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post #1 of 39 Old 03-20-2012, 03:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I have a benq w6000 and have been using a sheet of drywall as a screen while I finish my theater room(it actually looks great to me). Well its just about finished and I am in need of a screen. I was looking at the monoprice 120" multi-format because of the built in masking system and much lower price tag than da-lite and caradas offerings. Unsure of the build quality of the monoprice screen I have been a bit nervous about plopping down the cash for it, so I figured since my entire theater is diy and so are my subs, I might as well continue going the diy route.

I need to know what paint formula will best fit my viewing conditions. My ceilings are black, walls are taped mudded and waiting for the first coat of paint, I am going with a very dark charcoal grey. I would like to do a screen that is 120"-130". I have some screen samples from da-lite and carada and liked the da-matte and classic cinema white. Is it recommended to spray the screen over rolling it on? I only ask because my good friend is a graffiti artist, so if spaying is best he is the man for the job.

I am also going to build a masking system but that is for another thread. Any help in choosing the correct paint would be great.
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post #2 of 39 Old 03-20-2012, 06:06 PM
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Hi there!

OK...first off, depending on your location, acquiring a sheet of 6mm x 60" x 120" Sintra is the first step. Have the Height cut down to 50", leaving the width of 120" as is. That will provide you with a 130" 2.35:1 Format Screen. With the w6000's H&V Lens Shift and Zoom, Constant Image Height is available, and the only masking you'll ever have to do is at the side when switching into 16:9

These could be removable Black covered panels, or simply Black Velvet Curtains on Travis Rods on each side, ready to pull in to mask the inside edges of the 16:9 image.

Mounting it on the wall is next, and mounting the Sintra directly onto the wall is best, using a Elastomeric Adhesive Caulk...about 6 tubes worth, spread out smoothly after being applied in 1/4" beads top to bottom, spaced at 1/2"

The Sintra should lay flat...and now comes the painting.

For a dedicated room like yours with such an ideal paint scheme, a excellent White could easily suffice. But if ever...ever you deign to turn on any lights, contrast will suffer.

One in your position need not worry too awful lot about having a screen surface specifically intended to combat ambient light (...and certainly not reflected light...) however painting a well done "Light Silver Gray" surface with 1.3 gain could only give you all the more leeway under any reasonable ambient light situations. You would not have to be so "intense" of someone request a little illumination. and they will...count on it.

Such a screen can & will still deliver accurate colors and terrific Whites. better still, the gain available will allow you to run that BenQ Beamer on low lamp, and in "best" mode...and either a decent Avia, Video Essentials, or Disney WoW calibration to the light shade of Gray, things will be optimally as good as they can be under a variety of situations.

Ahhhh...but what "Silver Gray"? RS-MaxxMudd LL

That's a mix you can either Roll on or spray (...spraying is the BomB...and much preferred...) Spraying is inexpensive too!
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1398335

So now the Sintra is painted. Unless you paint your rear wall the same Black as the ceiling and simply "Float" your Screen, you'll take 1/2" x 3.25" MDF Base and Miter Cut 4 sticks, then wrap the Trim pieces in Black Velvet. (...same stuff you'd make the Curtains out of...$7.50 yard...)

The Trim then simply butts up against all 4 sides of the Sintra, and is attached to the wall using 1.5" Bright Finish nails....and hitting studs is not important...you drive the nails in at opposing angles to "cleat' the trim against the wall. You "set" the finish nails so they are just under the Black Velvet. Here's a tutorial.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=865218

Consider this route as far as the masking requirements, The Curtains could be motorized & automated, but even with that, the savings on the Screen alone will allow you to consider the best choice of hardware, yet the job of designing a masking system will be immeasurably easier since it would only involve Side Curtains.

