Sony "Theater Sync" - It actually works!

jmoyer · 10-06-07, 04:14 PM

We recently upgraded our TV, AV receiver and DVD player to Sony components that all support "Theater Sync", Sony's name for HDMI-CEC (Consumer Electronic Control). Not expecting much, I enabled "HDMI Control" in all these devices, and was pleasantly surprised to discover it actually works very well.

THE THEORY -
HDMI-CEC allows HDMI-connected components to send control signals to each other, for power on/off, input selection, and such. The HDMI standard defines specific capabilities, so this is supposed to work across different brands. The Sony components we have support:
1. "One Touch Play" - Selecting one component, like loading a DVD and pressing play, will turn on all the other components (AV receiver and TV) and configure the appropriate inputs on everything so the DVD appears on the TV, and the sound comes out the AV receiver.
2. "System Audio Control" - If you turn the TV on, the AV receiver is also turned on, the TV speakers are turned off, and the audio comes through the AV system. If you turn the receiver off, the TV speakers are turned back on.
3. "System Power" - turning the TV on or off turns the connected components on or off as well.

THE REALITY -
Our setup works exactly as described above, with no other work involved other than just enabling HDMI control! Most functions can be controlled using just the TV remote (which is much less complicated and has many fewer buttons than the receiver remote).

Note in the description below that the DVD player HDMI output is connected to the receiver "DVD" input, and the receiver HDMI output is connected to the TV HDMI input. There are both optical and RCA cables connecting the TV audio output to the receivers "TV" audio inputs. The receiver can auto select between the optical and RCA audio inputs.

To watch TV, just hit the power button on the TV remote. The TV turns on, the AV receiver turns on, the TV input on the receiver is selected, and the speakers on the TV are turned off. The volume and mute buttons on the TV remote control the volume on the AV receiver. When you turn the TV off, the receiver turns off too.

To watch a DVD, put a DVD in the player and hit the play button. The TV and receiver turn on (if not already on), the DVD input on the receiver is selected, and the DVD appears on the TV while the sound comes from the receiver. If, while the DVD is playing, you select a TV channel on the TV remote, everything switches back to TV. To go back to the DVD you can either use the "input" button on the TV remote to select DVD, or hit the play button on the DVD remote, and everything switches back to DVD. For either TV or DVD, the volume and mute buttons on the TV remote control the audio. Hit the off button on the TV remote and everything turns off.

The only analog component in the system is the (non-HD) Tivo box. It is connected to the TV via S-Video and RCA audio cables. The TV remote is used for input switching, so to watch Tivo merely requires using the input button on the TV remote to switch from TV to DVR. Unfortunately since the TIVO isn't HDMI connected the TV remote cannot change the Tivo channels. At the moment it is actually easier to just use 2 remotes (TV and Tivo) than to mess around with a universal.

That's it. Everything just worked right out of the box. After I set the system up my wife started using it without any explanations or training sessions, I wasn't even home at the time!

Hans_Gruber · 10-07-07, 09:37 AM

Do you suppose that the system will work with a Ps3? Have one yet?

This would partially resolve the problem between the more 21st century remote of the Ps3 (I mean not using 80's tech like infrared) and the ir remotes of other home theater components such as a projector and a/v receiver.

I would like to have a bluetooth system similar to the logitech harmony remotes. E.g. I would like to press "use playstation 3", and the bt remote would then turn on and setup correct inputs for the Ps3, a/v receiver and the projector.

Sometimes it makes you feel retarded when you try to use everything via infrared. Even though the current harmony remotes are quite ok and powerful, they sometimes fail to turn one component of the HT system on/off or something. And the lag...... makes you wish you had a similar instant response control system like the ps3.

tcwatkins · 10-07-07, 01:22 PM

Great to hear. I'm going all Sony in the hopes that my SO can use Theater Sync to watch TV and Videos. Came close a few times to having remote controls thrown up against walls.

