Pioneer Disappearing EPG - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 859 Old 07-12-2006, 02:55 PM
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I just found this forum yesterday and the information has been outstanding. I wish I had found you guys when I first bought my 633 back in November. Anyway just wanted to share my experience with Pio regarding this upgrade. I called customer support, went to their warranty entry and spoke to a first level tech. I told her my issue briefly with the TVGOS and said I wanted to open a ticket (I hadn't done this before because when I spoke to customer support back in February, they told me they knew of the problem but that it was TV Guide's problem and they were waiting on a fix,, so they would not open a ticket for me at that time). Anyway, this first level tech passed me on to technical support. I spoke to someone named Larry, told him of the issue and asked about the software upgrade. I told him that a tech named David had said an upgrade was available. Well Larry said the upgrade was not quite ready to send out and he had just spoken to David about this morning. He said if I wanted an upgrade, I should speak with David. He transferred me but I got David's voice mail, left a message but have not received a reply yet.

I firmly believe there is an upgrade almost ready and it will be sent out to those who have case numbers. I don't know if Pio thinks this will just solve specific problems and might not want to notify the entire registered base. But it is for sure that their first line tech support knows nothing about this.

Again thanks to all you who have posted suggestions, work arounds and advice. It's is nice to know that I'm not alone.
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post #722 of 859 Old 07-12-2006, 03:35 PM
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I know we're all anxious to get the "update" but I hope no one else mentions the tech rep's name at this point....I shouldn't have listed it, and he did ask me not to reveal his tel. #, so he could get pi**ed and we don't want that...yet.

I did ask him for instructions on how "a couple of my friends" could also get the update, so maybe the "couple of" people who have already used his name can be my "buds"...at least until we get the update.

We seem to have confirmed that an update is "in the works," and maybe patience will serve us all better at this point in time?


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post #723 of 859 Old 07-12-2006, 07:27 PM - Thread Starter
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I've been patient up to this point, what do I have to lose?

Once I reset my entire recorder, I can get the EPG to work reliably for up to a couple of months between losses of the guide.

I have it working now, and hopefully it will continue till an update is available.
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post #724 of 859 Old 07-13-2006, 03:48 AM
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Hi Guys!

Just to tell you that Pioneer Canada (Customer Support Departement) made an arrangement with me, to exchanged my faulty Pioneer DVR-633H-S (EPG , TV Guide if you prefer, not fonctioning correctly) They will send me a brand new 2006 Model, the DVR-640
Without any charge.

I was having lots of problems with the TV Guide ( never work here in Montreal SouthShore )

I call them maybe 5 times to resolve my problems since a got this device, And now they finally admit that they were having problems with the TV Guide feature on there 2005 Models.

I'm so happy that all my problems will gone with the new one..

So all of you users of DVR-633 or DVR-533 are having troubles with it.
Give a try, Call them, you got nothing to lose, just complaint to them if its not working.

If you are lucky enough they will send you the new one like me....


Good luck everyone

Norm
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post #725 of 859 Old 07-13-2006, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aydu View Post

I've been patient up to this point, what do I have to lose?

Once I reset my entire recorder, I can get the EPG to work reliably for up to a couple of months between losses of the guide.

I have it working now, and hopefully it will continue till an update is available.

aydu,

Tha's how I proceed as well. Although mine seems to go out in the 3-5 week range. Generally not a problem, except this spring, I set up the season finale of LOST, and went on a trip.

When I got back, no LOST. Usually it keep my scheduled recording, but twice now it hasn't. Not sure what the differnce is.

Well, i'm hoping they do realize an update. Other than the TVGOS, I've been really happy with the Pio 531.

Rick
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post #726 of 859 Old 07-13-2006, 09:59 AM
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BAD NEWS!

"My tech rep" at Pioneer finally returned my call re: the UPDATE!

IT WAS A MISTAKE!

It was for different product (or just another stalling technique?).

THERE IS NO UPDATE FOR TVGOS!

Your hopes can be dashed now!


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post #727 of 859 Old 07-13-2006, 10:51 AM
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Quote:


"My tech rep" at Pioneer finally returned my call re: the UPDATE!

