Magnavox 557, 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 143 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #4261 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 01:55 PM
Senior Member
 
Lazza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 226
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm still trying to recover from the shock of auskck's announcement. So is what we now know:

- SATA drives will work provided you have the right SATA-IDE adapter.

- 500 GB seems to be the maximum space the DVDR recognizes.

SATA drives are probably preferable to IDE drives because they are likely to be more reliable than IDE drives (..per an earlier posting talking about Seagate's published MTBF statistics). They are unquestionably more available than IDE drives. But this leads to my question:

If one comes upon an 500 GB IDE drive for a price less than the SATA drive plus adapter should one buy the SATA drive anyway because it is more reliable? Or is the IDE drive better because there would be no adapter to worry about (and possibly fail) and the installation would be easier?

Also, I assume what auskck did for his Maggies will also work with the Philips (..same room to work with, same power supply). Let me know otherwise. No rush; I'm not touching my 3576 until warranty expires.


_Lazza
Lazza is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4262 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 02:02 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Philips 3575SATA500HT Birth Procedures
Warning If you are a pessimist don’t do this upgrade.
For all the Optimist “Merry Upgrading and Happy Recording to all”.
Equipment used:
1 Philips head screwdriver
3.5" Drive
1 HITACHI Deskstar P7K500 HDP725050GLA360 (0A35415) 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM $59.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822145215
Or
2.5" Drive
1 HITACHI Travelstar 5K500.B HTS545050B9A300 (0A57915) 500GB 5400 RPM 8MB Cache 2.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Notebook Hard Drive - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...tent-_-text-_-
1 SATA Hard Drive Adapter SATAIDE-2
Subtotal 17.88 Shipping 9.52 Tax 0.00 Total 27.40
Nice little touch to the adapter to 2 led lamps green and red
Green power on Red flashes upon data transfer takes some of the guess work out of the installation.

http://www.cooldrives.com/sahadradtoid.html

1 IDE ribbon cable extender $6.89
Note: Not required for 2.5" drive installation
http://www.southernhillscomputer.com/ide40idsmato.html

Electrical tape (small piece)
Installation procedure:
Please do yourself a favor, take your time it's going to work
Power off and unplug let sit for a couple of minutes
Remove the lid (top cover)
Remove ribbon and power cables. Remove drive bracket 3 screws. Remove old drive from bracket 4 screws. Attach new drive to mounting bracket.
Remove jumper from adapter (very important)
Note:Align the notches on the ribbon cable when attaching
Connect male end of IDE ribbon extender cable to the DVR’s HDD pcb board 40 pin (not required for 2.5" drive)
Connect female end IDE ribbon extender cable to the adapter 40 pin (not required for 2.5" drive)
For 2.5" drive DVR’s HDD pcb board 40 pin to adapter
Connect power cable to adapter.
Connect adapter to the new SATA drive
Attach 3.5" drive to mounting bracket
Replace mounting bracket note (you may only be able to use 2 screws can’t get to top screw with adapter installed(arthritis))
Place a piece of electrical tape over the dvr HDD pcb. Tuck the PCB in a safe place
Fold ribbon cable flat (not required for 2.5" drive)
A small piece of Velcro Tape will hold the little 2.5" drive in place
Plug in and turn on
To format your new drive
Perform Skip 0-7-9 as per thread notes.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post12355769

After testing replace lid and secure it
Your done "Happy Recording"