I like the potential of your Theater...and I've wanted to try focusing on some applications that would utilize the w6000. It's advent of having H&V Lens Shift AND being a DLP just might start me leaning toward using DLPs with a degree of frequency not seen since 2005
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post #3 of 39 Old 03-20-2012, 07:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you for such a thorough detailed reply I do like the idea of being able to turn the lights up for football games and tv viewing but am mainly concerned about the best black level when the lights are out. If going to a 1.3 gain will not hurt the black levels then I am all for it.

My plan was to make a 120" 16:9 and mask it to do 2:35. Most of my viewing is gaming and they are all 16:9. Movies are a weekend only event when friends come over.

Thanks again for all the info, I will be looking for the sintra tomorrow.
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post #4 of 39 Old 03-20-2012, 07:42 PM
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I like the direction this thread is taking! Subscribed for hopefully many more updates and PICS.
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post #5 of 39 Old 03-21-2012, 05:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krbass View Post

Thank you for such a thorough detailed reply I do like the idea of being able to turn the lights up for football games and tv viewing but am mainly concerned about the best black level when the lights are out. If going to a 1.3 gain will not hurt the black levels then I am all for it.

To get there, all you need to do is determine to use a Gray surface that also possesses that degree of gain

Quote:
My plan was to make a 120" 16:9 and mask it to do 2:35. Most of my viewing is gaming and they are all 16:9. Movies are a weekend only event when friends come over.

Thanks again for all the info, I will be looking for the sintra tomorrow.

Well be advised that making an effective masking system to accommodate Horizontal masking for 2.35:1 content is not a easy or very affordable task. That's why the Screen Mfg charge a bundle for such a feature. You want it...they'll provide it...but the cost....the COST!!!

So lets consider that since your going to do a majority of your viewing in 16:9

If your wall is well finished and the resulting surface free of defects, then it is a very viable option to use as a screen.

That being said, painting a 60' x 143" area will provide you with the 122" diagonal 16:9 surface area you so desire, but when you pull back the Curtains and watch a Movie, your screen size will expand to a epic 155"s of sublime immersion.

Krbass, I tell you the truth....Constant Image Height and simple vertical masking is the only way to go. Painting the wall to be the Screen, even more so. Save money! Do it right! Make people be amazed over how the wall can perform. A huge part of the fun in DIY is seeing what we call the "Jaw Drop Syndrome" kick in. Oh yeah...and the "Eyes popping out" is pretty hilarious too.

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post #6 of 39 Old 03-21-2012, 05:58 AM - Thread Starter
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I will have to see what the maximum width the screen can be, but this sounds awesome. Even if I need to go a little bit smaller to say 116" in 16:9 that would be fine. I'll do some measuring as soon as I get home.

Would this mean that I would not use Sintra and just paint directly on the wall? The widest sintra sheets i found were 120" and its around 200 shipped.
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post #7 of 39 Old 03-21-2012, 06:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krbass View Post

I will have to see what the maximum width the screen can be, but this sounds awesome. Even if I need to go a little bit smaller to say 116" in 16:9 that would be fine. I'll do some measuring as soon as I get home.

We'll be waiting......

Quote:
Would this mean that I would not use Sintra and just paint directly on the wall?

To quote Rango; "Thats what I said!"

That Sir, is DIY Screen making to the Bone.

Quote:
The widest sintra sheets I found were 120" and its around 200 shipped.

Finger Lakes is in NY, right? I'm sure I could find you Sintra for less...a lot less, but with shipping, yeah, it's gonna cost.

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post #8 of 39 Old 03-21-2012, 02:59 PM - Thread Starter
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We'll be waiting......

Ok, the width will work. tomorrow night I will have to see if my projector can shoot that large of an image and also make sure I won't puke from the massive size.

What is the best black velvet to buy? Would joann fabrics be ok or do you know of a better online retailer?


Also what is the best way to paint the wall the screen will be going on? As of right now it is just a taped and mudded wall and I was told at lowes I need to use a special drywall paint before I put anything else on it. would I need a special roller with a low nap?

