Attn Newbies: You Cannot Record in Hi-Def Resolution on Current DVD Recorders - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 585 Old 03-23-2010, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borntalent View Post

I am not the biggest "tech" person in the world..but I am not completely tech illiterate. I have a question...
I just received the newest model of the Sony DVDIRECT as a gift, and on the box and in the manual, it claims that it can "record in HD"...
I have IO Optimum Cable HD DVR .. and I would like to transfer my HD recordings to the DVD...

If you acquire the Hauppauge HD-PVR 1212 and connect it to the component video and digital audio outputs of your Cable HD DVR, you can save AVCHD H.264 (5.1 audio if available from the source program) to your computer, which then presumably this Sony device will burn in Blu-Ray format, which will be playable on Blu-Ray Disc players.

I set my DirecTV HD receiver to 720p output (the Hauppauge will "record" at whichever resolution is fed to it), digitize at 6Mbps, and I am able to get 2 hours of content to fit on a DVD-double layer recordable disc. Of course, if your Sony device will burn to actual Blu-Ray blanks discs you can save 25Gig or 50Gigs on a Double Layer Blu-Ray blank, so you can burn 1080 resolution at higher digitizing rates with longer content.

I guess this side-steps the advantage of the Sony DVDDirect, which is to NOT require a computer, but since you got it as a gift, why not get the results you want: burning your HD content to DVDs that will play on Blu-Ray players in HD.

If you go this route, be sure to come back and report your results!

There are a couple of topics here on this forum that follow the HDPVR 1212 for either Windows or Mac:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1081590

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post18360297

POSTSCRIPT: It would be really interesting...

Since the notes claim that this device will record in real-time from an camcorder; if you could setup the Hauppauge directly to this device and record in real-time; you will have created a HD DVD-Recorder!!!
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post #452 of 585 Old 03-24-2010, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by borntalent View Post

"record from HD source and transfer it to SD", OR "record from HD source and burn to HD format playable on Blu Ray and PS3machines".
Is this not true?

Yes it is "true" but only from an HD camcorder [not a cable or satellite box] and possibly only Sony brand units at that. Sorry.

I highly doubt it would work with the Hauppauge HD-PVR, directly at least, without an intermediate PC as its source either, since drivers and other software have to be loaded into the recording PC in order for the Hauppauge to work.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #453 of 585 Old 03-24-2010, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

Yes it is "true" but only from an HD camcorder [not a cable or satellite box] and possibly only Sony brand units at that. Sorry.

I highly doubt it would work with the Hauppauge HD-PVR, directly at least, without an intermediate PC as its source either, since drivers and other software have to be loaded into the recording PC in order for the Hauppauge to work.

You are, of course, right about "real-time" recordings, but I will stand by my suggestion for using the Hauppauge HD-PVR to create the files so that his Sony until will work for the purpose he suggests (i.e., create Blu-Ray compatible DVDs of his cable HD content).

I would be happy to email him a sample AVCHD H.264 file with 5.1 audio created from my Hauppauge HD-PVR that he could transfer to an appropriate memory card and then create the sample disc...
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post #454 of 585 Old 07-16-2010, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borntalent View Post

I am not the biggest "tech" person in the world..but I am not completely tech illiterate. I have a question...
I just received the newest model of the Sony DVDIRECT as a gift, and on the box and in the manual, it claims that it can "record in HD". It claims in the manual that you can either "record from HD source and transfer it to SD", OR "record from HD source and burn to HD format playable on Blu Ray and PS3machines".
Is this not true?
If you can do this... I have a question as to what my best option for quality would be (which type of wire connection)?
I have IO Optimum Cable HD DVR .. and I would like to transfer my HD recordings to the DVD.

thanks in advance!!

Why dont you just use a firewire cable from your cable DVR to your PC/mac using CapDVHS/Exdues drivers on the PC side and the Apple FirewireSDK/iRecord on the mac side and transfer the HD stream untouched?
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post #455 of 585 Old 07-16-2010, 09:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

Yes it is "true" but only from an HD camcorder [not a cable or satellite box] and possibly only Sony brand units at that. Sorry.

I highly doubt it would work with the Hauppauge HD-PVR, directly at least, without an intermediate PC as its source either, since drivers and other software have to be loaded into the recording PC in order for the Hauppauge to work.

how do you know it wont work with a cable box? does the website mention it?
has it been tested?

on the other topic, If you need to change the aspect ratio of dvd files after the fact, you can use 'dvd patcher'
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post #456 of 585 Old 07-17-2010, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

how do you know it wont work with a cable box? does the website mention it?
has it been tested?

Under VRD-MC6 Specifications tab at the link:

"Inputs and Outputs:
...