Note: This will be the main post for the Philips 3575SATA500HT news and information I will update this post as required with new information.
Recording Capacity reported as 212hr 58min in SP mode
Ridata +R 16x size 4080mb length 1:59hrs HSD :29 elapsed
Ridata +R 16x size 3339mb length 1:38hrs HSD :28 elapsed
Memorex +R 16x size 3303 mb length 1:37hrs HSD :28 elapsed
Memorex +R 16x size 3723 mb length 1:49hrs HSD :28 elapsed
Memorex +R 16x size 2869 mb length 1:24hrs HSD :24 elapsed
Functions tested:
Record, delete, edit, HS dub, playback, FF, REW, FFW, next, prev
All performed without a hitch.
200903300745
Has been powered up and running for 48hr straight
HDD temperature is warm only
All functions running to spec.
200904010820
Over 40 hrs of recording now
Has been powered up for 4 days straight now
Absolutely no problems at this time
Has survived 3 power failures so far
200904041444 Hot Hot Hot
A release for ESATA drives is on the horizon coming soon
200904171707
Absolutely no problems at this time
200904221300
Absolutely no problems at this time
This concludes the testing of the 3.5" drive
*** HOT ****
Starting new testing with 2.5" 500gb sata drive
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...tent-_-text-_-
There is no heat, power supply problems with this drive, note no additional ribbon cable required for installation
IMO this drive will never tax the DVR's power supply or anything else. (less power and less heat than a standard drive)
http://s569.photobucket.com/albums/s...=IDESATA25.jpg
200904271330
Internal testing of sata drives has stopped
All testing is being conducted on external esata drives.
See
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post16351312
Pessimist comments are encouraged.
auskck is offline  
post #4263 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 02:28 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by vmalhotra View Post

Auskck,

Did you happen to take pictures of HD with adapter during your surgery.

Did you have any issues about space constraints. Is 3575 complimentary to 2080 model?

IMO Philips/Magnavox no difference as far as HDD replacement
Sorry no Pics, but not really required pretty simple operation.
I'll upgrade the 2160 soon.
I'm just glad we can take these fine recorders to a different level
auskck is offline  
post #4264 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 02:29 PM
Advanced Member
 
SteelTownGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 647
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazza View Post

I'm still trying to recover from the shock of auskck's announcement. So is what we now know:

- SATA drives will work provided you have the right SATA-IDE adapter.

- 500 GB seems to be the maximum space the DVDR recognizes.

SATA drives are probably preferable to IDE drives because they are likely to be more reliable than IDE drives (..per an earlier posting talking about Seagate's published MTBF statistics). They are unquestionably more available than IDE drives. But this leads to my question:

If one comes upon an 500 GB IDE drive for a price less than the SATA drive plus adapter should one buy the SATA drive anyway because it is more reliable? Or is the IDE drive better because there would be no adapter to worry about (and possibly fail) and the installation would be easier?

Also, I assume what auskck did for his Maggies will also work with the Philips (..same room to work with, same power supply). Let me know otherwise. No rush; I'm not touching my 3576 until warranty expires.

I don't think anyone (yet) has tried a HDD larger than 500GB in a Magnavox to confirm that they have the same FW limit as the Philips. Common sense would say it is probably also limited, but who knows.

I posted the earlier statistics from Seagate on reliability. They were actually AFR (annualized failure rate) numbers, not MTBF (mean time between failure). These may sound the same, but they are not. MTBF studies are done in a controlled laboratory environment by electronics manufacturers to qualify a product for sale.

AFR is a representation of actual failures for products in the real world which makes them much more meaningful. Think of it as the difference between what the EPA says your vehicle will get in mpg vs. what you see when you drive the car yourself.

Now, I can't say for sure that SATA is always more reliable than IDE. The biggest factor seems to be who manufactures the drive (and how serious are they about quality). Sounds like a discussion on blank DVD discs doesn't it? My impression was that the Seagate SATA drive is more reliable (0.32 AFR vs. 0.68 AFR -- lower is better), but probably because it is 2 generations newer. The IDE drive that comes with the Philips 3576 is a 7200.10 series (10th generation) while the SATA drive I pointed out was a 7200.12 series (12th generation).

You bring up a very good question. In the end, which is the smarter upgrade? A 500GB IDE drive w/o an adapter or a 500GB SATA drive w/ an adapter? It's a tough call. You don't have to worry about the adapter failing with IDE, but what happens if your IDE drive fails 3 years down the road? I don't think you'll find anyone still selling 500GB IDE drives at that time. Will you still be able to buy an adapter? Maybe. Maybe not. Worst case, you'd have to go back to your 160GB IDE drive if you hang on to it for a spare. I'm not sure what I'll do yet, either. On newegg, a Western Digital 500GB IDE is a little over $80 w/ shipping. What looks like a very nice Seagate 500GB SATA is $60 (free shipping) plus an adapter that's about $27 w/ shipping.
SteelTownGuy is offline  
post #4265 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 02:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelTownGuy View Post

I don't think anyone (yet) has tried a HDD larger than 500GB in a Magnavox to confirm that they have the same FW limit as the Philips. Common sense would say it is probably also limited, but who knows.