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Finger Lakes is in NY, right? I'm sure I could find you Sintra for less...a lot less, but with shipping, yeah, it's gonna cost.

It is, I am actually in Rochester now and thats 1 hour north of where I was.
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post #9 of 39 Old 03-21-2012, 03:01 PM
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Syfabrics. That's what i used.
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post #10 of 39 Old 03-26-2012, 02:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok so I tested out the size and it will work, but when I zoom to do the 2:35 content my center channel gets blasted with the grey bar and lights up like an xmas tree. Is there an AT blackout fabric I can use to cover it?
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post #11 of 39 Old 04-08-2012, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by michaelddd View Post

I like the direction this thread is taking! Subscribed for hopefully many more updates and PICS.

Me too. I'm nowhere near being able to start a project like this yet, but researching and following along with others is fun and educational. My wife and I are currently living in a two-bedroom condo and looking at buying a house this spring/summer; we have a 16-month-old daughter and the condo is ready to burst at the seams. While there are a lot of other factors that go into our house decision -- some of them admittedly more "important" like school system, neighborhood, commute -- I'd be lying if I said I didn't linger a little longer in the basement of every house that we see, trying to figure out how and where I would put everything together.
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Me too. I'm nowhere near being able to start a project like this yet, but researching and following along with others is fun and educational. My wife and I are currently living in a two-bedroom condo and looking at buying a house this spring/summer; we have a 16-month-old daughter and the condo is ready to burst at the seams. While there are a lot of other factors that go into our house decision -- some of them admittedly more "important" like school system, neighborhood, commute -- I'd be lying if I said I didn't linger a little longer in the basement of every house that we see, trying to figure out how and where I would put everything together.

If I could buy you a beer, I would. Your situation is almost identical to my situation. We have a 2.5 year old and are renting a house right now. My job has kept me moving every 5 years or so, preventing the purchase of my own home. When you rent, you can't really do what you want to the place b/c you'll have to "fix it all" when you leave. Though ironically enough, we would consider a bedroom painted black, soundproofed, with outlets and bannana jacks in the wall PERFECTLY FIXED. LOL!

I'll be retiring in the next 18 months and we'll FINALLY buy a house. Wife has already blessed the idea of turning a bedroom into a dedicated HT (there are no basements in Texas). I cannot wait. We're talking complete decoupling of the room from the house...building the "room within a room" thing. I am no pro, but I have tools and can learn. Who knows? Maybe we'll get lucky and get a house with a bonus room above a garage or something. However it works out, I'll finally have my dedicated HT. I'm so tired of dealing with WAF and landlords. I look at the HT build threads where folks are sheetrocking and debating where to place the riser...I have to fight for where to put the remote down where it won't look bad if company comes over. Someday, and it's coming soon.
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post #13 of 39 Old 04-09-2012, 12:11 PM
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If I could buy you a beer, I would.

Tell you what: if you're ever in Chicago, look me up and I'll buy *you* a beer.

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I am no pro, but I have tools and can learn.

That is exactly my feeling. Some of the places that we've seen have finished basements, which is exciting because I could get something up and running more quickly. On the other hand, an existing layout is less intriguing than a blank canvas where I can dream up whatever I want. I'd of course be limited by my lack of experience and carpentry skills, but I think it would be really rewarding to learn.

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I look at the HT build threads where folks are sheetrocking and debating where to place the riser...

Yep, that kind of stuff is so exciting. Maybe we'll both be working on our buildouts at the same time and can laugh at (and learn from) each other's mistakes. Best of luck!
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post #14 of 39 Old 04-09-2012, 12:34 PM
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Hey Dudes....

DIY Screens can be a "One Stop" for most any/all information on DIY Theater Builds, and you'll get some purposefully directed advice. In effect, a great many items in a Build can have much to do with PJ choice and the type Screen surface one needs.

So we advise on all of it.

