DCT6412 III HDMI won't work (sometimes) - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 340 Old 11-15-2006, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skipsterut View Post

You should definitely take her up on the offer of the 6416 since it is exactly the same as the 6412 with the noteworthy improvement of having a hard disk that is 33.3% larger (160GB vs 120GB) .

As has been stated many times in this forum and others -- within a given geographic area serviced by the same headend the firmware does NOT vary "box by box." It is rolled out ("pushed"/downloaded) to all STB's connected to the headend concurrently. So -- if you can get a 6416 instead of a 6412 -- by all means get it. You benefit by a larger hard drive and don't give up anything. The firmware should be pushed to all STBs -- both 6412 and 6416 -- at the same time -- hopefully soon according to other posters.

One thing I have noticed about the 6416 is the processor seems faster. It moves through the guide more quickly. I'll have to really test it by recording 2 HD shows while watching a recorded 3rd HD show! That would kill my 6412s.
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post #182 of 340 Old 11-16-2006, 08:24 AM
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sorry guys haven't had a chance to post. ok........as of today my 6416 is still 12.31 (jan 24 build) I think that the Cox super told me we would be getting the firmware (16.20) on 11/18/06 so I'm being optimistic. but still no change after 3 dates.....GRRRR the credit I referred to was the rental for the 6416 . They gave me a 2 month credit when I complained about the fact that I purchased all my equipment with the idea of HDMI switching!! my DVD, and my Cable box, and my PS3. but because of "Rights Mgt." we are all having problems.
till the upgrade....... So I told Cox that since their box was the problem and the firmware was at fault, they credited me 2 months. not much but something. So on the 18th I'll let you know.............but I'm not holding my breath. word on the street is that the Tivo software that Cox is going to implement won't be until next year......probably when my firmware comes in.....GRRRRR


still waiting.....in Irvine, Ca.
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post #183 of 340 Old 11-16-2006, 05:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KustomMerc View Post

word on the street is that the Tivo software that Cox is going to implement won't be until next year......probably when my firmware comes in.....GRRRRR

I would LOVE to have a Cox TiVo. I have a 30 hour unit that is 7 years old that I refuse to get rid of. UI is the best! Figure that is the only way that TiVo is going to survive....selling licensing. But that a whole other discussion.....
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post #184 of 340 Old 11-17-2006, 01:33 AM
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Originally Posted by skipsterut View Post

You should definitely take her up on the offer of the 6416 since it is exactly the same as the 6412 with the noteworthy improvement of having a hard disk that is 33.3% larger (160GB vs 120GB)

They brought out the 6416 this morning, it still has the 12.31 firmware, according to the tech they don't know when the new firmware will be pushed, I guess I will have to use component video cables for now.

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post #185 of 340 Old 11-17-2006, 03:14 PM
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I called Comcast Wednesday to complain about HDMI not working through my new AV receiver. I explained to the tech and then her supervisor that everything I have read puts the blame on their firmware. The supervisor did not know when the new firmware would be pushed through. I asked her to tell her superiors every chance she has that she is getting SO many complaints, hoping that would help. I then pushed the stands and racks back against the wall then rolled the carpet back into place thinking it will be a long time before Comcast moves up to 16.20.

Yesterday I noticed that the path to my 'favorites' in guide form was changed. I checked the firmware and it had been upgraded to 16.20. I would like to think that my pleading had something to do with it, but I'm sure it was only coincidence. Once again I moved everything away from the wall, hooked up the HDMI from the Moto DCT 3412 to the Onkyo 674 then to the JVC 46FN97, everything now works. Much less clutter and hopefully furniture and rugs are back in place for a long time. I have noticed a few new changes to the menu so there seems to be more to 16.20 than just fixing the HDMI operation.
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post #186 of 340 Old 11-18-2006, 07:56 AM
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11/18/06.........still nada.....12.31...grrrr
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post #187 of 340 Old 11-18-2006, 05:01 PM
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Its kinda strange that component video cables work with no problems and look just as good.

