The Official Silver Fire V.2 Thread. - Page 82 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2431 of 2544 Old 04-20-2016, 11:13 AM
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Can SilverFire (or Black Flame for that matter) be sprayed on to FlexiGRAY (not flexiwhite)
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post #2432 of 2544 Old 04-20-2016, 03:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelBlue07 View Post
Can SilverFire (or Black Flame for that matter) be sprayed on to FlexiGRAY (not flexiwhite)
Yes to both.

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post #2433 of 2544 Old 06-10-2016, 10:21 AM
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Substitute for Behr Ultrapure White 1850 Flat base?

I am collecting paints and tools for my SF 2.5/2 project. I have found all except the Behr UPW 1850 flat...Home Depot no longer sells it, only the UPW 1750 Matte base. The paint guy at Home Depot says "it's the same stuff," but I am not so sure, so I turn to you SilverFire experts. Can I use the 1750, or is there a source for the 1850, or another substitute?
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post #2434 of 2544 Old 06-10-2016, 11:55 AM
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I used the 1750 on my silverfire build and it worked fine.
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post #2435 of 2544 Old 06-11-2016, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carlb23 View Post
I used the 1750 on my silverfire build and it worked fine.
Thanks, Carl!
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post #2436 of 2544 Old 07-16-2016, 03:33 PM
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ive been using my trusted graco 1900 unit for spraying silver fire but am wondering if buying a stronger spray unit like Earlex new stronger spray station gives any added benifits apart from having to use less water. it seems that most on here now use stronger unit but am wondering what advantage they have vs using my 1900 unit.
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post #2437 of 2544 Old 07-16-2016, 05:15 PM - Thread Starter
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A more powerful air supply does not mean the Paint can be thicker, it means that when using the proper Needle size, you get more atomization, and a larger pattern.

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post #2438 of 2544 Old 07-17-2016, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
A more powerful air supply does not mean the Paint can be thicker, it means that when using the proper Needle size, you get more atomization, and a larger pattern.


What im more curious about is how darker silver fire would look with the spray sytem that requires more water vs one that requires less water. For instance, if i made a batch of silver fire 3.0, one batch for my 1900 unit that requires way more water vs one for the newer spraystations that require less water, I would expect the batch that has more water to not appear as dark as the batch for the stronger unit. More water spreads the pigment out more vs the batch with less water. More water, less silver and pigment concentration. less water, stronger silver and pigmentation. I would think if your using the newer spray units you have to really be more carefull on how many coats you put down or you'll create a hot spot quicker then if your using a more deluted mixture. When using my 1900 unit I also use a 1.0 needle. My graco 1900 unit required a lot of water to get a proper spray patteren. Like, I lost count amount of water to be exact, lol

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post #2439 of 2544 Old 07-17-2016, 07:43 PM - Thread Starter
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All the water in the paint eventually evaporates. It's there in the beginning to help effect a ultra smooth flow and application that you simply cannot get using heavier bodied paints.

Water also helps the individual components blend more evenly, and also works with the Polyurethane to do likewise.

As previously stated, more air pressure does have some effect, but when using a 1.0 mm needle / nozzle, thinness is the most important factor. Extra ooomph from higher air pressure just make it all happen all the better.

The Color of a given mix will always stay the same.

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post #2440 of 2544 Old 07-31-2016, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
All the water in the paint eventually evaporates. It's there in the beginning to help effect a ultra smooth flow and application that you simply cannot get using heavier bodied paints.

Water also helps the individual components blend more evenly, and also works with the Polyurethane to do likewise.

As previously stated, more air pressure does have some effect, but when using a 1.0 mm needle / nozzle, thinness is the most important factor. Extra ooomph from higher air pressure just make it all happen all the better.

The Color of a given mix will always stay the same.
can 1/2 an oz more of colorant be added to give a slighty darker shade screen without increasing the base ingrediants? For instance, if one wants to do a silver fire 4.0 screen which requires 4 oz of colorant, can you add an additional .5 oz of colorant to equal 4.5 oz without having to increase the rustoleum silver, liqitex gold, and white pearl by the proper % increase.
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post #2441 of 2544 Old 07-31-2016, 05:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes....that amount would be insignificant.

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post #2442 of 2544 Old 08-01-2016, 08:59 AM
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Question question regarding directly on wall or screen

I just bought a EPSON 2045 projector. i am going with 133" screen size(16:9) in basement with not that much light. the walls will be grey and carpet (square tiles) is also grey. I will be watching from 12 to 13 feet.

