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post #31 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 06:55 AM
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No...wet sanding was a staple back in the day when removing heavy texture off a painted wall prior to another coat was normal.

Done correctly, nothing removes paint more quickly. Done incorrectly and you can totally emulsify the paint to the point you get the whole business "sliding" off.

Rinsing the collected paint debris off the sponge was very important....I do so often, but usually I just quickly dampen the surface while scraping the sponge, then squeeze (not wring) the sponge until no water drips off. That usually is as "wet" as you want it to be.

But...as I'm sure you found out...once you start using a dampened Sponge, the paint you remove collects REALLY fast on the sponge, and requires even more frequent rinsing....and squeezing. Pretty much about every 15-20 strokes.

You should now take a dry fine grit sponge and "lightly and quickly" sweep sand the surface. That should take just 2 minutes....not 2 hours. To my reasoning you'd have to have "Alligator Peel", not orange peel to require 2 hours of dry sanding. eek.gif For bad Orange Peel, I would simply use first a Medium Grit Sponge and normal pressure, remaining at each spot for 8-10 strokes before moving over 1/2 the length of the Sponge and continuing. Then I'd repeat the process using a Fine Grit Sponge and light pressure.

What you accomplished was more akin to going all "Homer Formby-like" on the screen biggrin.gif But it seems it was the right choice...even if made inadvertently.

However...statements like "horrible Orange Peel" only tell me that the paint application technique was wrong. I don't think the paint was "horribly thin" or it would have simply ran down the surface once it hit. No...what seems to be / have happened was the paint was drying too slowly and / or the next coat went up over a "not dry enough" surface.

If all that sanding did not remove so much SF that the underlying surface showed through, and you have a fairly even looking shade left over, ten all you should need at this point is two well applied Dusters. Three at very most.

So take the time to experiment with pressure , distance , and speed to be certain this time you get a true "Dusting". Also, before you spray, crank up the heat until you reach 80 degrees, turn it off, then squirt. After 5 minutes, turn on the heat again until you squirt the second coat, and if you have one, take a 20" Box fan and place it elevated off the floor (...on a clean chair...) about 7' from the center of the screen and on medium speed, let it wash the screen with a gentle breeze. We/you want to get those paint droplets to contract as quickly as possible, and the entire surface as dried as possible before any following coat.

This is all about trying to solve a Orange Peel problem that seldom rears up as badly as it seems to be in this instance. If you had time, I'd send you my 1.5 mm Needle to substitute for the original, but in truth, many have used the 2.0 mm without having such severe texture issues, so I really do feel it's all about technique, with perhaps the paint itself being just a bit too thin.

Which brings to mind a final suggestion. If you can, let the can of paint remain open for about 3 hours, then stir and strain. That should let some moisture evaporate out.

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post #32 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 08:33 AM - Thread Starter
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The sanding really felt never ending. Normal pressure with the medium grit side of the sanding sponge was taking forever to get the surface close to smooth and would clog up quite quickly just as you said. It was taking a combo of medium to get the majority and then the fine to get it smooth. It really was amazing how much texture there was and totally showed the error in my ways! The wet sanding really did the trick. I got a bit proficient at wet sanding during a couple other projects from the past so that helped. There are a couple of spots that are now showing the white of the Sintra through so I will def need more than a couple dusters

I really do think the combination of ambient temp, technique, speed and possibly too much flow(3900 turbine pushing through a 2900 gun) were the factors. I will do a once over with a dry fine grit when I get home just to make sure everything is good. I will also let the paint sit open to let the moisture out. I will start the dusters again tonight. I may try and thin some of the left over UPW to a similar consistency to the SF to tinker with the flow of the gun a bit in the garage on some scrap cardboard.

I am really keeping my fingers crossed that this all comes to a head tonight and things go right.
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post #33 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 08:51 AM
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Lightly sweep paint into the sparely covered areas first, and try to put just a wee bit of paint onto them before attempting to re-coat the entire surface. Otherwise you might have lighter spots showing where the paint remains thinner compared to the spots where you did not reach all the way down to the Sintra.

