Magnavox 557, 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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True enough. I didn't realize how many direct-entry buttons the 3575 remote had until I tried a Sony RM-VL600 universal remote people were touting (from Wal-Mart). I couldn't find a LOGICAL or even CLOSELY NAMED button for 13 of the direct-entry buttons on the 3575's little remote! My wife refused to use it after I told her she'd have to press "Sleep" to see the Disc Menu!
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post #452 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 03:15 PM
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I was pondering buying a 2nd Philips remote for the 3575 now while they're available and before mine fails (just got the unit Friday!). Are you saying we can't order the real one from Philips or just that a knockoff is desirable for some reason?

At my local Tiger Direct I found Philips label DVD-R media which was not on the list of "tested w/ 3575" from Wajo's original info append. I've been looking for other media on that list and it's scarce where I usually hunt (Office Depot, Buy More and Target). I suppose the Philips media IS tested w/ the 3575 but not necessarily making the Wajo top ten (or 5) list.

I have plumbed out some of the machine features over the w/e and look forward to burning something this week, after serious editing, of course.

M.
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post #453 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Hardy View Post

...At my local Tiger Direct I found Philips label DVD-R media which was not on the list of "tested w/ 3575" from Wajo's original info append. I've been looking for other media on that list and it's scarce where I usually hunt (Office Depot, Buy More and Target). I suppose the Philips media IS tested w/ the 3575 but not necessarily making the Wajo top ten (or 5) list...

From the manual:
Quote:


Following discs are recommended for good recording
quality and are proven to be compatible with this unit.
However, depending on the media condition the unit
may not read the disc properly.
Verbatim DVD+R 8x, DVD+RW 4x,
DVD-R 8x, DVD-RW 2x
JVC DVD-RW 4x
Maxell DVD+R 4x/8x/16x, DVD-R 8x/16x
SONY DVD+R 4x/8x/16x, DVD+RW 4x
TDK DVD+R 4x/8x/16

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post #454 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 03:43 PM
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And you usually don't do wrong with top quality Taiyo Yudens.
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post #455 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 04:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Hardy View Post

I was pondering buying a 2nd Philips remote for the 3575 now while they're available and before mine fails (just got the unit Friday!). Are you saying we can't order the real one from Philips or just that a knockoff is desirable for some reason?

Here's one source for the 3575 remote, $29.95.
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post #456 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 04:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plplplpl View Post

And you usually don't do wrong with top quality Taiyo Yudens.

True. I use them for all my DVD recording,
not only for my recorders but my computer drives
as well.
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post #457 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck44 View Post

True. I use them for all my DVD recording,
not only for my recorders but my computer drives
as well.

Bare with me on this question. I have never owned a DVD recorder. So what DVD media and format ie -RW.+RW etc, is recomended to transfer/burn all the VHS tapes full of family videos. Keep in mind that I want them to be the most compatible say 10-20 years from now with what ever DVD players are on the market.

If after I transfer them to DVD what do you think about using a PC and copy them to a USB type external hardrive as back up copy and maybe one that would last forever?
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post #458 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 05:11 PM
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If you're using the 3575 I would say get +R discs like the TY's that were mentioned. + discs are more native to Philips and it sure wouldn't hurt to have a HDD backup of priceless recordings.
Some people also check there DVD's yearly for degradation/errors, using there PC's. If they detect a disc is getting errors, they make another copy of it. I suppose if you did this the HDD would be less needed, but at the price of HDD's you still might want to be sure.
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post #459 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 05:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Re: DVD media and format, some info in this post.

For archival longevity, use DVD-R or +R, not -RW/+RW, which have a "phase-changing" burn layer made for recording and erasing. Since they "change phase" between burnt and erased states, they aren't as good for long term storage as the -R/+R, which are designed for one burn and then no physical changes, i.e., the burn is permanent assuming you used a high-quality disc, like Taiyo Yuden. More info in the link above.
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post #460 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

That's the diff. between a player and recorder. The recorder has to abide by the DVD-Video/MPEG-2 stds which specifiy nothing better than DD2.0 recording ability, which also limits what can go thru the tuner.

