Can't get much better than this..... - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 3 Old 09-12-2011, 09:21 AM - Thread Starter
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I posted a few weeks back about the ProjectorCentral article where I tried adding small percentages of semi-gloss to the Sherwin Williams satin. I indicated in the earlier post that up to 20 percent made tremendous improvement and really gave the image pop. Well, it turns out that I was wrong. Wrong, at least, on how was achieving an improvement.

Ok, so here is what happened. When I first started this DIY project, just as an experiment, I painted the entire melamine piece with 100 percent semi gloss. As stated in the PC article it looked horrible. Bad hotspotting. However it was definitely brighter. So I blended 10 percent semi with the rest satin and painted it on. Now the image was totally transformed. It looked amazing compared to just satin. So for an experiment I decided to try 20 percent semi to 80 percent satin. Once again there was that same pop.
However after a couple of days of curing I noticed something. The image at 20 percent was dimmer than the image at 10 percent. There was a noticeable reduction in the amount of pop I was getting. I couldn't figure it out. How could more semi result in a dimmer image?

So after many hours of thinking about it, the potential reason came to me. It must be the 100 percent semi that I initially painted giving the image pop
When painting two white colors, it doesn't really dawn on you that you need considerable number of coats to cover up the bottom layer. Imagine painting two distinct colors on a wall in your house. With just one coat the bottom color will still show through. It takes two or more coats to completely mask the old color. I wondered if this was what was happening with the whites. When I painted the initial 10 percent semi/satin it was over the 100 semi and I only used one coat.

To test the theory I decided to maximize the variables. I went out and got the full gloss (not semi) Sherwin Williams paint. I painted three coats letting them dry sufficiently between coats. Then I fired up the projector. Yep, looked horrible. Brighter, but bad hotspotting. Then I took some of the satin and thinned it with distilled water at 20 percent water to satin. I loaded the foam roller and painted it own trying to minimize the amount of paint. My goal was to put as little on while equally dispersing it. For a 100 inch screen I only went into tray twice.

I let it cure for a few hours and fired up the projector. OMG, as my daughter would say. This thing was beautiful. In my history of experimenting with DIY and buying projector screens I have never seen anything this good. The whole thing glows like a big TV. I watched Hanna last night and just sat there amazed. The whites were beaming but it was uniform across the screen. The colors were amazing and the contrast was exceptional. Not once during the movie did I ever have a projector moment where I thought, I wish the image was a little better, more like my 55 flat screen LED. I mean it really blew me away.

So the reason I titled this thread Can't get much better than this is because I don't think it can for the money. I have experimented with a lot of DIYs and purchased many different screen materials looking for that dynamic image. None compare to this. There not even close and I've had a projector mounted directly above my head projecting onto a Dalite Hipower. This image is crazy good and the material cost is only 50 dollars.

I guess that really thin layer of satin is re-dispersing the light uniformly without significantly diminishing the gain. It's still hard for me to believe that it takes so little of the satin to achieve this. I mean I put so little of it on there. Truly amazing.
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post #2 of 3 Old 09-12-2011, 09:50 AM
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sounds a bit like if mm or pb were to do a 'white fusion' with white only, no grey.
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post #3 of 3 Old 09-12-2011, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by jbelljbell View Post

sounds a bit like if mm or pb were to do a 'white fusion' with white only, no grey.

Exactly......and in fact, Light Fusion was originally directed toward the use of a White surface....not Gray, overlaid against a surface decidedly more reflective than a Gloss White....a 2nd Surface (& 1st surface) Mirror.

"White Fusion" is in fact regularly done these days by those who use Thrifty White Hardboard with it's glossy white Melamine finish and apply the various SF / RS-MaxxxMudd mixes over it via spraying. The "White Fusion" refers to the Light rebounding off the white melamine and reintroducing itself back into the topmost layer of paint. Not the color of the specific Top Coat being used.

Bsims2719, what you have duplicated is the essential premise behind GOO System's application. In that sense, that means the use of a highly reflective Glossy White Base coating covered thinly with a slightly sheen-oriented Top Coat.

Nothing new there....but it always was a valid and viable premise.

It was the expense of the GOO, combined with the inability of many to effectively roll the product*** on without getting Roller marks that led me to develop Light Fusion.

But before LF came MississippiMud, (MM) a mix that actually combined the elements of both Base & Top coats into a one-step application.

Later, Silver Metallic was added in small amounts to enhance perceived contrast and deliver a better class of Color "PoP"

Your results look as good as they do not because the Black levels have improved but rather because the Whites have received an upward "reflective-oriented" kick in the pants. Once again, the perception of increased Black-oriented contrast is coming from the enhanced reflectivity of the brighter elements of the image via the action of the translucent Top Coat and Reflective Bottom coat.

As long as such enhanced reflectivity does not result in any undue amount of projected light being reflected off adjoining surfaces and returning to the screen to wash out the Black levels, you have yourself a real "Beamer" on your hands, a screen that almost assuredly can do a great job....a better one in fact....with the PJ set on low lamp mode.

Only one thing else needs to be addressed.

It can get MUCH better........, however for what you have done...and spent, you've seemed to have obtained pretty much the pinnacle of achievement as far as using just White Paints and a Roller to make up a screen surface.

That's no small achievement. Many before you have tried and come up short and wanting. I'm glad your so pleased with your efforts.....for the lasting feeling of accomplishment is a vital part of the DIY ideal.

*** GOO always advised against thinning their product, and when it had to be done, only then with 10% distilled water. In reality, it could easily be done with 30%, but then people would not have run out prematurely and have to re-order more.
Rolling always gobbles up paint far more qickly than spraying...and if you yourself had sprayed on the Top Coat, your results almost assuredly would have been even better still.

"They said it couldn't be done. Well, we sure showed 'em otherwise!"
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