Painting Onto A 106" Tab Tensioned Screen with Silver Fire v2.5 4.0 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 66 Old 10-03-2012, 05:14 AM - Thread Starter
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OK...vacation is over. Let's get'ter dun!

Here are some images of the screen

Front

ATensionedRetractableFrontview.jpg

Side

ATensionedRetractableSideview.jpg

Up inside the Custom made Slotted Inclosue


ATensionedRetractableupintheslot.jpg

Down through the Slot.

ATensionedRetractabledownthrutheslot.jpg

Now to go paint the darn thing!

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #2 of 66 Old 10-03-2012, 06:32 AM
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Been waiting for this with high expectations. Hope you you have enough time to make movies as well.

Will follow this thread closely.
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post #3 of 66 Old 10-03-2012, 06:42 PM
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MM, what projector will be used for this SF V2.5 4.0 screen?
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post #4 of 66 Old 10-04-2012, 12:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Well................................Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz !

It was a all-nighter with me alternating between installing several if the 13 Volume controls and running upstairs to spray the 8 coats of paint over 30-35 min. intervals. I came home at 9:30 am to fall out and now I'm on my way back.

I used the Graco with a 1mm needle assembly, and the results were absolutely among the best, smoothest finish ever. I'm supposing that those who have had some difficulty with getting non-orange peel results should consider getting the 1.5 mm Needle kit. 1MM produces a awfully fine mist w/reduced Spray Pattern and it made me have to apply 8 coats (...maybe 9...who knows, I was semi-aware of my surroundings anyway... redface.gif )

I also had to slow down to 2' per second is maximum overlap. But by far the biggest time consumer was masking off the Screen and the entire room, (...building a 3 sided Spray booth ...) 6 pm to 12:30 am. I used special Green Tape to edge the screen (..Frog Tape..great stuff....) that prevents edge crawl and had 99.99% success to the point I had maybe 2 little tiny dots creep onto the Black Surround.

Anyway...I have photos and movies (4 of the latter) but I have to go and get a LOT of other stuff finished between now and 4 am tomorrow. I will try to post up during any breaks I feel I can make.

But just wait until you see the "before & After" shots! Whoooo Boy! Bright to Ultra Dark Gray (SF v2.5 4.0 actually)

I feel this is a "Million Dollar" Screen! Why? Because feeling like I do now....it would take getting a million dollars to do another! eek.gif

Wolfie....,
I'm using a Short Throw WXGA DLP (1280 x 800) Viewsonic w/3K lumens and 15,000:1 Contrast (...the highest of any Presentation-oriented PJ around) It has HDMI and it's actually capable of producing a stunning Blu-Ray image. More details on that later as well. Gotta go.

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post #5 of 66 Old 10-04-2012, 01:32 PM
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MM you are a machine. This kind of work hours makes me reminisce of my years in the Navy.

Looking forward to learn more and see the b&a photos/movies. Sleep tight wink.gif
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post #6 of 66 Old 10-05-2012, 09:29 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm all done in......as in almost all gone. redface.gif Got no sane reason to be back up off the Bed...but I know several are waiting for this update and I'm nothing if not wholly insane at this conjecture.

Below are all the images I've taken so far. The 4 Videos are not loading fast enough onto Photo Bucket and since I've only gotten 4 hours sleep in 48 hours, and I have to man a show between 10-7 tomorrow, I just cannot get'em up onto this Thread this evening. They'll be here soon enough............

In basic order. Captions will also follow later. Get over it.

A note: The Images taken in the Morning with 4 Floods on....that was an unbeleivable amount of both ambient and directed (Floods) light. The best were taken with the Flood off, but still it's obvious that the amount of ambient light in the room was prodigious.

BTW, upon reviewing the dept of Gray on the Screen, I determined the Mix I had brought was a Silver Fire 2.5 4.0

Good Night.

masktiedownleft.jpg

Masktiedowmright.jpg

Mask1.jpg

Mask2.jpg

Mask3.jpg

UltraHighAmbientuinpaited2.jpg

UltraHighAmbienunpaited.jpg

Unmistakenlyready.jpg

UltraHighAmbienwspotpaintedb.jpg

UltraHighAmbienwspotpainteda.jpg

UltraHighAmbienwspotpaintedc.jpg

Ulowambiemtgray.jpg

Ulowambiemt1.jpg

ulowambient2.jpg

ulowambient3.jpg

UltraHighAmbienwspotpainted3.jpg

UltraHighAmbienwspotpainted2.jpg

UltraHighAmbienwspotpainted.jpg

FinishdTexture1.jpg

FinishdTexture34.jpg

FinishdTexture3.jpg


Here are 3 Videos. Be back on again after the Show! (8-9 pm)


th_Image139.jpg

th_Image140.jpg

th_Image141.jpg

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post #7 of 66 Old 10-06-2012, 12:18 AM
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It looks brilliant even with daylight/ambient light eek.gif I think it will getting better after it's fully cure and I believe that 5.0 & light fusion would looks even stunning smile.gif
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post #8 of 66 Old 10-06-2012, 06:12 AM
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Awesome... com'n MMan you still on Hawaiian time tongue.gif

