Recorder Market Is Unsettled Everywhere, Not Just USA/Canada Anymore - Page 10 - AVS Forum
First ... 8  9  10
DVD Recorders (Standard Def) > Recorder Market Is Unsettled Everywhere, Not Just USA/Canada Anymore
Seeker47's Avatar Seeker47 12:48 PM 05-02-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Seeker47 already indicated he has a Pioneer 640 for SD recording off the satellite DVR. I was under the impression that he was looking for something new to be able to capture HD/5.1, hence my confusion at his discussion of using converters to down-convert an HD signal to SD.

Sorry for any lack of clarity. The converter is strictly related to getting around the spontaneous-reboot-when-dubbing problem. (I should be able to put that to the test soon.) The HTPC discussion is for multiple reasons: as a hobbyist, I've long been curious about this possibility; we will need to be prepared for a post-DVDR future, whenever that may inevitably arrive; and if you're making that leap anyway, might as well take advantage of the options for HD instead of just SD archiving.

Oddly enough, I have a near-duplicated setup in a secondary location that has been minimally affected, so far. Therefore, I have been shifting as much of the more critical transfer jobs to that location as possible. In theory, both receiver boxes should have been receiving the same firmware updates on the same schedule, but I suppose it is possible that this was not the case. In the case of my Samsung Blu-Ray player, had I known about it in advance, I might well have blocked further firmware updates before they sent the one containing Cinavia my way, but that is just not possible for DirecTV. I'm pretty sure those come via the dish rather than the 'Net, so you can't really stop them. (They were sending software updates to me even before I had any home network here.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

And don't forget, for people like you who use both cable and OTA, the TiVo has dual Rf inputs for antenna and cable and an integrated tuner. Once you pop in the cable card you will get all your cable and OTA channels simultaneously in a single organized guide listing.

That's why I'm also curious to find out about DirecTV's reported second-go-'round with Tivo. I'm not one of those anti-Tivo people, the cost of it notwithstanding. Some family members and friends have it and like it. One virtue the critics rarely seem to mention is that Tivo has the friendliest UI in the biz for the less-technically-adept users. (Not that that will matter much to most of us.) And some significant problems you don't hear discussed much include Tivo's propensity to "lose sync" and need to be restarted, and various issues involving streaming, for things like Netflix.

I had TWC for around 10 years in the city where I used to live. Despite that, trying to navigate their current system here -- which thankfully I am seldom called upon to do -- is a tremendous exercise in frustration. (I might rather take my chances with U-Verse, if those were the only choices !) Anyway, as I previously noted, I think the current gen Tivo boxes have dropped some former hardware connectivity options that would have been very useful to me, and, even IF DirecTV has gotten into bed with them again, most any change you make to your DirecTV-supplied equipment will restart your two-year contract commitment from zero. I'd need to be very sure, before I did that.

Seeker47's Avatar Seeker47 01:03 PM 05-02-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by plplplpl View Post

To add to Kelson's excellent run down, if you don't want to climb the MultiAVCHD learning curve, there are also a couple of programs I use for authoring AVCHD and Blu-ray discs I'd like to suggest. Corel's (formerly Ulead) DVD MovieFactory Pro 7 is easy, not too expensive and has a lot of customizable menu templates.

I also use Nero Vision 10, which came included in some Nero 10 packages, so you may already have it in your Nero folder if you have Nero installed.

Thanks for expanding on those suggestions. I've used NeroVision for certain tasks . . . but I'm fixated on the Nero 6.x package (from before massive bloat creep and TONS of bugs), which I don't wish to dispose of. Nero still has some really nice convenience features -- like the 1-Button disc Copy, which works for anything DVD so long as the CP was first removed -- and which I don't think (the excellent) ImgBurn offers to this day. So, unless there exists this later NeroVision that someone has converted into a totally portable form . . . . (I've become a great fan of the PAF-type portable apps, which allow you to bypass the Registry, and allow different versions of the same program to peacefully co-exist side-by-side.)

