewing?

Originally Posted by binister

Without the Reon there really isn't any compelling reason to get the A35 vs the A30 in my opinion.

I really hope they include the Reon in this puppy.

See that is why I asked the question. I got the A20 because I don't care about DVD anymore, only HD. But at times I fell like I'm missing out on something and want to be sure this time that I make the right choice.

[turansformer]

Originally Posted by hd nOOb

Quick question, the main purpose of this chip ( Reon ) is for SD DVD up scaling?
And is not an important part for HD DVD 1080p viewing?

That is correct sir. You may now pass go and collect $200.

[Djoel]

No mention of DTS MA as well.....

Djoel

[sharkshark]

FWIW, if you have HDMI audio there's not a heck of a lot that seems to distinguish the two, I grant. However, for many of us Analogue output is a MUST have, and one reason many are still using G1 units. So, yeah, it's important.

[dobieck1]

Originally Posted by turansformer

That is correct sir. You may now pass go and collect $200.

I thought it also did good things for your HD picture as well. Maybe I read that in one of the reviews somewhere...

[Lee Stewart]

I really don't like to speculate but I THINK this chip is in the new Gen 3 players. This is a case of one chip replacing two to save on manufacturers cost.

http://www.cirrus.com/en/press/releases/P524.html

[turansformer]

If that is the chip used in these players, then it should be able to support DTS:MA.

[sharkshark]

...if anybody has definitive info about the REON and HD processing, let me know... I listed it as SD important above as, without receiving the $200, that's what I thought. I've been wrong...

Lee, good find, and my assumption as well - we're finally seeing one-chip solutions that will hopefully provide even better stability due to their customization for the process of HD DVD playback. Time will tell....

[dobieck1]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

...if anybody has definitive info about the REON and HD processing, let me know... I listed it as SD important above as, without receiving the $200, that's what I thought. I've been wrong...

Lee, good find, and my assumption as well - we're finally seeing one-chip solutions that will hopefully provide even better stability due to their customization for the process of HD DVD playback. Time will tell....

Found this. It appears to help both SD and HD

http://edageek.com/2007/01/02/toshib...deo-processor/

[sharkshark]

...yeah, if I undestand it correctly, the REON is used for upsaling, and, potentially, for outputting HD DVD via component. For HDMI HD video it's not used. I don't want this to get off topic, but it would go a long way to whether or not it's actually a big deal that the REON is available or not. As above, some don't care about Analogue outs, so they can get away with the other model. Some may worry less about "losing" the REON in favour of a half-the-price player that's even more stable and does just as good a job with HD content...

[dobieck1]

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart

I really don't like to speculate but I THINK this chip is in the new Gen 3 players. This is a case of one chip replacing two to save on manufacturers cost.

http://www.cirrus.com/en/press/releases/P524.html

Thats audio DAC I believe, not the video processing chip. I think the Onkyo 605 uses those instead of the Burr-Browns the higher end models have. Same for other brands I believe.

Edit, you never said it was for video, and I agree one chip for all audio is better. My bad

Sorry to get of topic as well.

[aaronwt]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

...yeah, if I undestand it correctly, the REON is used for upsaling, and, potentially, for outputting HD DVD via component. For HDMI HD video it's not used. I don't want this to get off topic, but it would go a long way to whether or not it's actually a big deal that the REON is available or not. As above, some don't care about Analogue outs, so they can get away with the other model. Some may worry less about "losing" the REON in favour of a half-the-price player that's even more stable and does just as good a job with HD content...

The REON must do something with the HD DVD video beacuse the pciture enhancement function of the REON still works when playing an HD DVD, but not any of the Noise reduction features.

[gtgray]

I am pretty sure the Reon does the 1080i to 1080P deinterlacing for HD as well as the various noise reduction techniques.

[Lee Stewart]

Someone help me out here . . .

To my understanding - there are three makers of UP DVD chips (did I already blow it?)

1. Sirrus Logic
2. Anchor Bay
3. Farjouuuuuu - whatever

We know the Samsung 2400 and the 5000 are using the SL Reon chip. We do not know (or at least I don't know) what UP DVD chip the P1400 will have.)

Anyone know which chip is in the A2?

[sharkshark]

...isnt' Anchor Bay a DVD distribution company?

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by gtgray

I am pretty sure the Reon does the 1080i to 1080P deinterlacing for HD as well as the various noise reduction techniques.

Fair enough, I (obviously) don't own the XA2, so I had assumed, incorrectly, that all video "tweaks" were bypassed when using HDMI.