I personally have been building Theaters since 1978, and doin' 'em on a Budget has always been paramount in what I would suggest. It's gotta be good....it's gotta be special, but it also should be affordable, and I'll tell ya this, the routes many determine to take based on advice given on "Dedicated Home Theater Construction" can run 180 degrees opposite from saving money.

So....take advantage of whatever free, sage advice you can gather. Consider that those who do many such projects might have suggestions that are better suited to your particular circumstances than what you might find coming from a example where it simply looks great...but cost a great deal more than necessary.

In the end, it always helps to have a varied and wide selection of potential alternatives. The only down side? You can want it "ALL" and/or get considerable "brain-lock" by over viewing too much information and trying to decide who/what's right and who/what is not.

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post #15 of 39 Old 04-09-2012, 07:51 PM
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Hey Dudes....
[...]
So we advise on all of it.

Much appreciated! You may end up regretting this if/when I ever get to a point where I can start a project -- I'll be needing plenty of advice.
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post #16 of 39 Old 04-09-2012, 08:20 PM
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Much appreciated! You may end up regretting this if/when I ever get to a point where I can start a project -- I'll be needing plenty of advice.

Been there, done that. No worries...I'm a glutton for punishment.

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post #17 of 39 Old 04-10-2012, 09:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Well I am getting closer to painting the screen. This week I am taping the back wall and putting finishing touches on the ceiling and electric.

I decided I am going to spray the entire room black(walls and ceiling).

I tested out a bunch of screen sizes and am still unsure what ratio to go with. I just might do a 133" 16:9 and make a removable masking for movies, something simple, lightweight and cheap. The idea of zooming was cool but my ceilings are low and the black bars when I zoom in end up hitting the ceiling and my speaker.

Will it be bad if the wall the screen is going on gets painted black? I only ask because I will be doing the painting with a wagner sprayer and if it is not a big deal will just blast everything. I ordered the recommended HVLP sprayer for the screen. Excited to see how it all turns out.

I can not wait to finally finish this room so I can sit on my arse and play mass effect 3, got the game and just can not bring myself to play it on my monitor.
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post #18 of 39 Old 04-10-2012, 11:02 AM
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Krbass,

Use Disney Color "Mouse Ears' for your Black, and use a Satin Base (spraying will "flatten" out any degree of satin sheen...)

Painting the Screen wall Black is just fine. It's just usually a non-issue because projected light reflects away from the wall...it cannot circle back. So usually, in a darkened room situation, even a light colored screen wall looks black as night.

hey...there is a good solution to the "bars' issue. Paint the Wall / ceiling Black, but apply this stuff:

http://www.fpi-protostar.com/hitack.htm
FPR-02 Hi-tack flocked light trap material "mini-roll"; self-adhesive (30" width x 200" length roll) $85.00

You'd only need a 30" wide strip across the ceiling above the screen.

Don't let something as silly as black bars stop you from getting the picture size you want. besides, with a 2.35:1 widescreen, when you zoom out, you only need to pull back some side curtains for masking, and in 16:9, simply pull them inward to the edges of the content. And by placing a small cover of Black Spandex over the speaker, it's presence will be mitigated.

Nothing is easier than that!

Anyway, the largest 16:9 image you can get will always be the same height as the 2.35:1 image, so you really have nothing to lose (well...$80.00) by trying the CIH approach first. Don't try it, and you just might never know how close you came to having something far more spectacular than you could imagine.

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post #19 of 39 Old 04-13-2012, 04:39 AM - Thread Starter
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OK I am sold. All I need now is the recommended paint for the screen.
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post #20 of 39 Old 04-13-2012, 06:40 AM
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I'd venture that because you're going to need some significant gain because of screen size,
RS-MaxxMudd LL. That joyce will also allow you to roll on the first coat of screen paint, lightly sand it, and then spray 1 or 2 other coats on top.

