Electric screen to Tab Tension conversion - with Silver Fire v2.5 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 84 Old 09-19-2012, 08:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Contacted a local AV dealer looking for a used or returned Mgf screen at a cheap price. My plan is to re paint it with SF 3.0 MM style.

As it turned out the dealer could not come down to my budget and I had to leave empty handed. But, just as I was about to exit the storage room (where all the goodies resides) the service rep pointed down the hall at a long cardboard box. He told me this was a 110" electric 16/9 screen that was faulty.

When the screen comes down it's not level and therefore it was mine for the taking free of charge. Being a tinker this should fit me just fine.

At home I took a quick look at the mechanics and found that the screens shaft had popped out of its bearing during transport. Some of the sheet metal holding the other end in place had also been bent a little but should be ok.

If all turns out well then I'll be following MM on dkings thread, trying to get as much input as possible before diving in and painting my own screen.

Fingers crossed.biggrin.gif
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post #2 of 84 Old 09-19-2012, 10:54 AM - Thread Starter
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The disassembly of my screen went well. Just drilled out 4 pop rivets and unscrewed the screen motor. The only damage it seems is the braket holding the motor side of the screen. It's somewhat bent but some muscles and a hammer should get it into the right shape. This will have to wait until tomorrow cause now I'm of swimming.




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post #3 of 84 Old 09-20-2012, 05:02 AM - Thread Starter
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IT'S ALIVE, MOAHAHAHA...

It's working just fine. It does have some wrinkles but I can't complain, it's a freebie. biggrin.gif



Sorry for the img quality - iphone.

I'm thinking of a DIY tab tension to correct some of the wrinkles and there is a lot of screen to work with as I was aiming for a 100" when I started my quest for a used/returned screen.

Does anyone have any experience with adding or painting black border/trimming on a roller screen?

Now all there is to do is to wait for supplies to arrive in the mail and some good tips from MM in dkings thread, Then I should be ready to spay away.
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post #4 of 84 Old 09-21-2012, 06:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Just a quick sketch up of the tab tension system I'm going for.



The tabs are 10cm cutouts of the screen itself were the screen is removed and the tabs left. Then they are cut and glued to the right sizes with the tension cord running through them.

Four tabs on each side so the screen will measure 220cm after the tabs have been made. Add in a 5cm border, I'm left with 210cm horizontal. This will give us a 95" screen that will suit our living room just fine.

The borders will be spayed on as instructed by MM here: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1167885/possible-to-repaint-screen-border
The hight of the screen is 150cm so that gives me the opportunity to add prox 25cm of black border on top.

As counterweight I'm using two 10cm rebar or steel rods found in the junk at a local work shop.

Have not decided on the tension cord and are open for any suggestions.
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post #5 of 84 Old 09-21-2012, 07:16 AM
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The cord must be very thin and not have a rough surface. Thick Polyester Thread, or a coated 30lb test fishing line might be the best solution.

Over the years a few on AVS have tried doing this sort of thing. I recall no one heralding any really positive results, but absolutely do not let that give you pause.

You seem to have a real direction to follow, so keep us all informed.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #6 of 84 Old 09-21-2012, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks MM.

Yes, the fishing line is one of the options I'm looking into. If it comes in black braided polyester then I'm sure that it is going to be a good fit. I'm also going to reinforce the inside of the tabs with fiber adhesive tape.

The way I'm cutting the screen is to ensure that the cord does not interfere with the screen while rolled up. Otherwise it may get wrinkled. Also I'm not adding any material to the border and believe this will result in a longer lasting wrinkle free screen.

I'm following dkings thread and understand that you will not be painting until after your Maui trip. Catch some big ones and let the beer quench your thirst;)
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post #7 of 84 Old 09-23-2012, 01:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Wonders never cease!

Yesterday after discussing the placement of the screen with my wife, she started tearing down the ugly wooden panels in our living room. This to make place for double drywalls with green glue. My soon also helped and was quite proud to do some demo.

But earlier that day I hurt my back during tile work in the ground floor bathroom and had to observe the bulldozing of the walls from a couch. I did however enjoy the sight of my beautiful wife with a crowbar working up a sweat wink.gif
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post #8 of 84 Old 09-24-2012, 05:59 AM - Thread Starter
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I went to a local sport store in search of some black fishing line 30 lbs or more. I told the service person about my project with the screen and he gladly gave me 25' of Berkley fishing Fireline 60 lbs for free. Just love when people want to help out.