To "sweep", simply point the Gun sideways to the screen, press the trigger, then rotate your wrist inward so the spray hits the screen just before the lighter area begins. Continue across the area then rotate back out as you reach the other side of the affected area. Do this "sweeping" in one continuous motion. NEVER start out by pointing the Gun directly at the screen.

If the areas are very small, just do the same only be more precise. You want to fill in the sparse area...at least somewhat, to eliminate any "shine through" Usually, it only takes 2-3 such quick "Sweep" applications to play "catch up".

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post #34 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 09:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Should i keep the same distance away for the sweeps(14in at closest point of sweep motion)? The few spots are small 1/4in by 3in little strips. Should I keep it on the vertical spray pattern or move it to the spot pattern?
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post #35 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by tza88 View Post

Should i keep the same distance away for the sweeps(14in at closest point of sweep motion)? The few spots are small 1/4in by 3in little strips. Should I keep it on the vertical spray pattern or move it to the spot pattern?

12"-14" Vertical Pattern. Center Pattern on Spot.

On the last "Sweep" of each affected area, do a Top / Bottom overlap to help blend the freshly painted spot into the surrounding area even more.

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post #36 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 02:40 PM
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With such small area,, it would seem your only going to twist / sweep in-out in one continuous motion. Just do that from 14" out two times....in-out-in-out. Not a slow rotation, but a smooth, twist of the hand.

That's it! Catch the needful area precisely. Let the area DRY.....then repeat. After the 2nd is dry, inspect. Probably won't hurt a thing to do one more pair....a single one in the least.

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post #37 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 09:13 PM - Thread Starter
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So I did a quick fine grit sand, wiped and let dry. I followed all of your other instructions; let paint sit open for 3 hours, cranked up the temp in the room, dialed back the flow control on the gun, moved faster and made sure I was a min of 14in away from the screen......and JACKPOT!!! I did the sweeps over the areas showing Sintra and those look great. Once those were completely dry, I did a total of 2 dusters - 50 min apart. It looks TOTALLY different than before. Just dialing the gun back 25-30% made a huge difference in the paint spray. The first pic below is 5 min after the first duster and the paint was pretty much dry to the touch. The second pic is 10 min after the second duster and same thing, pretty much dry. Zero texture! I know its hard to see in the pics but unless you come back and say it looks wrong(which I doubt), I will continued down this path tomorrow. I will also be bringing a small space heater home with me from a coworker to help with temp in the room.


5min after 1st duster - 3rd attempt
10min after 2nd duster - 3rd attempt
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post #38 of 99 Old 04-24-2013, 10:01 PM
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MississippiMan. If i recall shouldn't you be able to spray Silver Fire with the gun fully open. It seems when i hear you talking about spraying it you all ways have the gun fully open, but adjust the speed only of your moving left to right. Also, the 3900 and the 2900 use the same gun, no difference in gun. TZA88, is your gun spitting?? What i mean, is when you have the your gun paint flow dial open, does it spit bigger droplets out and if so how much do you have to have the wheel open before it starts spitting?? And when i say wheel, i mean the paint flow dial?? Is the gun spitting bigger droplets out that are much bigger and thicker then the normal particles and go further out from the diameter of the main pattern?? It sounds to me like your gun is spitting bad to give that heavnly textured look that you were getting above. Has the characteristics of your spray station changed and how it sprays changed?? How open can your paint flow dial be open if give you a good pattern without the spitting?? Your paint looks like mine did when the system started to mess up.
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post #39 of 99 Old 04-25-2013, 04:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Narhic_fd, i have only used the gun one other time and it was in the garage just to get a feel for how it worked so I cannot really tell if any characteristics or spray has changed. I was able to use it in the garage with Behr Premium Plus and fully open but then again that paint is super thick compared to SF. Look at the pictures below of my test sprays with it wide open. These tests where done at about 10in and you can see the larger droplets around the outer spray area. I honestly am not sure if it is technically "spitting" or if its normal. I have never used an HVLP before so its all new to me. I will say that i have watched various videos of this in use and it seems to be a better controlled spray compared to what i am getting.....but to be fair there is no telling what settings are being used in those videos.

