Magnavox 557, 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 253 - AVS Forum
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post #7561 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 01:03 PM
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I purchased two Philips DVDR3576H/37 units in July 2008. For reasons of ill health I did not get around to installing them until September 2009. Everything was fine with the exception of the clock update causing the HDD and fan to run when it feels like it. Then last Sunday I placed a disc in the DVD drive that was not recognized by the drive. The next day I switched the unit on and found that the Titles on the hard drive were just black boxes. I flipped to the Setup Menu and all of the HDD functions were grayed out. The unit was reporting an Error 49 code which I understand refers to the maximum number of titles on the DVD not the hard drive. I stripped the unit down and checked the HDD which appears to be running. Only having laptops I took the Western Digital unit to a local PC company to test the drive and all they could say was under Windows the disc would not show any evidence of any files. I re-installed the drive and then found the very informative thread by wajo! I have checked the SKIP 079 code and the DVD comes back OK and the HDD comes back Not Found. I am left wondering if this is a HDD fault or a Firmware corruption problem. I have checked Skip 654 and it confirms firmware issue HD4P3374EH1E. The machine has a pack date of February 2008. I notice that this firmware number is the same as the DVDR3575 with the exception of the font size in the thread of the first E HD4P3374EH1E. I am not well versed in core digital stuff so I do not understand the other differences DTV-S: 0x8D or 0x90 and FE: R40_016_000 verses DTV-S: 0x90 and FE: R40_026_000 listed in wajo's thread. Could this be a firmware problem or is it more likely to be a HDD fault? If it is a firmware problem can I use the 3575/early 3576 firmware listed on Philips website? I am located in the Caribbean so finding anyone with test gear is a joke. My second unit is located in Florida otherwise I would swap the drives to see if it solved it. If I need to I will wait until I return to Florida where I can test the drive and maybe burn an image from the good drive to the defective one if that is possible. What is the file format of this drive? ANY HELP would be greatly appreciated, as Philips technical is as much use as a chocolate teapot!
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post #7562 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 01:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Cap, Windows won't show anything and no one has "mirrored" one of our HDDs to date, AFAIK.

The SKIP 079 Self-Check was the right place to start, and showing "Not Found" means either the cable is loose or the HDD is dead. As shown in that SKIP 079 help file, some care has to be taken in removing and reinstalling these drives, esp. in pulling the cable from the HDD straight out and not sideways, as shown in one of the sketches. Basically, there's are probably many ways to end up with a Not Found condition, even a bad cable.

I'd go back in and check the HDD cable and make sure it's undamaged and well-seated and secure? If you can get past the Not Found condition with a working cable connection, then you can either do a Format or the SKIP 013 HDD Factory Check... both wipe recorded titles, etc. but 013 checks the platters for defects/bad spots.

The unit will sound like it turns on or spins up at noon and midnight to search for a time signal if you've got Auto Clock ON... you won't see anything on the display, just a low-pitched "whirring."
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post #7563 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 02:35 PM
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A couple of weeks ago I got the E2 system error while recording and was unable to power off either by remote or on the front panel power button, and had to unplug the 3575 in order to clear it.

Last evening, while viewing a title (not recording) I got the error again but this time I was able to power it off via remote and it was back to normal after powering back up. It did not leave a hanging title or otherwise cause any ill effects.

Does anyone know what the E2 system error denotes? The manual is of no help for E2.
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post #7564 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

The SKIP 079 Self-Check was the right place to start, and showing "Not Found" means either the cable is loose or the HDD is dead. As shown in that SKIP 079 help file, some care has to be taken in removing and reinstalling these drives, esp. in pulling the cable from the HDD straight out and not sideways, as shown in one of the sketches. Basically, there's are probably many ways to end up with a Not Found condition, even a bad cable.

I'd go back in and check the HDD cable and make sure it's undamaged and well-seated and secure? If you can get past the Not Found condition with a working cable connection, then you can either do a Format or the SKIP 013 HDD Factory Check... both wipe recorded titles, etc. but 013 checks the platters for defects/bad spots.

I've attached two photos that show the hard drive connections in place and disconnected. These photos were taken during my Magnavox 2080 hard drive upgrade. The views will be typical of Philips and Magnavox models with PATA hard drives.
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post #7565 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stump69 View Post

A couple of weeks ago I got the E2 system error while recording and was unable to power off either by remote or on the front panel power button, and had to unplug the 3575 in order to clear it.

