Magnavox 557, 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 358 - AVS Forum
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post #10711 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westly-C View Post

Here we go again...Comcast, right?
Having just been through this last week, you may want to try unscrewing the cable ou to the very edge letting it barely hang in, and rescan. I can't be 100% certain, but this did restore my missing QAMs. Don't suppose you have a tv with digital tuner you can check to see if those are still active?
Rescanning these days truly is turning out to be Russian roulette.

Time Warner.

Okay, I tried unscrewing the cable to the back of the 2160 and letting it hang by a thread. When doing this, the analog channels get fuzzy (but don't go out completely) which I believe is the desired effect. I tried entering the QAM channel numbers manually -- where they should be mapped -- and they did not return. I figure I should AT LEAST be able to get 66.1 (Fox) since it is still available on the other 2160 upstairs, but, sadly, I did not.

I do have a TV with digital tuner (downstairs only). Since hang-by-a-thread failed to help the missing digital channels, including Fox, on both the 2160 and the TV w/ digital tuner, I screwed the cable back in to the 2160 all the way and I'm running another full channel scan on both the DVDR and the HDTV...

Update: The 2160's channel scan got interrupted by a regularly scheduled recording (I forgot I had one coming up). On the plus side, the HDTV is currently showing 69 analog channels found and 10 digital (so far). I'll update again when the TV's finished.

Update2: The HDTV finished with 69 analog and 12 digital channels found. NBC (12.1), CBS (35.1) and Fox (66.1) have not moved channel assignments. ABC did move from 104.1 to 114.1. I'll have to wait another 1.25 hours for my scheduled recordings to finish up to see if I can get the 2160 to relock on these channels. I would REALLY REALLY like to get them back before football season. Those games record so much better in digital (widescreen).

Update3: Success! I simply rescanned with the 2160, and all digital channels are back again. They are all in the same locations as the HDTV (ABC moving to 114.1). I can't say, for sure, that I really did anything special. I did make sure to tighten the cable input to the 2160 with a wrench this time. Hopefully, I won't encounter this again anytime soon.
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post #10712 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorM View Post

I guess that puts this back in the hands of anyone feeling lucky.

ALTHOUGH, an easy test of this might be if someone who had two different models temporarily swapped the drives just to see if it functioned. Any takers?

Also, does anyone know if the 513 uses a drive faster than 8x?

The media recording speed is normally controlled by the units firmware (FW). While many DVD±R-RW drives are capable of recording at 12x and 16x, faster recording speeds tend to present problems, which may result in errors, making the disk unreadable (or what are often referred to as "coasters").

While 8x may seem slow, the amount of data transferred would be equivalent to a CD burner writing at 72x. (CD media is currently limited to a max 52x)


From the MDR513H user manual information, the "burn speed" of the 513H is the same as the H2160/H2160A.


ww
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post #10713 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 03:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelTownGuy View Post

Update2: The HDTV finished with 69 analog and 12 digital channels found. NBC (12.1), CBS (35.1) and Fox (66.1) have not moved channel assignments. ABC did move from 104.1 to 114.1. I'll have to wait another 1.25 hours for my scheduled recordings to finish up to see if I can get the 2160 to relock on these channels. I would REALLY REALLY like to get them back before football season. Those games record so much better in digital (widescreen).

Since attenuating the signal didn't seem to help, it sounds like you (and many others lately) are experiencing "tuning interference"?

See this help file for some info on that and ways to troubleshoot.

PHILIPS HD DVRs | MAG/PHILIPS SD DVDRs* | DVDR/DVR COMPARISONS | POST-DVDR OPTIONS
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post #10714 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 04:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Re: our Wish List for 234

I've added some of the "newly expressed" wishes into existing items in the list, and I've added 5 NEW items that were not already in the list in any form.

It's quite difficult to determine which posts on 9 pages added after the Wish List should be addressed either as already existing or new, so I could have EASILY missed an important Wish or two or mis-stated some.

Please click #3 in my sig. and see if there are Wishes not yet listed so it's as complete as possible for 234's use up to this point in time.

