Where have all the DVD recorders gone? - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 343 Old 03-15-2009, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by DeeKaye07 View Post

Wow -- glad I asked about the SD cards vs. DVD. I didn't know that movies may soon show up on SD cards.

Don't get too excited, it's not happening anytime soon and if it does it will be far more than you are willing to pay. The cost of the cheapest and slowest 8GB SDHC memory card is still in the $15-20 range. Compare this with the pennies per disk it costs to press an optical disk. Optical media is the cheapest ROM storage on Earth. Blu-ray costs a little more than DVD but they like it because of the draconian DRM it carries and they figure to make up the difference by charging you 2X the price for a BD movie -- just because it's in HD. The only thing that will replace optical media as the preferred distribution media is something cheaper. Flash memory has come a long way, but will have to get 2 orders of magnitude cheaper before it will be a viable distribution media.

BTW I have a Creative Zen Player with SDHC card slot. Ripping DVD's and downloading them to the Zen was cool for about a week, from a technology standpoint, until I asked myself why am I watching anything on this pathetic little screen when I have a 50" plasma sitting in my living room.

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As long as it's full bandwidth with all the hd audio as well it might be interesting but I'll bet it will be dumbed down or so crippled anyone that wants to make a backup or wants the true content wont be very happy.

The "SD" in SD-memory stands for "Secure Digital". It was designed as a DRM enabled flash memory platform. One can put their DRM'd music files on it (if one was foolish enough to buy them) and they will still be fully "protected" against piracy. So you can be certain that if video content is ever distributed on SD memory it will be as DRM protected against copying as the current technology will allow.

- kelson h

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post #182 of 343 Old 03-15-2009, 10:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

BTW I have a Creative Zen Player with SDHC card slot. Ripping DVD's and downloading them to the Zen was cool for about a week, from a technology standpoint, until I asked myself why am I watching anything on this pathetic little screen when I have a 50" plasma sitting in my living room.

Because you can't lug a 50" plasma around everywhere you go?

More and more, there are people who want the content to be on mobile devices. You might not, and I don't either, but the ones who do are growing.

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post #183 of 343 Old 03-16-2009, 12:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

The cost of the cheapest and slowest 8GB SDHC memory card is still in the $15-20 range.

It will be cheaper to create ROM versions of SD cards because the individual cells will be much simpler and therefore smaller and because all of the rather complex circuitry for flashing new contents into the memory won't be needed.

Also, movies on SD cards won't use quite as much storage because they won't need the very extensive ECC codes that are required to keep DVD data readable in the face of numerous insults to it's integrity. Those codes consume about 15-20% of the raw storage on a DVD. (Some redundancy may still be included, but solid state ROM storage by it's nature is a lot more robust, so any ECC information can simpler and won't take up as much space).

I'd give a wild guess at a manufacturing cost of a few bucks per card, which might translate into a $5-10$ premium at retail prices. But now is the right time to be planning the move, because Moore's Law is going to drive those prices down pretty quickly.
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post #184 of 343 Old 03-16-2009, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Tulpa View Post

Because you can't lug a 50" plasma around everywhere you go?

More and more, there are people who want the content to be on mobile devices. You might not, and I don't either, but the ones who do are growing.

Exactly...I wanted the ability to take it someplace and watch a show or a movie. Or if for some reason the power's out I can still watch something on the Zen.

I wanted it also for listening to music or FM radio on the go (or even at home). It's got lots of room for all of my favorite music, and lots of memory to spare. I had an older Creative MP3 player but it had a lot less memory and no capability for video, so figured it was time for a replacement.

But I digress. I'm still MUCH more inclined to use my DVD recorder for as long as possible, and plan on doing so.

DGK
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post #185 of 343 Old 03-18-2009, 02:00 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Nelson View Post

Oh come now, slprp1, would you actually pay that amount for one of these?

Considering a brand new Pioneer 560H is available in Canadian stores for Cdn$350 ($300 if you wait for a sale as I did), you could send a Canadian $500 to buy and ship one to you and keep the change and be way, way ahead. You'd have to be an idiot to pay $1200 for one.