Last evening, while viewing a title (not recording) I got the error again but this time I was able to power it off via remote and it was back to normal after powering back up. It did not leave a hanging title or otherwise cause any ill effects.

Does anyone know what the E2 system error denotes? The manual is of no help for E2.

E2 is a problem with a Test Unit Ready command, which I think could have something to do with the HDD cable or adapter. If a SKIP 079 Self-Check says connection is OK and you get a chance to open case, you might want to look at the adapter connection to see if it's tight, etc.?
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post #7566 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Cap, Windows won't show anything and no one has "mirrored" one of our HDDs to date, AFAIK.

My last attempt confirmed this. I tried both Windows and Linux. The HDD did not even contain file system info. Usually, even if the file system is something that's not recognized by the operating system, it still shows a code in a certain sector on the disk. There was no recorded code (I even used a HDD diagnostic utility to examine it). My thinking is the FW controls this file system by reading/writing files table information (sectors, offsets, file names...) from/to flash memory, so there is no need to have any information on HDD. Later, it dawn on me that perhaps this is exactly how they protect contents! by doing this, there is no encryption needed, since nobody can read the recorded programs without knowing how to access file system information.
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post #7567 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 03:40 PM
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Just curious if the HD showed the full size of the drive as empty. I had an external drive that was puzzling - I thought was empty, but 'part' of it was missing. Finally reformatted it -- it turned out it had been partitioned and half was supporting one operating system -- the other half, a second OS. So the second partition was never visible when using the other system. If it's all one partition and the drive is showing the full size (160, give or take formatting allowance), then it really is mysterious - or should I say ingenious!
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post #7568 of 26015 Old 11-22-2009, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by artwire View Post

Just curious if the HD showed the full size of the drive as empty. I had an external drive that was puzzling - I thought was empty, but 'part' of it was missing. Finally reformatted it -- it turned out it had been partitioned and half was supporting one operating system -- the other half, a second OS. So the second partition was never visible when using the other system. If it's all one partition and the drive is showing the full size (160, give or take formatting allowance), then it really is mysterious - or should I say ingenious!

Yeah, the HDD size shown full size "unallocated" (i.e. technical term for empty with no file system). I've done a school project in a somewhat similar fashion to bypass the operating system back in college, so I'm afraid this might be the approach they took. But when I get my next 2160, will attempt a second time to verify and put this issue to rest
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post #7569 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 01:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodhi78 View Post

My last attempt confirmed this. I tried both Windows and Linux. The HDD did not even contain file system info. Usually, even if the file system is something that's not recognized by the operating system, it still shows a code in a certain sector on the disk. There was no recorded code (I even used a HDD diagnostic utility to examine it). My thinking is the FW controls this file system by reading/writing files table information (sectors, offsets, file names...) from/to flash memory, so there is no need to have any information on HDD. Later, it dawn on me that perhaps this is exactly how they protect contents! by doing this, there is no encryption needed, since nobody can read the recorded programs without knowing how to access file system information.

I don't see how that can be the case. Based on the reports of successful disk farms, it seems that when different drives containing saved programs are installed in the DVDRs, they are able to view them. That would seem to imply that all the file informations is on the drive. It just is not in a structure that anyone has been able to find a reader for, other than the DVDRs themselves.
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post #7570 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 02:15 AM
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Originally Posted by kenavs View Post

I don't see how that can be the case. Based on the reports of successful disk farms, it seems that when different drives containing saved programs are installed in the DVDRs, they are able to view them. That would seem to imply that all the file informations is on the drive. It just is not in a structure that anyone has been able to find a reader for, other than the DVDRs themselves.

You're right, I did not consider that fact However, if the FW does manage the record programs by directly reading/writing disk sectors, then it could store the tables that way, too, at certain predefined sectors. And when the DVDR is turned on, those sectors can be read back and populate the index tables for its file system in memory. Again, this is still a speculation, since one try is not enough to determine whether it is true. My guess is if I try with the another HDD using Windows or Linux, I'll will see the same "unallocated" HDD partition. And I certainly agree with your assertion there, a "reader" that we don't have any info as to what "type" of reader it is, so we can start looking in that direction.
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post #7571 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 02:35 AM
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Originally Posted by CaptainUSA View Post



I purchased two Philips DVDR3576H/37 units in July 2008. ...