One question. I have FIOS with the Verizon provided DVR which has HDMI. Wonder if you can use the Sony remote to change the channels on that? It would be perfect!

N200PF · 10-07-07, 05:16 PM

That's JUST was I was going to ask. We're considering a Sony STR-DA5300ES to go along with a KDL-52XBR5 and a Blu-ray player but the soft link in the chain is going to be our HD-DVR from Comcast It does have HDMI out but I would be amazed if it worked with Theater Sync...which might make the entire idea not worth it considering how much cable we watch.

- Peter

jmoyer · 10-08-07, 12:20 AM

Sorry, I don't know about the PS3 or the DVR. All of the Sony Theater Sync gear has an item in a setup menu somewhere to turn "HDMI Control" on or off. If the devices you are interested in have such a setup item then they should in theory work with Theater Sync.

The Sony TV remote is not programmable. The Sony AVR remote is programmable but it's much less friendly due to the large number of buttons. So far using 2 (TV + Tivo) simple remotes seems easier than using 1 (AVR) complicated remote.

tcwatkins · 10-08-07, 05:05 PM

Talked to a FIOS tech rep today. He said he thought it would work with the Sony system (yeah!) then he said he saw a 12 page explaination, mainly diagrams, online. He also said that Motorola was the main STB company so they all had the codes to change channels. So I don't think he knew what he was talking about. Oh well, I'll find out in a few months when I buy the TV.

DrrD · 10-08-07, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcwatkins

Talked to a FIOS tech rep today. He said he thought it would work with the Sony system (yeah!) then he said he saw a 12 page explaination, mainly diagrams, online. He also said that Motorola was the main STB company so they all had the codes to change channels. So I don't think he knew what he was talking about. Oh well, I'll find out in a few months when I buy the TV.

I have the PS3, and the Sony KDS-A3000 with theater sync.

The PS3 does NOT show up in the theater sync menu of the KDS. Not sure if I'm doing something wrong, I haven't spent too much time on it, but it might mean it's not compatible.

jmoyer · 10-08-07, 06:50 PM

Attached is the Sony HDMI control manual. It shows how to turn on HDMI control on a Sony DVD player. There is some gibberish about hooking up a set top box, see the "tip" on page 5.

tcwatkins · 10-08-07, 11:18 PM

I thought this is what the FIOS guy was referring to but it's not. Not sure it even anticipates that you can run HDMI from STB to AV receiver to TV. Strange translations to English for sure!

But thanks a lot, it's a start.

Btw, never thought about looking for a separate manual for the function. The Theatre Sync Manual on the 5300ES page is at:

http://www.docs.sony.com/release/STR...uide_EN_FR.pdf

It's more complete than the one above but still doesn't answer the question. It does though show a lot more connections than I thought would be needed with HDMI.

lrosetti · 03-09-08, 05:30 PM

jmoyer,

I have a Motorola DCT6416 III DVR Cable Box connected by HDMI to a Sony HT-SS2000 at the SAT IN connection. The HT-SS2000 is connected by HDMI to a Sony Bravia LCDTV KDL-52W3000. A Sony Blu-ray Disc Player BDP S300 is connected by HDMI to the HT-SS2000 at the Video 2/ BD IN connection.
When I press PLAY on the BD remote the TV, the HTS And the BD turns on with the correct selection of the HDMI inputs. THE BD plays excellent. When I press POWER on the TV remote all units turn off. Good to this point. When I press POWER on the TV remote to turn on just the TV and HTS the correct HDMI input for the HTS is not selected. It selects VIDEO2/BD instead of SAT. Therefore, I do not get a Picture on the TV. I have press SAT on the HTS to get a picture. Is the Theatre Sync working correctly? If not, how can I correct the problem.

Larry

Pinstripe · 03-09-08, 06:38 PM

Sounds like Yamaha's SCENE feature.

jqmn · 03-09-08, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmoyer

Sorry, I don't know about the PS3 or the DVR. All of the Sony Theater Sync gear has an item in a setup menu somewhere to turn "HDMI Control" on or off. If the devices you are interested in have such a setup item then they should in theory work with Theater Sync.

