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post #1 of 56 Old 09-12-2009, 05:55 PM - Thread Starter
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please recommend a HDD DVD recorder.

requirement:
* to record international programs
* STB - have DISH subscription
* to burn/record from Camcorder(mini-DV)
* budget < $400
* continuous recording for 3 1/2 hours


Magnavox 2160A or DMR EH-58

Don't know if these are true, but is my understanding after reading couple of threads
* product warranty not available in DMR EH-58 if bought via W-I
* no TV-tuners in DMR EH-58
* Magnavox only HDD product available in walmart (usa market)
* Magnovox 2160A is not Region free
* 1080i or 1080p support not in 2160A

questions
* does EH-58 or Magnavox have TUBE-TV connectors
* disadvantage of not-having TV-Tuners or TV-guide
* any other product recommendations.


appreciate your time & response in advance.

-BG
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post #2 of 56 Old 09-12-2009, 06:43 PM
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If all your video is coming in via satellite or camcorder, a built-in tuner is useless to you. A tuner is for receiving over-the-air broadcasts via an antenna, which are now (almost) all digital (ATSC) in the USA; or analog cable TV (NTSC); or unencrypted digital cable TV (QAM) channels (which usually means only the local HD broadcast stations that your cable company carries).

With satellite, you have to use a STB, and record via a DVDR's line input (no tuner).

If by "TUBE-TV connectors" you mean composite video (yellow jack) or S-video (round multipin jack), plus stereo audio (red and white jacks), all DVDRs have at least composite video, and many have S-video (but I don't know about the Magnavox).
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post #3 of 56 Old 09-13-2009, 10:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtbell View Post

If all your video is coming in via satellite or camcorder, a built-in tuner is useless to you.

With satellite, you have to use a STB, and record via a DVDR's line input (no tuner).

thanks for the confirmation. Yes, i have STB.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtbell View Post

If by "TUBE-TV connectors" you mean composite video (yellow jack) or S-video (round multipin jack), plus stereo audio (red and white jacks)....

Yes, you are right.


Read this note for DH58
< This unit does not convert between PAL and NTSC. To record in PAL this unit must receive a PAL signal. To record in NTSC this unit must receive an NTSC signal.>

is output-signal from STB or Camcorder NTSC ? Do i need the converter
( will play-back using OPPO player)

seems like EH58 will fit my need, but what is that special need that will make me buy 2160A ? (is it the tuner ?)
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post #4 of 56 Old 09-13-2009, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neutronn View Post

Yes, i have STB.

But is it a Satellite STB?

If Cable, placing a digital-tunered DVDR 1st on the coax may be able to tune many channels on its own.

Even if Satellite, with a DVDR that has NTSC/ATSC/QAM tuners, a North American user could ADD cable or OTA antenna and tune those channels independently.

And... even if not interested or needing independent tuning today, think ahead... unless your life's future has already been predetermined!
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post #5 of 56 Old 09-13-2009, 01:01 PM
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He said he has Dish, so I would guess he means a satellite tuner. But which model?

Depending on the model, a new EH55 off of ebay might even be a better suggestion. Problem is, there's no way he's gonna get it for anywhere close to 400 bucks.

But with that model, he would't have to set timers on the recorder, or use an IR blaster to change channels on the tuner. You just set the recordings through the Dish guide (like you would with, say, TVGOS), and away you go.

I never plan on using my EH75 and 55 with cable, so those models were the best investment for me. I have the Dish 322 dual-tunered model. There are a few others it works with - some HD (the model #'s are buried on the Rovi/Macrovision site somewhere).

(edit: I just checked ebay, and there are no new EH55's available. Just some very old EH55 US models, and they're not the same as the more recent EH55 - they don't have that feature. Oh, well. Maybe elsewhere - but if there are any around, they'll still be priced up the wazoo, I'm sure. Probably like $600. It was just a thought, anyway.

