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post #1 of 28 Old 04-05-2013, 10:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi guys,

I've just delved into getting a projector. My main concerns were affordability and portability, since my residential location isn't exactly permanent, so I got the ultra-portable of LG PB60G (it's not great in terms of its 500 lumen output, but it's easy to pack and take along if I move away).

So the question is this:

What's my best option for a screen? Cheap and effective, best bang for the buck solution. Keep in mind that I may have to throw it away and start all over in a year if I move to a different apartment. My light control isn't great, as this will be in the living room. I understand daytime viewing will not be great (maybe impossible?)

1) I could make a frame out of plumbing tubes and stretch fabric over it. If so, what kind of fabric? I would like high-contrast with minimal gain loss... if that is even possible.

2) I could get a 4x8 shiny white board from Home Depot and paint it with some rollers. If I choose this option, what kind of paint will be easy and effective? I'm not exactly a handy person. Again, aiming for high-contrast and minimal gain loss.

Thanks alot! =)
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post #2 of 28 Old 04-05-2013, 10:29 PM
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Your 500 lumen output is a severe handicap as far as you're being able to view almost any content with ambient light present.

You don't mention what size screen you are aspiring too, and that has a very important role to play as well.

You keep your screen size at / below 80 inches, optimize your throw distance, and use a screen paint that has at least 1.3 gain and you should come very close to, if not completely achieve your goal of creating a Do It Yourself projector screen that will work great with your PJ.

rolleyes.gif edited for currrazy sentence structure...

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post #3 of 28 Old 04-06-2013, 02:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Thank you for the prompt response, MM! Much appreciated.

I was going for a 100" screen before you mentioned it, but I am more than ready to reduce it to 80" for image quality purposes. What's the point of a huge screen if the picture is washed out?

So, keeping the paint recommendation in mind, what are my best options? I'm not all that handy or experienced with DIY frames or paints. I can make the basics, though.

So should I make a fabric screen and paint it? Or rather, get a laminated mdf board and paint that? If I am to paint, I'll be rolling it on since I don't have the tools or expertise necessary for spraying. Silver Fire looks much too complicated for a guy like me :/
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post #4 of 28 Old 04-07-2013, 05:37 AM
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RS-MaxxMudd LL rolled onto Thrifty White hardboard and trimmed with 2" base Trim.

That'll do it to it.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #5 of 28 Old 04-07-2013, 03:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, MM.

From what I gather from skimming over that thread, since I'm using a white board as the backing, I won't need to use a base coat, right? Just mix all the listed ingredients and roll on? That is wonderfully simple if that is the case! =)
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post #6 of 28 Old 04-07-2013, 10:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Seems I spoke too soon. Obtaining all of the required ingredients here in Canada might be a challenge.

Does anyone on these forums participate in commerce? i.e., does anyone have the ingredients or pre-mixed leftover paint? I'm willing to pay for the convenience =)
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post #7 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 05:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

... use a screen paint that has at least 1.3 gain

Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

RS-MaxxMudd LL rolled onto Thrifty White hardboard and trimmed with 2" base Trim.

That'll do it to it.

are you implying that RS-MaxxMudd LL has 1.3 gain? would you care to share any measurements in support of the claim?
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post #8 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 09:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zheka View Post


are you implying that RS-MaxxMudd LL has 1.3 gain? would you care to share any measurements in support of the claim?

Yes I am...and no...I will not because such information has already been ascertained as being true by direct comparisons by actual end users. Also, due to one group's use of such testing with the sole intent of trying to discount any / all apps advocated on this Forum, demands that such tests be reciprocated, while also stating falsely that I only post to promote and sell screens elsewhere, I have been instructed by the AVS hierarchy NOT to post "Tit for Tat" test results that will obviously differ from other biased and misrepresented Tests, as such would only incite others to counter with more adverse postings. As it is, enough "crossover" postings by such as you and a very few others provide enough (ie; too much)

If you want to point a finger at those responsible for the lack of response you seek, blame those who felt the need ( desire actually) to try to "warn" others against what are the singularly most popular advanced DIY Screen apps on the Internet.

Now go back there and swap horror stories. But don't post Graphs from somewhere else that are years old, misleading results that are both biased and motive-oriented, nor post to incite responses. Post to help...or refrain from posting.

......and be advised I will not respond to another such request nor any obvious "bait" of yours again.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #9 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

Yes I am...and no...I will not because such information has already been ascertained as being true by direct comparisons by actual end users.

like this one ? RS was found dimmer than off the shelf Sherwin Willams paint which was measured to have 1.2 gain.