In my case i changed a number of things to get my current outcome so its difficult to tell if dialing the gun back is making a big difference or if all the other factors are just making up for my poor spraying the first time around. I havent had time to test the spitting/flow control theory as i would have to do it with other paint(not gonna waste SF for that). I can say that with it dialed back to its current setting(~25-30% less), the droplets seem to be smaller and the center area is less which I assume would be expected. Again, its difficult to say what the root cause of my original issue was. The Basement was ~68-70degrees during the first spray, i was definitely inconsistent with my distance(probably 6-8in away) and was no where near as fast moving as i am now.

When your spraystation messed up, what happened?



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post #40 of 99 Old 04-25-2013, 06:59 AM
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Ideally you should be able duster without runs with straight water alone. Also do a couple passes outsde the screen area before each coat to insure the right plume and it's behaving (ie not spitting). Also clogged heads, needles, air passages contribute. Clogged filters on the wagner will decrease and fluctuate the power and cause uneven/spitting spray.
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post #41 of 99 Old 04-25-2013, 07:23 AM
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The new Forum format no longer hold "cookies" that allow you to hit "go back" and see already typed content should for some reason the PC advance or change to another page due to typing errors or whatever. This means perhaps hundreds, even thousands of words of earnestly composed content....and a lot of time, are irretrievably lost.

While this might seem trivial to most casual members, for me, someone who tries hard to respond in depth, and who has limited time in which to do so, seeing that I must take quite a spell to "hunt and peck" my lengthy responses, this can mean having to give up and those who need timely help must either wait...or forge ahead unassisted. And when that spells trouble because of that loss, no one's efforts are advanced, and at times, people get pissed off and blame someone. Like me. frown.gif

This mini-rant comes after my having composed a very lengthy explanation & tutorial on mixing water into paint, and what / how varying amounts affect spraying, and how the adjust-ability of the Graco helps out in such instances.

Frankly, I just cannot justify the 1-1/2 hour lost, nor re-compose the info at this time. I have to go do some honest work !

I love this Forum, but the loss of information due to a lack of the site having such "cookie" retention is almost unconscionable. A gross oversight no doubt, but one that definitely needs correcting.


That being said.

1. Practice ! It is better to use a very small amount of paint (nickles & quarters worth) testing the quality of the Spray pattern than to waste Dollars seeing bad end results.

2. Don't be in a Rush ! Start out making the Mixes as instructed. Strain and test. Adjust the mix until everything looks correct. Questions? Ask first, squirt second.

3. You need advice "NOW"? PM, don't just post hoping for a response. I'm not subscribed to every thread, but I get notification on my Phone of every PM I receive, and if such a missive has a "HELP !" in the intro line...I don't ignore it.

Narhic_fd, read tza88's reply above. It relates to as why he was having issues, and states how they were easily resolved.

Me..? I have some nails to go chew on for a while. mad.gif

(...also, I get preempted by PB when I take so long....very disturbing. tongue.gif )

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post #42 of 99 Old 04-25-2013, 05:38 PM
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I did read TZA88 other threads up top. Made sure of it. The thing is that my spraystation started to mess up and act like his. My spraystation used to do a NICE pattern even the paint flow dial all the way open. Then, I decided to use the station to spray my bedroom and it did great, no problems but after doing my room I went to do my door and the sprayer was spitting like crazy like TZA88 above. I could barely open the paint flow dial and it was shooting big droplets like his at even 20% open. I did everything to try and figure out why. I did these steps:

I made sure the viscosity was at recommendations
I strained it through a sock strainer
made sure paint was at room temp
Used a mixer on it for 3 MIns
cleaned it extra good to make sure there was n dry paint clogging it
I even called Graco and thinking it might be the gun they sent me a new one but still it spit like his

