Cloth Tension Question...But Basically My 160" Screen Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 06:36 AM - Thread Starter
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EDIT: this WAS a 150" screen that I completed and sold..I now have moved to 160" of goodness that I use in my garage and outdoors...

Hola all:

I just finished a 150" screen for outdoor use (will be stored indoors) and I have two things:

1. I'm a bit timid of the "stretching" process. I ran into a nightmare with a sheet of parkland poly once but I expect this to go MUCH smoother so to speak due to the nature of the material. Basically my plan is to stretch and staple the left and right vertices, then the top and bottom, again, in the middle, and then stapling 6 inches or so on the left and right, switching back and forth, and then ditto for the top and bottom. Does this sound about right? Do I have to worry about "over stretching" this material. It's from Carl's Place by the way. Really not looking to jack it up and waste money, here.

2. Take a look at my frame if you will:



Now, I added some cross braces from the middle to both the top and bottom width-runs. It is VERY sturdy/rigid. That said, how will the BOC hold up, adequately stapled? I ask because it will be adhered the "front" side of the frame and then covered with another set of 1x4's I've already painted black, I was going to adhere these with titebond rather than mechanical fasteners (for looks and strength) so I won't exactly have easy access to re-stretch if the tensions laxes. So can anyone speak to the long-term in regards to said screen tension?

Maybe I'm unnecessarily working myself up over this...just want to do it right the first time. If I need to use screws so I can remove those black "cover boards" I'll do so.

thanks a ton guys!

James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #2 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 06:55 AM
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Nope...you start at the Center Top & Bottom...then the Center of the Sides, and moving progressively outward from each starting point...in turn, until you reach the Corners. This allows you to pull just enough to correct any tension differences.



I hope your Central Support is very slightly recessed from the face of your Horizontial Frame. Otherwise, it almost assuredly will cause it's presence to be known (seen) as a slight vertical Bump.

If it's too late...or too difficlut to change that, the adding some Lattice Strips around the Perimeter of the Frame's interior edges can reduce that possibility. Just stretch over then and staple onto the outside edges of the Frame.

As far as maintaining adequate tension over the long haul, it all depends upon how tight you can stretch it all out to begin with.
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post #3 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 06:58 AM - Thread Starter
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The more I think about it the more I feel I should prolly just go with the screws. Too much can happen including tears, holes, etc and if I tite bond those 1x4's together I can forget about ever getting them apart. I guess that also keeps painting the screen an option too down the road if I choose.

I guess I'm just afraid it won't be sufficient,..but pairs of 1 inchers every foot or so should prolly suffice.

talking to myself...out loud, lol.


James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #4 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 06:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

Nope...you start at the Center Top & Bottom...then the Center of the Sides, and moving progressively outward from each starting point...in turn, until you reach the Corners. This allows you to pull just enough to correct any tension differences.


Excellent, thanks. You know how easy it can be to find "bad information" on the internet, lmao. tongue.gif

James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #5 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 07:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Even more "new and improved idea"!

Lag bolts through either surface with wing nuts on the rear!

James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #6 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 07:10 AM
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OW. eek.gif

Speaking from experience. screwing through the BOC is a recipe for disaster. As the screws tighten down, the head seizes the cloth and pulls it Clockwise, creating wrinkles. Any such Screw would have to be the "Truss head" variety anyway to prevent "tearing" and the additional Head size would just serve to make the tendency to twist the Fabric all the more likely.

Also, trying to hold tension while loading up a screw and screwing it down ever so slowly isn't something that can be done easily, or with any degree of dependability. Using 1/4" Staples and a decent Staple Gun is the ticket. Tapping any Staples down that fail to sink flush is imperative as well.

And do not scrimp on the Staples. They need to be within 2" of each other "minimally". Basically...you cannot overdo the staples...especially when pulling the material as tightly as it will need to be.

Pulling staples later on to correct any issues is not terribly difficult. Just use a small, (Mini) Flat head Screwdriver to get under them and lift.

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post #7 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 07:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok. Let me be more clear.