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post #21 of 39 Old 04-13-2012, 08:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Tbh I thought the image looked great on my drywall. Whatever paint I choose I just don't want to lose any contrast. The benq black levels are the only thing that I wish were a little better.
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post #22 of 39 Old 04-18-2012, 04:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

I'd venture that because you're going to need some significant gain because of screen size,
RS-MaxxMudd LL. That joyce will also allow you to roll on the first coat of screen paint, lightly sand it, and then spray 1 or 2 other coats on top.

Walls are ready for paint now. what type of roller would I use for the MaxMudd LL and what do you recommend for sanding the first coat?
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post #23 of 39 Old 04-18-2012, 04:30 PM - Thread Starter
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BTW, has anyone dealt with movies that change aspect ratios. I assume for films like dark knight or tron I will be watching them in 16:9 format. I wish they did not switch it like that, whoever decided this was a good idea needs a beat down
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post #24 of 39 Old 04-19-2012, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
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Walls are ready for paint now. what type of roller would I use for the MaxMudd LL and what do you recommend for sanding the first coat?

1/4" High Quality Roller...pre-dampened slightly with water before set into Paint Tray.

Get Large (3" x 8" x 1") "Fine Sanding Sponge" in the Drywall dept at Home Depot. They are NOT in the paint department.

Be sure to sand very lightly using broad, sweeping strokes that overlap each other.


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BTW, has anyone dealt with movies that change aspect ratios. I assume for films like dark knight or tron I will be watching them in 16:9 format. I wish they did not switch it like that, whoever decided this was a good idea needs a beat down

Many employ a 2.35:1 width screen, with side mask curtains or attachable panels that are placed when 16:9 content in viewed.

Using Zoom, and lens Shift, the 2.35:1 content is zoomed out to fill the entire width of the screen surface (...the curtains retracted-panels removed...)

The principle is well know as CIH (Constant Image Height) and is well loved by it's stanchest advocates...those with particularly Ginormous sized screens whose sole purpose is to allow the Owner to revel in the absolute Biggest Widescreen image possible.

Most PJs must be manually adjusted for the procedure, but a very select few (such as the Panny 3000 - 4000- 7000 series...) have what is called "Lens memory" and if set up properly, automatically places the image within the desire screen formatted parameters.

JVC PJs have motorized Zoom / lens Shift, with is easier than twiddling with dials, Lens rings and levers,

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post #25 of 39 Old 04-30-2012, 08:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is a quick image I took last night testing out screen sizes and making sure my mud job was flat. I decided on a CIH of 54".



I am behind on everything atm and hope to paint the screen in a week or so. I will have detailed pics and impressions.
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post #26 of 39 Old 05-05-2012, 12:52 PM - Thread Starter
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How wide should the frame pieces be? I'm using 3.25" mdf
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post #27 of 39 Old 05-06-2012, 03:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krbass View Post

How wide should the frame pieces be? I'm using 3.25" mdf

That size will do nicely with a 54" x 96" - 129" (2.39:1)

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post #28 of 39 Old 05-07-2012, 07:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Wouldn't I be doing a 2.35:1 screen? Then mask down to 16:9. My measurements have me at a lot wider than 96".

When I asked about the width I didn't mean the overall width of the screen but the width of the screen border/frame.

I am no longer using mdf. The pieces I had have serious water damage on the back side. What do you recommend instead?
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post #29 of 39 Old 05-09-2012, 04:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Masked off screen area before paint tonight. My CIH is 56".



Still wondering what I should use for the frame.
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post #30 of 39 Old 05-09-2012, 06:50 AM
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Home Depot sells 3.25" Simple Curved "MDF" Baseboard Trim in 16' lengths. You simply cut each piece to 7" longer than the actual screen's width / height and then miter cut the ends.

Home Depot allows you to cut the lengths you need from the 16' stock, and in many stores there is a simple Plastic Miter Box & Saw provided at the cut table for Customers to use.

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