Magnavox 557, 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 316 - AVS Forum
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post #9451 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 03:09 PM
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I'm pretty sure you can still use an HD box with a standard tv if you have the right kinds of connection options that make the two compatible. Kind of overkill, but you would not need to replace the existing TVs (can't blame you for that reasoning!) and it might give you the ability to do timed recordings. ALso, you could go out from the STB to a maggie 2160, then from there to the tv ....
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post #9452 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gastrof View Post

The cable box shouldn't be expected to "control" a VCR/DVR, but according to a certain individual who posts here and elsewhere, Comcast boxes can be set to tune to a certain show at a certain time. This, along with a recorder's own timer, would allow for time-shifting that includes multiple channels during the same unattended period. (The timers on the two boxes would work alongside each other.)

As you've pointed out, however, not all Comcast boxes will change channels in the manner the guy described. I've tried it on mine (he claims the "reminder" feature achieves this), and all it does it produce an onscreen reminder that YOU have to change the channel yourself.

Oddly enough, my Maggie ignores this onscreen reminder, and waits for me to change the channel on the cable box. Funny, huh?

Two solutions-
1) Split your cable feed, and send one thru the box, the other directly to the Magnavox/Philips recorder. Feed the cable box into the recorder thru the A/V inputs. This will allow you to record unscrambled channels using the recorder's own tuner, and any channel the cable box is left on, by setting the recorder's timer to record from the A/V inputs. Leave the cable box on the scrambled channel you wanted to record.
2) Get an old Series 1 TiVo that will record without the TiVo service, and hook it up to your cable box, using the TiVo's IR blaster to change channels. Hook one of its set of A/V outputs to your Magnavox/Philips recorder's A/V inputs. Use the timers on both the TiVo and the Magnavox/Philips boxes, allowing the two recorders to work in tandem. You'll have two recordings of the show, but one will be on the machine with the DVD burner. (You could also split the cable feed as described in #1 above, allowing your Magnavox/Philips to still use its own tuner on unscrambled channels, which will produce a slightly better picture.)

Sorry to expand on the Tivo talk, but would a series 1 be a good alternative to the Magnavox if dvd recording and OTA weren't concerns? I downgraded to limited basic cable a couple of months ago so it isn't a current issue, but at some point hope to upgrade back to the expanded tier, or economy if it's ever offered here. It bugs me that my Magnavox's functionality will be limited with the higher channels.
A series 1 Tivo would work like a bare bones dvr with no subscription fee but with an IR blaster to control the Comcast DTA, right? And adding a second DTA would allow you to watch one channel while recording another? I guess you wouldn't be able to title programs but maybe I could live with that. Would this be a better solution than buying a second Magnavox 2160?
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post #9453 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by atti View Post

I guess you wouldn't be able to title programs but maybe I could live with that. Would this be a better solution than buying a second Magnavox 2160?

Could you elaborate on this? I can place a program name on anything recorded to the hard drive on the H2160. I usually leave the date & time intact but overwrite the channel number. Do you mean title names on the Tivo?
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post #9454 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 04:42 PM
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Yes, I meant you can't title programs (I'm guessing) on a Tivo without a subscription. Sorry that wasn't clear.
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post #9455 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

IMPORTANT NOTES

2. Some people, incl. Me, have noticed their H2160/a doesn't start AR immediately on startup...

The first day I was using my H2160/A, I noticed that AR was starting automatically (working correctly)...

But the next day, it wouldn't start automatically...
I had to change channels to get it to start...

So... I did some backtracking...
and found that AR starts automatically for me when there is a DVD in the tray when the unit is powered on...

For me, by leaving a DVD in the tray all the time (An H2160/A erased DVD+RW), AR works as it should when the 2160A is powered on...

Can someone out there test my theory???

If AR doesn't start automatically for you...
  1. Make sure you're in HDD mode...
  2. Place a DVD in the tray...
  3. close the tray...
  4. power off...
  5. wait 20 seconds for proper shutdown...
  6. power on...
  7. wait 20 seconds for proper startup...
  8. press PAUSE...
and see if AR is starting correctly...

Thanks...