Did you try swapping the HDDs in them?
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post #7572 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 07:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenavs View Post

I don't see how that can be the case. Based on the reports of successful disk farms, it seems that when different drives containing saved programs are installed in the DVDRs, they are able to view them. That would seem to imply that all the file informations is on the drive. It just is not in a structure that anyone has been able to find a reader for, other than the DVDRs themselves.

I've read that the HDD FW is loaded in the cache on new drives so each drive has all it needs to operate with the FW on any of our PhilMag machines... 3575+3576 tested so far by Auskck.

I also learned there is a difference between cache and buffer, as noted in this Wiki article:

"While the hard drive's hardware disk buffer is sometimes misleadingly referred to as "disk cache", its main functions are write sequencing and read prefetching. Repeated cache hits are relatively rare, due to the small size of the buffer in comparison to HDD's capacity."

The buffer is temporary storage, like our 3-sec read-write buffer, whereas the cache is for more "permanent" storage like the drive ID and FW.

Lots of articles like this one on whether a larger cache helps performance in computers and, generally, the answer is not really, and probably esp. so with our slow DVDR CPUs... and considering our OEM Seagates came with 2MB cache.
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post #7573 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 09:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Possibly Significant Finding for Cable Subs, Esp. Comcast

I've been helping a new member with a 2-yr-old 3575 and Comcast cable get his digital channels back after two "realignments"... one in October and one Nov 19th.

Comcast ended up sending him four analog channels that are duplicated in his digitals, 2.1/4.1/5.1/7.1. He tried the All-or-Nothing (AON) Procedure a couple of times and, each time, his digitals would be auto-changed to "Delete" after his power cycle to check results.

I told him about the "analog interference" some 3575's exhibited in cable systems (altho his was rock solid for the past 2 years). I thought the analog/digital duplication might be a possible explanation.

So, I asked him to FIRST change all his analog channels to Delete, do a normal AON power cycle, THEN do a separate AON for digitals... and that worked right away! He had thought he would be forced to use Comcast's free box but says now he's "gold" again with just the 3575. He promised to let me know if anything changes!

?A key finding in this?: He says he now has 2.1/4.1/5.1/7.1 in CH+/- button memory but they're BLANK... actually "blue screen"! WOW... evidence of analog-digital interaction for sure and maybe even proof of "analog interference"?

So, no analogs to "feed" the duplicated digitals?... meaning they're sending analogs but just duplicating them on "digital" channels for digital subs, as well as leaving them in the analog channel group for basic subs? Sounds like when he selects one of the duplicated digitals, it "bounces" to an analog but that channel's no longer in CH+/- button memory, so the bounce fails... or it won't tune at that analog frequency... or it "interferes" somehow... ? Interesting.

I told him he *could* probably add back the NON-duplicated analogs and, if feeling really brave, add those duplicated analogs in a separate test so we knew if the problem stems from ANY analogs or just from duplicated ones.

However, he didn't want to lose what he gained back... very understandable since he'd been working on this since October, then found this site. I reminded him that he didn't need the analogs anyway since he could still tune them directly or set them in a timer rec program if/when neeeded... they just won't be in CH+/- button memory so they're not "surfable"... good enough for him!

I changed the top "Notice" in the Scanning help file to describe a "MODIFIED AON PROCEDURE" for people who might also keep losing digital channel tuning, esp. in Comcast systems, and referred to it again in the AON Procedure steps so it shouldn't be missed.

UPDATE 11/24/09: He timer recorded a show on one of his analog channels that were on "Delete" and, apparently, just tuning the analog and recording from it changed all his digitals back to "Delete."

I've asked him if he'd do another test to see if he can duplicate this phenomenon so we know if, in fact, you have to stay away from a duplicated analog or ALL analogs, whether just tuning them manually also causes the problem, etc.
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post #7574 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 11:50 AM
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Here's another weird happening.

A friend asked me to record a football game for him yesterday, and this afternoon after I finished editing the content so only the game itself would be on the DVD and then shut the machine down...

The clock defaulted to military time.

Problem is there doesn't seem to be any control in the "General Settings" menu to switch between a 24 hour clock and an am/pm clock.

When I turned the machine off, the audio and picture were gone on the monitor, and the time still read correctly. Then something more shut down (I could hear a change in the sound of the recorder...it sort of went "more silent") and suddenly the hour display increased by 12 hours. (I think the PM icon was still lit up!)

When I turn the machine back on, when it's displaying the time it displays it in am/pm correctly. I went into the control menu and tried to cycle thru the hours on the clock set screen, but no joy. No sign of any numbers over 12.

