144" BOC screen - need paint help - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 53 Old 02-08-2010, 06:12 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Okay, had several days to watch it and calibrated the projector. I find that the screen is getting "brighter" day by day as the paint dries. There is now more of a lustre to the screen than the first day. That said, I am also noticed more uneven spray tracks due to weak overlap of the paint. They really don't bother me though, but they are there if you look hard enough on a white screen now. I watched the superbowl yesterday and I have to say, "I was there on the field!" in every sense of the word--truly amazing. I can also say a huge screen is not for everyone. My son got nausiated watching a TV show recently because of the quick movement of the camera for that show. The screen definitely heightens the sense of movement and your involvement in the action like IMAX does. Yup, bluray is superp on this screen.
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post #32 of 53 Old 02-08-2010, 06:34 AM
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threed123,

Everything looks great. Good to see the RS-MaxxMudd holding up so well under normal ambient, and even getting things done under adverse directed light.

That was a surprise to me as well, back in 2005 when I sprayed my first example of RS-MM. Came in handy too since it was for a Home Show exhibition in a Garage w/White Walls-Ceilings and Florescent Lighting.

Let's address those weak areas. If you can still do so, do at least one more Duster with 75% overlap. LOTS of overlap combined with a "duster speed' approach should completely mask those odd areas. It may look great 90% of the time, but we/you want to lay claim to that remaining 10%....yes?

1 or 2 more such quickly applied Dusters will fix it up, and also reduce the underlying sheen from the Rolled coats and heavier Spray coated areas so the Viewing cone will improve a bit...even with the amount of gain you have.

Take a few shots from 15'-18' back, but use your Zoom to fill the image area with the Screen except a very small black border area. Take those shots under Auto....and then a few under Auto/High ISO.

Once again....a great job done on a BIG Screen. Welcome Brother....to the "Big Picture Show"

BTW, the cure for the motion sickness is to set back until you can hold your hands up to the corners of each eye, directly in front of your Temples, palms flat to forward, and use that "Frame" to eclose the image in front of you. Your Son is letting his eye bobble back and forth trying to catch all the movement. Imax 's do that to people too.

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post #33 of 53 Old 02-08-2010, 11:53 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Let's address those weak areas. If you can still do so, do at least one more Duster with 75% overlap. LOTS of overlap combined with a "duster speed' approach should completely mask those odd areas. It may look great 90% of the time, but we/you want to lay claim to that remaining 10%....yes? .

Well, I'm caught between having to get more paint and the aggravation of hauling the screen back behind the furnance and getting everything set up again. I think the screen is fine. I'm just noting the paint tracks because I'm looking for them. My family doesn't see them even when I point them out--so I'm good. I do see that the screen is getting richer looking as the days pass as PB_Maxx said it would, and that is something for DIYrs to consider when using the Maxx_Mudd mixes--don't fully judge the screen results day 1!

Oh yeah--we got 10" of white stuff coming Tuesday night--yippeee
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post #34 of 53 Old 02-14-2010, 03:42 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Some Olympic pics of my newly mounted screen with black velvetine edging.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post18135864
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post #35 of 53 Old 02-14-2010, 07:41 PM
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Some Olympic pics of my newly mounted screen with black velvetine edging.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post18135864

Opening Olymipics. Note the skin tones and overall color.Great! This is a still of the recorded HD which has lots of artifacts if you zoom in so take that under consideration. The original HD was spectacular.



Just before the US walked in. Note the overall blue from the overhead lights and white ice underneath.



Yay, US team! Nice white uniforms in the background. Good flag colors. Nice contrast.



A luger getting ready. Note the black helmet--lots of different colors. Yes, he's wearing a red face mask.



Inside the arena. Note this shows the velvetine border around the edge. Done with 2" velvetine sticky tape.



US takes women's moguls!! Again I went for the colors. You can only imagine what it's like on this big screen to watch the action. Absolutely AAAA-mazing!



[quote]

That's some great looking 3-D like imagery. Yessir.

