Face / Off - Blu-Ray vs. HD DVD

bigdaddymars · 10-28-07, 10:08 PM

as you all know face / off was released in europe/australia by "disney" whereas the film is only available on hd dvd in the states!

how about a screenshot comparison?

i'm asking the blu-ray as well as the hd dvd users to put up some screenshots in this thread - let's compare them and choose the "winner"

lemonhead99 · 10-28-07, 10:12 PM

Why bother? Everyone knows Blu-Ray is technologically superior in every facet.

wormraper · 10-28-07, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lemonhead99

Why bother? Everyone knows Blu-Ray is technologically superior in every facet.

uncalled for man, he just wants to know which is better. same reason why people are buying the Import of T2 above the crappy lionsgate one.

Kram Sacul · 10-28-07, 10:37 PM

From the screenshots I've seen (on another forum) the BRD is more detailed but noisier and the HD-DVD has ugly DNR. Both look to be sourced from an old transfer.

I think the HD-DVD only has DTS whereas the BRD has PCM.

lgans316 · 10-28-07, 10:48 PM

I am pretty confident that both Paramount and BVHE used the same HD master with different encodes. On the audio front I compared the Japanese DTS track and the LPCM track and the difference is quite huge. LPCM is obviously better coz of better dynamics and extra LFE.

Kram Sacul · 10-28-07, 10:57 PM

It is the same master but the HD-DVD has had DNR applied on top. Example:

BRD / HD-DVD

GizmoDVD · 10-28-07, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lemonhead99

Why bother? Everyone knows Blu-Ray is technologically superior in every facet.

Reported

MEC2 · 10-28-07, 11:29 PM

Very subtle but I prefer the BD transfer - no reason to NR it.

MEC2

NickFoley · 10-28-07, 11:40 PM

So Paramount is DNR'ing the hell out of their older movies now?

Blumoon · 10-28-07, 11:47 PM

Wow... subtle my ass... The differences were night and day.

I would pick the BR hands down as superior looking. But is it worth 100% more entry price? For me yeah, but I dont think banding is typical for HD DVD, or at least the 12 or so I own.

rubso · 10-29-07, 12:30 AM

i can't tell the difference.

Averhoeven · 10-29-07, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubso

i can't tell the difference.

You're not the only one.
I think you guys may have missed the sarcasm in the "BD obviously better" post.... at least, that's how I took it after reading his sig. I saw him as saying the BD fanboys would flock in and make it a "no contest" argument by spewing garbage. I may be wrong in that interpretation though.

Boogie7910 · 10-29-07, 12:38 AM

What should I be looking for with DNR? I don't see what you guys are talking about.

jclark67 · 10-29-07, 12:56 AM

Wow! That is an amazing difference.

HiDef4Life · 10-29-07, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GizmoDVD

Reported

I think he was just being sarcastic. Check his signature.

Vincent Pereira · 10-29-07, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boogie7910

What should I be looking for with DNR? I don't see what you guys are talking about.

The bottom picture (domestic HD-DVD) has a very pasty, unnatural, video-processed look that the top picture (overseas BD) does not. I think if somebody took those screen-caps and did a mouse-over comparison it would be much more apparent to folks who aren't seeing it when they scroll between the images.

I don't think this is an HD-DVD vs. BD issue- this is an issue of bad video post-processing regardless of format, period.

Vincent

lemonhead99 · 10-29-07, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GizmoDVD

Reported

Cool. Have a great day.

HiDef4Life · 10-29-07, 01:09 AM

The BR looks a tad sharper but the lines on Travolta's forehead are more pronounced in the HDDVD version.

jclark67 · 10-29-07, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent Pereira

The bottom picture (domestic HD-DVD) has a very pasty, unnatural, video-processed look that the top picture (overseas BD) does not. I think if somebody took those screen-caps and did a mouse-over comparison it would be much more apparent to folks who aren't seeing it when they scroll between the images.

I don't think this is an HD-DVD vs. BD issue- this is an issue of bad video post-processing regardless of format, period.

Vincent

Do you know if this is common for domestic HD DVDs. I have noticed that the PQ on most the the HDs that I own don't really have that wow factor. I am kind of ignorant when it come to the hardware, but I was wondering if the player does any video processing because my A30 come out way more saturated than my BD player. I didn't know if it was the transfer or the player causing the problem. It seems like the movies on HD are not as detailed. They look nice, but they don't have that wow factor.

Thanks

lemonhead99 · 10-29-07, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent Pereira

The bottom picture (domestic HD-DVD) has a very pasty, unnatural, video-processed look that the top picture (overseas BD) does not. I think if somebody took those screen-caps and did a mouse-over comparison it would be much more apparent to folks who aren't seeing it when they scroll between the images.