You're not really an idiot, are you?

......No, Sean......I'm definitely not an idiot!......
Please re-read my post and point out specifically where I stated that I had any intentions to buy this unit!
......really, Sean, you surprised me with this......especially since I've always respected you opinion and appreciated your posts.
Coming from you, this is quite dissapointing (to say the least)!
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post #186 of 343 Old 03-19-2009, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by slprp1 View Post

......No, Sean......I'm definitely not an idiot!......
Please re-read my post and point out specifically where I stated that I had any intentions to buy this unit!

Well you sure seemed to be recommending this as a great chance to buy. I assumed that a recommendation like that to your friends here on the forum meant that you thought it was a good deal yourself. And frankly, if you did then I do have to wonder...
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post #187 of 343 Old 03-19-2009, 01:10 PM
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In the first post of the thread:

Please don't shoot the messenger! (re: Pioneer 640)

he does say:

Just passing along this information in case there's any interest (I'm actually considering it for myself).
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post #188 of 343 Old 03-19-2009, 01:41 PM
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I'd only consider $1200 as a last resort. Granted, HDD/DVDRs are becoming like Bigfoot sightings, there are still better deals here and there.

Don't believe everything on the Interwebz! A duck's quack DOES echo!
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post #189 of 343 Old 03-19-2009, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMas View Post

In the first post of the thread:

Please don't shoot the messenger! (re: Pioneer 640)

he does say:

Just passing along this information in case there's any interest (I'm actually considering it for myself).

He would probably have a much better chance of selling it if he dropped the price to a more realistic level.
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post #190 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 11:04 AM
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Looks like I need to dig out my Panny EH75 box and retrieve the IR Blaster that I left there for safe keeping and try to set it up.

I set up my new Philips 3576 yesterday and all I can say is as a DVD-recorder builder, Philips makes great toothbrushes (Sonicare).

What a huge disappointment. Remote sucks. Display is so small I can't read the clock which is the largest feature displayed. I am only part way through the manual but I could not find any quick program feature (TV-Guide or VCR+). I also could not find a way to add a quick chapter mark to a program I intended to return to at a later time to finish viewing from where I stopped.

No wonder Philips stopped making the unit. Not state-of-the-art at all. Huge disappointment that Panasonic did not update the EH75 with a digital tuner and larger HDD. I would have glady paid the price for a DVD-recorder like that.
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post #191 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizzie2 View Post

Looks like I need to dig out my Panny EH75 box and retrieve the IR Blaster that I left there for safe keeping and try to set it up.

With which external box?

The CM-7000 has the best PQ and is probably the easiest, most straightforward to set it up with (but people have gotten the Zenith/Insignia, RCA and DTV Pal to work with it, too).

For QAM, I don't know of any box out there that anyone's ever gotten the IR blaster to control.

If you mean the DTV Pal, so that you can try to get the digital TVGOS converted to analog, good luck (also, the Pal's PQ doesn't even come close to the CM's, unless you've got a small enough TV where it wouldn't matter).
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post #192 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 11:18 AM
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It doesn't have either feature, which I used a lot with my E80H. I wish the big boys would have continued making bigger better units too but once the digital crap happened they all just bailed, not enough profit and probably pressure from the movie and TV boys, plus cable with DVR's.
You can manually add chapter marks or let it auto add them at set points, plus it does have a resume feature for playback of the last thing you were watching from where you left off. I think it works after being turned off but not positive.
Unfortunately it's the best we're ever going to get with a digital tuner and Hard drive so you and the rest of us are stuck with it.
It's not as hideous as the Polaroid 2001g I had was as far as editing and naming things and at least the remote actually works without needing a LED upgrade.
It also has a full stereo tuner for analog... the other nice unlisted feature is it will take up to a 500 gig hard drive upgrade, I put a 250 in mine.
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post #193 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 11:40 AM
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I have both a Zenith 901 and a DTVPal. I think I have to set the DTVPal up with the IR blaster so it can change channels. Zenith does not have that feature. At least that is how I understand it. The threads on those items took twists and turns and lost me in heavy traffic. I am fairly well confused on that issue and had hoped to avoid it by purchasing a Philips.

