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post #1 of 13 Old 12-03-2011, 11:46 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm planning on building a DIY screen after reading through this wonderful forum. I was originally going to re purpose my 119" pull down but decided against that considering my ambient lighting. I have a Panasonic PT-AX200U projector. The room is about 11' wide for viewing distance. I'm thinking about a 92" screen on Sintra board. My local dealer (San Diego) has it in stock for $48. Throw distance will be 11' as well. The walls are a light blue shade. The ceiling is white and vaulted with the shortest end by the back wall where the couch is and the tall side on the screen side of the room. The light is semi controlled at best. Shutter style wooden blinds that let plenty of light in along with the skylight in the kitchen that brightens up the room. I'm looking for something versatile for everyday viewing with a balance for good night time performance. The day viewing will be 50% of the usage. Thanks!
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post #2 of 13 Old 12-04-2011, 03:35 AM
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Hello Dave,

PT-AX200U...a oldy but a goodie.

Many are the instances where a really good, high performance ambient light application has centered around that unit.

Straight away, I suggest you consider Silver Fire v2.5 4.0 applied directly onto the Sintra using this inexpensive HVLP sprayer. http://www.gleempaint.com/noname.html

Here are shots of that PJ and a similarly hued Silver Fire Light Fusion at 120" diagonal (w/new Bulb) at a 13' throw distance.





High ambient light is not as big an issue as is light directly washing against the screen from a source, be it Sunlight, Incandescent, or either as is reflected off a nearby surface. With a Screen on 48" high, and with the Panny's Lens Shift, you should be able to place the Screen as low on the wall as possible, therein avoiding reflective light off the Ceiling....your biggest troublemaker. (...especially during dark room viewing...)

You don't mention as to how you want to mount this Fixed Screen, but the price you stated indicates to me your getting the 6 mm thickness. Lots of options on here to choose from. Your going down a well traveled road with a great many experiences having gone before you so no worries as far as the unknown.

I would add that since your starting with a screen made from 48" x 96" Sintra (ie: White Fusion ) , that you might consider the epitome of Ambient Light Screens, Light Fusion. Purchasing a 4' x 8' x 1/8" (3 mm thick...) Acrylic Mirror would allow you to go further out to a darker SF 5.0, and give you the best performance possible due to the higher reflective index the Mirrored backing will provide. Painting a Light Fusion has only become all the more easier than ever using the darker SF versions and the new Electric HVLP Guns.

I'll tell you this....if the Mirrors were still available in the 5' x 8' and 5' x 10' x 3mm size, Sintra would still be waaaaaay down on my priority list. There is that much additional potential. You might want to check that Plastics Dealer out as the West Coast is one of the few places that Display Makers seem to consistently have need of the larger Mirror sizes. With a 5' x 10'er cut to 54" x 96" you could easily go out to 110" diagonal within your Throw and seating distance parameters. Certainly you will be able to easily get a 4' x 8'er and have them cut off one end to get the 85" length. Let me know if you need any assistance as to getting the best "mirror" price.....but as far as the best price for the Sintra, your already there.

One bit of important advice. Due to the design of the Pannys "Jot Stick" type Lens Shift control, try your very best to mount the units with the Lens as centered on the Screen as possible. Also, give yourself another 3" - 4" throw distance if possible if you do decide to go with a slightly larger Screen size. (...at 98" diagonal 11' Throw is just fine....)

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"

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post #3 of 13 Old 12-04-2011, 08:37 AM
 
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Hey Dave,
I'm in SD also. Where did you get the sintra? San Diego plastics?
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post #4 of 13 Old 12-04-2011, 11:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes San Diego Plastics is the place I contacted.

Mm- I was hoping I would get to have some dialog with you in this thread as you're the reason I'm doing this whole project. If you could direct me to where I should buy the mirror backed material that would be great. Sorry for leaving out some details. The projector will be ceiling mounted as far back against the wall as we can get. If I recall correctly the room is 12' wide in the projector/screen direction. I'm weary to go larger than 92" as I have the projector throwing an image roughly that large right now and it seems perfect. When I zoom out I have to start moving my eyes around too much to enjoy the image. Is there an advantage to that gun you linked over the Wagner control spray for $10 more?

PS your demonstration of the different gains of SF is what got me so excited about this.
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post #5 of 13 Old 12-04-2011, 11:54 AM - Thread Starter
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These photos show what the room looks like. Obviously we just moved in there's a lot of cluttered looking things. On Monday we're mounting the projector and running all of the cables (speakers, subwoofer, HDMI, cat5e, f-type) under the house in the crawl space. I bought a bunch of wall plates to finish off the job. The rear speakers will go behind the couch on either side of the window because I have an uneven wall to the left of the viewing area making side mounting challenging. Just thought I'd give you all an idea of what I'm working with.
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post #6 of 13 Old 12-04-2011, 12:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Here are some screen shots of the PSB's and a couple screen shots with the blinds closed. That's with the projector in normal lamp mode and normal video setting.
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post #7 of 13 Old 12-05-2011, 03:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave12285 View Post

Yes San Diego Plastics is the place I contacted.

Mm- I was hoping I would get to have some dialog with you in this thread as you're the reason I'm doing this whole project. If you could direct me to where I should buy the mirror backed material that would be great.

