Availability of Panasonic DMR-EH59/69 in USA? - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 274 Old 02-05-2010, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by kelstertx View Post

All this to get firewire input and 16X burn speed, which are big bumps up from my E80 and E85.

I hate to break it to you, but you can forget the 16x burn speed. Using 16x media in a recorder is like putting leaded gasoline into a BMW: gas is gas, and it may run a few miles on it, but you'll regret it soon enough. And none of these recorders even approaches 16x burn speed, on average they hit 8x if you're really lucky. The Panasonics probably have the most up-to-date burners of all current recorders, but they're still proprietary weird recorder burners instead of generic PC burners. If you want repeatable, reliable long-term results with a recorder skip the cheesy 16x pc media and get the premium 8x TY or Verbatim online. The cost is not that much more, it saves a huge amount of stress on the recorder, and increases your odds of consistently faster burning.

Regarding the 220/240 issue, US import dealers are not usually interested in selling things that can't be used at all in the US. Next unit you get, try plugging it in (before returning it) to check if it auto-adjusts to voltage (most global-market models do this even if labeled 220/240 only). Dealer sales staff and order takers are beyond clueless about the standard items they sell, forget the exotic stuff like an EH69. I went to J&R in person three times last fall to buy American-market Magnavox recorders, and each time the sales people had no idea how to even write it up, couldn't find it in their stock system/sales terminals, even though theres a display model and stacks of them for sale right under their noses. It isn't only consumers who have no head for DVD recorders, the sellers are even less informed: you have to hold their hands. Thats why it pays to buy from a place with a return policy: you really do have to buy 'em first to see how they'll work for you. The stores can't tell you anything useful and mfr info is hopelessly cryptic.
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post #92 of 274 Old 02-08-2010, 02:48 PM
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I have to agree with what the others have said here about the power supply in these Panasonic international units. I had an EH67, and I have an EH68 and an EH69. All of them had voltage-sensing power supplies, and I suspect that Panasonic is not putting together different versions of this unit with unique power supplies. Try the next one to see if it works. Chances are, it will.

Luke

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post #93 of 274 Old 02-09-2010, 07:35 PM
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Sweet to know! I have a used one from B&H sitting on my floor (a 67, and $200 cheaper than the 59 I just received from J&R). Between the two of them, maybe I'll get lucky and one or both will actually be 120v capable! I'm so glad I posted.... it hadn't even occurred to me that a 220 labeled unit might be 120 capable!

Thanks guys. I'll post back to let you know if they work at 120v.

-Kelly
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post #94 of 274 Old 02-10-2010, 09:41 AM
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Did it come with an AC adapter plug that you can use for 120V U ground outlets? Mine had a really small thing that you plug the two round pins into on side, and the other side had blades, like a regular power plug, unpolarized (both blades the same , rather then one wide and the other narrow). If it came with one of these, just plug it onto the end of the power cord, and then into the wall. If it did not come with one of these, go to radio shack and get one. It looks like this and is really cheap, BUT, it works great.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #95 of 274 Old 02-10-2010, 07:01 PM
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WooHOO! The used unit worked on 120V!

Oh, I didn't need any adapter, btw. I have about a dozen of those power cords that fit the back of the unit leftover in a drawer.

Tomorrow I check out the other unit and start deciding whether I want to go ahead and upgrade BOTH my recorders in one swoop.
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post #96 of 274 Old 02-11-2010, 09:24 AM
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I don't want to say, "I told you so," but...

Great! And enjoy the unit.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #97 of 274 Old 02-13-2010, 12:00 AM
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Yep, the other unit worked fine on 120vac too. Man, I wish I had posted in this thread earlier.

The only trick was getting it set to NTSC. The manual said to hold the stop and open/close buttons (on the unit) for 5+ seconds. That did it and I was off and running.

Thanks again, guys.