I am little confused. I was thinking of going with silver fire 2.5 N/C paint for my screen. Now do i Paint directly on wall (prefer) or do i buy a cloth from store, Create a screen and then paint that screen? Is there some DIY video or instructions I can follow.

I would really appreciate some help. Thanks.
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post #2443 of 2544 Old 08-01-2016, 10:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gujuhero View Post
I just bought a EPSON 2045 projector. i am going with 133" screen size(16:9) in basement with not that much light. the walls will be grey and carpet (square tiles) is also grey. I will be watching from 12 to 13 feet.

I am little confused. I was thinking of going with silver fire 2.5 N/C paint for my screen. Now do i Paint directly on wall (prefer) or do i buy a cloth from store, Create a screen and then paint that screen? Is there some DIY video or instructions I can follow.

I would really appreciate some help. Thanks.
Your choice...use the Wall itself (...if it's smooth...) You can purchase a solid material, hang it and paint on that. Purchase a Mfg Screen and re-purpose it with a better surface.

The choice is / should be based on what will work best in your situation, and given to your DIY skill set.

As far as instructions go......................

.......................waddami ? Chopped Liver?

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post #2444 of 2544 Old 08-14-2016, 03:23 PM
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If you needed to dry your paint quicker, apart from the use of a box fan blowing on it, would it be okay to use a hair dryer or a heat gun? of course this takes into consideration you heat the screen evenly not holding the hair dryer/ heat gun in one spot to long. Part of me thinks, since your drying it took quickly, it wouldnt be a good idea because it wouldnt allow gravity to spread that paint down a little to fill in the paintless areas. But i want to know for sure.
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post #2445 of 2544 Old 08-15-2016, 06:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Don't.

Just raise the room temp and use a fan.

Try doing things the accepted and proven way. Always better.

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post #2446 of 2544 Old 08-15-2016, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
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Don't.

Just raise the room temp and use a fan.

Try doing things the accepted and proven way. Always better.
Roger that.
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post #2447 of 2544 Old 08-15-2016, 02:26 PM
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I have an AE8000 projecting onto 110" of Sintra (time to finally paint!). The room has a couple of windows with blinds, but a fair bit of light still gets in the room. We mostly watch movies at night, but I would like the screen to look decent during daytime viewing also.



I was thinking SilverFire 2.5 v3.0 would be the best bet, but just was curious on the newer N/C version and if this might work for my application?
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post #2448 of 2544 Old 08-15-2016, 04:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by synergytheory View Post
I have an AE8000 projecting onto 110" of Sintra (time to finally paint!). The room has a couple of windows with blinds, but a fair bit of light still gets in the room. We mostly watch movies at night, but I would like the screen to look decent during daytime viewing also.



I was thinking SilverFire 2.5 v3.0 would the best bet, but just was curious on the newer N/C version and if this might work for my application?
The N/C version of both Silver Fire & Black Flame alludes to having more gain while retaining the ability to enhance colors and deepen Black levels. All that helps offset modest ambient light conditions. But that same increase in gain also let's the surface reflect more intense light from outside sources. To wit, a recent reviewer stated that he preferred the SF v2.5 3.0 because it delivered better Blacks in ambient light, and thereby appeared to be more dynamic than the UPW-Enhanced BF N/C

All that said, what with the recent addition of a higher percentage of Ultra Pure White being added, the inclusion of 3 oz of Colorant would serve to bring the ambient light performance of SF & BF N/C back to a near parity with their lower gain predecessors, while not affecting gain to a degree that makes the image appear any less vibrant.

The ability to customize the SF-BF mixes to a person's unique circumstances is a quality of both applications that sets them apart from most every other DIY Screen paint that exists.

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post #2449 of 2544 Old 08-17-2016, 11:35 AM
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I painted my first HT screen about 7 years ago with MississippiMan's "S-I-L-V-E-R". It's served me very well but I'm redoing the entire home theater and the screen just happens to be part of it . I am interested in the Silver Fire v2.5, but I'm a bit unsure if I should use the colorant or not. I have a 155" screen with a Panasonic AE-8000 ceiling mounted about 15' from the screen. I have excellent control of ambient light. I am also unsure how much reflective base to use, I am assuming with my ability to control ambient light it will be on the lower end of the scale, perhaps 1-3 ounces tops? Suggestions are welcomed and appreciated.