The Sony TV remote is not programmable. The Sony AVR remote is programmable but it's much less friendly due to the large number of buttons. So far using 2 (TV + Tivo) simple remotes seems easier than using 1 (AVR) complicated remote.

The HDMI 1.3 spec allows for "options" to be supported at the manufacturer's choice. It appears that while PS3 is HDMI 1.3, its manual seems to indicate that it only supports deep color; not CEC.

bsd107 · 04-01-08, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmoyer

Attached is the Sony HDMI control manual. It shows how to turn on HDMI control on a Sony DVD player. There is some gibberish about hooking up a set top box, see the "tip" on page 5.

Thanks for the link. This feature, "STB Syncrho" seems to be designed to help us get around the fact that no Set-top Boxes support HDMI control right now.

Unfortunately for me, I have a 52W3000 that has HDMI control, but it does NOT have the "STB Synchro" feature. And my 5300ES also has HDMI control, but it's not going to help in this case, either. Without HDMI Control for my TiVo Series 3, this feature isn't going to help me much....

bsd107 · 04-01-08, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jqmn

The HDMI 1.3 spec allows for "options" to be supported at the manufacturer's choice. It appears that while PS3 is HDMI 1.3, its manual seems to indicate that it only supports deep color; not CEC.

The PS3 is actually a HDMI v1.3a device. Not that this means much - with it's lack of bitstream support for HDMI v1.2-complaint audio codecs, and lack of HDMI Control, it's got to be one of the most limited v1.3a implementations yet.

It seems to be basically a v1.1 device with the addition of x.v.Color, which today is useless except for AVCHD discs made on x.v.Color-compliant DVD Camcorders (woopie!)....

Yes, I own a PS3, and, yes, I am bitter....

Spiff69 · 04-02-08, 01:44 AM

Does anyone remember S-Link?

How far we've come . . . or not.

merebito · 04-08-08, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bsd107

The PS3 is actually a HDMI v1.3a device. Not that this means much - with it's lack of bitstream support for HDMI v1.2-complaint audio codecs, and lack of HDMI Control, it's got to be one of the most limited v1.3a implementations yet.

It seems to be basically a v1.1 device with the addition of x.v.Color, which today is useless except for AVCHD discs made on x.v.Color-compliant DVD Camcorders (woopie!)....

Yes, I own a PS3, and, yes, I am bitter....

Is this something that can be updated with a firmware update - do you think?

bsd107 · 04-12-08, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrrD

I have the PS3, and the Sony KDS-A3000 with theater sync.

The PS3 does NOT show up in the theater sync menu of the KDS. Not sure if I'm doing something wrong, I haven't spent too much time on it, but it might mean it's not compatible.

The PS3 does not have the HDMI CONTROL feature.

One might hope that they could add it at a future date, but given that the PS3 doesn't have a fully capable HDMI v1.3a implementation, I doubt it...

jimmyfro5 · 04-15-08, 05:29 PM

hi
Can someone help me understand HDMI Resolution settings? I think it is related to my problem with my Sony STR-DG810 HDMI REceiver. The HDMI led use to be lit up above SAT when I'm watching cable TV. Now when I try to activate HDMI CONTROL On, the HDMI just flashes and does not respond to ENTER. any ideas?

gutnick · 09-12-08, 02:19 AM

Funny about the S-LINK. That was the coolest thing ever! Until digital TV rolls around and turned the TV into a fancy monitor.
Has anyone figured out if there is a way to integrate the Motorola Cable Box with DVR with Theatre Sync?