PHILIPS HD DVRs | MAG/PHILIPS SD DVDRs* | DVDR/DVR COMPARISONS | POST-DVDR OPTIONS
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post #10715 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 04:32 PM
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Looks to me like you've covered all the ideas that might be easily doable. Really hoping they add HD support and cable card, then maybe I could dump my box I've been forced to use and actually record some stuff directly and more things, rather then just the local channels with my HDTV card.
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post #10716 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by rdgcss View Post

technically a QAM tuner can tune an encrypted channel and pass it on, the rest of the system just can 't understand the data bits

What I wrote was [/i]Encrypted channels are "scrambled" so that a regular QAM tuner cannot tune them.[i]

Since "Display" is the end product of a "Tuner", a tuner which cannot display the contents of a channel cannot tune that channel.

- My STB tuners can display an encrypted QAM channel.
- My Funai tuners cannot display an encrypted channel.

There are several levels of functionality in a tuner, and although the ability to decrypt the contents is at a higher level than the low-level frequency lock, it has to exist to be a tuner. An analog tuner which cannot display the contents of a digital channel is in the same boat as a clear QAM tuner, it simply fails at a lower level of functionality.
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post #10717 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by wajo View Post

The copy-protection-in-commercials problem started in Sep 2008 and continued for some time after, and I haven't heard much about that problem lately.

JVC recorders were first to notice this problem and JVC engineering told their users that the CP was indeed in the commericals, but they didn't know why. It's possible that JVC might have helped stop this practice...

No such luck, just went to check my wife's machine and she has a half-dozen 'Doctors' broadcast by KTVU Oakland CA from December 2009 which have the No Copy icon. It's just luck that those are still around, because we were away last December and she is still catching up. I've seen it on other programs (not the Doctors) since then, but they have been deleted.
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post #10718 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by JimLely View Post

Could this explain the following problem with my wife's Magnavox TV: Comcast is my cable company and I live in Naples, FL. My wife's Magnavox 37MF231D LCD TV (with a clear QAM tuner) cannot pick up digital WGCU's (PBS) stations (3.1, 3.2, 3.3, 3.4), Fox's WFTX (4.4), CBS's WINK (5.5) and ? WXCW (6.6). All these stations are readily picked up by my other QAM-equipped TVs (Mitsubishi, Sharp and Vizio) and by an HDD recorder that has QAM tuner. She is able to pick up digital ABC (7.7) and NBC (2.2 and 2.3).

Yes.

If Comcast is not the worst offender it is certainly right up the top. You cannot even report that the PSIPs are corrupted, there is no such category on the trouble sheet, and good luck on finding a support person who has any concept of what a PSIP is. It's a case of "our network shows no problems, therefore there isn't one".
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post #10719 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by hollandboy View Post

...it shows you how the providers/channels are messing with the broadcasts.

What's the point of transferring to digital when the onscreen display is far worse than the analog?

Comcast squeezed up to 12 Expanded channels into a single analog band, so imagine the amount of compression that was applied. When a show was expanded onscreen with Zoom you could see the pixelation.

Have no idea what it is like now, because I switched to Direct TV as soon as Privacy Mode encryption was implemented. I do know Comcast returned the now-encrypted channels to their old frequencies in the 31-70 bands. Comcast could have left everything in Clear QAM because that band of channels is protected by the frequency trap but that would have taken away the excuse that encryption was done to prevent non-Expander subscribers from viewing those channels.

PSIPs are re-generated, programs are compressed, the list of manipulations goes on and on.
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post #10720 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by hollandboy View Post

Does the 'DMCA' specifically limit copying to 'volatile' media (HDD) and not to 'permanent' media (DVD)? If so, that means someone can still copy movies, broadcasts, etc. to their 2TB HDD, and just have that instead of putting it on DVDs! May not be a bad alternative to the 'copy-right' mess, especially if it also applies to copying HD (BD?) content to a HDD. Cost of HDD is almost a wash with equivalent DVD blanks.

That's the way I've been operating. Output from the TiVos (on satellite) are transferred by S-Video to the Funais. It keeps the TiVos clear, which is necessary because of the method used to schedule a recording. If titles are tagged with 'Keep Until I Delete" the sum of all scheduled recordings is added to the content currently recorded and if that exceeds recording capacity then titles forward in time are not scheduled. Unlike the Funais, there is no way to find out how much recording capacity remains.