That plastic cover room remands me of what Dexter would do...biggrin.gif

Impressive picture, I would imagine that in person is still better then the picture... awesome job.

Looking forward for the videos.

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post #9 of 66 Old 10-06-2012, 08:01 AM
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Wow, I see the videos are up... Niiiiiiiice!?

"Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid."
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post #10 of 66 Old 10-06-2012, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

Well................................Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz !

I used the Graco with a 1mm needle assembly, and the results were absolutely among the best, smoothest finish ever. I'm supposing that those who have had some difficulty with getting non-orange peel results should consider getting the 1.5 mm Needle kit. 1MM produces a awfully fine mist w/reduced Spray Pattern and it made me have to apply 8 coats (...maybe 9...who knows, I was semi-aware of my surroundings anyway... redface.gif )


You can get the kit for $24.97 plus tax and shipping. If you buy $45 worth of stuff you get free shipping. If you use f a t w a l l e t . c o m you can get 3% cashback from HD as well.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=203391447&storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=203391447&cm_mmc=shopping-_-googlebase-_-D24X-_-203391447#.UHBcFq6mUQk

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post #11 of 66 Old 10-06-2012, 11:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Here are a couple more CGI shots under Bright Daylight & Incandescent. These shots were "NOT" stop action paused, so what you see is a instant grab. (...oh OK...it's a Semi-Cloudy day.....I didn't stage that.)


VeryBright1.jpg


......and for those few who persist in claiming that the degree of Viewing angle "MUST" suffer if a Mica-Based Mix has any real degree of gain, I offer a "WTF" shot under the same intense lighting combo (...note Lamps / Cans / Sunlight all contributing...)
This shot was taken at a angle off axis of at minimum 80 degrees. I call it my "HTS" offering. (Holy Toledo Shot)

VeryBrightside.jpg

Today I hope to find the time to take several "Actual Humans in a Movie" shots. Also, the long awaited and obviously absent Window Treatment Curtains should get hung, so I'll try hard to get "Before & After" shots of the same scenes and at the same positions. However if the Curtains are in place, all I'll have resisting my efforts will be the lowly Light Bulbs. No issues there !

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post #12 of 66 Old 10-07-2012, 01:29 AM
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Wow, that screen is on fire eek.gif. Very impressive viewing angle. With the Epson 8100 would it be responsible to go with the same SF shade or even 5.0? The light condition in my living room is about the same as in the photos.
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post #13 of 66 Old 10-07-2012, 06:07 AM
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I have a this hvlp unit and a wondering if the hv3500 gun will fit my unit.



The reason I'm asking is because the gun is all plastic and the needle size is 1.8 mm. Would be nice to ad the hv3500 gun with the 1.5 mm brass needle kit to my unit.

The hose ending is 1.45" and the mounting hole on my gun is 1.485"




Here's the gun:



The unit is 600W and 420 ml / min.

Just to clarify, I wish to replace the blue/black gun in the picture with the hv3500 gun and 1.5 mm brass needle kit.
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post #14 of 66 Old 10-08-2012, 07:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rengep View Post

I have a this hvlp unit and a wondering if the hv3500 gun will fit my unit.

The reason I'm asking is because the gun is all plastic and the needle size is 1.8 mm. Would be nice to ad the hv3500 gun with the 1.5 mm brass needle kit to my unit.
The hose ending is 1.45" and the mounting hole on my gun is 1.485"

Just to clarify, I wish to replace the blue/black gun on the picture with the hv3500 gun and 1.5 mm brass needle kit.

I don't see any issues either way. Both spray heads attach in the same manner. I doubt (...but don't know...) if the Hose's end on the Graco is too "large", and of it's smaller, it can be "shimmed" by adding stouht Tape (Duct tape)

l'll close to my own 2900 today and take a measurement for you.