-Kelly
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post #98 of 274 Old 08-12-2010, 11:30 AM
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Church Av guy or anyone else who might know,
Do any of the international Panasonics have the option for DARKER input? On all my US Pannys I've selected DARKER for FUNCTIONS, SETUP, VIDEO, BLACK LEVEL CONTROL, INPUT LEVEL. The only problem is my EH-59 seems to lack that option and IMO the default is too light, probably like a US Pannys set to LIGHTER.
If I'm copying from a DVD player some have adjustments for brightness so I could compensate that way but other outputs like my Tivo HD have no such brightness adjustment and I don't want my DVDs to look washed out. Now it is possible to adjust my TV for the overly bright DVDs the EH-59 seems to make but I want my DVDs to be the correct black level for any TVs I might play them on.
I'm not talking about the crushed blacks like I noticed on the Funai recorders that I've used, on those the whites were too white and the blacks were too black but this is more like the black level is just a few notches too high. I like my blacks to be black but with the EH-59 I'm just getting more of a gray.
BTW one feature I like about the internationals that I've not seen mentioned is you can disable the display when the unit is OFF. I've already got too many clocks and it's nice being able to at least turn one off.

I'm not sure what the default setting is for US Panasonics, I think it might be DARKER and I think Panasonic got into trouble with some older models that had incorrect black level which is why they may have the option now. I wonder if other areas(Europe etc.) use a different level for black level and since these units are primarily intended for overseas use, that's why they might not have that option?
Note what I'm seeing is very subtle and you might only notice it on a properly calibrated TV and during dark scenes or most noticeable with white titles on a black background.

This rather long and complicated thread talks about back levels and what I alluded to earlier with the early Panasonics. I'm thinking(but hoping this is not the case) that the international Panasonics may have a different black level than the US Panasonics....
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post #99 of 274 Old 08-16-2010, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

Church Av guy or anyone else who might know,
Do any of the international Panasonics have the option for DARKER input? On all my US Pannys I've selected DARKER for FUNCTIONS, SETUP, VIDEO, BLACK LEVEL CONTROL, INPUT LEVEL. The only problem is my EH-59 seems to lack that option and IMO the default is too light, probably like a US Pannys set to LIGHTER...

I checked and the EH59 has no darker/lighter or black level control. Sorry.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #100 of 274 Old 08-16-2010, 03:44 PM
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Then personally I think this is a major flaw of using a Panasonic international DVDR in the US. If a person is recording from a DVD player that has a DARKER or BLACK LEVEL setting for composite/S-video outputs(which outputs 0 IRE for black) one can get proper spec DVDs, otherwise from a VHS, STB, Tivo etc. you'll get a recorded DVD that is +7.5 IRE. What this means is the recorded DVD will look washed out or overly bright(blacks looking grey and not black).
This thread talks all about the IRE issues using such a international DVDR with a North American TV.
I still like my EH-59 and think it's a fine quality recorder but personally this issue will restrict what sources I record from or in which cases I recommend the international Panasonic recorders. I wouldn't call it a bug, it's just using what the rest of the world uses for black levels, unfortunately not the US
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post #101 of 274 Old 08-17-2010, 10:12 AM
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I searched the manual a second time using every term I oculd think of, and there seems to be no black level control. Someone may know about a video signal processor that would give you the control you need.

I wouldn't call it a defect or flaw, any more than calling British cars flawed because the steering wheel is on the other side. They were made for a market other then ours. The tuners don't work here either you know.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #102 of 274 Old 08-17-2010, 11:48 AM
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All I know is that I've never set up a North American model here myself without having to adjust the black level. It's always too washed out.
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post #103 of 274 Old 08-17-2010, 01:11 PM
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jjeff , have you tested ALL the inputs to see if they are the same? There are four A/V inputs. Maybe they are not all set to the same level.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #104 of 274 Old 08-17-2010, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Church AV Guy View Post

jjeff , have you tested ALL the inputs to see if they are the same? There are four A/V inputs. Maybe they are not all set to the same level.