Has anyone seen anything like this? (It's my 2160A. The 2080 is in the same room with it, and it's fine.)

I went into the timer program list, wrote everything down, and unplugged the machine.

I'm going to wait a while and then plug it back in again and see what happens.
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post #7575 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Possibly Significant Finding for Cable Subs, Esp. Comcast

I've been helping a new member with a 2-yr-old 3575 and Comcast cable get his digital channels back after two "realignments"... one in October and one Nov 19th...

Could any of this be of help in trying to somehow correct the situation I posted about, Weather Channel and my Fox affiliate's widescreen channel sharing exactly the same channel number, the Fox one not being tune-able by the timer record process (unless the machine's left on and tuned to that channel)?
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post #7576 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gastrof View Post

Could any of this be of help in trying to somehow correct the situation I posted about, Weather Channel and my Fox affiliate's widescreen channel sharing exactly the same channel number, the Fox one not being tune-able by the timer record process (unless the machine's left on and tuned to that channel)?

FIRST: I am OTA only, so I have no first hand experience with the cable issues.
Now for my theorizing. For OTA, it seems that the scan process with the digital tuner steps through the available physical channel assignments and looks for detectable digital stations. When it finds one, it makes an entry in a table that shows the display channel number it found in the data stream and the physical channel it was tuned to when it found it. I don't think it makes any record of sub-channel information. Someone else has also speculated that, although the poster escapes me, but I had been thinking the same thing for a while. I believe there are both positives and negatives to the approach. It means you cannot delete individual sub-channels, since there is no table to delete them from. This is an issue if using the tuner as an STB, which I very rarely do. It has the advantage that rescans are not required when sub-channels are added or deleted. It had not occurred to me that multiple physical channels could report the same display channel number until the Minnesota Twin Cities situation came up. Apparently the designers did anticipate that possibility, since the scan does find the 2 transmitters and seems to have created mappings for both. However, things are not orderly. I think that the fact that the lower sub-channel numbers were assigned to the transmitter with the higher frequency assignment contributed to the confusion. That would seem to explain why the sub-channel numbers out of sequence when stepping up. First .3&.4 and then .1&.2. I don't know that the designers totally anticipated all the possibilities in this situation. I can think of a trap they could have easily fallen in. When trying to go to the .1 or .2 sub-channel for a scheduled recording, I would expect them to try the first entry in the tables first, which would be the lower frequency transmitter channel. That transmitter provides the .3&.4 sub-channels. If they did not anticipate the out of sequence situation, they may have assumed that there is no .1 or .2 sub-channel. I am not saying they should not have tried the other transmitter, but I have some sympathy for such a mistake. As I said, I didn't even consider the possibility of multiple transmitters sharing a single display channel. I don't think the ATSC standard provide a lot of guidance on the issue.

So now you may wonder where I am going with this. The Twin Cities people seem to be able to reliably schedule recording by using the physical channel number and the desired sub-channel number that is on that physical channel.

I theorize that, in some cases, the cable situation may be similar. In fact, for some, it may be the Twin Cities situation on steroids. I believe that cable channels occupy the same amount of spectrum as an OTA channel. I have seen people reporting large numbers of sub-channels. I would expect a physical channel with 6 or more sub-channels, even SD ones, to be unwatchable. I suspect that when someone reports 10 sub-channels, those sub-channels must be spread over several physical channels. This would create even more chances for confusion, or mistakes. Also the DVDR tuners, can only get mapping information from the examination of the information in the broadcast data stream. A cable box may even be able to to get information from data streams outside the actual channel content. That could allow them to work with PSIP information that is not accurate.

Now to the poster's question. It may be possible to tune the intended station, if you can find out the physical channel used and the sub-channel number used in that data stream. That would allow you to bypass the translation process, like the Twin Cities OTA people can do. I don't know how to get that info, but maybe someone in the local forum that discusses your local cable channels can provide the information. (The cable company could provide the info, but based on what I am seeing posted, I would not hold my breath wating for them to help out a customer trying to use equipment that is not leased from the cable company.) I know that a couple of people in the Denver OTA forum have tuners that allow them to share this sort of info for OTA stations.

There may be problems doing this for cable, that don't occur in OTA. For OTA, if a station uses display 6 and physical 18, like KRMA, I can tune sub-channel 3 as 6-3 or 18-3, as long as display 6 was found by the scan and there was no entry created for display 18 by a scan. I generally don't have to worry that there will have been an 18 found by the scan. There should not be a display 18 in our area. KRMA is the only station that ever had any rights to that number, although they still use their old NTSC analog station number as there display number, as is the standard.