IT WAS A MISTAKE!

If this is really true (and who can tell with Pio support), I'm done with pio products. It used to be a great brand.
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post #728 of 859 Old 07-13-2006, 11:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Oh well, I only lose my EPG data once every so often. A reset always brings it back.

Pioneer, however, has lost my business forever.
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post #729 of 859 Old 07-13-2006, 02:05 PM
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Just received a DVR640 in an even exchange for my 533. Took about a month after I turned over the 533 to Customer Service because CS had to wait for its July allocation of the product.
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post #730 of 859 Old 07-15-2006, 09:19 PM
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You guys might remember me from this thread ... I have reset my TV Guide on numerous occasions, and have even done hard resets at least five times in the past 3 months, but nothing is allowing my 531 to download (it worked flawlessly for 8 months or so, but just quit) ... I contacted Pioneer, in which they claimed that there was an issue with the actual signal (that I wasn't receiving it), and told me to contact my local PBS station to see if their Gemstar Encoder was working. I followed their advice and, sure enough, the encoder was working wonderfully. The nice gentleman at my PBS station forwarded a message to the TVGOS support, in which I have yet been able to get a hold of.

The EPG light still shows on my recorder, but I rarely hear the audible sounds that I used to hear blaring constantly -- and when I do hear them, they're quite a bit slower and more drawn-out, almost as if it's trying to download data, but there's nothing there...

I doubt this would have anything to do with it, but a few days prior to when I lost all of my data, I defragmented (or whatever it's called on the actual recorder) the drive ... Then, like just one day before the information was completely gone, the power flickered a few times; but I doubt that would mess the machine up completely.

Anyway, I live in a small town called Grant on the southern part of Brevard County, Florida (below Melbourne and Palm Bay), and before my incident, I had used a Palm Bay zip code, which worked flawlessly ... Since I lost the data, I've been switching between Palm Bay and Melbourne zip codes, hoping that, for some reason, that cures the problem. So far, no luck.

If anyone is able to give me any tips, that would be great ... Unfortunately, it looks like this is a pretty widespread issue; which would explain why the new models don't even feature the TVGOS system. It sucks, too, because in theory, the TVGOS is an awesome idea...
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post #731 of 859 Old 07-16-2006, 07:39 AM
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On my 531, any power drops or outs...even a nanosecond...loses TVG as does any RF outs (like pulling the coax).

You should be able to get TVG back with the TVG reset codes:
Go to TVG > SETUP > Highlight "Change system settings" (don't press Enter) > Enter on remote 753159852 > Enter 653274147 > Press TVG button > Turn power off.

(I think the 2nd # w/o the 1st also works by itself, but just to be sure use both #s.)

Turn power on and do a TVG reset, using the zip that worked before. Rekey Zip Code and toggle any items that might remain from before. If you get an initial menu that asks if everything is OK, select the "No my settings are wrong" item (or whatever the last choice says).

Next morning you may get a message to pick your cable system. Once selected, TVG should start filling up Days 1,2 and 8, then the rest.)???


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post #732 of 859 Old 07-17-2006, 12:12 PM
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Hi there,
I just joined right now as I just purchased and received the Pioneer 640H-S and don't know beans about DVR's etc. other than I have wanted one for the longest time and finally got one and hope I did the right thing by getting the 640?
I haven't turned it on yet to do the set up as I am shivering in my boots to do so!
I hooked it up by using the video component jacks as that is what my TV had open to use.
Has anyone hooked theirs up using the video component jacks? Took me quite a long time to figure how as the startup guide confused me a little. Had to buy cables first.
I must say, I am very CONFUSED on reading statements on this forum that ithe 640 doesn't have the EPG when mine does?????? At least I think it does? How does one know if it has or not?
Any hints on getting me going is deeply appreciated.
I understand I now have to turn the DVR on and follow a setup of some kind?
I have a big screen Mitsubishi analog TV and am on cable. Not broadband.
Thanx,
Urlee
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post #733 of 859 Old 07-17-2006, 12:57 PM
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If your remote has a "TV Guide" button, and if you get something like this when you press it:



...then your recorder has the EPG ("Enhanced Program Guide", also known as TVGOS, "TV Guide On Screen").
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post #734 of 859 Old 07-17-2006, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wabjxo View Post

On my 531, any power drops or outs...even a nanosecond...loses TVG as does any RF outs (like pulling the coax).