While I haven't tried the SCART inputs(I have no SCART devices or converters) I have tried the two S-video/composite inputs/outputs and they act the same. I believe the recorder is doing just what it was designed to do, for the markets it was primarily designed for. The problem really lies in our American devices which add 7.5 IRE to it's composite/S-video outputs, to be compatible with our 7.5 IRE displays.
Note if you use the international recorder to play back the non standard DVDs(7.5 IRE) and use the recorders composite or S-video outputs then they will look just fine on our TVs. Reason being is the recorder will not add 7.5 IRE to the DVD(like a American player) and the end output will be a 7.5 IRE(from S-video/composite outputs) which will look just fine on our TVs. HDMI output will look washed out/too bright. Playing a standard DVD on our internationals from the composite/S-video output will look overly dark on our displays since again they are expecting a 7.5 input. Playing a standard DVD on our TVs via HDMI or Component will again look fine on our displays since American displays use 0 IRE for such outputs/inputs.

Again this is not a bug or fault with the internationals, they are just doing what they were designed to do, but we must keep this in mind when recording DVDs with such a recorder(and later playing those DVDs on a standard US DVD player).

US Panasonics have black level adjustments for both it's inputs and outputs. For US use one should use DARKER for input(to lower 7.5 IRE input to 0 for recording to DVD) and LIGHTER for output(for changing the 0 IRE DVD to 7.5) for our displays. This means that a US Panasonic should work just fine in a area with 0 IRE displays(and the NTSC standard), but it's too bad Panasonic didn't make such settings on the internationals for our 7.5 IRE displays
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post #105 of 274 Old 08-18-2010, 11:34 AM
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In case anyone cares, J&R seems to have the EH69 on a sale that is almost $50 less than B&H or W-I.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #106 of 274 Old 08-20-2010, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

While I haven't tried the SCART inputs(I have no SCART devices or converters) I have tried the two S-video/composite inputs/outputs and they act the same. (



Using SCART makes no difference with mine, it's still too grey. I've resigned myself to using the Intl. Panny's for recording old movies on TCM.
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post #107 of 274 Old 10-26-2010, 02:27 PM
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One odd thing I noticed today using my EH-59, that I wanted to note.
If I give titles names with my EH-59 and then put the unfinalized DVD in any of my non international Panasonics(EH-50, EH-55, EZ-28) the titles don't show up It looks like I've not titled them. If I put the unfinalized DVD back in the EH-59 the titles appear again.
If I finalize the DVD in something other than my EH-59 I have no title names, if finalized in my EH-59 the titles show up on any DVDR or player. Weird

If I title on my US Panasonics those titles show up on my EH-59, even unfinalized discs....just something to keep in mind for those who like to swap unfinalized discs around.
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post #108 of 274 Old 10-26-2010, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

...just something to keep in mind for those who like to swap unfinalized discs around.

In several earlier posts you mentioned the advantage of making an initial recording, even a very brief recording, with an EZ series recorder and then swapping that disc into an ES series recorder for additional recording.

The advantage to this procedure is additional recording capacity per disc.

Recently I recorded a long TCM movie block with an EZ series recorder. That recording block was one minute short of three hours at the LP recording mode. The disc showed 61 remaining minutes (at LP) in the STATUS screen. I set that disc aside for several days.

Then, with an ES series recorder, I scheduled a TCM movie with a 63 minute running time in a 75 minute scheduling block. I inserted that EZ recorded disc in the ES series recorder. The ES series recorder STATUS screen reported that the disc had 71 minutes of remaining time (at LP). So, I used up that disc's remaining time as a 71 minute recording (at LP). (Of course Flexible Recording could also be used--but FR would waste a certain amount of disc space. And using FR in this scenario might reduce recorded picture quality.)