I would certainly look into the Corel program, once I got to working with AVCHD and BR.
Kelson's Avatar Kelson 01:59 PM 05-02-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by plplplpl View Post

if you don't want to climb the MultiAVCHD learning curve, there are also a couple of programs I use for authoring AVCHD and Blu-ray discs I'd like to suggest. Corel's (formerly Ulead) DVD MovieFactory Pro 7 is easy, not too expensive and has a lot of customizable menu templates.

Thanks for the tip. The price is certainly right, especially if it is friendly and supported. I may know how to use MultiAVCHD but I'm not wed to it and would chuck it in a heartbeat if I could find something simpler that did what I need at a reasonable price. I've always liked TMPGEnc from my early v1.6 days but I don't feel the need to spend the money for another editing program when I'm sold on Video ReDo. I'm going to download the "MovieFactory" trial version and give it a spin.

I've had two versions of Nero -- never again.

AVCHD on DVD certainly has its place, I didn't mean to say it didn't. I used it to learn MultiAVCHD by burning AVCHD to DVD-RW. And as you exemplified, it is good for intermediate storage of camcorder footage. But for burning HD/5.1 TV shows I don't have much use for DVD-R/DL. A 1hr HD/5.1 episode on NBC, CBS or FOX runs about 5.5-6GB. After cutting commercials and transcoding to H.264 at equivalent PQ (30% reduction) it's down to about 2.5-3GB. You can fit 1 episode on DVD-R; 2, possibly 3 on DVD+DL. I just put the first 8 HD/5.1 episodes of Fringe Season 4 on a BD-R.
profhat's Avatar profhat 03:35 PM 05-02-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Don't forget analog sunset only pertains to BluRay players. Cable/satellite/FIOS boxes are under no obligation to get rid of component outputs or to restrict component output to SD. Eventually component will go away as the number of legacy devices that need it dwindle -- such as has occurred with S-Video -- but that won't happen with STB's any time soon.

There is no shame on Hauppauge. They are simply following the terms of the license. To do otherwise would cause their HDMI license to be revoked and a probable injunction issued to cease sales of their product. Such was the case with the HD Fury 4. The HDMI input on the Colosus is there primarily to enable PC gamers and X-Box gamers to record their gameplay. Lord knows why they would want to do that, but they do and it is a very popular use of the Colosus.

Can you remember what happened to the HD Fury 4? Was it banned for the FCC or the HDMI org? I'd like to read the history from an expert in recordings.

I guess the gamers record their games for improvement and to share tricks.

Also here is the link to the original Gefen HDMI DVR which could record from HCDP STBs, all in the US:

Gefen DVR Records HD via HDMI


The MTV-7000D can make the same in HK, and maybe here with the right AC adapter.
Kelson's Avatar Kelson 04:55 PM 05-02-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by profhat View Post

Can you remember what happened to the HD Fury 4?

Yes, it can be purchased now for $400. Google their site.
Cyclone82's Avatar Cyclone82 05:06 PM 05-02-2012
That Gefen DVR is all over ebay. Cheapest i have seen is around $600. If it takes care of HDCP i would certainly consider it as it seems getting the MTV7000D is next to impossible.
profhat's Avatar profhat 02:06 AM 05-03-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone82 View Post

That Gefen DVR is all over ebay. Cheapest i have seen is around $600. If it takes care of HDCP i would certainly consider it as it seems getting the MTV7000D is next to impossible.

Just remember that the "new" models seem to be very restrictive devices.

More info at:

Gefen HD-PVR - records from HDMI or component
Kelson's Avatar Kelson 07:15 AM 05-03-2012
Eventually the law catches up.
Kelson's Avatar Kelson 09:39 PM 05-03-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by plplplpl View Post

if you don't want to climb the MultiAVCHD learning curve, there are also a couple of programs I use for authoring AVCHD and Blu-ray discs I'd like to suggest. Corel's (formerly Ulead) DVD MovieFactory Pro 7 is easy, not too expensive and has a lot of customizable menu templates.