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post #188 of 340 Old 11-18-2006, 05:23 PM
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problem with my Denon is that the digital audio that I have to use with the component cables makes my sound change from 5.1 to commercials.... it increases, hoping that will be fixed with HDMI. and the firmware update. the other reason is the denon is capable of HDMI switching , thats why the $1900 price tag I guess...
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post #189 of 340 Old 11-18-2006, 09:39 PM
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11/18 and guess what, no 16.20.

probably a waste of time anyway, ABC's HD coverage is so pathetic as far as audio goes, you just as well be back in the day when you simulated surround with stereo. absolutely no rear channel, and the center was very weak. man do they suck. CBS however has terrible video, but very nice audio, very nice.
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post #190 of 340 Old 11-23-2006, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KustomMerc View Post

problem with my Denon is that the digital audio that I have to use with the component cables makes my sound change from 5.1 to commercials.... it increases

I'm using the component video with the optical for the audio, no problems.

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post #191 of 340 Old 11-23-2006, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KustomMerc View Post

problem with my Denon is that the digital audio that I have to use with the component cables makes my sound change from 5.1 to commercials.... it increases

Quote:
Originally Posted by Croozer View Post

I'm using the component video with the optical for the audio, no problems.

Ditto (My AVR is a Pio Elite 72 -- not a Denon-- but I don't see why that would make any diff re: the problem)

Of course commercials are always programmed to be louder than the show itself, but I assume you are allowing for this and they are still SIGNIFICANTLY louder??

The other thing is that most HD shows are broadcast in 5.1 and the commercials (generally) are not (i.e. audio for commercials switches to stereo or mono(?)) -- so that may account for some sound level change -- and it most certainly accounts for a sound quality change.
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post #192 of 340 Old 11-24-2006, 04:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Croozer View Post

I'm using the component video with the optical for the audio, no problems.

We all are as well, but that is besides the point. We want to use the box as it was designed and simplify our HT systems.
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post #193 of 340 Old 11-24-2006, 08:03 PM
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well just got home from the holidays. Cox said they would change the firmware on nov. 20.....well just checked and no udate. same 12.31 I'm going to try and contact Cox on Monday to see what's up...a poster awhile back said something like the FCC was keeping this from happening. I don't understand that because someone in Marin county...San Francisco area said they just got ver. 16.20 and that is cox country... I can't really unserdtand the repeated holdups....but I'll let ya know.
Still waiting in Irvine, Ca.
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post #194 of 340 Old 11-25-2006, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mvalpreda View Post

We all are as well, but that is besides the point. We want to use the box as it was designed and simplify our HT systems.

LOL, if you are getting audio/video information the box is doing what it was designed to, other than that you will have to wait and do the component cable shuffle.

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post #195 of 340 Old 11-25-2006, 09:43 PM
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The Real Scoop:

I'm a Home Theater Installer for Circuit City, so I deal with these boxes on a daily basis.

Certain TVs don't require the source to use HDCP. Among these are the Hitachis and JVCs. Newer Sony sets (at least as far back as when they started branding their LCD engines as Bravias instead of Wegas) are a no-go, straight through to the tv and through receivers.

Comcast does not use HDCP. Why? Well I've gotten some inside info from Monster Cable, whose been trying to solve this issue as much as anyone. They are getting record returns on HDMI cables because of HDCP issues. People have been blaming the cables as being defective, but thats clearly not the case.

The reason is that Silicon Image, the company that developed HDMI, DVI, and HDCP handshaking, requires companies that use HDMI to pay royalties in order to have HDCP handshaking. Comcast has decided that they are too cheap to pay it.
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post #196 of 340 Old 11-26-2006, 11:51 AM
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Among these are the Hitachis and JVCs.

Wrong. My hitachi requires it.
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post #197 of 340 Old 11-26-2006, 02:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philycheezblunt View Post

The Real Scoop:

I'm a Home Theater Installer for Circuit City, so I deal with these boxes on a daily basis.

Certain TVs don't require the source to use HDCP. Among these are the Hitachis and JVCs. Newer Sony sets (at least as far back as when they started branding their LCD engines as Bravias instead of Wegas) are a no-go, straight through to the tv and through receivers.