The Fireline should fit the ticket as a tension cord as it does not stretch, is black and has a very smooth surface. These are all the qualities I'm after as it will not cut through the screen tabs which will be reinforced with adhesive fiber tape.

Do to my sore back there will not be much progress the next couple of days but here are some photos of the living room tear down:




My soon with a crowbar. He had a blast and was so proud being able to tear down the panels:



Here with the ugly wooden panels finally removed:



Bye, bye wooden panels and good riddance.biggrin.gif
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post #9 of 84 Old 09-25-2012, 09:48 AM - Thread Starter
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MM do you have any recommendations for black non reflective border paint?

Fond the Liquitex Basics in a local store here in Bergen. I'm sure they can order in the specific colors but for now they only carry primary once. They do however carry the silver and gold basic color.
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post #10 of 84 Old 10-01-2012, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rengep View Post

Just a quick sketch up of the tab tension system I'm going for.

Four tabs on each side so the screen will measure 220cm after the tabs have been made. Add in a 5cm border, I'm left with 210cm horizontal. This will give us a 95" screen that will suit our living room just fine.

With only 4 tabs per side I wonder if it would be effective to put 4 grommets per side with corresponding attachment points on the adjacent walls. Using perhaps a very light weight bungie type of material rather than something that doesn't stretch. It would have to be hooked and unhooked each time the screen was lowered or perhaps just two at the bottom corners pulling down and to the side a bit would be enough?

There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so.
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post #11 of 84 Old 10-01-2012, 10:56 AM - Thread Starter
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My opinion on your first suggestion is that it will work but leaves you with lots of work every time you choose to roll up or down. But the pull must be completely horizontal and not interfere with the vertical pull on the screen and might prove very difficult to get a good working result. The second suggestion will probably not work as the pull will be diagonal thus not suspend and straighten out the sides of the screen.

I chose to copy the idea of the new draper tab tension which are presented on youtube and try to make some workable weights similar to adeo to pull the tension cords.

My opinions are in no way or form meant to discourage you but hopefully give some kind of guidance to a solution you can be happy with. Taking into account that there are only a few threads about DIY tab tension and no one has a solution that I would be happy with.

As for my own project I should be able to start cutting the screen this week.
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post #12 of 84 Old 10-01-2012, 12:00 PM
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I have had an Elite gray nontensioned screen for five years. It has never developed a wrinkle. I believe one of the reasons is that the bottom bar is heavy.

It's just me, but before I started trying to convert to a nontensioned to a tensioned screen, I'd attach a heavy pole on the bottom and let it hang there for a couple weeks. I might also try to maybe glue lengths of cord to the back of the screen near the side edges, and pull them until the wrinkles were flat - and leave that a few weeks.

I think you could end up with an ugly result if you try to make it tensioned. I am pretty sure I couldn't do the job attractively.
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post #13 of 84 Old 10-01-2012, 12:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Lone Cloud.

I agree with you that doing a conversion of a perfectly fine screen is just plain nonsence. As for the bottom bar on my "free" screen, it's heavy alright. But it does have some wrinkles because it was damaged during transport.

I'm choosing to cut out the tabs both because the screen is a little oversized for our living room and because most of the damaged part of the screen is on 3-4" on each side. Not to mention the benefit of not adding any extra parts to the screen it self, thus preventing getting aditional wrinkles when rolled up.
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post #14 of 84 Old 10-01-2012, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rengep View Post

MM do you have any recommendations for black non reflective border paint?
Fond the Liquitex Basics in a local store here in Bergen. I'm sure they can order in the specific colors but for now they only carry primary once. They do however carry the silver and gold basic color.

Well...., over on this side of the Big Puddle, Disney's Mouse Ears is a preferred "Black".

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #15 of 84 Old 10-02-2012, 03:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks MM. smile.gif

I did read something about that color but could not recall what it was painted on.

Might be difficult to find the mouse color here but I'll have a look at the spec on it and try something similar. Maybe ebay can help
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post #16 of 84 Old 10-02-2012, 04:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Ahh.. finally some progress. My back has healed enough for me to take down and prep the screen for cutting. I'm also going to try straighten out some of the smaller wrinkles on the lower right of the screen with and iron set to low. Of course with a cloth to protect the screen.





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post #17 of 84 Old 10-02-2012, 04:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Here are some of the tools I'll be using:

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post #18 of 84 Old 10-02-2012, 06:01 AM - Thread Starter
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All masked and ready to cut. I decided on 6 tabs on each side for a more even pull. The tabs will be an inch thick and rounded of at the screen edge.