You should be able to get TVG back with the TVG reset codes:
Go to TVG > SETUP > Highlight "Change system settings" (don't press Enter) > Enter on remote 753159852 > Enter 653274147 > Press TVG button > Turn power off.

(I think the 2nd # w/o the 1st also works by itself, but just to be sure use both #s.)

Turn power on and do a TVG reset, using the zip that worked before. Rekey Zip Code and toggle any items that might remain from before. If you get an initial menu that asks if everything is OK, select the "No my settings are wrong" item (or whatever the last choice says).

Next morning you may get a message to pick your cable system. Once selected, TVG should start filling up Days 1,2 and 8, then the rest.)???

Thanks, man ... I'll do that this evening, and report on it tomorrow. :^)
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post #735 of 859 Old 07-18-2006, 03:24 AM
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Hi Sean,
My opologies,
Having wanted to get the 633 last year, I was reading the specs from that, thinking it was the 640. Realize now the 640 doesn't say it does have it.
Now I am finding out that having the component video hookup doesn't mean my TV is Progressive Scan compatible? It doesn't say in black & white if it it is?
Can that connection be used for the hookup even if the TV isn't compatible with progressive scan?
I was unaware of a having to be compatible. I just thought by having the component connection was all that was needed to be.
My TV doesn't state the word progressive scan in black & white so I have no way of telling?
It just describes the Input levels and Timing with Component Video, like Y = 1.0Vp-p (includes sync) 75ohms etc..on to the Pr & Pb=700mVp-p.
It says these inputs are compatible with component video signals from standard DVD players and other equipment sending a standard NTSC component video signal (480i).
What does that mean?
I still have yet to turn the DVR on for the set up, as I don't know, if by the way I have it connected, is OK and do I check Compatible instead of Not for PScan when setting it up?
I hope this unit is still in warranty by the time I get her going?
Also worried if it works? Better get it going soon.
So happy to have found this forum! I love it.

Urlee
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post #736 of 859 Old 07-18-2006, 05:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Urlee View Post

Hi there,
I just joined right now as I just purchased and received the Pioneer 640H-S and don't know beans about DVR's etc. other than I have wanted one for the longest time and finally got one and hope I did the right thing by getting the 640?
I haven't turned it on yet to do the set up as I am shivering in my boots to do so!
I hooked it up by using the video component jacks as that is what my TV had open to use.
Has anyone hooked theirs up using the video component jacks? Took me quite a long time to figure how as the startup guide confused me a little. Had to buy cables first.
I must say, I am very CONFUSED on reading statements on this forum that ithe 640 doesn't have the EPG when mine does?????? At least I think it does? How does one know if it has or not?
Any hints on getting me going is deeply appreciated.
I understand I now have to turn the DVR on and follow a setup of some kind?
I have a big screen Mitsubishi analog TV and am on cable. Not broadband.
Thanx,
Urlee

The 640 does not have the TVGOS EPG. The 2005 53X and 63X series did not implement the TVGOS EPG properly. In response, Pioneer removed the TVGOS from their 2006 recorders, leaving VCR+ and manual timer recordings.

RG
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post #737 of 859 Old 07-18-2006, 05:57 AM - Thread Starter
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In my area, the electric company has a program that shuts off power to volunteers, during high use hours, in return for a reduced electric rate. I have this program and a Pioneer 531.

Yesterday was one of the days that the power got cut for a couple of hours. Interestingly enough, it had no impact on my Pioneer's EPG.

The EPG had been working fine since a recent factory reset of the recorder, which is needed every so often to keep the EPG functional.

Just thought I'd pass this along as people have indicated that these units seem to be very sensitive to power outages.
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post #738 of 859 Old 07-18-2006, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Urlee View Post

...It says these inputs are compatible with component video signals from standard DVD players and other equipment sending a standard NTSC component video signal (480i).