# USB Port(s) : x1 (for HDD/MemoryStick® /DVD Handycam® camcorders only)
# i.LINK® Connection : 4-pin i.LINK (IEEE1394) (for camcorder connection only)"

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/...specifications

Its quite possible Sony's specifications are lying and that in truth the device will record in HD from any device. I have no evidence to support this, however, nor have I tested it.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #457 of 585 Old 09-05-2010, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelLAX View Post


I guess this side-steps the advantage of the Sony DVDDirect, which is to NOT require a computer, but since you got it as a gift, why not get the results you want: burning your HD content to DVDs that will play on Blu-Ray players in HD.

Since the notes claim that this device will record in real-time from an camcorder; if you could setup the Hauppauge directly to this device and record in real-time; you will have created a HD DVD-Recorder!!!

very interesting idea, but do blu-ray players already have the ability to play AVCHD discs(HD content to DVD that will play on blu-ray?)

I realize that such discs can only store 15 minutes of content, but at least it is an easy process, just dropping your raw .mts files in a video folder on a dvd. That's what I do with my raw footage that doesn't' require editing, just reviewing.
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post #458 of 585 Old 01-26-2011, 08:08 PM
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Does the DVR on the Magnavox (515) record and play high definition and the dvd does not, or is it both that do not record and play in hd?
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post #459 of 585 Old 01-27-2011, 03:15 AM
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No the Magnavox can not record or playback in high definition. Yes you can record HD channels, but any channels you are watching in HD, if you record them they will only be recorded in standard definition.
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post #460 of 585 Old 01-27-2011, 07:54 AM
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Along with getting a cable card for your computer to receive HD, you will also need to get a computer that has a dedicated HDMI out in the specs. It will also probably be best to get one running Windows 7 PRoThese computers are designed to handle the HD data and have the "power" to "play" with the data.

There is NO HDMI input on anything to date, and the industry really never wants to open that can of worms again. The only way to get HD content is through a HDSTB via satalite or cable. The current Magnivox 515 will not record in HD format, but only SD. It does a great job of then putting HD back out via HDMI to the TV, but it is more or less a dead end street for "archiving" in full HD. STBs are dead end streets as well, but they allow scrambled channels for HD viewing. Right now the only way to truly archive HD all the way to the bank is a computer with a cable card or a TIVO with a cable card, which is then connected to a computer via a network that can handle HD. I am not trying to downplay the 515, because that is the best we have here in North America to carry on the tradition in the easiest manner. Supporting it, as I see it, is the only way to get back on track to a HDVR.
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post #461 of 585 Old 01-31-2011, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timtofly View Post
There is NO HDMI input on anything to date, and the industry really never wants to open that can of worms again.
Never, never, nerver....

Quote:
Originally Posted by timtofly View Post
Right now the only way to truly archive HD all the way to the bank is a computer with a cable card or a TIVO with a cable card, which is then connected to a computer via a network that can handle HD.
I will remember this. Try to archive HD content isn't an easy task.
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post #462 of 585 Old 02-24-2011, 12:55 PM
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Is it possible at this time to record DVD in 480P with a stand alone DVD recorder with component video input? I keep reading that DVD recorders record only in 480i but commercial DVDs are actually 480P, though old players (pre DVI or hdmi out) dumbed down the output to 480i. Later machines with progressive output just line doubled the dumbed down 480i to make pseudo 480P but it still showed only half the original lines actually recorded on the DVD. I ask because I'd like to line double my laser discs then record them onto a DVD recorder for convenience without giving up any more quality than necessary in the process. I know I could use a quality video capture card in one of my computers to do this and will do it that way if I have to.

Rick Levine, TV & Audio technician for over 50 years with service, sales and design experience.
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post #463 of 585 Old 02-24-2011, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NH4012 View Post
Is it possible at this time to record DVD in 480P with a stand alone DVD recorder with component video input? I keep reading that DVD recorders record only in 480i but commercial DVDs are actually 480P, though old players (pre DVI or hdmi out) dumbed down the output to 480i. Later machines with progressive output just line doubled the dumbed down 480i to make pseudo 480P but it still showed only half the original lines actually recorded on the DVD. I ask because I'd like to line double my laser discs then record them onto a DVD recorder for convenience without giving up any more quality than necessary in the process. I know I could use a quality video capture card in one of my computers to do this and will do it that way if I have to.
You got some bad info, commercial DVD's are all interlaced, not progressive.
You can read up on it here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Video
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post #464 of 585 Old 02-24-2011, 01:34 PM
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AFAIK all DVDs(including commercially pressed DVDs) are stored as 480i. It's the player that will change the 480i to 480p and up to 1080p via HDMI. I know their is some confusion on the DVD format but generally when the dust settles it's determined DVD is 480i.
The following quote and link is on Wiki:
MPEG-1 formats do not support interlaced video. MPEG-2 formats support both interlaced and progressive-scan content, with the latter being encoded within interlaced stream using pulldown.