Really, either the H2160A or the EH58 will work fine. Most Dish tuners have timers, so he'll just have to set timers on both units. It's not bad to have some kind of cable capabilities in the recorder for possible future usage - but that may not really mean anything to him if he can't see himself ever leaving satellite behind. To get all the cable channels in the future, he'll most likely have to use an external box anyway.)
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post #6 of 56 Old 09-14-2009, 11:45 AM - Thread Starter
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thanks for your replies.

* pardon if STB & satellite receiver aren't the same, I have satellite subscription receiver , not FTA.

* model - DISH 111 (solo), Non-HD , with smart access card

* Because of international programming, dependent on Satellite

* My immediate need is to record a specific children program available only through international channel

Hence I assumed the setup as
Fig1: [ Wall --> Dish receiver --> DVDR --> TV ]

But is the advice to buy with "tuner" capabilities, to get more control over the setup & recording capabilities

Fig2: [ Wall --> DVDR --> any receiver --> TV ]

* Will i able to "record" using Fig 1, assuming, "timer" has to be setup in 2 places

* will compare these again 2160A & EH-58 (may be EH-55)

Thank you
-BG
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post #7 of 56 Old 09-14-2009, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neutronn View Post

thanks for your replies.

* pardon if STB & satellite receiver aren't the same, I have satellite subscription receiver , not FTA.

* model - DISH 111 (solo), Non-HD , with smart access card

-BG

More Dish 111 product detail is found linked at this page:

http://www.dbsinstall.com/Dish_netwo...1_Receiver.asp

"A ROSE BY ANY OTHER NAME WILL SMELL AS SWEET. BUT IT DOES NOT FOLLOW THAT WHATEVER WE CHOOSE TO CALL A ROSE WILL POSSESS THE ROSE'S FRAGRANCE."

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post #8 of 56 Old 09-14-2009, 05:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DigaDo View Post

More Dish 111 product detail is found linked at this page:

http://www.dbsinstall.com/Dish_netwo...1_Receiver.asp

thanks for the link DigaDo.

I hope there is Something in the link that will assist with connection-setup with DVDR.

-BG
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post #9 of 56 Old 09-14-2009, 11:22 PM
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The 111 has modulated RF as it's only output, so you should probably be able to watch it (and record from it) on the recorder through channel 3/4 (if not, then you'll need a modulator, which doesn't cost much).

It also has timers - so you should be OK there, too.

You will definitely need at least an NTSC tuner in the recorder - so the EH58 is out. That means the H2160A would be your best choice.

The 111 will work with the EH55 as I described above - if the software version is P276 or higher (http://www.rovicorp.com/support/9565.htm) - but even if you can find one, it won't be any cheaper than $600.00. I don't think it's worth that just for that one feature.
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post #10 of 56 Old 09-14-2009, 11:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neutronn View Post

* Will i able to "record" using Fig 1, assuming, "timer" has to be setup in 2 places

Yes.
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post #11 of 56 Old 09-15-2009, 11:15 AM
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Just to answer this question, if it is still an issue...
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutronn View Post

Read this note for DH58
< This unit does not convert between PAL and NTSC. To record in PAL this unit must receive a PAL signal. To record in NTSC this unit must receive an NTSC signal.>

is output-signal from STB or Camcorder NTSC ? Do i need the converter
( will play-back using OPPO player)

You will place the machine in NTSC mode, and then it will work just like any North American model, with the exception of the tuner. No converter is necessary. If you buy PAL disks, THEN a converter is necessary, but if you are feeding the recorder an NTSC signal, it will record it to the hard drive, and to recordable media just fine, and these will play back on any DVD player.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #12 of 56 Old 09-15-2009, 12:24 PM
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He would need an NTSC tuner to use the satellite tuner through RF, wouldn't he (since the tuner only has a modulated, channel 3/4 RF output)? And the EH58 only has a PAL/SECAM tuner, right?

Or doesn't that matter?

He just has standard Dish service - same as any other Dish service. I think because he has an "international" package, he's getting confused that the signal is being converted to something other than NTSC out of the RF (I get a few international channels with my standard Dish package, also).
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post #13 of 56 Old 09-15-2009, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

He would need an NTSC tuner to use the satellite tuner through RF, wouldn't he (since the tuner only has a modulated, channel 3/4 RF output)? And the EH58 only has a PAL/SECAM tuner, right?