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And if we could record (even only once) to BD HDD, here is the next best thing for Funai (you heard it here first 234). Offer a 500 GB HDD recorder with quick USB connect removable/replaceable HDD modules. Funai could sell the 500 GB HDD modules for around $50 (about equal to 100 DVDs @ regular price). It would reduce storage space, more convenient to handle, quicker access (instead of rifling though 100 DVDs), eliminate dubbing time to DVDs, and minimize the concern of degradation of DVD blanks, etc. etc.

It cannot be USB, that is considered a removable media, be it a stick or a hard drive.

However, you can buy eATA toasters which you can drop naked 3.5" and 2.5" drives into. Check out Search for the info needed. Funai 'could' add an eSATA connector to the back panel, just like the latest generation TiVos (which unfortunately require vendor-specific devices). Two issues here are that it would add cost, one SATA port for in-the-box and one for outside. It would also raise the specter of how recordings are divided between the two. If concatenated (the easiest solution) then one drive failure would take out ALL the titles.

To do it yourself involves cutting an opening in the chassis. As someone pointed out earlier, Funai could make friends by prepunching or perforating a cable exit. Using the SATA port to go external would make it easier for a DIYer willing to open the box. One disk drive, one failure point, one media removable point, so disk management is under control of the customer.
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post #10721 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorM View Post

Translation: In theory, if you put a video stabilizer between your cable box and DVR, there shouldn't be anything to worry about (I have not tried this). Since there is no useful digital input on these units, CCI will not be an issue (when using a STB or DTA).

Your theory is valid, and you do not need the stabilizer if the cable box output is solely analog. My stabilizer http://checkhere22.com/stabilizer/ is in place all the time behind the destination Funai and I see no degradation in signal quality over S-Video. I have done DTA-DVR transfers and did not need the stabilizer, but other STBs may be different and include CGMS in the analog output.

Quote:


This of course will not allow you to defeat the dreaded Ghostbuster symbol from anything you've recorded to the HDD and want to burn to DVD. (Actually, if you have two DVD Recorders, you can probably figure a way around that too.)

Right again, if you record via S-Video from one Funai to the other, you can burn DVDs on the other.
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post #10722 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:27 PM
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Replacing the HHD on my Mag 2160
i have had the cover off and removed the mounting screws..
but i am very scared of that ribbon data cable.. i used a bit of force and its still not wanting to disconnect.. is there a latch or some sorta locking mech.. that is holding into the Circut board connector... i have all the procedures ready to go but removing that data cable is just very scarry.. any suggestions..

help..
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post #10723 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 05:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Everyone who gives step-by-step instructions seems to mention "carefully remove tape" in several places on the HDD or its connections, but no one has said there are latches on the ribbon cables.

Philips advises against pulling those ribbon cables out by "rocking them" sideways, prob. cuz that could smear the separate, delicate copper contacts. They show pulling straight out, but I guess you have to get them to start first.

Maybe someone has run into this "fear factor" themselves and found a way to get the job done?

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post #10724 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Dear 234,

May you ask others what signal is used to set the 2160/513 clock? Any technical answer is fine.

SCTE-127
VBI
TVGOS
PSIP

Thank you.

Also, why turn on hard disk to check time? Waste of energy and reduces hard disk life.

Dear Joe,

I got an answer.

It is PSIP.
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post #10725 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 06:08 PM
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I don't think they have direct latches but the cables is pretty thin and if you yank it too hard or tweak it too much it could get damaged then your SOL.
Pretty sure I carefully pulled up the tape then gently pulled and rocked the connectors out. Then I put everything in loosely and plugged it all back in without shorting anything out to see if it would work or try to work. Once I knew it was good I mounted everything in it's original spots and plugged all the cables in for sure. Some of the style of direct plug in cables have clips or latch type things you pull or unsnap or whatever to get the cable loose so just double check it and go easy and you should be fine.
It has to fit pretty tight or the things are going to slowly work loose or just fall out and they'll be fixing non broken units just becuase something came loose.
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post #10726 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Everyone who gives step-by-step instructions seems to mention "carefully remove tape" in several places on the HDD or its connections, but no one has said there are latches on the ribbon cables.