I don't think this is an HD-DVD vs. BD issue- this is an issue of bad video post-processing regardless of format, period.

Vincent

Agreed, the second pic hurts to even look at, look at his bottom lip for instance. Night and day to me.

Kram Sacul · 10-29-07, 01:13 AM

BRD / HD-DVD

Mouseover:
http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd2.png

Mouseover of first set:
http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd1.png

lemonhead99 · 10-29-07, 01:18 AM

Thanks for the mouseovers, definitely reinforces my opinion that the HD DVD transfer is not as well done. The road cracks on the left side of the car pic is another example.

HiDef4Life · 10-29-07, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kram Sacul

BRD / HD-DVD

Mouseover:
http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd2.png

Mouseover of first set:
http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd1.png

I don't see much difference here.

lgans316 · 10-29-07, 02:01 AM

I love to take your Face/Off : Kram Sacul (Jus kidding). Looks like the BD version is a tad sharper than the HD DVD version. However if you have a close look at the shirt of Sean Archer you will figure out that the HD version looks more pleasing and smoothened out. In BD you will find the shirt texture to look a bit grainy. I am a die hard fan of Face/Off and would anyway buy the HD DVD version especially for the special features and bookmarks which is missing in the BD version. In terms of AQ the BD version will always remain superior coz of the bombastic PCM track.

Kram Sacul · 10-29-07, 03:15 AM

One last set:

BRD / HD-DVD

Mouseover:
http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd3.png

MovieSwede · 10-29-07, 03:23 AM

Its looks like both uses to much filtering.

But one uses sharpening, the other seems to uses some sort of DNR.

Denner · 10-29-07, 03:52 AM

Damn, BOTH transfers suck big time, the Blu-Ray is bad the HD-DVD is even worse, what the hell was Paramount thinking

MovieSwede · 10-29-07, 05:19 AM

Not sure if its Paramount to blame.

If you look at both images they both seem to have DNR applied. But the Disney footage seem to have added Sharpening.

So if anyone has photoshop on their computer can test and apply sharpening to the Paramount footage and see if it can match Disney.

If it matches then they had poor master.

philnerd · 10-29-07, 08:15 AM

I can't say I'm too impressed with either of these transfers based on the screenshots. The HD DVD is definitely losing detail, no doubts. The striped jacket on the guy in the left side of the screen in facehd2 loses a LOT of detail. Substantial portions that should be striped turn into mush.

The BD version unfortunately has a weird processed look to it. Could be sharpening.. but not sure. Looking at facehd1 there's just something funky going on over Travolta's ear. Switching to the BD version it almost looks like when you scan a magazine image into the computer and get that moire effect. I don't know, hard to describe.. just "processed". Still I'd easily give the nod to the BD version here.

Denner · 10-29-07, 08:46 AM

It is really weird, I am sure that i am seeing color bleed, like in the old VHS and LaserDisk days......

10-28-07, 10:08 PM	#1 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a4ac4393' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:30&n=a4ac4393' border='0' alt=''></a>
bigdaddymars New Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 10	Face / Off - Blu-Ray vs. HD DVD as you all know face / off was released in europe/australia by "disney" whereas the film is only available on hd dvd in the states! how about a screenshot comparison? i'm asking the blu-ray as well as the hd dvd users to put up some screenshots in this thread - let's compare them and choose the "winner"

10-28-07, 10:48 PM	#5 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a591f81a' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:36&n=a591f81a' border='0' alt=''></a>
lgans316 Never Ever Warn-her Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Bangalore India Posts: 6,379	I am pretty confident that both Paramount and BVHE used the same HD master with different encodes. On the audio front I compared the Japanese DTS track and the LPCM track and the difference is quite huge. LPCM is obviously better coz of better dynamics and extra LFE. __________________ Blu-ray : 213

10-28-07, 11:47 PM	#10 \| Link	<a href='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adclick.php?n=a591f81a' target='_blank'><img src='http://rev.avsforum.com/phpAdsNew/adview.php?what=zone:36&n=a591f81a' border='0' alt=''></a>
Blumoon BR Fanboy, HDDVD Fan Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 471	Wow... subtle my ass... The differences were night and day. I would pick the BR hands down as superior looking. But is it worth 100% more entry price? For me yeah, but I dont think banding is typical for HD DVD, or at least the 12 or so I own. __________________ PS3 - RFoM, SSHD, WH 360 - H3 PSN:XodusTrance XBL:XodusForever

10-29-07, 02:01 AM	#24 \| Link
lgans316 Never Ever Warn-her Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Bangalore India Posts: 6,379	I love to take your Face/Off : Kram Sacul (Jus kidding). Looks like the BD version is a tad sharper than the HD DVD version. However if you have a close look at the shirt of Sean Archer you will figure out that the HD version looks more pleasing and smoothened out. In BD you will find the shirt texture to look a bit grainy. I am a die hard fan of Face/Off and would anyway buy the HD DVD version especially for the special features and bookmarks which is missing in the BD version. In terms of AQ the BD version will always remain superior coz of the bombastic PCM track. __________________ Blu-ray : 213 Last edited by lgans316; 10-29-07 at 02:10 AM..