An MPEG-2 encoder can add flags in video stream to indicate scanning type, field order and field repeating. A DVD player uses these flags to convert progressive content into interlaced video suitable for interlaced TV sets. These flags also help reproducing progressive content on progressive-scan television sets.[7]


It seems to contradict itself but all I know is DVDs recorded on my standalone Panasonic DVD Recorder looks as good as the same commercially pressed DVD. I've not used laser disc so if that format is better than commercial DVDs you'll probably want to record to your computers HDD and burn on BR or DVD in the AVCHD format which is better than DVD format.
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post #465 of 585 Old 03-01-2011, 11:07 AM
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According to Wiki:
Laserdisc is a composite video format: the luminance (black and white) and chrominance (color) information are transmitted in one signal and it is the responsibility of the receiver to separate them. While good comb filters can do so adequately, these two signals cannot be completely separated. On DVDs, data is stored in the form of blocks which make up each independent frame. The signal produced is dependent on the equipment used to master the disc. Signals range from composite and split, to YUV and RGB. Depending upon which format is used, this can result in far higher fidelity, particularly at strong color borders or regions of high detail (especially if there is moderate movement in the picture) and low-contrast details like skin tones, where comb filters almost inevitably smudge some detail.

In contrast to the entirely digital DVD, Laserdiscs use only analog video. As the Laserdisc format is not digitally encoded and does not make use of compression techniques, it is immune to video macroblocking (most visible as blockiness during high motion sequences) or contrast banding (subtle visible lines in gradient areas, such as skies or light casts from spotlights) that can be caused by the MPEG-2 encoding process as video is prepared for DVD. However, proprietary human-assisted encoders manually operated by specialist experts can vastly reduce the incidence of artifacts.
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post #466 of 585 Old 03-01-2011, 11:57 AM
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IMO the native format of LD, composite NTSC 480i, should be recorded and digitized as is, onto a DVD. Line doubling which involves cadence detection deinterlacing , should be done as it is with all commercial DVD movie discs, in the play back machine with the best quality deinterlacer you can find, probably an Oppo, not that I follow DVD player differences much anymore.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #467 of 585 Old 03-01-2011, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NH4012 View Post

Is it possible at this time to record DVD in 480P with a stand alone DVD recorder with component video input? I keep reading that DVD recorders record only in 480i but commercial DVDs are actually 480P, though old players (pre DVI or hdmi out) dumbed down the output to 480i. Later machines with progressive output just line doubled the dumbed down 480i to make pseudo 480P but it still showed only half the original lines actually recorded on the DVD. I ask because I'd like to line double my laser discs then record them onto a DVD recorder for convenience without giving up any more quality than necessary in the process. I know I could use a quality video capture card in one of my computers to do this and will do it that way if I have to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

IMO the native format of LD, composite NTSC 480i, should be recorded and digitized as is, onto a DVD. Line doubling which involves cadence detection deinterlacing , should be done as it is with all commercial DVD movie discs, in the play back machine with the best quality deinterlacer you can find, probably an Oppo, not that I follow DVD player differences much anymore.

I agree.

I use the S-Video output of my Laserdisc player to record to DVD-R.

In the case of letterboxed Laserdiscs, I record them to DVD-RW, copy the MPEG-2 video from the DVD-RW to my computer, trim out the black bars and then burn to DVD-R at full 16 by 9 aspect ratio.

I have been very pleased with these results.
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post #468 of 585 Old 03-01-2011, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelLAX View Post

I use the S-Video output of my Laserdisc player to record to DVD-R.

Recording LD may be one of the rare instances where using the composite out strangely yields better results than the S-video out. It depends.

S-video is certainly the way to go for formats like S-VHS and Hi-8mm tapes where the native signal maintains a separation of the Y and C signal and records them separately using a "color under" methodology. LD does not, however, and its Y and C are combined together into a composite signal (hence the name of the jack) and recorded onto the disc. The benefits of keeping Y and C separate, reducing dot crawl, hanging dots, moire patterns and other forms of cross contamination are almost entirely lost if at any point along the start to finish chain the two are combined (like LD does). An S-video jack on such units simply means the manufacturer has elected to throw in a free comb filter, a "kludge" if you will, but using an external and more modern one may very well yeild better results.

The reason LD decks started having S-video jacks is because once the public became aware of the benefits of separated video on other formats (hence the term S-video, it has nothing to do with the word "super" although many people's first exposure to it was with "super-VHS decks") they naively thought it was entirely because of the jack itself. In truth LD machines with s-video jacks are merely normal LD machines with an added comb filter glued on to the back! There is however good reason to believe that the comb filter in a modern, $200 circa 2010 DVD recorder exceeds the capability of a circa 1995, $800 LD deck that simply had one glued on for marketing purposes.