I'm like a beaver...
A hot little beaver...
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post #9456 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 07:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timtofly View Post

My apologies for highjacking the Maggie thread with 2 Tivo commercials.

Don't worry - happens all the time in the DTVPal DVR thread - because so may are complaining about their Pal's and looking for something that actually works.
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post #9457 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

Don't worry - happens all the time in the DTVPal DVR thread - because so may are complaining about their Pal's and looking for something that actually works.

That's bulls**t.
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post #9458 of 25743 Old 05-27-2010, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Chuck44 View Post

That's bulls**t.

Let me re-phrase that then:

"- because so many are complaining about their Pals's, and others looking for a DVR that are coming into the thread are looking for something that's more reliable".
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post #9459 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 05:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bizarro_Stormy View Post

The first day I was using my H2160/A, I noticed that AR was starting automatically (working correctly)...

But the next day, it wouldn't start automatically...
I had to change channels to get it to start...

So... I did some backtracking...
and found that AR starts automatically for me when there is a DVD in the tray when the unit is powered on...

For me, by leaving a DVD in the tray all the time (An H2160/A erased DVD+RW), AR works as it should when the 2160A is powered on...

Can someone out there test my theory???

If AR doesn't start automatically for you...
Thanks...

Say, you don't happen to have a method to keep the drive from spinning unless recording or playing from the hard drive? Now that would be a nice energy saving feature. [just musing]
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post #9460 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atti View Post

Sorry to expand on the Tivo talk, but would a series 1 be a good alternative to the Magnavox if dvd recording and OTA weren't concerns? I downgraded to limited basic cable a couple of months ago so it isn't a current issue, but at some point hope to upgrade back to the expanded tier, or economy if it's ever offered here. It bugs me that my Magnavox's functionality will be limited with the higher channels.
A series 1 Tivo would work like a bare bones dvr with no subscription fee but with an IR blaster to control the Comcast DTA, right? And adding a second DTA would allow you to watch one channel while recording another? I guess you wouldn't be able to title programs but maybe I could live with that. Would this be a better solution than buying a second Magnavox 2160?

I cannot directly answer a question about a series one Tivo, since I do not own one. I have 3 Pioneer Tivos (some say that I am lucky that they are still working) These allow you to record to DVD without a subscription to tivo. While I cannot edit the recordings like you can on a Maggie, I can (if I wanted) record from them to a maggie in real time if I needed to do any editing. They do control the DTA just nicely although at the beginning of the recording you can see the channel numbers changing. You can use the blaster or there is a Direct cable that can be used also. The programming guide list programs coming up 3 days in the future and if you have cable internet it will download the information daily and even gives updated show changes for some of the network cable channels. It also lets me know everytime Comcast rearranges its channel lineup.
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post #9461 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timtofly View Post

I am curious if someone who is paying for a premium digital plan through comcast, can they "tune" in with the Maggie the channels that others have been loosing?

If that is the case then Comcast can block content based on the customers account via software. Your decision would be to either upgrade your account or rent seperate DTA's for each channel you wanted to record and hook them up to a Maggie.

While I pay for premium service with the Comcast HD DVR the remaining QAM tuners in my house only get local digital channels via cable.
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post #9462 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 09:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Say, you don't happen to have a method to keep the drive from spinning unless recording or playing from the hard drive? Now that would be a nice energy saving feature. [just musing]

Set it on Source L3 (DV).
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post #9463 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by JimLely View Post

While I pay for premium service with the Comcast HD DVR the remaining QAM tuners in my house only get local digital channels via cable.

Thank You for the response.

What we need then are "tru2way" (or whatever they are labelled) ie 2way IP enabled recorders that at least allow us the channels we pay for, but then again that would be third party "consumer" STB's that will still only record for one time veiwing and they will never let us put things on DVD.
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post #9464 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Set it on Source L3 (DV).

I know, I know. It was a subtle joke. Now, if the new 513 had a power saver mode that would turn off the HDD after a few minutes, that would be nice. It's been how long now and still just your review. That doesn't bode well for sales. Or maybe it means that since it works right out of the box that there are now no complaints. Either way, have a nice day.
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post #9465 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimLely View Post

While I pay for premium service with the Comcast HD DVR the remaining QAM tuners in my house only get local digital channels via cable.