I was using the berh ultra pure white paint as well which has a perfect consistency. I live in NC and since the the graco tech support place is only 2 hours from me I even DROVE there and saw Sam the tech guy and he should be some stuff. He gave me a smaller needle as well but with that smaller needle it became worse. I remember how beautiful the pattern was before it starting acting up and the picture above is not how the spray pattern should look. I started to test the turbine for abnormalities and after placing my hand over the turbine exit tube i noticed that the air flow was having little fluctuations in it. The air flow wasn't constant. I'm going back to the Graco place tomorrow and we are going to try another 3900 turbine and see if that IS the problem. I will take pictures of how the pattern it supposed to look posted tomorrow with the 3900.
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post #43 of 99 Old 04-26-2013, 01:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Narhic_fd, I am real curious to see your test sprays to compare to what I am getting. While I think mine is fine now that I lowered the flow and made all the other changes, I had some free time this afternoon so I did a similar test to you. I loaded up the gun with some of the leftover Behr UPW from the SF mix. I did a few sprays with it wide open and then a couple with it at the setting I am using for the screen(75% open). I also did a quick full path with each setting. if you enlarge the photo you can still see the "spitting" I am referring to around the exterior of each spray. I can only assume this is normal cause my turbine has zero issues with keeping the pressure constant.

I am going to continue spraying the SF dusters tonight

Test sprays with Behr UPW
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post #44 of 99 Old 04-26-2013, 02:16 PM
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The "Spitting" (sparse droplet pattern) is always present at the very edges of the pattern because it's the least dense, less focused part of the spray.

Absolutely, a balance between low viscosity and pressure should be pursued. But stated again, err on the conservative side, using less water and full output. Find the right viscosity to use with maximum pressure by adding a small amount to the mix each step, and you'll be rewarded by getting the tallest pattern, easier blending with overlapping, the ability to cover the area in the shortest amount of time, and if proper speed and distance are observed, a very fine finish.

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post #45 of 99 Old 04-26-2013, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
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I brought a space heater home with me today from work and it has really helped with keeping the temp up in the room. I did 4 dusters tonight. All of them were pretty much dry within 15 min but i waited 45 just in case. Below are a couple pics 15min after the 6th duster. I did notice a spot in the upper right portion of the screen that i need to do a couple sweeps on as it is lower in paint then the rest of the screen. Guess that area got sanded to a lower point. No biggie, will fix tomorrow

Other than that one spot, how are these looking? I know its probably difficult to tell from the pics but it seems to be going well. However after 6 fast dusters, you can still clearly see individual drops. Is there a point that this should go away? I was also tempted to jack up to wide open to see how things went but didnt want to risk it since there isnt a ton of paint left. i would much rather continue with doing a bunch more dusters then screw it up by setting the gun to wide open.

15min after 6th Duster - 3rd attempt
15min after 6th Duster - 3rd attempt - 2
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post #46 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 06:36 AM
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So, I got back from the Tech office of the Graco/Earlex and taught me alot of stuff about the 3900. I will have to recant my last statement and say that the pattern coming out above is CORRECT, lol. Since there is a difference in air pressure of the 3900 vs the 2900 it can affect the paint mixtures in quite a bit on how they come out. Unlike those using the 2900, you don't want to over dilute the viscosity of the Silver FIre. If you over dilute it it's going to spit. Thing is about the 3900 like you and I have, (A) the air pressure is higher and (B) the tube that comes with the 2900 is wider which allows more air in. I'm going to be test spraying some S-I-L-V-E-R today and I'll let you know some detail. Sorry about being wrong up top taz88.
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post #47 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narhic_fd View Post

So, I got back from the Tech office of the Graco/Earlex and taught me alot of stuff about the 3900. I will have to recant my last statement and say that the pattern coming out above is CORRECT, lol. Since there is a difference in air pressure of the 3900 vs the 2900 it can affect the paint mixtures in quite a bit on how they come out. Unlike those using the 2900, you don't want to over dilute the viscosity of the Silver FIre. If you over dilute it it's going to spit. Thing is about the 3900 like you and I have, (A) the air pressure is higher and (B) the tube that comes with the 2900 is wider which allows more air in. I'm going to be test spraying some S-I-L-V-E-R today and I'll let you know some detail. Sorry about being wrong up top taz88.