The powers that be don't want you to make a HD copy in any sense, video or audio.

The 3575 PLAYS DD5.1 tho, and it's awesome when playing a commercial DVD with HDMI. Your home-made DVDs will only have DD2.0 however.

It seems to me that recoding DVDs with signals that already have a DD signal on it wouldn't need any DD encoder.

It sounds more like "the man" does not want you to easily copy anything digitally. "Easy" is the key word here, because it is certainly possible to record a program's existing DD stream onto a DVD using a computer rig.

Unless someone knows of a DVD recorder with an ATSC tuner that can record the DD5.1 stream (with down-rezzed SD video of course) your only option is to transfer programs from your DVR with your computer.
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post #461 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 05:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, it's definitely "the man" that limits our audio recording capability since DVDs are capable of holding many audio tracks, and I mis-spoke about the specs limiting that ability. Just like the "edict" for NO COMPONENT OR HDMI INPUTS, they limit audio to L/R stereo inputs, but some nice outputs, of course.
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post #462 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 08:33 PM
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Probably an odd, obscure question, but if anyone anywhere knows, I suspect it will be here...

Has anyone taken one of the discs recorded on the 3757 and then ripped it to their computer successfully? And *very carefully* viewed the results?

The reason I stress "very carefully" is that I recently set out to dub an old beta tape of mine to my venerable Panasonic DMR-HS2 (first to HDD, then to DVD-R), and then rip the results to a Mac. The transfer to the HS2's HDD seemed fine. The dub to DVD-R seemed fine. The finalized DVD-R plays back everywhere I test it (the HS2, an Oppo DV-970HD player, and a couple of different Macs). Yet when the video is ripped, there is a very slight hesitation in the motion periodically (on the order of every 20 seconds). This is whether I rip/re-encode using Handbrake, MPEG Streamclip, or VLC. The hesitations are very objectionable to me, perhaps especially as the video clips are important to me and mostly modern dance.

Based on MPEG Streamclip telling me the .VOB file needed to have timecode breaks repaired (and claiming it had done so), I suspect the HS2 records video in short segments without paying attention to continuity of timecode between these segments. And this seems not to hurt playback of the original at all, yet every method I've found of re-encoding that data has problems with these frequent timecode breaks.

I'm hoping that many years downstream from the HS2, the 3575 simply won't have any such problems. But I've searched around for comments on this to no avail. Any definitive answer available here?

(Yes, I could skip the DVD recorder entirely and import the analog video out of my VCR directly into my computer with a suitable A/D converter, which I actually have, but just due to equipment locations and sane limits on cable lengths, it would be much, much easier if I could do things as outlined above.)
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post #463 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 08:57 PM - Thread Starter
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I think AmesDP does lots of editing on a PC, not sure about a Mac. I've not heard anyone report problems with timecode breaks and/or stuttering with 3575 files.

Interesting Panasonic FAQ page here with FAQ #22 and #28 stating the HS2 is not designed for PC/Mac editing SW.
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post #464 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 09:13 PM
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Interesting. Thanks, wajo. #22 sounded close to my interests, but I'm not actually trying to get the deck to do anything under the control of the computer, which is what that item seemed to be about. And unlike #28 I'm not trying to directly copy files off of the HS2. (Didn't even know anyone had figured out how to do that.)

I think that simply doing a rip/re-encode from a disc recorded in a 3575 would completely tell the tale. It's just that people probably don't often go that direction, ripping a disc they just recorded themselves. And I hesitate to purchase a unit and risk discovering that the main purpose for which I bought it is a bust.
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post #465 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 09:26 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't think you'll have any major problems getting 3575 stuff into your Mac. The only thing I know... or think I know... is that the +VR std used by Philips/Funai recorders (50% of all in North America) produces an extra _RM folder, which doesn't matter to PC/Mac editing, and I've read of "duplicate" files, but once you understand the nature of the +VR files structure, should be no problem. (+VR std is completely compatible with DVD-Video std, in case you wonder.)

Wikipedia says this about the +VR file system: "The resulting file system also looks slightly different from what one would expect on most authored DVD Video discs. On authored discs there is typically one group of VOB files per title; whereas on a DVD+VR recorded disc a single VOB set is shared by all recordings. For a DVD Video player this makes no difference."