Sam,
I'd strongly recommend you do not limit your research only to advises given by a few prolific posters here. Unfortunately I cannot point you to the resources because they are on competing forum.
But I can assure you there are off the shelf solutions that cost less, easier to deal with and have been tested to perform as well if not better
Good luck
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post #10 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 12:15 PM
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you mean the same who concluded...
that he "preferred' the rs-maxxmudd overall.

and then withdrew his consideration from SW because of it's awful hotspotting...
despite having tried it in two different applications... both spraying and rolling...

"I'm withdrawing my recommendation of Sherwin-Williams ProClassic. The hotspotting on my test panel is horrendous. I don't know why I have this issue when I haven't heard of anyone else having it, but all I can go by is what I'm seeing myself.

I even rolled a few coats on, and while I think the overall texture is actually improved versus my sprayed coats, the hotspotting is at least as bad if not worse
."

seems like the 'gain' of the SW was derived solely from it's sheen... ...making it's false gain numbers... at best.
wink.gif

seems like to the fudging from the other forum and their advocates continues... amuck.
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post #11 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx View Post

you mean the same who concluded...
that he "preferred' the rs-maxxmudd overall.

and then withdrew his consideration from SW because of it's awful hotspotting...
despite having tried it in two different applications... both spraying and rolling...

"I'm withdrawing my recommendation of Sherwin-Williams ProClassic. The hotspotting on my test panel is horrendous. I don't know why I have this issue when I haven't heard of anyone else having it, but all I can go by is what I'm seeing myself.

I even rolled a few coats on, and while I think the overall texture is actually improved versus my sprayed coats, the hotspotting is at least as bad if not worse
."

seems like the 'gain' of the SW was derived solely from it's sheen... ...making it's false gain numbers... at best.
wink.gif

seems like to the fudging from the other forum and their advocates continues... amuck.

His is the only case ever reporting hotspotting on SW. Which cannot be said about any of the mixes by you or MM.

I do not know what paint curttard ended up with but at some point he was considering Glidden Diamond 450 Titanium White which has higher gain than both the SW and your white mix, pb
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post #12 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 03:22 PM
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given the unbiased nature of his report... and seeing as there are less than a handful of such reports...
his reports seem to have some weight in them... otherwise you would not have used it to 'handpick' the parts
you wanted to report and the parts you so easily now dismiss.

as for your quote of 'my mix' being white... it's never been said.
it is and will always be a 'grey screen'.
it does however, exhibit many of a white screen's characteristics...
and yes without a white sample next to it... you might probaby say it has a silvery-white appearance.

it is however, only one of a handful (less) of a diy grey screens that has positive gain.
never said it was the highest.
and neither is 'gain' the overiding factor in an overidingly satisfactory projection screen experience.
in fact, what most people harp on when it comes to white screens is the lack of contrast and dimensional depth.

time for me to get back to helping folks and leave the fussing to the others.
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post #13 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 05:07 PM
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I did not bring up curttards thread to claim that SW is better than RS LL, though it probably is. I used it to gauge the 1.3 gain claim. And given that SW was brighter, it is safe to say that the real gain of the RS mix is below 1.2

I did not realize you consider the LL mix grey. I was confused by the fact that it was included in the white screen comparison and was found brighter (both whites and blacks ) than some known white screens. my bad.
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post #14 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 05:53 PM
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Sam, Google is your best buddy.

Google Silver Fire, Sherwin Williiam Extra White, Black Widow screen paint and you will find all the information you need including measured data and user reports from multiple perspectives and a wider of DIYers and enthusiasts.

Sometimes, I find the most functional solutions are the simplest ones. But hey, that's just me. tongue.gif

PS, this is an excellent read on the Sherwin Williams Extra White paint.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1310840/diy-screen-paint-article-at-projectorcentral-com
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post #15 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 06:27 PM
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an excellent read if you would like to see a bunch of people bickering and fighting about everyhing under the sun...
including how some people's test equipment, software, and data don't measure up and that only they (the god of science)
knows how to use the equipment and software properly.

and to that end, absolutely no conclusions of any kind is brought forth.

yes, a good read if you'd like to be more thoroughly confused between competing factions from competing sites
with no independent, unbiased data, or any kind.

rolleyes.gif
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post #16 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 06:31 PM
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I guess our idea of excellence differs, but that's fine with me.

I am open minded and like to see different perspectives. You can pick out some exceptional points from all that bickering, you only need to keep your mind open.
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post #17 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 06:36 PM
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too funny!
i guess open minded means to cherry pick the stuff from the site and folks you advocate and dismiss the rest.
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post #18 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 06:44 PM
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i like to allow the reader to make that decision on his own.
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post #19 of 28 Old 04-08-2013, 08:38 PM
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There are countless DIY options, both here and elsewhere.

Or are we only allowed to discuss and reference DIY options that are highly promoted within these borders?