Seems like I said exactly that, the pressure / viscosity combination was causing the tendency to splatter.

If your going to spray S-I-L-V-E-R, just be certain to observe the "Duster" regimen all the more carefully, and DO NOT over apply any coat at any stage. S-I-L-V-E-R was the first DIY paint app to require such a technique, and it's absolutely essential that it consist of repeated, very sparse layers that eventually build up and cover the surface.

I'll tell ya narhic_fd, you know better than anyone else that I'm not only on your team here, I'm pulling hard for you to reach a point where spraying stops and watching starts. But attempting S-I-L-V-E-R, a application where proper viscosity AND spray technique must be observed meticulously, seems a bit out of place until you are completely comfortable with the spray process and the performance of your Gun.

The fact that your using the original Needle instead of a 1.5 mm Needle is all the more reason for concern. All the S-I-L-V-E-R-s I have done utilized the original Wagner Control Spray, which had both a lower pressure output than the Graco, and a 1.5 mm Needle. Trying to keep the situation under control by keeping S-I-L-V-E-R at a thicker state of viscosity is NOT the solution.

So be so advised...... cool.gif

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post #48 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narhic_fd View Post

So, I got back from the Tech office of the Graco/Earlex and taught me alot of stuff about the 3900. I will have to recant my last statement and say that the pattern coming out above is CORRECT, lol. Since there is a difference in air pressure of the 3900 vs the 2900 it can affect the paint mixtures in quite a bit on how they come out. Unlike those using the 2900, you don't want to over dilute the viscosity of the Silver FIre. If you over dilute it it's going to spit. Thing is about the 3900 like you and I have, (A) the air pressure is higher and (B) the tube that comes with the 2900 is wider which allows more air in. I'm going to be test spraying some S-I-L-V-E-R today and I'll let you know some detail. Sorry about being wrong up top taz88.

Sorry, mistyped on the (B). The tube that comes with the 3900, not the 2900, is bigger. Sorry my bad, lol..again.Yeah, you were right Mississippi man. It seams with the 3900 we have to be more careful when it comes to diluting the mixes. Thats what must have happen to my Silver Fire i did a while back that made it spit so much. I will make sure it meets the proper viscosity that is recommended by you guys.
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post #49 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

Seems like I said exactly that, the pressure / viscosity combination was causing the tendency to splatter.

If your going to spray S-I-L-V-E-R, just be certain to observe the "Duster" regimen all the more carefully, and DO NOT over apply any coat at any stage. S-I-L-V-E-R was the first DIY paint app to require such a technique, and it's absolutely essential that it consist of repeated, very sparse layers that eventually build up and cover the surface.

I'll tell ya narhic_fd, you know better than anyone else that I'm not only on your team here, I'm pulling hard for you to reach a point where spraying stops and watching starts. But attempting S-I-L-V-E-R, a application where proper viscosity AND spray technique must be observed meticulously, seems a bit out of place until you are completely comfortable with the spray process and the performance of your Gun.

The fact that your using the original Needle instead of a 1.5 mm Needle is all the more reason for concern. All the S-I-L-V-E-R-s I have done utilized the original Wagner Control Spray, which had both a lower pressure output than the Graco, and a 1.5 mm Needle. Trying to keep the situation under control by keeping S-I-L-V-E-R at a thicker state of viscosity is NOT the solution.