My TV is a 46" Sharp Aquos 1080p so PQ does matter.

I just spent a week trying to repair my computer and failing. I ended up erasing the hard drive and reformatting. I am also working on my taxes. I am definitely not in the mood for more nonsense.
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post #194 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 11:59 AM
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The Zenith will definitely work with the EH75's IR blaster. And it will also give you better PQ (and less erratic behavior) than the DTV Pal (IMO).

Look up the poster here by the name of "ssgoodri" in the Members section at the top of the forum page here for detailed instructions on how to set the EH75 up with the Zenith. He doesn't post that often, so it shouldn't be too much work to trace his posts back.

(edit: Darn - "ssgoodri" is not exactly correct. It's something like that, but I can't find it in the members listings. If anyone here knows the correct spelling, or better yet, the exact posts, can you please let us know? Thanks.)
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post #195 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

The Zenith will definitely work with the EH75's IR blaster. And it will also give you better PQ (and less erratic behavior) than the DTV Pal (IMO).

Look up the poster here by the name of "ssgoodri" in the Members section at the top of the forum page here for detailed instructions on how to set the EH75 up with the Zenith. He doesn't post that often, so it shouldn't be too much work to trace his posts back.

(edit: Darn - "ssgoodri" is not exactly correct. It's something like that, but I can't find it in the members listings. If anyone here knows the correct spelling, or better yet, the exact posts, can you please let us know? Thanks.)

I would appreciate that. The Zenith is by far my favorite of the two converter boxes. I used it for months before I replaced my small kitchen TV with a newer digital tuner model.

I replace it with a Sharp Aquos LC-19D45U. I want to again take the opportunity to recommend NOT buying this television. It is barely audible at maximum volume. I am not the only customer complaining about the poor audio. My larger Sharp also has poor audio but I usually play it back through my 2-channel music system. I will not buy any more Sharp televisions because of their poor audio performance.

Back to the topic at hand. Pannys and IR blasters.
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post #196 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizzie2 View Post

I set up my new Philips 3576 yesterday and all I can say is as a DVD-recorder builder, Philips makes great toothbrushes (Sonicare).

I am only part way through the manual . . .

After more than two years of Panasonic use the addition of a Philips 3575 (a 2007 model) wasn't an easy transition for me, especially with such a different operating system and that frustrating remote. What a joy it was to get the Magnavox 2160 with the better (dare I say "Panasonic-like") remote. You need to realize that the Philips and Magnavox HDD/DVD recorders are built (by Funai) for us regular folks that couldn't afford the high end Panasonics of yesterday. Give the 3576 a chance, it's an acquired taste. My 3575 is pretty good, but I prefer the Magnavox 2160 for its remote and blazing fast dubbing.

You will not find the Owner's Manual to be the best source of information. Wajo's sticky thread is better. Do you want to do front and end cut editing? It's not in the Owner's Manual but it's found in Wajo's sticky thread. Let the first post in that thread be your guide:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=940657

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post #197 of 343 Old 03-22-2009, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizzie2 View Post

I have both a Zenith 901 and a DTVPal. I think I have to set the DTVPal up with the IR blaster so it can change channels. Zenith does not have that feature. At least that is how I understand it. The threads on those items took twists and turns and lost me in heavy traffic. I am fairly well confused on that issue and had hoped to avoid it by purchasing a Philips.

My TV is a 46" Sharp Aquos 1080p so PQ does matter.

I just spent a week trying to repair my computer and failing. I ended up erasing the hard drive and reformatting. I am also working on my taxes. I am definitely not in the mood for more nonsense.