If this were cable, I suspect you could have a situation like display 6 on physical 18, and display 18 on physical 22. If display 18 was in the DVDR table, then you would not be able to tune physical 18 since you would get re-directed to 22. In that case, you would have to manually delete 18 and tune it using 22. But, 22 could also be an active display channel, and you would have to work around that. In the end, you might have to wipe out much or all of the DVDR digital channel list, and schedule almost everything by physical channels and the sub-channel numbers found on them.

I may be all wet on this, and I have no inside information on how cable systems are configured or experience with one, but I thought I would share my theory anyway.
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post #7577 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 03:25 PM
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I saw someone else had an E2 error.

I got a 3576 last summer, which I paid DEARLY for ($400) because at the time I knew they were no longer in production, and hadn't yet found the 2160A. I waited to return it due to the 2160A burning problem (since solved) and the 20% fee the guy wanted.

So I just plugged it in, and on the 3rd recording, it freezes with an E2 error, then again further in the recording. It seemed like bad sectors on the hard drive, and when I try the same points, same error. It does at least allow power off after a couple of minutes.

I've kept the recording to "protect" the bad sectors, if that is correct. But is it more than that? Should I try to return the unit, even though 6 months have passed and it's from someone who wanted $400, so all I could do is ruin his Amazon score, but probably not get my money back.
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post #7578 of 26015 Old 11-23-2009, 03:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by relentlesscactus View Post

I saw someone else had an E2 error.

I got a 3576 last summer, which I paid DEARLY for ($400) because at the time I knew they were no longer in production, and hadn't yet found the 2160A. I waited to return it due to the 2160A burning problem (since solved) and the 20% fee the guy wanted.

So I just plugged it in, and on the 3rd recording, it freezes with an E2 error, then again further in the recording. It seemed like bad sectors on the hard drive, and when I try the same points, same error. It does at least allow power off after a couple of minutes.

I've kept the recording to "protect" the bad sectors, if that is correct. But is it more than that? Should I try to return the unit, even though 6 months have passed and it's from someone who wanted $400, so all I could do is ruin his Amazon score, but probably not get my money back.

If you don't have a lot of rec titles you can't offload, I'd do a SKIP 079 Self-Check to test cables/comm., then maybe a SKIP 013 to check the HDD.

I never saw an E2 with my refur'd 3575 with "sort-of-bad" HDD that apparently had some "glitches" on the HDD at the beginning of the drive write area... my first 2 or 3 recordings of 2-hr-SP shows would skip and freeze on playback. By the 3rd or 4th show,with 1 and 2 still n the HDD, playback went back to normal.

I couldn't do a SKIP 079 and a SKIP 013 threw a "NG" on the initial media surface scan.

So, I kept adding 2-hr shows until there were 30 or so of them, with only ~5.5 hours free space. I recenlty deleted all titles on the HDD with the HDD Menu, recorded 2 more nights of shows and those played back without any problems.

All this to say it might clear on its own if the problem is just some bad sectors?
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post #7579 of 26015 Old 11-24-2009, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Possibly Significant Finding for Cable Subs, Esp. Comcast

I've been helping a new member with a 2-yr-old 3575 and Comcast cable get his digital channels back after two "realignments"... one in October and one Nov 19th.

Comcast ended up sending him four analog channels that are duplicated in his digitals, 2.1/4.1/5.1/7.1. He tried the All-or-Nothing (AON) Procedure a couple of times and, each time, his digitals would be auto-changed to "Delete" after his power cycle to check results.

I told him about the "analog interference" some 3575's exhibited in cable systems (altho his was rock solid for the past 2 years). I thought the analog/digital duplication might be a possible explanation.

So, I asked him to FIRST change all his analog channels to Delete, do a normal AON power cycle, THEN do a separate AON for digitals... and that worked right away! He had thought he would be forced to use Comcast's free box but says now he's "gold" again with just the 3575. He promised to let me know if anything changes!

?A key finding in this?: He says he now has 2.1/4.1/5.1/7.1 in CH+/- button memory but they're BLANK... actually "blue screen"! WOW... evidence of analog-digital interaction for sure and maybe even proof of "analog interference"?