Here's a thread I started to help another Mac editor (but didn't know he was Mac at the time)... got lots of great PC info anyway for PC editors... may help some at least in understanding file structure?
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post #466 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 09:39 PM
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That editing thread is very interesting, but only raises my level of concern. The second poster, rmae, says using MPEG Streamclip, a common, favorite tool of mine, failed with 3575 recordings. And rmae posted later asking for suggestions for editing 3575 recordings on a Mac and never got a reply. There was a lot of useful information in the thread, though, particularly for PC users. And since it indicated that editing data from discs recorded on a 3575 on a PC is completely doable, that at least suggests the whole multiply broken timecode thing is not a problem on the 3575 (unless the editing software they refer to is fixing it on the fly). Well, I'm learning. Just not convinced it'll work yet. Thanks.
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post #467 of 25966 Old 03-09-2008, 10:00 PM
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Don't suppose anyone who participates here has both a 3575 and a Mac, and could give it a try?
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post #468 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 12:05 AM
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I don't think there's anything unusual about the 3575's recordings. I use the same editing software with the 3575 as I do with all other DVDs, and the files look the same as they do with all other DVD+VR discs.

It's true that DVD recorders add multiple recordings to the same title set instead of making a new title set for each recording. That can sometimes confuse simple video software that reads VOB files without looking at the IFO files, particularly when you mix recordings at different frame sizes in the same VOB file. But it is allowed by the DVD standard, and handled properly by all DVD reading/editing software that I know of.

DVD+VR discs have two file systems, an ISO file system and a UDF file system, making two separate index structures pointing to a single common set of files. That sometimes causes editing software to see all the files on the disc twice if both the ISO and UDF file systems are read, but usually you can just pick the first copy of each file and everything works fine.
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post #469 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 04:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

...Some people also check there DVD's yearly for degradation/errors, using there PC's. If they detect a disc is getting errors, they make another copy of it...

This is very important, especially for data that would
be hard to replace.
Most folks are unaware of the fact that home-burned
DVD media does not last indefinitely, and can go bad
over time.
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post #470 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 06:21 AM
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Sorry to go back to an older part of this thread but I was away all weekend. I realize that you can't read video from a USB drive (at least not here in North America). However, can video be dubbed from the HD to an external USB drive? This would sure be handy.

BTW I would never flash my unit with non-compliant firmware. At least I wouldn't be the first person to do it =-)
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post #471 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 06:53 AM - Thread Starter
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No, per manual, pg 117:
"Can I record to USB device? No, you cannot. USB device can only be played back on this unit."
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post #472 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 01:24 PM
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I am a new user of the DVD357H/37 and have the following question regarding it's audio capabilities:

I have the recorder connected to the AV Receiver via the digital audio coax connection.

When playing a DVD the Dolby the multi-channel decoding light (5.1) on the receiver is triggered (as appropriate). Yet when watching DTV it is not, even when watching a channel that is sending 5.1 (as evidenced by watching the same channel using my set-top box).

The question is, whether or not the DVD357H/37 DTV tuner is sending 5.1 or not?

Thank you.
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post #473 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 01:27 PM
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Does anyone have any experience with the DVDR3575H and the Harmony Remote 800, or could point me to information regarding the optimum setup.

Thank you.
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post #474 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCCISProf View Post


The question is, whether or not the DVD357H/37 DTV tuner is sending 5.1 or not?

Thank you.

Just like HD, the 5.1 is stripped off, so even when just watching TV through the 3575's tuner it will be SD with 2 channel audio, even if broadcast HD 5.1.
All DVDR's will be the same.
The same would be of most all of the CECB's coming out. It's possible the Channel Master 7000 will have a Coax digital audio out, for 5.1, but it has not yet been approved for coupon eligibility.
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post #475 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 01:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCCISProf View Post

I am a new user of the DVD357H/37 and have the following question regarding it's audio capabilities:

I have the recorder connected to the AV Receiver via the digital audio coax connection.