On a side note relevant to this Thread, I went out last night and bought 4 -48" x 82" Tan Blackout Curtain Panels for the Window behind the Screen. (I will be reimbursed ! mad.gif )I then went back around 11:00 pm and hung 'em. Obviously Curtains were always called for, but got neglected by the Decorator. Still, it did give me the opportunity to experiment with seeing / showing how well the SF 2.5 4.0 application performed under such adverse conditions, and how it could do so as a re-coating on top of a Mfg. Screen

I appreciate the comments, and the Kudos. The next round of Photos will be under various levels of Incandescent lighting only. I'll use varied "Dimmer" levels in taking paused shots, so the graduated results will be easily ascertained.

I want to put a controlled spin on the shown results. I realize that the shots show exceptional results under crazy bright conditions....but all the same, as good as they are...i do not consider them as being Videophile in quality. I'm fairly certain a Movie like one in the Underworld Series would have still left Black Levels in the "Gray Zone" under such lighting. Sensible limitations should always be striven for. Under worst case conditions, it is of course nice to know you can still get a image that is watchable, and certainly live TV and Sports fall into the category where such viewing is often necessary due to time of day or spousal considerations.

I do take comfort though...as should you all, in knowing that the Mfg of expensive "Ambient Light Oriented" Screen designs "NEVER" exhibit their wares under such conditions. In knowing such, hence the reason I almost always do so, because DIY efforts always need the additional validations because they seemingly always get compared to the similar Mfg Screen examples. That should make us all realize how far DIY Screen making as come. cool.gif

Also of note, the Short Throw PJ used is 3000 lumens, and while a good deal of those Lumens are wasted as they pass through the Wide Angle lens, it still represents a lumen level delivered than many PJs can not muster.

So I'm here to state that your own results may vary, and that sensible expectations and judicious planning can come together to provide unexpected and pleasing results under a wide variety of conditions.

To quote James T. Kirk;
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post #15 of 66 Old 10-08-2012, 08:47 AM
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Yes, sorry for the of topic and thank you for taking the time to help. smile.gif
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post #16 of 66 Old 10-08-2012, 09:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rengep View Post

Yes, sorry for the of topic and thank you for taking the time to help. smile.gif


Talking about what spray gun you want to use is definitely not off topic. I didn't say "more relevant".....just "relevant to..."

Asking questions means getting the answers you need, and that means getting it done right the first time.

Ya wanna know what really makes me wanna go " Mississippi " on somebody? That's when somebody doesn't bother to ask a question, has a problem because they didn't ask a question, and then come back on and off nothing but complain about what happened. So you're "all good".

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post #17 of 66 Old 10-09-2012, 02:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok...here are some composites of Screen shots (..to keep load times down...)

Some show the Room / Screen under 3 separate lighting conditions:

No lights w/ low ambient Sunlight leakage
Additional 25% Can Lighting w/Flood Bulbs
(...yeech...should be "Spots"....) mad.gif ...and will be soon !
Full on 100% Floods. (...not a real world circumstance but an effective comparison to show that resistance to such lighting is actually happening...)


The first 3 shots on the left side of the first composite were taken at 4:30 PM after the Sun had passed the south facing Window. All the others were takem mid-morning to just past Noon when the Sun was hitting the Window full on.

acomposite1.jpg



acomposite2.jpg



acomposite3.jpg


Room shots and a close up of the Viewsonic PJD 6683ws Short Throw PJ http://www.projectorcentral.com/ViewSonic-PJD6683ws.htm


acompositeroom-PJ.jpg

Any request for particular screenies will be accomodated if possible.

Upcoming....Digital TV Shots (Foot Ball ! ) and the installation of a Darbee Processor

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post #18 of 66 Old 10-09-2012, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

Any request for particular screenies will be accomodated if possible.

Any possibilities of some screenshots from Avengers & Underworld Awakening (viewing angle from main listening & viewing position) during daytime with blind open & close?
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post #19 of 66 Old 10-09-2012, 06:42 AM
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Excellent! That screen shows some impressive pictures under challenging conditions. Great example of how well the SF paint performs.
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post #20 of 66 Old 10-10-2012, 05:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WereWolf84 View Post

Any possibilities of some screenshots from Avengers & Underworld Awakening (viewing angle from main listening & viewing position) during daytime with blind open & close?

I don't have UW-A...and cannot locate my other Underworld DVDs ????confused.gif Must have left them at some other Home. mad.gif

I'm thinking however that you expectations are out of line with reality. If your room has any more severe light issues that what I've been showing as "worst case" scenarios, the you need to address those circumstances as much or more than you need to try to make a Screen / PJ combo try to accommodate them. Sensible limitations exist.