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post #36 of 53 Old 03-26-2010, 11:04 AM
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Just a pre-conclusion note: I have had projectors since 1995 (yes, I started with CRTs, a Benq 8700, an Optoma HD70, an Optoma HD20--for several days, and now a Mits 3800). I also have had various screens, including 1.0 gain Stewart, 1.5 gain Dalite Silver Matte, 2.5 gain Dalite High Power, and 2+ gain Draper M2500. Does this replace all those screens without trepidation--yes--except for the Dalite High Power--not much beats that--but it's not a good screen for ceiling mounted projectors--and I couldn't afford it anyway.

I've been researching screens and I think I've settled on the M2500 for a ceiling mounted DLP projector. Can you describe your impressions of the M2500, and describe a bit more about how your DIY screen compares? Is all of the work worth the differences? Ideally, I would like a higher gain screen that can also bring down the black levels a bit for DLP projectors.
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post #37 of 53 Old 03-26-2010, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by avmjt View Post

I've been researching screens and I think I've settled on the M2500 for a ceiling mounted DLP projector. Can you describe your impressions of the M2500, and describe a bit more about how your DIY screen compares? Is all of the work worth the differences? Ideally, I would like a higher gain screen that can also bring down the black levels a bit for DLP projectors.

You betcha!

But RS-MaxxMudd is the easiest of the advanced Screens
to paint....especially if one sprays.

It has exactly the properties you stated you want above. Pretty much cut & dried there.

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post #38 of 53 Old 03-26-2010, 04:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by avmjt View Post

I've been researching screens and I think I've settled on the M2500 for a ceiling mounted DLP projector. Can you describe your impressions of the M2500, and describe a bit more about how your DIY screen compares? Is all of the work worth the differences? Ideally, I would like a higher gain screen that can also bring down the black levels a bit for DLP projectors.

The current M2500 is rated at 1.5 whereas mine was rated at 2.5--it had a very noticeable hot spot, though, probably why they reduced the gain on it. The RS-MaxxMudd appears to have about 1.3+ gain. Rather hard to tell with the large screen that I have. That said, I can use the Mits HC3800 in low lamp mode, so that should give some idea of it's gain properties. My M2500 was 126" diag, whereas the current screen is around 144"
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post #39 of 53 Old 03-28-2010, 08:59 AM
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Thanks everyone!

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Originally Posted by threed123 View Post

The current M2500 is rated at 1.5 whereas mine was rated at 2.5--it had a very noticeable hot spot, though, probably why they reduced the gain on it. The RS-MaxxMudd appears to have about 1.3+ gain. Rather hard to tell with the large screen that I have. That said, I can use the Mits HC3800 in low lamp mode, so that should give some idea of it's gain properties. My M2500 was 126" diag, whereas the current screen is around 144"

So the main difference between your M2500 and your DIY RS-MaxxMudd is the hotspotting with the M2500? Since you had the older, higher gain M2500 screen, the newer ones sound like they would be much like the RS-MaxxMudd. Were there any other differences to speak of?
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post #40 of 53 Old 03-28-2010, 09:57 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks everyone!



So the main difference between your M2500 and your DIY RS-MaxxMudd is the hotspotting with the M2500? Since you had the older, higher gain M2500 screen, the newer ones sound like they would be much like the RS-MaxxMudd. Were there any other differences to speak of?

Well, of course, price. It cost around $250 or so for the homemade screen vs. $600-$1000 for a M2500.
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post #41 of 53 Old 03-28-2010, 10:25 AM
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Thanks. Would the RS-MaxxMudd have noticably deeper black levels than the M2500? If it does, and they have comparable gain, then the RS-MaxxMudd should have a major advantage overall.
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post #42 of 53 Old 03-28-2010, 11:48 AM
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Thanks. Would the RS-MaxxMudd have noticably deeper black levels than the M2500? If it does, and they have comparable gain, then the RS-MaxxMudd should have a major advantage overall.

Here's a direct quote from a Draper outlet:
Quote:


The Draper M2500 material is a good choice for lower brightness projectors (less than 600 lumen, Typically CRT) with contrast ratios or 2000:1 or better in moderately controlled lighting environments. The fleshy off-white color of this material provides a near neutral colors with enhanced brightness.

The above plainly states that the M2500 (1.5 gain version) works best with PJ that already can supply all the Black Levels needed. And note the part that says "Moderately Controlled Lighting Environments". Now just exactly what does that mean I wonder?