10-29-07, 03:23 AM	#26 \| Link
MovieSwede AVS Special Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Guess 3 times... Posts: 4,814	Its looks like both uses to much filtering. But one uses sharpening, the other seems to uses some sort of DNR. __________________ I want my grain region free.

10-28-07, 10:12 PM	#2 \| Link
lemonhead99 Tier 0 wannabe Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 172	Why bother? Everyone knows Blu-Ray is technologically superior in every facet.

10-28-07, 10:37 PM	#4 \| Link
Kram Sacul Screenshot Scientist Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 4,856	From the screenshots I've seen (on another forum) the BRD is more detailed but noisier and the HD-DVD has ugly DNR. Both look to be sourced from an old transfer. I think the HD-DVD only has DTS whereas the BRD has PCM.

10-28-07, 10:57 PM	#6 \| Link
Kram Sacul Screenshot Scientist Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 4,856	It is the same master but the HD-DVD has had DNR applied on top. Example: BRD / HD-DVD

10-28-07, 11:29 PM	#8 \| Link
MEC2 AVS Special Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Frisco, TX (D/FW area) Posts: 1,062 Classified Rating: 100% (1)	Very subtle but I prefer the BD transfer - no reason to NR it. MEC2

10-28-07, 11:40 PM	#9 \| Link
NickFoley Advanced Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Out There Somewhere Posts: 603	So Paramount is DNR'ing the hell out of their older movies now?

10-29-07, 12:30 AM	#11 \| Link
rubso Old Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 15	i can't tell the difference.

10-29-07, 12:38 AM	#13 \| Link
Boogie7910 Advanced Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 520	What should I be looking for with DNR? I don't see what you guys are talking about.

10-29-07, 12:56 AM	#14 \| Link
jclark67 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 125	Wow! That is an amazing difference.

10-29-07, 01:09 AM	#18 \| Link
HiDef4Life Advanced Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 976	The BR looks a tad sharper but the lines on Travolta's forehead are more pronounced in the HDDVD version.

10-29-07, 01:13 AM	#21 \| Link
Kram Sacul Screenshot Scientist Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 4,856	BRD / HD-DVD Mouseover: http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd2.png Mouseover of first set: http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd1.png

10-29-07, 01:18 AM	#22 \| Link
lemonhead99 Tier 0 wannabe Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 172	Thanks for the mouseovers, definitely reinforces my opinion that the HD DVD transfer is not as well done. The road cracks on the left side of the car pic is another example.

10-29-07, 03:15 AM	#25 \| Link
Kram Sacul Screenshot Scientist Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 4,856	One last set: BRD / HD-DVD Mouseover: http://horn.hdtvtotal.com/hdtvtotal/...cs/facehd3.png

10-29-07, 03:52 AM	#27 \| Link
Denner Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Denmark Posts: 223	Damn, BOTH transfers suck big time, the Blu-Ray is bad the HD-DVD is even worse, what the hell was Paramount thinking

10-29-07, 05:19 AM	#28 \| Link
MovieSwede AVS Special Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Guess 3 times... Posts: 4,814	Not sure if its Paramount to blame. If you look at both images they both seem to have DNR applied. But the Disney footage seem to have added Sharpening. So if anyone has photoshop on their computer can test and apply sharpening to the Paramount footage and see if it can match Disney. If it matches then they had poor master. __________________ I want my grain region free.

10-29-07, 08:15 AM	#29 \| Link
philnerd Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 410	I can't say I'm too impressed with either of these transfers based on the screenshots. The HD DVD is definitely losing detail, no doubts. The striped jacket on the guy in the left side of the screen in facehd2 loses a LOT of detail. Substantial portions that should be striped turn into mush. The BD version unfortunately has a weird processed look to it. Could be sharpening.. but not sure. Looking at facehd1 there's just something funky going on over Travolta's ear. Switching to the BD version it almost looks like when you scan a magazine image into the computer and get that moire effect. I don't know, hard to describe.. just "processed". Still I'd easily give the nod to the BD version here.

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Denner Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Denmark Posts: 223	It is really weird, I am sure that i am seeing color bleed, like in the old VHS and LaserDisk days......