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post #1 of 23 Old 04-02-2013, 05:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Hello there, i finally convinced my wife to buy a projector. I don't have a perfect back room, ceiling is white, walls are beige. My room has cathedral ceiling, so i have purchased an adapter for the ceiling mount from chief to level the projector, which in my case is a Sony HW50se. Dimensions of the room are 10 Ft wide-(10ft high down to 8ft), and 22ft long. I don't want to invest the money in a high end projector screen, but i would like to get a a good quality screen by diy with Silver Fire. Most likely my screen will be a 16:9 ratio with 133 diagonal.
Any help or suggestions are highly appreciated. TY
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post #2 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 06:03 PM - Thread Starter
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6 days and no one wants to give their 2 cents input. Already purchased everything. Today i finished the frame 16:9 (122") and i have attached the sintra to it, waiting until morning for the sintra to bond really well to the frame so i can start painting. I decided on Silver FIre 4.0. I wish MM would have stopped by with some suggestions. Oh well, i will post my honest opinion once i am done, about the whole experience. So far i can tell you that this DIY screen , paint, frame , sintra 5-10', brackets, velvet for border, will reach around $250, it would have been a lot more, but i plan on returning the spray gun and stapler. I really hope that all this effort and money are well spent.
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post #3 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 06:18 PM
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ok... 2 things come to mind...
getting the mix right. and getting the spraying right.

any questions about the mix and how to do?
any questions on spraying?
have you taken some latex paint and mixed it with water and practiced on a sample board...
as doing so help you greatly to know how much water is needed for the mix to spray properly with your spray gun.

as for MM. not sure how he missed your thread.
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post #4 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 06:41 PM - Thread Starter
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I have watched all the videos and thread description regrading that. As far as practicing, i have never used a hvlp gun , but i have painted before with my regular compressor sprayer. Mixing seems pretty straight forward. I will do more practicing tomorrow before i will start the actual screen painting.
Do you think SF 4.0 might be too dark for my sony projector? I wanted to do a light fusion build but the acrylic mirror in my area is around $450 for a 4x8" so i will compromise with the sintra board for now.
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post #5 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 06:50 PM
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i think your projector was designed initially for the sony blackscreen which is darker than sf 4.0...
i am however, hesitant at your screen with your choice of 4.0
personally, i think you should go with 2.5 or 3.0
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post #6 of 23 Old 04-09-2013, 06:56 PM - Thread Starter
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3.0 it is
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post #7 of 23 Old 04-10-2013, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx View Post


as for MM. not sure how he missed your thread.

6 days ago I was ensconced in extreme southern Mississippi, with only my phone. I'm sorry the Thread came up, and then immediately go pushed away from the top. It doesn't usually happen that I miss any specifically directed requests, but emphasis must be placed on "doesn't usually" because If I an not subscribed to a thread, I don't get notified of any postings.

I always urge any member with a rush request to PM as I do get any such notifications immediately.

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3.0 it is

I concur.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #8 of 23 Old 04-10-2013, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

They had an agenda in mind...to use science to refute something that real world results proved was doing otherwise....

If all the measurements of the SF I am aware of are fake then surely there are measurements somewhere that can give SF the deserved justice. WHERE ARE THEY?
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post #9 of 23 Old 04-10-2013, 05:35 PM
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it's a case of rock in a hard place... as my measurements would be deemed to be biased as well.
but i'm also not the group who wholeheartly stated they will do everything in their power to disprove SF, or for that matter anything to do with or pertaining to MM.

truth is, without unbiased testing... the argument will continue to persist.

i don't go out of my way to bash BW or the folks wanting to use it... unless i'm being disrespected for being a part of SF.
truth is, i believe wholeheartly, that both are heads and tails better than the other diy alternatives... unless one requires AT.

it's one thing to say, you might want reconsider BOC, or SilverScreen... because we've clearly shown their weaknesses... without any data no less...
it's something we've all come to agree upon... but it's a whole other thing to bash a group of believers in a diy creation vs another diy creation.

because in the end... regardless of the numbers... it's still a matter of visual preference.
that's why i often ask, do you tend to prefer the white screen experience... or are you someone who loves black levels... because something has to give.

it's the very reason, that some of the most preferred stereo amplifiers have slightly higher thd, and thousands are spent on digital to analog converters...
...to get back to a more airy, natural sound.