Last edited by rayians; 08-17-2016 at 11:48 AM.
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post #2450 of 2544 Old 08-17-2016, 11:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
The N/C version of both Silver Fire & Black Flame alludes to having more gain while retaining the ability to enhance colors and deepen Black levels. All that helps offset modest ambient light conditions. But that same increase in gain also let's the surface reflect more intense light from outside sources. To wit, a recent reviewer stated that he preferred the SF v2.5 3.0 because it delivered better Blacks in ambient light, and thereby appeared to be more dynamic than the UPW-Enhanced BF N/C

All that said, what with the recent addition of a higher percentage of Ultra Pure White being added, the inclusion of 3 oz of Colorant would serve to bring the ambient light performance of SF & BF N/C back to a near parity with their lower gain predecessors, while not affecting gain to a degree that makes the image appear any less vibrant.

The ability to customize the SF-BF mixes to a person's unique circumstances is a quality of both applications that sets them apart from most every other DIY Screen paint that exists.
So SF v2.5 3.0 would be best in my situation? Or the N/C mix with 3oz of colorant?
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post #2451 of 2544 Old 08-17-2016, 02:21 PM - Thread Starter
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SF v2.5 3.0 if you want to DIY compile and assemble the Primary Mix and the Colorant yourself, or go with BF X1I with 3 additional Oz. BF Colorant, both premixed and delivered to you ready to squirt.

Either will provide the performance you want...it's just that the v2.5 formula is ever so slightly higher in gain because it was formulated to work in conjunction with the Colorant, while theBF X1Iwas not, but can be adapted to allow for such.

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post #2452 of 2544 Old 08-17-2016, 02:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rayians View Post
I painted my first HT screen about 7 years ago with MississippiMan's "S-I-L-V-E-R". It's served me very well but I'm redoing the entire home theater and the screen just happens to be part of it . I am interested in the Silver Fire v2.5, but I'm a bit unsure if I should use the colorant or not. I have a 155" screen with a Panasonic AE-8000 ceiling mounted about 15' from the screen. I have excellent control of ambient light. I am also unsure how much reflective base to use, I am assuming with my ability to control ambient light it will be on the lower end of the scale, perhaps 1-3 ounces tops? Suggestions are welcomed and appreciated.
I suggest Silver Fire v2.5 3.0 with 10 oz additional UPW added

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post #2453 of 2544 Old 08-18-2016, 03:55 AM
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MississippiMan, you are the bomb, thank you for your continuous efforts in helping make the world a better place to have a huge HT screen! I did forget to mention while 3D content is not a huge part of my library, I do have a few dozen and when given with the option always go the 3D route. I am not sure if that would factor into your recommendation or not?
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post #2454 of 2544 Old 08-18-2016, 05:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rayians View Post
MississippiMan, you are the bomb, thank you for your continuous efforts in helping make the world a better place to have a huge HT screen! I did forget to mention while 3D content is not a huge part of my library, I do have a few dozen and when given with the option always go the 3D route. I am not sure if that would factor into your recommendation or not?
At 155", it is absolutely a consideration. In a completely dark, fully light controlled room, even the AE8000u's image will be considerably muted in 3D. This is NOT because of the suggested paint applications, but rather is due to the attenuation effect the Panny's Shutter Glasses have. Even a completely White screen would exhibit such a lessening if light output.
(...there may be compatible 3D Glasses available that produce less attenuation, but I haven't discovered them yet...)

3D at that size with the Panny is incredible...I've viewed such at 146" diagonal many times. But there was no mistaking that the brilliance of the image seen in 2D was lacking. The Mix I used was a 3.0 with added UPW. So revising my suggestion based on your current desire to view 3D(...which can only increase, not go away...) I would suggest going with either N/C version (DIY or Pre-Made) w/UPW.

With the DIY version you could increase the amount of Pearl by 25% which along with the UPW should increase the gain by at least 2 fractional points (to 1.3>) Retaining the Silver Metallic element will still provide some Contrast / Black Enhancement. A big reason SF / BF both look as "deep" as they do is the build-up of multiple layers of semi-translucent coatings. That helps both absorb and retain incoming light within the surface, and creates a depth of image that really makes 3D all the more special. "S-I-L-V-E-R" had much of the same premise going for it, and was in fact part and parcel behind the retention and use of that same principle with the SF / BF applications.