If you really want to retain all the features and superior PQ of your Panasonic and you are willing to spend the money, there is another option that will give you a lot more. Return the Philips, add $300 to it and buy a TiVo HD with lifetime service (no further fees). First, connect the HDMI out of the TiVo HD into your Aquos to record/timeshift in HD and get all the clarity of that 1080p display you paid all that money for. Then, for those shows you want to keep, feed the S-Video output of the TiVo into your EH75. You can que the programs to record to the Panasonic while you sleep. You are now feeding the EH-75's encoder with a high quality down-scaled HD signal so you can use all the Panasonic's editing features. You are apparently OTA, so you will never have problems with copy-flags -- real or imagined -- because the TiVo HD ignores all OTA copy flags.

jjeff has his TiVo HD hooked up like this with one of his recorders and says the recorded PQ from the TiVo is better than from the DVDR's tuner. I was going to hook my EH-85 up like this, but I have my TiVo networked so I just send everything I want to keep to my PC.

There are a lot of people out there like you, with classic high-end Panasonic, Pioneer and Toshiba recorders who have bought big-screen HD-TVs and want to make the transition to digital tuner DVDR's but are unhappy with the current offerings. I certainly was one. A TiVo HD will let you retain everything you like about the EH75 and give you a whole lot more in the bargain. Check out the TiVo HD FAQ and get all the information.

- kelson h

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post #198 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 02:37 AM
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Kelson,

Regarding the TiVo HD.

Does the S-Video output a full screen widescreen image, or the floating postage stamp 16:9 image like the Comcast Motorola HD STB?

I read the TiVo HD FAQ and did not see this mentioned one way or the other. Since it did not state the picture was "miniaturized", I'm presuming it puts outs 16:9 full screen.
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post #199 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 05:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike99 View Post

Kelson,

Regarding the TiVo HD.

Does the S-Video output a full screen widescreen image, or the floating postage stamp 16:9 image like the Comcast Motorola HD STB?

I read the TiVo HD FAQ and did not see this mentioned one way or the other. Since it did not state the picture was "miniaturized", I'm presuming it puts outs 16:9 full screen.

I can't answer that myself because I don't have it hooked up to my E-85. I get the impression from jjeff that it outputs an anamorphic frame, but someone else will have to deliver the definitive answer to your question.

- kelson h

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post #200 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike99 View Post

Does the S-Video output a full screen widescreen image, or the floating postage stamp 16:9 image like the Comcast Motorola HD STB?

By default, the TivoHD outputs an anamorphic 16:9 image on HD channels through s-video and composite unlike most cable company boxes.

You can still use the TivoHD with a 4:3 TV, but you've got to change the aspect ratio in Settings -> Video -> TV Aspect Ratio. The options are 16:9, 4:3 Smart Screen (output HD channels as 16:9 and SD channels and menus as 4:3), and 4:3.

I'll add that to the FAQ.
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post #201 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 11:13 AM
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I've been looking at the Hauppauge WinTV HVR 1950 or the HD PVR 1212 as an alternative to a DVD recorder, using my laptop as the PVR to save stuff to and possible record to DVD if I want to keep something. Would either of these be a viable alternative? (Is it worth getting either one, that is?) This would be of course in the event that something happens to my current Panny DVD recorder (which still works fine as far as I know) and I can't get something to replace it...

Thanks in advance,
DGK
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post #202 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bfdtv View Post

By default, the TivoHD outputs an anamorphic 16:9 image on HD channels through s-video and composite unlike most cable company boxes.

You can still use the TivoHD with a 4:3 TV, but you've got to change the aspect ratio in Settings -> Video -> TV Aspect Ratio. The options are 16:9, 4:3 Smart Screen (output HD channels as 16:9 and SD channels and menus as 4:3), and 4:3.

I'll add that to the FAQ.



Thanks for the information. I was interested from a recording perspective. Currently if I use the Motorola HD STB & record via the S-Video connection, I get the postage stamp image. Sounds like TivoHD has the cure.
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post #203 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 01:42 PM
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wajo had a post that detailed which STBs and DVRs did widescreen over composite and s-Video.

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post #204 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 02:25 PM
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What functions does an IR-blaster enable? In other words does it change channels, turn on/off the converter box? What does it do with a Zenith 901 and DTVPal?