So, no analogs to "feed" the duplicated digitals?... meaning they're sending analogs but just duplicating them on "digital" channels for digital subs, as well as leaving them in the analog channel group for basic subs? Sounds like when he selects one of the duplicated digitals, it "bounces" to an analog but that channel's no longer in CH+/- button memory, so the bounce fails... or it won't tune at that analog frequency... or it "interferes" somehow... ? Interesting.

I told him he *could* probably add back the NON-duplicated analogs and, if feeling really brave, add those duplicated analogs in a separate test so we knew if the problem stems from ANY analogs or just from duplicated ones.

However, he didn't want to lose what he gained back... very understandable since he'd been working on this since October, then found this site. I reminded him that he didn't need the analogs anyway since he could still tune them directly or set them in a timer rec program if/when neeeded... they just won't be in CH+/- button memory so they're not "surfable"... good enough for him!

I changed the top "Notice" in the Scanning help file to describe a "MODIFIED AON PROCEDURE" for people who might also keep losing digital channel tuning, esp. in Comcast systems, and referred to it again in the AON Procedure steps so it shouldn't be missed.

UPDATE 11/24/09: He timer recorded a show on one of his analog channels that were on "Delete" and, apparently, just tuning the analog and recording from it changed all his digitals back to "Delete."

I've asked him if he'd do another test to see if he can duplicate this phenomenon so we know if, in fact, you have to stay away from a duplicated analog or ALL analogs, whether just tuning them manually also causes the problem, etc.

As a followup to the above, here is an example. Most of our local network channels (but NOT all of them) are now duplicated as below:

NET/PRIMARY/ALTERNATE
NBC/ 4.1/ 108.1
FOX/ 5.1/ 105.1
ABC/ 7.1/ 103.1
MNTV/ 20.1/ 106.1
ION/ 17.1/ 58.1

If I set a timer program for the NASCAR race, for example, on ABC at 7.1, the 3575 tuner not only fails to record but knocks out the digital channels with all going to 'blue screen' and into 'delete' status. I learned this the hard way by missing a race last month. After testing it, I set it up the following week to record from 103.1 and was viewing FOX News on 82.8 at the time the recording was scheduled, so I saw the tuner switch 82.8>103.1>7.1.

So, as long as I program everything for the upper digital tier, it records properly and retains channels. You will notice in the above chart, neither CBS nor CW are represented. We can WATCH them both in HD on 9.1 and 50.1 on our Panny HDTV but cannot record or view them through the 3575's tuner. Both of the nets are still available on analog, so far.

I no longer use this machine for any analog recordings, as we have plenty of others that still work for analog locals.
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post #7580 of 26015 Old 11-24-2009, 08:07 PM
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Some of you might have noticed that in the last couple of weeks, I purchased and returned 2 brand new H2160MW9A units, from WalMart. After reading such glowing reports about the 2160, I decided to try just one more time. So, last weekend I ordered a refurb unit thru J&R.

The unit arrived a couple of hours ago, and I am enjoying it at this moment! So far, everything works, including the self-checks which I was not able to enter on the other two units. Everything I have tried to set-up has been successful so far, and I just programmed it to record a program.

Thanks to all for the encouragement and tips as I tried to figure out what was going on with the other two units before I returned them to WalMart. I was really starting to get a complex! Hopefully the two units I returned will be refurbished and repaired/adjusted to operate properly.

The unit I just received was built originally in June of 2009, and refurbished in October. The HDD information shows 2 hours of "ON" time. The only problem I noticed was that the coax cable had its pin bent so that when attempting to insert it into the antenna socket, the signal would be completely shorted out. Perhaps the original owner wasn't aware of that, and returned the unit as inoperative.

I am a happy camper, finally! Now to learn how to use the unit, and enjoy it!

Dave
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post #7581 of 26015 Old 11-24-2009, 09:59 PM
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Newest fun and games.

I've had to rescan three times over the last two days, both with my Maggies and my RCA QAM television.

A few, but not all channels, suddenly weren't there any more, but were back after the rescan, same channel number in each case.

It's as if they're slightly altering the exact frequency of the channel or something.

Worst part is it includes some OTAs.

I'm hoping this is just a temporary thing and they'll finally settle down and stay put. Maybe this is something to do with the new lineup.

Additional interesting point-

On my RCA television, I checked on the two locals that are sharing channel numbers with Weather Channel and C-Span.

Get this... The Fox affilate is there as ".1", and Weather Channel comes up as ".2", with all the channels with that number on my Maggie also coming up, but all off by one subchannel number.