Thread title as for a "cheap screen". What's cheaper than a $20 over the shelf neutral paint, that is also enjoyed my many DIYers (again, both here and elsewhere).
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post #20 of 28 Old 04-09-2013, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Sam, Google is your best buddy.


PS, this is an excellent read on the Sherwin Williams Extra White paint.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1310840/diy-screen-paint-article-at-projectorcentral-com

Excellent thread indeed. I honestly do not understand why it is a good business to systematically push away those who support scientific approach and promote a few projects of questionable quality. When the claims cannot withstand even basic scrutiny, the only way to maintain the status quo is by censorship and information blockade. And this cannot possibly last forever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

On this Forum, it's the Members themselves who judge DIY applications. We don't publish "Data"...we provide instruction.

... on how to make pink polar bears
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post #21 of 28 Old 04-09-2013, 10:15 AM
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post #22 of 28 Old 04-09-2013, 09:08 PM
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I have a 110" SW ProClassic screen and have not seen any hot-spotting. I've also read the Glidden Diamond 450 paint in velvet matte sheen is slightly brighter then the SW.

-Darrell
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post #23 of 28 Old 04-10-2013, 05:59 AM
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As Zheka posted above, so far I've seen only 1 report of hotspotting with the SW classic paint.

I never had any issue with it myself.
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post #24 of 28 Old 04-10-2013, 11:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi guys!
It looks like the debate got hot over the couple of days that I didn't check!

I'm certainly glad more options have come on the table since last time. I don't doubt the quality of the Maxxmudd, but the ingredients are not available in local stores around here. Again, aside from good image quality, cheap and easy are main points. A screen like the Maxxmudd seems good, but if I can't find the ingredients and I'll have to spend $50 - $80 just on paint... it's not cheap or easy.

Thanks for the other options presented. My local paint store said they have "Behr Silverscreen." I will also check for Sherwin Williams ProClassic. Any other paints out there worth looking out for? How does the SW PC compare to the Behr SS?

Thanks
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post #25 of 28 Old 04-11-2013, 12:06 AM
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My suggestion amounts to being the least expensive and easiest solution to actually give you the kind of performance you need.

Behr Silver Screen is a very distant also-ran, however the SW Pro Classic Enamel in "FLAT" tinted to N8.5 Neutral Gray would at least let you move on without too much compromise.

Then again, neither the SW or Glidden paint "Is not Cheap" either,( $50.00 gal...the only size available...) and the cost of decent quality Rolling supplies will add to that.

DIY Screen performance that goes beyond the "Ho Hum" level requires a specific minimum expense and effort. Exemplary results just don't come winging their way out of a cheap can of inexpensive Paint being splashed on with cheap Rollers. Decent results yes...even unexpectedly better results that thought possible, but not outstanding.

But perhaps more than most any other true "Bang for the Buck" experience, in DIY Screen making you can get far more value & performance that you can realize at this conjecture if you choose wisely, and don't fudge on the barest minimum of what is needed to get there.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #26 of 28 Old 04-11-2013, 02:17 AM - Thread Starter
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I've read the rolling techniques page already and plan to use that as a reference. I'm not going into this completely blind.
The hassle needed to obtain multiple paints, pay for shipping, and cross-border brokerage and customs fees for MaxxMudd seems beyond the scope of what I'm intending for my screen. Silver Fire was also excluded for this and the equipment and labour it requires.

My choice is going to come down to:
1) What is domestically available in Canada?
2) What is relatively cheap?
3) What is easy to make/mix/paint/mount etc?
4) What solution combines the above 3 while giving me the best edge possible over a plain, unpainted matte white board? (I've already got a 4x8 white board at Home Depot,@ $16 cut to size)

When I've got a permanent residence and want to build the home theater of my dreams, my criteria will change. In the mean time, I can settle for good instead of excellent =)
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post #27 of 28 Old 04-11-2013, 02:17 AM - Thread Starter
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I've read the rolling techniques page already and plan to use that as a reference. I'm not going into this completely blind.
The hassle needed to obtain multiple paints, pay for shipping, and cross-border brokerage and customs fees for MaxxMudd seems beyond the scope of what I'm intending for my screen. Silver Fire was also excluded for this and the equipment and labour it requires.

My choice is going to come down to:
1) What is domestically available in Canada?
2) What is relatively cheap?
3) What is easy to make/mix/paint/mount etc?
4) What solution combines the above 3 while giving me the best edge possible over a plain, unpainted matte white board? (I've already got a 4x8 white board at Home Depot,@ $16 cut to size)

When I've got a permanent residence and want to build the home theater of my dreams, my criteria will change. In the mean time, I can settle for good instead of excellent =)
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post #28 of 28 Old 04-11-2013, 07:58 AM
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i see you've a homedpot
i may be able to direct you to using rs-maxxmudd... using some alternatives.
shoot me pm.
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