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post #109 of 274 Old 10-26-2010, 03:18 PM
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I think you would have also found that if you had recorded that 71 minute LP program to your EH-50 that you could have HS'd the title to your disc. IOW using your EZ and ES basically allows you to use up the whole disc for direct to DVD recording, something normally you cannot do without first recording to a HDD that is.
I'm actually a little surprised you only gained an extra 10 minutes LP, normally I gain ~ 7 minutes SP or 14 minutes LP, it's usually pretty consistent(unless you've deleted titles off your "R" DVD which eats up the buffer). If you had used FR on your EZ-28 you would have had ~400Mb unused space, you made the better choice.
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post #110 of 274 Old 10-26-2010, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

One odd thing I noticed today using my EH-59, that I wanted to note.
If I give titles names with my EH-59 and then put the unfinalized DVD in any of my non international Panasonics(EH-50, EH-55, EZ-28) the titles don't show up It looks like I've not titled them. If I put the unfinalized DVD back in the EH-59 the titles appear again.
If I finalize the DVD in something other than my EH-59 I have no title names, if finalized in my EH-59 the titles show up on any DVDR or player. Weird

If I title on my US Panasonics those titles show up on my EH-59, even unfinalized discs....just something to keep in mind for those who like to swap unfinalized discs around.

I commented on this a few years ago. It was with my EH67 that I first noticed it, and I was using -RAM disks at the time. It's like the international models put the unfinalized titles in a different spot, so the US models cannot read them. Weird indeed! Does it happen if you make an unfinalized disk with a US model, including titles, and then try to read that disk with your EH59?


Hey! When do you think there will be a followup to the EH59 & EH69 recorders? THey have been out longer than the EH67 or 68 models were. Don't you think that updated models are about time in coming?

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #111 of 274 Old 11-15-2010, 02:23 PM
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Just in case anyone cares, BH has three units on open-box sales right now: two EH59's and an EH69. The prices are pretty good, ~$100 off new equipment. I have purchased used items from them in the past and have been completely satisfied.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #112 of 274 Old 11-15-2010, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Church AV Guy View Post

Just in case anyone cares, BH has three units on open-box sales right now: two EH59's and an EH69. The prices are pretty good, ~$100 off new equipment. I have purchased used items from them in the past and have been completely satisfied.

I finally took the plunge a while back and agree - they are a great value for the $$$.

Also, looking at the recent B&H pricing, it looks as if they are a little higher than in the past. I recall seeing the 59s for $249 a couple of months ago, then $259 last month, now $279. So if you're thinking of getting one now might be the time if the prices keep creeping up.
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post #113 of 274 Old 11-15-2010, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Breyean View Post

I finally took the plunge a while back and agree - they are a great value for the $$$.

Also, looking at the recent B&H pricing, it looks as if they are a little higher than in the past. I recall seeing the 59s for $249 a couple of months ago, then $259 last month, now $279. So if you're thinking of getting one now might be the time if the prices keep creeping up.

So, it isn't my imagination! I THOUGHT they were at $250, then $260, now they are at $280. Many prices at BH seem to be going up. I wonder why, exactly?

Occasionally JR has had open box items, so I am not a shill for BH. I merely thought someone might want to save a few dollars.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #114 of 274 Old 11-15-2010, 05:42 PM
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I got my EH-59 for $249
I thought under $250 seemed like a deal that couldn't last
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post #115 of 274 Old 11-16-2010, 09:57 AM
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It's a very capable machine. I am quite impressed with mine. With the SCART adapters it has a fair array of inputs and outputs. I haven't found a good SCART/component adapter though. I am still wondering if the EH59/EH69 will acept a component in through the SCART plug. That might help some people with the dreaded "letterboxed widescreen video through composite/S-Video connections" issue.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #116 of 274 Old 11-16-2010, 10:43 AM
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SCART is one of those idiotic designed-by-commitee, "only the nanny state knows what's good for you" standards imposed by dunderheads in the European union. Of the friends I correspond with overseas, 100% loathe these big clumsy noisy connectors. They may not be able to carry anything but standard composite video and audio signals, I don't think they handle component?