The BOC WILL be stapled down. With no shortage of staples, lol.

Then I'll trim the excess and should have a 1 1/2 to 2" outer area around where I can screw the black screen borders onto the BOC-free void. Picture the BOC, stapled-down, sandwiched between two 1x4's.

Now I'm thinking a couple dozen drywall screws to fasten the outer screen borders and ditching the "over kill" lag bolt idea, lol.

James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #8 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 07:45 AM
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Ow again. Screws will also pull / tear the Black velvet wrapped Trim (...that I just know your going to use....)

And 1"x4" for Trim is not a good idea. The 3/4" Height of such Trim will create a shadow on one side or the other of the Screen's edges unless the inward leading edge is tapered inward.

Use 1/2" x 3.25" Primed MDF Base. It already has such a tapered edge, it only costs $0.60 a lf, and cuts / works with like a dream.

Check out this Trim Tutorial.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/865218/wrapping-black-velvet-on-trim-with-mitered-or-butt-joined-ends

Lastly, use 1.25" Bright Finish Nails to attach the Trim, and set them below the Velvet using a Small sized Nail Punch.


Pretty much changin' most of your plans straight up, ain't I?

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post #9 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 07:53 AM - Thread Starter
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We are having a bit of a communication break down I'm afraid.

The screws will not be going into any cloth/screen material of any kind. None.

IF I were to add the velvet border it would lay atop the screwed-in 1x4 screen border (and screws). The existing frame is composed of 1x4 so that's what I'm using to form the border. It's important to understand that my viewable screen is the ID of the 1x4 frame so I cannot just simply add a differing size border and maintain the proper AR...and if I add a smaller piece of trim around the ID I will still be painting or covering the existing 1x4 anyway. I've done it before (1x4 border) and was pleased as punch with it. Not sure why it's a bad idea, but that's just the way it will be this time around.

Kinda ditto with the black velvet. I did my last screen half beluga flat black paint and the other half with black velvet and absolutely no one in my driveway could even tell they were different at 15-18'....I asked and had to point it out to them, up close. Seeing paint's much less expensive and easier, that's what I'm going to do. I appreciate the info and I don't doubt that all being equal black velvet is superior, it just didn't make a difference to warrant it in my situation.

I'd consider nails to attach, but I've watched too many pull away after "x" number of months. Is their a quality to these bright finished that make them unique in this regard? thanks!


James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #10 of 13 Old 08-30-2013, 11:52 AM
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What about making a simple frame and stapling the blackout cloth directly to the back? Is that a no no?

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post #11 of 13 Old 10-11-2013, 06:06 AM - Thread Starter
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^ just coming back to this thread. That would prolly work, but doing the vertices internally (within the 1x4 rectangular outer frame) with proper braces across the back increases rigidity, and then hitting it (the internal braces) with 80 grit and then 220 grit paper for 5 minutes draws back the braces a 1/16" of an inch or so and there's no way you're going to discern the braces through properly stretched blackout cloth.

I'm sure others have done it the way I am, but I "came up" with this methodology after simply being put off at the idea of messing with stretching cloth over and around the front and to the rear of the frame. Simply is too time consuming, tedious (relative to this methodology, anyway), and unnecessary to me.

This way, you simply stretch the cloth across the front, staple, and then trim.

Add your pre-painted (or pre-velveted) borders, screws every two feet (through the trim and outside of the trimmed cloth, beneath) into the frame. Done.

Perhaps I'll post pics of my latest 157". Two and a half hours, beginning to end, $110.

James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #12 of 13 Old 10-11-2013, 06:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Here's my frame...






James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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post #13 of 13 Old 10-15-2013, 12:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Finished up and I'm ecstatic with these results for under $100. Just iphone snaps, so visual justice is being robbed, but at 21 feet, it's really hard to argue with the results, imo:







Just hard to believe you can end up in such a great place with so little $'s.

James

Actual phone call (see pic to left):

 

Tech (responding to laughter): "I'm sorry sir, did I miss something?"

Me: "Yeah, a case of Diet Mountain Dew walking across my living room."

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