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post #19 of 84 Old 10-02-2012, 08:37 AM - Thread Starter
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OK I've done some cutting and it's going great. To round of the corners between the tabs and the screen I'm using a scraper as a guide.

While cutting I'm locking my arm in one position and using my body to move the cutting knife. This way I'm more likely not going to cut to far. I can't mess up as there is no gluing any tabs back on.

You might understand I'm somewhat nervous cutting this screen despite it being a freebie.





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post #20 of 84 Old 10-03-2012, 06:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Got all the tabs cut out without cutting to far. eek.gif

Next I'll be cutting of each side of the bar and measuring the best sizes for the tabs to get an even pull. Was thinking in the lines of:

2" - 1" - 1/2" - 1/2" - 1" - 2"

The cut bars will be reconnected with small hinges and filled with lead.



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post #21 of 84 Old 10-03-2012, 07:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Oh, I almost forgot... Here's a beautiful picture of the fishing line 60 lbs. wink.gif

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post #22 of 84 Old 10-03-2012, 09:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Masked up the bottom bar and are ready to cut. The bar is made of aluminum and has a steel rod through it. The hard part is going to cut through the steel rod with a jig saw. Can't use a grinder as it may damage the screen.



Here's the super glue I'll be using on the tabs: (better watch those fingers tongue.gif)

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post #23 of 84 Old 10-03-2012, 11:59 AM - Thread Starter
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The cutting proved to be quite a challenge. The steel rod inside the aluminum bar were to tough for the jig saw. Instead I had to flip the bar and saw the four sides of it to get it loose and pull it of the inner steel rod. The steel rod is actually loose inside the bar and I'll be taking it out and cut it into shape with a grinder.

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post #24 of 84 Old 10-04-2012, 11:58 PM - Thread Starter
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The grinder did not disappoint and cut through the steel like a hot knife through butter. Next I'll be filling the cut bar ends with lead and attach a mini hinge to them.

Regarding black acrylic for the border there seems to be no Disney mouse black in my country. The blackest I could find was charcoal black.
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post #25 of 84 Old 10-05-2012, 08:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Got the lead fit into the end bars and they are now at least twice the weight they were with the cut steel rod. Also glued the hinges on with CA glue to the end bars.





Did some measuring and laid down the cutout from the screen to get a visual idea how the cord will pull the screen via the tabs. The cords angle has to increase from tab to tab to get an even pull (except for the two tabs in the middle). When attaching the cord to the end bars, the closer to the hinge the more pull but less flexible adjustment room.

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post #26 of 84 Old 10-05-2012, 01:07 PM
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You're making some good progress and your work looks very nice.

There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so.
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post #27 of 84 Old 10-05-2012, 01:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Chezteladog. Trying to get a couple of hours in every day but with kids and work the build will take some time. But most important, I'm enjoying my self and learning new stuff from the build and the members on this forum.
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post #28 of 84 Old 10-08-2012, 05:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Some more progress. Been hold up with tiling a bathroom this weekend.

Got the right side tabs measured and cut. Reinforced them with fiber tape and glued them into place with CA glue.

A good tip is to pre fold the tabs to get the angles measured and in sync with the other tabs. Also use a protective cloth on the screen as to much fat transfered onto the screen from your hands probably will affect the end result if you decide to respray the screen. To avoid gluing the tabs to the floor, keep a cutout between the tabs and the floor.

I did all this without any accidents. Pure luck I guess. tongue.gif

When doing the angle measuring you'll quickly discover that the tabs needs some fitting by cutting some of the top or bottom of the tabs that stick out when folded into place. This will not affect the tensioning and if you don't mind the end result with out fitting the tabs, then don't bother cutting.

Here are some progress photos:



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post #29 of 84 Old 10-08-2012, 12:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Measured and pre folded the left side of the screen. Did also strengthen the tabs with fiber tape. Should get them done tomorrow and start drilling holes in the tension weights for the cord.



Used masking tape on the floor to measure the length and angle of the tabs.
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post #30 of 84 Old 10-10-2012, 04:38 AM - Thread Starter
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A quick update.

Drilled holes in the tension weights for the cord and glued them to the bottom bar. The hinges are from some old broken ray ban fakes that fits the job perfectly.



Next on the to do list is fastening the tension cord to the screens shaft, mount the screen back into its housing and roll it back up.

Then there is the fine tuning of the tension weights and the cords.
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