I posted the earlier statistics from Seagate on reliability. They were actually AFR (annualized failure rate) numbers, not MTBF (mean time between failure). These may sound the same, but they are not. MTBF studies are done in a controlled laboratory environment by electronics manufacturers to qualify a product for sale.

AFR is a representation of actual failures for products in the real world which makes them much more meaningful. Think of it as the difference between what the EPA says your vehicle will get in mpg vs. what you see when you drive the car yourself.

Now, I can't say for sure that SATA is always more reliable than IDE. The biggest factor seems to be who manufactures the drive (and how serious are they about quality). Sounds like a discussion on blank DVD discs doesn't it? My impression was that the Seagate SATA drive is more reliable (0.32 AFR vs. 0.68 AFR -- lower is better), but probably because it is 2 generations newer. The IDE drive that comes with the Philips 3576 is a 7200.10 series (10th generation) while the SATA drive I pointed out was a 7200.12 series (12th generation).

You bring up a very good question. In the end, which is the smarter upgrade? A 500GB IDE drive w/o an adapter or a 500GB SATA drive w/ an adapter? It's a tough call. You don't have to worry about the adapter failing with IDE, but what happens if your IDE drive fails 3 years down the road? I don't think you'll find anyone still selling 500GB IDE drives at that time. Will you still be able to buy an adapter? Maybe. Maybe not. Worst case, you'd have to go back to your 160GB IDE drive if you hang on to it for a spare. I'm not sure what I'll do yet, either. On newegg, a Western Digital 500GB IDE is a little over $80 w/ shipping. What looks like a very nice Seagate 500GB SATA is $60 (free shipping) plus an adapter that's about $27 w/ shipping.

Don't forget the IDE extender cable.
I'll have to order another adapter and extender cable for the Magnavox 2160, we will see what happens when we shoehorn the 1tb into it.
I don't think anybody has tried a transplant in the 3576 yet.
auskck is offline  
post #4266 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 03:02 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
FYI:The ultimate Maggie/Philips would be external removable 500gb drives. (power supply not a problem)
100+ 2hr Movies in Sp Mode per drive.(less than $.60 a movie)
The price of a 500gb SATA drive is dropping as we speak.
auskck is offline  
post #4267 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 03:22 PM
Senior Member
 
Lazza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 226
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thanks SteelTownGuy wrt MTBF and AFR. I was too quick to use the term I was more familiar with.

IMHO, it is probably better to go with an IDE drive versus the SATA equivalent as a general rule of thumb ... while there are still IDE drives to be had. Less to go wrong, a cleaner solution. Of course in 2-3 years the SATA drive (and adapter) approach will be the only way to go.

As an aside, one would assume a SATA drive would also be faster than its IDE equivalent. But since HDD performance is never a bottleneck I think this advantage would never be realized.


_Lazza
Lazza is offline  
post #4268 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 03:33 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazza View Post

Thanks SteelTownGuy wrt MTBF and AFR. I was too quick to use the term I was more familiar with.

IMHO, it is probably better to go with an IDE drive versus the SATA equivalent as a general rule of thumb ... while there are still IDE drives to be had. Less to go wrong, a cleaner solution. Of course in 2-3 years the SATA drive (and adapter) approach will be the only way to go.

As an aside, one would assume a SATA drive would also be faster than its IDE equivalent. But since HDD performance is never a bottleneck I think this advantage would never be realized.


_Lazza

The hard drives in these DVRs are in sleep mode very little head movement when recording. Probably the hardest workout they get is when dubbing
Your right performance is not a issue IDE/SATA
auskck is offline  
post #4269 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 04:27 PM
Member
 
Raunch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quick update on my750GB PATA. (Okay, I know this is old news since you're all going to SATA's.) 100 hrs.+ rec'd @ SPP. No probs. I'm filling it as quick as possible to see if the 500GB limit is just for the counter. Not likely, I assume, but we'll see in a couple of weeks.
Raunch is offline  
post #4270 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 04:42 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raunch View Post

Quick update on my750GB PATA. (Okay, I know this is old news since you're all going to SATA's.) 100 hrs.+ rec'd @ SPP. No probs. I'm filling it as quick as possible to see if the 500GB limit is just for the counter. Not likely, I assume, but we'll see in a couple of weeks.