Here are your Avenger Shots...as best as I could manage during a Show that goes from 10 am to 7 pm and has crowds moving through at all times. And BTW, I opened the Curtains as much as I could without physically taking them down...which almost happened anyway since the Rod is an Expandable one and came apart in the middle when I tried pulling the Curtains apart. frown.gif I took a few early on...then some more later during more reduced sunlight...but pretty much tried to use room lighting to some extent in all but 2 examples.

I hope this goes some distance toward showing you what you want / need to see.

CompositeAvengers.jpg


CompositeAvengers2.jpg


And some more various examples......the first under the most extreme circumstances (11 AM)


Composite5thElement.jpg


CompositeNemo.jpg


CompositeBeeGees.jpg


99.9% of the images above were taken "in motion" (...can't pause with people watching....) In fact, all the Avengers shots but one were done in that manner.... I'm getting pretty good at doing that...but I'm coming to realize that while doing such does capture a good balance between exposure of the room's lighting and that of the Screen, the image on-screen does lose some degree of potential "Snap" when it's grabbed in-motion by the Camera. Also, I prefer taking shots from off center because they disprove comments about loss of brightness (viewing cone issues) and they give a truer perspective of how a Screen performs than "straight-on Eye Candy" Zoomed shots do.

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post #21 of 66 Old 10-10-2012, 07:23 AM
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Thanks a lot & appreciates for the Avengers screenshots wink.gif also the nice screenshots from the 5th Element smile.gif I'm get used to plasma image for few years, so it's quite ambitious to achieve plasma like image under ambient/daylight situation......agree with you, thick & heavy curtains will certainly helps to improve the situation, it would be even better to combine with SF mix + light cannon pj
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post #22 of 66 Old 10-11-2012, 07:45 AM - Thread Starter
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I installed a Darbee Processor yesterday evening. It worked as promised set at 50-60% effect. Both Contrast and Sharpness were definitely enhanced.

Here are shots of the image coming from the Viewsonic 1280 x 800 PJ.

Looking good. wink.gif


abigProff.jpg



aproffroomsized.jpg


I'll take one last round of Screenies today, then that will wrap up my personal efforts. I don't want this Thread to be primarily a Screen shot Showcase and have people fault it for that reason.

However if anyone still has any requests, I'll oblige as I can...which actually give us all some time since the Show runs all the way until October 28th

(sheesh...my Feet already ache! eek.giffrown.gif )

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post #23 of 66 Old 10-11-2012, 02:22 PM
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Personally don't mind the thread becoming a testament of the screen's performance through screen shots.

Very cool...

One question, where is the equipment housed?

Also are the speakers transducers in this installation?

I guess that's two questions! eek.gif

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post #24 of 66 Old 10-11-2012, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

However if anyone still has any requests, I'll oblige as I can...which actually give us all some time since the Show runs all the way until October 28th
(sheesh...my Feet already ache! eek.giffrown.gif )
How about some screenshots of dark movies such as Sci-Fi movies (unfortunately you don't have Underworld with you) to show the full potential of the SF biggrin.gif
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post #25 of 66 Old 10-11-2012, 09:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superleo View Post

Personally don't mind the thread becoming a testament of the screen's performance through screen shots.
Very cool...
One question, where is the equipment housed?

The Equipment.....all 3 pieces of it ...a Sony STR-DA4600es...a Sony 3d-DVD Networking Blu-Ray Player....and the itty bitty Darbee unit, are located in a tiny narrow Closet in a Hallway just around the right rear corner of the room as you face the Screen.
Quote:
Also are the speakers transducers in this installation?

But of course! That's why in every photo taken from every angle, the only "speaker" you see is that smallish Polk Audio Wireless 8" Subwoofer.

With the latest High Output Transducers installed, I'm only using 1 per channel x 5 channels so it can be directly compared (cost-wise) to single speaker systems...both Ceiling Mounted and Suspended (BOSE Satellites and other small Cabinet types....etc.) (RedTopDown's system has 8 per channel in the RF/C/FL locations) It's really a silly comparison, for even with the Transducers being located only in the Ceiling, they effectively fill the entire area with a seamless multi-channel sound stage. No "adjustable-Cube" or Directional Mini-Cabinet spkrs can begin to compare to the Transducer's effective 8' radial dispersion.