Philips advises against pulling those ribbon cables out by "rocking them" sideways, prob. cuz that could smear the separate, delicate copper contacts. They show pulling straight out, but I guess you have to get them to start first.

Maybe someone has run into this "fear factor" themselves and found a way to get the job done?

My only hard drive swap was with a PATA hard drive. This swap did not require disconnecting or disturbing the ribbon cable--other than lifting the ribbon cable up off the hard drive. This hard drive swap involved disconnecting/reconnecting the power connector and the PATA adapter printed circuit board from the hard drive itself. I didn't closely examine the ribbon cable connector at the time. The photos seem to show that the ribbon cable connector is of the locking type where the black portion of the connector is the flip-up lock.
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post #10727 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 06:45 PM
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ok im a bit confused.. by this thread

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=4134

it shows you do not need to even remove those thin little data cable ribbons just the adapter that they connect to..

is this right.. i was under the assumption that you would need to remove the data cable.. and but its such a wispy kinda connection that im wondering if im getting this all wrong..

am i making any sense?

any how im sure i will be able to figure it out and really appreciate you alls help on this...

will take another dive after some more research..

edit: yea after doing a bit more digging i think your on the right track on this and it must have been my mistake... glad i dont need to fool with those silly ribbons....
thanks DigaDo.. thats great help..
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post #10728 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 06:49 PM
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see, it IS harder than it sounds I am about to swap my drive, too (as soon as I can back up some stuff, hopefully over labor day weekend)... so any basic advice is most welcome. As for this:

To do it yourself involves cutting an opening in the chassis. As someone pointed out earlier, Funai could make friends by prepunching or perforating a cable exit. Using the SATA port to go external would make it easier for a DIYer willing to open the box. One disk drive, one failure point, one media removable point, so disk management is under control of the customer.

That was me, and yes, wouldn't that be nice? Open the chassis, disconnect the esata cable from the existing drive (presumably we could leave it in place for later reconnection, thus not losing all the recorded titles?) and then simply pull the esata cable out of the chassis hole so it could connect to an external drive or a toaster for bare drives that could be swapped. MUCH easier.
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post #10729 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 08:20 PM
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ok so i get my name on the Pioneers list.. all systems go and such..
sucess in hard drive up grade.. its just about as easy as replacing a hard drive in a desktop.. not a thing to worry about.. no fiddly ribbon cable just the connector to the hard drive its self..

this is cool!

THANKS FOR ALL THE GOOD HELP FOLKS!
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post #10730 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 08:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuzzo View Post

ok so i get my name on the Pioneers list.. all systems go and such..
sucess in hard drive up grade.. its just about as easy as replacing a hard drive in a desktop.. not a thing to worry about.. no fiddly ribbon cable just the connector to the hard drive its self..

this is cool!

THANKS FOR ALL THE GOOD HELP FOLKS!

Well, Scuzzo, I'd love to add you to the list of Pioneers, but I'd have to refer people to at least 8 posts of yours and a couple of other members to follow your path to success!

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post #10731 of 26077 Old 08-30-2010, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 234 View Post

Dear Joe,

I got an answer.

It is PSIP.

Thank you. Now I need to find a channel with good PSIP data on my cable feed. Since I get results only two times per day, it may take some time. Maybe with next version 513 could check every minute when powered off?
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post #10732 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted by sydyen View Post

It cannot be USB, that is considered a removable media, be it a stick or a hard drive.

Good point Sydyen, but then maybe any 'quick disconnect' would do. Intent being that it eliminates dubbing to DVD, which more and more channels seem to be preventing you from doing (had some PBS programs now prevent dubbing to DVD also), and simplifies the storage of recordings. This would only work if one could transfer programs/movies from a DVR (HDD recorder) to another HDD, as some people (me) would still want to timeshift record to the DVR, then determine if any of them are good enough to transfer to the HDD. For now that seems to be oK,

Recording to a BD capable HDD that has at least 500GB capacity would be terrific. Also would make it easier to manufacture for Funai (no DVD drives, laser etc.), and generate additional revenues if they made the HDD configuration specific to the unit.
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post #10733 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 05:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuzzo View Post

Replacing the HHD on my Mag 2160
i have had the cover off and removed the mounting screws..
but i am very scared of that ribbon data cable.. i used a bit of force and its still not wanting to disconnect.. is there a latch or some sorta locking mech.. that is holding into the Circut board connector... i have all the procedures ready to go but removing that data cable is just very scarry.. any suggestions..

help..