You stated needs are an instance where I myself, if I was doing a Theater where the owner made such statements about 3D...and had Light Control, I would be altering the Mix to conform with such needs. That flexibility is what makes such adaptations possible. So that is why I suggest your doing likewise.

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post #2455 of 2544 Old 08-18-2016, 08:10 AM
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MississippiMan, I absolutely agree with your take on 3D glasses, and yearn for the day I find a pair that does not considerably darken the image. That is hands down the biggest down side to the 3D experience. Just to clarify, your recommendation is N/C with an additional 10oz of UPW (26oz total) and an additional 25% White Pearl (30oz total), correct?

Last edited by rayians; 08-18-2016 at 08:21 AM.
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post #2456 of 2544 Old 08-18-2016, 09:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes. I believe that mixture will provide you with all the gain and contrast assistance you need to create some spectacular 2D & 3D imagery, and have both be completely acceptable at 155" diagonal.

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post #2457 of 2544 Old 08-18-2016, 09:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
Yes. I believe that mixture will provide you with all the gain and contrast assistance you need to create some spectacular 2D & 3D imagery, and have both be completely acceptable at 155" diagonal.
Thank you SO much once again! There will be yet another MississippiMan screen in my HT that will no doubt will be more spectacular than the first one. I have some work to do before the screen is ready to spray, but give me a month or two at the most and I'll be sure to post some pics. MANY THANKS!!
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post #2458 of 2544 Old 08-21-2016, 05:08 AM
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I'm actually moving much quicker on my "to do" list than anticipated. I'm thinking 1-2 weeks from now I should be ready to tackle the screen, so I want to start gathering materials. I am taking MississippiMan's advice on paint, so that's just a trip to town and an Amazon order. I do have an existing screen, so I'm just going to put a skim coat of spackle over it and sand it out with 320 grit. After that I am looking for advice from the pros on here.

-I believe from back in the day it was recommended to prime it with Kilz. Is this still what is the norm or is has something else become the standard in the HT community?
-Is it advised to spray or roll the primer?
-What spray gun(s) is (are) currently recommended? I do have a compressor if by chance there is an air spray gun someone recommends.
-How many coats of screen paint?

Thank you all again for all of your continued efforts!

Last edited by rayians; 08-21-2016 at 06:10 AM.
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post #2459 of 2544 Old 08-21-2016, 03:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rayians View Post
I'm actually moving much quicker on my "to do" list than anticipated. I'm thinking 1-2 weeks from now I should be ready to tackle the screen, so I want to start gathering materials. I am taking MississippiMan's advice on paint, so that's just a trip to town and an Amazon order. I do have an existing screen, so I'm just going to put a skim coat of spackle over it and sand it out with 320 grit. After that I am looking for advice from the pros on here.
DO NOT USE SPACKLE !!!

Use Lightweight Drywall Joint Compound.

Quote:
-I believe from back in the day it was recommended to prime it with Kilz. Is this still what is the norm or is has something else become the standard in the HT community?
If you spray on Primer (...and you should, at least 3 coats....) the Kinsser Bulls Eye Primer is the better choice, as the Kilz needs considerable thinning.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Quote:
-Is it advised to spray or roll the primer?


Quote:
-What spray gun(s) is (are) currently recommended? I do have a compressor if by chance there is an air spray gun someone recommends.
Compressor Fed Guns require Water / Rust Filters, and non-condensing Hoses (rubber) PITA city.

The best Electric Airless HVLP is this one:
https://www.amazon.com/Earlex-0HV2901PUS-Spray-Station-Precision/dp/B00K26SJ5U/
By contacting Earlex/Wagner you can order a 1mm Needle / Nozzle Kit.

Another choice is: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00L7D78C2/
Much less expensive, but you only get a 1mm Needle, and you have to carry the unit while painting.


Quote:
-How many coats of screen paint?
7-8 "Duster-Type" coats. If you do not yet know what a Duster Coat is or how it's done, you still are on the learning curve.

Quote:
Thank you all again for all of your continued efforts!
Methinks it's only just begun.

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HAS Advanced Audio and Imaging Solutions...Audio Transducers & Projection Screen Coatings
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post #2460 of 2544 Old 08-22-2016, 08:53 AM
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Many thank you's MississippiMan! Would you recommend the same 1.0mm spray guns for priming?
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