Unless you posses a 3-Chip DLP (...no mention as of yet what it is you do have...) it's doubtful you have Black levels that do not or could not be improved upon. And really even if you do.

"Less than 600 Lumens'" Do you know what that relates to in "real lumens' for such a PJ? Under 200 actual lumens. That being so, the gain that the newer M2500 possesses is only 1.5 because if it was any brighter, you'd find Blacks were suffering even more. And they will anyway as well if you shoot any really brighter PJ onto that type/color Screen.

Dude, the M2500 is a Screen that is mismatched with anything except a 'el cheapo PJ or a true Oldster. And gollly gee, it does cost a bit of cheese too.

RS-Maxx on the other hand is a Paint the specifically enhances contrast while also delivering brightness levels above 1.3-1.4 gain.

If you want "increased Blacks, a bright image, and both coming to you at a bargain price..............where is there a decision needing to be made here....

Reason it out....you'll agree I'm sure.

To quote James T. Kirk;
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post #43 of 53 Old 03-28-2010, 12:11 PM
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Wow thanks! I am planning to get the new Infocus SP8602 by the way. Definitely not a low brightnes projector and it could use a boost in black level performance as about all DLP projectors do. It sounds like the RS-MaxxMudd is more akin to the Stewart Firehawk?

I have already planned to spend a good amount on a screen and I'm not sure I can find the time for another DIY project for a good while. Somebody should sell these ready to go.
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post #44 of 53 Old 03-28-2010, 12:44 PM
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Wow thanks! I am planning to get the new Infocus SP8602 by the way. Definitely not a low brightnes projector and it could use a boost in black level performance as about all DLP projectors do. It sounds like the RS-MaxxMudd is more akin to the Stewart Firehawk?

Actually, about 4 years ago I authored a Thread called, "Roasting the "Bird" over a Silver Fire" that pretty much plucked, skewered, and cooked the ST-FH to a turn.

...and that ticked off a BUNCH of Stewart FH owners and those who sell 'em too!

A 2.0 Silver Fire screen is darker than a FireHawk, brighter than a FireHawk, and looks much more "smoother" than a FireHawk. RS-MaxxMudd is very similar to a 2.0 SF Screen but does not use a added "Colorant" to get to a state of "Gray" but rather depends upon the gray "base" in the Delta Silver Metallic to offer up that shade. So naturally it will look...and is a lighter shade...much more akin to a Silvery "off White". You can slightly increase the shade/depth of Gray in RS-MaxxMudd, but really, when someone needs ambient light assistance, it's Silver Fire that is suggested. you don't seem to be in that sort of need.

But that Silver in RS-MaxxMudd is directly responsible for boosting perceived Contrast by actually deepening the Black levels without adversely crushing down colors and whites. The Pearl helps boost reflectivity of the Lighter Colors. Together with the added Poly they serve to create a surface that is at once "deeply reflective" yet "Flat" in shade.

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I have already planned to spend a good amount on a screen and I'm not sure I can find the time for another DIY project for a good while.

Awwww.....how big an image are you planning? Listen up....you can acquire a sheet of GatorFoam, pre cut to size, ($75.00 max) a Wagner Control Spray ("Double Duty" or Plus) for $60 to $88.00 respectfully, the paints and Ploy (....about $45.00 max) and spray it completely in under 4-5 hours Total time (humidity and temp determine rate of drying time per coat.) Each Coat takes all of 1 minute, 30 seconds at most to apply to a BIG screen. The technique is as easy as walking at a measured speed sideways and pointing your Hand like your holding a Gun.

Total cost? About $200.00 (incl. Spray Gun) for a screen up to 134" diagonal.
Even less....much less....if you prep and paint directly onto a wall surface. (my favorite next to Mirrored Light Fusion)

Quote:


Somebody should sell these ready to go.

They were sold at one time, but due to the conflicts and complaints that arise whenever a DIY'er asks to buy something "pre-made" from a fellow DIY'er, it was decided to stop doing so., even on "Screens' where such things are permitted.

I can't say that many other people who have taken advantage of what is/has been discovered and posted on this Forum have followed suit. At least 4-5 Screen paint endeavors have stated up in the last 2-3 years using clones of the Mixes developed "open source" on this Forum. But as for PB-Maxx & myself, we just "don't want to go there" while trying to maintain a true "benefit the DIY Screen Forum members" approach. But outside the USA...that's different, but the Status Quo at Home will remain so for the present.