Yes, the ribbon cables are connected by clips. You just stick a finger nail at the point where the cable is inserted, gently pull up on the plastic clip, and it opens. If you do remove the cable, just make sure you put the cable back in correctly and then push the clip back down until it locks.

You only need to remove the cable from the clips if you are somewhat clumsy like me and don't want to take the chance of causing damage. The adapter and power cable connecting to the hard drive are all you really have to remove and then reattach to the new drive.

The "carefully remove tape" everyone refers to is the double-sided tape holding the ribbon cable to the top of the hard drive. Sometimes it comes off easily, sometimes you have to pull pretty hard (hence my clumsy like me comment above).

5 MAGNAVOX 2160 & 7 PHILIPS 3576 OTA
TWC ROADRUNNER
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post #10734 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Re: our Wish List for 234
Please click #3 in my sig. and see if there are Wishes not yet listed so it's as complete as possible for 234's use up to this point in time.

I appear to be the only one asking for it, so if you decide to leave it off, it makes no difference to me:

My suggestion for a manual chapter mark button on the remote that could add chapters during recording or record-pause.
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post #10735 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 06:57 AM
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It goes beyond.

All I was asking for was a software program that we could run on a PC to copy from an HDD removed from the unit to a new HDD to replace that original HDD, not FW and a port. That would be nice, but I would think much more expensive.

An alternative would be to document how recordings are stored on the disc so that someone here could write such a software program.

Bruce
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post #10736 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 07:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

Well, Scuzzo, I'd love to add you to the list of Pioneers, but I'd have to refer people to at least 8 posts of yours and a couple of other members to follow your path to success!

ok i think i may be able to at least throw up a thread on how i went about the Hard Drive up grade.. its pretty much what every one else did and i forgot photos but might be fun just to give my perspective and ideas.. but once you do it its like dang.. whats the fuss. its no different then replacing a desktop HDD.

bit of an update..

day one still running superb.. and i agree with the picture quality improvements.. and its great fun to record every show i want in HQ..

thanks for the really great resource and all the very well thought infromation on these little HDD recorders.. im aready addicted to them..

good job Wajo!
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post #10737 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 07:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Scuzzo View Post

ok i think i may be able to at least throw up a thread on how i went about the Hard Drive up grade..

Please don't start a new thread for your upgrade story, just put it all in one post here so people will always be able to find it... this Sticky thread won't disappear someday like normal threads do as they age.

PHILIPS HD DVRs | MAG/PHILIPS SD DVDRs* | DVDR/DVR COMPARISONS | POST-DVDR OPTIONS
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post #10738 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 07:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Thank you. Now I need to find a channel with good PSIP data on my cable feed. Since I get results only two times per day, it may take some time. Maybe with next version 513 could check every minute when powered off?

FYI to all: you can use "The 11:57 Procedure" to let you know immediately if there is any good time signal in your channel lineup?

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post #10739 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 07:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dare2be View Post

I appear to be the only one asking for it, so if you decide to leave it off, it makes no difference to me:

My suggestion for a manual chapter mark button on the remote that could add chapters during recording or record-pause.

I added it to #10 Better Remote.

PHILIPS HD DVRs | MAG/PHILIPS SD DVDRs* | DVDR/DVR COMPARISONS | POST-DVDR OPTIONS
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post #10740 of 26077 Old 08-31-2010, 07:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by blgaarder View Post

It goes beyond.

All I was asking for was a software program that we could run on a PC to copy from an HDD removed from the unit to a new HDD to replace that original HDD, not FW and a port. That would be nice, but I would think much more expensive.

An alternative would be to document how recordings are stored on the disc so that someone here could write such a software program.

I changed #44 on the Wish List to 3 alternatives.

PHILIPS HD DVRs | MAG/PHILIPS SD DVDRs* | DVDR/DVR COMPARISONS | POST-DVDR OPTIONS
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