Comcast does not use HDCP. Why? Well I've gotten some inside info from Monster Cable, whose been trying to solve this issue as much as anyone. They are getting record returns on HDMI cables because of HDCP issues. People have been blaming the cables as being defective, but thats clearly not the case.

The reason is that Silicon Image, the company that developed HDMI, DVI, and HDCP handshaking, requires companies that use HDMI to pay royalties in order to have HDCP handshaking. Comcast has decided that they are too cheap to pay it.


This is almost all wrong.

1) The source device decides if HDCP is used - not the TV. No TV "requires" HDCP.

2) Comcast uses HDCP in every market I know of. That's why people report green-screen error messages on this forum all the time.

3) HDCP royalties are 1/2 cent per unit. I think Comcast can afford that. Motorola probably pays it anyway.
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post #198 of 340 Old 11-26-2006, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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BTW - my boxes were upgraded to 16.20 about a week ago. I haven't checked to see if it solved any HDCP repeater problems yet. (I still have component hooked up on one and direct to TV on the other.

This is in Los Gatos, CA - near San Jose (Comcast)
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post #199 of 340 Old 11-29-2006, 04:57 AM
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Millenium customer in MD. Been complaining about green screen and asking for info on firmware update (currently 12.31) since July. No help. The AV-SYNC issues associated with the HDMI/Component shuffle are getting annoying.

Last week I was told that by upgrading from 6412 to the brand new 6416's they're handing out, I'd get newer firmware. Bzzzzt ! Still 12.31 !! Thanks for making me tear apart my entire entertainment system twice, for very little gain. (ok, more hard drive space is nice).

At least I'm getting "I don't know what you're talking about" answers from people further up the chain.

:- (
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post #200 of 340 Old 11-29-2006, 08:04 AM
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Well got the new date.....Dec 4 06 for the Irvine area... and the firmware upgrade ...
this is the 4th date. so I'm not to optimistic. but you never know.

still waiting in Irvine.......................but not forever.
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post #201 of 340 Old 11-29-2006, 10:01 AM
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I can report that Pioneer VSX-82TXS cannot pass the HDMI signal from the DVR w 16.20 firmware. I was wondering if anybody has the same combo? Since my receiver is new I can return it, if anbody is successfully using Denon 2807 with the comcast dvr 6416 please let me know.
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post #202 of 340 Old 11-29-2006, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KustomMerc View Post

Well got the new date.....Dec 4 06 for the Irvine area... and the firmware upgrade ...
this is the 4th date. so I'm not to optimistic. but you never know.

still waiting in Irvine.......................but not forever.

I'm not either. I just put in my new TV too, I really don't want to move all this junk! But this Sony 55A2000 would benefit from HDMI from the cable box. I can see the difference between HDMI and component on a 37" Philips LCD. Can't wait to see it on the Sony!
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post #203 of 340 Old 11-29-2006, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalguru1 View Post

I can report that Pioneer VSX-82TXS cannot pass the HDMI signal from the DVR w 16.20 firmware. I was wondering if anybody has the same combo? Since my receiver is new I can return it, if anbody is successfully using Denon 2807 with the comcast dvr 6416 please let me know.

I suspect that it's either a firmware bug in the 16.2 DVR or something other than your receiver. Do you have a DVD player with HDMI? If so, does it pass through the Pio 82 OK -- because if it does (as I suspect it will) then the HDMI/HDCP problem is NOT with the Pio since any HDMI DVD player must also be HDCP compliant.

If you don't have a DVD with HDMI, can you get one to see if it works? -- borrow one or buy one at CC (there are some Sammy and LG models under $100) and then return it.

I have a Pio 72 that works great with my Oppo 970 outputting HDMI, so I know it deals with properly programmed HDCP correctly. Hard to imagine that the 82 would be worse than a 72 in this important aspect of its design. If your Pio 82 doesn't pass a "correct" HDMI signal such as from a DVD player, then you probably a defective AVR.
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post #204 of 340 Old 11-30-2006, 07:22 AM
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Firmware
Version 16.20
Available for Models: DCT-64xx PI, PII & PIII, DCT-34xx
Available Date: 2006-09-20
Build Date: 2006-07-13 15:06:09

Bugfixes:
Tuners fail to tune to a channel following a scheduled recording.