So be so advised...... cool.gif

I'm actually using the smaller needle you recommended not the one that came with the gun. The tech guy hooked me up with the smaller needle and a Lid that fits snug over the paint container for free. He didn't want me to leave empty handed for driving out there. It only was about a 2 hour drive but He taught me a lot. I told him about this website and how because of your guys mixture that it is a gun bought a lot for people on this forums. He's probably going to join the forums so he can help others out on here that could need, when it comes to the gun that is, lol.
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post #50 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 10:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Narhic_fd, no worries about any wrong info. I actually didn't realize I had the 3900 turbine till after I started this project. That is one of the best parts about these forums is that you can learn A TON and there are many people(such as MississippiMan) that are more than willing to take the time to respond in a thorough way. That's the only reason I decided to take the DIY plunge!


Hey MM, when you get a chance, can you take a quick look at my last post and pictures. I am going to be spraying some more dusters tonight and don't want to go adding if I need to take other steps before hand. I learned that after the first completely failed attempt that caused me to have gumby arms from sanding. Id rather ask and wait for a response then do and have to attempt to undo(or waste paint for that matter) biggrin.gif
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post #51 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narhic_fd View Post

I'm actually using the smaller needle you recommended not the one that came with the gun. The tech guy hooked me up with the smaller needle and a Lid that fits snug over the paint container for free. He didn't want me to leave empty handed for driving out there. It only was about a 2 hour drive but He taught me a lot. I told him about this website and how because of your guys mixture that it is a gun bought a lot for people on this forums. He's probably going to join the forums so he can help others out on here that could need, when it comes to the gun that is, lol.

Well that bodes well. But remember this....with the smaller needle, using all the pressure available is not just OK...it's what you want to do. So that means start out with the mixes using the prescribed amount of water. If it strains freely with only a slight "back up", load the Gun and do a brief test on something expendable. Look for a pattern that is 10" tall and solid if you hold it in place at 14" off the surface for 1 second. If not, add water at the rate of "only" 2 oz. per test.

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Originally Posted by tza88 View Post

Narhic_fd, no worried about any wrong info. I actually didn't realize I had the 3900 turbine till after I started this project. That is one of the best parts about these forums is that you can learn A TON and there are many people(such as MississippiMan) that are more than willing to take the time to respond in a thorough way. That's the only reason I decided to take the DIY plunge!

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Hey MM, when you get a chance, can you take a quick look at my last post and pictures. I am going to be spraying some more dusters tonight and don't want to go adding if I need to take other steps before hand. I learned that after the first completely failed attempt that caused me to have gumby arms from sanding. Id rather ask and wait for a response then do and have to attempt to undo(or waste paint for that matter) biggrin.gif

The degree of texture I see is pretty Flat. You have two directions to choose from. Using the Fine Grit "Dry", Sand again...in the manner I suggest.....sweeping with a very light touch, about 4-6 strokes then shifting over 1/2 the length of the sponge, repeating...so on to the other end. Only try to do roughly the top 5/8th of the screen....just past the horizontal center line. On the next pass, you just do the opposite across the bottom, sweeping up into / past the center line.

This is just one pass each direction. Relax.

Your touch should be light enough that you do not have much if any build-up on the sponge beyond dust. I'm worried about your having too much paint, but I suppose after the aggressive wet sanding you did we are ok there. This short bout of sanding is setting you up to do at most, two well applied Dusters. The sanding is going to take off any "tops" and basically lower the texture enough that the final layers applied will Flatten out, instead of "fill" over the rises of the texture..

But once again, let me stress. A visually perfectly surface isn't going to happen. Especially under macro inspection. What any DIY'er aspires to is a surface that shows no presence within the content from a viewing location "minimally", and hopefully up to 3' to 4'. The thing is, when the Screen is not in use, and under room lighting, that's when people tend to be most scrutinizing. And we are talking 12" or under stuff.

Which brings us to the second option. Leave it "as is". The Texture I see is more than satisfactory if the color and consistency of the coating is now completely uniform. For that is always just as far as you ever want to take it. Too much paint becomes a light absorbing sponge. You want a great majority of light to be reflected, and depend upon the underlying reflectivity of the substrate to help reclaim what small amount does penetrate below the surface.

You don't want a coating so thick that it absorbs and traps light.