But you CAN expect all the helpful advice and assistance you need if you but ask for it.

Call my bluff. (...a Double Dog Dare... )

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #45 of 53 Old 03-28-2010, 01:19 PM - Thread Starter
 
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But you CAN expect all the helpful advice and assistance you need if you but ask for it.

Call my bluff. (...a Double Dog Dare... )

Yeah, +1 on what he said
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Ok the amount of useful information given so quickly here is scary good LOL. I'm looking to 133" 16:9. The room is completely darkened, but I have some paint experience that has led me to still prefer a darker screen...

Before I had a screen, I was projecting my Infocus IN83 on an very light off-white wall in a fully darkened room. Then I painted the wall a very dark brown, probably only 10% white on a gray scale, 15% at most. What I found interesting is that I like the picture on the very dark wall better than the light off-white wall. Of course the whites were greatly affected, but what I liked is that the overall contrast seemed at least the same, but shifted into much deeper blacks. The affect had two significant benefits.

Most important to me is that when the overall contrast seemed the same but with deeper backs and reduced overall brightness, the overall experience in the room was improved because the room itself did not light up and you don't get reminded that you are in a room. Even with a fully darkened room, if you blast a bright projector on a light screen, the room will light up and you will see it. When I was able to achieve what seemed to be the same level of contrast by shifting both the brightness and the black levels lower with the very dark paint, I got amazing black levels along with a much more immersive overall experience in the room.

The other benefit to mention was that, on the dark wall, the picture was perfectly watchable even with the lights on, but not when projecting onto the wall when it was off-white.

I was really surprised about the affects of these two benefits because it completely defies absolutely everything I've ever read from everyone else that a light or white screen is best for a fully darkened room. Finding a preference for the opposite first hand has really opened my eyes to these benefits that are never addressed when people discuss screens for a fully darkened room, and it's completely changed what I'm looking for in a screen - or at least made the decision *MUCH* more confusing.

What this has led me to believe is that I could use a dark screen material with some angular-reflective gain for a ceiling mount projector. The Stewart Firehawk seems like it would be perfect, but in today's economy I just can't justify the cost for a 133" screen. Plus the Firehawk has a limited viewing cone, and I really need people that are 45-degrees off-center, and maybe even as far as 60-degrees off-center, to see a nice picture.

I have Elite white screen material I was planning to use but decided against white after this experience, so maybe I could use the material as the beginning of a new DIY project. Or I could pick up a solid surface material so that I didn't have to worry about stretching the screen. I will look into the materials you've suggested.

Anyhow, what I've been trying to get at here, is that my limited experience so far has me wondering if I should go for the RS-MaxxMudd or the 2.0 Silver Fire. Since the newer Infocus SP8602 projector I plan to use will have much better black levels with some reduced brightness over the Infocus IN83, maybe it would be safe to stick with the RS-MaxxMudd and not jump into the dark screen territory just yet. I really don't know and I guess I could use some more pointers to help steer me in a direction. You've already made me realize that DIY is the way to go for me, and I have access to a professional automotive spray gun, compressor, air dryers, nozzles, and masks, etc. I really appreciate all of the time you people put into helping others like myself. This just might get very exciting, and might save me a lot of money as well.

With either the RS-MaxxMudd or the Silver Fire, can I expect a decent picture at 45-degrees off-center, or even 60-degrees off-center?
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post #47 of 53 Old 03-29-2010, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avmjt View Post

Ok the amount of useful information given so quickly here is scary good LOL. I'm looking to 133" 16:9. The room is completely darkened, but I have some paint experience that has led me to still prefer a darker screen...

Before I had a screen, I was projecting my Infocus IN83 on an very light off-white wall in a fully darkened room. Then I painted the wall a very dark brown, probably only 10% white on a gray scale, 15% at most. What I found interesting is that I like the picture on the very dark wall better than the light off-white wall. Of course the whites were greatly affected, but what I liked is that the overall contrast seemed at least the same, but shifted into much deeper blacks. The affect had two significant benefits.