It remains far too early to know what chip will be inside the G3 units, and whether or not the new chip (if not a REON) will do a similar level of PQ.

In the mean time, here's hoping this thread can remain a civil place for the discussion of these specific models when new info is presented.

[littlesaint]

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart

Someone help me out here . . .

To my understanding - there are three makers of UP DVD chips (did I already blow it?)

1. Sirrus Logic
2. Anchor Bay
3. Farjouuuuuu - whatever

We know the Samsung 2400 and the 5000 are using the SL Reon chip. We do not know (or at least I don't know) what UP DVD chip the P1400 will have.)

Anyone know which chip is in the A2?

The Reon is made by Silicon Optix. It is in the XA2. Their high-end chip is the Realta.

ABT makes the chip in the A20. They also make the chips that go on the high-end DVDO scalers.

Not sure about the A2.

[Lee Stewart]

Originally Posted by littlesaint

The Reon is made by Silicon Optix. It is in the XA2. Their high-end chip is the Realta.

ABT makes the chip in the A20. They also make the chips that go on the high-end DVDO scalers.

Not sure about the A2.

Silicone Optix . . thank you! I am jumping back and forth between two forums and it is evident I am getting confused and confusing others - time to take a 15 minute break.

Here is the Anchor Bay Tech chip I believe you are discussing for the A20:

ABT-1018:

http://www.9web.co.uk/abt/downloads/..._PB_011606.pdf

[hconwell]

Before I saw this thread I was thinking about the A35 and how I might use it. I've got my old HD-A1 in our guest room hooked up to a Samsung CRT direct view 30" 1080i TV. That's just fine. My XA2 is in my theater hooked up to the IN76. But I'm limited to using coax digital out for audio because of the lipsync problems with that unit.

So I'm thinking of moving my XA2 into the bedroom paired with a new 1080p LCD and, perhaps, getting the new A35 for the theater. That will only work if 1.) the video performance of the new player is as good as the XA2 for both DVD and HD DVD. and 2.) Tosh finally solves the lipsync problem on the analog outs.

With those two prerequisites in place, I'm very interested in this player.

BTW, this thread was a good idea.

[sharkshark]

...it'll be next to impossible to keep the announcement thread on track, so let's all try and keep this one up to date over the next few weeks/months.

Are there any other key questions that any of you may have for this upcoming unit that I should add to the top? Once we have answers to these questions I'll include them above so that they'll be located in one place.

Hopefully we can thus keep at least this one thread on track...

[Jon_W]

Someone in another thread said that there would be an XA3 but it would not be coming out with the other three new models. Not sure how reliable that info. is.

[sharkshark]

...probably as good a guess as any - FWIW, it's question number two above (pending a confirmed answer)

[hconwell]

Sharkshark -

This is just a fine point ... but I think the lipsync issues on various HD DVD players manifest themselves on all audio output ports ... not just the analogs. I know I've posted myself that I have a problem with the lipsync issues ON THE ANALOG OUTS. But here's the explanation:

The lipsync issues on the digital outs (coax and toslink) can be completely remedied using a Felston digital audio delay. I have one. And I bought it because I needed it badly. But I am not aware of any way to delay analog audio out. Hence, the lipsync issues with analog are simply not fixable.

fine point ... but, I thought, worth mentioning ... since I don't want someone to read this and come away thinking they can have good lipsync using coax/toslink digital audio out. I think they'd still have a problem.

[dobieck1]

Originally Posted by Jon_W

Someone in another thread said that there would be an XA3 but it would not be coming out with the other three new models. Not sure how reliable that info. is.

That was me. My source who works for Tosh said hes pretty sure they are coming out with a succesor, but not until later this year, and it wasn't going to be announced with these (as it wasn't).

Take it for what its worth. He's been dead nuts on with every other thing he's told me so we will see.

[sharkshark]

...cool, added to above. We all take any of this info with a grain of salt, of course. I for one -assume- that the XA3 is coming, or at least something to capture the high end market. The question, then, is what this model has compared to the -previous- model champion. We'll add the comparison to the XA3 (or equiv.) when/if it gets announced.

Edited lipsync issues comment above. As there contines to be tonnes of "does it do XXX?" repeated in the announcement thread, I may have missed some key questions. Sorry to repeat, but let me know as this develops, as above, and I'll do my best to keep what we know up to date.

[Megalith]

I'll get the A35 if it loads HD-DVDs as quickly as standard DVDs, has pure 1080p output with no interlacing steps, and can create a phantom center through analog out.