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post #52 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 12:36 PM - Thread Starter
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UGH I honestly am not sure which route to take. part of me says leave it but the other part says can I get it any better. I have a little over 16oz of paint left. Color uniformity is good as you can see in the pic(ignore the lighter upper left and right corners as that's from the lights in the room).

Is it really worth going the first route or is there more of a potential to screwing something up? If you think its not worth it then don't bother answering the next couple questions. If I do decide to go that route, I have a quick question about the sanding as I have a feeling I was doing it different to begin with. I was sanding 1ft sections top to bottom moving the sanding block right to left within that 1ft area. I see now you say one direction for the top and opposite for the bottom. Are you suppose to walk the length of the screen with putting pressure on the sanding sponge kinda like the diagram below? I guess I am a little confused with your directions

I have half a mind to just be done and if anyone dares scrutinizing my screen, they know where the door is. HA

Full Screen after 6th duster
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post #53 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 12:52 PM
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No....Sanded rows are vertical.

That screen looks pretty damn good. No doubts, if you do sand as instructed, and apply some very light, correct dusters, the surface appearance will improve...at least somewhat. I don't see you at this conjecture making any drastic mistakes.
(.....just don't step on the hose........)

Light sweep sanding is a "smoothing" technique. Read my instructions again carefully. I said to only try to sand just over 1/2 the height of the screen on each of the two passes across. That so the second pass overlaps the middle where the first pass did likewise..

Restrained but wide sanding like that allows you to focus on keeping the vertical rows straight, and also your being able to extend to the top edge up to the tape and maintain even pressure. But...if you feel more comfortable by stopping just before the uttermost Top & Bottom edges, going back across with short, light strokes that target the Top & Bottom edges of the Screen is no issue. As I stated, your not trying to "remove" materials as much as your "smoothing" material.

Myself...I'd "go there" in a heartbeat. But that's me...and I just don't even think twice about such decisions.

But I also have always held the position that if someone has no complaints until he wanders up close and pokes his nose within 1' of the screen, and then finds it necessary to comment on the texture, I would be obligated to not invite him back again.

Unless he's bringing the beer, and then i'll give him another chance. biggrin.gif

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post #54 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 12:58 PM
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Well that bodes well. But remember this....with the smaller needle, using all the pressure available is not just OK...it's what you want to do. So that means start out with the mixes using the prescribed amount of water. If it strains freely with only a slight "back up", load the Gun and do a brief test on something expendable. Look for a pattern that is 10" tall and solid if you hold it in place at 14" off the surface for 1 second. If not, add water at the rate of "only" 2 oz. per test..

I'm pretty sure on this but want to make sure. Now the container the paint is being strained into is the graco sprayer paint container, right?? And not into another gallon paint can??
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post #55 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by narhic_fd View Post

I'm pretty sure on this but want to make sure. Now the container the paint is being strained into is the graco sprayer paint container, right?? And not into another gallon paint can??

Either or. Myself, I use a new 1 gallon can to receive the Strained paint, and a "Spout Style" lid for easy pouring into the Guns cup..

If your still in the guessing stage as far as consistently getting the water / paint ratio correct, the advantage of this is that after the first straining, adding more water to the gallon can, stirring... then reloading the Cup for another go is ok.

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post #56 of 99 Old 04-27-2013, 09:51 PM
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UGH I honestly am not sure which route to take. part of me says leave it but the other part says can I get it any better. I have a little over 16oz of paint left. Color uniformity is good as you can see in the pic(ignore the lighter upper left and right corners as that's from the lights in the room).