Many have found that when they first get a PJ and shoot it into a wall, they are almost happy enough to stop there. Of course the image is far from ideal, but as often is the case, not "knowing" the difference between such and something far more ideally suited always make the "make do" seem acceptable.

Quote:


Most important to me is that when the overall contrast seemed the same but with deeper backs and reduced overall brightness, the overall experience in the room was improved because the room itself did not light up and you don't get reminded that you are in a room. Even with a fully darkened room, if you blast a bright projector on a light screen, the room will light up and you will see it. When I was able to achieve what seemed to be the same level of contrast by shifting both the brightness and the black levels lower with the very dark paint, I got amazing black levels along with a much more immersive overall experience in the room.

Yer Preachin' to the Preacher here.....

Only my religious Doctrine demands that while shifting Blacks downward to the Netherworld, the White must remain as "Angelic" as possible. It's a fine balancing act....one that a few on here have disputed can actually be accomplished. All agree that you must have the "Gray' to shift Black levels downward, but enough surface reflection to allow Lighter elements of the image reflect back without undue attenuation. That is where Poly comes in in a small way, and the correct use of Metallics add the rest of the Story. And THAT is where the division between camps occurs. Are Metallics really needed? Are they actually beneficial? Is doing an advanced DIY Screen application really worth it?

Usually it take someone having experiences like yours to "See the Light" metaphorically speaking. Ot's at least satisfying to have seen the use of metallics become generally accepted over the last 4-5 years.

Quote:


The other benefit to mention was that, on the dark wall, the picture was perfectly watchable even with the lights on, but not when projecting onto the wall when it was off-white.

Really? I'll have to digest that a while.

We call that "Ambient Light Watch-ability" around here, and most people on here (...and everyone whose tried it...) will agree that Silver Fire is at the head of the DIY class in that regard. RS-MaxxMudd has always shown definite ability in that direction as well, but being a Silver-Grayish White, it will still be affected in worse case situations more than SF would.

Quote:


I was really surprised about the affects of these two benefits because it completely defies absolutely everything I've ever read from everyone else that a light or white screen is best for a fully darkened room. Finding a preference for the opposite first hand has really opened my eyes to these benefits that are never addressed when people discuss screens for a fully darkened room, and it's completely changed what I'm looking for in a screen - or at least made the decision *MUCH* more confusing.

People listen to "Experts" usually, and when those "Experts' are the ones trying to convince someone to buy something, their objectivity and presentation is naturally slanted. Shoot...we are hardly different on here excepting that we "sell" the performance of our various offerings to try to persuade the "Fence Sitter' to jump down and get'er dun!

Back when PJ heads consisted primarily of CRT owners, those CRTs always had excellent Blacks. but they were also very dim, and so darkened rooms and reflective white surfaces became the Status Quo and accepted standard.

When folks started bringing home really bright, but very "contrast challenged" Presentation PJs from work, and shooting onto walls, they discovered what you did...that a darker surface made the Blacks look MUCH better. And those extra Lumens help keep Whites looking less dull....to a point. If a White reference was used to compare, of course then the Whites projected on it then showed how crushed the Whites on a Tan/Gray/off White wall really were.

After the advent of the InFocus X1, PJ started getting better...and brighter. Leading up to and beyond that point, "High Contrast" Gray screens came into being to help mitigate poor contrast. Little was ever stated that it was to let 'em perform in ambient light though....Dark rooms still remained a "standard" requirement.

A old adage in DIY Screens is "What is Old becomes New again" and that especially applies to those who are just discovering things on their own. Eureka Moments abound when one really starts to focus on the Hows/Whys/Should be's. And it's an addicting Hobby...brook no mistake about that!

Also...there is a "Pop Quiz" slated for next Friday, so study. It counts toward 25% of your Grade this semester.

BTW...there is NO Grading curve in DIY Screen making. To this Teacher, it's a "A" or it's really only deserving of a "F" if performance falls short of what it can/should be.

Quote:


What this has led me to believe is that I could use a dark screen material with some angular-reflective gain for a ceiling mount projector. The Stewart Firehawk seems like it would be perfect, but in today's economy I just can't justify the cost for a 133" screen. Plus the Firehawk has a limited viewing cone, and I really need people that are 45-degrees off-center, and maybe even as far as 60-degrees off-center, to see a nice picture.