The Spanish language channel? WHOLE 'NOTHER matter.

The OTA is nowhere to be found, and C-Span is ".1" on that channel set. I haven't compared the two lists yet, but I'm going to guess in that case the channels will be exactly the same numbers on the TV and on the Maggies.

Found one other oddity...

We get the 4x3 versions of each local up towards the end of the channel lineup on the Maggies. Only got one on the TV the other day on the original scan. It was up in the 200s, with the final two digits of the main channel number being the channel's OTA channel number, followed by ".1".

None of the other channels showed up.

Today's rescan ended up with NONE of the 4x3 locals at all.

The TV is at the end of the longest cable run in the house, and I'm thinking about getting a 25 foot coaxial cable and connecting it to the line in the bedroom, then trying a rescan. (The "real" cable run is broken at two points including a wall jack. I figure a single piece of cable MIGHT help.)

Watch-

I'll get all this straightened out, and the QAMs will go dark.
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post #7582 of 26015 Old 11-24-2009, 10:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveFinton View Post

Some of you might have noticed that in the last couple of weeks, I purchased and returned 2 brand new H2160MW9A units, from WalMart. After reading such glowing reports about the 2160, I decided to try just one more time. So, last weekend I ordered a refurb unit thru J&R.

The unit arrived a couple of hours ago, and I am enjoying it at this moment! So far, everything works, including the self-checks which I was not able to enter on the other two units. Everything I have tried to set-up has been successful so far, and I just programmed it to record a program.

Thanks to all for the encouragement and tips as I tried to figure out what was going on with the other two units before I returned them to WalMart. I was really starting to get a complex! Hopefully the two units I returned will be refurbished and repaired/adjusted to operate properly.

The unit I just received was built originally in June of 2009, and refurbished in October. The HDD information shows 2 hours of "ON" time. The only problem I noticed was that the coax cable had its pin bent so that when attempting to insert it into the antenna socket, the signal would be completely shorted out. Perhaps the original owner wasn't aware of that, and returned the unit as inoperative.

I am a happy camper, finally! Now to learn how to use the unit, and enjoy it!

Dave


Dave, you just got burned a couple times, that's all. I've got three of the Maggies. An 80GB version (refurb), the original 2160 (refurb) and a 2160A.

Except for the new problems with my cable provider and that weird thing on the "A" machine the other day (somehow switched to military time with no menu control to go back, fixed by a hard reboot) these three machines are even better than the two Philips versions I have.

Yes. Learn to use and enjoy!!!!
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post #7583 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 05:35 AM
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gastrof

Not sure from your comments if you have a drop amp in your 25' cable run. I put one in before a 30' run and it opened up a bunch of QAM channels on the 2160A.

Doug
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post #7584 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 06:58 AM
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gastrof

Not sure from your comments if you have a drop amp in your 25' cable run. I put one in before a 30' run and it opened up a bunch of QAM channels on the 2160A.
Doug

What is a "drop amp", please? I would like nothing more than to get more clear QAM. Right now I only get the major networks, PBS, and a few low buget local channels. Thanks...
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post #7585 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 08:12 AM
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Hi I cannot try a drive swap out until I return to the States in December as my other unit is located in Florida and I am in Providenciales, in the Turks & Caicos Islands just South East of the Bahamas. First thought was to try a swap out when I get there on Dec 15. I have checked and re-checked the drive cables and they all fit singly in their holders having only been removed by pulling straight out. Cheers!
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post #7586 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 08:14 AM
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I have checked and re-checked the drive cables and they all fit singly in their holders having only been removed by pulling straight out. I cannot get past SKIP 079 it just states HDD NOT FOUND. If I try SKIP 013 it just stalls on the first test HDD Media Check and then reverts to System Error Please power off SE2

The drive is a Western Digital WD1600AVBB which I assume is a PATA. If I purchase a new one will the firm ware recognize this and allow me to format just by installing the new drive?

Thanks again for your input.
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post #7587 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 08:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainUSA View Post

I have checked and re-checked the drive cables and they all fit singly in their holders having only been removed by pulling straight out. I cannot get past SKIP 079 it just states HDD NOT FOUND. If I try SKIP 013 it just stalls on the first test HDD Media Check and then reverts to System Error Please power off SE2

The drive is a Western Digital WD1600AVBB which I assume is a PATA. If I purchase a new one will the firm ware recognize this and allow me to format just by installing the new drive?