I downloaded the trial of DVD Movie Factory and gave it a run through. This is old software, circa 2007-8. The specs do not list support for Win 7. I installed it on my test PC on a disposable Win XP partition. I didn't like that it force installed older versions of some windows components. I tried to author a BD disk and was not happy. The software tried to recode the files and convert the audio. There was no way I could tell it to leave the files as they were. Also it would only let me output by burning to a disk and not to the HDD. Then there are some compilations I make from ripped BD disks - the software really can't handle those kinds of files without screwing them up by recoding. As I said, this is old software and is outdated as far as capabilities.

While exploring the Corel product list, it looks as though their VideoStudio Pro X4 or X5 might be the better choice for me. It's modern software with support for Win 7 and the i7 QuadCore processors. It took me an hour to download the X4 trial (827MB) so I didn't have time to play tonight. I will do so over the weekend. The X4 version is available for $30 from Amazon. As long as it doesn't force a recode and leaves DTS-HD audio alone, I'll be happy.
plplplpl's Avatar plplplpl 11:11 PM 05-03-2012
  • It works on XP, Vista or Win7.
  • It makes use of all four cores on my quad core system.
  • You can set set it to, "Do not convert compliant MPEG files," so it won't reconvert. Just make sure your project settings match and the project bitrate exceeds your imported file's bitrate.
  • You have the option of burning a disc, creating folders, generating an .ISO disc image or any combination thereof.

DTS audio - admittedly, I've never tried that, so I couldn't say for sure, but I think you're right it can't handle it. I 'm pretty sure all you can do is Dolby Digital Stereo, Dolby Digital 5 channel, or LPCM.

But to each his own. Maybe you will indeed be happier with X4 or X5. Give them a whirl. They are are in fact newer, and they're bigger because they're more complete editing packages.

I haven't had a chance to try them because DVD MovieFactory 7 fulfills my DVD, AVCHD and BD authoring needs fine. I especially like the creatively versatile and customizable menu templates, and I've added to the repertoire by importing templates from previous versions so I have a whole boatload now. I realize that that sort of thing is not important for everybody, but on occasion I like to make a big, creative authoring production of some special videos.
Kelson's Avatar Kelson 06:48 AM 05-04-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by plplplpl View Post

  • It works on XP, Vista or Win7.
  • You can set set it to, "Do not convert compliant MPEG files," so it won't reconvert. Just make sure your project settings match and the project bitrate exceeds your imported file's bitrate.
  • You have the option of burning a disc, creating folders, generating an .ISO disc image or any combination thereof.

Admittedly I didn't try it on my main Win-7 system. I try all new software on my easily reloaded XP test system first. I still didn't like it force installing older Windows components on my XP partition. I did not see how to generate folder structures when trying to assemble a BD. It only gave me a choice to burn a disk, there was no other option. Perhaps when constructing DVD Video it is more flexible.

The recoding was the biggest problem; it has its own idea of what compliant MPEG-2 files are. When I gave it a mixed file set that was a combination of MPEG-2 and H.264 it wanted to make everything one or the other. That and the lack of HD audio support makes this unsuitable for me. If I were only making compilations of HDTV captures that I left formatted as MPEG-2 this would probably be workable, but like I said, this is 4-5yr old software and lacks support for BD Video files and codecs.

I'll give VideoStudio Pro a test drive. MultAVCHD, for all its complexity, does exactly what you want it to do and handles BD Video files and codecs.
Cyclone82's Avatar Cyclone82 07:56 AM 05-04-2012
Oh bummer so the Gefen is restricted? Even if it can record component it might be ok?

Actually this device does seem bad

maybe this would be better

http://www.cypress.com.tw/english/di...=1336181425166
plplplpl's Avatar plplplpl 09:44 AM 05-04-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

I did not see how to generate folder structures when trying to assemble a BD. It only gave me a choice to burn a disk, there was no other option. Perhaps when constructing DVD Video it is more flexible.