Piedmont Plastics
9040-C Activity Road
San Diego, CA 92126

Toll Free: 800-675-5150
Phone: 858-549-5150

You might want me to check for you as to pricing as that is a Wholesale house and Walk-ins often get quoted higher prices. Even with that in mind, expect a 2x increase in price of similarly sized Sintra


Quote:


Sorry for leaving out some details. The projector will be ceiling mounted as far back against the wall as we can get. If I recall correctly the room is 12' wide in the projector/screen direction. I'm weary (wary?)to go larger than 92" as I have the projector throwing an image roughly that large right now and it seems perfect. When I zoom out I have to start moving my eyes around too much to enjoy the image. Is there an advantage to that gun you linked over the Wagner control spray for $10 more?

If it is the older Control Spray, or the Double Duty, I'd go with the suggested sprayer. If you can get the Wagner Plus for $10.00 more, then grab it quick...I'll take another one of those too!

Quote:


PS your demonstration of the different gains of SF is what got me so excited about this.

Just understand that gain is not always the desired ends to a means, and often introduces it's own conditions and considerations. It's really about acheiving a balance between lumen output, throw distance vs screen size/color/gain, room colors, and lighting conditions.

You seem well fixed to achieve such a balance, but I have to question you about the hours on your Bulb.

Be advised that we can hook you up with a high gain Gray, but viewing cone will be reduced. Using Light Fusion will help mitigate that better than Sintra, but even then, you must still expect a less broad area of equal dispersion if you opt to achieve any significantly higher gain than 1.4 / 1.6

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"

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post #8 of 13 Old 12-05-2011, 07:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Awesome! Thank you very much MM. I misspoke about the gain part and i learned that last night surfing through the forums. What I meant were the darker colors of SF in the "absolute proof" thread. My bulb has a lot of hours on it. Over 1200 I believe but I'll be getting a new one soon. Either that or upgrading the projector.

If you could check on the pricing I would definitely pick up one of those mirror back substrates. Activity rd is down the street from my work too.

I saw you mentioned something about the viewing cone. I'm assuming that means that the gain will nose dive when viewing from off angles. Correct me if I'm wrong. If that's the case there's no worries. As you can see by the pictures there's only room for three people on the couch with the middle seat being centered on the screen and maybe one on either side of the couch in makeshift chairs. The projector can be mounted pretty close to the center of the screen in respect to height and width if that helps.
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post #9 of 13 Old 12-05-2011, 02:36 PM
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Well, more important to me is avoiding the prospect of being able to see the Screen's surface in areas of light content, as when viewed from closer than normal distances.

"Speckles" or "Specularity" has always been a trade-off...or caveat if you will...of having any degree of significant gain. Over time we have licked the "Hot Spotting" issue, but when there is a marked difference between the highly reflective and less reflective elements in a Screen coating, the darker elements tend to stand out.

Many have wrongly stated that the phenomena is the brighter particles are "sparkling" when in fact it's the darker areas that are being predominant in making their presence
apparent to the eye.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"

http://www.invisiblestereo.com
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post #10 of 13 Old 12-06-2011, 09:00 AM - Thread Starter
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That's an interesting response. I was under the impression that you want me to use the darker SF 4.0 instead of the 3.0 on the acrylic mirror. Was that still the plan? If so, did you find out a price from the plastics place?

After cutting into the ceiling yesterday I found that we can mount the projector about 6" closer so the throw will be decreased slightly. Another option would be to mount it as far back as possible making it closer to the center of the screen. The closer I get the higher the projector will be due to the vaulted ceiling.
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post #11 of 13 Old 12-06-2011, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave12285 View Post

That's an interesting response. I was under the impression that you want me to use the darker SF 4.0 instead of the 3.0 on the acrylic mirror. Was that still the plan? If so, did you find out a price from the plastics place?

4.0 would be it. I called and got a Wholesale / Dealer's price of $158.00 for 3mm Mirror 4' x 8' (...a Walk-in would pay almost 15% more...)
That's about a $45.00 increase since last Fall, and $70.00 uptick since 2009....and one primary reason that SF was reformulated 2 years ago so it would work "almost" as well as it did in a LF application. What had to be done was to increase gain to make up for the loss of the Fusion effect...primarily with White levels. The other reason was the loss of availability of truly epic sized Mirrors in 5' x 8' and 5' x 10 /6' x 10' sizes.

Quote:


After cutting into the ceiling yesterday I found that we can mount the projector about 6" closer so the throw will be decreased slightly. Another option would be to mount it as far back as possible making it closer to the center of the screen. The closer I get the higher the projector will be due to the vaulted ceiling.

Closer is always gonna be better, and with the right Mount selection, the 1.5" diameter PVC Drop Pole can accommodate whatever length you need to minimize the necessary amount of Vertical Lens Shift.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"

http://www.invisiblestereo.com
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post #12 of 13 Old 12-06-2011, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Thank you for getting that price. How do I go about actually buying it at that price?

I just did some measurements and while they're not exact they will serve as a very close estimate. The lens will be 6'6" off the ground. The throw will be 9'6". This is with the standard drop from the mount I have.

I forgot to answer your question a few days ago about how I will mount the board to the wall. Well I was originally to use your idea of the 2x4's on the wall and truss head screw the board to that. Now I'm a little lost on how to get the mirror on the 2x4's. I'm also planning on using rope lighting around the wood base and putting dimmable wall sconces on either side I the screen as there is now lighting in the room currently.

Here are some pics of our progress yesterday. Today is the lighting and drywall patching. All the wall plates are in which is not reflected in the photos.
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post #13 of 13 Old 12-12-2011, 09:25 AM
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OK Dave....wassup?

I just know your not stuck somewhere gazing into a unpainted Mirror.

I'm planning a trip into SD to do a Commercial Screen just after the first of January. I hope we'll be able to meet up for a Brew....or two. PM me a contact number if interested.

To quote James T. Kirk;
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