Or doesn't that matter?

He just has standard Dish service - same as any other Dish service. I think because he has an "international" package, he's getting confused that the signal is being converted to something other than NTSC out of the RF (I get a few international channels with my standard Dish package, also).

You are correct. He would need a tuner if the only output of the Dish receiver is RF. It would be so insanely stupid of Dish, to make a satellite receiver with RF output only, that it never occurred to me that it was even a possibility. The EH58 has composite and S-Video inputs. It also has two SCART connectors which might be able to accept component (480i) inputs. I haven't tested THAT yet. The SCART connectors that I have purchased so far only break out video and S-Video input and output. That part works fine. If your receiver does not have composite or S-Video output connections, then I guess you are stuck with not using this machine, getting an RF to composite converter, or getting a satellite receiver that is not electronically ancient technology.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #14 of 56 Old 09-15-2009, 08:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:


You will definitely need at least an NTSC tuner in the recorder - so the EH58 is out. That means the H2160A would be your best choice....

Quote:


He would need an NTSC tuner to use the satellite tuner through RF, wouldn't he (since the tuner only has a modulated, channel 3/4 RF output)? And the EH58 only has a PAL/SECAM tuner, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Church AV Guy View Post

You are correct. He would need a tuner if the only output of the Dish receiver is RF.

Quote:


If your receiver does not have composite or S-Video output connections, then I guess you are stuck with not using this machine, getting an RF to composite converter, or getting a satellite receiver that is not electronically ancient technology.

Quote:


No converter is necessary


thank you Rammitinski & Church AV Guy

i will try to summarize what i understood from your excellent posts.

Dish 111 receiver
a) Dish 111 has only 1 output , RF-Output CH3 or CH4
b) RF-Output is NTSC .

DMR EH-58
c) EH-58 doesn't have native NTSC tuner (line-in)
d) DISH 111 RF-Out , cannot be connected to , EH-58 , directly
e) a RF to composite-converter is required, to connect
f) RF to composite -converter is not same as NTSC/PAL converter

Magnavox 2160 (A)
g) Dish 111 RF-Out , can be directly connected , to Magnavox 2160(A)
h) Magnavox has inbuilt NTSC tuner


Options:
1) DISH 111 receiver, Magnavox 2160
2) Dish 111 receiver, RF to composite converter, DMR EH-58
3) newer DISH (322)????, DMR EH-58


thanks again. very insightful.
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post #15 of 56 Old 09-15-2009, 11:53 PM
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Two questions-

Has it been established that the OP lives in the States?

Also, does anyone know if you can even FIND an RF-to-composite converter?

A/V (Composite video) to RF yes, but the other way around? For a decent price?
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post #16 of 56 Old 09-16-2009, 06:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Has it been established that the OP lives in the States?

Texas country ;-)


Quote:
A/V (Composite video) to RF yes, but the other way around? For a decent price?

Ooops,if true, iam limited . Replace dish111(+regionfree eh58) or purchase 2160.

thank you folks.
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post #17 of 56 Old 09-16-2009, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gastrof View Post

Two questions-

Has it been established that the OP lives in the States?

Also, does anyone know if you can even FIND an RF-to-composite converter?

A/V (Composite video) to RF yes, but the other way around? For a decent price?

As far as a RF to composite converter goes, any old VCR will do this. It doesn't even matter if the transport works anymore, as long as the electronics are functioning, it will take an RF signal and put out a composite signal.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #18 of 56 Old 09-18-2009, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Church AV Guy View Post

As far as a RF to composite converter goes, any old VCR will do this. It doesn't even matter if the transport works anymore, as long as the electronics are functioning, it will take an RF signal and put out a composite signal.

awesome, i have a working VCR. Yes, verified, it does have a composite-out. at-last, i will be able to buy a region-free EH58.