If you don't see the phrase "480p" in your manual somewhere close to where it says "480i", then your TV isn't capable of displaying a progressive signal.

If you're bold you could actually try setting the Pioneer to output a progressive signal to see if it works or not. The trick is that if it doesn't work you won't be able to see the setup menus to set it back again. The way out of this Catch-22 situation is to reset the recorder by going to it's front panel (not the remote), then pressing and holding the STOP button and press the PLAY button at the same time.
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post #739 of 859 Old 07-18-2006, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aydu View Post

In my area, the electric company has a program that shuts off power to volunteers, during high use hours, in return for a reduced electric rate. I have this program and a Pioneer 531.

Yesterday was one of the days that the power got cut for a couple of hours. Interestingly enough, it had no impact on my Pioneer's EPG.

The EPG had been working fine since a recent factory reset of the recorder, which is needed every so often to keep the EPG functional.

Just thought I'd pass this along as people have indicated that these units seem to be very sensitive to power outages.

My EPG has been up and running now for about 5 months. I implemented the fix described by Aydu and its been running fine ever since. I even added (turned on) a few additional channels to my guide about a month ago and it is still working great. This is the second time I've used his fix. The 1st time fixed it for about 2 months. This time is much longer. I've even experience a few power outages durring this last stint with no impact to the EPG. I highly recomend everyone use this fix.
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post #740 of 859 Old 07-20-2006, 04:51 PM
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As someone requested a few pages back, the 'fix' by aydu can be found back at 02-09-06 06:14 PM (about page 15).

LazyK - Dan
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post #741 of 859 Old 07-20-2006, 08:21 PM
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I just wanted to report that, even after resetting my DVR-531 (as listed above), I still have no data.

What gets me is that the EPG light is on, but I don't hear it downloading anything, like I used to ... Quite depressing.

Thank you for the info, Wab and Aydu. It really does mean a lot to me.

If anyone has any other recommendations, it'd be great...
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post #742 of 859 Old 07-20-2006, 08:25 PM
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At this point, you probably need to call your local PBS station engineer and ask if the Gemstar/Norpak encoder/inserter is working for the TVGOS signal.

If you let me know where you're located (city, state zip), I can give you the probable station and tel. #.


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post #743 of 859 Old 07-20-2006, 08:34 PM
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I actually did contact my local PBS station, and they said that the encoder was working fine, and suggested it was an issue with my machine or cable provider; to which Pioneer insisted my 531 wasn't receiving a TVGOS signal, whatsoever, and blamed the Gemstar signal-thingy... lol.

I'm going to try resetting one more time, and if that doesn't work, I'm going to call TVGOS and talk firsthand.

Oh, I live in a small town, called Grant (area code 32949), that's just south of Melbourne, Florida.

Thank you very much for everything. :^)
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post #744 of 859 Old 07-20-2006, 09:23 PM
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Sorry for the double post, but I needed to ask a question to Aydu...

Quote:


4. I immediately went into the channel editor and turned off one of the two PBS stations that are provided by my cable system. I get PBS on channels 12 and 13 on my cable system. Channel 13 was where the EPG diagnostic screens told me the guide info was coming from. I turned off channel 12 in the TV tuner.

Now, by "turning off" that channel, do you mean that you went into the Home Menu, Initial Setup, Manual Tuning (or whatever), and then found the PBS channel that you didn't need and chose "Skip". I only ask because I wasn't sure if there was another way to "turn off" the unnecessary channel.
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post #745 of 859 Old 07-20-2006, 09:52 PM
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Skarusty, there is one more thing you could do, and it's something that has worked for me when all else failed: do a new auto channel search using Setup Navigator (not Initial Setup), then a TVG reset.

In the TVG reset, make sure you rekey your zip code and toggle the other responses, even tho' the old info. might already be there.

If you later get into turning channels off, that's done via the TVG > SETUP > Change channel display menu.


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post #746 of 859 Old 07-21-2006, 06:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skarusty12 View Post

Sorry for the double post, but I needed to ask a question to Aydu...



Now, by "turning off" that channel, do you mean that you went into the Home Menu, Initial Setup, Manual Tuning (or whatever), and then found the PBS channel that you didn't need and chose "Skip". I only ask because I wasn't sure if there was another way to "turn off" the unnecessary channel.