Re the B&H price creep, this is typical. Despite its super-slick website and national name recognition, B&H is still run the way it was 30 years ago: as a niche specialty New York City "Joe sent me" type of place that changes its rules and its pricing on an almost hourly basis. Photography and video pros here just roll their eyes and expect it, but tourists who see the huge store or web shoppers online are sometimes flummoxed by the roller coaster. I would not at all be surprised if B&H is not fully aware of the chatter on this and other threads and is upping the price as they smell blood in the water: they don't miss a trick. If you see a bargain at B&H, don't stall: grab it before it starts getting talked up and they notice the item they were trying to blow out is actually hot.
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post #117 of 274 Old 11-16-2010, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by CitiBear View Post

SCART is one of those idiotic designed-by-commitee, "only the nanny state knows what's good for you" standards imposed by dunderheads in the European union. Of the friends I correspond with overseas, 100% loathe these big clumsy noisy connectors. They may not be able to carry anything but standard composite video and audio signals, I don't think they handle component?

Re the B&H price creep, this is typical. Despite its super-slick website and national name recognition, B&H is still run the way it was 30 years ago: as a niche specialty New York City "Joe sent me" type of place that changes its rules and its pricing on an almost hourly basis. Photography and video pros here just roll their eyes and expect it, but tourists who see the huge store or web shoppers online are sometimes flummoxed by the roller coaster. I would not at all be surprised if B&H is not fully aware of the chatter on this and other threads and is upping the price as they smell blood in the water: they don't miss a trick. If you see a bargain at B&H, don't stall: grab it before it starts getting talked up and they notice the item they were trying to blow out is actually hot.

Well said.

Interestingly, while their used EH59 price seems to keep going up every time they sell one, the EH69 price has stayed about the same. So a couple of months ago when the 59 was $249, the 69 was around $325. Today, the 59 is $279 and the 69 is still at $325. I surprised they haven't been moving the EH69 price up as well.
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post #118 of 274 Old 11-16-2010, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Breyean View Post

Well said.

Interestingly, while their used EH59 price seems to keep going up every time they sell one, the EH69 price has stayed about the same. So a couple of months ago when the 59 was $249, the 69 was around $325. Today, the 59 is $279 and the 69 is still at $325. I surprised they haven't been moving the EH69 price up as well.

I have noticed this as well. Maybe they have had too many returns and are tired of taking a loss (or at least, minimum profit) on them, so the price is nudging up. Re: prices going up, about six months ago I was searching for some wireless microphones for my church*. Last week I was looking again for similar items and noticed that the ones I paid $275 for in May/June of this year, were now $350. That's very strange. J&R had the same model for the six-months-ago-B&H-price of $275, so guess where I bought them?

* The FCC sold some frequencies to cell phone providers for EXCLUSIVE USE. This (so called) 700MHz band was very popular with low-power wireless microphones. Many of us had to retire our perfectly good wireless microphones because it is illegal for us to use them anymore. The fines for use, if caught, were outrageous. The 700MHz band actually runs from 698MHZ to 806MHz. Churches, theater groups, bands, and many other users of wireless communications were adversely impacted.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #119 of 274 Old 12-02-2010, 02:45 PM
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Just in time for the Christmas Season!

I noticed today that the J&R web page shows that the EH59 and EH69 are out of stock. The exact phrase shown on their web site suggests that they will be getting more. the B&H site no longer has a used EH69 listed. It has three used EH59's though, at prices of $279, $279 and $285. I wonder why the prices on these used items keep inching higher?

It also is listing a used EH68 for $299 though I would be reluctant to recommend it, even at that price.

Luke

Evil is charming and beautiful. It makes you doubt yourself. It asks for one small compromise after another until it whittles you down, and it functions best when no one believes in it.-JOA
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post #120 of 274 Old 12-02-2010, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Church AV Guy View Post

Just in time for the Christmas Season!

I noticed today that the J&R web page shows that the EH59 and EH69 are out of stock. The exact phrase shown on their web site suggests that they will be getting more. the B&H site no longer has a used EH69 listed. It has three used EH59's though, at prices of $279, $279 and $285. I wonder why the prices on these used items keep inching higher?

It also is listing a used EH68 for $299 though I would be reluctant to recommend it, even at that price.

Just out of curiosity, I got an EH69 from B&H a while ago and am quite pleased with it. I don't have an EH68. Why do you say the 68 is one to stay away from? Is the 69 that much improved over it?
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