Is it really worth going the first route or is there more of a potential to screwing something up? If you think its not worth it then don't bother answering the next couple questions. If I do decide to go that route, I have a quick question about the sanding as I have a feeling I was doing it different to begin with. I was sanding 1ft sections top to bottom moving the sanding block right to left within that 1ft area. I see now you say one direction for the top and opposite for the bottom. Are you suppose to walk the length of the screen with putting pressure on the sanding sponge kinda like the diagram below? I guess I am a little confused with your directions

I have half a mind to just be done and if anyone dares scrutinizing my screen, they know where the door is. HA

Full Screen after 6th duster

MississippiMan, Does his finale pic here appear to have a texture look to it or is that just the camera giving it that look. Do you think that those textured spots will show up when he shots his projector image on it?? I know that the Silver Fire will show imperfections being that it's a contrast enhancing mixture I'm curious to how the image will look Taz88. When will you get to throw up an image on the screen?? when you do let me know how it looks.
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post #57 of 99 Old 04-28-2013, 05:49 AM
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The degree of texture we are talking about is very slight....and the properties inherent in the SF paint create enough of a defused dispersion of light that such small texture cannot be resolved under normal viewing at normal distances with "normal" eyesight.

Lasik people with 20-5 vision are exceptions, of course.

And texture is not like "imperfections" caused by scratches, large bumps or dips, or embedded particles. The texture shown has a very flattened surface, and if corrected even more, will become all the more invisible.

Room lighting is usually non-directional in a basic sense...even when coming from a obvious source. (...sunlight through a window included...) As such, being non-focused, it's tendency is to create shadows from the variations in how it strikes surfaces. That's why imperfections in a painted wall jump out under indirect lighting whereas in bright lighting they seem to not be there.

A PJ is highly directed light. Yes, it's dispersed over a specific area, but within that are it's very precisely focused, and the uniformity of light distributed across the specific area is usually above 85%. That value far exceeds that of artificial light, or ambient sunlight.

Soooooo................it takes a pretty good rise off the surface to produce a shadow. Think how at noon outside shadows are very short, if visible at all. You'd have to find a very tall boulder to give you shade in the desert at Noon. That's how texture on a Screen is. Some Mfg Screens have quite noticeable texture. (...the desert is littered with big boulders...) It seems they expect people to stay in their seats, and texture drives their suggested seating distances. (...resolution used to as well, but not nearly as much today...)

It's a testimonial to the drive toward perfection in DIY Screen making that we judge texture issues by observing such from "inches" away...not "feet". We take "Macros" of the surface...and then critique the results. That is a hard row to hoe...and one made necessary by the high contrast, highly reflective surfaces of advanced DIY Screen paint mixes.

Spraying is advocated to both reduce the tendency of a roller-pressed surface to have a sheen...and to prevent Roller marks that become very obvious under projected light.

But since we cannot use the type of paints that produce glossy, smooth, Car-like finishes, there will always be some degree of observable texture. Expectations simply run higher with DIY Screen making, and in reality, that has served us all in good stead. It does create some pretty persnickety, awfully picky people though.....I blame myself. Sue me.

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post #58 of 99 Old 04-28-2013, 09:19 AM
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narhic_fd

now that you've been schooled on the 3900... and have a 1.5mm tip in hand...
shoot for texture something like this...



macro of a SF 6 screen sample... the white above is a sheet of paper.

the beauty of dusters is the you eliminate the possibly of hotspotting out of the equation and place focus of uniformity back on the projector.
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post #59 of 99 Old 04-28-2013, 11:35 AM - Thread Starter
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So I think i am going to be done with the painting. I decided to connect the bluray play to the PJ and see what the screen looks like as it sits right now(IE option 2 - leave it be). I looks amazing. At this point i am hard pressed to see how this could get better with sanding and a couple dusters.....maybe i am completely wrong. The pictures below are all handheld so please ignore any slight blurriness and i am sure the reflectivity of the sheeting didn't help in the second pic.

Thoughts?


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post #60 of 99 Old 04-28-2013, 11:50 AM
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Your the only real judge that matters. If you put up content that has a blue sky with the occasional cloud and the camera pans across the screen, and from 1/2 your viewing distance it seems pristine and dot / texture free, your good to go IMO.

I've always found that excepting the very few who seem to be overly critical about such "texture"...or suffer from having a bad case of "Eagle Eye" syndrome, most all others find nirvana in the end results they achieve. Really, only those who do something really wrong ever have issues that need dealing with.

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