In the "olden" days, cable would be sent to a central point for local distribution. If you didn't pay for premium channels Comcast would install a "notch filter" to block the sync signal for your HBO or other premium channel. Now they simply send a signal to your "box" to let you receive (unscramble) the content. They can also ask the box if it's working, and perhaps other questions. Great for the marketing department.

I still get 70+ analog channels, like ESPN, and the same channels come though in SD. I'll bet, since they (not Comcast) keep saying they will be going "all digital", that when that happens I will need a "box" to get anything except locals. I may need a box for them too, since the DTA will be free. But this is a discussion for a different thread.
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post #9466 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

I still get 70+ analog channels, like ESPN, and the same channels come though in SD. I'll bet, since they (not Comcast) keep saying they will be going "all digital", that when that happens I will need a "box" to get anything except locals. I may need a box for them too, since the DTA will be free. But this is a discussion for a different thread.

A quick note on this... once your provider goes all digital, you'll most likely be offered a free STB, and possibly a couple of DTAs. This is Comcast's offering. You'll need a STB for your cable channels, and this can play absolute havoc with the H2160 series versatility and convenience. The wonderful days of analog which allowed programming the Maggie for a number of timer recordings on different cable channels are over - at least for me, with the exception of the locals which are delivered in clear QAM. Everything else is encrypted. With my Comcast STB, I can only record what I'm watching in real time, unless I want to complicate matters with multiple STBs or DTAs.
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post #9467 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Colloquor View Post

A quick note on this... once your provider goes all digital, you'll most likely be offered a free STB, and possibly a couple of DTAs. This is Comcast's offering. You'll need a STB for your cable channels, and this can play absolute havoc with the H2160 series versatility and convenience. The wonderful days of analog which allowed programming the Maggie for a number of timer recordings on different cable channels are over - at least for me, with the exception of the locals which are delivered in clear QAM. Everything else is encrypted. With my Comcast STB, I can only record what I'm watching in real time, unless I want to complicate matters with multiple STBs or DTAs.

Complexity doesn't bother me. I have so much stuff now it's embarassing. The H2150 is very convenient. I have a DTA that was mailed to me last year but I've never opened the box. My biggest fear? Today I saw on my cable company's web site that they now offer i-Guide. That's one step closer to scrambling basic cable and leaving me with only local in the clear. On the brighter side, somebody is laying a lot of cable on the state roads around my borough. It's not power. I hope it's FiOS. I would just like a choice. Any choice really.

Ouch! They just posted June 1 for dropping all analog basic cable. They are not going to scramble the digital channels. Next week will be interesting.
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post #9468 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bizarro_Stormy View Post

The first day I was using my H2160/A, I noticed that AR was starting automatically (working correctly)...

But the next day, it wouldn't start automatically...
I had to change channels to get it to start...

So... I did some backtracking...
and found that AR starts automatically for me when there is a DVD in the tray when the unit is powered on...

For me, by leaving a DVD in the tray all the time (An H2160/A erased DVD+RW), AR works as it should when the 2160A is powered on...

Can someone out there test my theory???

If AR doesn't start automatically for you...
  1. Make sure you're in HDD mode...
  2. Place a DVD in the tray...
  3. close the tray...
  4. power off...
  5. wait 20 seconds for proper shutdown...
  6. power on...
  7. wait 20 seconds for proper startup...
  8. press PAUSE...
and see if AR is starting correctly...

Thanks...

Yep, AR starts. I put an erased DVD+RW and AR starts. I had a CD out there too so I re-tested using the CD and the AR starts, the CD has a bin file on it for another device and I get an error pop up about it being unplayable. With the CD I can hear it seeking.

Ok, blank DVD+R and AR starts, it seeks once, AR starts. I didn't try a blank DVD-R.
Blank CD, spoooky! Spins up, clunk clock clunk clock bizzzzz, AR didn't start so I ejected it for fear of breaking the drive.