Yes. This is how I deactivated the channel.

I have gotten long periods where the EPG works perfectly. In fact, I'm in one of those cycles right now - works every day, like clockwork.

When it does lose the information, I have found it easiest to just to a complete factory reset of the unit. That has never failed to generate EPG data the next day.

The downside to doing this is that you have to redo any modifications you may have made to the channel lineup and reselect your recurring recordings. After that, it seems to chug away, rebuilding all 8 days of listings, until something unknown happens that causes the recorder to lose the EPG data again.

When it is running right, I have experienced power outages for several hours with no disruption; outages of the PBS station that carries the Gemstar signal; etc. with no adverse affects.

I've come to wonder if channel changes to my cable lineup somehow cause the problem. My cable provider adds and drops stations every once in awhile. I wonder if the software in the recorder has problems with additions or deletions.

Just a guess, and I've had many guesses as to why this system goes down.

Pioneer and Gemstar are the only ones that could provide a definitive answer, and they have completely ignored the flaws in their products.

My recourse is to withhold my future purchasing dollars from Pioneer and will likely avoid any product that features any version of the TVGOS system. Throwing half baked products at consumers, without support, is not something I will accept in a company.
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post #747 of 859 Old 07-21-2006, 08:02 AM
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Thank you, Wab and Aydu ... I'll update you guys tomorrow with the new information.

Oh, and it's incredibly ironic that you mentioned your cable company adding/changing channels and it having an effect on the TVGOS system, Aydu, because, right around the same time that this problem started occuring, my cable company had just moved two stations to different channels.

As of this morning, after "skipping" two PBS stations that I know I don't receive EPG information from, I hear my 531 making those audible "download" sounds it used to ... I'm afraid to check it right now, so I will tomorrow morning, to give it all the time possible. :^)

Thank you both again.
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post #748 of 859 Old 07-21-2006, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aydu View Post


My recourse is to withhold my future purchasing dollars from Pioneer and will likely avoid any product that features any version of the TVGOS system. Throwing half baked products at consumers, without support, is not something I will accept in a company.

Aydu, how do you receive your TVGOS, through analog cable without a STB, or through a STB? The reason I ask is that the TVGOS EPG works very well on Panasonic DVD recorders if it is received through analog cable (STBs create problems, except the newer Panasonic recorders seem to have improved on this).

For some unknown reason, Pioneer recorders seem to have great difficulty with the TVGOS EPG. No one, to my knowledge, has offered convincing information as to why. This became a problem of such great extent that reportedly Pioneer removed the remaining 2005 HDD recorders from the market. I still have not seen proof that this has occurred, since there are still reports of units being available. In addition, the 2006 640 model does not have the TVGOS EPG, only VCR+.

More to your point, the TVGOS EPG works very well in a number of DVD recorders, not to mention TVs, it just doesn't work well in some.

RG
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post #749 of 859 Old 07-21-2006, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgazzara View Post

For some unknown reason, Pioneer recorders seem to have great difficulty with the TVGOS EPG. No one, to my knowledge, has offered convincing information as to why.

I have a "theory" on that, but it's only "circumstantial."

I think Pio made a mistake by using only PBS as the SOLE source of the TVGOS signal...they're not designed to find any other independent source for that signal when an "error" occurs.

Your Panny is designed for and uses various commercial networks/stations, in addition to PBS, which gives your TVGOS system multiple "paths" for its signal.

PBS is ~40% supported by the U.S. govt, so it could easily be suffering from the malaise that seems to affect "many" govt and govt-sponsored operations.

Of course, an alternate explanation could be that the Pio design engineers are still asking what the words "fault isolation" mean!!!


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post #750 of 859 Old 07-21-2006, 10:51 AM
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Wabjxo, was the PBS-only download of TVGOS EPG on Pioneer recorders ever proven? It would only take 1 person who received the EPG from a non-PBS station to disprove it.

Has anyone with a Pioneer recorder ever mentioned that they received the EPG from a non-PBS station?

Here's a chance for you to tell us, if you are out there!!

RG
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