I also had that thought. Will see what a newer Maggie 2160 does with a sata 1tb drive soon. When you want to fill the drive up it seems to take for ever, when using the 160gb it seems like it's always getting full.
auskck is offline  
post #4271 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 05:09 PM
Member
 
Raunch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by auskck View Post

I also had that thought. Will see what a newer Maggie 2160 does with a sata 1tb drive soon. When you want to fill the drive up it seems to take for ever, when using the 160gb it seems like it's always getting full.

A little math shows the EP hr. count to be very close to 4 digits @ 750gb. !?!
Raunch is offline  
post #4272 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 05:48 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raunch View Post

A little math shows the EP hr. count to be very close to 4 digits @ 750gb. !?!

Interesting software for writing, fixing, debugging FW.
http://www.atmel.com/dyn/products/to...p?tool_id=2725
I think I'll check it out. I understand assembler language and the bits and bytes side of it.
auskck is offline  
post #4273 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 06:09 PM
Member
 
Raunch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by auskck View Post

Interesting software for writing, fixing, debugging FW.
http://www.atmel.com/dyn/products/to...p?tool_id=2725
I think I'll check it out. I understand assembler language and the bits and bytes side of it.

Wouldn't it be cool if you could just add a 4th digit to the counter and free us up to 9999 hrs. @ EP. I'd have to REALLY work to fill a drive THAT big (7500gb)!!!
Raunch is offline  
post #4274 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 06:12 PM
Member
 
Raunch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raunch View Post

Wouldn't it be cool if you could just add a 4th digit to the counter and free us up to 9999 hrs. @ EP. I'd have to REALLY work to fill a drive THAT big (7500gb)!!!

Sorry. 7.5tb!
Raunch is offline  
post #4275 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 06:18 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raunch View Post

Sorry. 7.5tb!

Yep, also fix the no copy flag and region playing
auskck is offline  
post #4276 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 06:31 PM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
FYI:Want to do an external configuration on the cheap?
http://www.cooldrives.com/dubayesouca8.html

I think I can't pass this up, looks like my next project.
auskck is offline  
post #4277 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 09:08 PM
Advanced Member
 
DoctorM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 998
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by auskck View Post

Interesting software for writing, fixing, debugging FW.
http://www.atmel.com/dyn/products/to...p?tool_id=2725
I think I'll check it out. I understand assembler language and the bits and bytes side of it.

Ooh, 3576 feature requests:
-Autoclock from digital tuner
-Play DivX from USB port
-Ability to name timer programs.
-Ability to set aspect ratio for timer programs.
-Ability to sort titles by name or date.

Now get cracking!

--
(this space for rent)
DoctorM is offline  
post #4278 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 09:10 PM
Advanced Member
 
kenavs's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Louisville, CO
Posts: 985
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by auskck View Post

Don't forget the IDE extender cable.
I'll have to order another adapter and extender cable for the Magnavox 2160, we will see what happens when we shoehorn the 1tb into it.
I don't think anybody has tried a transplant in the 3576 yet.

Congratulations and thanks for all your great information.

I have never opened my 3575 or 3576, but the pictures I have seen seem to indicate there is a PC board which jumpers between the connector to mate with the HDD connector and the Flex cable that attaches to the connector that plugs into the disk controller board. I presume this PC board assembly is causing physical interference when plugged onto the adapter which is plugged into the HDD.
Am I reading you right, that the IDE extender cable replaces the flex cable/PC board assembly and the connectors on that assembly?