data matters... but our senses still ultimately make the choice.
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post #10 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 08:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Good news, i finished painting and the velvet border. Screen looks great. I have purchase some really nice velvet, it really stands out, Joann fabrics 50% off cuppon rocks.
Bad news, 1. sony hw50 will only be shipped next week. 2. I painted inside the garage and i saw today, when i installed the velvet a damn fly got stuck in my paint. Its not huge, but i am sure it will show in the bright scenes. So i am thinking of applying another coat pf silverfire after the screen is installed. I hate to do all the painting prep work, but i don't think there is any other way.
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post #11 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 10:15 AM
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very nice. i'm guessin' the fly decided on the center of the screen!
if not, you probably be the only one who's drawn to that spot.
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post #12 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 10:20 AM - Thread Starter
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You are probably right, truth be told from 16 Ft seating area that 1/16-1/8" will be invisible. Once i set up the projector i will make my final decision on applying another coat.
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post #13 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 11:21 AM
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aside from hitting it with a couple of dusters...
you could use the 'Prevail" method as MM has described...
or you could get a very fine tip brush and very lightly touch the dark spot... let it dry... and then barely touch it again... sort of like a duster with fine tip brush.

just enough to forget about it rather than fiscating on it.
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post #14 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eurohc View Post

Good news, i finished painting and the velvet border. Screen looks great. I have purchase some really nice velvet, it really stands out, Joann fabrics 50% off cuppon rocks.
Bad news, 1. sony hw50 will only be shipped next week. 2. I painted inside the garage and i saw today, when i installed the velvet a damn fly got stuck in my paint. Its not huge, but i am sure it will show in the bright scenes. So i am thinking of applying another coat pf silverfire after the screen is installed. I hate to do all the painting prep work, but i don't think there is any other way.

Looks great!

Is there any chance you could take a picture with flash standing 8 feet or so in front of the projector? It may be better to detect hot spotting at this stage if it is indeed present.

You may have to close the garage door though. Ideally, the screen should be illuminated evenly by the ambient light.
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post #15 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 12:30 PM
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and yes what would be the magic of 8ft...
why not 12ft... or 3ft for that matter...
because what you are recording is the uniformity of the flash... not the screen.
the better the screen... the better it will record that centered flash.

again... some real insight... for those that seek to cherry pick the truth.
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post #16 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 01:00 PM
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Ha! While I was a'huntin an a peckin' away, PB has carried the torch forward with a lot briefer summary as to what such a request really means. Well, there is a lot more to tell so I'll just leave the rest below "as is".


Quote:
Originally Posted by zheka View Post

Looks great!

Is there any chance you could take a picture with flash standing 8 feet or so in front of the projector? It may be better to detect hot spotting at this stage if it is indeed present.

You may have to close the garage door though. Ideally, the screen should be illuminated evenly by the ambient light.

Using a Flash to detect Hot Spotting is like using a Match to look for a Gas leak.

And especially on a screen that is just hours old and wholly uncured.

Barring that, a Flash from any source except professional Reflector arrays is going to be a narrowly focused, instantaneous beam, and it's intensity will, (...and almost every P&S today does....) governed by distance and room conditions.

That in no way represents anything remotely like what a screen would ever work with, owing the the whole purpose of PJ optics is to create uniform light dispersion.

And if the object here to try to show that a high gain screen will show a bright center when hit with a Flash that amounts to perhaps 3x+ the intensity of a PJ's lamp at any given point........to that I say it should be obvious what would happen. In the same regard, under the same assault, any Screen so low in gain that it could suppress such a Flash and show no effect would show that it was indeed, a suppressive medium, and it's only real accomplishment it attenuating light across the board.

But gosh, what if a Screen like SF does not seem to show any "hot Spotting" during a regular showing of content. Well the next step in the ongoing attempt to find something wrong is to take a Photo (OMG!) of the Screen under a Blue Screen, or other mono field, and then show it in "Negative" fashion. Then, what the eye doesn't see, nor the normally exposed photo's image would show, is the small degree of non-uniformity around the "EDGES"....just like about 98% of all Screens. This effort has been made to mislead opinions and is touted as "proof" when in fact, and once again taking into account that SF is a high gain High Contrast application, the shown results are not to be considered poor or detrimental.

Unless some want to try to make it seem that way.

It is this disparity between what those who test to disprove and discount try to present as "fact" and what is really going on behind the scenes. Considering the source, and reputation, and the fact that all such tests are happily provided by "Off Forum" members whose motives cannot be mistaken, It is not hard at all to reason why the vast majority of actual SF End Users post completely different accounts.

A real issue is how these tests are done and presented is intended to force those who have absolutely no clue as to what is going on to accept them on the weight of "Their Word". What is proposed here is based on far more experience and member involvement. This Forum maintains a adherence to purist DIY principles, and not because it's always the easiest. It is to effectively divide the two Camp...Mfg and DIY, and both encourage creativity in DIY, while also keeping DIY from intruding on Mfg Screen.

Oh yes! There was a time when the Screens forum was dominated by DIY postings. And believe this....the DIY Screens being done did not involve using a hybrid of DIY / Mfg. And this did not come about because the DIY Screens were under performers. In any case, to make the Forum a better, more congenial place, the DIY and Mfg camps were split. You would think that some would "get this" since there is in fact a Forum / Sub Forum in place.