New Bugs:
Audio dropouts and digital video artifacts when watching a recorded or buffered program.
Corruption of DVI/HDMI video outputs.
DVR erroneously claims to be 100% full.
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post #205 of 340 Old 11-30-2006, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skipsterut View Post

I suspect that it's either a firmware bug in the 16.2 DVR or something other than your receiver. Do you have a DVD player with HDMI? If so, does it pass through the Pio 82 OK -- because if it does (as I suspect it will) then the HDMI/HDCP problem is NOT with the Pio since any HDMI DVD player must also be HDCP compliant.

If you don't have a DVD with HDMI, can you get one to see if it works? -- borrow one or buy one at CC (there are some Sammy and LG models under $100) and then return it.

I have a Pio 72 that works great with my Oppo 970 outputting HDMI, so I know it deals with properly programmed HDCP correctly. Hard to imagine that the 82 would be worse than a 72 in this important aspect of its design. If your Pio 82 doesn't pass a "correct" HDMI signal such as from a DVD player, then you probably a defective AVR.

Thanks. I tested with my media center which has DVI . THe Pioneer passes that fine . So most likely its the cable box.
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post #206 of 340 Old 11-30-2006, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KustomMerc View Post

Firmware
Version 16.20
Available for Models: DCT-64xx PI, PII & PIII, DCT-34xx
Available Date: 2006-09-20
Build Date: 2006-07-13 15:06:09

Bugfixes:
Tuners fail to tune to a channel following a scheduled recording.

New Bugs:
Audio dropouts and digital video artifacts when watching a recorded or buffered program.
Corruption of DVI/HDMI video outputs.
DVR erroneously claims to be 100% full.

Bad! I can confirm that I have experianced the 1st 2 bugs reported !
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post #207 of 340 Old 11-30-2006, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalguru1 View Post

Thanks. I tested with my media center which has DVI . THe Pioneer passes that fine . So most likely its the cable box.

As I said on my other post, I'm also pretty sure the problem is in the STB -- i.e., bug #2 in post #204.

But -- do you know for sure that the DVI from your media center is HDCP compliant? I don't have an HTPC myself but have heard there are quite a few earlier video boards with DVI out that don't do HDCP. Since it's the HDCP source that controls/demands proper "handshaking" all along the chain, unless your DVI out has HDCP it's still not a full test of the Pio's ability to pass it through.
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post #208 of 340 Old 12-01-2006, 05:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skipsterut View Post

As I said on my other post, I'm also pretty sure the problem is in the STB -- i.e., bug #2 in post #204.

But -- do you know for sure that the DVI from your media center is HDCP compliant? I don't have an HTPC myself but have heard there are quite a few earlier video boards with DVI out that don't do HDCP. Since it's the HDCP source that controls/demands proper "handshaking" all along the chain, unless your DVI out has HDCP it's still not a full test of the Pio's ability to pass it through.

If you have an ATI card built before mid 2006, it's not HDCP compliant. They are in the middle of a class action lawsuit because they stated they were....and they weren't!

nVidia cards have been HDCP compliant for a long time. For HTPC, stick with those.
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post #209 of 340 Old 12-01-2006, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by mvalpreda View Post

If you have an ATI card built before mid 2006, it's not HDCP compliant. They are in the middle of a class action lawsuit because they stated they were....and they weren't!

nVidia cards have been HDCP compliant for a long time. For HTPC, stick with those.


My ATI card is definitely built before mid 2006 so I guess its not a test of my Pioneer! I guess I will have to borrow a new DVD player from a store to check that out. Maybe I should have waited to get my HDMI switching AV receiver !
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post #210 of 340 Old 12-01-2006, 09:26 AM
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So glad to find this thread and realize it's my Motorola DCT6412 III cable box and not my new Bravia. Had a cable guy out yesterday that was clueless, and after calling Sony I was looking at having to call a local repair shop to come out and test the HDMI inputs. Now I can sleep a little easier, and just wait/hope.

Comcast/Adelphia in VA.
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