So, blank DVD+R or a cd with data, non playable data and you get an error pop up. Take your pick. I would rather they pop out another firmware with the correct DVD drive check.
Oh, my firmware is whatever with a 5 on the end and this is a 2160A from Walmart online.


Thor
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post #9469 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

Don't worry - happens all the time in the DTVPal DVR thread - because so may are complaining about their Pal's and looking for something that actually works.

I digress too, but not BS, i agree....
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post #9470 of 25743 Old 05-28-2010, 08:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Thanks for posting this. I hadn't heard of anyone finding "deep" subchannels w/o either a "Scrambled" or tunable XX.1 since Beekeeper posted a couple of years ago that his machine did.

I've now changed the intro to the AON Proecdure to add a 2nd bulleted "Important Note" as follows:
...

Wajo, I realized I needed to clarify something. I reported earlier I received 87.9 HSN, 87.10 QVC, and 89.3 NECN (and other deep channels) on my INITIAL scan with no other station at 87.1 and 89.1. Actually, in all cases where I got deep channels on the initial scan, the xx.1 channel was a scrambled channel. All subsequent Auto scans, AON procedures, and manual scans, have reveled no additional channels anywhere to be found. Does this slight additional detail change anything in your revised AON procedure?

So, for me, the "Auto" scan find every available channel, without exception. For me, no need for AON, because, as you indicate in your revised AON procedure, "deep subchannels can't hide from" me. However, if this was pre-SDV, I suspect it might have been different.
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post #9471 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 03:45 AM
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Ouch! They just posted June 1 for dropping all analog basic cable. They are not going to scramble the digital channels. Next week will be interesting.

in our area it was approx. 6 months after dropping analog that they scrambled the digital except locals
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post #9472 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 04:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Mac View Post

in our area it was approx. 6 months after dropping analog that they scrambled the digital except locals


What's your cable co?
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post #9473 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 04:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVS_MA View Post

Wajo, I realized I needed to clarify something. I reported earlier I received 87.9 HSN, 87.10 QVC, and 89.3 NECN (and other deep channels) on my INITIAL scan with no other station at 87.1 and 89.1. Actually, in all cases where I got deep channels on the initial scan, the xx.1 channel was a scrambled channel. All subsequent Auto scans, AON procedures, and manual scans, have reveled no additional channels anywhere to be found. Does this slight additional detail change anything in your revised AON procedure?

So, for me, the "Auto" scan find every available channel, without exception. For me, no need for AON, because, as you indicate in your revised AON procedure, "deep subchannels can't hide from" me. However, if this was pre-SDV, I suspect it might have been different.

Actually, I think it does change things because the old 3575/3576 units would normally NOT find any deep subchannels if the Auto scan couldn't find or enter an XX.1 in CH+/- memory... the scan would skip that group entirely.

I think your experience shows that at least one 2160, with later FW, might treat a "Scrambled" XX.1 differently... it CAN find deep subchannels if XX.1 is Scrambled.

Without getting more complicated by mentioning the possible diff. between early 357x units and newer 2160 units, I revised the 2nd bulleted note to cover the subject like this:
  • One Reason this AON procedure might not be needed. You don't need to do an AON procedure if you've done ONLY Auto Channel Presets WITHOUT ANY MANUAL ADDITIONS and your DVDR finds deep subchannels even tho XX.1 shows as "Scrambled" or you can surf with CH+/- directly to a "deep" subchannel like 89.3 or 89.13 w/o FIRST stopping on 89.1. If so, you've got the exceptional cable/DVDR system that can find deep subchannels w/o a viewable XX.1 major channel... deep subchannels can't hide from you!
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post #9474 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Actually, I think it does change things because the old 3575/3576 units would normally NOT find any deep subchannels if the Auto scan couldn't find or enter an XX.1 in CH+/- memory... the scan would skip that group entirely.

I think your experience shows that at least one 2160, with later FW, might treat a "Scrambled" XX.1 differently... it CAN find deep subchannels if XX.1 is Scrambled.