In a slightly off topic question, have you considered temporarily trying the adapter you will be ordering in a PC. I believe you mentioned that you had a lot of problems with the first type of adapter you bought when you tried it in a PC. It would be nice to hear that the cooldrives adapter works well in a PC, for those of us still using PCs with no SATA capability, and aging IDE drives. You mentioned that the recorder only saw 500GB of your 1TB SATA drive, which seems be a limitation of the recorder. Would a PC see the whole 1TB if the adapter is not introducing any limitations?
kenavs is offline  
post #4279 of 25918 Old 03-27-2009, 11:33 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Dartman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,635
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 13
If you can crack the FW the sky MAY be the limit. We've done it for years in the dvd burners to make em region free, burn crappy media at full speed, add Dual layer burning, etc.
I have people I chat with online that have been doing it for years, they read it like a book and modify as needed. I never got that far but I have poked around with editors and things. Some have things labeled in plain language which makes it easy to figure out, others do things in machine type language to where you have to guess or understand the bits, guess too far wrong you have a nice brick...
If some of the European versions have extra features on the same electronics may be able to do a compare and figure some things out.
My 250 is still going strong so don't see why anyone else's wont work as long as the rest of the machine,as long as you don't get stupid and use a old drive that draws way more power then the stock ones.
Dartman is offline  
post #4280 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 01:53 AM
Advanced Member
 
DoctorM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 998
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorM View Post

Ooh, 3576 feature requests:
-Autoclock from digital tuner
-Play DivX from USB port
-Ability to name timer programs.
-Ability to set aspect ratio for timer programs.
-Ability to sort titles by name or date.

Now get cracking!

Oh yeah...
-Need to push and hold stop button to stop timed recording (like the H2160).

I wouldn't mind taking a look at the code as well. Where did you get source firmware to examine?

--
(this space for rent)
DoctorM is offline  
post #4281 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 02:32 AM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorM View Post

Oh yeah...
-Need to push and hold stop button to stop timed recording (like the H2160).

I wouldn't mind taking a look at the code as well. Where did you get source firmware to examine?

There is 1 firmware update available on the web for the 3575 no source code.
Hence the need for decoding software.
auskck is offline  
post #4282 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 02:51 AM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenavs View Post

Congratulations and thanks for all your great information.

I have never opened my 3575 or 3576, but the pictures I have seen seem to indicate there is a PC board which jumpers between the connector to mate with the HDD connector and the Flex cable that attaches to the connector that plugs into the disk controller board. I presume this PC board assembly is causing physical interference when plugged onto the adapter which is plugged into the HDD.
Am I reading you right, that the IDE extender cable replaces the flex cable/PC board assembly and the connectors on that assembly?

In a slightly off topic question, have you considered temporarily trying the adapter you will be ordering in a PC. I believe you mentioned that you had a lot of problems with the first type of adapter you bought when you tried it in a PC. It would be nice to hear that the cooldrives adapter works well in a PC, for those of us still using PCs with no SATA capability, and aging IDE drives. You mentioned that the recorder only saw 500GB of your 1TB SATA drive, which seems be a limitation of the recorder. Would a PC see the whole 1TB if the adapter is not introducing any limitations?

Thanks, good questions.
The first, if you plug the DVR PCB drive connector directly to the adapter there is a height problem (can't close case), hense the use of the ribbon cable extender (M/F connector). The extender cable is placed between the DVR PCB and the adapter. Now the DVR pcb will be loose hense the small piece of tape for protection. The extender cable can now be folded flat, the lid will now close.
As for the second one I will give it a try but don't want to spend alot of time on it. IMO the adapter I used will work in a desktop PC

I hope this helped.
auskck is offline  
post #4283 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 04:51 AM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
*** Help * Help * Help ***
Need help finding bulk IDE ribbon cable (IDC 40) and male and female 40 pin connectors.
I want to build my own cable lengths.
Cables will be used in the HDD external storage project
Thanks Guys and Girls

