White screens: BOC vs C&S Ultra vs RS-MM-LL vs Sherwin Willams ProClassic - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 60 Old 01-06-2013, 02:26 PM
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I can't tell you in 1,000,000 words how many times we all have read how someone has to state: "I should have followed the directions to the letter." It's a reoccurring theme that often is made all the more worse when some refuse to consider that perhaps...just maybe, they should do exactly as they are instructed.

Now I'm not saying your such a case. No...you only made a slip up as far as a Roller choice. But your experience does show that even slight variances from proven norms can often have disproportionately poor outcomes.

Glad you nailed it finally. Now you can start to really enjoy your effort, and feel wholly justified in relating the entire process...good & bad...to others.

To quote James T. Kirk;
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post #32 of 60 Old 09-02-2013, 01:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

What I said was, if a comparison between two examples show without question that one has Darker Blacks AND "as white as" or whiter Whites, and the one with the blacker blacks and whiter whites is the Gray (...as opposed to the white....how then can those results be misconstrued or ignored, let alone discounted? Yes, the Camera might not capture the full extent of the difference, or oy might overstate it somewhat, but if there IS a noticeable difference....all in the same shot, the something has to be happening. No?

Be it with actual Video Content or a Checkerboard chart, different and disparate results MUST count for something.

Now let's see if we/someone can post something akin to that premise. wink.gif

Looking through my old threads and saw this one. Just wondered if anyone has yet posted a checkerboard pic with a white sample overlaid on a grey screen where the grey screen has darker blacks and the same or better whites.

Will be painting a new screen in new house in November and will have to get back on this merry-go-round :P
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post #33 of 60 Old 09-05-2013, 04:48 AM
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Thank you for this information. I was thinking going blackout cloth for my first home theater, but seeing your review makes me want the sherman williams. Would it be possible to paint a boc with the sw paint and get a better screen. In your testing it looks as if u did the sw paint on a drywall, might not have read it right. So would it be better to use boc or boc painted with sw
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post #34 of 60 Old 09-05-2013, 07:20 AM - Thread Starter
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All of these were painted on BOC. Whether the Sherwin-Williams or any other paint will be "better" depends on what you're after. The SW will be noticeably brighter than the bare BOC, but this also means the blacks will be lighter, too, and it will wash out more in ambient light. You need to find the balance that works for your projector, screen size, viewing conditions, and the qualities that matter most to you.
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post #35 of 60 Old 09-05-2013, 12:18 PM
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I think it would be good for my conditions. It is light controlled basement, so no ambient light to worry about, and epson 8350, along with the 110" im planning on making. Since its light controlled should I go ahead with the SW as it has better whites and only small difference in blacks. as shown by your pictures and color codes.
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post #36 of 60 Old 09-05-2013, 03:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, sounds like a good choice for you. It also rolls on extremely well. My rolled SW is actaully a far smoother finish than my sprayed RS-MM-LL and C&S Ultra.

Another you might want to give a try is Glidden GLN9000 flat white paint, available at Home Depot. It's extremely cheap -- only $10/qt or $18/gallon -- cheap enough you could try it out and see how well it works for you. The guys at Hometheatershack measured it and found it to be extremely neutral, in fact iirc the most neutral paint they'd come across. Brightness should be close to SW as well. I'm going to do some tests with it hopefully this weekend.
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post #37 of 60 Old 09-05-2013, 04:48 PM
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Thank you for your help! I would try the paint out, but not making the screen until December as I am still saving up to buy everything. Also im actually might go for a benq w1070 as people say it is better than the 8350. but i dont thank that changes much for what paint I should use.
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post #38 of 60 Old 09-06-2013, 12:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Comparing the Glidden and the SW panels tonight, I would have to say that in general I see no noticeable difference between them. I still haven't taken the photos which will tell the real tale. Let me correct my previous statement and say I do see one difference -- the SW is hotspotting. No one else seems to have this issue, so I don't know what to think about it. The paint job (rolled onto BOC) is exceptionally smooth, much smoother than any of the other test panels or my RS-MM-LL screen. It's so smooth it's hotspotting. I think I need to try a different nap roller (used 3/16" I think) or even try spraying it. But otherwise, again, I can't tell a difference between it and the far cheaper Glidden. Both are a hair dimmer than the RS-MM-LL (with correspondingly darker blacks), but that's because the RS-MM-LL is hotspotting a bit too -- from any angle other than dead on, even just sliding over one seat on the sofa, the SW and Glidden are brighter than the RS-MM-LL.
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post #39 of 60 Old 09-06-2013, 02:09 AM
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OK Thank you for all the help. Is the ho spotting terrible? or is it minor, like barely noticeable?
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post #40 of 60 Old 09-06-2013, 10:01 AM - Thread Starter
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It's quite noticeable. But like I said, no one else has had the issue. But since the SW offers no significant advantage over the Glidden, and is twice the price, I see no reason not to go with the Glidden.
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post #41 of 60 Old 11-14-2013, 01:35 AM
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For the Sherwin Williams. What is the best finish and color?