Thanks again for your input.

Yes, the FW will put the reqd HDD FW on a new drive so it can be read by any other 3575, 3576 and probably 2080 or 2160 without reformatting, i.e., all titles intact. The 3575/3576 interchange has been proved by Auskck's HDD Farm, but a 3575-6/2160 i/c hasn't been "proved in practice" yet but theoretically a "slam-dunk"?

I'm thinking your existing drive is OK except for whatever attaching it to your computer might have done to it (not a good idea). I'm wondering if you could format that drive in your computer as FAT32, maybe the 3575 would recognize it again and format it with SKIP 079.

I think FAT32 is correct but maybe others who have done a HDD formatting on a computer could verify?

If you end up getting a new drive, check the SKIP 079 file for recommended drives and, if WD, make sure it's one of the "AV" models like the OEM original.
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post #7588 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 12:20 PM
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Now that I have a 2160A that seems to be working correctly, I have a question ...

If I have been viewing an analog channel prior to power-down, I get a problem when I re-start it: The video appears, I get a momentary "LOAD" message in the display, and then the video disappears (audio stays ON with a light blue screen). The video cycles back on and then off a couple of times, and then the unit locks up completely - front panel switches and the remote are inoperative. This requires a master reset to get functions working again.

However, when I first apply power, if I quickly switch the DTV/TV button to DTV ("LOAD" message still appears) and allow a digital channel to appear, I can then switch back to TV (analog?) and the video is normal.

If I have been viewing a digital channel prior to shut-down, this does not happen.

Do I have something set incorrectly? I'm connected directly to Comcast cable - no Set Top Box. Everything else appears to be functioning nicely!

Thanks in advance for any ideas!

Dave
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post #7589 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 12:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveFinton View Post

Now that I have a 2160A that seems to be working correctly, I have a question ...

If I have been viewing an analog channel prior to power-down, I get a problem when I re-start it: The video appears, I get a momentary "LOAD" message in the display, and then the video disappears (audio stays ON with a light blue screen). The video cycles back on and then off a couple of times, and then the unit locks up completely - front panel switches and the remote are inoperative. This requires a master reset to get functions working again.

However, when I first apply power, if I quickly switch the DTV/TV button to DTV ("LOAD" message still appears) and allow a digital channel to appear, I can then switch back to TV (analog?) and the video is normal.

If I have been viewing a digital channel prior to shut-down, this does not happen.

Do I have something set incorrectly? I'm connected directly to Comcast cable - no Set Top Box. Everything else appears to be functioning nicely!

Thanks in advance for any ideas!

I'm working with a 3575 user on Comcast w/no box with a similar problem that *might* apply to you?

After 2-years of no tuning problems with his 3575, he lost ALL his digitals after two channel "realignments." So far, we've "pinpointed" the problem to be 4 analog channels that are DUPLICATED in the digital realm... e.g., he has both an analog 4 and a digital 4.1 (plus 3 others).

HDTVs with combo tuners have no problem differentiating between analog and digital channels in the same main ch# sequence, but apparently our hybrid (switched) tuners don't like Comcast's "enhanced channel realignment for increased customer enjoyment."

I advised him to Delete ALL his analogs, which allowed him to do a MODIFIED All-or-Nothing Manual Channel Preset for digital channels, which got the digitals back and stable.

However, if he does a timer rec from his analog 4 (possible even if not in CH+/- memory), it worked once in the a.m. That left the 3575 on analog 4. He then checked the recording and left it on a digital channel for another timer rec that night on analog 4... after which, ALL of his channels, both analog and digital, were auto-Deleted (no longer in CH+/- memory).

We're still testing (when he gets more time) but it appears that with Comcasts' new "customer enhancements" have duplicated channels in the analog and digital realms (prob. just sending one channel and splitting it somehow to both analog and digital customers), and GOING TO AN ANLOG CHANNEL CAN CAUSE DIGITAL CHANNEL LOSS.

That may occur ONLY if using one of the duplicated analogs, OR it might happen if you use either the dup. analog or digital, but that's what he's going to test for later... to see if it's JUST a duplicated analog or ANY analog.
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post #7590 of 26015 Old 11-25-2009, 02:06 PM
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Posted also in the Maggy's thread: As of today at 12:50pm pst J&R have one Philips DVDR3576H-RB DVD Recorder w/ 160GB Hard Drive for $229 refurbished.
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