I share that sentiment with every case I encounter.

Quote:


I have Elite white screen material I was planning to use but decided against white after this experience, so maybe I could use the material as the beginning of a new DIY project. Or I could pick up a solid surface material so that I didn't have to worry about stretching the screen. I will look into the materials you've suggested.

Solids are so much better and far more able to become exactly what you need them to be...and with a lot less effort. If that wasn't true, you can bet I'd be a staunch advocate of Blackout Cloth Screens. Oh they can be made into excellent high performance Screens...but it takes more doing. myself...I prefer doing something right...but as quickly and as easily as possible.

Quote:


Anyhow, what I've been trying to get at here, is that my limited experience so far has me wondering if I should go for the RS-MaxxMudd or the 2.0 Silver Fire. Since the newer Infocus SP8602 projector I plan to use will have much better black levels with some reduced brightness over the Infocus IN83, maybe it would be safe to stick with the RS-MaxxMudd and not jump into the dark screen territory just yet. I really don't know and I guess I could use some more pointers to help steer me in a direction. You've already made me realize that DIY is the way to go for me, and I have access to a professional automotive spray gun, compressor, air dryers, nozzles, and masks, etc. I really appreciate all of the time you people put into helping others like myself. This just might get very exciting, and might save me a lot of money as well.

Although I'm not one to suggest taking a course that is less than one needs to be amazed by the end results, suggesting RS-MaxxMudd seems very appropriate in this instance. That then is what I suggest.

Quote:


With either the RS-MaxxMudd or the Silver Fire, can I expect a decent picture at 45-degrees off-center, or even 60-degrees off-center?

How about placing 'em 3' ahead of the screen wall to each far side?

Both applications enjoy 1/2 gain figures that don't occur until you move almost to a "Ear to the Screen wall" position.

Basically it's "All Good"....except the "Elbow Grease' requirement. But for some...getting there is half the Fun.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #48 of 53 Old 03-29-2010, 11:37 AM
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Fantastic! RS-MaxxMudd it shall be. I think I owe someone here a drink.
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post #49 of 53 Old 03-29-2010, 12:49 PM
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I really don't know and I guess I could use some more pointers to help steer me in a direction. You've already made me realize that DIY is the way to go for me, and I have access to a professional automotive spray gun, compressor, air dryers, nozzles, and masks, etc. I really appreciate all of the time you people put into helping others like myself. This just might get very exciting, and might save me a lot of money as well.

I didn't address this;

Relate to me the type Gun/Compressor you have, the various sizes you have in Needle/Nozzle assemblies. That Air Dryer is a wonderful thing...something I only had the pleasure of using once out of 30-40 sprayed screens right at the beginning when I switched from Rollin' to Sprayin'

I like to help to determine the lack of viscosity (thinness) in the mix you'll need to get a grate Flow rate, and knowing the Needle sizes and Gun type/specs is essential knowledge.

For instance, using a Air Fed HVLP gun with a 1.2mm to 1.5mm needle, usually I usually set the Tank Valve's outlet/Hose pressure at 85 psi, and the Gun's pressure at 40-45 psi.

Those settings can bleed out pressure pretty quickly with a Compressor/Tank set up. If the Tank/Hose pressure falls to within 15 psi of the Gun's Setting, the Spray Pattern becomes more sparse and has less Height. Myself, I had to know just how many Rows I could squirt before I'd have to stop and let the Tank recover pressure. With a 32 Gallon / 5.5 HP rig, usually that meant doing three passes at most on 110" to 144" diagonal Screens (...you don't want to peter out mid-Row...EVER! )

Once I used a BIG 4 Cylinder Air Nailer Rig (8 outlets!) that ran all the time but could easily maintain 120 psi constantly. That is the closest thing to using a constant pressure Electric Wagner Turbine Gun I ever came when using a true HLVP pressure fed Gun.

I'm feeling very confident you'll ace this application right out of the Gate.