Update found 1 that does custom cables (not the cheapest)
http://www.criticalcables.com/itemMa...=&MatrixType=2
auskck is offline  
post #4284 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 05:11 AM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
FYI:If in fact the FW limits us to 500gb drives, I would suggest doing the upgrade with the 500gb IDE drive.
Unless the drive is DOA which happens, they should last for years.
auskck is offline  
post #4285 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 07:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
FYI:Popped the lid on the Maggie 2160 no visual difference between it and the Philips 3575
HDD is a Hitachi HDP725016GLAT80 Date Apr-2008 160gb IDE
Standard replacement drive $55.78
http://www.pcrush.com/product/Hard-D...T80-Hard-Drive
No seals to be broken so warranty will stay in affect
The HDD Power On Hours shown by doing the 0-7-9 are the hours read from the HDD's FW not how long it's been operating in your DVR
auskck is offline  
post #4286 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 07:48 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Club Gold
 
wajo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,055
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 134
With the sudden frenzy of HDD upgrade planning, I added a list of SEAGATE SATA HDDs, Barracuda 7200.12 Series, to the HDD upgrade help file that *should* fit perfectly with the Auskck modifications described in the link below... for those who want to stay with the same drive mfgr. I'd still recommend waiting for a modicum of long-term results from Auskck's 500GB SATA mod.... just me tho... SATA drives should be available for a long time, unlike the IDE/PATA drives.

List of Optional Seagate SATA HDDs

Note 1: These SATA HDDs are more readily available but require more DIY effort, incl. an Adapter and M/F ribbon cable, as described in this post.

Note 2: Mild caution... As of 3/28/09, there has been only one installation of a SATA drive with adapter (see link above), so there's no long-term testing yet to confirm no adverse effects caused by a different type of drive (should be OK) and the use of an adapter.

Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 SATA HDDs for the 3575/3576/2080/2160...Spec Sheet Feb 2009

Size (GB) SATA Model # UsageW IdleW Height in. Width in. Depth in. Notes
160 ST3160318AS <8.0 <5.0 0.78 4.00 5.87  
250 ST3250318AS <8.0 <5.0 0.78 4.00 5.87  
320 ST3320418AS <8.0 <5.0 0.78 4.00 5.87  
500 ST3500418AS <8.0 <5.0 0.78 4.00 5.87 Max. size FW allows.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
wajo is offline  
post #4287 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 09:34 AM
Senior Member
 
sydyen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 276
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
> Need help finding bulk IDE ribbon cable (IDC 40) and male
> and female 40 pin connectors.
> I want to build my own cable lengths.
> Cables will be used in the HDD external storage project

A word of caution since you will be using these to go outside the case.

The 40-pin IDE has very few grounds, and even though it was spec'd for <18" inside the case, the interface had lots of crosstalk and transmission errors. The faster IDE became the worse the problems, and many a blue screen blamed on Microsoft was actually a corrupt transfer inside the PC. It did not matter which end of the cable was used at the host.

For a few years now IDE drives have had to use 80-conductor cables with the 40-pin connectors. The connectors have a third row of pins which form a common ground bus and pierce every second conductor in the cable. The ground between every signal makes for a huge reduction in cable crosstalk. The new cable has colored connectors because it is asymmetrical.

There is no point in getting custom cables for a long term solution until you know what you want. Twisting the cable (to form a tube) for any runs more than a few inches helps. Use an insulator where the cable comes in contact with metal such as resting directly on the case. Length is the enemy on IDE, keep the cable runs as short as possible.

On the positive side, an occasional data transfer error is no big deal because it will only cause a glitch on screen.

The worst case arises if an error occurs when internal tables are being updated, such as when titles are being edited. Table corruption could take the DVR down so hard it could lose access to all titles.

BTW, going external is a winning strategy because it will prevent stressing the DVR power supply, and I share the concern that has been expressed about the power supply being lightweight for the larger drives.

My thoughts for an internal replacement are to go for a $100 2.5" 500GB drive like the WD Scorpio.

The Scorpio comes in both IDE and SATA variations and is low power with a Read/Write of only 2.5W and Idle of 0.85W. The caveat is that this is a 5V only drive. The DVR power supply is designed to run a 3.5" drive where the load is primarily on the 12V line. The 5V line may be marginal to run a 2.5" drive.

Does anyone know the 5V rating of the DVR power supply?
sydyen is offline  
post #4288 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 09:43 AM
Member
 
Mike Hardy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Cary, NC
Posts: 99
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raunch View Post

Quick update on my750GB PATA. (Okay, I know this is old news since you're all going to SATA's.) 100 hrs.+ rec'd @ SPP. No probs. I'm filling it as quick as possible to see if the 500GB limit is just for the counter. Not likely, I assume, but we'll see in a couple of weeks.