The recoding was the biggest problem; it has its own idea of what compliant MPEG-2 files are. When I gave it a mixed file set that was a combination of MPEG-2 and H.264 it wanted to make everything one or the other. That and the lack of HD audio support makes this unsuitable for me. If I were only making compilations of HDTV captures that I left formatted as MPEG-2 this would probably be workable, but like I said, this is 4-5yr old software and lacks support for BD Video files and codecs.

I'll give VideoStudio Pro a test drive. MultAVCHD, for all its complexity, does exactly what you want it to do and handles BD Video files and codecs.

The option to create BD folders is on the 3rd and final page:



You're most probably right that it won't let you do a combination of MPEG-2 and H.264 files on the same BD without re-encoding one or the other. I didn't even know that was possible within the BD spec. I've never needed to do that, but since I have multiAVCHD installed, it's good to know it can do that if I ever need it.

I suspect in that respect that the authoring engine in X4 or X5 may be similar, but who knows, they might have changed it. I can see that if you need to combine MPEG-2 and H.264 files on the same BD, this can be a deal-breaker.
LL
Kelson's Avatar Kelson 12:14 PM 05-04-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by plplplpl View Post

The option to create BD folders is on the 3rd and final page:

Hmmm . . . I did not have that "Create BluRay Folders" checkbox on my screen. I wonder if that is a restriction of the trial version.

Still, the other issues I noted make this unacceptable for me.
plplplpl's Avatar plplplpl 01:47 PM 05-04-2012
Just a footnote: Except for those of us who want nothing to do anymore with anything Nero (and I counted myself among those after Nero 6 until recently), it's interesting to note I've found that Nero Vision (and I would guess Nero Video) accepts Windows Media Center files (Corel DMF doesn't), so you can burn a BD of WMC HD recordings.
profhat's Avatar profhat 03:20 PM 05-05-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone82 View Post

Oh bummer so the Gefen is restricted? Even if it can record component it might be ok?

Actually this device does seem bad

maybe this would be better

http://www.cypress.com.tw/english/di...=1336181425166

Very interesting, so is there any review on it?
Kelson's Avatar Kelson 07:14 PM 05-05-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by plplplpl View Post

I suspect in that respect that the authoring engine in X4 or X5 may be similar, but who knows, they might have changed it. I can see that if you need to combine MPEG-2 and H.264 files on the same BD, this can be a deal-breaker.

Yes, the authoring/burning module on VideoStudio Pro X4 & X5 is essentially the same as DVD Movie Factory: it wants to recode all my video and convert any audio to either AC3 or LPCM instead of leaving it alone as DTS-MA. Looks like I'll be staying with MultiAVCHD. It is by far the most flexible authoring software and does exactly what I want it to do.
Cyclone82's Avatar Cyclone82 07:42 PM 05-05-2012
Actually Profhat, i think Cypress made/make the recorders for Gefen and they are the same anyway. Thats what i read somewhere on here. Have not really studdied them though. I will not be surprised though if that is the case.

All i want is a standalone recorder that can record from component inputs and can export via USB/SD card and be ready for playing as is. I dont want just a capture card eg black magic inensity or Haugpauge where you still need your computer to do all the work (encoding).
profhat's Avatar profhat 01:08 PM 05-06-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone82 View Post

Actually Profhat, i think Cypress made/make the recorders for Gefen and they are the same anyway. Thats what i read somewhere on here. Have not really studdied them though. I will not be surprised though if that is the case.

I'm guessing so, even that can explain why they look very similar:






Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone82 View Post

All i want is a standalone recorder that can record from component inputs and can export via USB/SD card and be ready for playing as is. I dont want just a capture card eg black magic inensity or Haugpauge where you still need your computer to do all the work (encoding).

I'm agree, that's is a conformist way to get the job done. Now the CHD-PVR80G seems to also have an 80 GB HD , but what about its HDMI inputs? And, can it transfer the recordings?

Because the site only says:

Video Recording: H.264 MP/HP (Main Profile/High Profile partial ) and stereo sound, optimized resolution for TV up to 1920x1080i@60fields/s.
First ... 8  9  10

Up
Mobile  Desktop