Feeling very good about it / for you too.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #50 of 53 Old 03-30-2010, 06:42 AM
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I will have to get back to you on the model of spray gun because it's my fathers from when he did detail a long time ago, so it's a much older spray gun which he says was very expensive back in his day. Hopefully older spray guns are still comparable to newer ones. It's still used occasionally for auto body work and everything comes out as perfect as I can tell. I don't know much about them, but it sure seems to make massive clouds of ultra fine mist in a single trigger pull. I would be afraid to use it, so I would have him help me with this. From things I've seen him do with it in the past, I'm sure there won't be any problems getting full coverage; but auto paint is an entirely different beast I'm sure. Hmm, I bet some interesting results could be had with professional auto paint by the way! So many options with metallics.
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post #51 of 53 Old 03-30-2010, 09:27 AM
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I will have to get back to you on the model of spray gun because it's my fathers from when he did detail a long time ago, so it's a much older spray gun which he says was very expensive back in his day. Hopefully older spray guns are still comparable to newer ones. It's still used occasionally for auto body work and everything comes out as perfect as I can tell. I don't know much about them, but it sure seems to make massive clouds of ultra fine mist in a single trigger pull. I would be afraid to use it, so I would have him help me with this. From things I've seen him do with it in the past, I'm sure there won't be any problems getting full coverage; but auto paint is an entirely different beast I'm sure. Hmm, I bet some interesting results could be had with professional auto paint by the way! So many options with metallics.

Yes, Auto paints are often very thin, and the fact that they contain petroleum elements to assist in quicker evaporation makes them form those vapor clouds. Also, one doesn't want to ever get a "run" when painting a smooth surface so lots of Air is mixed into the paint. hence the use of HVLP guns.

Much of the same painting technique used to paint a car is employed in painting a Screen's surface. You want 'smooth' so the paint is thinner than usual, and applied in successive light layers.

Using Auto Paints for DIY screens is not new. DDog (AVS Member) tried to popularize it almost 10 years ago, but the cost, mess (clean-up is a b- - ch) over spray & smell effectively doomed it almost from the start. BTW, the use of Auto Air Aluminum as a reflective additive originated with the DDog v.1 application. S-I-L-V-E-R is a similar app to DDog v.1 as it uses Water based "clear Glaze with a small percentage of Silver Metallic.

These days, buying Wagner Control Spray Double Duty is the way to go. It's less than $60.00, and handles Latex Water based paints like a dream. Clean up is as simple as rinsing it out under a Faucet.

Over Spray. Much ado about very little concern. The amount of Over Spray when using a Electric Turbine Gun like the Wagner CS-DD is reduced to so little it's 'almost' no real concern. I paint screens inside completed homes all the time simply by draping Furniture with $2.00 sheets of 9' x 12' 1 mil. Plastic. At that size, it's just pennies to effectively cover and protect all surfaces of any concern (within 8') That combined with the drastically reduced time needed to spray on each coating just makes it less of an issue than it has ever been before.

Trouble is, too many still see it as being messy and worrisome. Shame that. In truth, it's easier and cleaner and produces results superior to Rolling, no matter what the skill of the Painter. Just follow simple instructions and you get virtual perfection.

Breathing. Always important. I always use a breath mask indoors, but when outdoors, and seeing that even a big 135" diagonal screen project only takes at most 1 minute 30 seconds to squirt. A 85" x 48" 98" diagonal screen? 50 seconds of spray time. I can almost hold my breath that long. But use a mask anyway.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #52 of 53 Old 03-30-2010, 10:00 AM
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These days, buying Wagner Control Spray Double Duty is the way to go. It's less than $60.00, and handles Latex Water based paints like a dream. Clean up is as simple as rinsing it out under a Faucet.

Ya, I might just pick that up if would do just as well. The simplicity would be worth it to me. I will be spraying outdoors and can hold my breath for 2 minutes so I should be ok.
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post #53 of 53 Old 03-30-2010, 10:08 AM
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Ya, I might just pick that up if would do just as well. The simplicity would be worth it to me. I will be spraying outdoors and can hold my breath for 2 minutes so I should be ok.

You'll be glad you did.

Watch out for little Gnats. They seem attracted to Latex paint. If you get one, or a piece of dust or lint, unless you can easily pluck it off without smearing paint...let the paint dry and then brush/ lightly rub it off. The drying paint dessicates tiny bugs and dries them to a crispy texture, as it also does with hair and lint.

To quote James T. Kirk;
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