Granted I don't own an LDS2 state of the art LD machine, however through careful analysis of the Snell and Wilcox motion zone plate video test sequence I determined that using the native composite signal out of my Pioneer LD, instead of S-video, and doing the separation downstream through more modern digital comb filters made over a decade after its release , I got a noticibly better image!

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #469 of 585 Old 04-29-2011, 10:34 PM
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Are there any Blu ray Recorders with component inputs to record in HD ? all the blu ray recorders I see online can still only record in standard defenition. I mean might as well just stick to DVDRs

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post #470 of 585 Old 04-29-2011, 10:46 PM
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^ There are standalone bluray video recorders in US distribution?
Please provide a link, or at least a model number, thanks.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #471 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 12:45 AM
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try this for HD recording.
capture to your pc then create avchd or bluray disc.
You'll have to do some research but its not that complicated.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815116030
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post #472 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

^ There are standalone bluray video recorders in US distribution?
Please provide a link, or at least a model number, thanks.

This
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/DV...6/N/4294210544
list generally has one or two standalone BR recorders for sale(#2 at the time of posting). But as Champer said, why bother...they only record in SD for anything other than from select camcorders via DV input. As nikknightt said, you'll need a PC to really burn HD to BR(or even DVD).
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post #473 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 08:21 AM
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Thanks guys, but I've owned a Hauppauge HDVPVR 1212 since 2008. I believe I was the very first person in these forums to have bought one from a retailer and not factory direct, in fact.

I've made dozens of AVCHD discs and HD Bluray discs from it and it is a royal pain in the a$$ and a very time consuming and convoluted process compared to just popping in a blank disc and pressing one button, "record".

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #474 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 08:46 AM
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I bought a USB to component cable off of ebay, that should work wont it ?

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post #475 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 09:20 AM
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If it works in reverse, component to USB, and has a built-in analog to digital video converter (like the Hauppauge HDPVR) then it should work just fine.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #476 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

Thanks guys, but I've owned a Hauppauge HDVPVR 1212 since 2008. I believe I was the very first person in these forums to have bought one from a retailer and not factory direct, in fact.

I've made dozens of AVCHD discs and HD Bluray discs from it and it is a royal pain in the a$$ and a very time consuming and convoluted process compared to just popping in a blank disc and pressing one button, "record".

I dont find the process a pain in the ass.
Play the content to be captured. (same as stand-alone)
Author the file with tsmuxer. burn the disc.

Two extra easy steps and voila. HD disc.
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post #477 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

Thanks guys, but I've owned a Hauppauge HDVPVR 1212 since 2008. I believe I was the very first person in these forums to have bought one from a retailer and not factory direct, in fact.

I've made dozens of AVCHD discs and HD Bluray discs from it and it is a royal pain in the a$$ and a very time consuming and convoluted process compared to just popping in a blank disc and pressing one button, "record".

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

I dont find the process a pain in the ass.
Play the content to be captured. (same as stand-alone)
Author the file with tsmuxer. burn the disc.

Two extra easy steps and voila. HD disc.

Although making disc's are my last priority (ever since I purchased and hacked my Apple TV six months after its initial release to play files stored on my computer's external hard disk):

I also find it easy to take the resultant file from the HDPVR 1212 (I save at 720p) and use Toast 10 to burn it in Blu-Ray format on a double sided DVD to get a 8Gb disc that will play in my Blu-Ray player.

After waiting for what seemed "forever" for some hardware that would burn HD content, I purchased mine direct from Hauppauge on May 29, 2008.

Initially I had to install Windows XP on my Mac Mini to run it in Windows. Since Steven Toth released his wonderful HDPVR Capture software for the Mac, I have abandoned using Windows to control it.
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post #478 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

I dont find the process a pain in the ass.
Play the content to be captured. (same as stand-alone)
Author the file with tsmuxer. burn the disc.
Two extra easy steps and voila. HD disc.

If authoring and burning the disc were instantaneous processes, which they aren't, then I'd agree.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #479 of 585 Old 04-30-2011, 07:50 PM
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This
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/DV...6/N/4294210544
list generally has one or two standalone BR recorders for sale(#2 at the time of posting). But as Champer said, why bother...they only record in SD for anything other than from select camcorders via DV input. As nikknightt said, you'll need a PC to really burn HD to BR(or even DVD).
whats the name of the DV input exactly ? and will it record in HD ? also is there any component adapters to that DV connection you are rerferring to

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post #480 of 585 Old 05-01-2011, 05:02 AM
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whats the name of the DV input exactly ? and will it record in HD ? also is there any component adapters to that DV connection you are rerferring to

FireWire: 4-pin (x1 Input) is another term for DV and as for adapters I haven't really heard of any, I think it's basically for from select camcorders that record in HD and output in DV. Many SD DVDRs also have DV inputs but of course in that case I'd think you'd need to output 480i.
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