Million thanks to everyone.
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post #19 of 56 Old 10-09-2009, 01:56 PM - Thread Starter
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i was planning for EH58, but out of luck.

w.i says, buy Pioneer_dvr-660H-k, as EH58/68 are out of stock, and new EH69model is more expensive.

any recommendations for Pioneer_dvr-660H-k ?
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post #20 of 56 Old 10-09-2009, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neutronn View Post

i was planning for EH58, but out of luck.

w.i says, buy Pioneer_dvr-660H-k, as EH58/68 are out of stock, and new EH69model is more expensive.

any recommendations for Pioneer_dvr-660H-k ?

The Owner's Manual may be downloaded here:

http://www.pioneerelectronics.ca/POC...R-660H-K?tab=D

Are you aware that this model has only an NTSC (analog) tuner? There is no digital tuner for ATSC broadcast or clear QAM cable. It has analog composite, RF and S-Video inputs for recording from exterior tuners, CECBs, cable boxes and satellite receivers.

"A ROSE BY ANY OTHER NAME WILL SMELL AS SWEET. BUT IT DOES NOT FOLLOW THAT WHATEVER WE CHOOSE TO CALL A ROSE WILL POSSESS THE ROSE'S FRAGRANCE."

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post #21 of 56 Old 10-09-2009, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neutronn View Post

EH58/68 are out of stock, and new EH69model is more expensive.

Do you have a link for the EH-69? I found nothing about it at WI.
I was just able to add both the EH-58 and EH-68 to my cart at WI
Who told you it was out of stock?
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post #22 of 56 Old 10-09-2009, 03:33 PM
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RE: EH69

I found this link for it on a New Zealand site. I found a version of the manual here. This looks really a lot like my EH68 manual.

I STILL don't see it listed on W-I's web site, or 220-volt, or Gandhi. If it exists, it barely exists.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, if I thought I had it sort of figured out, I guess I was wrong, yet again...

At THIS site there is a manual for the DMR-EH49/59/69 DVD recorders. Yup, the EH49, which I never heard of until today is identical to the others, as far as I can tell, with one minor difference. The 49/59/69 HDD sizes are 160/250/320 GB. The only other difference is the 69 has the SD card slot.

I haven't found anywhere it is available in the US.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #23 of 56 Old 10-09-2009, 06:46 PM
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I compared the EH58/68 and EH59/69 manuals. In the specifications, the differences seem to be:

EH59/69: can play back MP3, WMA, JPEG, DVD-Video, DivX from DVD-R.
EH58/68: can play back only DVD-Video, DivX from DVD-R.

EH59/69: HDAVI Control 4 for communicating with TV via HDMI
EH58/68: HDAVI Control 3

EH59/69: USB 2.0 High Speed
EH58: USB 2.0 Full Speed
EH59: USB 2.0 High Speed

The tables of contents are almost identical, even down to the page numbers. The only difference I see is in copying of audio files:

EH59/69: can copy MP3 and WMA files from USB, CD-R/RW, DVD-R to HDD
EH58/68: can copy only MP3, and only from USB
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post #24 of 56 Old 10-10-2009, 07:33 AM
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Thanks Luke and jtbell, I linked your posts to my Panasonic DVDRs thread. I'll update it as more information becomes available.
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post #25 of 56 Old 10-10-2009, 10:06 AM
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On page 42 of the EH68 and EH69 manuals, it shows the enter text dialog box. On the EH68, there is no phrase save feature, but on the EH69, there IS the phrase save feature. I'm looking at the manuals now, but finding differences is not very easy. The EH69 maintains the very convenient title grouping feature that I like so much in my EH68.

I have sent a letter to world import customer service asking about this. I'll report back what they say.