Speaker Invisibility is a important aspect of this particular Room's design and purpose owning to the fact it's not ever going to be anything like a "Dedicated" Theater. But that doesn't mean it can't drop some Jaws, and pop some Eyeballs out when it's called to duty. wink.gif
Quote:
I guess that's two questions! eek.gif

I never did learn to believe AVS Posters much on that score. tongue.gif

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post #26 of 66 Old 10-11-2012, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WereWolf84 View Post

How about some screenshots of dark movies such as Sci-Fi movies (unfortunately you don't have Underworld with you) to show the full potential of the SF biggrin.gif

How about new like Prometheus? Or a splendid goodie like "V"?

One thing to consider...I got Ladies and Kiddies that pop in so content has to be a bit under control most times.

To quote James T. Kirk;
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post #27 of 66 Old 10-11-2012, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

How about new like Prometheus? Or a splendid goodie like "V"?
One thing to consider...I got Ladies and Kiddies that pop in so content has to be a bit under control most times.
Prometheus would be fine & great smile.gif
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post #28 of 66 Old 10-11-2012, 11:00 PM
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I came, I saw, what am I seeing?

MM, that gadget...is it a must have? Does it give 3D lovin'?
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post #29 of 66 Old 10-12-2012, 05:40 AM
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Any feedback from the audience at the show? They must wonder what kind of sorcery you practice to achieve such a stunning picture quality. biggrin.gif
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post #30 of 66 Old 10-12-2012, 07:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rengep View Post

Any feedback from the audience at the show? They must wonder what kind of sorcery you practice to achieve such a stunning picture quality. biggrin.gif

You bet! I always get a bunch of plaudits at these things. To be exact, this Show involves 5 Custom Homes especially built together in a Cul-De-Sac gated Community so that the Public can tour them ($12.00 adm.) and see all the latest / greatest building techniques and amenities. The Homes range from $750,000.00 to just under 1 Mil. Expected attendance? Over 40,000. The only drawback? Gotta be there 10 hrs a day 6 days a week for 3 weeks! On my Feet the whole time! eek.gif You simply cannot imagine how tired I get watching every Movie I bring (at least a Dozen or more) as well as a couple Demo DVDs...over and over and over and over and over.......... redface.gif Crazily...one comment I get daily on a repeated basis? "Boy...I wish I had you Job! Getting to watch Movies all day long!" rolleyes.gif

(...and if anything can prove a PJ's performance under constant daily use...this show certainly can! )

The last time I posted Attendees' comments was in a thread (...closed...) called "Roasting the Bird over a Fusion Fire". tongue.gif That alluded to my only real competition at the time, the Stewart Fire Hawk and a Sim2 PJ. I had a Studio Experience DLP and a 110" Light Fusion (2004 MM-SE edition) I burned that Bird bad....but because of the posting of about 3 pages of commentary, certain elements called "Fowl" for my doing so and got the thread closed for seemingly promoting the "Sales" of what was obviously a DIY application. My intent was solely to disprove all the adverse and negative posts by those who wished to dismiss the concept...but it did come off a bit like a Infomercial...so.......rolleyes.gif

So I don't go there anymore, opting to let AVS'ers make their own judgements based on my posted efforts at project construction and the shown end results (...shown not as Eye Candy but under somewhat intolerable conditions...) Such is also the reason I do not engage in showing any extensive Tests or Graphs to justify people considering the apps I /others advocate. For others, doing so is more a case for their promoting the supposed validity of their apps over the ones shown on this Forum If I did so...it would be branded sheer promotion only, so I don't go there either.

In truth...that's what they must do because they sure as 'ell can't post up any shots that show the sort of results members can obtain with the Ambient Light apps we offer. wink.gif

The big difference between what is inferred by some and the real truth is that I do what I do on AVS because I enjoy it immensely...I like helping the Forum draw / keep interested Traffic, and I especially enjoy reading the "Thank yous". Kinda a bit self-serving that last...but with only good intentions in mind. smile.gif

Anywho...it does seem there is a small demand for some eye candy...and since others do so on other threads, I'll relent today and take some dark room shots from every conceivable angle to show just how "Black" blacks can be with a PJ that only sports 15K:1 Contrast when it splashes it's image on a dark Gray surface that still has positive gain characteristics.

Oh yeah...I'm bettin' the colors will pop too....most likely. biggrin.gif

BTW...this year my competition is a $20K+ Sim2 PJ and a 140" Stewart Screen. I'm still getting "I prefer yours..." comments, if for no other reason than the $24,000.00 price difference. tongue.gif

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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