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post #42 of 60 Old 11-14-2013, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curttard View Post

It's quite noticeable. But like I said, no one else has had the issue. But since the SW offers no significant advantage over the Glidden, and is twice the price, I see no reason not to go with the Glidden.

...Sorry for the newbie question,? but how do these paints compare to the "Silver Fire v2.5 4.0 " mix I've been reading a lot about ??
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post #43 of 60 Old 11-14-2013, 10:20 PM
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I'm now probably going to get the Glidden Diamond 450. I have a 3/16" nap roller from Sherwin Williams, would this do nicely or should I get a microfiber roller or some other special kind? Thanks.

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post #44 of 60 Old 11-14-2013, 10:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randyc1 View Post

...Sorry for the newbie question,? but how do these paints compare to the "Silver Fire v2.5 4.0 " mix I've been reading a lot about ??

These are white screens, so would generally be suited for light-controlled theaters. If you have ambient light, a grey screen will work better, and that's when you look at grey screens and SilverFire etc.
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post #45 of 60 Old 11-14-2013, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curttard View Post

These are white screens, so would generally be suited for light-controlled theaters. If you have ambient light, a grey screen will work better, and that's when you look at grey screens and SilverFire etc.

What he said... smile.gif

I just saw your question about the Glidden tonight, sorry for the late reply! You tested the 9000 against the SW and found them roughly equal in brightness? Interesting... I'll get a test panel of the 9000 soon and compare it to my screen.


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post #46 of 60 Old 11-15-2013, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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My SW panel is problematic because it hotspots terribly. The only thing I can think of is that the can was a glossier finish than the Flat it was marked as, because no one else has ever reported hotspotting with the SW as far as I know. So I can't really put much stock in any comparisons of the Sherwin with anything else.

The GLN9000 is promising because it's just so darn cheap, not to mention universally available. $9/sq, $18/gallon at Home Depot, and Harpmaker measured it as essentially identical in terms of color to your 450. The only real question is if the brightness compares. I assume the 450 probably has the edge in rolling smoothness.
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post #47 of 60 Old 11-15-2013, 05:15 PM
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I picked up a can of the Glidden at HD today. I'm going to paint a panel then give it a month to cure before doing any comparisons. BTW, I talked to a Painter I met there, he swore up and down that the 450 would be massively easier to roll, but had no idea about brightness.


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post #48 of 60 Old 11-15-2013, 10:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I suspect the 450 probably rolls on much smoother. That said, I didn't have any issues rolling the 9000. Got a smooth texture without any real effort. And that was on blackout cloth.
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post #49 of 60 Old 11-17-2013, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mijotter View Post

I'm now probably going to get the Glidden Diamond 450. I have a 3/16" nap roller from Sherwin Williams, would this do nicely or should I get a microfiber roller or some other special kind? Thanks.

Anyone?

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post #50 of 60 Old 11-17-2013, 09:03 PM
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are you kiddin?
nobody actually wants to be helpful... they just wanted to argue and try to one up each other with their so called knowledge and personal opinions.

to answer you question.
use a 3/16" roller you have from SW. do not use a foam, mohair, or microfiber roller.
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post #51 of 60 Old 11-18-2013, 11:22 AM - Thread Starter
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I think most want to be helpful. Speaking for myself, I didn't respond because I don't know the answer. I think many have, in fact, found this thread helpful.

Why did you preface "knowledge" and "personal opinions" with "so-called"? Do you have a problem with posts in this thread?
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post #52 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curttard View Post

I think most want to be helpful. Speaking for myself, I didn't respond because I don't know the answer. I think many have, in fact, found this thread helpful.