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jmoyer New Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 8	Sony "Theater Sync" - It actually works! We recently upgraded our TV, AV receiver and DVD player to Sony components that all support "Theater Sync", Sony's name for HDMI-CEC (Consumer Electronic Control). Not expecting much, I enabled "HDMI Control" in all these devices, and was pleasantly surprised to discover it actually works very well. THE THEORY - HDMI-CEC allows HDMI-connected components to send control signals to each other, for power on/off, input selection, and such. The HDMI standard defines specific capabilities, so this is supposed to work across different brands. The Sony components we have support: 1. "One Touch Play" - Selecting one component, like loading a DVD and pressing play, will turn on all the other components (AV receiver and TV) and configure the appropriate inputs on everything so the DVD appears on the TV, and the sound comes out the AV receiver. 2. "System Audio Control" - If you turn the TV on, the AV receiver is also turned on, the TV speakers are turned off, and the audio comes through the AV system. If you turn the receiver off, the TV speakers are turned back on. 3. "System Power" - turning the TV on or off turns the connected components on or off as well. THE REALITY - Our setup works exactly as described above, with no other work involved other than just enabling HDMI control! Most functions can be controlled using just the TV remote (which is much less complicated and has many fewer buttons than the receiver remote). Note in the description below that the DVD player HDMI output is connected to the receiver "DVD" input, and the receiver HDMI output is connected to the TV HDMI input. There are both optical and RCA cables connecting the TV audio output to the receivers "TV" audio inputs. The receiver can auto select between the optical and RCA audio inputs. To watch TV, just hit the power button on the TV remote. The TV turns on, the AV receiver turns on, the TV input on the receiver is selected, and the speakers on the TV are turned off. The volume and mute buttons on the TV remote control the volume on the AV receiver. When you turn the TV off, the receiver turns off too. To watch a DVD, put a DVD in the player and hit the play button. The TV and receiver turn on (if not already on), the DVD input on the receiver is selected, and the DVD appears on the TV while the sound comes from the receiver. If, while the DVD is playing, you select a TV channel on the TV remote, everything switches back to TV. To go back to the DVD you can either use the "input" button on the TV remote to select DVD, or hit the play button on the DVD remote, and everything switches back to DVD. For either TV or DVD, the volume and mute buttons on the TV remote control the audio. Hit the off button on the TV remote and everything turns off. The only analog component in the system is the (non-HD) Tivo box. It is connected to the TV via S-Video and RCA audio cables. The TV remote is used for input switching, so to watch Tivo merely requires using the input button on the TV remote to switch from TV to DVR. Unfortunately since the TIVO isn't HDMI connected the TV remote cannot change the Tivo channels. At the moment it is actually easier to just use 2 remotes (TV and Tivo) than to mess around with a universal. That's it. Everything just worked right out of the box. After I set the system up my wife started using it without any explanations or training sessions, I wasn't even home at the time!

10-07-07, 09:37 AM	#2 \| Link
Hans_Gruber Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 100	Hdmi Cec & Ps3 Do you suppose that the system will work with a Ps3? Have one yet? This would partially resolve the problem between the more 21st century remote of the Ps3 (I mean not using 80's tech like infrared) and the ir remotes of other home theater components such as a projector and a/v receiver. I would like to have a bluetooth system similar to the logitech harmony remotes. E.g. I would like to press "use playstation 3", and the bt remote would then turn on and setup correct inputs for the Ps3, a/v receiver and the projector. Sometimes it makes you feel retarded when you try to use everything via infrared. Even though the current harmony remotes are quite ok and powerful, they sometimes fail to turn one component of the HT system on/off or something. And the lag...... makes you wish you had a similar instant response control system like the ps3.