Luke

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post #26 of 56 Old 10-10-2009, 10:35 AM
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I think you and I seem to be the only people really interested in the PS feature
I use it every time I finalize a DVD. At the very least I use it to save the title of the main title (example Monsters Inc.) and then title my DVD the same. It just saves typing the whole title over again.
I also have several common phrases stored (probably the first dozen of 20) so I don't have to type them over again. My one wish with PS was that it did more than the first half or so of available characters. For longer phrases I use 2 slots which works out fine too but of course it uses up the slots quicker and is a little tricky to setup.
I'd really miss PS if my machines didn't have that feature and when I had my EZ Pannys I'd always edit and finalize on one of my older ES series that had PS. I think most people don't take the time to name their titles or just don't understand how PS worked. I suppose with a HDD DVDR you wouldn't have the luxury of being able to edit it on another DVDR until you actually put it on DVD, and if you're like me you like to do all your editing on the HDD prior to putting it on DVD.
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post #27 of 56 Old 10-10-2009, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Church AV Guy View Post

On the EH68, there is no phrase save feature, but on the EH69, there IS the phrase save feature.

The manual doesn't flag it as specifically for the EH69, so it must be on the EH59 also.
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post #28 of 56 Old 10-11-2009, 05:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

Do you have a link for the EH-69? I found nothing about it at WI.

that is right, nothing in website. WI sales person said, it will be in 2+weeks. that is the 1st time i heard about eh69.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

I was just able to add both the EH-58 and EH-68 to my cart at WI
Who told you it was out of stock?

i added EH-58 to the cart, and called the toll-free number to buy it. sales person said no eh-58 or eh-68 in stock. i asked him the exact same question, and answer was website-info needs to be removed. iam confused as you are.

skipping the toll-free, and purchasing eh58 online via W-I site, will the website reject my purchase, iam not sure. hope it's not a sales-pitch to buy different product?
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post #29 of 56 Old 10-11-2009, 06:07 AM
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Thanks for the follow up. Personally I don't think WI would do a bait and switch. I just think maybe their website isn't so good for reporting out of stock situations. Hopefully Church will hear back about his request for more EH-69 news, or you'll hear more info.
AFAIK the EH-x7 EH-x8 line, it's a similar design to the US EH line that was last sold in '06. I keep wondering how long they'll keep making it instead of switching to something less featured and more flaky like the EZ series.
Here's hoping they keep making(and selling to the US) the quality products of the past.
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post #30 of 56 Old 10-11-2009, 11:52 PM
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Okay, my letter to W-I and their reply. I have to agree, their web site is not updated regularly so they have to do some back-pedaling.



10-OCT-2009

Victor,
I heard from someone on the AVS forum that the DMR-EH58 and
DMR-EH68 were no longer available. I thought the EH68 was a
new product. Is it gone already? The person also said that there is
an EH69 available now. to replace those two. If this is true, what
does the EH69 cost? If this is all nonsense, please let me know.


Hello Sir,

Yes, He is right. DMR-EH58 and DMR-EH68 are no more. We are getting Panasonic DMR-EH69 in 7-10 business days and cost is $499.99.

Why do you prefer to go for only Panasonic. Why do not you go for Pioneer models. We do have 2 models in Pioneer brand. One is Pioneer DVR-560H with 160 GB HDD and second one is Pioneer DVR-660H with 250 GB HDD. They are same as Panasonic. You can see both Pioneer models on our website at:

For Pioneer DVR-560H with 160 GB HDD:

http://www.world-import.com/Pioneer_...D_Recorder.htm

For Pioneer DVR-660H with 250 GB HDD:

http://www.world-import.com/Pioneer_...D_Recorder.htm

Thank You,

Victor B.
http://www.world-import.com



This is not entirely unexpected. The rapid turnover in products is a little surprising, as the EH68 wasn't a viable product for very long. I have one and really like it. If Victor is correct, they will have the EH69 on Oct 17th (Saturday) - 20th (Tuesday). He has the Pioneers now, and he seems eager to sell them. I don't for a moment think it is a bait-and-switch. He is merely attempting to sell his available inventory. He can't sell what he doesn't have now can he? I have made two purchases from them, both have been flawless. I guess I trust them. I am not guaranteeing them, merely expressing an opinion.

The 220-volt, and Gandhi electronics sites both still list the EH58/68. I have never ordered from either, so I have no endorcement. The BH site lists both the 58/68 as in stock, and their web site is rarely off like some of the others. I have ordered from BH many times and can definitely say that they are reputable.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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