Thanks Raunch for keeping us updated. It will be interesting to follow.

I haven't given up the PATA idea for SATA. Just have to get off the dime (uh, dollar?).
Mike Hardy is offline  
post #4289 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 10:28 AM
AVS Special Member
 
auskck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Diamondhead, MS
Posts: 1,825
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by sydyen View Post

> Need help finding bulk IDE ribbon cable (IDC 40) and male
> and female 40 pin connectors.
> I want to build my own cable lengths.
> Cables will be used in the HDD external storage project

A word of caution since you will be using these to go outside the case.

The 40-pin IDE has very few grounds, and even though it was spec'd for <18" inside the case, the interface had lots of crosstalk and transmission errors. The faster IDE became the worse the problems, and many a blue screen blamed on Microsoft was actually a corrupt transfer inside the PC. It did not matter which end of the cable was used at the host.

For a few years now IDE drives have had to use 80-conductor cables with the 40-pin connectors. The connectors have a third row of pins which form a common ground bus and pierce every second conductor in the cable. The ground between every signal makes for a huge reduction in cable crosstalk. The new cable has colored connectors because it is asymmetrical.

There is no point in getting custom cables for a long term solution until you know what you want. Twisting the cable (to form a tube) for any runs more than a few inches helps. Use an insulator where the cable comes in contact with metal such as resting directly on the case. Length is the enemy on IDE, keep the cable runs as short as possible.

On the positive side, an occasional data transfer error is no big deal because it will only cause a glitch on screen.

The worst case arises if an error occurs when internal tables are being updated, such as when titles are being edited. Table corruption could take the DVR down so hard it could lose access to all titles.

BTW, going external is a winning strategy because it will prevent stressing the DVR power supply, and I share the concern that has been expressed about the power supply being lightweight for the larger drives.

My thoughts for an internal replacement are to go for a $100 2.5" 500GB drive like the WD Scorpio.

The Scorpio comes in both IDE and SATA variations and is low power with a Read/Write of only 2.5W and Idle of 0.85W. The caveat is that this is a 5V only drive. The DVR power supply is designed to run a 3.5" drive where the load is primarily on the 12V line. The 5V line may be marginal to run a 2.5" drive.

Does anyone know the 5V rating of the DVR power supply?

Good post, I found some round high grade IDE cables but none with M/F connectors. Years ago a saw just a connector M/M. I would like to find some of these, it would solve all the problems.
auskck is offline  
post #4290 of 25918 Old 03-28-2009, 12:12 PM
Senior Member
 
sydyen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 276
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I wanted a M/M adapter a while back and came up with nothing.

Although it seems like a trivial thing, it requires a circuit board to run the conductors correctly.

When you put the connectors face-to-face the pin numbering is reversed so pin 1 is facing 39 i.e.

01 03 05 07 09 11 13 15 17 19 21 23 25 27 29 31 33 35 37 39
02 04 06 08 10 12 14 16 18 xx 22 24 26 28 30 32 34 36 38 40

39 37 35 33 31 29 27 25 23 21 19 17 15 13 11 09 07 05 03 01
40 38 36 34 32 30 28 26 24 22 xx 18 16 14 12 10 08 06 04 02

If you do a flipped face to face then the rows are reversed and pin 1 is facing pin 2 i.e.

01 03 05 07 09 11 13 15 17 19 21 23 25 27 29 31 33 35 37 39
02 04 06 08 10 12 14 16 18 __ 22 24 26 28 30 32 34 36 38 40

02 04 06 08 10 12 14 16 18 __ 22 24 26 28 30 32 34 36 38 40
01 03 05 07 09 11 13 15 17 19 21 23 25 27 29 31 33 35 37 39

A double transition would achieve the numbering consistency but it will not work because pin 20 is a key, there is no conductor and the hole is usually blocked.

If you do find a M/M adapter I'll be ordering some myself.
sydyen is offline  
Reply DVD Recorders (Standard Def)

Tags
Magnavox Mdr515h 500gb Hdd And Dvd R With Digital Tuner
Gear in this thread - Mdr515h by PriceGrabber.com

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off