10-07-07, 05:16 PM	#4 \| Link
N200PF Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: North Oaks, MN Posts: 27	That's JUST was I was going to ask. We're considering a Sony STR-DA5300ES to go along with a KDL-52XBR5 and a Blu-ray player but the soft link in the chain is going to be our HD-DVR from Comcast It does have HDMI out but I would be amazed if it worked with Theater Sync...which might make the entire idea not worth it considering how much cable we watch. - Peter Last edited by N200PF; 10-07-07 at 05:17 PM.. Reason: spelling error

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jmoyer New Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 8	Sorry, I don't know about the PS3 or the DVR. All of the Sony Theater Sync gear has an item in a setup menu somewhere to turn "HDMI Control" on or off. If the devices you are interested in have such a setup item then they should in theory work with Theater Sync. The Sony TV remote is not programmable. The Sony AVR remote is programmable but it's much less friendly due to the large number of buttons. So far using 2 (TV + Tivo) simple remotes seems easier than using 1 (AVR) complicated remote.

10-08-07, 11:18 PM	#9 \| Link
tcwatkins Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 151	I thought this is what the FIOS guy was referring to but it's not. Not sure it even anticipates that you can run HDMI from STB to AV receiver to TV. Strange translations to English for sure! But thanks a lot, it's a start. Btw, never thought about looking for a separate manual for the function. The Theatre Sync Manual on the 5300ES page is at: http://www.docs.sony.com/release/STR...uide_EN_FR.pdf It's more complete than the one above but still doesn't answer the question. It does though show a lot more connections than I thought would be needed with HDMI. Last edited by tcwatkins; 10-08-07 at 11:42 PM.. Reason: Found Another Manual

10-07-07, 01:22 PM	#3 \| Link
tcwatkins Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 151	Great to hear. I'm going all Sony in the hopes that my SO can use Theater Sync to watch TV and Videos. Came close a few times to having remote controls thrown up against walls. One question. I have FIOS with the Verizon provided DVR which has HDMI. Wonder if you can use the Sony remote to change the channels on that? It would be perfect!

10-08-07, 05:05 PM	#6 \| Link
tcwatkins Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 151	Talked to a FIOS tech rep today. He said he thought it would work with the Sony system (yeah!) then he said he saw a 12 page explaination, mainly diagrams, online. He also said that Motorola was the main STB company so they all had the codes to change channels. So I don't think he knew what he was talking about. Oh well, I'll find out in a few months when I buy the TV.

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lrosetti New Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1	Sony Threater Sync jmoyer, I have a Motorola DCT6416 III DVR Cable Box connected by HDMI to a Sony HT-SS2000 at the SAT IN connection. The HT-SS2000 is connected by HDMI to a Sony Bravia LCDTV KDL-52W3000. A Sony Blu-ray Disc Player BDP S300 is connected by HDMI to the HT-SS2000 at the Video 2/ BD IN connection. When I press PLAY on the BD remote the TV, the HTS And the BD turns on with the correct selection of the HDMI inputs. THE BD plays excellent. When I press POWER on the TV remote all units turn off. Good to this point. When I press POWER on the TV remote to turn on just the TV and HTS the correct HDMI input for the HTS is not selected. It selects VIDEO2/BD instead of SAT. Therefore, I do not get a Picture on the TV. I have press SAT on the HTS to get a picture. Is the Theatre Sync working correctly? If not, how can I correct the problem. Larry

03-09-08, 06:38 PM	#11 \| Link
Pinstripe Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 457	Sounds like Yamaha's SCENE feature.

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Spiff69 Extra Special Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: SoCal Posts: 471	Does anyone remember S-Link? How far we've come . . . or not.

04-15-08, 05:29 PM	#18 \| Link
jimmyfro5 jimmyfro5 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: ohio Posts: 3	hi Can someone help me understand HDMI Resolution settings? I think it is related to my problem with my Sony STR-DG810 HDMI REceiver. The HDMI led use to be lit up above SAT when I'm watching cable TV. Now when I try to activate HDMI CONTROL On, the HDMI just flashes and does not respond to ENTER. any ideas?

09-12-08, 02:19 AM	#19 \| Link
gutnick New Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 1	Any solution for Comcast DVR? Funny about the S-LINK. That was the coolest thing ever! Until digital TV rolls around and turned the TV into a fancy monitor. Has anyone figured out if there is a way to integrate the Motorola Cable Box with DVR with Theatre Sync?