Creating Backups (Fair Use) - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 08-27-2003, 09:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Another recent thread mentioned copying DVDs from one DVD player to a DVD-Recorder. With the exception of flags and macrovision, a poster said that it would work.

My young daughter has not quite learned the fine art of DVD care, and thus a few of her DVDs have been scratched and thus unplayable.

Are there inline "black boxes" that would stip off macrovision and flags that would allow me to archive the master and just use the copy for everyday use?

Im not sure if my fair use rights allow bypassing copy protection (sorry DMCA). I know I could do this with a PC DVD Burner quite easily, but I'd rather the ease of a set top DVD recorder.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Steve
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post #2 of 11 Old 08-30-2003, 12:37 AM
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Steve,

DVD's use a higher level of protection than the Macrovision used on VHS tapes. From everything I've read...the so-called black boxes are a hit or miss proposition.

Here is what I use to copy DVD's.

Feed DVD into a digital camcorder ( I use a Phillips 985)...feed the output from the camcorder to the DVD recorder using a firewire. This strips all copy protection and allows the copying of any and all material.

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post #3 of 11 Old 08-30-2003, 05:58 AM
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mor eimportantly, ,most commercial dvds are dvd9 (dual layer, 9.4gb) and all recordable media is dvd5 (single layer, 4.7gb media) so regardless of protection, without either removing content or changing compressions you cant copy from a dvd without losing structure
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post #4 of 11 Old 08-30-2003, 06:39 PM
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As important, you lose the dolby 5.1 surround track, if the movie has it.

Anyway, all forms of dvd copying (including ripping) represents unauthorized reproduction according to the copyright holder, if they so choose to enforce it. And that applies whether you own a store-bought disc or rented it. This places us in a gray area of the law, like driving 1 MPH faster than the speed limit.

One of these days, someone is going to use the "merchandisability and fitness of use" clauses of the Uniform Commercial Code, as an argument in favor of "backing up" a dvd on a more robust medium, such as an armor-plated dvd-r (they really do exist, and I defy your kid to scratch it without a file or knife). The opening argument: "This dvd is not child-proof. It scratches too easily and becomes unplayable. It is not fit for general casual use."
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post #5 of 11 Old 09-02-2003, 11:50 AM
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Star 56:

doesn't your method result in loss of quality?
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post #6 of 11 Old 09-02-2003, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ollie W. Holmes

One of these days, someone is going to use the "merchandisability and fitness of use" clauses of the Uniform Commercial Code, as an argument in favor of "backing up" a dvd on a more robust medium, such as an armor-plated dvd-r (they really do exist, and I defy your kid to scratch it without a file or knife). The opening argument: "This dvd is not child-proof. It scratches too easily and becomes unplayable. It is not fit for general casual use."
If the deal is I'm only purchasing a license to view the content, and not the actual bits on the disc (I believe I am buying the bits, but I digress), why can't they replace my disc for a nominal media cost if its damaged or otherwise unplayable (shoddy manufacturing, etc etc)?

We've done that for years with software vendors, including MS, at work, and its not a big deal to them. "Hey, our CD of foo is broken." And for $5-10, we get another CD in the mail.

Of course the greedheads at the MPAA want it both ways; it's a license if we try to copy it, it's a purchase if we break it.
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post #7 of 11 Old 09-02-2003, 04:33 PM
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Outboard black boxes are indeed hit or miss. However, a number of the all-region mods at a place like www.jvb.nl get rid of both macrovision and css (the ones labelled "DVD recorder friendly".) JVB has a pretty good track record of delivering what they promise.
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post #8 of 11 Old 09-03-2003, 07:12 AM
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Your best bets would be either:

a) For an analog-intermediary backup, get a DVD player that has the ability to universally disable Macrovision. Older Apex DVD players have this ability, as do many others. It varies from player to player.

b) Use a PC-based solution, in which case lossless backups are possible. (Note: MOST commercial DVDs are dual-layer DVD-9, so "lossless" is defined by me here as "no video quality lost but all extras cut out".)

The point of TDK Armor Plateds is an excellent one... Too bad Hollywood (or at the very least, Netflix) doesn't use whatever coating TDK is using.
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post #9 of 11 Old 09-03-2003, 12:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the suggestions. SInce my post, I now have another $20 coaster version of the brand new "Stitch the Movie" DVD with teeth marks in it. UGH! Armor Dvd's where are you???

I did go out yesterday and bought a PC DVD recorder, but have not yet found the time to figured it out. I also dont know wither her TV's built in DVD player will accept +R DVD's. I guess I'll find out though :-)

I dont really care if she looses the extras. Plus Disney DVD's have about 20 minutes of commercials prior to the the movies starting which maybe I can edit out.

I also got a TV tuner card and am going to try and make a poor mans STB DVD Recorder. This way I can archive MST3K for my wife! This should work until the Panny 100 comes down in price (I would like a firewire input).

Steve
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post #10 of 11 Old 09-04-2003, 08:20 AM
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BTW, check out www.doom9.org - Great forum for DVD backups, etc.
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post #11 of 11 Old 09-04-2003, 11:41 AM
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SteveHoltam - check your PM's.

You know, I used to think it was awful that life was so unfair. Then I thought, wouldn't it be much worse if life were fair, and all the terrible things that happen to us come because we actually deserve them? So now I take great comfort in the general hostility and unfairness of the universe.
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