Whatever........it still remains to be said that dubious or misleading "test standards" do nothing to convey what actual use can. This Forum is about working to help every requester achieve what is best for his own situation. It's not about making attempts to save people from what a extremely small member of people personally consider a bad thing. The request to the OP amounts to baiting him to try something that would at best confuse him.

So here's a good chance to show what's real and what is not.

The OP is certainly going to use his Screen. he might, with enough urging, try some of the nonsensical tests that are suggested. I'm not worried. I will wait until he gets his PJ up and running, and the project will rise or fall based on his evaluation. Not screen captures one of you get and reverse.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #17 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 01:19 PM
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I have seen at least one SF screen that withstood the flash camera scrutiny reasonably well (after the duster treatment and all). Who knows, perhaps you guys should not worry.
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post #18 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 01:52 PM
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there is no scrutiny. your flash test is bogus. let me say it again. a misinterpretion at best.
most camera's have a very CENTRALIZED flash and is many, many times more NON uniform then any decent projector on the market
and the BETTER the screens will absolutely SHOW that centralized flash. PERIOD.

AGAIN, the screen is reflecting that centralized flash and returning it to the camera to be captured.

if your screen is negative gain and SO bad as to NOT capture that...
then i'll be blunt about this...
you screen STINKS!!!

your logic in this case is once again.... HOGWASH.
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post #19 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 02:11 PM
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don't get all worked up. LOL.
As I said, there IS a chance it won't hotspot. it's known to happen before though that may have been due to application error.
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post #20 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 02:42 PM
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nope it won't hotspot.
now if you use false logic, and bolster them with bogus claims... and then flaunt that for all to see...
then you'd realize that it's all shining a really bad light on the cherry picking group with their lack of belief in the diy spirit.
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post #21 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 06:11 PM - Thread Starter
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I was so anxious to try the screen that i went and bought a temporary projector from Best Buy. I know, i am abusing the return policy, but trust me, they made enough money off me when i purchased my Elite kuro and all the ht equipment. I finally mounted the screen, a monster of 73 LBS (i used my scale). The projector i have purchased is an Epson 8350. I am sure its miles away from a sony hw50, but that was the only one they had at this store. PQ is inferior to my kuro, but that 120" screen is impressive. During the day, ambient light, the image is watchable,, but after the sunset oh my, such a different story







. I took some pictures, checking the viewing angle, to my surprise it did better than the BD 1.4 showcased at the magnolia HT from BB. I can't say i noticed any hot spotting , still the screen is freshly painted and this projector is far away from being calibrated. Can't wait for my Sonny Hw50es, i am sure it will make a huge difference. TY again for all the help. SO far, a happy camper.
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post #22 of 23 Old 04-11-2013, 07:25 PM
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now i've heard of impulse buying... and marvel at how quickly my kids say 'daddie can you buy this for me' in the checkout aisle.

but i gotta say. man, you take the cake!!! biggrin.gif

very nice, indeed.
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post #23 of 23 Old 04-12-2013, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eurohc View Post

I was so anxious to try the screen that i went and bought a temporary projector from Best Buy. I know, i am abusing the return policy, but trust me, they made enough money off me when i purchased my Elite kuro and all the ht equipment. I finally mounted the screen, a monster of 73 LBS (i used my scale). The projector i have purchased is an Epson 8350. I am sure its miles away from a sony hw50, but that was the only one they had at this store. PQ is inferior to my kuro, but that 120" screen is impressive. During the day, ambient light, the image is watchable,, but after the sunset oh my, such a different story

I took some pictures, checking the viewing angle, to my surprise it did better than the BD 1.4 showcased at the magnolia HT from BB. I can't say i noticed any hot spotting , still the screen is freshly painted and this projector is far away from being calibrated. Can't wait for my Sonny Hw50es, i am sure it will make a huge difference. TY again for all the help. SO far, a happy camper.

No surprises from this quarter. wink.gif

The last image does seem to be very bright, especially up in the left corner, but that can and usually does happen when one takes a dark room shot that does not use any zoom whatsoever....resulting in the Camera collecting too much light for it's given f-stop and exposure time in Auto. Many DIY'ers and Mfg screen owners come up against such....or the opposite...too dark images coming from underexposure due to a screen's minimalistic reflective level.

All in all, the 4th & 5th images are the most revealing as far as detail, contrast and claritry, and they bode well for the near future.

And you bet....once you get 1700 lumen output up there, coming with 100,000:1 "SXRD-oriented" Contrast and enhanced clarity, things will go from "oh my" to "OMG" in a big hurry.

Go ahead...be excited. Your Camping trip is about to become an extended sabbatical from the mundane and ordinary. cool.gif

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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