When playing a DVD the Dolby the multi-channel decoding light (5.1) on the receiver is triggered (as appropriate). Yet when watching DTV it is not, even when watching a channel that is sending 5.1 (as evidenced by watching the same channel using my set-top box).

The question is, whether or not the DVD357H/37 DTV tuner is sending 5.1 or not?

Use the INFO button to see what audio options are available when playing DVDs, and select whatever option is available that you want.

Some info and tips here.

Edit: Apparently no DTS... nothing in manual and I played a DTS movie with no option for DTS via INFO button.
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post #476 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

Just like HD, the 5.1 is stripped off, so even when just watching TV through the 3575's tuner it will be SD with 2 channel audio, even if broadcast HD 5.1.
All DVDR's will be the same.

OK. That's what I thought. It's no big deal, as I am using a Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner setup box, for normal OTA viewing and it does indeed provide 5.1., and as a DVD player it works as expected.

I just needed reassurance, that I had set everything up correctly.

Thanks for the quick response.
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post #477 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 03:12 PM
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I believe it was a lot of peoples wish that the next generation of DVD recorders with built in digital tuners would provide HD and even 5.1 for normal TV watching through the tuner. Sadly not this year anyway.
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post #478 of 25966 Old 03-10-2008, 05:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Hardy View Post

I was pondering buying a 2nd Philips remote for the 3575 now while they're available and before mine fails (just got the unit Friday!). Are you saying we can't order the real one from Philips or just that a knockoff is desirable for some reason?

Mike, I hope you haven't bought that extra remote for $29.95 per the link I gave earlier...

IT'S ONLY $7.60 FROM PHILIPS, HERE!

They're going fast: 99 left last night, 84 left Tues Mar 11!
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post #479 of 25966 Old 03-14-2008, 05:24 AM
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Thanks Wajo (Waj for short??), I placed the order last night, also for the update disk (cd or dvd?). I hope there is info on the content of the udate. I am loathe to apply a "fix" for no apparent reason.
It might address my wish list tho', which is growing...

1- Support a USB keyboard w/ function keys assigned to remote keys.

2- Let me delete a CHAPTER, not just a Scene. I haven't mastered the "start / end of scene" fingering yet. Yes I saw the Wajo doc on "how to" but my machine seems to be saying "not today...". More thrashing this w/e. Makes me glad I ordered that replacement remote... The "auto stop at beginning/end of scene" seems to not work for me and my machine.

3- I burned a real-time disk (didn't offer fast burn) and was not happy to see it really meant "real time". To take that long to burn is sort of silly, isn't it? Locks up the whole machine doing the burn. I can't imagine the merit of such a thing. Perhaps someone will enlighten me? Not that I need to understand. Being a computer guy I never deal well with stuff in "frames-per-second time" when it's digital. I am using 4x media, probably the biggest reason there's no "fast" option (or whatever, sorry).

So check me on these:
1- We bother with chapters - why?
a) easier to jump/navigate thru movie (like I wanna butcher the movie )
b) Chapters later in the DVD (see a) above)
c) Easy to delete a chap--- oops, sorry.

2- Can't go "thru the clouds" (wrap around from 1st to last of content) because???
a) again, just learning to edit.

3- Editing commercials is a matter of defining a SCENE DELETE to do it? I'd make them into Chapters but can't delete a chapter so why?

No answer on Philips media yet. Anyone have a view?? It seems like rationale for choosing a manufacturer is:
1- make them themselves, comments ___________
2- Use "high quality" materials, comments ________
3- Put a lot of material on, comments _________
4- Performs consistently well on degredation tests, comments ______
5- Has Mfg warranty (smile), comments __________
I guess us engineers need some facts other than "yep, it always worked for me".
Hope this doesn't start a religious discussion, just trying to get criteria for choosing media for myself.
Thanks all - M.
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post #480 of 25966 Old 03-14-2008, 05:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck44 View Post

From the manual:

Sorry Chuck44 I missed your point here.
I've seen the list, same as Wajo posted too.

Are you saying Philips media is not on the list so don't use it or just general info for us?

Sorry to take so long to reply, spend time "chasing children" as I put it.
Thanks, M.
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