Why did you preface "knowledge" and "personal opinions" with "so-called"? Do you have a problem with posts in this thread?

I think his comment is prefaced by how things appeared to be presented, and based upon a dislike of how some present their opinions and personal findings in a less than polite manner, and with some fairly obvious bias against other solutions....essentially dismissing other options out of hand. When that happens, especially when such is based upon out of date methods and materials, even when something of an alternative nature is offered that is based on correct thinking, it can becomes a bit suspect, and subject to being considered as being more detrimental than helpful.

We had a belly full of that sort of approach in the past...and it still can rankle, even if it's not done intentionally or nearly as obtrusive. PB is one of the nicest, most helpful and polite Posters on this Forum, so if he gets a bit miffed every once in a great while, he deserves a "small" bit of allowance.

Emphasis on "small"...because we all must make an effort to play nice.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #53 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 06:10 AM
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As an addendum to the above, any example that is rolled will differ in performance from one that is sprayed. Such being the case, no really accurate assessment can be made, let alone validated as being definitive as being other than what results are obtained when rolling.

The metallic mixes all benefit greatly from being sprayed, even RS-MM LL. The latter simply being an application that can suffer being rolled.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #54 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 07:13 AM - Thread Starter
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My RSMMLL was sprayed, the SW was sprayed, the C&S Ultra was sprayed, the GLN9000 was rolled.

I have not dismissed anything out of hand -- not only did I spend $80 on paint and another $60 minimum on sprayer and supplies to try RSMMLL, but it has actually been my screen until now. How's that for "bias"? :P
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post #55 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 08:52 AM
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I was not specifically referring to you, only generalizing the circumstances that might have led to PBs comment. You need to stop being defensive...even confrontational.

If I am making specific reference to someone...I state "You"...I don't veil my comments.

Your added info serves to clearly state your circumstances, and makes sure no one can be mistaken as to such.

PB almost assuredly did not have the skinny. So now he does.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #56 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 09:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Makes one wonder why he posted that comment. Looking through this thread, I can't even begin to imagine what he finds objectionable or how he reached the conclusion that "nobody wants to be helpful".
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post #57 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 10:09 AM
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look yourself in the mirror. are you posting to be helpful? or are just tagging behind a certain someone to disputed everything they say, or the way they said it, or the solutions they advocate to someone else.
does everything have to be rebutted over and over again? you have an opinion that's great... have you posted it loud and clear several times in the same thread? is there a need to make sure every new poster hears it again and again so you can discount all others who've used the mix and differ greatly in their opinion from you?

honestly, be helpful whenever you can. be less argumentative when you can. respect others opinions when you can. respect others diy solutions when you can.

be creative. contribute. be constructive. be respectful. embrace the diy spirit.
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post #58 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 10:23 AM - Thread Starter
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It is great that I have an opinion, you are right. When I see someone asking what screen solution they should use, and one is repeatedly recommended that I have personal experience with -- in fact that I have on my own screen -- but that offers little or no advantages over MUCH cheaper, MUCH easier alternatives, yes, I'm going to point that out.

Can you explain what your issue is with that? Personally, I find that to be VERY helpful. I wish I had side-by-side comparisons available of $20/gallon OTS paints and RSMMLL and detailed descriptions of the difference between them so I could have saved myself $150+ and lots of time, and ended up with an arguably superior solution. The fact that there are several posts in this very thread saying how helpful it is indicates that YOU are the one with the agenda.
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does everything have to be rebutted over and over again?

Gee, you tell me. When MM tells recommends RSMMLL to someone, and I recommend OTS paint based on my own experience, he sure seems compelled to "rebut" my post every time. Yet your problem is apparently with me and not him. Why is that, I wonder?
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post #59 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 10:43 AM
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yes you tail along MM at every turn. pointing out whenever you think he smells a little funny. enjoy it. breathe it all in. let everyone know about it. and let everyone how expert you are about it.
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post #60 of 60 Old 11-19-2013, 11:09 AM - Thread Starter
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I let everyone know that based on my experience, there is an easier, much cheaper, and frankly better solution than this particular one he recommends. Again, what is your problem with that? When he shows up on 100% of the threads in this forum to recommend his solution over OTS paint, you seem to have zero issue. When I show up on threads where people ask for a white paint and I recommend OTS over RSMMLL, you seem to be bothered.

Again: Why? Gee I wonder if it's because you yourself are personally invested in those solutions.
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