Without getting more complicated by mentioning the possible diff. between early 357x units and newer 2160 units, I revised the 2nd bulleted note to cover the subject like this:
  • One Reason this AON procedure might not be needed. You don't need to do an AON procedure if you've done ONLY Auto Channel Presets WITHOUT ANY MANUAL ADDITIONS and your DVDR finds deep subchannels even tho XX.1 shows as "Scrambled" or you can surf with CH+/- directly to a "deep" subchannel like 89.3 or 89.13 w/o FIRST stopping on 89.1. If so, you've got the exceptional cable/DVDR system that can find deep subchannels w/o a viewable XX.1 major channel... deep subchannels can't hide from you!

Any chance you could add a note that sometimes if the .1 channel is "scrambled", the remaining sub-channels could be moved up by one? I think it's just me, but it never hurts to ask.
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post #9475 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 07:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Any chance you could add a note that sometimes if the .1 channel is "scrambled", the remaining sub-channels could be moved up by one? I think it's just me, but it never hurts to ask.

Not sure I understand the "moved up" concept? Channels won't "move" depending on what's in XX.1. A "Scrambled" channel in XX.1 is a viable, independent channel, but it's one our DVDRs can't tune and display by itself.
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post #9476 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Not sure I understand the "moved up" concept? Channels won't "move" depending on what's in XX.1. A "Scrambled" channel in XX.1 is a viable, independent channel, but it's one our DVDRs can't tune and display by itself.

I do notice, though, that the number on tv for channel (for example 5.1) is one up on the 2160 sometimes -- the other nite I hurriedly set the recorder for 5.1, but got blank air, cause I forgot that on the 2160A, Fox channel 5 comes in at 5.12 . The weird thing is, if you go up one channel up after 5.12, it goes to 5.1 (after a brief flash of 20, another station) it tunes in what I believe is the "SD" version, but it didn't record by timer -- 5.1 does record if you click the record button 'live' and you can watch it on the 2160, but you cannot pre-set it to that number.

Could that be similar to the 'move up by one' reference in the earlier post? Defective 'channel' identification ?
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post #9477 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thor__ View Post

I put an erased dvd+rw and ar starts...
Blank dvd+r and ar starts...

I would rather they pop out another firmware with the correct dvd drive check.

Oh, my firmware is whatever with a 5 on the end and this is a 2160a from walmart online.

Thanks for checking out my theory Thor...

Maybe Wajo can update his AR facts with this info...

It would be nice if they actually fixed the firmware so AR worked as it was supposed to... I wouldn't hold my breath though ...

Mine's also a new Walmart online 2160A...

Manufacture date: November 2009
Successfully updated with the latest firmware...

I'm like a beaver...
A hot little beaver...
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post #9478 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 11:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bizarro_Stormy View Post

Thanks for checking out my theory Thor...

Maybe Wajo can update his AR facts with this info...

It would be nice if they actually fixed the firmware so AR worked as it was supposed to... I wouldn't hold my breath though ...

Mine's also a new Walmart online 2160A...

Manufacture date: November 2009
Successfully updated with the latest firmware...

I'll add a note on leaving a DVD in the tray, but I'd use a recorded and finalized DVD since leaving a blank will eventually use up the Power Calibration (PC) area of the disc, so the laser will be used to burn unnecessarily for the tests, and after many tests, the blank will be unusable.

Not a big deal since it takes many PC tests, but it seems a finalized disc should work just as well, with only bias/barely-on power used to check the disc status?

Someone needs to check out a finalized disc for this purpose.
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post #9479 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 12:17 PM
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Wondering if this is due to the firmware update, or if the symptoms existed before. I have a few machines that I have NOT updated, yet, since the AR is working ok on all ... It may be a glitch that was introduced later, since my machines are almost all about 6 months older than these... Currently I just finalize in batches, since I have to switch to L3 to do so. Admittedly it'd be easier to do it all at once, so I was tempted to update the firmware, but I don't want to lose the AR capability (without having to change channel to initiate it). I'd be interested to hear whether this AR problem existed before you updated the FW. Maybe I'll just sacrifice one to the cause, and use that to finalize everything...
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post #9480 of 25743 Old 05-29-2010, 12:38 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't think this is related to the FW update since my original 2160, and several other originals, also have sometimes-on and sometimes-off AR on startup, requiring a channel change to engage.
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