The way I understand it I would have to program both my Panasonic EH75 manually (for input 1) and program the DTVPal separately for each show I want to record. How does the IR-Blaster change any of that?
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post #205 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 04:13 PM
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The IR blaster controls the ATSC set top box just as if it were a cable box, letting you avoid the "set timers on both units" aggravation: you just set the Panasonic recorder and it controls the ATSC tuner with the IR blaster. This pretty much obviates any need for the crummy DTVpal, which is a lousy tuner solely justified by its half-assed "multievent" timer. With an IR-blaster-capable recorder, you are free to use the far superior Channel Master CM-7000 or Zenith DTT901. The recorders own timer always stays on the line inputs, while its blaster changes channels on your ATSC box as needed. (I think you have to leave the box on at all times though: not sure if the blaster can do a power-on/power off cycle as well as the channel change).

The only time this blaster thing gets tricky is with the goofy "sub-channels" now offered by some broadcasters: while the ATSC box can tune them. the blasters sometimes have difficulty pulsing the third channel digit quick enough for the box to accept. Workarounds for this are mentioned in threads devoted to the specific topic: look for posts by Rammitinski for good tips.
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post #206 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 04:55 PM
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Citibear, Thank you for the information. That is good news. I like the way the Zenith 901 works and I like its remote. I only bought the DTVPal for its "alleged" programming capabilities. It will be my pleasure to leave it in its box.

I wish the Zenith had some instructions about using an IR blaster. Some of the threads have become long and winding roads and are tedious to extract information from. What I do not understand is how I program the Zenith to record from input one and set a desired channel at the same time. When I program it I have to designate either a channel or an input, not both. I am not using it at the moment so I cannot explore other options.

I do not see any need for me to record the .2 and .3 channels so those shoud not be an issue.
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post #207 of 343 Old 03-23-2009, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizzie2 View Post

I wish the Zenith had some instructions about using an IR blaster. Some of the threads have become long and winding roads and are tedious to extract information from. What I do not understand is how I program the Zenith to record from input one and set a desired channel at the same time. When I program it I have to designate either a channel or an input, not both. I am not using it at the moment so I cannot explore other options.

I do not see any need for me to record the .2 and .3 channels so those shoud not be an issue.

Take a look at this how-to post and others in the thread. Although they are primarily concerned with the CM-7000 the basic principles apply to any CECB as long as you can figure out which code to select when setting up the Panasonic. See the posts by jjeff for his EH-55. That will be the same as the EH-75 for setup. Although the EH75 currently has the capability of downloading TVGOS from analog OTA channels to allow guide-based recording from the CECB, that will all vanish come 6/12 and your EH75 will behave like the EH-85 I detail in the referenced post.

Only the DTVPal is supposed to have the capability of converting digital TVGOS to analog and feeding it to the recorders. It remains to be seen if it will ever work and even if it does the PQ of the DTVPal is inferior -- the bigger the screen the worse it looks -- so plan for the worst.

- kelson h

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post #208 of 343 Old 03-30-2009, 06:51 AM
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Reading the first page of posts, a Canadian Pioneer DVD recorder was mentioned, but no model number. What is the deal with the Canadian version? Why is it better?
Also, the the Magnavox 2160 was supposedly introduced late last summer. Six months later it is discontinued with no reference to it on Manavox's website, just the older 2080. Ideas on this?

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post #209 of 343 Old 03-30-2009, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Reading the first page of posts, a Canadian Pioneer DVD recorder was mentioned, but no model number. What is the deal with the Canadian version? Why is it better?

Better than what? The US version?

If so, it's better for one simple reason. It's available for purchase if you can make it to Canada or know someone there who can send you one. The US version went bye-bye some time ago. The Canadian one will work as long as you don't need a built-in ATSC tuner.

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post #210 of 343 Old 03-30-2009, 07:31 AM
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The way the posts were written seemed to mean the Canadian version had other features/options.

Abundant OTA television is what makes this country different from all others. Lets keep it this way.
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